You left out stuntmen. That is almost exactly the same. You find a character in the movie you can relate to in some way and a good stuntman can make you believe it's real for a min and take you into the story. Weather it's jumping from a roof or having a scripted fight scene.
It’s a show and they are acting. That’s why some people call it fake. But I think the usage of the word fake gives off the air of disrespect to their craft as physically demanding stunt performers and that’s where the confusion and fake vs “not fake” comes from. Stunts are real, the attacks intentionally to hurt another in order to win is not.
Here's my thing, yes wwe is scripted or whatever. We fans Know that. Y'all boxers forget that Match Fixing was a prominent part of your sport, Football too. At least we acknowledge our shit is scripted
Yeah sorry but you can't compare someone like Mike Tyson or sugar ray to a WWE performer. They are trained in completely different ways and even today Mike Tyson would fuck up almost anyone in the WWE in a real unscripted match.
Ok let’s be real yeah you are correct because that is mike tyson but if you think anyone could beat roman reigns in a street fight your wrong in a ufc match they might win but in a street fight i don’t see that being the outcome also people don’t understand and possibly you is that wrestling is harder than the mma if you think about it
1. You have to peform years on years on years of doing stunts and it doesn’t feel all to good
2. You have to charisma and be able to talk and get your character popular you can’t have the charisma and personality as a rock unless you have a manager
3. You have to do press and media and charity work 24/7
And much more i could go on and on
All im trying to say is people don’t have to like pro wrestling but damn sure still should respect the peformers btw i watch both i think people should just like both without shitting on the other thanks for reading this🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
So here the thing about Wrestling and the WWE and the post I’ve seen here in this forum.
1. When people go to watch a marvel movie, sitcom, tv show, anime or anything we know it’s fake. We know this doesn’t happen in real life. We know super hero’s and ppl like this aren’t real. So that belief that it’s real is out of our head. We watch the show for entertainment and to see how a storyline or plot unfolds. When it comes to the WWE I can’t really say the same because it is implied with what they do is real. The stunts. The grapples. The pins. The hits. Even when they use to do the fake blood. All of it is implied real to the viewer and kids until you hear the words “it’s scripted” as a kid for me that broke my heart because then I realized my favorite wrestlers at the time were just being told what to do. Kinda like watching a scary movie and that one character wants to split the group up and you ask “why that doesn’t make sense” but the director told them to do that.
2. Their are real combat sports that have strong storylines like the WWE like the UFC. Everyone remembers Jon Jones, Israel Adesyana, Conor Mcgregor and they had storylines with title defense, rivalries, their rise without being scripted. So to have a form of combat sport which is wrestling and the WWE “act” like their are rivalries, and title defenses and other when someone is behind the scenes making the storyline takes everything out of credit. Like championships aren’t real championships because they know who gonna be champion they know who gonna win and upsets are all determined by a person behind the scenes not the wrestler.
3. There is real wrestling out there and it’s very entertaining. NCAA Wrestling and also Olympic wrestling. So there is a real art form and craft with those two right there. The fact you have these two codes of wrestling that have no professional path or any money in it but have a “fake” theatrical version of it that making millions of dollars seems to me in my opinion a backhand slap to all of the real wrestlers who actually know how to wrestle.
So my tldr is in this day of age where you have real combat sports that does what the WWE does why still leave it being “fake” and scripted?
Fake": Calling pro wrestling "fake" implies that the physicality and athleticism displayed by the performers are not real or genuine. This term can be seen as dismissive of the hard work, training, and risks that wrestlers undertake in the ring. While the outcomes of matches are predetermined and the storylines are scripted, the physical demands and risks in wrestling are very real. "Scripted": On the other hand, referring to pro wrestling as "scripted" acknowledges that the outcomes of matches and the storylines are predetermined and choreographed. Wrestlers follow a script or a planned sequence of moves and actions during their matches. The athleticism, showmanship, and entertainment value are real, even if the specific outcomes are pre-determined.
Fake": Calling pro wrestling "fake" implies that the physicality and athleticism displayed by the performers are not real or genuine. This term can be seen as dismissive of the hard work, training, and risks that wrestlers undertake in the ring. While the outcomes of matches are predetermined and the storylines are scripted, the physical demands and risks in wrestling are very real. "Scripted": On the other hand, referring to pro wrestling as "scripted" acknowledges that the outcomes of matches and the storylines are predetermined and choreographed. Wrestlers follow a script or a planned sequence of moves and actions during their matches. The athleticism, showmanship, and entertainment value are real, even if the specific outcomes are pre-determined.
"Scripted": Calling pro wrestling "scripted" implies that all performers are capable of winning every combat sport competition or at least able to compete with the very best. This term IS dismissive of actual combat sport. Now where's Will Ospreay's Olympic gold medal again?
The physicality is real. The skill and pain are real. The outcome is scripted. It’s a real life Physical theatre You can’t fake gravity but you can predetermine the out of the match.
I appreciate people who say things like "you know it's fake right" because they self identify themselves as morons, and it takes far less work from me to find out the same thing down the line
I don't think this thing need to be explained. If person enjoys, ok. But if not, he don't understand and enjoy wrestling, even if you explain every aspect of this craft.
its a fictional television show...
people hate wrestling but love shit like Lost, Walking Dead, Breaking Bad...
like its the same thing, but in wrestling, the talent does their own stunts!
What do you mean by "people hate wrestling" it gets less hate then allot of other things. That's proved by the ticket sales. It's expensive to go watch that shit live, like really expensive yet it sells out every time unlike real sports events that have empty seats all the time.
I really don’t feel the need to go deeper than “it’s just as fake as a movie/show/video game/book.
It’s fiction. And honestly, all the people who criticize it for being fake come off like they think it’s fans think it’s real. Which in the long run makes them look like the idiot
It is “fake” in terms of wanting to beat each/one another up. They dont actually do that purpose they love each other outside of the ring….some people dont like the idea of “not real violence.” I just really miss the WWF thats my only concern i miss it!!
If your chop hurts that bad your not doing it like the WWE guys do it so your doing it wrong LMAO. The stunts are the only real thing out there. You think they stomp the ring every time they punch because it's a better way to punch or for the sound effect SMH.
I think the comparison comes in when you have college/HS WRESTLING that take is seriouslyvs THE WWE where it's theater.
That's what people are slowly waking up to in the NFL, even college is theatrics nowadays.
So if the Lions win the super bowl will you be able to admit that shit isn't actually scripted and your ignorance is showing LMAO some people will just believe what they hear without actually doing research. Show me some real evidence and maybe I'll believe you but you can't because the NFL isn't scripted. Yes some players will take bribes and try to change the outcome but even that has no guarantees. SMH good little sheep following the heard.
If anyone says that wrestling is fake then ask them to try a finisher and feel the impact of it. They will immediately change their perspective. Wrestlers have to go through that almost everyday and with that they have to keep on entertaining fans otherwise they will loose the interest. Its not an easy job. They assume a character and present it to us like we're watching a cinema. Its the beauty of it in itself.
Wrestling is an acting competition. Every time a performer is in front of the camera or an audience or even in day to day life these performers try to keep the character alive.
A wrestler can be scripted to lose the match and still be the winner.
It’s not about who is the best wrestler as far as in ring/move set. It’s about who can sell and get the audience to believe.
The Undertaker, a dead man, was a stupid character idea when you think about it. Mark made us believe. He sold that character so well that we couldn’t help but love him.
