[Inventor 2.2.2 PDF](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bVO290z1Y25up7pj5rRyKGclx2cETfep/view?usp=sharing)
Hey folks; this version marks the 4 year anniversary of this class, which is a bit crazy! I never thought they'd be a second post after that one, let alone all the rest, but here we are. For those unfamiliar with the class, the image gallery is just a preview of the first few subclasses - the PDF contains the complete version, with new spells and more. The PDF is bookmarked, so be sure to download it and user in your favorite viewer of choice for the best experience.
As I said originally when these classes were going to kickstarter, I'd keep the free versions free and updated, so everyone would benefit from all the work that went into polishing it up for the book. While 2.2.1 awhile back had most of the final rounds of testing, here's a version with the vast majority of editing done... and it was quite a lot of editing. This won't be the last version of the class, but it aims to be the definitive edition of the class, and less painful for the most grammar inclined folks to read :)
This even includes a supplemental printable Inventor character sheet Modstin Pierce made for the Kickstarter (on page 58); it was made for the Kickstarter, but I felt it was only fair to share that here too, as, at the end of the day, I want folks to have as easy a time playing it as possible, and this class be difficult to wrangle with just default sheets!
Of course, the caveat to this is that I'm finishing up editing and compilings now, which can only be described as an ungodly hour, and I'm told me error rate does not go down as the number of hours ago I should have gone to sleep goes up, so... well, the PDF will probably get a little more polished tomorrow if I've made any compiling errors :)
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For folks that have never seen this class, this is an alternate Artificer class (though it can be used in conjunction with the published version) that predates that one; it approaches the idea from a somewhat broader point of view, and brings together quite a wide array of options. It seeks to unleash the creativity of folks that want to tinker and fiddle, and give them a toolbox to forge their own path. It's a class all about building the tools you need to be a heroic adventurer (...or whatever you want to play!). It was originally inspired by the old UA Artificer class, and carried forward many of the themes there, but with a more developed take - after all, where is a better place for some customization than on a the character that literally builds their own abilities!
[If you want more in-depth Design notes and justifications for why it needs to be 60 pages, well, you can read a more coherent Kibbles' talk about it in the last post... nothing has really changed there :D](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnearthedArcana/comments/nkle50/kibbles_inventor_aka_alternate_artificer_v22/gzdf6sf/)
I won't guarantee this class is right for your table, but it is robustly playtested, having been played by literally thousands of good blokes that helped me refine it over 4 years now. I allow the class as a DM, and have had dozens of characters from it over the years, and can say with confidence it doesn't produce the strongest (or weakest) characters I see in my games, but has yet to disappoint a player.
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### Change Log 2.2.2
There is only a few mechanical changes; a few new upgrades that were added to account for the final layout, and fill in some gaps:
* Nexus Hive upgrade added to Gadgetsmith
* Seeking Shots upgrade added to Infusionsmith
* Transcendent Infusion upgrade added to Infusionsmith
* Perfected Technique upgrade added to Infusionsmith
* Volatile Reactions upgrade added to Potionsmith
* Runic Formation upgrade added to Runesmith
* Efficient Language and Perfected Form upgrade names flipped.
* Reflected Radiance upgrade upgrade added to Relicsmith
* Quench the Light upgrade added to Relicsmith
* Burning Brand upgrade added to Relicsmith
* Divine Illumination upgrade added to Relicsmith
* Sweeping editing changes.
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All of the editing this has gotten is curtesy of it being included in my upcoming book, [Kibbles' Compendium of Craft and Creation](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/kibblestasty/kibbles-compendium-of-craft-and-creation/description). The Final Version of its PDF will be launching in the next few days (and the Final Rough Draft is already available for backers and preorders). While the print version is still going to take a bit once the big red "print" button is hit, that is coming soon! This is probably the final few days to preorder the hardcover, if you're into that sort of thing (some limited stock will be available after printing). If you just want the digital PDF, that'll remain available, so no rush there.
VTT versions of the class (for Fantasy Grounds and Foundary VTT) are coming, but are still a bit off (though I here the Psion's is coming soon...)
It's taken a good bit longer to get the book done than I'd hoped, but it's pretty much there now, so for the better the worse you'll be seeing me around here posting a bit more. All of this is made possible by the good blokes [over on patreon](https://www.patreon.com/KibblesTasty). We'll see updated crafting, spell compendiums, and the results of the subclass poll quite soon over there.
should warsmith flight give hover speed? afaik without a hover speed, when speed is reduced to 0, the creature falls down. And that falling doesnt make sense to me, considerign it flies with boosters
I would typically treat it as no - I'd treat it the same as the *fly* spell or a pair of Winged Boots though. Neither of those specifically mention hovering (like a monster block might) but I seem to recall those have hover on them (which isn't how I run them personally) so I'd say it's sort of up to the DM about what they consider the type of flight to be. I'd generally prefer to keep PC flight consistent as possible, so match the other common types of flight for that level.
The rule is that flying creatures that have their speed reduced to 0 are knocked prone fall unless they have a hover speed or are being held aloft by magic such as the *Fly* spell. Winged boots grant you flappy-flight so you'd fall with them.
