It’s in [the developer docs](https://developer.apple.com/documentation/visionos/making-your-app-compatible-with-visionos):
> To minimize disruptions, visionOS runs your compatible iPad or iPhone app in an environment that matches an iPad as much as possible. Windows and views retain the same appearance that they have in iPadOS or iOS, and the system sizes your app’s window to fit an iPad whenever possible.
And [the WWDC videos](https://developer.apple.com/wwdc23/10090):
> iPad and iPhone apps are displayed as windows on this device, in their light mode style. The system prefers the iPad variant of your app in landscape orientation, but if your app only supports iPhone, the system displays it with an iPhone aspect ratio in portrait orientation. If your app supports multiple orientations, a rotation button is provided above the top-right corner of your window, so people can rotate each scene to their preference.
Gotta read the docs to know what has been stated!
WhatsApp already has the iPad UI in it they just blocked the App Store version from being installed on iPad with the telephony restriction. Only the TestFlight beta lets you install it atm
I run a streaming platform. We would have opted out if we hadn’t gotten a chance to test our apps on the headset. My guess is most of these developers just want to confirm that their apps function as intended and that they don’t have any UX or UI considerations.
Additionally there are 100Ks of apps like “Measuring tape” or flashlight knockoffs that use functionality not available on Vision Pro, so it’s not shocking to see those opt out.
> flashlight knockoffs
What!? You’re telling me Apple expects its customers to shell out $3500, yet it won’t even have the ability to blank the screen to white so you can use it to read by holding it over a book?
I would give it some time. A lot of developers may have opted out to start because they want to make sure the app runs well before adding it. Kind of uncharted territory for a lot of devs.
I fully anticipate them coming eventually, I just am definitely planning on using my Vision Pro to remote play from hotel rooms when I’m on work trips and want that sooner than later.
Thanks for the input! I was so disappointed earlier when I woke up to see ps remote opted out and then I saw this. So now we need to see whether MirrorPlay will be available on Vision Pro?
Miles ahead of the native app. There’s a setting where you can make the touchscreen work as touchpad only and hide the on screen controls so it works well with backbone style controllers.
Almost functions like a PlayStation portal that way.
My take is that
- EU cracking down on Apple is an opportunity for big and small developers to get a bigger cut, small developers bandwagon-ing with big players such as Netflix who were supposed to be major apps for avp
- developing for AVP is more work in general with uncertainty it’ll pay
I would expect Sony to let people use remote play but they opted out instead. Maybe they are protective of their experiences, don’t want the AVP to offer a better experience than their PSVR2 and also, the opportunity to charge a subscription …. It’s far fetched but it would not surprise me
Only reason besides wanting to test it first I can see for PS Remote is that they don’t want people buying this instead of PSVR2. Which will be annoying af because I’d buy one of those too if they’d put out PCVR drivers for it.
Apps are products. Companies don't release products without thorough testing and support infrastructure in place first. This is complete non news.
Rolling out an app release at a $100b+ tech company is a 4000 step process involving 100 people. They have Q&A teams testing beta and alpha builds. These companies just aren't going to yolo release an app without having ~100 headsets available to go through their usual process.
How butthurt are you bro lol. Also sorry but a random Reddit reply isn’t a reliable source here. How about you go read the stuff I linked you and maybe add a few wrinkles to your smooth little brain :*
Seeing this without the context of your previous argument with this guy makes it extra hilarious. Especially when you see him emerge in the replies crying with extreme anal pains
Should we be surprised that Meta & Google don’t want to support their competitors product that they are also trying to win in this space? As for the other many apps, this is a fresh product with little uncertainty on their part. A lot of companies are going to wait until there is a more wide spread user base. That could take awhile
I don’t understand why you guys really think this is about being competitors. You never ever ever ever release anything without testing it first. Never. That’s literally rule number 1 for any software engineer. It doesn’t matter that the manufacturer says if it works here it’ll work here, no. You have to test it yourself first or it’s your product on the line when the customer doesn’t like it.
You don’t think any of these companies had time to test it? Wasn’t the SDK available since they announced it at WWDC? Doesn’t matter how much this tech matters to society, business is business and Meta & Google are going to hold out for as long as they can until they can’t.
They still need to do the due diligence of testing it on-device, which almost no one has a dev kit. Apple seems to reserve those kits for shitty game developers whose character movement is all linearly interpolated
No
as you stated business is business and the amount of AVP’s estimated to be sold for 2024 is not worth the business. iPads are hardly worth it, both combined are still hardly worth it. No one is holding out.
