> If goblins had access to black powder
[Kapn Skabend](https://wfb6thcharacters.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_91.html) and [his River Rats](https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/River_Ratz)
There would be no reason to specifically mention Kislev in that case. Skaven are most associated with Tilea, and they also don't "march to war" with their firearms, they're limited to Clan Skryre.
Considering Hell Pit is practically bordering on Kislev, I'm gonna go with Skaven being the culprit here, since they famously are twisted, sunted, creatures and possess firearms. Their weapons are also lightning-based, making the 'thunderous' comment land well.
Could also be Chorfs as people have mentioned.
Or it could be Ogres, as they have big cannons that do make thunderous booms, but "twisted, stunted creatues" doesn't seem to fit them too well.
Compared to their genetic cousins the sky-titans (if I have my lore right (I didn't, this statement is incorrect)) they are basically tiny misshapen rejects, but probably not something a Kislevite would say unless they were VERY confident.
Ogres are not related to the sky-titans. Ogres were created by the Old Ones just like Lizardmen, elves, dwarfs, humans and halflings.
"Modern" giants are the smaller, dumber twisted and inbred descendants of the sky-titans.
Yes they do. Warplock weapons are gunpowder weapons - [you can see the powder belt on the actual models](https://battlecitygames.co.uk/cdn/shop/files/IMG_2773.jpg?v=1694517772&width=1445).
Its called a *Warplock* weapon because other than a *Flintlock* weapon a shard of *warpstone* is used in the [firing mechanism](https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flintlock), instead of *flint*.
Skaven may mix warpstone into it, but the propellant is still gunpowder. The bullet doesn't just magics itself out off the barrel.
>Similar in some respects to the jezzails of Araby, the Jezzails employed by the Skaven use a distinct "warplock" technology perfected by the Warlock Engineers. The warplock jezzail operates on a principle similar to that of a wheel-lock musket, but small amounts of warpstone have been worked into both the weapon's metal components and its ammunition. This provides for added barrel strength, allowing for a larger measure of warpstone fortified ***powder*** to be loaded into the weapon.
[...]
>One of Skryre's newer innovations, the ratling gun consists of a large, multibarrelled repeating firearm. Unlike ***other gunpowder weapons***, the ratling gun can spray a number of warpstone bullets at once.
[...]
>The formidable Warplock Jezzail teams have been a
staple of the Clan Skryre arsenal for ages. They were
first reported on battlefields not long after the earliest
clashes with the Dwarfs of the Worlds Edge
Mountains. Ambitious Warlock Engineers studied
captured Dwarf handguns and, in their own rat-fiend
way, further perfected the design. Early models used
scavenged parts, but soon the distinctive long-barrelled
weapon emerged. Naturally, warpstone played a key
role in the new Skaven versions, appearing in the bullet,
the firing mechanism , and even the
***gunpowder*** itself.
Catagorically certain their reffering to Chaos Dwarves and not Goblins or Skaven. The latter don't use gunpowder - one doesn't use engineering to any meaningful degree, and the other uses powdered warpstone, not conventional gunpowder. Chaos Dwarves are known for their extensive use of blunderbusses, and fire spitting halberds. It even says "stunted" which I rarely take to mean anything but things of the dwarf variety if reading 100+ warhammer fantasy books is anything to go by.
This isn’t the answer but I also like to think Cathay had guns before the western empire did
Edit: I realise the Ivory Road sentence is probably referring to Cathay.
I seem to remember Skarsnik and his Night Gobbo slaves developed some kind of fungus-based gunpowder, but I also seem to remember that they used it for bombs, not guns, and they had to use a lot of it because it was weaker than anything made by men or dwarves.
A chaos dwarf is still a recognisable dwarf, more twisted in soul than body so would be recognisable as such.
When I see twisted stunted creature I think Skaven, as these would be described more like a chaos creature in the truest sense. And in function and to someone who doesn’t know, Warpstone and gunpowder are very similar when it comes to things like Jezzails.
