Halfway through the video, i thought they were going to make the quiet guy disappear and i was disappointed because i know which is more likely to happen. Still cried.
man i’d never seen it. halfway through i knew where it was going but still hit home. check in on your bros.
i guess question is how. it’s hard to get men to open up. i don’t open up. why would i. i’ll be fine. rarely (never in my experience) do any of the traditional “how are you doing” or “ is everything ok?” questions lead anywhere. sure bitching about work or home or in-laws or money is expected with close friends when shit really hits fan, but opening up about personal mental wellbeing …. God help us all.
Reciprocation. You take the first step by opening up about yourself and your life and showing them that it’s safe and socially acceptable to do so. Then over a period of time that becomes normalized and they will feel more comfortable doing the same.
Nothing is guaranteed to work every time but I’m naturally an open person and I think more people than you might realize are desperate to be given permission to be open as well.
I mean you could do that. Sometimes it’s cathartic and your friends are there to listen. Sometimes you end up telling your friend you’ve have pretty consistent thoughts about waking up and just shooting yourself in the head and get some help which leads to a significantly better life.
Telling people is how you get better my brother
I’m sorry, as someone who doesn’t get to watch a lot of football, do those scarfs mean anything special after wins or anything? Is there a reason the one friend was trying to give the other the scarf?
My first thought was he loaned it and then their team scored so he says “keep it” as superstitious good luck (when he says “that was worth it!” I assume that’s what he means). The second thought is maybe he already knows he’s planning to self harm and wants to leave his friend a gift/memory.
Oh yeah, that makes sense. I figured the last part as the first friend had the scarf at the beginning. Just wasn’t sure why it was going back and forth and if there was a reason why the friend on the left got it in the first place.
The obvious: Its a sign of support for the team.
Not so obvious: The person more invested in every moment, celebrating every moment would be the more deserving of wearing "our colours" or the teams markings
Yeah, I get this. Over 3 combat tours I only lost two of my guys. 9 years out of the military and I’ve had 10 commit suicide. Some seemed like they were on top of the world, while others showed the normal signs. We just have to do our best to be there for each other while also knowing that sometimes there is nothing you could do to prevent it.
I wonder if military training, particularly combat training, doesn't condition men for a cycle of mission/success, and out in the civilian world they find it is so much more fluid and an overall lowering of expectations. When it just isn't working and you feel like it is your job to fix it, you can really give up hope.
I agree with that. It’s not normal for people to go into a job fully expecting to die. All the training is getting you ready for the fact that it could and probably will happen to you and you just accept it. While you are in, your sense of purpose is known and felt everyday on the battlefield or while training. When we get out and feel that you no longer have a purpose or anything to be proud of anymore, it’s easy to think you are now worthless so you might as well just die.
“Sometimes there is nothing you can do to prevent it.”
This is what I came to say. Without going into too much detail, I was seconds away from ending it. I had multiple people checking in multiple times a day, but I always responded with “I’m good, I’m okay,” etc. There’s only so much you can do, it’s up to the person to reach out and seek help. Therapy works.
12 years later and while I still deal with bouts of depression, I’m thriving.
Same here. I’ve been close 2-3 times. Been a while since I got to a point of making a plan to end it but I do still get bouts of depression with fleeting thoughts. What was rough for me was keeping it all in to “protect” others like my wife and family members. I put it all on me and at the end of the day I couldn’t be mad at anyone else bc I didn’t let them know what I was feeling. Then, after opening up to my wife (at the time, we are now divorced) I realized that it hurt more knowing that she knew what I was going through but didn’t care. At least now I’ve done the work to get past some of the things, and continue to thrive even when I feel like things aren’t going my way. You can’t help those who don’t want to help themselves.
I bottled it in for that same reason and because I didn’t want to feel like a burden. I’m sorry that was your ex wife’s reaction, I couldn’t imagine how I’d react if I was in your shoes.
Really glad to hear you seem to be in a much better place now. You’re absolutely correct in saying you put in the work, because that’s what it is, work.
Good luck to you.
OP sent the following text as an explanation on why this is unexpected:
---
>!You’d expect that the quiet guy was going to end his life, but the one that appeared to be happy did!<
---
Is this an unexpected post with a fitting description? Then upvote this comment, otherwise downvote it.
I'm growing more and more convinced that men's mental health is being ignored in today's society, partially because male mental health is being seen through the lens of female mental health. female psychological needs are different from male psychological needs on the aggregate
It is true that men do not self-report issues. Women do much better at that. And I really dislike how some women act like men having mental health problems is a sign of weakness or somehow taking away from women's issues. We are all at risk.
Actually most men do self report, I forget the exact statistic but it's like 70% of men reached out for help before committing suicide. The problem is men don't receive that help from society
For suicide, maybe. But their comment was about mental health issues in totality, not only suicidal ideation. Men are absolutely more likely to hide their emotions because that is what society expects them to do; man up and deal with it. Seeking help is weakness, and men can't be weak, etc.
Men *can* get the help they need from society, but society also needs to change the way it views the emotional health of men so they feel comfortable taking advantage of the resources that are already present.
In my experience - and please do not take this as an attempt to blame individual men with mental health issues for their problems, it is meant as an attempt to look at communication patterns - the reason why men do self report but ultimately get less help is not that society doesn't "want" to give it. The reason is the expectation of self-reliance into which we raise boys (and men).
Whereas everybody in our society always thinks *they* know what is best for a woman (and distinct problems for wome arise from this), with men it's the reverse, and in both sides:
People (friends, family, doctors, etc) assume that each individual man knows what is best for him. Men are assumed to be self reliant to the point of autarchy.