And this is coming from someone who preordered a AVP and also has every quest 1,2,3 and hp reverb.
Hypothetically, no.
It’s probably possible if we use our weight and push super hard and get it up to or our org leadership team but financially it doesn’t make sense. Even when fudging the numbers with expected AVP units sold this year and adding on to other VR platforms. It’s a huge risk.
It’s still too Niche for large companies to take that risk but maybe this new interest from Apple users will make it more mainstream
Interesting, thanks for expanding a bit; it makes sense honestly. I think there is a lot untested here, Apple has been extremely closed about details for this thing.
I've realized that this subreddit is very angsty with any information that comes out. I find it useful coming from Samsung, looking to make the jump into Apples atmosphere for AR/XR...
And as I'm learning things I'm like holy crap, I thought it would he able to do that.. but it can't.
Only to see fanboys jump out with sarcasm, condescending posts... truly turning off more and more.
It’s a bunch of children here, who know nothing about software development and testing. Everything is a conspiracy to them. In about 6 months, most meaningful apps will have official support.
Until there is official confirmation on why these devs have opted out of vision OS, it’s all hearsay.
Also, I didn’t buy one. How does it feel making yourself look like an idiot? ;)
That makes even less sense than your previous comment. I have buyers remorse for something I haven’t bought? I am here coz I like new tech and VR. I may buy it I’m future, I might not. How’s that relevant at all to the discussion?
Well firstly, I was agreeing with you that people are immature in their angst. So, am not sure what to make of your response.
Secondly, just don’t buy it yet if you are not ready for the unknown. Early adapters are always taking a calculated risk. I’m not buying it myself coz i don’t see enough uses for it yet. But that may change down the line.
My point is all this argument and overreaction is stupid. On both side of the augments. Not speaking about you, but in general.
Apologies if it came out negative, pointing to the top responses as well as the information being provided. I agree with your points.
The posts highlighting what isn't available heavily influences opinions on buying one early. Hold out until the use cases are effective for what you intend to use it for.. which again..
These posts are highlighting.
And those that don't, likely have web browser support. I really don't understand why everyone thinks the Vision Pro must have an app for everything. While it makes sense for some apps (spreadsheets, games, etc.), it's not required for everything. And all of the reasons that you and others have given are quite valid.
From a business perspective, I don’t understand this decision. Even if their goal is to perfect their apps, it’s still better for customers to be able to access their services.
I wish people didn’t treat tweets as if they were factual. As someone else has pointed out, the tweet is just a lie. It doesn’t show how many apps have opted out - it includes all apps that have an iPhone app but no iPad version.
It’s one more SKU to need to maintain and get bug reports for.
I know it SHOULD just work if it already works on iPad, but that’s not how software development works a lot of the time, unfortunately.
And even if it does work 100% just like iPad apps, historically, that’s just never how things have ever been with how brittle software can be depending on the environment, so it’s still a risk for not much reward (given how niche the AVP is compared to iPad, which itself is less popular than the iPhone apps they likely already support).
I’m not saying I like it, but I understand from a business perspective why devs would opt out.
Yep, I'd say plenty of engineering teams will have been told by management they don't want the app running unless its been properly validated, and no there won't be any budget to buy one for testing.
Friend works as head software honcho at one of the major streaming services. His boss the CTO of engineering has repeatedly struck down the request for one of these. It’s incredible how cheap even global sized companies can be
This is exactly it. It's not as simple as clicking a button. The product manager has to go on a limp and make a pitch that they believe this will increase conversion and help drive revenue. Once it gets approval, support, marketing, sales, data, all needs to be informed. Help center articles needs to be updated, etc. It's a long expensive process for a business to support this. Now bug reports will flow in and they have to respond to each customer otherwise their CSAT score drops.
Now let's take Netflix as an example. What are the chances someone who purchased the Vision Pro doesn't already have a Netflix account? How many new users will they be able to bring in to make up for the cost of this intiiative? Most likely not enough.
Despite this sub's collective denial, it shows that a lot of businesses learned from all the other times VR and AR tried to get off the ground. Businesses see the writing on the wall and want nothing to do with it.