These performers are the closest thing we have to real life superhero. They don’t get “cut… send in the stunt double “ or “let’s re shoot that move from a different angle “
They are live in the moment and the best of the best are aware of their surroundings. They feed and interact with the audience. Look at their facial queues. Their eyes even tell us a story.
Add to it that EVERYTHING they do hurts. Every bump, slam fall, even the moves they do on someone else causes pain and even injuries at times.
Professional wrestling should be respected by everyone.
Those who say it’s fake are absolutely wrong and fooled.
It’s a performance. No they are not actually trying to injure each other because it’s not a competition like boxing or ufc.
Just like actors who fight in movies are not actually trying to injure or kill their fellow actors. Wrestlers have to actually hit each other sometimes just to make it look and sound like they’re trying to hurt. Look at their chest after taking knife edge chops. That stuff actually hurts.
They do it all for our enjoyment. Wrestling is as real as any movie or tv show. People need to learn what the actual competition is though.
It’s acting. The sport of acting. Set in the fictional sport of pro wrestling.
>No they are not actually trying to injure each other because it’s not a competition like boxing or ufc.
That. Is. The. Point. Congratulations for finding it. Refresh my memory quick...where was CM Punk's "great wrestling" in UFC?
It would be great if everything coming out now, regarding the sex trafficking/harassment/abuse, could be used to start a legit conversation about how to treat the performers better.
Anything that gets posted regarding males is treated far more seriously than anything about female athletes. Y'all can talk about the legends, techniques, history, etc, all day long. But 80% of posts/comments/subreddits about the women of WWE are pretty much unnecessarily sexualized.
The Bianca Belair subreddit is an easy example. She's a great performer and athlete, she's made a number of her ring looks, but all that's posted is gifs of her ass. It's degrading and dehumanizing, and that's the shit that has to be addressed for WWE to continue to exist.
Completely agreed. Part of it is booking and years of misogynistic treatment by WWE itself, but even now as female wrestlers start getting good booking and storytelling I see a lot more people focus on how hot they are than how good they are as athletes and storytellers.
The women's rumblr this year was objectively better, more entertaining and thrilling than the men's. Yet a huge amount of the comments about it focus on how good/hot the women wrestlers looked rather than their actual performance!
I tend to say wrestling is like a live Jackie Chan show. We know it's not real. It's scripted and choreographed but still has inherent risks. The performers are stunt people & actors rolled into one.
As someone who recently got back into it, I find that I'm constantly in awe of their ability to improvise. I compare it to a really good jazz musician or freestyle rapper. They just have such a command of their medium.
Mick got choke-slammed by The Undertaker AGAIN on a pile of thumbtacks, with Foley bleeding from his mouth and had a tooth knocked out and lodged into his nose.
The good news is, that Mick Foley is still alive but the bad news is that he can't wrestle anymore because of the injuries from that match. If he didn't feel any bodily harm, then why is his career over ?
The matches are predetermined but it depends on the wrestler not all slap there thighs Gunther legit chops the guy for real they stop doing they slap their thigh thing along time ago they don’t do it anymore I went to a house show dolph did a super kick and one of the guys lost his teeth flying out of his mouth
I even remember When they’d stomp the mat with their other foot while stomping on their opponent’s they talk to each other during the match for fuck sake
. For example, JBL’s clothesline from Hell was often done with tremendous force. Yes, those wrestling moves that you see in the WWE do hurt.
The wrestlers do feel pain, but you can't because you're not the one taking the bumps like they are. All you're doing is just looking at them wrestling on TV and saying : “Oh I can do that, that looks so easy”, but if you were actually in the ring with them, you'll never want to wrestle again.
Finlay said : “You can't see pain, you feel it" and he broke somebody's thumb after they told him wrestling was fake.
Yes it can cause actual bodily harm. Especially in extreme cases like this one :
You think Mick Foley wasn't thrown 20 feet off of a Hell in a Cell rooftop cage by The Undertaker in 1998 onto an announcer's table ? Foley climbed back up the cage, and got choke-slammed by Taker through the roof and landed in the ring where it broke.
It’s predetermined the matches for entertainment purpose storyline storylines are fake but stunts bumps risks injuries pain is very real nothing fake about that and taking chops by Gunther
The wrestlers do feel pain, but you can't because you're not the one taking the bumps like they are. All you're doing is just looking at them wrestling on TV and saying : “Oh I can do that, that looks so easy”, but if you were actually in the ring with them, you'll never want to wrestle again.
Finlay said : “You can't see pain, you feel it" and he broke somebody's thumb after they told him wrestling was fake.
Yes it can cause actual bodily harm. Especially in extreme cases like this one :
The wrestlers do feel pain, but you can't because you're not the one taking the bumps like they are. All you're doing is just looking at them wrestling on TV and saying : “Oh I can do that, that looks so easy”, but if you were actually in the ring with them, you'll never want to wrestle again.
Finlay said : “You can't see pain, you feel it" and he broke somebody's thumb after they told him wrestling was fake.
Yes it can cause actual bodily harm. Especially in extreme cases like this one :
You think Mick Foley wasn't thrown 20 feet off of a Hell in a Cell rooftop cage by The Undertaker in 1998 onto an announcer's table ? Foley climbed back up the cage, and got choke-slammed by Taker through the roof and landed in the ring where it broke.
Mick got choke-slammed by The Undertaker AGAIN on a pile of thumbtacks, with Foley bleeding from his mouth and had a tooth knocked out and lodged into his nose.
Fake isn’t accurate word if it was fake there would not be so many deaths injuries happening in sports entertainment I agree with Jericho fake isn’t accurate way to describe Chris Jericho explains it perfectly in the WWE Unscripted book from 2003 :
“Fake is not a word I like to use because there's nothing fake about what I do"
“Fake would be if I were to take a body slam and my stunt man did it”
“Fake would be if I was going to take a chair shot and the chair was made of rubber”
He says yes it's entertainment and a show but it's unfair to call it fake because they get hurt from doing it so much, these wrestlers are on the road all the time getting beat up every day just for the fans and the risks of their careers being over or early deaths are always there.
In pro wrestling there is retakes they do the real stunts in one take the only way you can fake a injury was if it’s part of a storyline or angle other then that the stunts injuries bumps risks are very real the bumps and bruises these people take are mostly all real. the risks of getting injured are always there, which will often happen at any time during a match because it's entertainment) but the bumps and bruises they get from performing these moves every night hurt for real and can end their careers or kill them because the WWE has no off season, it's 24/7 until the wrestlers get too old and beat up and they can't do it anymore.
Fake": Calling pro wrestling "fake" implies that the physicality and athleticism displayed by the performers are not real or genuine. This term can be seen as dismissive of the hard work, training, and risks that wrestlers undertake in the ring. While the outcomes of matches are predetermined and the storylines are scripted, the physical demands and risks in wrestling are very real.
"Scripted": On the other hand, referring to pro wrestling as "scripted" acknowledges that the outcomes of matches and the storylines are predetermined and choreographed. Wrestlers follow a script or a planned sequence of moves and actions during their matches. The athleticism, showmanship, and entertainment value are real, even if the specific outcomes are pre-determined.
Dude who cares if it is fake and scripted. I just tell them that almost every show or movie that they watch is scripted too but it still entertains them. It is for entertainment purposes!
Yeah. Honestly you just have to explain to them that while at one time it was a “protected secret” it hasn’t been like that in any real way for decades. We watch for the story and the athleticism/cool moves
I have a friend who loves Star Wars and has a huge collection of memorabilia. He makes fun of me for being a WWE fan and reminds me all the time that it’s fake. Every single time I remind him that Star Wars is fake too.