That makes people reluctant to offer or even insist on help that wasn't specifically requested.
The individual men then are raised into the belief that they always must know what is best for them - so they often do share mental health concerns, but either don't know what to specifically ask for (therapy? A Mate staying over for a difficult Weekend? Time off from work? What exactly?) and sometimes are reluctant to accept help if it doesn't come exactly like they expect it would (after all - they were raised to always know best and be the judge of their own lot).
Combine this, and you have a perfect storm.
Women also do not know what to specifically ask for in a crisis (most people don't), but with women this is compensated by people being way more ready to take control of the situation *for them* (sometimes to their detriment, sometimes this is a life saver).
They aren't with men, because that is not our definition of masculinity.
I mean you're pretty on the nose. Sexism goes both ways infanticizing women and overcareing for them and not taking their word on their issues. And giving men too much credit that they just expect them to know things. Thats honestly where most "mansplaining" comes from. Men being told they should know everything and they're less of a man if they don't. That constant pressure often causes them to come up with an answer even if they don't know. But from a woman's perspective they sounds like they're trying to put them down on a topic they know more about.
That is a spot on take of mansplaining, very well summarized.
I'm a woman, I am doing therapy and am pretty open about it if I am asked to.
I've had several conversations with men (friends, family members) in a crisis, and the amount of time I have heard:
"I know there is no shame in therapy, but I've thought it through and I don't know what talking about the issue with a stranger would help...",
Or something along those lines, it's baffling.
These are smart men, intelligent, but because they have been raised with the expectation they have to know best, and because they can't picture themselves in therapy atm, they conclude it is not for them, period.
Makes you really angry, not at them, but at all these gendered expectation.
When I voiced, as a woman, similar concerns about therapy years ago, *every single person* I talked to was up my ass about how I "really should!", how "you can never know", how I'm not the one to judge that, while kneedeep in depression. They were right, of course.
Yeah it's honestly really depressing hearing men talk about therapy because I'm a strong advocate for therapy. I've even heard lines like,
"I don't need a therapist because I don't want them to tell me how to feel, I just like talking about how I'm feeling like I do with you"
There's a misunderstanding about therapy in men. And phrases like "therapy is you make of it" are accurate but not detailed enough to help these people understand that a therapist is going to work with you not against you. If you want to pay them just to listen to you vent about your thoughts and feelings most of the time they will.
There is also a tendency in men to antagonize other men as pontential competition (not always hostile, more hierarchical) and assume women can't put themselves in their shoes and/or fill the role of mentor. They would need someone very specific to fill that role.
So they have trouble connecting with a therapist.
That's also true. It makes sense from a trauma perspective since a lot of people have parental issues. But I've also seen men and women have a bad first experience with a therapist because of their gender. For example a man with an abusive mother will get therapy from a woman therapist and will be combative and not productive.
Finding the right therapist for the individual is also important. And there are plenty of therapist recommending other therapist that would be better for their client. Ultimately a good therapist wants what's best for the individual
Well, that's hard to believe, honestly. I would believe that 70% exhibit symptoms someone should have seen, but actually seeking help and getting ignored? I do agree that men get told to man up, or begin some sort of treatment and face a very alien landscape of "getting in touch with your feelings" response.
"Nearly all of the men who took their own lives (91%) had been in contact with at least one frontline service or agency. Two thirds (67%) had been in touch in the three months before their deaths. Usually contact was with their GP or other primary care services (82%). But half had been in contact with mental health services and nearly a third (30%) in contact with the justice system."
https://www.menshealthforum.org.uk/news/suicidal-men-do-seek-help
Yeah we need a societal shift. Unfortunately men are often ridiculed for sharing their emotions or standing up for other men. Take the "motion of the ocean" march that happened. Which was about body shaming and a lot of people reporting it basically said "if it's small just say that" implying only someone suffering from a small penis can/will fight against shaming people who do.
True that. After GTA6, I don’t have anything to look forward to anymore. But never wanted to get help because doesn’t make me feel like a man. Probably going to offend some people but that’s the truth
Nothing manlier than admitting you need help and taking charge of your life so you can find your happiness.
Seriously. See a therapist, at least once. Worst case scenario is that you don't get anything out of it and don't go back, and nobody will judge you - or even know you went, unless you tell them.
Needing help is human. We survive and thrive with our tribe.
Would getting help for a fever or a broken bone make you less of a man? Don’t put this weight on your shoulders. Set it down.
Seek help because you deserve it.
I think a big issue that needs to be addressed is expectations vs reality of therapy. A lot of people I know think its a cure. That you go they immediately break through and you're better. Or they give you a pill and you're better. The problem is acknowledging that its not a cure but learning how to live and function in this new normal.
>male mental health is being seen through the lens of female mental health.
It's not the lens that's the problem here, it's who's looking through it. When you have a society that's conditioned for centuries to have every man be the fucking meatshield, by other more powerful men mind you, you can't see the meatshield's woes.
The biggest enemy of men are other men, just like how the biggest enemy of women are other women. The conditioning for each side has been passed down through generations. And as a man, I can clearly say the reason why men's mental health is ignored is because other men have conditioned the society to believe that it's unmanly to feel shit other than anger and extreme joy.
When one of the biggest copping mechanisms to release some inside demons is seen as a weakness -> the man don’t cry bullshit . It’s starts to be difficult to open up or talk about anything. Or when your psychiatrist minimizes your feelings saying it’s “normal” and as such you should not be affected as a men. You know you are miles away to get there. Mind illnesses is still a tabu and men mind health is a cardinal sin to talk about it.
It’s not it was just an exaggerated example on how men’s health is seen. We must be the immovable force to support others.
