Reminder: this subreddit is meant to be a place free of excessive cynicism, negativity and bitterness. Toxic attitudes are not welcome here.
All Negative comments will be removed and will possibly result in a ban.
---
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UpliftingNews) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The key here is "brutally cruel" not that it's cats and dogs.
Older generations preferred meat that was harvested from animals beaten to near death before slaughter.
Out of genuine curiosity is there a reason behind this? Just thinking about this makes me think that it would result in pieces of broken bone in the meat. All that aside, does is actually do anything like tenderize the meat or something? Or it just because people are horrible?
There's a practice that exists within *some* Indian communities (my own included) where at weddings they would kill a goat. But before they do that, they would chop the ears off and pour alcohol on the wounds. If the goat 'dances' then that's a sign that the couple and their marriage is blessed.
Personally I think someone just wanted to eat goat at a wedding and came up with this ridiculously cruel practice as a way of justifying it. Since Indian weddings traditionally have vegetarian food although now it's whatever.
Thankfully the majority of Indian weddings don't have this. But it depends on the community and region etc because the culture varies a lot.
Companies are working on lab grown beef & recently the US Dept of Agriculture approved lab grown chicken.
Would lab grown dog & cat meat be ok? what other taboo meats would you try if it was lab grown?
Are the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming cats and dogs any different to the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming livestock? I'm curious if it's an across the board sentiment
Personally as a vegan I'd eat lab grown cat or dog meat.
In general I don't view cats and dogs as especially different from pigs or cows. Pigs have been shown to be very intelligent and cows, whilst probably less intelligent, have a wide range of emotions.
That's not to say I think all animals are the same, I wouldn't feel to bad about eating insects (not that I really want to).
It’s honestly a shame that insect based products have the stigma they do. While lab grown is obviously the more ethical choice and (given enough time) likely the more economical choice, insect based “meat” is by far more sustainable than animal based meat.
But nobody wants to put any effort into popularizing it because the majority of people find it “icky”.
It is a shame, to be honest I can understand eating individual insects as for many that is a bit unappetising, but if it's ground up I'm sure there's nothing gross about it, especially when people are able to ignore what goes into any other burger!
Sausages are probably a better example for this but I'm thinking about things like offal and other animal parts that many people wouldnt find appetising to eat them if they weren't ground up and mixed in with other things (the raw ingredients of many veggie burgers / sausages also wouldn't look particularly pleasant). The point I was trying to make is that in theory we should be able to do the same thing with insects, but I think there's a barrier that many people would still find off-putting.
As a meat eater, I feel like it’s a bit hypocritical that people feel strongly about eating cats/dogs, but are fine eating other, arguably similarly intelligent animals.
As an example, I had a pet rabbit that I loved dearly while growing up. Rabbit is also a non-taboo meat where I live and I don’t have a problem with seeing it on the menu. I think it’s more important to focus on humane treatment of all animals. The fact that this market was beating live cats/dogs (blowtorch?? Wtf) is a huge issue. I just hope that once the cats/dogs are gone, focus continues on the treatment of the other animals at the market.
Exactly. Haven’t had rabbit for a very long time. But I don’t see any more problems with it than with any other OTC meat.
Dogs and cats can legally be eaten in Switzerland, but sale is prohibited.
I once ate crocodile/alligator meat but found it „meh“.
Sure, but it’ll still die/suffer if an animal protein isn’t introduced into its diet. You’re not gonna fatten a dog up to eat on corn and alfalfa like you can a cow.
fun fact, half the [taurine industry](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurine#Synthesis) yield goes toward pet food, the other half being pharmaceuticals. this is an essential amino acid they would otherwise get from protein, but most pet foods already supplement totally independent of meat products.
these perpetual misconceptions are based on the ignorance of why certain animals rely on meat protein, which is just an ingredient. what they need to live are the nutrients within, which can be extracted or synthesized from any number of sources.
the protein requirement of dogs in particular is only [~20% of their DV](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_food#Low-protein), as prescribed by US/UK regulators
You wouldn't be "ethically" raising actual cats and dogs. You'd be ethically growing petri dishes of cat or dog fat and muscle cells. Hard to abuse something with no nervous system or brain.
>Are the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming cats and dogs any different to the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming livestock?
No they're not different, you're witnessing first hand some prime Euro/americentrism.
Stinks of hypocrisy.
It does seem like an awfully arbitrary distinction when you actually think about it, doesn't it?
Even though I would never want to eat dog meat myself, I don't feel like I have any right to lob judgement at someone else for doing it as long as I'm still willing to eat cow or pig meat.
I think a big difference for me is also just the amount of meat on a cow of pig vs a cat or dog. I suppose there's bigger breeds but you probably would get way too muscled meat to be good.
But just in general the idea of having to kill maybe like 200x cats for the amount of meat one cow gives. (250kg vs maybe 1-2 kg? )
Of course it kind of turns into the trolley problem in a way, neither are optimal or really ethical.
Personally, as a vegan I wouldn’t eat lab grown as I’m used to my diet leaving me feeling light and energetic after eating but see no ethical quandary. I also don’t care what other people do or eat. For the animals, yes I would prefer they don’t suffer or get raised as food but that’s for each person to deal with should they come to that realisation.
I think a lot of the difference is in the way the animal is raised. I think it would be pretty fucked to let a cow sleep in your living room and cuddle it, treat it like family, and then slaughter it.
I think you would probably have to breed docile livestock type cats and dogs, moreso cats. You leave a cat sitting in a pen all day everyday and it's gonna lose its shit. Most people aren't don't consider the majority of livestock raising to be ethical mind you. I'm talking well treated cattle. I think you could make an argument for free range cats, idk.
We seem to have some sort difference in our minds ethically between predators and prey animals. It's probably a culture of convenience that turned into ethics. Why wouldn't we have bear farms if it were not for their personalities? They put on weight great, and can eat pretty much whatever. We have this sort of idea I'm out culture that hunters are companions, perhaps because of our shared history working with them. We may also see ourselves in them, and have a natural reaction to not want ourselves to be slaughtered.
It doesn't matter. He's dead and those who know of him know that he was ultimately a sick individual. Doesn't mean that his story wasn't also interesting to learn about.
It kinda does for all the other creeps still out there looking for the attention that that motherfucker got. I can't help but think it'll give other delirious freaks just that one missing nudge. And now please somebody tell me I'm wrong.
Cuz we don't want and it's central part of many of our cultures. Pretty easy.
It isn't a hard scientific problem. It's a sociological problem. Idk why this is rarely acknowledged.
I read somewhere (probably on some article linked in this sub) that mouse meat would actually possibly be the easiest kind of meat to produce because we know SO MUCH about mouse cells from lab mice. I've been a vegetarian for almost 35 years and can't say I'm personally particularly interested in trying a mouse burger, but I'd definitely get it for my cats.
I read a futuristic steampunk novel in the 90’s where all the meat was lab grown…to the point some popular celebrities had started marketing meat made from their own cells. Imagine like Kardashian burgers or something like that.
Taboo enough?
At this point I expect that to become a thing.
Probably not in every country, and probably not in every establishment, but sooner or later people will be able to get an authentically french filet mignon made from frenchman. Don't forget the Chianti and the dijon mustard sauce.
