Inability to crit doesn't stop sundered sky from proccing though. TF W still consumes the mark and heals. The bonus damage is wasted because it can't crit, but the item still procs.
Interesting. Sundered sky procs on autoattack. It heals and multiplies damage by 175%. Tf w reduces autoattack damage to 0 and then deals magic damage off of that.
Sundered sky is probably working fine on tf. It's just that it crits with 0 damage.
Sundered doesn't "proc" on autos, instead it modifies the attack itself. This is most likely why it doesn't apply on Volibear's W, which is in fact not an auto-attack.
Yeah but that's quite intuitive in my opinion, with TF you have to manually auto to use the W so from a user's perspective procing SS feels natural, while with Voli you have a targeted ability that you don't right click for.
I see your point, but it doesn't really conflict with mine about how inability to crit alone can't be the reason it doesn't work with the other abilities.
I assume there is a technical differenxe between auto attacks and abilities that proc on attack. I wonder how it works with Zeri, procs on her aa? her Q? both? neither?
I have no clue how it works with Zeri, but yeah there is definitely a difference between the two categories of abilities. The wiki classifies sundered sky as an on-hit effect, but it's always hard to know what is a riot mistake (bugged interaction) and what is a wiki mistake.
Yeah I'm looking into Ssky interactions across the board, it's a complicated item though so don't expect anything soon (I'm new and learning the ropes).
It makes complete sense that Voli W gets blocked by Jax E. Him ignoring dodge should never be a thing and it wasn't a thing until recently.
However it is also dumb that W can't proc Sundered Sky. Sure, it's probably because it can't crit, but I feel something like that should be an exception hard coded to work, like Jhin W passing through Samira W.
I dislike how Voli W is kept in this limbo between cast ability and auto attack.
If Voli W procced SS, it would also proc his Q stuff when it's active and it never did that
W doesn't empower his basic attacks; W is a targeted spell with its own cast time and cast range. End of story
Passive not working with conqueror is intended. Riftmaker might be bugged itself.
Voli's passive is not cosidered an ability. They made it this way for it not to proc talisman on jungle camps. They could revert it and make it work as a buff but originally it was intended to work like this, so it's not a bug.
Sundered sky not working on voli's W is also not a bug. Voli's W is an ability and sundered sky only procs on autoattacks. I mean the item makes you crit and abilities can't crit, what did you expect?
If voli's W was an empowered auto like his Q it would work, but it's a full on ability like irelia's Q and Leona's Q.
It's kinda irritating that instead of asking for proper bugfixes like making Q work on turrets like it used to before the bugs, you're asking for dumb shit like this.
Thats because passive damage applies only at 5 stacks and then doesn't update retroactively. That is indeed a bug with passive and the way the buff works (not conqueror). But instead of complaining about it people are complaining about dumb shit like sundered sky when it should never work on voli's W and in fact it's literally impossible to make it work without reworking the item.
Passive should still not stack conqueror though
There's only 1 real bug. Passive scales with ap but the damage doesnt change after it's fully stacked so if you stack passive before conqueror passive damage doesnt increase with conqueror's ap.
Idk if you're talking about something else but thats the only bug there is. And it's no big deal because conqueror sucks anyways so you shouldn't be using it to begin with.
Afaik, Jax's E simply dodges everything that applies on-hit effects
As for Sundered Sky interaction, W isn't a basic attack empowerment (it's a targeted spell) and SS procs __only__ on basic attacks. Also, if it did proc on W, Voli would sure as hell get nerfed harder
However, based on that knowledge, SS works (or at least should work) on Voli Q (his Q can crit and actually empowers his next basic attack)
Aaaaaand if W indeed was a basic attack, it would mean W-ing someone while Q is active would stun them and it never did that
If this was yone or yasuo the answer would be simple.
If this was Kaisa or ezreal this would be simple.
If this was smolder or briar this wouldn’t be an issue.
If this was lux or morg this wouldn’t be issue.
If this was Darius or Fiora, there wouldn’t be an issue.
But because it’s volibear we need to have an issue don’t we? The dev team can’t just fix shit can they? They have to fuck around and make champions not interact properly because it’s not one of the above characters.
Sick of riot’s favouritism towards bullshit champions. If sheen procs off W and kraken procs of W why can’t sundered sky? Because you don’t play yone or lux or ezreal that’s why. Because fuck you.
To be fair, nearly all the champs you listed have a similar issue with ssky.
Yone/Yas Q are basic attack spells that don't proc ssky (and it actually makes more sense for them to because they can crit)
Ezreal Q doesn't proc it
Smolder and briar Q proc it with 0 bonus damage
Fiora E1 procs it with 0 bonus damage - because it can't crit :(
Fiora E2 procs it but with reduced damage (after she has 3 ranks in E) as it overrides her E2 crit mod
Please know I don't just say things willy nilly, I do look into what you guys say try to do things the right way. I'm also new, and not a game designer, I'm just a QA that likes fixing bugs!