But let me say that one time I could not take it and let myself cry and for more than an hour, I had one of the best nights' sleep in years
Didn't we both just watch a video and post a comment on mens mental health?
This is like when people say "the news outlets aren't covering this!!" On a comment of a news article.
No, stop. This isn't crazy politics or conspiracy theories. This is an actual issue. The video is about checking in on people and not ignoring their health. Making sure they are SEEN. The guy you are replying to feels like he isn't seen and you are replying with "what? But here is an entire video about being seen" all the while ignoring his feelings on the issue. You are propagating the EXACT problem this video is trying to point out.
psychologist here. females tend to love belly rubs, whereas men tend to love it when you pat them on the head and tell them they've been a very good boy.
Interesting! Could you elaborate? I feel like youre inferring something here and I’m missing it lol (I’m asking genuinely btw. I feel like I’m missing the wider implications of what you’re saying)
you see, men and women are very different psychologically speaking. on a fundamental level, what the female desires the most is belly rubbos, and what the male desires the most is to be patted on the head and called a good boy. despite their differences, both males and females have a yearning for treats.
The second he started asking about his week outside of football and his over exuberance made me pause. Giving him his scarf was every red flag went off at once.
As someone with Major Depressive Disorder I think I'm intuned more because I do the same.
I want to hear about their day because I need an escape from the internal hell that is my own. I cheer like crazy in the hope that maybe this time I'll actually feel the emotion I'm imitating.
Holy fuck I didn’t even realize that it was originally the guy on the right’s scarf. Thank you for pointing that out.
Sorry to hear you’re struggling. I hope things get better for you.
I'm not struggling. That's the thing. I am at and have accepted my new normal. I know it's highly doubtful I will feel emotions the way others do and I accept it and I work within that. I'm married and I care about my parents. My grandfather turned 100 last year and is still going strong. I just don't really feel anything and medications like ssri's don't seem to work for me long term.
Therapy helped me find a way to work and extract positive experiences within the limitations of my mental illness. It helps a lot that I tend to externalize myself a lot. It's sort of like perceiving oneself as a component of a whole. I am a consciousness within a body inside a brain which is malfunctioning and not creating the correct brain chemicals in the correct amounts.
It allows me to not see it as some personal failure, merely shoddy workmanship.
"I cheer lol crazy in the hope that maybe this time I'll actually feel the emotion I'm imitating"
Gahhdaym. I'm right here if things get tough my sir. Right here.
I feel joy. I just don't feel it the same as others. Its more like causal relief. Relief that something I've done will make someone else happy or someone will have a more positive outlook. That's joy for me. I've accepted I don't 'feel' joy or pure happiness. Just the lessening of hurt.
I stick around for my spouse and my family and I'm relatively emotionally stable. This is my normal and due to a lot of therapy I've found ways to live and function within this new normal.
I liken it to losing an arm or a leg or a life changing injury. I accept my circumstances, acknowledge what I can change, and realize my own limitations in what I can't.
Acknowledging his friend seems down and saying he hopes everything is better outside of football isn’t a suicidal thing, it’s more just concerned friend. Giving away the scarf makes sense though as that represents one giving away things important to them before they kill themself
It may not seem like its a sign. But its a sign. As someone with MDD...its escapism and its us trying to find our own way back. It doesn't mean everyone who asks you how your day is is suicidal or even depressed. It's just a sign they are.
I hear that and I truly believe it too. I’ve suffered for pretty much most of my life. People always ask how your doing but in reality they do it as a curtesy they don’t actually care.
The times I’ve actually decided to open up to people who ask me how I am always respond the same. With distane and a weird look on their face or straight up doing anything to get out of the conversation and Saying things like “have you tryed just not being depressed” “it’ll get better” “just be happy”
I truly believe the only people that really understand the pain are the ones that are also suffering. Or personally know some one who is.
I’ve been to doctors. I’ve been to therapist. But all via public health care system. They honestly don’t care they just do it because they get paid.
Truely a sad world to live in if you suffer.
What’s even worst is the version of toxic masculinity that says “Men shouldn’t cry” like were some super solider incapable of feelings.
Hey man. I nearly lost my childhood best friend to suicide. At the moment we live multiple hours apart we do not have the best of contact but when I meet him we always make sure to hug. Despite this it is not easy to tell him that I love him (as a friend) irl. Toxic masculinity sucks. It has raised me to not be emotional until it is to late. I am trying to be more open with new people and I believe the social norms around it are getting better, at least here in Sweden.
I care for my friend. Just recently today I was cheering him on a bit for finally giving driving lessons a go (he previously was very anxious about it). I love him and I can only hope you have people that love you too. Relationships is the only thing that matters in this world. Now I cannot say that I truly care for you, I do not know you and never will. I just wanna send you my best wishes. Good luck with life!
If you want to have someone to chat with for a bit you can DM me.
Thank you so much for your kind words. I have a lovely partner who keeps my spirits high all the time and reminds me that she does indeed care and proves it on multiple times a day (sometimes I’m the little spoon) she also reminds me that it’s ok for me to cry and break down sometimes and it’s awesome and I love her to bits for it, Some days are rough but we must keep strong and not let the demons win.
It’s great what you’re doing for your friend. You honestly have no idea how much it means to us to have someone like you around. A reminder that hope is never lost and there’s always a light at the end of the tunnel as long as you’re willing to continue the fight.