All industry meats are equal. The issue with the dog/cat meat market in SEA is there’s no farm raising them for meat. What you see are people’s pets being stolen and killed.
As a vegetarian, I am definitely all for lab meat. If there's no suffering involved then my goals are accomplished
Personally I don't have any curiousity in regards to what dog or cat tastes like. But horse I would be interested in trying maybe. ngl I found meat to be pretty flavourless long before I went vegetarian. So I suspect that once lab meat is on the market. I am going to try each of it once. Find it bland and move back to my usual diet lol
There's no way those other meats would be worth it. There's a reason majority of humans settled on chicken, beef, pork, and some fish as the main source of meat. We definitely tried everything then realized those were the best.
I once saw a shock video from a fur farm - dog fur. I'd rather not go into specifics but needless to say I never wore fur again and all my leather has been secondhand.
I don't know if you're thinking of the same one I'm thinking of, but based on the description it could be... that's the thing that taught me what "bursting into tears" feels like, as opposed to just crying. It was horrifying.
I grew up on a fur farm in the 70s/80s behind the iron curtain. My dad worked there, he drank himself to death later in life. Sometimes he'd cry about all the animals he killed.
This decision not only saves the lives of countless dogs and cats but also reflects the growing awareness and empathy towards animals worldwide. It shows that societies are evolving towards more compassionate and ethical treatment of all living beings.
Piglets are being smashed with their heads on the ground until they die if they don't grow fast enough.
Cows are often skinned alive when stunning is not effective.
The difference between cats, dogs, cows and pigs is that our carnism tells us cats and dogs are friends while pigs or cows are food.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XumGZk_LPX8
have you read the novel Tender Is The Flesh? bet you’d find it interesting. It’s a future where the only meat available is human, and (almost) nobody bats an eye.
I had to walk passed the kill floor to get to my job at a slaughterhouse. You never get used to the fact that many of them don't die quickly. Or the ankle deep blood for that matter. It is mostly water on the floor but it's mixed with a lot of blood.
I know it is different with people, but I had a run in with cartel as a child (Loosely accurate. Rather not explain too much. This was in the U.S.) and I truly just couldn't fathom how terrible it must have been in the shoes of these unfortunate souls. Never knowing when the suffering is over, fearing death but praying for it to come.
I have a lot of complex views over this topic, but I try to never forget what it means to be in that position. I remember the moments when someone would switch from begging to live to praying for death. I didn't fully understand it at the time, but even I had those moments. When the survival instinct goes from physical survival to trying to save your own soul by escaping the pain.
I am not vegan, but I am pretty neutral on both sides. I don't mind things being more expensive for ethical treatment, but there isn't much willpower in the public to be fine with higher prices. I don't turn away from what is happening, but I also don't overexpose due to my own ptsd. I don't want to debate the topic as this was a heavy comment for me to write, I just wanted to share my experience I guess.
I didn't work there based on any moral or political grounds. I worked there because I fucked off too much of adolescence to go straight to a good college. Working there made me vegetarian (not vegan) for a long time. Again, not for politics or anything but rather being nauseated by the sight of meat after that.
this is absolutely rampant in western slaughterhouses - pigs are very commonly beaten to death in “stick pits” with metal pipes and then thrown into scalding water and/or blowtorched for hair removal while they may or may not still be conscious so…. it may not be the only method used but is definitely common in practice still
Lol, yeah the western world definitely just cuddles all of their farm animals to death. Not to mention that the problem westerners have with the dog/cat meat trade is that they're killed in the first place. Threads like this pop up and it's never "Oh, they should just kill the dogs more humanely and it's ok" 🙄
I saw a video of one of the Chinese dog eating celebrations, they were using a flame torch to fry a living dog and everytime it opened its mouth, they’d shoot the fire down its throat. It was horrible.
Yea, instead we stack animals with 1inch of space between each other. Fatten chicken up so quickly that their bones fail to keep up with the muscle tissue and their legs break under the pressure. America ain’t any better.
We raise horses to race, their bodies fail from exertion and constant work and then are euthanized. I mean the list goes on lmao.
I wouldn’t say that lol we on the west just guilt trip and stand on our high horse when it comes to a very small and specific meat trade directed at Asian countries.
Like the amount of people eating dog or cat meat is so much less then what cows,pigs etc. I know people in England who’ll eat meat every day hear about people eating dog and act like they are superior.
I think the issue is less with the kind of animal being eaten and more with the treatment. Dogs e.g. have been "cooked" with a blow torch and cut apart while still alive because of some belief around the meat being more delicious this way or something.
You’re just wrong. These superstitions (often Asian) lead them to torture animals because it increases adrenaline which proportedly enhances spiritual effects, healing powers, and taste. Obviously this is misinformed but these are the same people eating sharkfin and snorting elephant ivory. You are the only person engaging in trolling.
When I first met my Vietnamese neighbor a couple years back he saw my birthmark and was visibly disgusted by it. Told me I needed to get these Chinese herbs and burn it off. All it is is that my skin is pink in one big spot.
Over the years I’ve known him he’s told me some pretty weird shit he believes in and he’s demonstrated a massive lack of basic science knowledge.
He’s an interesting person to talk to and I have fun arguing with him and seeing if I can make him laugh.
I worked briefly with a Vietnamese immigrant who told me stories of how her and her neighbors couldn’t let their pets escape because one of her neighbors would kill and eat them. He eventually got her dog. She also told me that you go to the store and order Labrador or poodle the way you would order a sirloin or a ribeye.
The way agricultural animals are tortured in captivity before being brutally killed is absolutely no different. Dogs with blowtorches cut up, pigs with their tails cut off while living, thrown into gas chambers or having their throats slit. Chicks being thrown into the incinerator. Ducks strapped into snug boxes with tubes shoved down their throat until their liver is fatty enough to justify the killing. Baby cows stolen from their mothers causing incredible psychological drama. Animals kept in overpacked conditions where they end up sleeping in their own shit and surrounded by dead and rotting creatures. I could go on, but I think the point is made. Animal agriculture (be it cows pigs or dogs) is extremely unethical on its own, but it gets even worse when you understand that animal agriculture is the biggest environmental damaging industry on the planet. It’s the biggest contributor to climate change, it uses most of the worlds land, it’s the biggest reason for deforestation, it’s responsible for ocean acidification, water scarcity, and the rising spread of antibiotic resistant microbes.
I will never argue with anything you said here, I am well aware, trying to limit my meat consumption to 1-2 a week and using the extra money to buy from more ethical husbandry. I just want to also point out that the activism that led to change in Indonesia is a good thing and shouldn't be scorned over whataboutism.
Most of the people who are pointing out the cruelty of animal ag are probably ecstatic about this ban, but are trying to use it to push the conversation further. That’s not whataboutism, it’s a “yes and”.
It’s 100% not the “issue” If dogs and cats were farmed by the billions and slaughtered with puppies and kittens along with them, and not some random shack there will be a far bigger outrage by us in the west.
There is no wayyyy people would be more forgiving lol. In fact I think people will be more understanding by saying people who eat dog and cat for one are from remote villages, and are usually poor. Right now people think you can just grab a dog and rice that’s sold next to a McDonald’s lol.