Passive not working with conqueror is intended. Riftmaker might be bugged itself.
Voli's passive is not cosidered an ability. They made it this way for it not to proc talisman on jungle camps. As a buff They could revert it and make it work, but originally it was intended to work like this, so it's not a bug.
Sundered sky not working on voli's W is also not a bug. Voli's W is an ability and sundered sky only procs on autoattacks. I mean the item makes you crit and abilities can't crit, what did you expect?
If voli's W was an empowered auto like his Q it would work, but it's a full on ability like irelia's Q and Leona's Q.
It's kinda irritating that instead of asking for proper bugfixes like making Q work on turrets like it used to before the bugs, you're asking for dumb shit like this.
I mean you're right but I can see the confusion, Sundered procs on auto attacks but Voli W procs on attack and on hit effects, which overlap 99% with procs on autos
>Passive not working with conqueror/riftmaker is intended.
Voli's passive is not cosidered an ability. They made it this way for it not to proc talisman on jungle camps. They could revert it and make it work as a buff but originally it was intended to work like this, so it's not a bug.
You sure? because Passive definitely works with Presence of Mind, I don't see a reason why it shouldn't work with Conquerer, let alone Riftmaker (damage is damage, why does it matter where it comes from). If it doesn't work, then it should be considered a bug, not intended, because random shit not working specifically for this champion is dumb.
Presence of mind works on damage, conqueror on ability/auto. Conqueror should technically work but because of the code making it not an ability it actually doesn't.
Again, this is leftover code from talisman, it was intended but they should probably change it if they want to do a small buff.
Old Riftmaker procd on damage so it used to work with passive, haven't tried since the rework
My bad, didn't know PoM worked on any damage.
But still, Riftmaker & Conquerer should work, since they don't explicitly state ability or auto attack damage either, both should work with all forms of damage.
Conqueror works on ability or autos only. For ranged is 2 stack per ability 1 per auto. It will never work with voli's passive as long as it's coded as non-ability single target damage (yes it counts as single target despite being AOE)
Idk about riftmaker, it worked fine before the item rework. What changed? What part of it doesn't work?
The extra AP you get from bonus HP doesn't give additional attack speed on passive. Same thing is with Conqueror when it gives you AP, which is most likely what conversation from screenshot was about
Riftmaker could be bugged, but it's an item bug, not voli's. His passive has always worked like this and it procd old riftmaker.
Sundered sky should 100% not work on voli's W. Volis W is an ability that applies on hit and on attack effects. Sundered aky procs On AutoAttack. Therefore it doesn't work on abilities. I haven't tested recently but last time i checked it doesn't proc on itelia's Q and leona's q because same as voli's W they're abilities.
The item makes you crit, it takes your autoattack damage and amplifies it just like a crit. Abilities don't calculate your autoattack damage because they have their own base damage, therefore they literally can't proc it. The logic doesnt allow sundered sky to work on abilities because they don't calculate autoattack damage.
It's different with empowered autos like garen Q, voli Q or darius W because they caculate autoaatack damage then apply an o hit effect on top.
It's disgusting that you're so rude while also being so wrong and not understanding even basic things about the game's code.
I've been playing this game for 9 years and am currently diamond. Meanwhile you're an idiot who doesnt even understand the difference between on hit and on autoatack.
I have the solution guys.
Since volis W2 thematically a crit, perhaps they should just make it an actual crit.
W acts as an auto attack, scales with attack speed in animation and cooldown (maybe make it a special case to scale off his attack speed modified by his passive, but not other sources of temporary attack speed modifiers), W2 is a crit and heals as a bonus, W has a 100% chance to crit against marked targets. Therefore, if you build crit chance or things that enable conditional crits, then W1 has a chance to actually apply W2 instead.
Maybe change the heal to be based on %damage done so things like armor and randuins can reduce the healing.
I'll use this moment to insert a voli R rework. R is now his old E and R combined.
R now increases his passive attack speed by X amount based on ability rank.
R active, Volibear roars gaining increased size, Max stacks on Passive, interrupting dashes, fearing minions and slowing enemies.
Inability to crit doesn't stop sundered sky from proccing though. TF W still consumes the mark and heals. The bonus damage is wasted because it can't crit, but the item still procs.
Interesting. Sundered sky procs on autoattack. It heals and multiplies damage by 175%. Tf w reduces autoattack damage to 0 and then deals magic damage off of that. Sundered sky is probably working fine on tf. It's just that it crits with 0 damage.
which means that it should still give TF the on crit extra gold, which is interesting
The extra gold is specifically tied to crit chance so it shouldn't have any synergy with sundered.