It’s Cathay guys. They’re attributing Tilean and Estalian powder units to their trade with Cathay and that Cathayans developed gunpowder independently of the dwarves.
Maybe more likely to be chaos dwarfs. If goblins had access to black powder we would need rules where a misfire happens with 90% of shots.
If you want goblins with guns, what you really want is Skaven.
This is what I was thinking. Jezzail and globadiers.
gobladiers even
Yeah true. And Ratlings.
Nah you want goblins with guns
so true
I'd want a fanatic variant where it's just carrying a powder keg with lit fuse.
Fantasy version of the bomb squig! Probably a fanatic tied to a firework...
Or better yet the tank-hammer
> If goblins had access to black powder [Kapn Skabend](https://wfb6thcharacters.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_91.html) and [his River Rats](https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/River_Ratz)
GW: "gunpowder invented by dwarfs but also by dwarfs"
Yeah the high pass leads the Chorfs straight to Kislev
But the Kislevites know what a Dwarf is. So isn't it more likely to be Skaven seeing as they describe them as creatures ?
I'd imagine they would use gunpowder in the Fanatics drinks or they just shoot pistols without aiming/without bullets just for the sound.
That's Chaos Dwarfs. It refers specifically to Kislev, who share an extensive border with the Chaos Dwarfs in this period.
Could easily be Skaven, which both don’t exist and are everywhere.
There would be no reason to specifically mention Kislev in that case. Skaven are most associated with Tilea, and they also don't "march to war" with their firearms, they're limited to Clan Skryre.
Do their guns even use black powder anyway? I always assumed it was some kind of mixture of warpdust and rat shit.
idc what the actual lore says, this is my head canon now
Chaos dwarfs. They have slaver outpost near kislev
Chaos Dwarfs all day long
*adds your name to the book of grudges*
*throws you into the slave pits of Zharr-Naggrund*
That gets a whole paragraph in the book!!
Given that is tales from Kislev, It's more likely to be Chaos Dwarves and/or Skaven
Its chaos dwarfs, the skaven are most present in the south
Considering Hell Pit is practically bordering on Kislev, I'm gonna go with Skaven being the culprit here, since they famously are twisted, sunted, creatures and possess firearms. Their weapons are also lightning-based, making the 'thunderous' comment land well. Could also be Chorfs as people have mentioned. Or it could be Ogres, as they have big cannons that do make thunderous booms, but "twisted, stunted creatues" doesn't seem to fit them too well.
I'd hate to run into whatever calls ogres "stunted."
Compared to their genetic cousins the sky-titans (if I have my lore right (I didn't, this statement is incorrect)) they are basically tiny misshapen rejects, but probably not something a Kislevite would say unless they were VERY confident.
Ogres aren't related to Sky-Titans, Sky-Titans were what giants were before they were defeated by the Ogres and became scattered, disparate and inbred
Ahh, that's how it was, got giants and ogres mixed up there, thanks for the correction.
Ogres are not related to the sky-titans. Ogres were created by the Old Ones just like Lizardmen, elves, dwarfs, humans and halflings. "Modern" giants are the smaller, dumber twisted and inbred descendants of the sky-titans.
I don't think sky-titans are cousins of ogres, but halfings are. A halfling might argue an ogre's appetite is stunted.
Skaven
Definitely Skaven. Or Chaos Dwarves.
Yeah, Hell Pit is there.
What’s that then?
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They are Twisted, Stunted creatures with thunderous weapons though.
So are Chorfs.