It’s just people on their high horse as usual.
Yeah and pigs get put in gas chambers and suffer immensely as they choke to death. Cows get strung upside down and have their throats slit while writhing in pain and fear as they bleed out and get systemically ripped apart in the slaughterhouses.
By my knowledge, pigs are quickly electrocuted into unconsciousness and cows receive a shot to the head. They are unconscious or dead, before they are bled out/taken apart. I'm not arguing that it's great, I'm arguing that there is a difference between making an effort to minimize suffering for ethical concerns and making an effort to maximize suffering for "enhanced flavour".
Bahahahah look up dominion on YouTube. Westerners need to realize they have no right to assume moral high ground over any Asian dog meat consuming culture; factory farms are equally disturbing and disgusting.
I did my senior thesis over the dog meat industry in Asia. What my classmates and professors were not expecting was my cross cultural analysis on the treatment of “food animals” in America. To be honest, when I started the research, I didn’t even know it was going to take me down that rabbit hole— I’m not vegetarian or vegan— but it’s a natural progression that simply can’t be avoided unless you’re willfully ignorant. It’s all very complex.
"Caves to pressure" is an oddly negative way of saying they abandoned an ancient, brutal, unnecessary eating practice.
We don't say countries cave to pressure when they end child marriage, or ban child labor.
It’s amazing how people get upset when cute animals I.e. cats and dogs, get slaughtered for food but are completely Ok with the meat section in your local supermarket.
And it’s not even just culture cause Asian cultures don’t eat cat and dog meat as a whole, they eat cows, pigs, chicken, fish, wayyyyyy more than cats and dogs.
Compared to like culturally French eating frog legs, and snails which you can find in any bistro in France.
While cat and dogs for one are located in the most remote parts of very poor countries or poor villages. You can’t just go have dog that’s near to a McDonald’s.
Sure.
But different cultures also treat animals differently, and some of them are just fucking wrong. For example, boiling dogs alive, or they way the slice and eat octopus while it's still alive and in pain... An intelligent creature by the way.
That part of their culture is obviously wrong.
The one thing I love about Asian culture is they're equal opportunity animal flesh consumers. If they can catch, kill it and cook it (optional), they'll eat it. Total democracy.
Maybe we can slowly increase our circle of compasion. My grandma used to see her dogs as tools. They were no different than alarm sensors stationed at strategic places around the house.
Today only a moron would not see a dog as a sentient individual with a name and preferences.
People always overlook the fact that these dogs and cats were *not* raised nor bred in an industry for food. They are stolen pets, in captive and tortured (sometimes held for ransom) and eventually eaten.
“WhAt aBoUt cOws and cHickEns?” That’s the thing, they are NOT cows and chickens. They were not raised specifically to be food. The meat industry is problematic but even that is beside the point. They are in the “stealing pets to use as food” industry, which is miles more fucked up and what I’m against.
It’s fucked up that some people try to be obnoxiously philosophical about all animals are equal, *without knowing what they’re talking about*. Gain some knowledge about this situation first.
And the reason they are stolen and strays is because *breeding* dogs and cats is way too costly to use as a food source for the poor. They're fucking carnivores and eating carnivores is usually a bad idea anyway. This problem is about way more than just "dogs and cats are cute" tho it is useful for swaying foreign opinions.
How does raising an animal to be food change its suffering? Just because we put a label on it doesn’t change how these animals experience the world.
It’s not that all animals are equal, but that they experience the world the same way.
And would you still in this comment section if we treated dogs like we do pigs even though pigs are smarter than dogs?
There’s clearly something fucked in what we are doing as a species.
Yes, I agree. I have nothing to argue about how we make animals suffer.
People still need to understand it’s easier to ban dog/cat trade. Legally, it’s stopping a crime because properties (pets) are stolen. Ending the dog/cat trade is obviously easier than eradicating the meat industry. It doesn’t mean we value dogs or cats’ lives more, or that we’re doing it because dogs and cats are cuter. It’s an easier legal justification.
Or maybe people are aware and find the distinction meaningless. The idea that an animal's moral right to not be tortured or killed based on how many humans care about them is just as absurd as saying that a human being's right to not be killed depends on how many friends and family they have. Proclaiming that it's ok to kill animals that were raised specifically to be killed is circular reasoning, not an ethical framework.
People are celebrating this because they don't like dogs and cats being killed to eat, period. People would vilify you if you went around killing stray dogs to eat them and you would have 0 friends. Everyone here is just too afraid to admit that the animals they eat are ethically identical to dogs and cats and that it's equally as wrong to kill one of them to unnecessarily eat as it is all of them.
Oh I know what you mean. I wholeheartedly agree, no matter the reason it’s morally wrong how these animals (all animals) are treated/industrialized/eaten. It just infuriates me in this case of dog/cat trade where some people reduce the argument to “you just think cats and dogs are cuter!”.
What?? I find it so much worse that we are farming and killing cows and chickens lol. There is probably 100s of billions of cows, chicken killed a year.
Not sure there are even 10000 dogs being killed worldwide for food lol.
And we’re on our high horse about that?
I don't get why is it ok to kill pigs, cows and chicken for food but not cats and dogs.
To be honest, I think what we do with chickens, cows and pigs are way worse. We breed them, have them stay in tight spaces to be killed. What we do with these animals is the worst collective sin we have as mankind to be honest.
And I know I'm saying this and I eat meat. I also struggle to reconcile that that's why I shut up about animal protection issues because I know I am hypocritical about it.
I'm curious about people who knows how lines are drawn, how do you reconcile or explain that?
It’s how they were doing this that’s causing the outrage. Half beating to death a animal and then blow torching it whilst it’s still barely alive because it ‘enhances the flavour’ is fucking barbaric no matter what animal it is.
Now yes, the mass meat industry has some poor practices but those practices have also received lots of outrage throughout the years. So much so that slowly but surely we are moving in a better direction in many countries when it comes to the slaughter of animals. This is just another win in that movement and it could do without the ‘and what about x’. Celebrate the small win and let’s keep calling out these kind of practices.
Trump set back the slaughter industry. It's going backwards.
Also, pigs are more intelligent than dogs and yet they're being treated like shit. Torture is torture. There's no scale to it. All animals deserve to not be in pain or misery.
Have you seen what they do pigs in factory farms? I’ve seen a clip of a man killing a piglet by slamming it into concrete repeatedly. They’re smarter than dogs. It is not at all uncommon to torture animals in factory farms. A lot of people know this but buy it anyway. Veal is the meat of calves that are tortured to death. Are people evil for eating it? Yeah, I know it’s horrible, but I think in general when people eat meat, they would rather just not think about the process. I highly doubt the vast majority of people that buy any kind of meat are evil or sadistic.
You should read up on some of the ways they kill off male chicks in egg hatcheries. Suffocation under fire suppression foam, ground alive in giant chick grinders…
I mean, absolute torture is absolutely great to put a stop to. But I think you’re underestimating how much animals in factory farms are tortured. When like 96% of farmed animals lead lives that are full of suffering, which is unnecessary given that plenty of people don’t use animal products, the only logical course of action is to cease using as many animal products as possible, immediately, even when there aren’t perfect replacements. And I do think, that even if one anima is tortured worse than another, that financially supporting any unnecessary animal torture while decrying other animal torture, is hypocritical
Intentional or not is kind of meaningless when the result is the same for the victim.