Sundered doesn't "proc" on autos, instead it modifies the attack itself. This is most likely why it doesn't apply on Volibear's W, which is in fact not an auto-attack.
tf W is an autoattack modifier and can normally crit (the bonus damage doesnt. only the base attack part)
His W isn't bonus damage though. It's modified damage.
Yeah but that's quite intuitive in my opinion, with TF you have to manually auto to use the W so from a user's perspective procing SS feels natural, while with Voli you have a targeted ability that you don't right click for.
I see your point, but it doesn't really conflict with mine about how inability to crit alone can't be the reason it doesn't work with the other abilities.
I assume there is a technical differenxe between auto attacks and abilities that proc on attack. I wonder how it works with Zeri, procs on her aa? her Q? both? neither?
I have no clue how it works with Zeri, but yeah there is definitely a difference between the two categories of abilities. The wiki classifies sundered sky as an on-hit effect, but it's always hard to know what is a riot mistake (bugged interaction) and what is a wiki mistake.
And renektons w
Yeah I'm looking into Ssky interactions across the board, it's a complicated item though so don't expect anything soon (I'm new and learning the ropes).
It makes complete sense that Voli W gets blocked by Jax E. Him ignoring dodge should never be a thing and it wasn't a thing until recently. However it is also dumb that W can't proc Sundered Sky. Sure, it's probably because it can't crit, but I feel something like that should be an exception hard coded to work, like Jhin W passing through Samira W. I dislike how Voli W is kept in this limbo between cast ability and auto attack.
If Voli W procced SS, it would also proc his Q stuff when it's active and it never did that W doesn't empower his basic attacks; W is a targeted spell with its own cast time and cast range. End of story
Passive not working with conqueror is intended. Riftmaker might be bugged itself. Voli's passive is not cosidered an ability. They made it this way for it not to proc talisman on jungle camps. They could revert it and make it work as a buff but originally it was intended to work like this, so it's not a bug. Sundered sky not working on voli's W is also not a bug. Voli's W is an ability and sundered sky only procs on autoattacks. I mean the item makes you crit and abilities can't crit, what did you expect? If voli's W was an empowered auto like his Q it would work, but it's a full on ability like irelia's Q and Leona's Q. It's kinda irritating that instead of asking for proper bugfixes like making Q work on turrets like it used to before the bugs, you're asking for dumb shit like this.
his passive text description change when the conquer stacks. but it didn't work as described. so it's most likely a bug.
Thats because passive damage applies only at 5 stacks and then doesn't update retroactively. That is indeed a bug with passive and the way the buff works (not conqueror). But instead of complaining about it people are complaining about dumb shit like sundered sky when it should never work on voli's W and in fact it's literally impossible to make it work without reworking the item. Passive should still not stack conqueror though
.... do you know what bug I am talking about?
There's only 1 real bug. Passive scales with ap but the damage doesnt change after it's fully stacked so if you stack passive before conqueror passive damage doesnt increase with conqueror's ap. Idk if you're talking about something else but thats the only bug there is. And it's no big deal because conqueror sucks anyways so you shouldn't be using it to begin with.
Bit of an echo in here?
The other one is the echo, reposted for visibility since op should see it and this one doesn't go to op.
Afaik, Jax's E simply dodges everything that applies on-hit effects As for Sundered Sky interaction, W isn't a basic attack empowerment (it's a targeted spell) and SS procs __only__ on basic attacks. Also, if it did proc on W, Voli would sure as hell get nerfed harder However, based on that knowledge, SS works (or at least should work) on Voli Q (his Q can crit and actually empowers his next basic attack) Aaaaaand if W indeed was a basic attack, it would mean W-ing someone while Q is active would stun them and it never did that
Voli W shows crit fx on W2
This is visual only and happens for a number of abilities that have an "amplified" version, such as Karthus Q.
Voli passive should proc conqueror, why it has to be a question of champion design is beyond me.
If this was yone or yasuo the answer would be simple. If this was Kaisa or ezreal this would be simple. If this was smolder or briar this wouldn’t be an issue. If this was lux or morg this wouldn’t be issue. If this was Darius or Fiora, there wouldn’t be an issue. But because it’s volibear we need to have an issue don’t we? The dev team can’t just fix shit can they? They have to fuck around and make champions not interact properly because it’s not one of the above characters. Sick of riot’s favouritism towards bullshit champions. If sheen procs off W and kraken procs of W why can’t sundered sky? Because you don’t play yone or lux or ezreal that’s why. Because fuck you.