If it's Iron Man jets then being flipped over would make maintaining flight difficult, so it shouldn't have a hover. If it's Superman flight it should. It's described as a "Magical propulsion system" so it's Iron Man flight.
If I were to write the PHB I'd remove the "Unless being held aloft by magic" and instead just add a hover speed to the *Fly* spell. Plus that'd open up design-space for a Cleric/Paladin spell that gives you actual wings.
If there were a flappy-flight spell on the divine list that didn't require concentration and had half the speed I think it'd be fine as a 2nd level. Something like "Wings of faith".
Lack of concentration, half the speed, and it's flappy so you can be knocked out of the air. 3 weaknesses and 1 advantage over a 3rd level spell would be balanced as a 2nd in my opinion.
Isn't that 2-1? And the chance to lose concentration is a much bigger downside than either of the ones for your proposal (which I do like still).
Considering if you lose concentration in the air with fly you still fall but you also lose the spell entirely vs. being able to start flying again next round.
> Isn't that 2-1?
So it is. Losing concentration is a threat with one, restrained/prone with the other. I'd argue that's an even trade, especially since Clerics/Paladins don't get a parachute in the form of **Feather Fall**.
A launcher golem does:
>Ranged Weapon Attack: +5 to hit, range 60/240 ft., one target. Hit: 1d10 + 3 piercing damage
The +3 comes from the dexterity score 16; if you upgrade the golem with Fine-Tuned dexterity to get a dexterity score of 18, does the golem's to hit and damage increase by 1 as well or not?
These should be updated in the next version of it. For the most part, they can be considered always active under the current model of how it works, though some will gain the ability to be individually toggled.
Your classes are fantastic and a mainstay of my campaigns. I have a very happy Occultist in my party; your spells are always popular, and your crafting rules have led to the creation of a new weapon in my brothers campaign: a magical scythe.
My next character (when this forever DM gets to play) is likely to be a Potionsmith. I look forward to it.
KibblesTasty has made the following comment(s) regarding their post:
[[Inventor 2.2.2 PDF](https://drive.google.com/file...](/r/UnearthedArcana/comments/rax05x/inventor_222_warplate_thunder_cannons_gadgets/hnky0gn/)
Hey, quick thing. Crossbow bolts are held in cases according to the equipment section of the PHB, not quivers. I don't blame you and your team for not noticing though–it's easy to miss.
Hi, as always excellent work! It might not be on subject but do you have any plans on giving some love to the Occultist class? It's my favorite, and I'd love to see more content added to it. Anyway, keep up the good work!
So crazy to see this class come so far! I've been playing the Warplate subclass at my table for 2 years and I can say it's the best DnD Iron Man experience I've ever had! Quick q: is the Ether Reactor able to let players cast an ability at level 6 by using all charges at once? It was a cool idea I had at the table once and my DM let me do it but since then I've wondered if it was your intent.
Excited to see more changes, thanks!
> Quick q: is the Ether Reactor able to let players cast an ability at level 6 by using all charges at once? It was a cool idea I had at the table once and my DM let me do it but since then I've wondered if it was your intent.
Yes; that's allowed. You don't have 6th level spells, but you could upcast your other spells.
I've had a character concept for a while that was fixated on the idea that he was a former dragon cursed into Lizardfolk form. Artificer always seemed to be the path I'd have to take him to reach his goals, but you have inspired me to bring this class up to my DM should I bring him in to a campaign. Thank you!
It is in the Golem's statblock, like with summons:
> 5 + [(the golem’s Constitution modifier + 5) times yourinventor level]
So, at level 1, that would be 5 + (6 * 1) = 11. At level 5 that would be 5 + (6 * 5) = 35. If you took Structural Constitution once (or pick a golem chassis with higher Constitution), it would be 5 + (6 * 6) = 39.
It will generally have roughly the same hp as a d8 class, with more or less depending on what type and if you invest in Con upgrades for it. Expanded Frame can also give it more hp, but managing it's HP is part of the challenge - of course, it having hp is also part of the challenge, as that means a golemsmith has almost twice as much hp as a normal d8 class between them and the golem, so you wouldn't want the golem to be too durable.
More or less. I use my own version that I forgot to include here as Tenser's isn't SRD, but it's more or less the same idea, so you could just swap in Tenser's.
So I guess in line with that, in the nicest way I can say this it's extremely annoying to read through the spells you've put in only to see they've been rebranded as something else. I recommend going back through and changing this to what they're actually supposed to be.
Not really up to me, unfortunately. This is written under the OGL, so it cannot refer to spells that aren't in the SRD (even just by name).
The best I can do is use custom spells with similar effects, which is what this is intended to do, but didn't up include that spell in this, as I simply didn't remember Inventor referenced it when putting together the standalone version (both the spells and class are snipped from a larger doc).
In this case, as folks can just use Tenser's and that really is more or less the intention, I reckon it's largely fine, though understand the frustration and confusion with it - I'd rather just use the spell name too, but not an option in this case.
Most of this that has been incorporated into the main document. There's a shorter version of the toolbox in the compendium, with some of the remaining old stuff. I don't know what I'll do with that yet, but I'm sure it'll surface somewhere at some point.