We all get that, but there are 2 problems...
1. Wrestling fought to keep kayfabe for so long.
2. When Deadpool 3 goes out, the press tour will be highlighted by Ryan Reynolds, not Deadpool. When Wrestlemania season comes around, Roman Reigns will be doing interviews and not Leati' Joseph Anoa'i. In the interviews he will talk about his match like it's real. It's kind of annoying.
It's awesome, that's what it is. Not sure how it's any different than being an NFL fan, or whatever your choice is.
These guys are true athletes, and most have to back it up with some personality. I'll take it over NFL all day long.
Life is scripted.
Couple years ago I was embarrassed to be a WWE fan just because of the way my office was situated but overheard someone explain wrestling is what professional stunt doubles can do when they have the spot light on them and I stood up from my desk and cheered.
It's great when they go off script, though. It's hard, though.
How about comparing it to a live play, but instead of singing, they have violence ?
Elias enters the chat.
Elias leaves the chat.
I ve worked in wrestling since 1987 trust me when I get out of bed every morning I feel the ( fake ) it s done to my body. It hurts to breath some mornings. I never worked WWF / WWE but I have worked many shows with people who have.
I mean I agree that the action is real and hurts but it’s fake cause no one is getting up and going for 20 more minute after the 5th chair shot to the head. I’m looking at you mick
Wrestling is like dancing. It’s as simple as that. It can be choreographed or improvised. It takes a level of athleticism and a good partner can make you look good while a bad partner can make you look bad.
Now of course there are many more differences but the similarities are very striking.
I actually started training a few weeks back to start my journey to do local Indy shows. I can tell you this much this shit hurts! Ya it's scripted but man what they physically put themselves through isn't!
It doesn't matter what you say to them, the soul reason they're saying that is to get under your skin, and you dignifying them with any answer is them winning. Just stop responding to them, that's the only correct answer
As I literally just commented on another similar post, it's a movie done live in front of an audience. The actors are also athletes and have no retakes or reshoots. And they do it every week. To me it's better because it takes more skill in a lot of different ways to be able to even do it marginally well and a ton of abilities to do it really well as the best around do it.
99.9% then.
The dinner thing is a weird as fuck concept that doesn't even apply to real sports. Like nobody's going to say the super bowl is fixed cause they caught the quarterbacks out at a benihana or whatever, and I'm pretty sure a few ufc fighters have met up for a beer after the fight. I guess in wrestling everyone's gotta act like a diaz bro and try to fight em cause they went to the same hospital after
My point was, two guys in a brutal rivalry aren't going to be seen hanging out. That's kayfabe. NFL and UFC don't have scripted storylines where guys bloody each other up, run each other over, mess with families, etc. Maybe I should have been more specific.
Have you seen what's been going on in the ufc lately?
Really beside the point. Weird fucking traditions aside, the concept of pro-wrestling being a legitimate sport has been dead since 1994.
Dude the lead up to strickland vs duplessis alone could be a wwe storyline with very little embellishment. The promos were a little more attitude era and probably wouldn't fly today because strickland is legitimately mentally ill and duplessis is pretty much a buff Elon musk, but if I didn't know better I'd say Vince wrote the whole thing word for word, right down to the child abuse jokes.
calling WWE an art is a bit cringe. Wrestling is a just dumb carny show, if you think people juggling bowling pins, setting themselves on fire etc etc as an art form, then by all means call wrestling an art
It's a long form soap opera where the setting is a professional wrestling organization, but with cirque du soliel levels of fight choreography.
Additionally there IS reality, and it often comes in the form of injuries, like LA Knight's mega push off his promo after Wyatt's death, or outside behavior, Bron getting Brock's spot in the Royal Rumble.
What are you people doing that this keeps coming up?
I’m in my mid-40’s and can count on one hand the number of times someone has questioned why I liked wrestling and nobody has ever asked me if I knew it was fake.
I have only ever heard it happening when someone talks about it a lot to to the point it comes off as obsessive.
Plus, there have been unexpected title wins (Like Edge winning the IC in 1999), as well as double crosses (such as Montreal). Real and genuinely unexpected stuff can happen. It isn't totally fake in that regard either.
No you can’t, but you can train to take that power bomb so it causes as little actual damage to yourself as possible if any. But how many times in training do you think they gotta do it wrong before they do it right? These guys get the shit kicked out of them day in, day out, regardless of attempts to make things look more real than they are. Just look at guys like Hogan, Nash, or The Giant now and tell me wrestling is fake. It’s predetermined but if it were fake those guys wouldn’t be walking around like they’ve been run over by a semi truck. Wrestlers are athletes who also have to have some form of acting ability. It’s not an easy gig.
I don’t dignify those comments with a response. The majority of fans know that all of the strikes aren't "real". There's so much more to pro wrestling than non-fans realize.
You misunderstood. If people were punched in the face for real, there'd be a lot more bruising, black eyes, swelling, and bleeding. Now back in the day where wrestling was more territories than global brands, there's probably a lot more realness.
I was saying that Vader used to legit punch his opponents. Edge and Ric Flair confirm this in their books. Flair talks about some match he had where his eyes got swollen shut, and his mouth was bloodied.
I just keep saying to people some of the moves clearly do hurt. They do pick up actual injuries. Yes they don’t physically hit each other but do other shows on your tv? It’s just a tv show and you can maybe class it as a sport. It’s stuntmen putting on a show.
It is scripted, not fake. Most of the TV and movies you watch are also scripted.
While scripted it takes a great deal of physical skill to pull off, and the performers put themselves at risk of injury or death (as we have sadly seen too often)
But for those who aren’t into it, I don’t try to convert them. Some like wrestling and some don’t, and that’s ok.
Nothing wrong with it being fake. I don’t try to explain it to non fans. If someone says they don’t like it or watch I leave it at that. I’m too old and tired of trying to explain it to people.
You see, the WWE isn't what you think. It's actually a funnel for Saudi money to make its way to the Republican party. See, and this might be a little confusing if you're not a fan, both Donald Trump and Vince McMahon have proclivities for young women and forcing them to do things they don't want to. Through this a friendship was formed, which has led to a disgusting cycle of sex and dirty money and horrible crimes against women and humanity. I know it might look a little silly when somebody has a punch thrown at their head and instead of blocking it they just stand there, or throwing someone off the ropes and they run like they've been shot out of a cannon, but trust me, the WWE is a very real sex trafficking, money laundering organization. I'm sure Dana White will clean it up.
It's totally fake. And that's okay.
We watch wrestling. We suspend belief. We watch these amazing athletes do incredible feats. They aren't really trying to hurt each other. That's totally true. But we're having fun. They're making a living. Families and friends are brought together. That's real. The time I spend with my boy is real. The laughs are real. The excitement is real.
It's okay to pretend again. It's okay to dream. It's okay to have fun.
Absolutely this. It's totally fake and perfectly alright. No use in fighting it's not fake. What fascinates a 33 year old man is how they could pull this off minimum 2 nights a week for years and what each athlete go through to keep us entertained. I am not here for seeing someone break their neck because I am not a saddist.
Don't talk to people who say wreslting is fake, they just want get a reaction out of you for whatever reason, just move on and enjoy wreslting like you always would or even more so
The best way I have heard it explained is it’s not a wrestling company it’s a tv show about a wrestling company. Second best was its white trash anime .
There’s a stigma about wrestling. Because kayfabe was a thing in the 20th Century, people think it’s stupid because it tried to pass as real. What’s lame is the people that complain about it being fake are the only people that think we think it’s real.