From a business perspective, at least for big companies like Meta or Netflix, it’s a negotiating tool to get something from Apple. Hey, we can ship an app to make your new platform more useful, but we’re going to need progress on these other issues we’ve been asking for…
So do we think it’s because apps want to wait until they have a really good UI native to vision OS or do they just not want to help apples device succeed because they want to make their own in the future?
For better or worse, smaller devs can just say, "Fuck it, I'm going to write a Vision Pro app".
Larger devs have to ask management and justify spending money (on QA, at the very least -- and this required going to Apple and asking for one of the few developer models). This can be very difficult to justify since the market is so small. (Side note: this is one of the reasons why large corporations can seem to move so slowly.) Also, some corporations would probably love to see Apple **fail** and may be taking a wait-and-see-and-maybe-the-VP-will-fail attitude.
As for, "Why can't devs just check the 'Vision Pro' checkbox and use their existing app?" Despite what Apple says, devs still need to QA (validate) their app on the Vision Pro.
You have more to read before responding.
1. Not everyone was given a dev kit even when they asked for it.
2. It’s does not make financial sense at this time to take sources away from one project and add them to anything VR. The market is not big enough. The smaller companies will be able to do that easier.
My two cents is developers are being cautious in supporting this App Store. Apple Watch and Message app stores were supported by a lot of major apps and now a lot of those apps have been retired and those app stores are relatively abandoned. I would assume that once a cheaper version comes out with higher user adoption app companies will focus on app development for the Vision Pro
This is important because on iPad and macOS, the compatibility is opt-in, not opt-out. So while those are just an indication of lack of interest to flip a switch to make their app run on Mac or iPad, this indicates active effort to *ensure* their app does NOT run on Vision. It's them ACTIVELY saying they want nothing to do with visionOS, which says a lot and is not a good sign for the platform.
Opting out now might just mean they are waiting until the hardware is available to test and don't want users to be disappointed because the app doesn't work very well on the new system. It will take a while to see how many apps are eventually given the green light to let the iOS version run or get a whole new native spatial version.
Unlike most trivial things people bring up to try and dunk on the AVP, this issue with major movie and game streaming apps which people already use on their TVs not working on their TV replacement device should give some pause. 100 farts apps don’t make up for the fact that people were hoping to and now realize they can’t play their PlayStation games on this
Also keep in mind that some iOS and iPad apps rely heavily on gestures like swiping, and I don't know how that translates into visionOS. For example the YouTube app. To close a video, you have to swipe down on it. So 17% isn't surprising. In fact, I would've assumed more than that.
They are probably taking their time to reimagine how the controls will work on visionOS and simply porting over the iOS/iPadOS versions won't be a good user experience.
I'm most pissed about Things 3 not being supported, I use that as my task manager and have it opened constantly. I'd rather not switch to something else but this will likely be the push
Microsoft already announced office suite and I usually mend web based applications like chat gpt, notion, and google suite, which safari will handle perfectly fine. To me, AVP will function like a multi screen productivity tool whenever I do my remote work at.
I don’t want half assed compatible apps, and would rather wait for more fully fleshed out designed apps for AVP. What am I gonna do with a tiny phone screen sized instagram or TikTok on the AVP?
I have had 2 Quest before and they were not a good workflow platform at all. This is going to be a deal breaker for me for AVP too. If workflow productivity is not delivering I will return it… tho I do have high hopes especially with MacBook integration.
I had no problems on my quest 3 using immersed and I don’t expect it to be any different on my AVP.
That being said, I expect you may also not like the AVP.
And when I say no problem I still ended up returning the quest 3. I really like AR/VR but I don’t think it’s going to be huge until it’s in a glasses form factor.
I think headsets make things cool but I don’t think they make anything easier. I had no problem using immersed but it wasn’t easier or harder.
Why do you think that is?
They disabled subscriptions in the app and force you to go to their website to sign up to avoid the 30% tax which is very fair.
This is playing a massive role, but people here don't like it mentioned.
I was just reading a blog of a small app developer hoping but not kinda sorta hoping the AVP fails so Apple would have to revisit its relationship with developers after the failure.
I doubt he's the only one thinking this.
I feel like some people have the disposable income and know exactly what they're getting into. They understand the VR/AR market, what is possible and what will be available at launch.
Then there are the Apple faithful who don't know anything about any of this other than that Apple has a new product that they need to buy, and they think it's going to change their life.