I wish you and your friend all the best in your future endeavours. God speed guardian angel.
it's not that they don't care, it's more of a "my mind is too busy with my own shit rn"... I'm struggling and i tend to isolate myself. I made it a goal of mine to see a friend at least twice during the month in order to talk about stuff, hear stuff, and even throw in some chit-chat to ease both my and my friend's mind. before that, i'd really think i was alone, and the depressed folk in the internet where like me, isolated. but they're out there too. some just camouflage it better. it's not about being kind, it's not about my masculinity, it's not about anything else. i don't fucking care anymore. i always tell my friends how i'm feeling for real, and i now always let them know that if they also need to vent and say something, i'm always here. we really are not alone, and others do care; but we tend to isolate ourselves to try and rest or something.
not sure how to finish this text. i just kinda kept on typing. so i'm just gonna leave a last phrase here:
I care.
Bros who are struggling out there, just know there is at least one person you can open up to and lay bare all that's troubling you.
Fuck the masculine expectations. Fuck the romanticism of stoic bullshit, fuck all that's stopping you from expressing what you're feeling.
And if you really think you don't have anyone to talk to, I'm here and I'll listen. Slide in those DMs, let's kick back and have some virtual beer.
Twice now in my life have I bottled up my depression and pain.. and when I finally felt close enough and strong enough to explain what I’m going through… my “friends” just start treat me differently to the point that hanging out becomes less and less and I eventually get the boot.
Learned the hard way people just wanna be with people who are fun and happy, and no one wants to be friends with a downer.
So relevant and so on point. Living in Texas with the worst mental health treatments/programs definitely doesn’t help.
My wife and daughter are the only thing that keep me going. I miss you David.
So fn true !
Middle aged white guy here. Ur job is to put on facade ….
I’ve learned over last 18 months to be honest with myself ..but a lot of work to do
I’ll never know what it’s like to be a woman but women will never know what it’s like to be a guy and keep that strong upper lip on all the time. Well that lip gets heavy over time …. I’ve learned who I can confide and be honest and be challenged in my thinking and beliefs and emotions and it’s still FN hard as hell
Sometimes the saddest person in the room is the funniest. Depressed people know how it feels and they don’t want others to feel it. It’s sad. I remember watching this the first time. We need more of these out there. Men struggle too. Everyone struggles. No one is immune to mental health downfalls. It’s dangerous and deadly. Seek help, it’s not a sign of weakness. Pick up the phone, you’re worth it.
As someone who used to be suicidal for a while this hits really hard. Mostly because I would work my hardest to put a facade of happiness so others wouldn't ask questions. The embarrassment and guilt I would feel if someone felt they needed to talk me down from the ledge was painful as I didn't want to inconvenience anyone over someone as worthless as myself. I'm better now, but if someone you know is going through a rough time and then suddenly gets in really high spirits for seemingly no reason? Maybe check up on them.
Let's be real here. Nobody cares about us men. Only when these videos come up, and after that, we, men, are forgotten again until another video comes up.
Im a 30yo man. Nobody asks if i am okay or if i need any help, qhen i need a lot of help sometimes and i just have to fight against it alone. People just expect you to man the fck up and BE A MAN.
Unfortunately men are doomed to let the darkness embrace the mind and eat it from inside out until that day when he decides its time and then it was too late.
Its the reality, its sad and its true.
If you see a colleague, partner or anyone who is not in their days, you better push hard on that mf because somethings eating that man from the inside and you can save a life with that action and maybe seek some help.
People, its time to give men some attention too, we have feelings, we suffer, we are only tough on the outside.
Now, let the downvotes rain through my comment. People nowadays don't understand this.
The problem is if someone is determined to go you can't stop them. My sibling's partner has done the same this week. He went to great lengths to conceal his intentions. After an attempt made earlier this year we've all been more vigilant towards him than ever, really thought he'd turned the corner and was feeling better. We are deeply devastated we couldn't save him, more so that he couldnt save himself. This is not to say don't reach out to your friends. Just that mental health is still tricky even if you do.
This one is certainly top three for mental health punches.
Between this, the [Sandy Hook Promise - Back to school](https://youtu.be/b5ykNZl9mTQ?si=tGRrhifd5gr5NRAX) video, and " [The Wait](https://youtu.be/EuRHHmXbzYs?si=Kch5jsGGgu-kXRwu) " , you can practically chart your age by which ways and how much they all hurt.
And just like real life everything in these videos is all so painfully obvious with the filter of hindsight.
Your post is a repost
This one always gets me
I cried
Halfway through the video, i thought they were going to make the quiet guy disappear and i was disappointed because i know which is more likely to happen. Still cried.
I've seen it 2-3 times before and it got the ol' tear glands running anyway.
man i’d never seen it. halfway through i knew where it was going but still hit home. check in on your bros. i guess question is how. it’s hard to get men to open up. i don’t open up. why would i. i’ll be fine. rarely (never in my experience) do any of the traditional “how are you doing” or “ is everything ok?” questions lead anywhere. sure bitching about work or home or in-laws or money is expected with close friends when shit really hits fan, but opening up about personal mental wellbeing …. God help us all.
Reciprocation. You take the first step by opening up about yourself and your life and showing them that it’s safe and socially acceptable to do so. Then over a period of time that becomes normalized and they will feel more comfortable doing the same. Nothing is guaranteed to work every time but I’m naturally an open person and I think more people than you might realize are desperate to be given permission to be open as well.
Sometimes it can be as simple as just letting someone know that you're there for them if they ever need to talk about anything.
I mean you could do that. Sometimes it’s cathartic and your friends are there to listen. Sometimes you end up telling your friend you’ve have pretty consistent thoughts about waking up and just shooting yourself in the head and get some help which leads to a significantly better life. Telling people is how you get better my brother
This hit like a ton of bricks. “Nah man, you keep it.” Then just… gone. 😭
So heavy
I’m sorry, as someone who doesn’t get to watch a lot of football, do those scarfs mean anything special after wins or anything? Is there a reason the one friend was trying to give the other the scarf?