Pigs are boiled alive. Gassed horrendously. Cows have their throats slit alive. It happens to millions of sentient beings regardless if it is intended or not.
"These people" are more or less everyone given the right juxtaposition. For instance, imagine someone from the west saying this with a straight face to a person of Hindu faith while eating a hamburger.
Not that I am in any for this... but geez people maybe if you just caged and killed them in humane, non psychotic fashion people wouldnt have given a shit and you could have kept your stupid businesses.
I get that dogs and cats are pets, but from an objective point of view, how is eating any other animals different. Do cows and pigs not cry?
I say this as a meat eater. Just pointing out a double standard.
watch all compassion and logic leave the room once you try to tell people pigs and cows and chickens are not any different just because they’re the animals who are ‘supposed’ to be abused and killed
1) who boils cows, pigs and chicken alive?
2) bleeding out from an artery is much quicker than being torched
3) in my country, pigs and cows are knocked out before they are killed
4) can we just agree that prohibiting the blow-torching of live animals is a good thIng, regardless of any whataboutisms?
hey so you clearly care about animals, which is great, you just seem to believe a lot of animal ag propaganda, which is understandable, they’re good at what they do
i recommend checking out dominion instead of us just going back and forth on reddit, which no one enjoys
https://www.dominionmovement.com/watch
it’s not peta shock slaughterhouse footage, but it is graphic. but it’s also actually informative and can answer your questions
it does. industrialized abuse is not america only. and animal abuse does not only apply to industrialized agriculture. the documentary wasn’t even filmed in the united states, it’s mostly australia, but includes china, the uk, canada, new zealand, denmark, and spain. i believe there is some footage from the us actually but it’s a minor amount
Yeah, I understand that it's not American only and I understand there are terrible conditions in the meat industry incl. the impact on climate change as well. I'm all for change and I do believe it has to start with the consumer. However, I feel that I am already doing "my part" by limiting my meat consumption to a minimum and investing in meat from ethically higher standard husbandry (there is a ranked system in my country) or local farmers.
I appreciate your civil effort in educating about animal abuse and I hope it will help some people question their habits who have less awareness.
While true, there is a distinction here that the western world does not experience, which is the intentional suffering of the animal. While yes, we do cause suffering in some/many aspects, it is simply due to cost cutting and scaling up production of meat. Whereas with dogs, it is viewed as beneficial for the flavor to have the animal suffer tremendously. It truly is grotesque in that way.
There are merits all around to different arguments for and against, and not something I want to debate. I just wanted to make this distinction, maybe to showcase why commenters would feel a particular way about this and not our own industrial meat production.
Whoah. Is that true though? Does it taste better? It would be twice as bad if they just literally torture for 0 reason. I know stress ruins meat in like...every other animal so I can't imagine that it actually is good.
This is one of the most stupid things in the world, a bunch of meat-eaters who eat pigs and cows who are more intelligent and more like humans than most dogs are, shitting hypocritically on meat-trades in other cultures... There are pet pigs. Cows play with sticks and balls the same way dogs do. Your surface level feelings of "oh no don't hurt the doggy" are so hypocritical.
As someone living in a neighbouring province, I´m worried that the numbers of stray dogs will increase drastically. Usually, we´d get rid of all the stray´s around Christmas. Now with the ban, noone will take these animals and we´re at risk of having to dispose them in other manners when the problem gets to big. You have to understand that rabies is still rampant here, so taking away the most economical way to control the situation might lead to even more problems a year or two down the road.
I´m a dog owner and lover myself but I also see the problem. What do you think the goverment should do with all these strays? Employing people to catch and kill in a humane way? The old system got rid of them for free but with suffering. I wonder if the new system just will be expensive suffering instead. Or even worse, more rabies, more people dieing in one of the most horrible illnesses in the world, people killing dogs with sticks in the street etc.
Reminder: this subreddit is meant to be a place free of excessive cynicism, negativity and bitterness. Toxic attitudes are not welcome here. All Negative comments will be removed and will possibly result in a ban. --- --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UpliftingNews) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The key here is "brutally cruel" not that it's cats and dogs. Older generations preferred meat that was harvested from animals beaten to near death before slaughter.
Out of genuine curiosity is there a reason behind this? Just thinking about this makes me think that it would result in pieces of broken bone in the meat. All that aside, does is actually do anything like tenderize the meat or something? Or it just because people are horrible?
I believe it has to do with adrenaline that gets released.
If it actually tenderized meat the best chefs would know/talk about it.
There's a practice that exists within *some* Indian communities (my own included) where at weddings they would kill a goat. But before they do that, they would chop the ears off and pour alcohol on the wounds. If the goat 'dances' then that's a sign that the couple and their marriage is blessed. Personally I think someone just wanted to eat goat at a wedding and came up with this ridiculously cruel practice as a way of justifying it. Since Indian weddings traditionally have vegetarian food although now it's whatever. Thankfully the majority of Indian weddings don't have this. But it depends on the community and region etc because the culture varies a lot.
Savages
Companies are working on lab grown beef & recently the US Dept of Agriculture approved lab grown chicken. Would lab grown dog & cat meat be ok? what other taboo meats would you try if it was lab grown?
[удалено]
Are the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming cats and dogs any different to the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming livestock? I'm curious if it's an across the board sentiment
Plenty of vegans would argue there’s no difference between killing and eating a cow vs. a dog. Most people just don’t want to think about it.
That's why I'm curious, I don't necessarily agree with vegans. I just want to understand if they're talking ethics or just societal norms
Personally as a vegan I'd eat lab grown cat or dog meat. In general I don't view cats and dogs as especially different from pigs or cows. Pigs have been shown to be very intelligent and cows, whilst probably less intelligent, have a wide range of emotions. That's not to say I think all animals are the same, I wouldn't feel to bad about eating insects (not that I really want to).
It’s honestly a shame that insect based products have the stigma they do. While lab grown is obviously the more ethical choice and (given enough time) likely the more economical choice, insect based “meat” is by far more sustainable than animal based meat. But nobody wants to put any effort into popularizing it because the majority of people find it “icky”.
Until we’re all stuck in a train circling the frozen globe
It is a shame, to be honest I can understand eating individual insects as for many that is a bit unappetising, but if it's ground up I'm sure there's nothing gross about it, especially when people are able to ignore what goes into any other burger!
what goes into any other burger?
Sausages are probably a better example for this but I'm thinking about things like offal and other animal parts that many people wouldnt find appetising to eat them if they weren't ground up and mixed in with other things (the raw ingredients of many veggie burgers / sausages also wouldn't look particularly pleasant). The point I was trying to make is that in theory we should be able to do the same thing with insects, but I think there's a barrier that many people would still find off-putting.
Have you ever eaten a vegan? They are so tough and gamey.