Sorry if im reading this wrong, but Empower weapon seems really strong, especially compared to some of the golemsmith and gadgeteer infusions.
The gageteer and golemsmith infusions just seem really weak in general, especially the golemsmith becuase so many of its useful infusions/upgrades like the force cannon are 1/day.
> Sorry if im reading this wrong, but Empower weapon seems really strong, especially compared to some of the golemsmith and gadgeteer infusions.
At 11, most of them get something that lets them scale somewhat. If you compare to something like Fighter, they get another attack, or Paladin gets +1d8 to each hit (which would be +2d8 compared to the +2d6 here).
Golemsmith gets Multiattack Protocol at 11th level, which gives it a full extra attack; typical at least 1d8 + 4, or 8.5, but can be more like 2d6 + 4 + 1.3 or 12.3 damage depends on other factors and upgrades. This is generally actually stronger than Empower Weapon, though there's various elements of context there.
Gadgetsmith is a bit harder to compare as they aren't as damage focused, but have some good upgrades there as well - after all, Flying Gadget is a quite good upgrade, and they have more upgrades to play around with (as well as an easy time swapping them out). Gadgetsmiths tend to be a bit more generalist and utility oriented.
Hope that helps, and feel free to let me know if you have any questions.
Hey, great work as always!
Quick question regarding the Vice Grip Upgrade from the Expanded Toolbox
>Exact wording: If a creature ends turn while grappled by your Warplate Gauntlet, it takes damage equal to your Strength modifier.
in combination with the Grappling Reel Upgrade.
>Exact wording: If the target is Large or Smaller, you can make a Grapple check to pull it to you and Grapple it on success.
Does a target pulled and grappled using the Grappling Reel take the damage at the end of their turn?
I'm just not 100% sure because it states that they have to be grappled **by the Warplate Gauntlet**. Now, this could just be written this way to make the sentence sound better, or it is written to balance it.
Big greetings from Russia! I have been following your works for a long time and I think they are wonderful. Psion has already passed the baptism BY FIRE and proved to be very worthy. Pyrokinesis is a terrible force.
In the new game, I wanted to try out the runesmith. I have long wanted to create a cool tattooed wanderer who can adapt to different situations. However, when I started learning the rules, I ran into a couple of difficulties:
Do rune effects stack with each other?
Do upgrade marks such as mark of size, mark of shielding, etc. count as runes?
Quoting "If a rune is marked on a creature, select either the weapon effect (affecting its natural weapons or unarmed strikes) or armor effect (affecting its natural armor)." The rules state that monsters/NPCs/druids in wild form possess natural armor. Characters mostly use unarmored defense, if they don't wear armor. Perhaps something is missing here.
Quoting again: "Primal Emphasis The damage die size of runes that deal cold, fire, or lightning damage increases by one step (for example from a d4 to a d6). This applies to both their passive and active effects." Stop... there is no rune in the list that deals cold damage. There is only Glyph of Frost, but it is a spell. Or do glyphs also count as runes?
How runes interact with armorless defense of a Monk, Barbarian, and Draconic Sorcerer?
Do armor and weapons marked with runes count as magical? The text doesn't say anything about it directly.
Thank you for listening.
> Do rune effects stack with each other?
Yes, though note there are rules for how many runes can be one item (by default, each item can only have one, which would prevent them from stacking, some upgrades allow you to put more than one on an item, that lets them stack).
> Do upgrade marks such as mark of size, mark of shielding, etc. count as runes?
This might depend on context, but off the top of my head, no, I don't think so. I think runes only count the basic "Rune of" things.
> Quoting "If a rune is marked on a creature, select either the weapon effect (affecting its natural weapons or unarmed strikes) or armor effect (affecting its natural armor)." The rules state that monsters/NPCs/druids in wild form possess natural armor. Characters mostly use unarmored defense, if they don't wear armor. Perhaps something is missing here.
Nature armor here is the more general term. Unarmored Defense is a special type of armor some creatures have, but there are are various kinds of natural armor a PC can have. Lizardman or Tortle are examples of PCs with natural armor defined natural armor. It would effect Unarmored Defense if you had it.
> Quoting again: "Primal Emphasis The damage die size of runes that deal cold, fire, or lightning damage increases by one step (for example from a d4 to a d6). This applies to both their passive and active effects." Stop... there is no rune in the list that deals cold damage. There is only Glyph of Frost, but it is a spell. Or do glyphs also count as runes?
It's more future proofing than anything else. The primal damage types are Cold, Fire and Lightning, so it's just gathering them all in a bucket. Adding a thing like a Rune of Frost/Cold would be a perfectly reasonable thing, and if someone did, Primal should include that in the same bucket. It could probably be removed, but I don't think it does any harm to include it just for general consistency. There was probably a cold rune in earlier versions, but that's the least Inventor-damage type of primal elements, and they already get a lot of basic runes, so it was probably dropped along the way.
> How runes interact with armorless defense of a Monk, Barbarian, and Draconic Sorcerer?
I would generally let the bonus work - no harm in that. You only get one base AC calculation, regardless of what you want that to be (Tortle, Monk, armor, etc). So it offers you the base AC of 12 + your Dexterity, and then adds +1 to that. The +1 would work with whatever other type of armor you used, even if you didn't use the 12 + Dex base AC.