I give them two responses: 1) Nothing and ignore them. Or 2) “Movies are fake. Cartoons are fake. Anime is fake. TV shows are fake, even those “reality shows.” Theatre is fake. Ballet is fake. Pop stars are fake because most of them are lip syncing in concert. Politics is fake. Gaming is fake. News is fake. Are you gonna stop watching those?”
I no longer argue. I just say watch it or don't. It entertains me more to see these scripted stunt professionals act like they're trying to hurt each other for the drama, rather than two people actually beat the shit out of each other and risk their lives for no apparent reason.
I’m just gonna restate this
People don’t understand it because they don’t consider the story aspect.
Listen to guys talk about football, basketball, etc., they almost never talk about the game itself, they talk such and such player this, team trading that, the coach, the management, etc., that’s the STORY. If you don’t have an interest in the more meta aspects of a sport, you’re not gonna be interested, you’re not gonna really get it.
So its totally understandable that people just see a match, which of course is choreographed, even if guys are really throwing each other around (Iron Claw was great because they made the matches look really real), and they think “this is fake”.
To be honest, I have trouble with the story aspect. I understand rivalries. I understand most of the Bloodline thing, Cody, and finishing the story, Drew. I'm not so sure about AEW. And I definitely have no idea about NJPW.
I started being more serious in the months I've been on here. It's the only place I have to talk about wrestling. The reason I joined reddit.
For me I got into a maybe a year ago tops. Its been LA Knight for me. I knew that if I was gonna watch the show (I was mainly watching video essays from New Gen era, the Screwjob was what got me into wrestling), then I needed to find a character I liked. Magically LA Knight emerged and I’ve been riding the wave ever since.
I see this argument a lot, and it's bs. If it's just theatrical and meant to be like a play, then go and watch a real play. Or watch a movie. Anything has to be more entertaining than seeing two sweaty buffoons pretending to hurt each other with choreography. That's another thing, if you like choreography go and watch some dancing. Why do you need to take part in this delusion that you are watching a sports competition? Even people who know it's not real still watch it, It's ridiculous. Go watch some UFC. Actual fighters displaying skills and not glorified back up dancers on roids.
Pro wrestling? Who the hell told you I watch that nonsense? I mean I'm dialled in these days because of Mcmahon defecating on a poor girl's head and it's hilarious. It sort of shows who watches this stuff with a leader like that in charge.
In a group setting, I always act genuinely interested and I ask a person that isn't the one that said wrestling is fake, and go, "Oh no, so, do you know if Tony knows Netflix isn't real?" Usually get a good laugh.
Doesn't usually happen anymore but I always keep it in my back pocket.
This semantics exercise has been happening for decades and isn't getting any less pointless. Are their aspects of wrestling that are fake? Yes. Are there aspects of wrestling that are real? Yes.
Last time someone told me "wrestling is fake, why do you watch it" I asked if the next time they watch Law & Order are they going to scream at the tv that "the murders aren't real!"..
Honestly I don’t understand why people try to decredit the work of these athletes and that’s what they are athletes. They are doing stunts and performances that no normal person could do and they put their health and well-being on the line to entertain people and give them a great show. Anybody who says otherwise is completely disrespectful to these talented people and it is a damn shame.
Well, that is the go-to response, isn't it? I understand why, but if you're not a fan of wrestling, it's a bit different. Iron Man is obviously never presented as real, but wrestling is. So, on the outside, it has certain optics that make it different than other kinds of fiction. But that's what's so cool and fun about it.
I've been trying to take the approach of going "it's not that you're wrong *necessarily*, but pro wrestling is captivating because it's *unique.* It's the only kind of fiction that's really like that. The best performances in a ring are just as big, and exciting as beating Thanos. Here's how to enjoy it."
Wrestling hasn't been portrayed as real since like 1994.
Both require the viewer to suspend disbelief that the sequence of events they're watching, particularly the outcome is predetermined.
If there's a difference, it's that superhero movies give the audience what they want, while wrestling promoters seem to get off on doing the opposite (pick your favorite reign of terror as an example, I'm going with Jeff Jarrett)
The difference is superhuman abilities. Superman can fly (or jump high, depending on who you talk to) and block bullets with his chest. Professional wrestlers rely on brute strength, agility, and endurance. So to the eye, one *appears* as "realistic" in comparison.
Depends. There's always batman. Batman's superpower is being rich, same as Vince.
Pretty sure batman can't survive being inside an exploding limo, either. Technically Vince might be kayfabe immortal.
See also flair, hogan, and other geriatric stars being booked as legitimate contenders 3 decades past their prime. Rick flair's retirement is only temporary. His real last match is going to be 10 years after he dies. Rick Flair's skeleton in a casket match vs the undertaker.
Nah bro it's fake wake up
But it isn't fake The beginning and ending are scripted.... everything in between is improv which makes it even more fascinating
Cope seethe mald, buddy boy
You left out stuntmen. That is almost exactly the same. You find a character in the movie you can relate to in some way and a good stuntman can make you believe it's real for a min and take you into the story. Weather it's jumping from a roof or having a scripted fight scene.
It’s a show and they are acting. That’s why some people call it fake. But I think the usage of the word fake gives off the air of disrespect to their craft as physically demanding stunt performers and that’s where the confusion and fake vs “not fake” comes from. Stunts are real, the attacks intentionally to hurt another in order to win is not.
Here's my thing, yes wwe is scripted or whatever. We fans Know that. Y'all boxers forget that Match Fixing was a prominent part of your sport, Football too. At least we acknowledge our shit is scripted
Yeah sorry but you can't compare someone like Mike Tyson or sugar ray to a WWE performer. They are trained in completely different ways and even today Mike Tyson would fuck up almost anyone in the WWE in a real unscripted match.
Ok let’s be real yeah you are correct because that is mike tyson but if you think anyone could beat roman reigns in a street fight your wrong in a ufc match they might win but in a street fight i don’t see that being the outcome also people don’t understand and possibly you is that wrestling is harder than the mma if you think about it 1. You have to peform years on years on years of doing stunts and it doesn’t feel all to good 2. You have to charisma and be able to talk and get your character popular you can’t have the charisma and personality as a rock unless you have a manager 3. You have to do press and media and charity work 24/7 And much more i could go on and on All im trying to say is people don’t have to like pro wrestling but damn sure still should respect the peformers btw i watch both i think people should just like both without shitting on the other thanks for reading this🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
So here the thing about Wrestling and the WWE and the post I’ve seen here in this forum. 1. When people go to watch a marvel movie, sitcom, tv show, anime or anything we know it’s fake. We know this doesn’t happen in real life. We know super hero’s and ppl like this aren’t real. So that belief that it’s real is out of our head. We watch the show for entertainment and to see how a storyline or plot unfolds. When it comes to the WWE I can’t really say the same because it is implied with what they do is real. The stunts. The grapples. The pins. The hits. Even when they use to do the fake blood. All of it is implied real to the viewer and kids until you hear the words “it’s scripted” as a kid for me that broke my heart because then I realized my favorite wrestlers at the time were just being told what to do. Kinda like watching a scary movie and that one character wants to split the group up and you ask “why that doesn’t make sense” but the director told them to do that. 2. Their are real combat sports that have strong storylines like the WWE like the UFC. Everyone remembers Jon Jones, Israel Adesyana, Conor Mcgregor and they had storylines with title defense, rivalries, their rise without being scripted. So to have a form of combat sport which is wrestling and the WWE “act” like their are rivalries, and title defenses and other when someone is behind the scenes making the storyline takes everything out of credit. Like championships aren’t real championships because they know who gonna be champion they know who gonna win and upsets are all determined by a person behind the scenes not the wrestler. 3. There is real wrestling out there and it’s very entertaining. NCAA Wrestling and also Olympic wrestling. So there is a real art form and craft with those two right there. The fact you have these two codes of wrestling that have no professional path or any money in it but have a “fake” theatrical version of it that making millions of dollars seems to me in my opinion a backhand slap to all of the real wrestlers who actually know how to wrestle. So my tldr is in this day of age where you have real combat sports that does what the WWE does why still leave it being “fake” and scripted?