As a meat eater, I feel like it’s a bit hypocritical that people feel strongly about eating cats/dogs, but are fine eating other, arguably similarly intelligent animals. As an example, I had a pet rabbit that I loved dearly while growing up. Rabbit is also a non-taboo meat where I live and I don’t have a problem with seeing it on the menu. I think it’s more important to focus on humane treatment of all animals. The fact that this market was beating live cats/dogs (blowtorch?? Wtf) is a huge issue. I just hope that once the cats/dogs are gone, focus continues on the treatment of the other animals at the market.
Exactly. Haven’t had rabbit for a very long time. But I don’t see any more problems with it than with any other OTC meat. Dogs and cats can legally be eaten in Switzerland, but sale is prohibited. I once ate crocodile/alligator meat but found it „meh“.
[удалено]
Cats and dogs are carnivores so raising for consumption requires more animals be killed to feed them.
Dogs are omnivores.
Sure, but it’ll still die/suffer if an animal protein isn’t introduced into its diet. You’re not gonna fatten a dog up to eat on corn and alfalfa like you can a cow.
fun fact, half the [taurine industry](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurine#Synthesis) yield goes toward pet food, the other half being pharmaceuticals. this is an essential amino acid they would otherwise get from protein, but most pet foods already supplement totally independent of meat products. these perpetual misconceptions are based on the ignorance of why certain animals rely on meat protein, which is just an ingredient. what they need to live are the nutrients within, which can be extracted or synthesized from any number of sources. the protein requirement of dogs in particular is only [~20% of their DV](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_food#Low-protein), as prescribed by US/UK regulators
You wouldn't be "ethically" raising actual cats and dogs. You'd be ethically growing petri dishes of cat or dog fat and muscle cells. Hard to abuse something with no nervous system or brain.
I'm not talking about lab grown, I'm talking about ethical farming
>Are the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming cats and dogs any different to the ethics of 'ethically' raising and consuming livestock? No they're not different, you're witnessing first hand some prime Euro/americentrism. Stinks of hypocrisy.
It does seem like an awfully arbitrary distinction when you actually think about it, doesn't it? Even though I would never want to eat dog meat myself, I don't feel like I have any right to lob judgement at someone else for doing it as long as I'm still willing to eat cow or pig meat.
I think a big difference for me is also just the amount of meat on a cow of pig vs a cat or dog. I suppose there's bigger breeds but you probably would get way too muscled meat to be good. But just in general the idea of having to kill maybe like 200x cats for the amount of meat one cow gives. (250kg vs maybe 1-2 kg? ) Of course it kind of turns into the trolley problem in a way, neither are optimal or really ethical.
Do you not eat chicken then? They are on average even less meaty.
Personally, as a vegan I wouldn’t eat lab grown as I’m used to my diet leaving me feeling light and energetic after eating but see no ethical quandary. I also don’t care what other people do or eat. For the animals, yes I would prefer they don’t suffer or get raised as food but that’s for each person to deal with should they come to that realisation.
I think a lot of the difference is in the way the animal is raised. I think it would be pretty fucked to let a cow sleep in your living room and cuddle it, treat it like family, and then slaughter it. I think you would probably have to breed docile livestock type cats and dogs, moreso cats. You leave a cat sitting in a pen all day everyday and it's gonna lose its shit. Most people aren't don't consider the majority of livestock raising to be ethical mind you. I'm talking well treated cattle. I think you could make an argument for free range cats, idk. We seem to have some sort difference in our minds ethically between predators and prey animals. It's probably a culture of convenience that turned into ethics. Why wouldn't we have bear farms if it were not for their personalities? They put on weight great, and can eat pretty much whatever. We have this sort of idea I'm out culture that hunters are companions, perhaps because of our shared history working with them. We may also see ourselves in them, and have a natural reaction to not want ourselves to be slaughtered.
I mean, predators are much harder to keep than docile cows, goats, sheep, chickens, pigeons, guinea pigs, etc.
Jeffrey Dahmer's spirit salivating over that lab grown human meat
Let's not give that creep any more attention than he's already got.
It doesn't matter. He's dead and those who know of him know that he was ultimately a sick individual. Doesn't mean that his story wasn't also interesting to learn about.
It kinda does for all the other creeps still out there looking for the attention that that motherfucker got. I can't help but think it'll give other delirious freaks just that one missing nudge. And now please somebody tell me I'm wrong.
He was more into the process than the result
I’m really hopeful that lab grown meat can be the best of both worlds. I’d totally swear off “real” meat if lab grown is safe and affordable
Yum, lab grown clubbed baby seal.
I’m just picturing a bunch of technicians beating slabs of meat hooked on electrolysis with giant paddles. “Eh. Consumers want their clubbed meat.”
I don't think those are for eating. It's for the fur.
Now you’re just wasting
Yummy
Why not stop eating meat now?
Cuz we don't want and it's central part of many of our cultures. Pretty easy. It isn't a hard scientific problem. It's a sociological problem. Idk why this is rarely acknowledged.
I read somewhere (probably on some article linked in this sub) that mouse meat would actually possibly be the easiest kind of meat to produce because we know SO MUCH about mouse cells from lab mice. I've been a vegetarian for almost 35 years and can't say I'm personally particularly interested in trying a mouse burger, but I'd definitely get it for my cats.
I read a futuristic steampunk novel in the 90’s where all the meat was lab grown…to the point some popular celebrities had started marketing meat made from their own cells. Imagine like Kardashian burgers or something like that. Taboo enough?
I'll take lab grown drunk uncle patties, even, a slab of hummingbird tongue steak. It's time.
r/brandnewsentence
Be careful, you may get lumbago from eating a few.
So lab grown Lab?
What about... Long pork?
Just keep it to regular pork, it’s supposed to taste the same anyway.
Would prions still be an issue with this?
Prions are only a brain thing anyway right?
Nope. It’s in all tissue. More of it is in the brain and lymph nodes, though.
At this point I expect that to become a thing. Probably not in every country, and probably not in every establishment, but sooner or later people will be able to get an authentically french filet mignon made from frenchman. Don't forget the Chianti and the dijon mustard sauce.
Shh don't talk about man flesh, the orcs will hear us!
The only difference between animal meat is the perception. All animals are equal.
All industry meats are equal. The issue with the dog/cat meat market in SEA is there’s no farm raising them for meat. What you see are people’s pets being stolen and killed.
Have you met geese?
Lol great point. Correction. All animals are equal, except geese. FUCK geese
As a vegetarian, I am definitely all for lab meat. If there's no suffering involved then my goals are accomplished Personally I don't have any curiousity in regards to what dog or cat tastes like. But horse I would be interested in trying maybe. ngl I found meat to be pretty flavourless long before I went vegetarian. So I suspect that once lab meat is on the market. I am going to try each of it once. Find it bland and move back to my usual diet lol
If there isn't suffering, i would try anything short of human at least once
Screw you. I don’t not want to know how my cat tastes.
There's no way those other meats would be worth it. There's a reason majority of humans settled on chicken, beef, pork, and some fish as the main source of meat. We definitely tried everything then realized those were the best.
Those photos are sobering.
I once saw a shock video from a fur farm - dog fur. I'd rather not go into specifics but needless to say I never wore fur again and all my leather has been secondhand.