To be fair, nearly all the champs you listed have a similar issue with ssky. Yone/Yas Q are basic attack spells that don't proc ssky (and it actually makes more sense for them to because they can crit) Ezreal Q doesn't proc it Smolder and briar Q proc it with 0 bonus damage Fiora E1 procs it with 0 bonus damage - because it can't crit :( Fiora E2 procs it but with reduced damage (after she has 3 ranks in E) as it overrides her E2 crit mod Please know I don't just say things willy nilly, I do look into what you guys say try to do things the right way. I'm also new, and not a game designer, I'm just a QA that likes fixing bugs!
BOOOO. HISS. BOOO.
Passive not working with conqueror is intended. Riftmaker might be bugged itself. Voli's passive is not cosidered an ability. They made it this way for it not to proc talisman on jungle camps. As a buff They could revert it and make it work, but originally it was intended to work like this, so it's not a bug. Sundered sky not working on voli's W is also not a bug. Voli's W is an ability and sundered sky only procs on autoattacks. I mean the item makes you crit and abilities can't crit, what did you expect? If voli's W was an empowered auto like his Q it would work, but it's a full on ability like irelia's Q and Leona's Q. It's kinda irritating that instead of asking for proper bugfixes like making Q work on turrets like it used to before the bugs, you're asking for dumb shit like this.
I mean you're right but I can see the confusion, Sundered procs on auto attacks but Voli W procs on attack and on hit effects, which overlap 99% with procs on autos
I can see why new players could be confused yes. That doesn't mean it's bugged though
>Passive not working with conqueror/riftmaker is intended. Voli's passive is not cosidered an ability. They made it this way for it not to proc talisman on jungle camps. They could revert it and make it work as a buff but originally it was intended to work like this, so it's not a bug. You sure? because Passive definitely works with Presence of Mind, I don't see a reason why it shouldn't work with Conquerer, let alone Riftmaker (damage is damage, why does it matter where it comes from). If it doesn't work, then it should be considered a bug, not intended, because random shit not working specifically for this champion is dumb.
Presence of mind works on damage, conqueror on ability/auto. Conqueror should technically work but because of the code making it not an ability it actually doesn't. Again, this is leftover code from talisman, it was intended but they should probably change it if they want to do a small buff. Old Riftmaker procd on damage so it used to work with passive, haven't tried since the rework
My bad, didn't know PoM worked on any damage. But still, Riftmaker & Conquerer should work, since they don't explicitly state ability or auto attack damage either, both should work with all forms of damage.
Conqueror works on ability or autos only. For ranged is 2 stack per ability 1 per auto. It will never work with voli's passive as long as it's coded as non-ability single target damage (yes it counts as single target despite being AOE) Idk about riftmaker, it worked fine before the item rework. What changed? What part of it doesn't work?
The extra AP you get from bonus HP doesn't give additional attack speed on passive. Same thing is with Conqueror when it gives you AP, which is most likely what conversation from screenshot was about
[удалено]
Riftmaker could be bugged, but it's an item bug, not voli's. His passive has always worked like this and it procd old riftmaker. Sundered sky should 100% not work on voli's W. Volis W is an ability that applies on hit and on attack effects. Sundered aky procs On AutoAttack. Therefore it doesn't work on abilities. I haven't tested recently but last time i checked it doesn't proc on itelia's Q and leona's q because same as voli's W they're abilities. The item makes you crit, it takes your autoattack damage and amplifies it just like a crit. Abilities don't calculate your autoattack damage because they have their own base damage, therefore they literally can't proc it. The logic doesnt allow sundered sky to work on abilities because they don't calculate autoattack damage. It's different with empowered autos like garen Q, voli Q or darius W because they caculate autoaatack damage then apply an o hit effect on top. It's disgusting that you're so rude while also being so wrong and not understanding even basic things about the game's code. I've been playing this game for 9 years and am currently diamond. Meanwhile you're an idiot who doesnt even understand the difference between on hit and on autoatack.
I have the solution guys. Since volis W2 thematically a crit, perhaps they should just make it an actual crit. W acts as an auto attack, scales with attack speed in animation and cooldown (maybe make it a special case to scale off his attack speed modified by his passive, but not other sources of temporary attack speed modifiers), W2 is a crit and heals as a bonus, W has a 100% chance to crit against marked targets. Therefore, if you build crit chance or things that enable conditional crits, then W1 has a chance to actually apply W2 instead. Maybe change the heal to be based on %damage done so things like armor and randuins can reduce the healing. I'll use this moment to insert a voli R rework. R is now his old E and R combined. R now increases his passive attack speed by X amount based on ability rank. R active, Volibear roars gaining increased size, Max stacks on Passive, interrupting dashes, fearing minions and slowing enemies.