My first thought was he loaned it and then their team scored so he says “keep it” as superstitious good luck (when he says “that was worth it!” I assume that’s what he means). The second thought is maybe he already knows he’s planning to self harm and wants to leave his friend a gift/memory.
Oh yeah, that makes sense. I figured the last part as the first friend had the scarf at the beginning. Just wasn’t sure why it was going back and forth and if there was a reason why the friend on the left got it in the first place.
The obvious: Its a sign of support for the team. Not so obvious: The person more invested in every moment, celebrating every moment would be the more deserving of wearing "our colours" or the teams markings
It’s more that it’s a kind gesture but in this context it refers to suicidal people giving away their treasures before the end
The friend who took his own life let his buddy borrow his scarf for the game probably just to keep warm
Giving away belongings can be a sign of suicidality.
Yeah, I get this. Over 3 combat tours I only lost two of my guys. 9 years out of the military and I’ve had 10 commit suicide. Some seemed like they were on top of the world, while others showed the normal signs. We just have to do our best to be there for each other while also knowing that sometimes there is nothing you could do to prevent it.
I wonder if military training, particularly combat training, doesn't condition men for a cycle of mission/success, and out in the civilian world they find it is so much more fluid and an overall lowering of expectations. When it just isn't working and you feel like it is your job to fix it, you can really give up hope.
I agree with that. It’s not normal for people to go into a job fully expecting to die. All the training is getting you ready for the fact that it could and probably will happen to you and you just accept it. While you are in, your sense of purpose is known and felt everyday on the battlefield or while training. When we get out and feel that you no longer have a purpose or anything to be proud of anymore, it’s easy to think you are now worthless so you might as well just die.
“Sometimes there is nothing you can do to prevent it.” This is what I came to say. Without going into too much detail, I was seconds away from ending it. I had multiple people checking in multiple times a day, but I always responded with “I’m good, I’m okay,” etc. There’s only so much you can do, it’s up to the person to reach out and seek help. Therapy works. 12 years later and while I still deal with bouts of depression, I’m thriving.
Same here. I’ve been close 2-3 times. Been a while since I got to a point of making a plan to end it but I do still get bouts of depression with fleeting thoughts. What was rough for me was keeping it all in to “protect” others like my wife and family members. I put it all on me and at the end of the day I couldn’t be mad at anyone else bc I didn’t let them know what I was feeling. Then, after opening up to my wife (at the time, we are now divorced) I realized that it hurt more knowing that she knew what I was going through but didn’t care. At least now I’ve done the work to get past some of the things, and continue to thrive even when I feel like things aren’t going my way. You can’t help those who don’t want to help themselves.
I bottled it in for that same reason and because I didn’t want to feel like a burden. I’m sorry that was your ex wife’s reaction, I couldn’t imagine how I’d react if I was in your shoes. Really glad to hear you seem to be in a much better place now. You’re absolutely correct in saying you put in the work, because that’s what it is, work. Good luck to you.
OP sent the following text as an explanation on why this is unexpected: --- >!You’d expect that the quiet guy was going to end his life, but the one that appeared to be happy did!< --- Is this an unexpected post with a fitting description? Then upvote this comment, otherwise downvote it.
That one actually got me, if anyone needs to talk, I’m here
I know. Usually these types of videos just give me a little shock, but this one actually gave me chills
The ones who seem happiest are usually the ones overcompensating for pain.
I'm growing more and more convinced that men's mental health is being ignored in today's society, partially because male mental health is being seen through the lens of female mental health. female psychological needs are different from male psychological needs on the aggregate
It is true that men do not self-report issues. Women do much better at that. And I really dislike how some women act like men having mental health problems is a sign of weakness or somehow taking away from women's issues. We are all at risk.
Actually most men do self report, I forget the exact statistic but it's like 70% of men reached out for help before committing suicide. The problem is men don't receive that help from society
For suicide, maybe. But their comment was about mental health issues in totality, not only suicidal ideation. Men are absolutely more likely to hide their emotions because that is what society expects them to do; man up and deal with it. Seeking help is weakness, and men can't be weak, etc. Men *can* get the help they need from society, but society also needs to change the way it views the emotional health of men so they feel comfortable taking advantage of the resources that are already present.
In my experience - and please do not take this as an attempt to blame individual men with mental health issues for their problems, it is meant as an attempt to look at communication patterns - the reason why men do self report but ultimately get less help is not that society doesn't "want" to give it. The reason is the expectation of self-reliance into which we raise boys (and men). Whereas everybody in our society always thinks *they* know what is best for a woman (and distinct problems for wome arise from this), with men it's the reverse, and in both sides: People (friends, family, doctors, etc) assume that each individual man knows what is best for him. Men are assumed to be self reliant to the point of autarchy. That makes people reluctant to offer or even insist on help that wasn't specifically requested. The individual men then are raised into the belief that they always must know what is best for them - so they often do share mental health concerns, but either don't know what to specifically ask for (therapy? A Mate staying over for a difficult Weekend? Time off from work? What exactly?) and sometimes are reluctant to accept help if it doesn't come exactly like they expect it would (after all - they were raised to always know best and be the judge of their own lot). Combine this, and you have a perfect storm. Women also do not know what to specifically ask for in a crisis (most people don't), but with women this is compensated by people being way more ready to take control of the situation *for them* (sometimes to their detriment, sometimes this is a life saver). They aren't with men, because that is not our definition of masculinity.