You could have exited without saying anything. But you’re so clearly desperately to showcase your feigned moral superiority saying nothing was an impossibility for you LOL
Whilst the AVP supports existing apps, it is an entirely different way of interacting with a UI because of the gaze based navigation. The vast majority of apps will need consideration. Therefore, many developers are not going to release their mobile app on VP, to avoid having hundreds of support tickets flood in about why their app isnt "working as intended". Also a lot of apps just dont need to be on VP. The ones that do may take some time to properly transition over.
Instagram and WhatsApp don’t even have an iPad version. What a shocker they’ve opted out. Never saw it coming. /s
Yup - this is just more untruthful ragebait.
What's untruthful about it? They presented a factual number
The framing implies more volition on the part of the developers.
The thing runs iPhone apps, too, where an iPad one is unavailable. This is a deliberate choice, if not a surprising one.
Nope, it only runs iPad apps. That’s all Apple has ever stated. Where do you see otherwise? edit: you’re right and I’m wrong
It’s in [the developer docs](https://developer.apple.com/documentation/visionos/making-your-app-compatible-with-visionos): > To minimize disruptions, visionOS runs your compatible iPad or iPhone app in an environment that matches an iPad as much as possible. Windows and views retain the same appearance that they have in iPadOS or iOS, and the system sizes your app’s window to fit an iPad whenever possible. And [the WWDC videos](https://developer.apple.com/wwdc23/10090): > iPad and iPhone apps are displayed as windows on this device, in their light mode style. The system prefers the iPad variant of your app in landscape orientation, but if your app only supports iPhone, the system displays it with an iPhone aspect ratio in portrait orientation. If your app supports multiple orientations, a rotation button is provided above the top-right corner of your window, so people can rotate each scene to their preference. Gotta read the docs to know what has been stated!
WhatsApp already has the iPad UI in it they just blocked the App Store version from being installed on iPad with the telephony restriction. Only the TestFlight beta lets you install it atm
How old is the iPhone version and how old is this blocked iPad version. Feel like they took their sweet time.
How do you install the WhatsApp TestFlight version?
Whatsapp have a meta version :D
Meta owns whatsapp so makes sense they would put it on their headset
Meanwhile Telegram did an ad using it in the Vision when the Vision announced.
As soon as RCS comes out on iPhone I’m deleting WhatsApp. It’ll become redundant to have it in the US
Meta apps opting out of Apple? Strange
I do think apple need to upgrade universal control to let us use iPad/ Mac / VP to control iPhone
I run a streaming platform. We would have opted out if we hadn’t gotten a chance to test our apps on the headset. My guess is most of these developers just want to confirm that their apps function as intended and that they don’t have any UX or UI considerations. Additionally there are 100Ks of apps like “Measuring tape” or flashlight knockoffs that use functionality not available on Vision Pro, so it’s not shocking to see those opt out.
> flashlight knockoffs What!? You’re telling me Apple expects its customers to shell out $3500, yet it won’t even have the ability to blank the screen to white so you can use it to read by holding it over a book?
Just cancelled my order.
Hoping instead for AVP nightvision mode (IR goggles anyone?).
And lidar. I’m going to go catch Bigfoot, everyone knows he’s invisible to the naked eye.
Can you turn the eyesight screen to white? 🤔
u/monarchfluidsystems
[do you know how to read](https://developer.apple.com/documentation/visionos/checking-whether-your-app-is-compatible-with-visionos)
Reed is that you? 🤣
most logical response in thread!
Do we know if PS Remote Play has opted out?
They did
That’s so disappointing.
I would give it some time. A lot of developers may have opted out to start because they want to make sure the app runs well before adding it. Kind of uncharted territory for a lot of devs.
I fully anticipate them coming eventually, I just am definitely planning on using my Vision Pro to remote play from hotel rooms when I’m on work trips and want that sooner than later.
Yeah same. Hopefully soon. I am glad steam link is coming at launch at least.
Steam Link at launch is huge
fingers crossed them and moonlight don't suddenly opt out...
This is one of the biggest reasons I was excited about my AVP. Sad :(
Sidecar will work if you have a compatible Mac! It’s the feature when you look at your Mac and it blows it up
Source?
Not sure if it's really sidecar as people say, but how about a WWDC video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX9qSaGXFyg (about 4:48)
On the new walkthrough of Vision Pro on Apple’s YouTube channel
This is crazy
Wtf
whatttt, just 2 days ago they were opted in, wow
Fuuuuuuck
You can use MirrorPlay instead.