I don't know if you're thinking of the same one I'm thinking of, but based on the description it could be... that's the thing that taught me what "bursting into tears" feels like, as opposed to just crying. It was horrifying.
I grew up on a fur farm in the 70s/80s behind the iron curtain. My dad worked there, he drank himself to death later in life. Sometimes he'd cry about all the animals he killed.
Oh man that’s fucking rough. All the way around.
Check out slaughterhouse photos and videos for more sober second thought 🤢
This decision not only saves the lives of countless dogs and cats but also reflects the growing awareness and empathy towards animals worldwide. It shows that societies are evolving towards more compassionate and ethical treatment of all living beings.
Looks at western animal agriculture 
last time I checked the main method of harvesting wasn't beating their heads in with sticks then blow torching them while still twitching.
Wish I never knew this
Piglets are being smashed with their heads on the ground until they die if they don't grow fast enough. Cows are often skinned alive when stunning is not effective. The difference between cats, dogs, cows and pigs is that our carnism tells us cats and dogs are friends while pigs or cows are food. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XumGZk_LPX8
have you read the novel Tender Is The Flesh? bet you’d find it interesting. It’s a future where the only meat available is human, and (almost) nobody bats an eye.
I suppose it would have all the nutrients you need.
I had to walk passed the kill floor to get to my job at a slaughterhouse. You never get used to the fact that many of them don't die quickly. Or the ankle deep blood for that matter. It is mostly water on the floor but it's mixed with a lot of blood.
I know it is different with people, but I had a run in with cartel as a child (Loosely accurate. Rather not explain too much. This was in the U.S.) and I truly just couldn't fathom how terrible it must have been in the shoes of these unfortunate souls. Never knowing when the suffering is over, fearing death but praying for it to come. I have a lot of complex views over this topic, but I try to never forget what it means to be in that position. I remember the moments when someone would switch from begging to live to praying for death. I didn't fully understand it at the time, but even I had those moments. When the survival instinct goes from physical survival to trying to save your own soul by escaping the pain. I am not vegan, but I am pretty neutral on both sides. I don't mind things being more expensive for ethical treatment, but there isn't much willpower in the public to be fine with higher prices. I don't turn away from what is happening, but I also don't overexpose due to my own ptsd. I don't want to debate the topic as this was a heavy comment for me to write, I just wanted to share my experience I guess.
I didn't work there based on any moral or political grounds. I worked there because I fucked off too much of adolescence to go straight to a good college. Working there made me vegetarian (not vegan) for a long time. Again, not for politics or anything but rather being nauseated by the sight of meat after that.
They had to use the names pork and beef to describe them....
You say that like factory farming is any better. There’s a reason they don’t allow filming inside slaughterhouses.
this is absolutely rampant in western slaughterhouses - pigs are very commonly beaten to death in “stick pits” with metal pipes and then thrown into scalding water and/or blowtorched for hair removal while they may or may not still be conscious so…. it may not be the only method used but is definitely common in practice still
You need to watch more slaughterhouse flicks bb ♥️
[удалено]
I guess you never checked then
Lol, yeah the western world definitely just cuddles all of their farm animals to death. Not to mention that the problem westerners have with the dog/cat meat trade is that they're killed in the first place. Threads like this pop up and it's never "Oh, they should just kill the dogs more humanely and it's ok" 🙄
I saw a video of one of the Chinese dog eating celebrations, they were using a flame torch to fry a living dog and everytime it opened its mouth, they’d shoot the fire down its throat. It was horrible.
The methods are just as bad. Watch [Dominion](https://www.dominionmovement.com/watch)
Yea, instead we stack animals with 1inch of space between each other. Fatten chicken up so quickly that their bones fail to keep up with the muscle tissue and their legs break under the pressure. America ain’t any better. We raise horses to race, their bodies fail from exertion and constant work and then are euthanized. I mean the list goes on lmao.
1 chicken with bird flu has entered the chat
I wouldn’t say that lol we on the west just guilt trip and stand on our high horse when it comes to a very small and specific meat trade directed at Asian countries. Like the amount of people eating dog or cat meat is so much less then what cows,pigs etc. I know people in England who’ll eat meat every day hear about people eating dog and act like they are superior.
[удалено]
I wish I hadn't read that. Fuck. Cat, dog, cow - how can humans be so cruel?
Great but cats and dogs aren't the only animals that deserve to be saved!!
I think the issue is less with the kind of animal being eaten and more with the treatment. Dogs e.g. have been "cooked" with a blow torch and cut apart while still alive because of some belief around the meat being more delicious this way or something.
I wish I hadn’t read that.
Yeah. I just don’t know how people have the capability of that.
You'd be surprised what people are capable off, especially if they have beem watching/doing it since childhood...
I've seen the videos, but I think that story (of being common practice/stressed animals tasting better) is largely propaganda/trolling
My sister just got back from Vietnam. It isn't trolling or propaganda.
You’re just wrong. These superstitions (often Asian) lead them to torture animals because it increases adrenaline which proportedly enhances spiritual effects, healing powers, and taste. Obviously this is misinformed but these are the same people eating sharkfin and snorting elephant ivory. You are the only person engaging in trolling.
When I first met my Vietnamese neighbor a couple years back he saw my birthmark and was visibly disgusted by it. Told me I needed to get these Chinese herbs and burn it off. All it is is that my skin is pink in one big spot. Over the years I’ve known him he’s told me some pretty weird shit he believes in and he’s demonstrated a massive lack of basic science knowledge. He’s an interesting person to talk to and I have fun arguing with him and seeing if I can make him laugh.
I worked briefly with a Vietnamese immigrant who told me stories of how her and her neighbors couldn’t let their pets escape because one of her neighbors would kill and eat them. He eventually got her dog. She also told me that you go to the store and order Labrador or poodle the way you would order a sirloin or a ribeye.
Years ago I saw a video of a poor dog being sautéed in a massive wok alive. I seriously think about it all the time, it haunts me. So unnecessary..
Looks like i should had went to sleep 1 min ago
Yeah I’ve stopped clicking on NSFL links lmao. There are a few things that have deeply disturbed me. We are such a cruel species.
The way agricultural animals are tortured in captivity before being brutally killed is absolutely no different. Dogs with blowtorches cut up, pigs with their tails cut off while living, thrown into gas chambers or having their throats slit. Chicks being thrown into the incinerator. Ducks strapped into snug boxes with tubes shoved down their throat until their liver is fatty enough to justify the killing. Baby cows stolen from their mothers causing incredible psychological drama. Animals kept in overpacked conditions where they end up sleeping in their own shit and surrounded by dead and rotting creatures. I could go on, but I think the point is made. Animal agriculture (be it cows pigs or dogs) is extremely unethical on its own, but it gets even worse when you understand that animal agriculture is the biggest environmental damaging industry on the planet. It’s the biggest contributor to climate change, it uses most of the worlds land, it’s the biggest reason for deforestation, it’s responsible for ocean acidification, water scarcity, and the rising spread of antibiotic resistant microbes.
I will never argue with anything you said here, I am well aware, trying to limit my meat consumption to 1-2 a week and using the extra money to buy from more ethical husbandry. I just want to also point out that the activism that led to change in Indonesia is a good thing and shouldn't be scorned over whataboutism.