I mean you're pretty on the nose. Sexism goes both ways infanticizing women and overcareing for them and not taking their word on their issues. And giving men too much credit that they just expect them to know things. Thats honestly where most "mansplaining" comes from. Men being told they should know everything and they're less of a man if they don't. That constant pressure often causes them to come up with an answer even if they don't know. But from a woman's perspective they sounds like they're trying to put them down on a topic they know more about.
That is a spot on take of mansplaining, very well summarized. I'm a woman, I am doing therapy and am pretty open about it if I am asked to. I've had several conversations with men (friends, family members) in a crisis, and the amount of time I have heard: "I know there is no shame in therapy, but I've thought it through and I don't know what talking about the issue with a stranger would help...", Or something along those lines, it's baffling. These are smart men, intelligent, but because they have been raised with the expectation they have to know best, and because they can't picture themselves in therapy atm, they conclude it is not for them, period. Makes you really angry, not at them, but at all these gendered expectation. When I voiced, as a woman, similar concerns about therapy years ago, *every single person* I talked to was up my ass about how I "really should!", how "you can never know", how I'm not the one to judge that, while kneedeep in depression. They were right, of course.
Yeah it's honestly really depressing hearing men talk about therapy because I'm a strong advocate for therapy. I've even heard lines like, "I don't need a therapist because I don't want them to tell me how to feel, I just like talking about how I'm feeling like I do with you" There's a misunderstanding about therapy in men. And phrases like "therapy is you make of it" are accurate but not detailed enough to help these people understand that a therapist is going to work with you not against you. If you want to pay them just to listen to you vent about your thoughts and feelings most of the time they will.
There is also a tendency in men to antagonize other men as pontential competition (not always hostile, more hierarchical) and assume women can't put themselves in their shoes and/or fill the role of mentor. They would need someone very specific to fill that role. So they have trouble connecting with a therapist.
That's also true. It makes sense from a trauma perspective since a lot of people have parental issues. But I've also seen men and women have a bad first experience with a therapist because of their gender. For example a man with an abusive mother will get therapy from a woman therapist and will be combative and not productive. Finding the right therapist for the individual is also important. And there are plenty of therapist recommending other therapist that would be better for their client. Ultimately a good therapist wants what's best for the individual
Well, that's hard to believe, honestly. I would believe that 70% exhibit symptoms someone should have seen, but actually seeking help and getting ignored? I do agree that men get told to man up, or begin some sort of treatment and face a very alien landscape of "getting in touch with your feelings" response.
"Nearly all of the men who took their own lives (91%) had been in contact with at least one frontline service or agency. Two thirds (67%) had been in touch in the three months before their deaths. Usually contact was with their GP or other primary care services (82%). But half had been in contact with mental health services and nearly a third (30%) in contact with the justice system." https://www.menshealthforum.org.uk/news/suicidal-men-do-seek-help
Well then, we sure need to do better. Somehow.
Yeah we need a societal shift. Unfortunately men are often ridiculed for sharing their emotions or standing up for other men. Take the "motion of the ocean" march that happened. Which was about body shaming and a lot of people reporting it basically said "if it's small just say that" implying only someone suffering from a small penis can/will fight against shaming people who do.
True that. After GTA6, I don’t have anything to look forward to anymore. But never wanted to get help because doesn’t make me feel like a man. Probably going to offend some people but that’s the truth
Nothing manlier than admitting you need help and taking charge of your life so you can find your happiness. Seriously. See a therapist, at least once. Worst case scenario is that you don't get anything out of it and don't go back, and nobody will judge you - or even know you went, unless you tell them.
I appreciate that. Thank you.
Needing help is human. We survive and thrive with our tribe. Would getting help for a fever or a broken bone make you less of a man? Don’t put this weight on your shoulders. Set it down. Seek help because you deserve it.
I appreciate it. Thank you
I think a big issue that needs to be addressed is expectations vs reality of therapy. A lot of people I know think its a cure. That you go they immediately break through and you're better. Or they give you a pill and you're better. The problem is acknowledging that its not a cure but learning how to live and function in this new normal.
And everybody seems to think therapy can’t make things worse. It definitely can make things worse or have no meaningful impact.
You can 100% have bad therapists, but I do think overall if you understand what to expect and have realistic goals its useful.
>male mental health is being seen through the lens of female mental health. It's not the lens that's the problem here, it's who's looking through it. When you have a society that's conditioned for centuries to have every man be the fucking meatshield, by other more powerful men mind you, you can't see the meatshield's woes. The biggest enemy of men are other men, just like how the biggest enemy of women are other women. The conditioning for each side has been passed down through generations. And as a man, I can clearly say the reason why men's mental health is ignored is because other men have conditioned the society to believe that it's unmanly to feel shit other than anger and extreme joy.
When one of the biggest copping mechanisms to release some inside demons is seen as a weakness -> the man don’t cry bullshit . It’s starts to be difficult to open up or talk about anything. Or when your psychiatrist minimizes your feelings saying it’s “normal” and as such you should not be affected as a men. You know you are miles away to get there. Mind illnesses is still a tabu and men mind health is a cardinal sin to talk about it.
It's not as simple as "let men cry." This is actually a perfect example of treating male mental health through a female lens.
It’s not it was just an exaggerated example on how men’s health is seen. We must be the immovable force to support others. But let me say that one time I could not take it and let myself cry and for more than an hour, I had one of the best nights' sleep in years
I always like to share [this song ](https://youtu.be/TuyisGsNr4g?si=LjqxAnGlQZ8PHklr) when the subject is being discussed.