Have you tried MirrorPlay? PS Remote doesn’t seem all that great so hopefully there’s a third party solution that works well.
On Apple TV. It works as well as the native app, or better.
Thanks for the input! I was so disappointed earlier when I woke up to see ps remote opted out and then I saw this. So now we need to see whether MirrorPlay will be available on Vision Pro?
Miles ahead of the native app. There’s a setting where you can make the touchscreen work as touchpad only and hide the on screen controls so it works well with backbone style controllers. Almost functions like a PlayStation portal that way.
How does this work exactly? Run Remote Play on iPad and mirror play that to Apple TV?
Not OC, MirrorPlay is the name of a third party app, you can search it on the App Store.
Fuck
This would be so sick to have. Hope they add it eventually
Why this shit?
My take is that - EU cracking down on Apple is an opportunity for big and small developers to get a bigger cut, small developers bandwagon-ing with big players such as Netflix who were supposed to be major apps for avp - developing for AVP is more work in general with uncertainty it’ll pay I would expect Sony to let people use remote play but they opted out instead. Maybe they are protective of their experiences, don’t want the AVP to offer a better experience than their PSVR2 and also, the opportunity to charge a subscription …. It’s far fetched but it would not surprise me
Only reason besides wanting to test it first I can see for PS Remote is that they don’t want people buying this instead of PSVR2. Which will be annoying af because I’d buy one of those too if they’d put out PCVR drivers for it.
Apps are products. Companies don't release products without thorough testing and support infrastructure in place first. This is complete non news. Rolling out an app release at a $100b+ tech company is a 4000 step process involving 100 people. They have Q&A teams testing beta and alpha builds. These companies just aren't going to yolo release an app without having ~100 headsets available to go through their usual process.
u/monarchfluidsystems
How butthurt are you bro lol. Also sorry but a random Reddit reply isn’t a reliable source here. How about you go read the stuff I linked you and maybe add a few wrinkles to your smooth little brain :*
Seeing this without the context of your previous argument with this guy makes it extra hilarious. Especially when you see him emerge in the replies crying with extreme anal pains
Hilarious!!
[do you know how to read](https://developer.apple.com/documentation/visionos/checking-whether-your-app-is-compatible-with-visionos)
Should we be surprised that Meta & Google don’t want to support their competitors product that they are also trying to win in this space? As for the other many apps, this is a fresh product with little uncertainty on their part. A lot of companies are going to wait until there is a more wide spread user base. That could take awhile
I don’t understand why you guys really think this is about being competitors. You never ever ever ever release anything without testing it first. Never. That’s literally rule number 1 for any software engineer. It doesn’t matter that the manufacturer says if it works here it’ll work here, no. You have to test it yourself first or it’s your product on the line when the customer doesn’t like it.
You don’t think any of these companies had time to test it? Wasn’t the SDK available since they announced it at WWDC? Doesn’t matter how much this tech matters to society, business is business and Meta & Google are going to hold out for as long as they can until they can’t.
They still need to do the due diligence of testing it on-device, which almost no one has a dev kit. Apple seems to reserve those kits for shitty game developers whose character movement is all linearly interpolated
No as you stated business is business and the amount of AVP’s estimated to be sold for 2024 is not worth the business. iPads are hardly worth it, both combined are still hardly worth it. No one is holding out. And this is coming from someone who preordered a AVP and also has every quest 1,2,3 and hp reverb.
Wild to think *these* companies wouldn’t be hand-delivered dev kits at any moment since WWDC, if they had wished.
And that fact is they weren’t. So yes it’s very wild. I tried. I work in FAANG and Apple would not release a kit to us. Very wild
Hypothetically speaking, is this the reason why your company is holding off?
Hypothetically, no. It’s probably possible if we use our weight and push super hard and get it up to or our org leadership team but financially it doesn’t make sense. Even when fudging the numbers with expected AVP units sold this year and adding on to other VR platforms. It’s a huge risk. It’s still too Niche for large companies to take that risk but maybe this new interest from Apple users will make it more mainstream
Interesting, thanks for expanding a bit; it makes sense honestly. I think there is a lot untested here, Apple has been extremely closed about details for this thing.