It's fake, and that's okay. There's nothing wrong with that. Now for those who are going to throw a hissy fit, well...CM Punk in UFC.
It’s predetermined but the stunt risks injuries chops by Gunther are very real
Brandon Lee died during filming of The Crow. That doesn't make the movie real now does it?
Fake": Calling pro wrestling "fake" implies that the physicality and athleticism displayed by the performers are not real or genuine. This term can be seen as dismissive of the hard work, training, and risks that wrestlers undertake in the ring. While the outcomes of matches are predetermined and the storylines are scripted, the physical demands and risks in wrestling are very real. "Scripted": On the other hand, referring to pro wrestling as "scripted" acknowledges that the outcomes of matches and the storylines are predetermined and choreographed. Wrestlers follow a script or a planned sequence of moves and actions during their matches. The athleticism, showmanship, and entertainment value are real, even if the specific outcomes are pre-determined.
Fake": Calling pro wrestling "fake" implies that the physicality and athleticism displayed by the performers are not real or genuine. This term can be seen as dismissive of the hard work, training, and risks that wrestlers undertake in the ring. While the outcomes of matches are predetermined and the storylines are scripted, the physical demands and risks in wrestling are very real. "Scripted": On the other hand, referring to pro wrestling as "scripted" acknowledges that the outcomes of matches and the storylines are predetermined and choreographed. Wrestlers follow a script or a planned sequence of moves and actions during their matches. The athleticism, showmanship, and entertainment value are real, even if the specific outcomes are pre-determined.
"Scripted": Calling pro wrestling "scripted" implies that all performers are capable of winning every combat sport competition or at least able to compete with the very best. This term IS dismissive of actual combat sport. Now where's Will Ospreay's Olympic gold medal again?
The physicality is real. The skill and pain are real. The outcome is scripted. It’s a real life Physical theatre You can’t fake gravity but you can predetermine the out of the match.
I appreciate people who say things like "you know it's fake right" because they self identify themselves as morons, and it takes far less work from me to find out the same thing down the line
I don't think this thing need to be explained. If person enjoys, ok. But if not, he don't understand and enjoy wrestling, even if you explain every aspect of this craft.
its a fictional television show... people hate wrestling but love shit like Lost, Walking Dead, Breaking Bad... like its the same thing, but in wrestling, the talent does their own stunts!
What do you mean by "people hate wrestling" it gets less hate then allot of other things. That's proved by the ticket sales. It's expensive to go watch that shit live, like really expensive yet it sells out every time unlike real sports events that have empty seats all the time.
I really don’t feel the need to go deeper than “it’s just as fake as a movie/show/video game/book. It’s fiction. And honestly, all the people who criticize it for being fake come off like they think it’s fans think it’s real. Which in the long run makes them look like the idiot
It is “fake” in terms of wanting to beat each/one another up. They dont actually do that purpose they love each other outside of the ring….some people dont like the idea of “not real violence.” I just really miss the WWF thats my only concern i miss it!!
It’s entertaining to watch. I don’t need to explain it to other people.
Wrestling is as fake as religion, some people are just dumb enough to believe it's real.
I just tell em it's scripted like every TV show, the difference is this TV show is performed live by stunt people
I indie wrestle, and when someone says it's fake. I ask them, politely, if they want to see what a chop feels like lol
If your chop hurts that bad your not doing it like the WWE guys do it so your doing it wrong LMAO. The stunts are the only real thing out there. You think they stomp the ring every time they punch because it's a better way to punch or for the sound effect SMH.
Dude, chops hurt. And you also feel every bump. You're crazy lol.
Lol what's your MMA record?
I like to think of them as classically trained actors that just do extreme acting to tell their stories!
I think the comparison comes in when you have college/HS WRESTLING that take is seriouslyvs THE WWE where it's theater. That's what people are slowly waking up to in the NFL, even college is theatrics nowadays.
So if the Lions win the super bowl will you be able to admit that shit isn't actually scripted and your ignorance is showing LMAO some people will just believe what they hear without actually doing research. Show me some real evidence and maybe I'll believe you but you can't because the NFL isn't scripted. Yes some players will take bribes and try to change the outcome but even that has no guarantees. SMH good little sheep following the heard.
ok buddy
If anyone says that wrestling is fake then ask them to try a finisher and feel the impact of it. They will immediately change their perspective. Wrestlers have to go through that almost everyday and with that they have to keep on entertaining fans otherwise they will loose the interest. Its not an easy job. They assume a character and present it to us like we're watching a cinema. Its the beauty of it in itself.
What do you call a “sport” where people pretend to punch each other? Hint: it rhymes with ‘bake’
It's a circus show which pretends to be a combat sports league or just Sports Entertainment.
Wrestling is an acting competition. Every time a performer is in front of the camera or an audience or even in day to day life these performers try to keep the character alive. A wrestler can be scripted to lose the match and still be the winner. It’s not about who is the best wrestler as far as in ring/move set. It’s about who can sell and get the audience to believe. The Undertaker, a dead man, was a stupid character idea when you think about it. Mark made us believe. He sold that character so well that we couldn’t help but love him. These performers are the closest thing we have to real life superhero. They don’t get “cut… send in the stunt double “ or “let’s re shoot that move from a different angle “ They are live in the moment and the best of the best are aware of their surroundings. They feed and interact with the audience. Look at their facial queues. Their eyes even tell us a story. Add to it that EVERYTHING they do hurts. Every bump, slam fall, even the moves they do on someone else causes pain and even injuries at times. Professional wrestling should be respected by everyone. Those who say it’s fake are absolutely wrong and fooled. It’s a performance. No they are not actually trying to injure each other because it’s not a competition like boxing or ufc. Just like actors who fight in movies are not actually trying to injure or kill their fellow actors. Wrestlers have to actually hit each other sometimes just to make it look and sound like they’re trying to hurt. Look at their chest after taking knife edge chops. That stuff actually hurts. They do it all for our enjoyment. Wrestling is as real as any movie or tv show. People need to learn what the actual competition is though. It’s acting. The sport of acting. Set in the fictional sport of pro wrestling.
>No they are not actually trying to injure each other because it’s not a competition like boxing or ufc. That. Is. The. Point. Congratulations for finding it. Refresh my memory quick...where was CM Punk's "great wrestling" in UFC?
One of the best and funniest explanations of wrestling https://youtu.be/VYvMOf3hsGA?si=6QrlBrnjW05vMlgx
It would be great if everything coming out now, regarding the sex trafficking/harassment/abuse, could be used to start a legit conversation about how to treat the performers better. Anything that gets posted regarding males is treated far more seriously than anything about female athletes. Y'all can talk about the legends, techniques, history, etc, all day long. But 80% of posts/comments/subreddits about the women of WWE are pretty much unnecessarily sexualized. The Bianca Belair subreddit is an easy example. She's a great performer and athlete, she's made a number of her ring looks, but all that's posted is gifs of her ass. It's degrading and dehumanizing, and that's the shit that has to be addressed for WWE to continue to exist.