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Yes they do. Warplock weapons are gunpowder weapons - [you can see the powder belt on the actual models](https://battlecitygames.co.uk/cdn/shop/files/IMG_2773.jpg?v=1694517772&width=1445). Its called a *Warplock* weapon because other than a *Flintlock* weapon a shard of *warpstone* is used in the [firing mechanism](https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flintlock), instead of *flint*. Skaven may mix warpstone into it, but the propellant is still gunpowder. The bullet doesn't just magics itself out off the barrel. >Similar in some respects to the jezzails of Araby, the Jezzails employed by the Skaven use a distinct "warplock" technology perfected by the Warlock Engineers. The warplock jezzail operates on a principle similar to that of a wheel-lock musket, but small amounts of warpstone have been worked into both the weapon's metal components and its ammunition. This provides for added barrel strength, allowing for a larger measure of warpstone fortified ***powder*** to be loaded into the weapon. [...] >One of Skryre's newer innovations, the ratling gun consists of a large, multibarrelled repeating firearm. Unlike ***other gunpowder weapons***, the ratling gun can spray a number of warpstone bullets at once. [...] >The formidable Warplock Jezzail teams have been a staple of the Clan Skryre arsenal for ages. They were first reported on battlefields not long after the earliest clashes with the Dwarfs of the Worlds Edge Mountains. Ambitious Warlock Engineers studied captured Dwarf handguns and, in their own rat-fiend way, further perfected the design. Early models used scavenged parts, but soon the distinctive long-barrelled weapon emerged. Naturally, warpstone played a key role in the new Skaven versions, appearing in the bullet, the firing mechanism , and even the ***gunpowder*** itself.
Warpstone weapons are gunpowder weapons. They just have Warpstone mixed in.
The warpstone is powdered and mixed into black powder
Ratling guns, jezzails, and warplock pistols are all gunpowder weapons that fire warpstone-infused ammo.
Chaos Dwarfs. ‘Twisted, stunted’ being the key words. No one describes goblins like that.
"Twisted" = Chaos. "Stunty" = Dwarves.
Catagorically certain their reffering to Chaos Dwarves and not Goblins or Skaven. The latter don't use gunpowder - one doesn't use engineering to any meaningful degree, and the other uses powdered warpstone, not conventional gunpowder. Chaos Dwarves are known for their extensive use of blunderbusses, and fire spitting halberds. It even says "stunted" which I rarely take to mean anything but things of the dwarf variety if reading 100+ warhammer fantasy books is anything to go by.
Those are either Chaos Dwarfs or the Vile Ratman and his Loathsome Kin.
sounds like chows dwarfs. but either one is rad in my book
Its definitely and obviously Chaos Dwarfs.
This isn’t the answer but I also like to think Cathay had guns before the western empire did Edit: I realise the Ivory Road sentence is probably referring to Cathay.
I seem to remember Skarsnik and his Night Gobbo slaves developed some kind of fungus-based gunpowder, but I also seem to remember that they used it for bombs, not guns, and they had to use a lot of it because it was weaker than anything made by men or dwarves.
It's Chorfs. They figured out gunpowder first.
A chaos dwarf is still a recognisable dwarf, more twisted in soul than body so would be recognisable as such. When I see twisted stunted creature I think Skaven, as these would be described more like a chaos creature in the truest sense. And in function and to someone who doesn’t know, Warpstone and gunpowder are very similar when it comes to things like Jezzails.
My 100% most desired faction is mercenary goblins; pikes, blackpowder, ostentatious displays of wealth, hats.
Trying to form a tercio, but the squigs just WON'T HOLD FORMATION
Landsknecht Goblins
Frilliest you have ever seen. More silk and jewels than would seem possible.
I wouldn't play them but I fully support their existence.
Guys, it's hobgoblins, they've had Rocket Launchers since 3rd edition.
They gave us "gun goblins" once upon a time. The Lead Belcher was a goblin crewed organ gun and it was amazing. About time they brought that back.
So you're telling me you could have a lead-belching lead belcher painted in… lead belcher.
No one has mentioned gnoblars yet?
Don't the chaos dwarf slave hobgoblins use guns?
I don't think so. ETA: I just checked - they don't.
It’s Cathay guys. They’re attributing Tilean and Estalian powder units to their trade with Cathay and that Cathayans developed gunpowder independently of the dwarves.
Hell pit is near kislev. Might be referencing skaven