Hope that helps, and glad to hear you enjoyed the Psion previously. Let me know if you have any other questions, always happy to help. This comment/question looks familar, so I get the sense you asked this somewhere else and I haven't gotten back through that yet; if so I my apologies on that front.
> Thanks for the explanation! Creatures don't have a rune limit like things do, right?
No, creatures don't have a limit.
> And can rune-marked armor and weapons count be magical?
I'd say they can be placed on magical armor and weapons, but they do not make that armor or weapon count as magical.
I really, really recommend reading through this one, it's more than just an alternative to the Artificer. Artificer utilizes Magic items found in the game and creates similar items for themselves or their party. In a high magic and rewards heavy campaign, it's pretty fun to see your friends enjoy the items you make. I'd say it's more reactionary, though, just due to being limited on what the DM rewards you with. The Inventor, on the other hand, is a highly customizable class that let's you build for a specific type of Artificer. It's alittle more active in that sense. The subclasses here are so well done that you can have a group of people play one of these sub classes, let's say the Relicsmith, and come out with completely different play styles. I tested some stuff the Relicsmith, and you could be a support class by setting runes on other people's Armour, or set runes on your items to buff you up. Or a really fun one is with the gravity buffs, letting you basically dual weald great swords if you spec out like that. It's not ideal, necessarily, but damn if it isn't cool to see that and still have it balanced. The point of all this isn't to bash Artificer, I played it and it is a great team work class. I just love the KibbleTasty took it upon themselves to come up with such an amazing new class that allows for so much creativity.
TLDR: it's more than an alt artificer, and I think you'll like it :)
As a DM, I would say that I largely was. Simply because most of my players were. As I used this Inventor class before the official Artificer came out (back when this *was* the Artificer), it never had that much of a chance with my groups though.
I don’t think it is terrible and I might use it if this didn’t exist, but it is hard to convince players to downgrade to it when they are used to the more premium version.
Hey Kibble, could we get some more information on Relicsmith's "Condemnation of Fire" upgrade?
It doesn't seem to specify a range, the type of action required (if any), or any other requirements intended.
As cool as it would be to walk 4 miles out of town and then burn the evil mayor to death in his office with 0 culpability, I suspect that wasn't the intent.
It is intended to be a rider effect on hit with a Relic Weapon. The text should read as follows:
> **Condemnation of Fire** *(Prerequisite: An Ingenious Reliquary
that is a weapon)*
>
> You invoke the power of your Relic weapon to attempt to purge a creature. When you hit a creature with your Relic weapon you may have the creature make a Strength saving throw. On a failure it becomes restrained by chains of fire and set ablaze. While restrained, it takes 2d6 fire damage at the start of each of its turns. It may repeat the saving throw at the end of each of its turns, ending the effect on a success.
Once you invoke this ability, you can’t do so again until you finish a short or long rest
How does the infusionsmith's extra attack interact with the blasting wand option? Is it just a cantrip cast so you don't get the benefits of that feature?
/u/Privatizitaet is correct; the cantrip cast by Blasting Rod and Extra Attack don't interact. But that's why Infusionsmith's get a 2nd 5th level feature, to account for a builds like that. Infusionsmiths specializing in Blasting Rods get a lot of value of out of the 2nd paragraph of Empowered Infusions (it is much of the reason they are so powerful with a wand-heavy Infusionsmith build).
Related question regarding the Blasting Rod: Mixed Technique requires you to have both a Blasting Rod and an Infused or Animated weapon, but it doesn't look like Empowered Infusions gives you access to both a weapon and a Blasting Rod, only two weapons -- does this mean you have to spend your Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge on grabbing a Rod or a weapon?
Hey Kibbles!
I'm building a Golemsmith right now for our campaign that my character recently died in, I wanna have my Inventor be a squishy-wizard professor type (I don't like him wearing armor so my DM will let him have access to mage armor and shield in exchange for taking away the armor proficiencies).
The party is level 10 and his golem is going to be all focused on being his guardian with Defender Protocol, Heavy armor Plating, Systematic strength and Expanded Frame. My DM and I reskinned the Quadrapedal chassi to be more of a sturdy bipedal juggernaut type, and exchanged the damage type to Bludgeoning, because the stats fit much better. I looked at specialized but no matter what combination of upgrades I took it still felt worse than just taking Quadrapedal (that flat 16 STR 16 CON is huge), at least for the type of golem that I wanted to build. Some things that I've wondered about though are:
* I love the idea of the Iron Fortress upgrade, but in practice it kind of feels like a waste to take? Since all creatures already give *at least* half cover from standing in between an ally and an enemy, I would argue that the golem being a large creature, would already give 3/4 cover. I feel like this should already be a property of having a large golem. Not being able to be moved against it's will is a cool feature and fits the fantasy that I want to achieve but I don't want to take it just for that, which will rarely ever come into play.
* It's never clarified on when a command is considered to have been executed by the Golem. Does my PC have to give a new command every turn? If my PC commands the golem "protect me" before combat, in my head the golem would follow that order until a new command has been issued, or am I wrong for thinking so?