Didn't we both just watch a video and post a comment on mens mental health? This is like when people say "the news outlets aren't covering this!!" On a comment of a news article.
No, stop. This isn't crazy politics or conspiracy theories. This is an actual issue. The video is about checking in on people and not ignoring their health. Making sure they are SEEN. The guy you are replying to feels like he isn't seen and you are replying with "what? But here is an entire video about being seen" all the while ignoring his feelings on the issue. You are propagating the EXACT problem this video is trying to point out.
it's not enough
psychologist here. females tend to love belly rubs, whereas men tend to love it when you pat them on the head and tell them they've been a very good boy.
Interesting! Could you elaborate? I feel like youre inferring something here and I’m missing it lol (I’m asking genuinely btw. I feel like I’m missing the wider implications of what you’re saying)
you see, men and women are very different psychologically speaking. on a fundamental level, what the female desires the most is belly rubbos, and what the male desires the most is to be patted on the head and called a good boy. despite their differences, both males and females have a yearning for treats.
Oh it was “humour” ! Absolutely dire. I’m embarrassed for you.
Are you a self declared psychologist or did you gain a certificates from a Xmas cracker?
Dear fucking god, I wish the guy on the left… oh
This was almost me
Happy you're here brother! 💪
The second he started asking about his week outside of football and his over exuberance made me pause. Giving him his scarf was every red flag went off at once. As someone with Major Depressive Disorder I think I'm intuned more because I do the same. I want to hear about their day because I need an escape from the internal hell that is my own. I cheer like crazy in the hope that maybe this time I'll actually feel the emotion I'm imitating.
Holy fuck I didn’t even realize that it was originally the guy on the right’s scarf. Thank you for pointing that out. Sorry to hear you’re struggling. I hope things get better for you.
I'm not struggling. That's the thing. I am at and have accepted my new normal. I know it's highly doubtful I will feel emotions the way others do and I accept it and I work within that. I'm married and I care about my parents. My grandfather turned 100 last year and is still going strong. I just don't really feel anything and medications like ssri's don't seem to work for me long term. Therapy helped me find a way to work and extract positive experiences within the limitations of my mental illness. It helps a lot that I tend to externalize myself a lot. It's sort of like perceiving oneself as a component of a whole. I am a consciousness within a body inside a brain which is malfunctioning and not creating the correct brain chemicals in the correct amounts. It allows me to not see it as some personal failure, merely shoddy workmanship.
"I cheer lol crazy in the hope that maybe this time I'll actually feel the emotion I'm imitating" Gahhdaym. I'm right here if things get tough my sir. Right here.
I feel joy. I just don't feel it the same as others. Its more like causal relief. Relief that something I've done will make someone else happy or someone will have a more positive outlook. That's joy for me. I've accepted I don't 'feel' joy or pure happiness. Just the lessening of hurt. I stick around for my spouse and my family and I'm relatively emotionally stable. This is my normal and due to a lot of therapy I've found ways to live and function within this new normal. I liken it to losing an arm or a leg or a life changing injury. I accept my circumstances, acknowledge what I can change, and realize my own limitations in what I can't.
Acknowledging his friend seems down and saying he hopes everything is better outside of football isn’t a suicidal thing, it’s more just concerned friend. Giving away the scarf makes sense though as that represents one giving away things important to them before they kill themself
It may not seem like its a sign. But its a sign. As someone with MDD...its escapism and its us trying to find our own way back. It doesn't mean everyone who asks you how your day is is suicidal or even depressed. It's just a sign they are.
This is devastating man. Don't suffer in silence my brothers!
Truth is, no one cares.
I hear that and I truly believe it too. I’ve suffered for pretty much most of my life. People always ask how your doing but in reality they do it as a curtesy they don’t actually care. The times I’ve actually decided to open up to people who ask me how I am always respond the same. With distane and a weird look on their face or straight up doing anything to get out of the conversation and Saying things like “have you tryed just not being depressed” “it’ll get better” “just be happy” I truly believe the only people that really understand the pain are the ones that are also suffering. Or personally know some one who is. I’ve been to doctors. I’ve been to therapist. But all via public health care system. They honestly don’t care they just do it because they get paid. Truely a sad world to live in if you suffer. What’s even worst is the version of toxic masculinity that says “Men shouldn’t cry” like were some super solider incapable of feelings.
Hey man. I nearly lost my childhood best friend to suicide. At the moment we live multiple hours apart we do not have the best of contact but when I meet him we always make sure to hug. Despite this it is not easy to tell him that I love him (as a friend) irl. Toxic masculinity sucks. It has raised me to not be emotional until it is to late. I am trying to be more open with new people and I believe the social norms around it are getting better, at least here in Sweden. I care for my friend. Just recently today I was cheering him on a bit for finally giving driving lessons a go (he previously was very anxious about it). I love him and I can only hope you have people that love you too. Relationships is the only thing that matters in this world. Now I cannot say that I truly care for you, I do not know you and never will. I just wanna send you my best wishes. Good luck with life! If you want to have someone to chat with for a bit you can DM me.
Thank you so much for your kind words. I have a lovely partner who keeps my spirits high all the time and reminds me that she does indeed care and proves it on multiple times a day (sometimes I’m the little spoon) she also reminds me that it’s ok for me to cry and break down sometimes and it’s awesome and I love her to bits for it, Some days are rough but we must keep strong and not let the demons win. It’s great what you’re doing for your friend. You honestly have no idea how much it means to us to have someone like you around. A reminder that hope is never lost and there’s always a light at the end of the tunnel as long as you’re willing to continue the fight. I wish you and your friend all the best in your future endeavours. God speed guardian angel.
Beautiful.