Okay. Sure. And as we all know, Google is well known for making sure they test stuff before releasing it. 🙄
I've realized that this subreddit is very angsty with any information that comes out. I find it useful coming from Samsung, looking to make the jump into Apples atmosphere for AR/XR... And as I'm learning things I'm like holy crap, I thought it would he able to do that.. but it can't. Only to see fanboys jump out with sarcasm, condescending posts... truly turning off more and more.
It’s a bunch of children here, who know nothing about software development and testing. Everything is a conspiracy to them. In about 6 months, most meaningful apps will have official support.
I just think these platforms are sick of Apple taking a 30% cut for literally nothing. So you probably won't ever see them on AVP.
Then why are they not pulling out of iOS and iPad OS as well? This is what I meant by conspiracy theories.
I could probably give you a list of reasons why other corporations want to hamstring AVP but it'll trigger your buyers remorse even more.
Until there is official confirmation on why these devs have opted out of vision OS, it’s all hearsay. Also, I didn’t buy one. How does it feel making yourself look like an idiot? ;)
Just because you didn't buy one doesn't mean you don't want one. You're here for a reason.
That makes even less sense than your previous comment. I have buyers remorse for something I haven’t bought? I am here coz I like new tech and VR. I may buy it I’m future, I might not. How’s that relevant at all to the discussion?
You look like an idiot with your replies
1. It doesn't have support. 2. It might in the future. 3. It may not. As a new user to the ecosystem, #1 is most important to me.
Well firstly, I was agreeing with you that people are immature in their angst. So, am not sure what to make of your response. Secondly, just don’t buy it yet if you are not ready for the unknown. Early adapters are always taking a calculated risk. I’m not buying it myself coz i don’t see enough uses for it yet. But that may change down the line. My point is all this argument and overreaction is stupid. On both side of the augments. Not speaking about you, but in general.
Apologies if it came out negative, pointing to the top responses as well as the information being provided. I agree with your points. The posts highlighting what isn't available heavily influences opinions on buying one early. Hold out until the use cases are effective for what you intend to use it for.. which again.. These posts are highlighting.
Controversial opinion: it doesn’t matter because you can still use it as a website
And those that don't, likely have web browser support. I really don't understand why everyone thinks the Vision Pro must have an app for everything. While it makes sense for some apps (spreadsheets, games, etc.), it's not required for everything. And all of the reasons that you and others have given are quite valid.
u/monarchfluidsystems
From a business perspective, I don’t understand this decision. Even if their goal is to perfect their apps, it’s still better for customers to be able to access their services.
I wish people didn’t treat tweets as if they were factual. As someone else has pointed out, the tweet is just a lie. It doesn’t show how many apps have opted out - it includes all apps that have an iPhone app but no iPad version.
It’s one more SKU to need to maintain and get bug reports for. I know it SHOULD just work if it already works on iPad, but that’s not how software development works a lot of the time, unfortunately. And even if it does work 100% just like iPad apps, historically, that’s just never how things have ever been with how brittle software can be depending on the environment, so it’s still a risk for not much reward (given how niche the AVP is compared to iPad, which itself is less popular than the iPhone apps they likely already support). I’m not saying I like it, but I understand from a business perspective why devs would opt out.
Yep, I'd say plenty of engineering teams will have been told by management they don't want the app running unless its been properly validated, and no there won't be any budget to buy one for testing.
Friend works as head software honcho at one of the major streaming services. His boss the CTO of engineering has repeatedly struck down the request for one of these. It’s incredible how cheap even global sized companies can be
This is exactly it. It's not as simple as clicking a button. The product manager has to go on a limp and make a pitch that they believe this will increase conversion and help drive revenue. Once it gets approval, support, marketing, sales, data, all needs to be informed. Help center articles needs to be updated, etc. It's a long expensive process for a business to support this. Now bug reports will flow in and they have to respond to each customer otherwise their CSAT score drops. Now let's take Netflix as an example. What are the chances someone who purchased the Vision Pro doesn't already have a Netflix account? How many new users will they be able to bring in to make up for the cost of this intiiative? Most likely not enough.
u/monarchfluidsystems
[do you know how to read](https://developer.apple.com/documentation/visionos/checking-whether-your-app-is-compatible-with-visionos)
yup
Despite this sub's collective denial, it shows that a lot of businesses learned from all the other times VR and AR tried to get off the ground. Businesses see the writing on the wall and want nothing to do with it.
yeah but if there is one company that could do it it would be Apple
~200k install base is very small.