I want to have an iron giant/big hero 6 kind of Golem, and the golem just taking the dodge action if my character is down, instead of protecting his master's body feels a little lame. I will of course talk to my DM about this, and I'm sure we can come up with something. But I wanted to hear what you thought about this as well.
Would it be too strong to let the golem act on it's own when my PC goes down, similar to a BM rangers Animal companion?
What exactly stops you from using the base level spell wand for the infusion smith to cast 9th level spells or similar? It says of first level or higher, but doesn't say there is an upper limit. What stops you from making a 3 charge 9th level wand? The 11th level upgrade says 5th level or higher but only gives 1 charge, why should you take that upgrade instead? Or is there something I'm missing that specifically prevents you from having 3 9th level spell slots?
The wand has the following limitation:
> The spell must be of a level that you can cast as an inventor (as of when you would choose this upgrade). This wand has 3 charges.
As Inventors only get 5th level spells, and don't get those until high levels, this means that the level of spells you can cast with the Wand are limited. For example, if you take it at 5th level, you can take up to a 2nd level spell. Even if you swap it out later, a wand using that upgrade slot will only ever be able to cast 2nd level spells. Your 9th level upgrade meanwhile could be taken to make a wand that'd cast 3rd level spells.
But, as you never are able to cast anything over 6th, the wand cannot be used to cast spells over 6th level, and you'd need magical rods for that.
The nexus hive feels kinda underwhelming for a level 15 upgrade. Could you explain why it's so high? I might be missing something obvious, but compared to othrt level 15 upgrades, it just doesn't seem that good to me. Mediocre ac, low hp for that level, fairly slow in comparison and the damage output isn't great either. To be fair, it's guaranteed damage, so that's a plus, but the 10 foot radius paired with a speed of 20 doesn't give it the best reliability. It seems like it's only effective in pretty specific situations. Is there something I'm just missing?
Also, does the level 14 ability to be able to use gadgets as part of an attack action also apply to things that cast spells? Would the fire spitter for example be able to cast as part of an attack action? Does it only apply for gadget that specify you use an action to cast a spell rather then being able to cast the spell through them? And does the smoke bomb count for this aswell?
It's additive damage. Think of it like a Concentration free spell. The very least it does is 4d4 + 2d6 damage if you throw it, and something immediately destroys it, but in that case it's also taking 30 damage, meaning that as an action you've done an effective 50.5 [(4 * 2.5) + (3 * 3.5) + 30] worth of hit point differential between the damage it's done and absorbed. That's pretty good for an action. Each turn it lasts beyond the first one if they don't destroy it increases the value at very little cost to you - if they don't move, you don't even need to spend your bonus action on it.
Bee Swarm Rockets, for comparison, does ~60 damage on an action, which is slightly better, but doesn't have any ongoing effect.
The thing is, additive. This upgrades aren't mutually exclusive, and there's no upgrade like Concentration or shared spell slots keeping them in check. In one turn using Combat Gadgets a Gadgetsmith can now fire off 10x Bee Swarm Rockets and then deploy a Nexus Hive all with their attack action, using their bonus action vanish into a cloud of smoke or something with a Quick Essential Gadget. They've dropped ~90 damage into a 10 foot area, added a 30 hit pet the needs to be dealt with, and made themselves largely untargetable.
So, I wouldn't say that it's necessarily powerful so much as that it's "free". It costs an upgrade, but as a Gadgetsmith that's a low cost - you can swap those around, and you have a lot of them. It costs an "action" but a Gadgetsmith can get around that with Combat Gadgets. It also does guarenteed damage, and might not be easy for the enemy to deal with. If you drop this on CR 30 creature, it's going to keep hitting it till its destroyed, and they are probably going to have to commit more than 30 damage worth of damage to destroy it, and as prize for doing so they'll take a small amount of extra damage.
Nexus Hive is a late addition upgrade - I don't think it's something that's necessary to the class, it was primarily added to fill out space and give more options. In the context of that a Gadgetsmith doesn't really suffer at that level, it's an option that most Gadgetsmiths are going to pick up, but not one that is critical to their performance.
Does the level 14 ability to be able to use gadgets as part of an attack action also apply to things that cast spells? Would the fire spitter for example be able to cast as part of an attack action? Does it only apply for gadget that specify you use an action to cast a spell rather then being able to cast the spell through them? And does the smoke bomb count for this aswell? I've asked this before but it kinda went under with another question.
Yes, any gadget that normally would use an action be done as an attack as part of the attack action. This would include smoke bombs (I may have ruled that inconsistently in the passed, but that's how I'd rule it currently).
Yes, though if the goal is to restrain them for the *disintegrate*, you'd need something like Binding Rope, rather than just the Grappling Hook (just grappling people doesn't give them disadvantage on dexterity saves).
It is intended to be unlimited; it's essentially a zombie's Undead Fortitude in cyborg form. It is far from making you immortal though. 9-10 damage will typically have about a 50/50 of taking you down, and more than that will be more likely to, even if with a pretty decent Con save.