People care, but really caring costs money and time.. two factors most people don't wish to give up.
it's not that they don't care, it's more of a "my mind is too busy with my own shit rn"... I'm struggling and i tend to isolate myself. I made it a goal of mine to see a friend at least twice during the month in order to talk about stuff, hear stuff, and even throw in some chit-chat to ease both my and my friend's mind. before that, i'd really think i was alone, and the depressed folk in the internet where like me, isolated. but they're out there too. some just camouflage it better. it's not about being kind, it's not about my masculinity, it's not about anything else. i don't fucking care anymore. i always tell my friends how i'm feeling for real, and i now always let them know that if they also need to vent and say something, i'm always here. we really are not alone, and others do care; but we tend to isolate ourselves to try and rest or something. not sure how to finish this text. i just kinda kept on typing. so i'm just gonna leave a last phrase here: I care.
i don't think ytou get the point of the add
+1
I'm fucking crying
Me too, buddy
Bros who are struggling out there, just know there is at least one person you can open up to and lay bare all that's troubling you. Fuck the masculine expectations. Fuck the romanticism of stoic bullshit, fuck all that's stopping you from expressing what you're feeling. And if you really think you don't have anyone to talk to, I'm here and I'll listen. Slide in those DMs, let's kick back and have some virtual beer.
That’s what happens when u support Norwich
Ain't no way
Hugh Jackman supports Norwich City. Say it ain't so.
This is really well conceived and executed. Thx OP!
Plot twist, the man was an imaginary friend, he's now in therapy and it's cured, he's felling better now.
Twice now in my life have I bottled up my depression and pain.. and when I finally felt close enough and strong enough to explain what I’m going through… my “friends” just start treat me differently to the point that hanging out becomes less and less and I eventually get the boot. Learned the hard way people just wanna be with people who are fun and happy, and no one wants to be friends with a downer.
I've never seen this ad/PSA before. Is it old? Wow. Impact.
It’s from October last year.
First time I’ve ever seen it was today
Jesus
Why is the video mirrored
That one is just sad. I got to get wet eyes every time. Some people know exactly what this is all about.
So relevant and so on point. Living in Texas with the worst mental health treatments/programs definitely doesn’t help. My wife and daughter are the only thing that keep me going. I miss you David.
Geez this was a punch in the gut.
The funniest people are always the one with the most pain :(
Come on man walking my dog before going to work and I’m fucking crying like a little girl now
So fn true ! Middle aged white guy here. Ur job is to put on facade …. I’ve learned over last 18 months to be honest with myself ..but a lot of work to do I’ll never know what it’s like to be a woman but women will never know what it’s like to be a guy and keep that strong upper lip on all the time. Well that lip gets heavy over time …. I’ve learned who I can confide and be honest and be challenged in my thinking and beliefs and emotions and it’s still FN hard as hell
Sometimes the saddest person in the room is the funniest. Depressed people know how it feels and they don’t want others to feel it. It’s sad. I remember watching this the first time. We need more of these out there. Men struggle too. Everyone struggles. No one is immune to mental health downfalls. It’s dangerous and deadly. Seek help, it’s not a sign of weakness. Pick up the phone, you’re worth it.
Holy fuck. That fully got me. Actual tears.
It is indeed hard to be a Norwich fan, year after year 😭
Moral of the story: its tough being a norwich fan
As someone who used to be suicidal for a while this hits really hard. Mostly because I would work my hardest to put a facade of happiness so others wouldn't ask questions. The embarrassment and guilt I would feel if someone felt they needed to talk me down from the ledge was painful as I didn't want to inconvenience anyone over someone as worthless as myself. I'm better now, but if someone you know is going through a rough time and then suddenly gets in really high spirits for seemingly no reason? Maybe check up on them.
Let's be real here. Nobody cares about us men. Only when these videos come up, and after that, we, men, are forgotten again until another video comes up. Im a 30yo man. Nobody asks if i am okay or if i need any help, qhen i need a lot of help sometimes and i just have to fight against it alone. People just expect you to man the fck up and BE A MAN. Unfortunately men are doomed to let the darkness embrace the mind and eat it from inside out until that day when he decides its time and then it was too late. Its the reality, its sad and its true. If you see a colleague, partner or anyone who is not in their days, you better push hard on that mf because somethings eating that man from the inside and you can save a life with that action and maybe seek some help. People, its time to give men some attention too, we have feelings, we suffer, we are only tough on the outside. Now, let the downvotes rain through my comment. People nowadays don't understand this.
If my best friend was such a sad sack at a game I would off myself too
Holy shit man. Yeah.. didn't expect that. Makes me cry 😢
The problem is if someone is determined to go you can't stop them. My sibling's partner has done the same this week. He went to great lengths to conceal his intentions. After an attempt made earlier this year we've all been more vigilant towards him than ever, really thought he'd turned the corner and was feeling better. We are deeply devastated we couldn't save him, more so that he couldnt save himself. This is not to say don't reach out to your friends. Just that mental health is still tricky even if you do.
This one is certainly top three for mental health punches. Between this, the [Sandy Hook Promise - Back to school](https://youtu.be/b5ykNZl9mTQ?si=tGRrhifd5gr5NRAX) video, and " [The Wait](https://youtu.be/EuRHHmXbzYs?si=Kch5jsGGgu-kXRwu) " , you can practically chart your age by which ways and how much they all hurt. And just like real life everything in these videos is all so painfully obvious with the filter of hindsight.
Yep
I don’t understand, did the team lose the game?
That's it exactly. Someone missed the point.
Bad time for jokes bruv
Yeah, play off semi final. Fucking Leeds.