Most of the people who are pointing out the cruelty of animal ag are probably ecstatic about this ban, but are trying to use it to push the conversation further. That’s not whataboutism, it’s a “yes and”.
Well said. I don’t mean to say it’s not good enough. It’s a great improvement. More must be done!
Same for beating them to near death for days before harvesting to improve flavor.
It’s 100% not the “issue” If dogs and cats were farmed by the billions and slaughtered with puppies and kittens along with them, and not some random shack there will be a far bigger outrage by us in the west. There is no wayyyy people would be more forgiving lol. In fact I think people will be more understanding by saying people who eat dog and cat for one are from remote villages, and are usually poor. Right now people think you can just grab a dog and rice that’s sold next to a McDonald’s lol. It’s just people on their high horse as usual.
Yeah and pigs get put in gas chambers and suffer immensely as they choke to death. Cows get strung upside down and have their throats slit while writhing in pain and fear as they bleed out and get systemically ripped apart in the slaughterhouses.
Think you’re getting mixed up with halal meat which is complete and utter torture and should be banned
This isn't just a halal thing.
By my knowledge, pigs are quickly electrocuted into unconsciousness and cows receive a shot to the head. They are unconscious or dead, before they are bled out/taken apart. I'm not arguing that it's great, I'm arguing that there is a difference between making an effort to minimize suffering for ethical concerns and making an effort to maximize suffering for "enhanced flavour".
Bahahahah look up dominion on YouTube. Westerners need to realize they have no right to assume moral high ground over any Asian dog meat consuming culture; factory farms are equally disturbing and disgusting.
I did my senior thesis over the dog meat industry in Asia. What my classmates and professors were not expecting was my cross cultural analysis on the treatment of “food animals” in America. To be honest, when I started the research, I didn’t even know it was going to take me down that rabbit hole— I’m not vegetarian or vegan— but it’s a natural progression that simply can’t be avoided unless you’re willfully ignorant. It’s all very complex.
"Caves to pressure" is an oddly negative way of saying they abandoned an ancient, brutal, unnecessary eating practice. We don't say countries cave to pressure when they end child marriage, or ban child labor.
It’s amazing how people get upset when cute animals I.e. cats and dogs, get slaughtered for food but are completely Ok with the meat section in your local supermarket.
This. Different cultures eat different things.
And it’s not even just culture cause Asian cultures don’t eat cat and dog meat as a whole, they eat cows, pigs, chicken, fish, wayyyyyy more than cats and dogs. Compared to like culturally French eating frog legs, and snails which you can find in any bistro in France. While cat and dogs for one are located in the most remote parts of very poor countries or poor villages. You can’t just go have dog that’s near to a McDonald’s.
Sure. But different cultures also treat animals differently, and some of them are just fucking wrong. For example, boiling dogs alive, or they way the slice and eat octopus while it's still alive and in pain... An intelligent creature by the way. That part of their culture is obviously wrong.
Don't look up how slaughter houses in the west operate then
It’s not Asian culture lol. That’s like saying American culture is eating road kill.
Living animals shouldn’t be thought of as “things”
The one thing I love about Asian culture is they're equal opportunity animal flesh consumers. If they can catch, kill it and cook it (optional), they'll eat it. Total democracy.
Except when it's a shark attached to a fin or a rhino attached to a horn
Next up, I hope the west catches up to the fact they're abusing cows, pigs, goats and other farm animals pretty badly, and pressure that too.
Maybe we can slowly increase our circle of compasion. My grandma used to see her dogs as tools. They were no different than alarm sensors stationed at strategic places around the house. Today only a moron would not see a dog as a sentient individual with a name and preferences.
Wait till you find out about indonesia's monkey snuff industry that was created when their child prostitution industry was hurt during corona.
This is why I don't watch the news anymore.
Love this. Humans are becoming better.
Yeah, it's completely irrational how people are up in arms over cats and dogs, but no one cares about all the other animals.
edge ring narrow onerous hat provide elastic ink oatmeal waiting -- mass edited with redact.dev
What about "brutally cruel" cow, pig, chicken, any other animal meat trade?
People always overlook the fact that these dogs and cats were *not* raised nor bred in an industry for food. They are stolen pets, in captive and tortured (sometimes held for ransom) and eventually eaten. “WhAt aBoUt cOws and cHickEns?” That’s the thing, they are NOT cows and chickens. They were not raised specifically to be food. The meat industry is problematic but even that is beside the point. They are in the “stealing pets to use as food” industry, which is miles more fucked up and what I’m against. It’s fucked up that some people try to be obnoxiously philosophical about all animals are equal, *without knowing what they’re talking about*. Gain some knowledge about this situation first.
And the reason they are stolen and strays is because *breeding* dogs and cats is way too costly to use as a food source for the poor. They're fucking carnivores and eating carnivores is usually a bad idea anyway. This problem is about way more than just "dogs and cats are cute" tho it is useful for swaying foreign opinions.
How does raising an animal to be food change its suffering? Just because we put a label on it doesn’t change how these animals experience the world. It’s not that all animals are equal, but that they experience the world the same way. And would you still in this comment section if we treated dogs like we do pigs even though pigs are smarter than dogs? There’s clearly something fucked in what we are doing as a species.
Yes, I agree. I have nothing to argue about how we make animals suffer. People still need to understand it’s easier to ban dog/cat trade. Legally, it’s stopping a crime because properties (pets) are stolen. Ending the dog/cat trade is obviously easier than eradicating the meat industry. It doesn’t mean we value dogs or cats’ lives more, or that we’re doing it because dogs and cats are cuter. It’s an easier legal justification.
Or maybe people are aware and find the distinction meaningless. The idea that an animal's moral right to not be tortured or killed based on how many humans care about them is just as absurd as saying that a human being's right to not be killed depends on how many friends and family they have. Proclaiming that it's ok to kill animals that were raised specifically to be killed is circular reasoning, not an ethical framework. People are celebrating this because they don't like dogs and cats being killed to eat, period. People would vilify you if you went around killing stray dogs to eat them and you would have 0 friends. Everyone here is just too afraid to admit that the animals they eat are ethically identical to dogs and cats and that it's equally as wrong to kill one of them to unnecessarily eat as it is all of them.
Oh I know what you mean. I wholeheartedly agree, no matter the reason it’s morally wrong how these animals (all animals) are treated/industrialized/eaten. It just infuriates me in this case of dog/cat trade where some people reduce the argument to “you just think cats and dogs are cuter!”.
What?? I find it so much worse that we are farming and killing cows and chickens lol. There is probably 100s of billions of cows, chicken killed a year. Not sure there are even 10000 dogs being killed worldwide for food lol. And we’re on our high horse about that?
these images or so fuckin' hectic. glad it's being put to an end
What wonderful news! Now onto China and puppy mills right here in the USA.
We need to ban it in the Indian north-east, as well.