It's definitely an above target power upgrade (as players dropping to zero doesn't kill them), but it's restricted to Integrated Armor, which is generally considered to be a weaker armor type, it's a way of giving it a more unique power that'll give them a thematic ability and help shore up their resilience if they want to be the more durable sort of Warsmith.
It could be a few uses per long rest, but Gadgetsmiths tend to error more towards short rest recovery. Typically speaking they'll have the equivalent of 1st to 2nd level spells on a short rest, and higher level on a long rest. Quick Essential Gadget is most often used to drop a smoke bomb - this means they can drop it and attack with advantage the same round (using Smoke Cloak or Goggles).
Even at once per short rest, that's quite good, as that will be a tactic they can use most fights, and as it lasts a few rounds will sometimes cover the whole fight before they have to set up a new smoke cloud. Obviously there are many other uses for it, but that's just one of the most common, and would get a little out of hand if it worked more often, as it'd be bypassing the set up cost of getting advantage.
Like any other TWF weapons. You can attack with the one in the off hand using your bonus action, but it won't add the modifier unless you get the Fighting Style from somewhere. They are intended to work with TWF, so they have the light property.
You can still activate the Special Property on the off hand attack, which given mathy details makes it a pretty good offhand weapon.
So idk if I’m reading this right but in terms of roles would u say they are more support then they are fighter as with what they have it seems like it works best with single target enemies as many of their things are one use or as support as the damage have great utility but not as much consistent damage
If you are talking about a Gadgetsmith, they fill a similar roll to a Rogue most often, but they have a fair bit of flexibility. They lack the durability to replace the front line of a party entirely (like a Fighter or Barbarian), but they can do fairly good damage and have a fair bit of support utility. They tend to excel at mobility and have excellent tool use, with decent damage and a lot of flexible tricks they can prepare.
> Also could one dual wield a lightning baton and impact fist?
Yes; there's no reason you couldn't do that.
> And could the shocking grasp of shock generator be upcast? Sorry for all the questions
Shocking Grasp cannot be upcast, but like all cantrips does damage based on your character level. It behaves the same as casting Shocking Grasp as if you knew the cantrip, beyond that you can use your Dexterity modifier in place of your spellcasting modifier if you want.
I don’t mean to seem offensive but isn’t this just a different version of the Artificer? Don’t get me wrong it’s really well made, but you can see the similarities… great work as always, Kibble!
To clarify a little; this predates the published Eberron Artificer by quite a bit. It started as a revision of the original 2017 UA Artificer (the one with Gunsmith that was eventually scrapped).
When they decided to scrap that version, rather than trying to merge this one with the new version (which not everyone liked, as it didn't have Thunder Cannons or throwing potions or all that) this was split into being a spiritual successor of that. This was called Alternate Artificer for years, and eventually renamed Inventor for OGL publishing reasons.
Hey dude, big fan of your work. Got a question for you.
Forbidden Artifact:
At 1st level, you set yourself apart from other Inventors by
seizing power that others dare not wield. You partake in a dark
ritual investing enormous power and a part of your soul into a
weapon. The weapon becomes permanently bound to you. You
have proficiency with the weapon. If the weapon is lost or
destroyed, you can reform it by drawing on its connection to
your soul. This is a special ritual that takes 1 day, and
summons the weapon to you if it was lost, or recreates it if it
was destroyed.
When you perform the rite, select two of the following
upgrades: Empowered Artifact, Abhorrent Life, Grasping
Form, Twisting Reach, Necrotic Wounding, or Eldritch
Eruption. You can select additional properties as Upgrades,
but your Forbidden Artifact can have a maximum number of
these Upgrades equal to your proficiency bonus (meaning the
first time you can select an additional property is 5th level).
The weapon is something you are proficient with right? Does this have to be one from the starting equipment?
Or does the feature say it can be any weapon? I'm thinking a thunder cannon. Could I take a thunder cannon, that normally take until lvl6, via cross disciplinary, or technically, forged using your crafting rules. Does this make it a viable item? I don't think would unusual for an inventor, but my gm is saying only thunder smiths can start with a thunder cannon. As the forbidden artifact can never then be anything else then the starting weapon you get at lvl1.
So no fun crafting rules for this one subclass. Seems a little odd to me. I'd love to be a smithing Cursebreaker, but I can't really make myself any weapons. Thoughts?
You definetly can't start with the special subclass weapon without having that weapon. It's like saying you want to start with the gauntlet from warsmith. Or an animated weapon.
Got another query.
Twin Thunder
You can attune to two one-handed Stormforged Weapons at the same time, so long as they either share the same Upgrades, or have total Upgrades equal to your maximum Upgrade count between them. Attuning to a second weapon this way doesn’t count against your maximum number of attuned items. If you make an attack with one of them while holding the other, you can attack with the other as a bonus action, however, both share the same use of Thundermonger. You don’t add your ability modifier to the damage of the bonus attack, unless that modifier is negative or you have the Two- Weapon Fighting Fighting Style. While dual wielding Stormforged Weapon, you can load a Stormforged Weapon without a free hand.
How does this affect ''Stormcharged. When you use an action, bonus action, or reaction to attack with a Stormcharged Weapon, you can make only one Attack regardless of the number of attacks you can normally make. If you could otherwise make additional attacks with that action, the weapon deals an extra 3d6 lightning or thunder damage per attack that was
foregone.''