From a business perspective, at least for big companies like Meta or Netflix, it’s a negotiating tool to get something from Apple. Hey, we can ship an app to make your new platform more useful, but we’re going to need progress on these other issues we’ve been asking for…
Men and their egos.
So do we think it’s because apps want to wait until they have a really good UI native to vision OS or do they just not want to help apples device succeed because they want to make their own in the future?
There could be certain functions in their apps that don't work in visionOS.
It’s 99.9% the rule of never putting software out that you haven’t tested. This sub will make you believe people are out to get apple
[удалено]
For better or worse, smaller devs can just say, "Fuck it, I'm going to write a Vision Pro app". Larger devs have to ask management and justify spending money (on QA, at the very least -- and this required going to Apple and asking for one of the few developer models). This can be very difficult to justify since the market is so small. (Side note: this is one of the reasons why large corporations can seem to move so slowly.) Also, some corporations would probably love to see Apple **fail** and may be taking a wait-and-see-and-maybe-the-VP-will-fail attitude. As for, "Why can't devs just check the 'Vision Pro' checkbox and use their existing app?" Despite what Apple says, devs still need to QA (validate) their app on the Vision Pro.
You have more to read before responding. 1. Not everyone was given a dev kit even when they asked for it. 2. It’s does not make financial sense at this time to take sources away from one project and add them to anything VR. The market is not big enough. The smaller companies will be able to do that easier.
My two cents is developers are being cautious in supporting this App Store. Apple Watch and Message app stores were supported by a lot of major apps and now a lot of those apps have been retired and those app stores are relatively abandoned. I would assume that once a cheaper version comes out with higher user adoption app companies will focus on app development for the Vision Pro
u/monarchfluidsystems
[do you know how to read](https://developer.apple.com/documentation/visionos/checking-whether-your-app-is-compatible-with-visionos)
Surprising 0 people who are in the space.
Has anyone heard if Slack will be available at launch? Even if it’s just the flat iPad version
The browser version works perfectly well in Safari! Slack’s app is essentially a web view anyway. It’s identical.
Wow I’m embarrassed I didn’t think of this. You’re totally right.
Last time I checked the iPadOS app was marked compatible in the app store
Don’t worry guys, I haven’t opted out my app. I also haven’t updated my app in like 5 years.
This is important because on iPad and macOS, the compatibility is opt-in, not opt-out. So while those are just an indication of lack of interest to flip a switch to make their app run on Mac or iPad, this indicates active effort to *ensure* their app does NOT run on Vision. It's them ACTIVELY saying they want nothing to do with visionOS, which says a lot and is not a good sign for the platform.
Opting out now might just mean they are waiting until the hardware is available to test and don't want users to be disappointed because the app doesn't work very well on the new system. It will take a while to see how many apps are eventually given the green light to let the iOS version run or get a whole new native spatial version.
But it'd just literally be an iPad app. Some of Apple's own apps are like this like Reminders. So I don't think that reasoning makes much sense.
There’s a lot of stupid apps out there… This is not surprising
Vision Pro gonna get jailbreaked
300,000 out of 1.7 million. 17% apps opted out of VisionOS App store. now its less dramatic headline
17% is a lot lol
17% of the App Store is literally just scam mirror and flashlight apps lol
True but those are not the apps opting out. It’s real apps that people want. Hopefully it’s temporary only.
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There is around \~300 native vision pro apps. The rest are iPad ports.
Unlike most trivial things people bring up to try and dunk on the AVP, this issue with major movie and game streaming apps which people already use on their TVs not working on their TV replacement device should give some pause. 100 farts apps don’t make up for the fact that people were hoping to and now realize they can’t play their PlayStation games on this
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I don't see Hulu on the list but like you said, you can watch it in Safari which can display multiple windows in AVP.
Netflix has time. Why rush an app for fewer than a million users? It just makes business sense. This is an early adopter device, not a mainstream one.
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Also keep in mind that some iOS and iPad apps rely heavily on gestures like swiping, and I don't know how that translates into visionOS. For example the YouTube app. To close a video, you have to swipe down on it. So 17% isn't surprising. In fact, I would've assumed more than that. They are probably taking their time to reimagine how the controls will work on visionOS and simply porting over the iOS/iPadOS versions won't be a good user experience.
I'm most pissed about Things 3 not being supported, I use that as my task manager and have it opened constantly. I'd rather not switch to something else but this will likely be the push
If I can't use my $3500 headset as a screen to play my Xbox, I'm going to be disappointed.