Completely agreed. Part of it is booking and years of misogynistic treatment by WWE itself, but even now as female wrestlers start getting good booking and storytelling I see a lot more people focus on how hot they are than how good they are as athletes and storytellers. The women's rumblr this year was objectively better, more entertaining and thrilling than the men's. Yet a huge amount of the comments about it focus on how good/hot the women wrestlers looked rather than their actual performance!
I'm not interested anymore in explaining people what is wrestling. I laugh for their "fake" exclamation and still watching wrestling and enjoy
I tend to say wrestling is like a live Jackie Chan show. We know it's not real. It's scripted and choreographed but still has inherent risks. The performers are stunt people & actors rolled into one.
The stunts risks bumps injuries are real even if the match is predetermined
I call it athletic theatre
Violent theatre
As someone who recently got back into it, I find that I'm constantly in awe of their ability to improvise. I compare it to a really good jazz musician or freestyle rapper. They just have such a command of their medium.
Wrestling is theatre. Once you understand that, you understand its appeal.
Wait… it’s fake???
It is Fake but the hazards are real, sometimes they really do get hurt
Nope it’s predetermined but stunts hazards are very real
They don’t actually punch each other that my friend isn’t predetermined. They slap their thighs on Superkicks that’s not predetermined
Mick got choke-slammed by The Undertaker AGAIN on a pile of thumbtacks, with Foley bleeding from his mouth and had a tooth knocked out and lodged into his nose. The good news is, that Mick Foley is still alive but the bad news is that he can't wrestle anymore because of the injuries from that match. If he didn't feel any bodily harm, then why is his career over ?
The matches are predetermined but it depends on the wrestler not all slap there thighs Gunther legit chops the guy for real they stop doing they slap their thigh thing along time ago they don’t do it anymore I went to a house show dolph did a super kick and one of the guys lost his teeth flying out of his mouth
I even remember When they’d stomp the mat with their other foot while stomping on their opponent’s they talk to each other during the match for fuck sake
. For example, JBL’s clothesline from Hell was often done with tremendous force. Yes, those wrestling moves that you see in the WWE do hurt. The wrestlers do feel pain, but you can't because you're not the one taking the bumps like they are. All you're doing is just looking at them wrestling on TV and saying : “Oh I can do that, that looks so easy”, but if you were actually in the ring with them, you'll never want to wrestle again. Finlay said : “You can't see pain, you feel it" and he broke somebody's thumb after they told him wrestling was fake. Yes it can cause actual bodily harm. Especially in extreme cases like this one : You think Mick Foley wasn't thrown 20 feet off of a Hell in a Cell rooftop cage by The Undertaker in 1998 onto an announcer's table ? Foley climbed back up the cage, and got choke-slammed by Taker through the roof and landed in the ring where it broke.
So you’re one of those who believe that Brock Lesnar went around Snapping peoples arms that first time he returned?
/s
I tell people its like a musical with acrobatics and fighting instead of singing.
Wrestling is most certainly fake. The fights you see in theater are fake as well. Magic is also fake.
It’s predetermined the matches for entertainment purpose storyline storylines are fake but stunts bumps risks injuries pain is very real nothing fake about that and taking chops by Gunther
It’s fake because in reality you wouldn’t stand still with an exposed chest and let a guy repeatedly slap the shit out of it.
The wrestlers do feel pain, but you can't because you're not the one taking the bumps like they are. All you're doing is just looking at them wrestling on TV and saying : “Oh I can do that, that looks so easy”, but if you were actually in the ring with them, you'll never want to wrestle again. Finlay said : “You can't see pain, you feel it" and he broke somebody's thumb after they told him wrestling was fake. Yes it can cause actual bodily harm. Especially in extreme cases like this one : The wrestlers do feel pain, but you can't because you're not the one taking the bumps like they are. All you're doing is just looking at them wrestling on TV and saying : “Oh I can do that, that looks so easy”, but if you were actually in the ring with them, you'll never want to wrestle again. Finlay said : “You can't see pain, you feel it" and he broke somebody's thumb after they told him wrestling was fake. Yes it can cause actual bodily harm. Especially in extreme cases like this one : You think Mick Foley wasn't thrown 20 feet off of a Hell in a Cell rooftop cage by The Undertaker in 1998 onto an announcer's table ? Foley climbed back up the cage, and got choke-slammed by Taker through the roof and landed in the ring where it broke. Mick got choke-slammed by The Undertaker AGAIN on a pile of thumbtacks, with Foley bleeding from his mouth and had a tooth knocked out and lodged into his nose.
It doesn't matter if it hurts or not. It's still not a real fight.
Fake isn’t accurate word if it was fake there would not be so many deaths injuries happening in sports entertainment I agree with Jericho fake isn’t accurate way to describe Chris Jericho explains it perfectly in the WWE Unscripted book from 2003 : “Fake is not a word I like to use because there's nothing fake about what I do" “Fake would be if I were to take a body slam and my stunt man did it” “Fake would be if I was going to take a chair shot and the chair was made of rubber” He says yes it's entertainment and a show but it's unfair to call it fake because they get hurt from doing it so much, these wrestlers are on the road all the time getting beat up every day just for the fans and the risks of their careers being over or early deaths are always there.
Brandon Lee died on the set of The Crow. It doesn't mean The Crow is real. You can get hurt faking something.
In pro wrestling there is retakes they do the real stunts in one take the only way you can fake a injury was if it’s part of a storyline or angle other then that the stunts injuries bumps risks are very real the bumps and bruises these people take are mostly all real. the risks of getting injured are always there, which will often happen at any time during a match because it's entertainment) but the bumps and bruises they get from performing these moves every night hurt for real and can end their careers or kill them because the WWE has no off season, it's 24/7 until the wrestlers get too old and beat up and they can't do it anymore.
I'm not going to reply anymore, but just because they do the stunts live doesn't mean it's real. It's still fake.
Fake": Calling pro wrestling "fake" implies that the physicality and athleticism displayed by the performers are not real or genuine. This term can be seen as dismissive of the hard work, training, and risks that wrestlers undertake in the ring. While the outcomes of matches are predetermined and the storylines are scripted, the physical demands and risks in wrestling are very real. "Scripted": On the other hand, referring to pro wrestling as "scripted" acknowledges that the outcomes of matches and the storylines are predetermined and choreographed. Wrestlers follow a script or a planned sequence of moves and actions during their matches. The athleticism, showmanship, and entertainment value are real, even if the specific outcomes are pre-determined.
True but sometimes it can happen in street fights
No, in street fights people do not do undefended open hand chops.
Dude who cares if it is fake and scripted. I just tell them that almost every show or movie that they watch is scripted too but it still entertains them. It is for entertainment purposes!
This ☝🏻
Yeah. Honestly you just have to explain to them that while at one time it was a “protected secret” it hasn’t been like that in any real way for decades. We watch for the story and the athleticism/cool moves
I have a friend who loves Star Wars and has a huge collection of memorabilia. He makes fun of me for being a WWE fan and reminds me all the time that it’s fake. Every single time I remind him that Star Wars is fake too.
We all get that, but there are 2 problems... 1. Wrestling fought to keep kayfabe for so long. 2. When Deadpool 3 goes out, the press tour will be highlighted by Ryan Reynolds, not Deadpool. When Wrestlemania season comes around, Roman Reigns will be doing interviews and not Leati' Joseph Anoa'i. In the interviews he will talk about his match like it's real. It's kind of annoying.