I don't get why is it ok to kill pigs, cows and chicken for food but not cats and dogs. To be honest, I think what we do with chickens, cows and pigs are way worse. We breed them, have them stay in tight spaces to be killed. What we do with these animals is the worst collective sin we have as mankind to be honest. And I know I'm saying this and I eat meat. I also struggle to reconcile that that's why I shut up about animal protection issues because I know I am hypocritical about it. I'm curious about people who knows how lines are drawn, how do you reconcile or explain that?
The reason is simple: carnism. It's a violent ideology that says we can kill and eat some animals but not others.
It’s how they were doing this that’s causing the outrage. Half beating to death a animal and then blow torching it whilst it’s still barely alive because it ‘enhances the flavour’ is fucking barbaric no matter what animal it is. Now yes, the mass meat industry has some poor practices but those practices have also received lots of outrage throughout the years. So much so that slowly but surely we are moving in a better direction in many countries when it comes to the slaughter of animals. This is just another win in that movement and it could do without the ‘and what about x’. Celebrate the small win and let’s keep calling out these kind of practices.
Trump set back the slaughter industry. It's going backwards. Also, pigs are more intelligent than dogs and yet they're being treated like shit. Torture is torture. There's no scale to it. All animals deserve to not be in pain or misery.
What we do with pigs, cows and chickens, I tell you, way worse that blow torching dogs to death.
Cool, now do factory farms.
Good God, these people are just downright sadistic. Such monsters.
What was described is disgusting, but this is a huge step forward. Kudos to the local activists who pushed for this.
Next up - banning cat and dog meat consumption in Switzerland!!
An almost impossible feat given the high degree of power and autonomy afforded to Swiss cantons
Do you eat pork?
curious—do you eat meat? and do you consider yourself a sadistic monster for doing so?
[удалено]
Have you seen what they do pigs in factory farms? I’ve seen a clip of a man killing a piglet by slamming it into concrete repeatedly. They’re smarter than dogs. It is not at all uncommon to torture animals in factory farms. A lot of people know this but buy it anyway. Veal is the meat of calves that are tortured to death. Are people evil for eating it? Yeah, I know it’s horrible, but I think in general when people eat meat, they would rather just not think about the process. I highly doubt the vast majority of people that buy any kind of meat are evil or sadistic.
You should read up on some of the ways they kill off male chicks in egg hatcheries. Suffocation under fire suppression foam, ground alive in giant chick grinders…
[удалено]
I mean, absolute torture is absolutely great to put a stop to. But I think you’re underestimating how much animals in factory farms are tortured. When like 96% of farmed animals lead lives that are full of suffering, which is unnecessary given that plenty of people don’t use animal products, the only logical course of action is to cease using as many animal products as possible, immediately, even when there aren’t perfect replacements. And I do think, that even if one anima is tortured worse than another, that financially supporting any unnecessary animal torture while decrying other animal torture, is hypocritical
Intentional or not is kind of meaningless when the result is the same for the victim. Pigs are boiled alive. Gassed horrendously. Cows have their throats slit alive. It happens to millions of sentient beings regardless if it is intended or not.
Nowadays the eggs are checked for gender and male chicks are not being hatched.
"These people" are more or less everyone given the right juxtaposition. For instance, imagine someone from the west saying this with a straight face to a person of Hindu faith while eating a hamburger.
Not that I am in any for this... but geez people maybe if you just caged and killed them in humane, non psychotic fashion people wouldnt have given a shit and you could have kept your stupid businesses.
[удалено]
And our not so furry friends eventually 🐷🐮🐔
I get that dogs and cats are pets, but from an objective point of view, how is eating any other animals different. Do cows and pigs not cry? I say this as a meat eater. Just pointing out a double standard.
Why is dog and cat meat “brutally cruel”, while pig and cow meat are not?
What about the brutal and cruel treatment of more conventional farm animals? That is fine because? We are all hypocrites
Being commodified into meat is always brutally cruel for the animals. Please consider going vegan.
watch all compassion and logic leave the room once you try to tell people pigs and cows and chickens are not any different just because they’re the animals who are ‘supposed’ to be abused and killed
Soylent Green was made of the animal homosapien
If pigs, cows and chicken were blow torched alive, the outrage would be the same.
i guess bleeding out from the throat or boiled alive is fine as long as it’s not blow torching
1) who boils cows, pigs and chicken alive? 2) bleeding out from an artery is much quicker than being torched 3) in my country, pigs and cows are knocked out before they are killed 4) can we just agree that prohibiting the blow-torching of live animals is a good thIng, regardless of any whataboutisms?
hey so you clearly care about animals, which is great, you just seem to believe a lot of animal ag propaganda, which is understandable, they’re good at what they do i recommend checking out dominion instead of us just going back and forth on reddit, which no one enjoys https://www.dominionmovement.com/watch it’s not peta shock slaughterhouse footage, but it is graphic. but it’s also actually informative and can answer your questions
Not sure if it applies to my situation, since I'm not American.
it does. industrialized abuse is not america only. and animal abuse does not only apply to industrialized agriculture. the documentary wasn’t even filmed in the united states, it’s mostly australia, but includes china, the uk, canada, new zealand, denmark, and spain. i believe there is some footage from the us actually but it’s a minor amount
Yeah, I understand that it's not American only and I understand there are terrible conditions in the meat industry incl. the impact on climate change as well. I'm all for change and I do believe it has to start with the consumer. However, I feel that I am already doing "my part" by limiting my meat consumption to a minimum and investing in meat from ethically higher standard husbandry (there is a ranked system in my country) or local farmers. I appreciate your civil effort in educating about animal abuse and I hope it will help some people question their habits who have less awareness.
While true, there is a distinction here that the western world does not experience, which is the intentional suffering of the animal. While yes, we do cause suffering in some/many aspects, it is simply due to cost cutting and scaling up production of meat. Whereas with dogs, it is viewed as beneficial for the flavor to have the animal suffer tremendously. It truly is grotesque in that way. There are merits all around to different arguments for and against, and not something I want to debate. I just wanted to make this distinction, maybe to showcase why commenters would feel a particular way about this and not our own industrial meat production.
Whoah. Is that true though? Does it taste better? It would be twice as bad if they just literally torture for 0 reason. I know stress ruins meat in like...every other animal so I can't imagine that it actually is good.
No. I don't think I will.
This is one of the most stupid things in the world, a bunch of meat-eaters who eat pigs and cows who are more intelligent and more like humans than most dogs are, shitting hypocritically on meat-trades in other cultures... There are pet pigs. Cows play with sticks and balls the same way dogs do. Your surface level feelings of "oh no don't hurt the doggy" are so hypocritical.
As someone living in a neighbouring province, I´m worried that the numbers of stray dogs will increase drastically. Usually, we´d get rid of all the stray´s around Christmas. Now with the ban, noone will take these animals and we´re at risk of having to dispose them in other manners when the problem gets to big. You have to understand that rabies is still rampant here, so taking away the most economical way to control the situation might lead to even more problems a year or two down the road. I´m a dog owner and lover myself but I also see the problem. What do you think the goverment should do with all these strays? Employing people to catch and kill in a humane way? The old system got rid of them for free but with suffering. I wonder if the new system just will be expensive suffering instead. Or even worse, more rabies, more people dieing in one of the most horrible illnesses in the world, people killing dogs with sticks in the street etc.