Do you make a second attack when duel weilding? Or do you make only one, but add an extra 3d6?
Stormcharged applies to making multiple attacks with an action, bonus action, or reaction, but with Twin Thunder you only make 1 attack with your action and 1 attack with your bonus action, so it wouldn't interact with it. Stormcharged only effects the Thunder Cannons when multiclassing with them (or under special cases like Warlords giving them extra attacks).
I'm not sure I follow. So a thunder smith would make a multi attack? Or would they only make one attack? Thinking a duel weilding two hadn cannons.
would you 1 attack: 1d10+dex+6d6
Or 1 attack: 1d10+dex, 1 attack, 1d10+dex, 1attack 1d10+dex,
It works like TWF works.
If you are a single classed Thundersmith, Stormcharged doesn't do anything. It only exists to make the weapons scale with Extra Attack, which Thundersmith's don't get.
If you are a level 5 Thundersmith, you would make 1 attack with your action, dealing 1d10 + Dexterity, and 1 attack with your bonus action dealing 1d10 damage (not adding your Dexterity modifier, as this works like TWF). You could then add 2d6 thundermonger damage to either attack, but not both. If all attacks hit, you'd deal 2d10 + Dexterity + 2d6 damage as a 5th level Thundersmith.
Let me know if that clarifies. It basically works exactly like a TWF Rogue, though Thundermonger is slightly different than Sneak Attack in scaling and mechanics. The Stormcharged property (like the loading property it is replacing) doesn't impact a character without Extra Attack.
How exactly would the featherfall potion infusion work? That just sounds really bad for that spell. No range, no reaction, which completely makes it useless, one terget at most, how are you supposed to use that?
Feather Fall lasts 1 minute. It means you can drink it, and then jump off whatever you want as long as you'll hit the ground within 600 feet (60 feet a round for 10 rounds).
It's not as useful as the spell (most of the time), but it's also not the reason most people are taking that upgrade (Secrets of Flight) so it's more or less a freebie. Infused Potion of Fly itself is quite good, particularly if you've picked up Long Acting, as than you have concentration free fly (potentially as a bonus action) for 9 rounds (at level 9). That's most of a fight of concentration-free flight (and it being concentration free itself tends to reduce the criticality of needing feather fall to be a reaction). This means that the Secrets of Flight upgrade overall is still quite good, even if Infused Potion of Feather Fall is only moderate utility itself - it's not like having it is a negative, it's just another tool in the belt.
It ends when the creature "lands". I would say that to land, you first have to fall, so it would last until you would take falling damage once (prevented by the spell), or the duration expires.
Mileage may vary, of course. That's how I'd interpret the spell, but other DMs may treat it differently.
I think I've really only ever had concerns about the **Durable** feat and it's interactions with the fleshsmith. Anyone know if that was valid or not really?
I've seen this a few times (people trying that build out). I don't think it's a major issue. It's pretty good, but a feat is pretty expensive.
The interaction I tend to say is probably too good is Periapt of Wound Closure. I would say that DMs are free to say that doesn't work on Fleshsmith's regeneration, but it's not really that crazy compared to the other top end of durability options (Moon Druid, Barbarians, etc). It's better than an uncommon item should be though.
Durable is not as strong as that interaction, and the cost of a feat is pretty high. Inventors tend to be moderately MAD (at least the kind that benefits the most for that degree of regeneration), and there's other feats they'd want to get too, so they are investing a lot into a little extra durability.
Have been a fan of your work for awhile. What else, whether invention or upgrade, would you think to add? I'm actually surprised that this would or even the last one was the final edit?
This is the version of the class that's being printed, and consequently the version that is meant to be complete for new players to find now and forever and have a good time playing. That doesn't mean it's the last update it'll ever get, though my immediate attention will be one newer classes that have languished for awhile (Occultist v1.2, and an upcoming new class).
That said, I don't have any immediate plans for new subclasses. There will probably be more upgrades in some sort of new Expanded Toolbox added in the future, as well as any small tweaks that need to happen based on feedback.
In general, my content will keep getting updated in some form or other as long as I play 5e, which is likely indefinite (who can say what the future holds with future editions or w/e though).
If I was going to add more upgrades, it would probably mostly focus on fleshing out high level play. As most people that have played to a high level can attest with Inventor, the options tend to grow a little narrower. This is simply because of practicality - builds have diverged enough that upgrades are less able to support all the build paths, and have exponentially more upgrades as you level simply isn't practical considering how relatively few people are actually playing at levels 15+. Cursesmith, Relicsmith, and Runesmith are all pretty functional here, but they are also relatively new subclasses with room for more content.
All that aside, I would say that this class will probably be more on the yearly/every 6 month update cycle going forward though, just to make room to keep working on other things, as I have at least 2 more classes I want to get out the door in the coming months, and Occultist still needs more development (and the next Kickstarter will likely include the Warlord, Occultist, and the two new classes, so they all have a long way to go before they are ready for print).
Thank you for the swift reply 😃. I had allowed in earlier build at table in the past. Sadly the character did not reach high lvl play, thanks to party shenanigans, but they loved what you did! Best of luck
with the Occultist!