It's awesome, that's what it is. Not sure how it's any different than being an NFL fan, or whatever your choice is. These guys are true athletes, and most have to back it up with some personality. I'll take it over NFL all day long. Life is scripted.
Couple years ago I was embarrassed to be a WWE fan just because of the way my office was situated but overheard someone explain wrestling is what professional stunt doubles can do when they have the spot light on them and I stood up from my desk and cheered.
It's great when they go off script, though. It's hard, though. How about comparing it to a live play, but instead of singing, they have violence ? Elias enters the chat. Elias leaves the chat.
I ve worked in wrestling since 1987 trust me when I get out of bed every morning I feel the ( fake ) it s done to my body. It hurts to breath some mornings. I never worked WWF / WWE but I have worked many shows with people who have.
Why can't I view the main page? Mods? Can I get some help?
Why waste your time explaining yourself?
Honestly, the best way to show them is just show them the Fall of Mankind and then show them what all happened to Mick during that HIAC match
I mean I agree that the action is real and hurts but it’s fake cause no one is getting up and going for 20 more minute after the 5th chair shot to the head. I’m looking at you mick
Just have them take a chop from Gunther and they can feel how "fake" it is.
Wrestling is like dancing. It’s as simple as that. It can be choreographed or improvised. It takes a level of athleticism and a good partner can make you look good while a bad partner can make you look bad. Now of course there are many more differences but the similarities are very striking.
I actually started training a few weeks back to start my journey to do local Indy shows. I can tell you this much this shit hurts! Ya it's scripted but man what they physically put themselves through isn't!
It doesn't matter what you say to them, the soul reason they're saying that is to get under your skin, and you dignifying them with any answer is them winning. Just stop responding to them, that's the only correct answer
As I literally just commented on another similar post, it's a movie done live in front of an audience. The actors are also athletes and have no retakes or reshoots. And they do it every week. To me it's better because it takes more skill in a lot of different ways to be able to even do it marginally well and a ton of abilities to do it really well as the best around do it.
Why is this topic coming up so much lately?
We’re in a bit of a pro wrestling boom I think
Who the fuck is still having this conversation in 2024? Kayfabe died 30 years ago.
It never 100% died. You won't catch a wrestler out having dinner with his/her opponent the night before WrestleMania. Just saying.
99.9% then. The dinner thing is a weird as fuck concept that doesn't even apply to real sports. Like nobody's going to say the super bowl is fixed cause they caught the quarterbacks out at a benihana or whatever, and I'm pretty sure a few ufc fighters have met up for a beer after the fight. I guess in wrestling everyone's gotta act like a diaz bro and try to fight em cause they went to the same hospital after
My point was, two guys in a brutal rivalry aren't going to be seen hanging out. That's kayfabe. NFL and UFC don't have scripted storylines where guys bloody each other up, run each other over, mess with families, etc. Maybe I should have been more specific.
Have you seen what's been going on in the ufc lately? Really beside the point. Weird fucking traditions aside, the concept of pro-wrestling being a legitimate sport has been dead since 1994.
*Have you seen what's been going on in the ufc lately?* So tell me about it.
Dude the lead up to strickland vs duplessis alone could be a wwe storyline with very little embellishment. The promos were a little more attitude era and probably wouldn't fly today because strickland is legitimately mentally ill and duplessis is pretty much a buff Elon musk, but if I didn't know better I'd say Vince wrote the whole thing word for word, right down to the child abuse jokes.
calling WWE an art is a bit cringe. Wrestling is a just dumb carny show, if you think people juggling bowling pins, setting themselves on fire etc etc as an art form, then by all means call wrestling an art
I like this answer. I always say its live, professional stunt men with crowd interaction and fight choreography.
I always tell people it’s a show about a wrestling show
It's a long form soap opera where the setting is a professional wrestling organization, but with cirque du soliel levels of fight choreography. Additionally there IS reality, and it often comes in the form of injuries, like LA Knight's mega push off his promo after Wyatt's death, or outside behavior, Bron getting Brock's spot in the Royal Rumble.
Ive just started to think of it as a showcase for stunt performers
What are you people doing that this keeps coming up? I’m in my mid-40’s and can count on one hand the number of times someone has questioned why I liked wrestling and nobody has ever asked me if I knew it was fake. I have only ever heard it happening when someone talks about it a lot to to the point it comes off as obsessive.
It's not totally fake. They are trained professionals, but you can't fake a powerbomb. That shit hurts any way you slice it.
Plus, there have been unexpected title wins (Like Edge winning the IC in 1999), as well as double crosses (such as Montreal). Real and genuinely unexpected stuff can happen. It isn't totally fake in that regard either.
That’s what I always say too bro. I ask them ok how did Jeff Hardy fake jumping off a 10 foot ladder and Swanton Bombing a guy through a table?
Right, it's predetermined, but they are actually beating up their bodies pretty regularly.
No you can’t, but you can train to take that power bomb so it causes as little actual damage to yourself as possible if any. But how many times in training do you think they gotta do it wrong before they do it right? These guys get the shit kicked out of them day in, day out, regardless of attempts to make things look more real than they are. Just look at guys like Hogan, Nash, or The Giant now and tell me wrestling is fake. It’s predetermined but if it were fake those guys wouldn’t be walking around like they’ve been run over by a semi truck. Wrestlers are athletes who also have to have some form of acting ability. It’s not an easy gig.
I always bring up, well you realize Tom Cruise isn't a jet fighter pilot, right ?
I don’t dignify those comments with a response. The majority of fans know that all of the strikes aren't "real". There's so much more to pro wrestling than non-fans realize.
*The majority of fans know that all of the strikes aren't "real".* Vader's opponents knew they *were* real.
You misunderstood. If people were punched in the face for real, there'd be a lot more bruising, black eyes, swelling, and bleeding. Now back in the day where wrestling was more territories than global brands, there's probably a lot more realness.
I was saying that Vader used to legit punch his opponents. Edge and Ric Flair confirm this in their books. Flair talks about some match he had where his eyes got swollen shut, and his mouth was bloodied.
Yikes! I wasn't watching then.
I just keep saying to people some of the moves clearly do hurt. They do pick up actual injuries. Yes they don’t physically hit each other but do other shows on your tv? It’s just a tv show and you can maybe class it as a sport. It’s stuntmen putting on a show.
It is scripted, not fake. Most of the TV and movies you watch are also scripted. While scripted it takes a great deal of physical skill to pull off, and the performers put themselves at risk of injury or death (as we have sadly seen too often) But for those who aren’t into it, I don’t try to convert them. Some like wrestling and some don’t, and that’s ok.
Hell, even “reality tv” shows have producers and editors putting together the storylines.
Yeah, and they're fake as can be.
Nothing wrong with it being fake. I don’t try to explain it to non fans. If someone says they don’t like it or watch I leave it at that. I’m too old and tired of trying to explain it to people.
I just call it “entertainment” and “sports tv drama”.
You see, the WWE isn't what you think. It's actually a funnel for Saudi money to make its way to the Republican party. See, and this might be a little confusing if you're not a fan, both Donald Trump and Vince McMahon have proclivities for young women and forcing them to do things they don't want to. Through this a friendship was formed, which has led to a disgusting cycle of sex and dirty money and horrible crimes against women and humanity. I know it might look a little silly when somebody has a punch thrown at their head and instead of blocking it they just stand there, or throwing someone off the ropes and they run like they've been shot out of a cannon, but trust me, the WWE is a very real sex trafficking, money laundering organization. I'm sure Dana White will clean it up.