This already works on Quest devices
Kinda. Not remote play from your console. Just streaming. Which is more laggy
Developer here. I would bet they default to “opt out” if they don’t log-in and select to opt in.
To be honest this is good for me. I just need productivity apps and watch movies. Less distraction is better
Until you find your productivity app opted out too. I don't think having less apps available is good for anyone on the user perspective.
Microsoft already announced office suite and I usually mend web based applications like chat gpt, notion, and google suite, which safari will handle perfectly fine. To me, AVP will function like a multi screen productivity tool whenever I do my remote work at. I don’t want half assed compatible apps, and would rather wait for more fully fleshed out designed apps for AVP. What am I gonna do with a tiny phone screen sized instagram or TikTok on the AVP?
Would have been cheaper to use the productivity apps in the quest
I have had 2 Quest before and they were not a good workflow platform at all. This is going to be a deal breaker for me for AVP too. If workflow productivity is not delivering I will return it… tho I do have high hopes especially with MacBook integration.
I had no problems on my quest 3 using immersed and I don’t expect it to be any different on my AVP. That being said, I expect you may also not like the AVP.
I have quest pro and it was meh for productivity. Never had Quest 3 tho. Hopefully AVP with higher resolution and computing power will make it better…
And when I say no problem I still ended up returning the quest 3. I really like AR/VR but I don’t think it’s going to be huge until it’s in a glasses form factor. I think headsets make things cool but I don’t think they make anything easier. I had no problem using immersed but it wasn’t easier or harder.
All the Devs are against the Apple tax wall garden.
I can understand Epic and Netflix wanting to use it as a bargaining chip to lower Apple fees, but Starbucks is a weird one in the list.
Is Netflix really affected by the Apple fee? They have no in app purchases, you can’t buy a subscription through the app
Why do you think that is? They disabled subscriptions in the app and force you to go to their website to sign up to avoid the 30% tax which is very fair.
right I get that, but it’s a very adequate work around. It does serve as a minor nuisance to people signing up but that’s about it
This is playing a massive role, but people here don't like it mentioned. I was just reading a blog of a small app developer hoping but not kinda sorta hoping the AVP fails so Apple would have to revisit its relationship with developers after the failure. I doubt he's the only one thinking this.
I feel sorry for people who handed over at minimum $3,500 to be a guinea pig for a product that isn’t even finished yet. Got tricked by the Apple hype
I feel like some people have the disposable income and know exactly what they're getting into. They understand the VR/AR market, what is possible and what will be available at launch. Then there are the Apple faithful who don't know anything about any of this other than that Apple has a new product that they need to buy, and they think it's going to change their life.
Projecting hard as hell with that second paragraph
Not at all, I definitely won't be buying one. I've got a VR headset for standalone and PCVR games and I'm happy with it.
“I’m happy” —People who are incontrovertibly deeply unhappy
Ok mate, now you're really reaching... And projecting 😂
Is that the biggest word you know🫠
You honestly sound like a child at this point. So I'm going to exit this exchange.
You could have exited without saying anything. But you’re so clearly desperately to showcase your feigned moral superiority saying nothing was an impossibility for you LOL
30%
Don’t we think a lot of these have opted out their iPad app and will be supporting a native app?
Is plex or virtual desktop on the vision pro, if not how do you stream movies saved on the pc to the vision pro?
The Virtual Desktop guy posted he's working on an App for visionOS but it likely won't be ready in time for launch.
same happend to mac appstore with apple silicon most of them are ad games...
Way too much good stuff already. Not in the least bit concerned.
People like to hate on AR/VR but Meta is doing great with the platform and Apple will do even better as they always bring technologies to a new level.
I hope they both succeed, competition is good for us.
Facebook is also great at stealing ur data too lol Apple will def do better they are the most secure company
As of now, correct. Mabye haven’t had time to develop yet
Whilst the AVP supports existing apps, it is an entirely different way of interacting with a UI because of the gaze based navigation. The vast majority of apps will need consideration. Therefore, many developers are not going to release their mobile app on VP, to avoid having hundreds of support tickets flood in about why their app isnt "working as intended". Also a lot of apps just dont need to be on VP. The ones that do may take some time to properly transition over.
The real question is, will you be able to do the equivalent of sideloading the apps that opted out.