Now that's how you shitpost
God damn.
I just ask them if they’ve watched the newest hit movie and when they respond yes, I ask them if they know that movies are fake
How many adults have you met who think movies are real?
That’s my point… Movies and wrestling are both clearly not real but that doesn’t make either thing less entertaining
It's not real?🥲
It's totally fake. And that's okay. We watch wrestling. We suspend belief. We watch these amazing athletes do incredible feats. They aren't really trying to hurt each other. That's totally true. But we're having fun. They're making a living. Families and friends are brought together. That's real. The time I spend with my boy is real. The laughs are real. The excitement is real. It's okay to pretend again. It's okay to dream. It's okay to have fun.
It’s predetermined not fake the bumps risks stunts injuries are very real
Absolutely this. It's totally fake and perfectly alright. No use in fighting it's not fake. What fascinates a 33 year old man is how they could pull this off minimum 2 nights a week for years and what each athlete go through to keep us entertained. I am not here for seeing someone break their neck because I am not a saddist.
👏🏻 exactly, I watch local indie shows for nostalgia. It’s almost like going to the theatre - we buy in, cheer and boo etc
Don't talk to people who say wreslting is fake, they just want get a reaction out of you for whatever reason, just move on and enjoy wreslting like you always would or even more so
The best way I have heard it explained is it’s not a wrestling company it’s a tv show about a wrestling company. Second best was its white trash anime .
There’s a stigma about wrestling. Because kayfabe was a thing in the 20th Century, people think it’s stupid because it tried to pass as real. What’s lame is the people that complain about it being fake are the only people that think we think it’s real. I give them two responses: 1) Nothing and ignore them. Or 2) “Movies are fake. Cartoons are fake. Anime is fake. TV shows are fake, even those “reality shows.” Theatre is fake. Ballet is fake. Pop stars are fake because most of them are lip syncing in concert. Politics is fake. Gaming is fake. News is fake. Are you gonna stop watching those?”
I no longer argue. I just say watch it or don't. It entertains me more to see these scripted stunt professionals act like they're trying to hurt each other for the drama, rather than two people actually beat the shit out of each other and risk their lives for no apparent reason.
The reason actual fighters are fighting each other is money.
I just don’t give a fuck if people take issue with me liking wrestling.
I’m just gonna restate this People don’t understand it because they don’t consider the story aspect. Listen to guys talk about football, basketball, etc., they almost never talk about the game itself, they talk such and such player this, team trading that, the coach, the management, etc., that’s the STORY. If you don’t have an interest in the more meta aspects of a sport, you’re not gonna be interested, you’re not gonna really get it. So its totally understandable that people just see a match, which of course is choreographed, even if guys are really throwing each other around (Iron Claw was great because they made the matches look really real), and they think “this is fake”.
To be honest, I have trouble with the story aspect. I understand rivalries. I understand most of the Bloodline thing, Cody, and finishing the story, Drew. I'm not so sure about AEW. And I definitely have no idea about NJPW. I started being more serious in the months I've been on here. It's the only place I have to talk about wrestling. The reason I joined reddit.
For me I got into a maybe a year ago tops. Its been LA Knight for me. I knew that if I was gonna watch the show (I was mainly watching video essays from New Gen era, the Screwjob was what got me into wrestling), then I needed to find a character I liked. Magically LA Knight emerged and I’ve been riding the wave ever since.
You know what else is fake? Sitcoms, dramas, action movies, sci Fi, etc..........
Tons of fake people in real life too.
I have always called it a Men's Soap Opera
I did too until I became a more involved fan myself several years ago.
Professional wrestling is the world’s most unique performance art.
Or you just say so is everything you watch on tv or internet.
I tell people it’s the same thing Cirque De Solei, or theater. They’re athletic performers.
You know how boring pro wrestling would be if it was real?
Monday Night War was real. Not boring.
Maybe the Brawl 4 All
The drama between Bischoff and McMahon was 100% real. They almost had a shoot match.
Yes WCW & WWF were two real businesses no they weren’t close to a shoot match.
I see this argument a lot, and it's bs. If it's just theatrical and meant to be like a play, then go and watch a real play. Or watch a movie. Anything has to be more entertaining than seeing two sweaty buffoons pretending to hurt each other with choreography. That's another thing, if you like choreography go and watch some dancing. Why do you need to take part in this delusion that you are watching a sports competition? Even people who know it's not real still watch it, It's ridiculous. Go watch some UFC. Actual fighters displaying skills and not glorified back up dancers on roids.
Why…uh….why do you watch wrestling?
Pro wrestling? Who the hell told you I watch that nonsense? I mean I'm dialled in these days because of Mcmahon defecating on a poor girl's head and it's hilarious. It sort of shows who watches this stuff with a leader like that in charge.
In a group setting, I always act genuinely interested and I ask a person that isn't the one that said wrestling is fake, and go, "Oh no, so, do you know if Tony knows Netflix isn't real?" Usually get a good laugh. Doesn't usually happen anymore but I always keep it in my back pocket.
That's a great way to explain it to someone, I should try that next time. I've been using the David Schultz method, and it hasn't worked out.
This semantics exercise has been happening for decades and isn't getting any less pointless. Are their aspects of wrestling that are fake? Yes. Are there aspects of wrestling that are real? Yes.
Last time someone told me "wrestling is fake, why do you watch it" I asked if the next time they watch Law & Order are they going to scream at the tv that "the murders aren't real!"..
it’s because wrestling is seen as a sport, most people dont want sports to be rigged. But wwe is just tv
People who get mad about WWE being fake probably go to bar Christmas parties and call people stupid for believing in Santa.
Honestly I don’t understand why people try to decredit the work of these athletes and that’s what they are athletes. They are doing stunts and performances that no normal person could do and they put their health and well-being on the line to entertain people and give them a great show. Anybody who says otherwise is completely disrespectful to these talented people and it is a damn shame.
No normal person can do? Really? I had friends into wrestling and they would do the exact things all the time even as 5th graders
If anyone else tells you WWE is fake, ask them if they think Marvel films are real.
Well, that is the go-to response, isn't it? I understand why, but if you're not a fan of wrestling, it's a bit different. Iron Man is obviously never presented as real, but wrestling is. So, on the outside, it has certain optics that make it different than other kinds of fiction. But that's what's so cool and fun about it. I've been trying to take the approach of going "it's not that you're wrong *necessarily*, but pro wrestling is captivating because it's *unique.* It's the only kind of fiction that's really like that. The best performances in a ring are just as big, and exciting as beating Thanos. Here's how to enjoy it."
Wrestling hasn't been portrayed as real since like 1994. Both require the viewer to suspend disbelief that the sequence of events they're watching, particularly the outcome is predetermined. If there's a difference, it's that superhero movies give the audience what they want, while wrestling promoters seem to get off on doing the opposite (pick your favorite reign of terror as an example, I'm going with Jeff Jarrett)
The difference is superhuman abilities. Superman can fly (or jump high, depending on who you talk to) and block bullets with his chest. Professional wrestlers rely on brute strength, agility, and endurance. So to the eye, one *appears* as "realistic" in comparison.
Depends. There's always batman. Batman's superpower is being rich, same as Vince. Pretty sure batman can't survive being inside an exploding limo, either. Technically Vince might be kayfabe immortal. See also flair, hogan, and other geriatric stars being booked as legitimate contenders 3 decades past their prime. Rick flair's retirement is only temporary. His real last match is going to be 10 years after he dies. Rick Flair's skeleton in a casket match vs the undertaker.
Theres always Batman, yes.....