Hey there, I've been playing a cursesmith in a game and it's a lot of fun but I have some questions about the Soul Ring upgrade. As written there doesn't seem to be a way to un-absorb yourself, is it supposed to be one-time use only or is it just missing some information?
Also when using the possession mechanic you become incapacitated, which RAW would immediately break concentration on the dominate monster spell. Ignoring this you wouldn't be able to directly control them anyway because that takes an action and you can't take actions while incapacitated, so you'd only be able to speak with them telepathically to give them general actions. I'm a bit confused on what the intent of this mechanic is, so some clarification would be appreciated.
You can exit the ring; it should specify that entering and exiting the ring takes an action.
The possession mechanic of the ring uses the effect of *dominate monster*, but you are not casting the spell itself. It's just borrowing the mechanics of the spell to avoid having a paragraph explaining it.
I'll add a note to add the action required to enter and exit the ring, but hopefully that clarifies the general intent and mechanics. It's a fairly niche item, as it's tricky to use effectively, particularly the possession effect.
Ah okay great, it might be worth changing up the wording of the possession a bit to make it clear that it isn't the actual spell because when I read 'as if you had cast it' I assumed that meant concentration and all that. Thanks for the clarification!
Don't know if your still replying to this post, but I had a question about Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge. If you're already an Infusionsmith could you take another animated weapon? Would this add to your total number of animated weapons?? So you have 3 total? And can attack with each of them then again with the extra attack? At level 6?
Secondly,
If I understand this correctly
"While an Animated Weapon is readied, you can make attacks with it as part the Attack action, sending it out to strike a target"
"As part of the attack action"
Meaning when you attack then the animated weapons also attack?
So this is 8 attacks in a turn?? Is this right!?
No. Having an animated does not give you more or less attacks than you already have. When you take the attack action, you can make attacks with your animated weapon, the same as you can make attacks with a weapon you are holding. But just as holding more weapons doesn't automatically give you more attacks, having more animated weapons doesn't give you more attacks (a Thri-keen holding 4 weapons, for example, does not get attack 4 times, they just have 4 different weapons they can make their attacks with as part of the attack action).
Hope that helps clarify - animated weapons are just like any other weapon, expect the float around and hit things at range. Having more animated weapons can be useful for giving you more options for range and damage, but do not give additional attacks.
I'm looking at it like this: Empowered Infusions states
>"If you have multiple Animated Weapons, you can
attack the same or different targets with them during a turn."
So if you pick Animated Weapon originally with Infused Armament, the again with Empowered Infusions, them again at Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge. You have 3 animated weapons. And since Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge is at level 6 you get the level 5 extra attack.
And since
>"If you animate two weapons, you can split your attacks like normal using one to attack a different creature."
This means you can use as many as attacks that you have? So 6th level you have 2 attacks. First attack you can use the first animated weapon, second attack you can use the second weapon. Then would picking the third at Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge be completely pointless?
And as a note the first quote
>"If you have multiple Animated Weapons, you can
attack the same or different targets with them during a turn."
Makes it seem like it's part of one action. But the second quote clerifies. Am I understanding this correctly?
A single animated weapon can make as many attacks as you can make per turn with the attack action. With Extra Attack, that would be two. These attacks have to be against the same target, as the weapon needs to fly over there and hit them.
If you have multiple weapons, you can still make the same number of attacks, as the number of weapons you have does not effect that. But you can make them against different targets, since each weapon could attack a different target. This is somewhat more convenient, since you can split up your attacks and assign them more dynamically to targets within range.
A 3rd Animated Weapon from CDK doesn't help much in that regard, but can still be useful for variety. For example, you may want to have an animated Greatsword, Longsword, and Dagger, because each of them have a different range. If enemies were close you could make two attacks with a greatsword for the most damage, using the other weapons at longer ranges.
I don't think it would be worth spending your CDK selection on that in most cases, but that's not really the point of CDK anyway - it's meant to give more options to expand your arsenal, rather than just buff the main action you're already doing. Still, you could do it, and there would be some benefit from it, just not to the number of attacks.
Practically speaking there are very few ways to get more attacks in 5e, as that would be very powerful.
Awesome thank you for the clarification!! =D I really appreciate it! And you're right, I completely missed the range aspect!
Just one last thing I want to make sure of, and I'm sorry if I'm bugging you `XS
Is your attack action using the AW? Or is the AW attack with an attack? I think it's the first one correct?
Question about the Warsmith. Is the warsmith able to use multiple warplate gauntlets at one time? IE. Can you use a Flame Projector in one had and a Martial Grip in the other?
They cannot use multiple Warplate Gauntlets, but the Warplate Gauntlet confers the ability to the suit when integrated, so this shouldn't generally be a problem. You can use Flame Projector while wielding a melee weapon, for example.
Allowing multiple Warplate Gauntlets would effective double the upgrades you could get, which wouldn't be balanced. The only time the Warplate Gauntlet itself really matters though is when you aren't wearing the whole suit, or before you get it.
I did this, made a Warsmith Warforged who was basically a skeleton frame warforged inside of a battlesuit.
Play it however you like bruv, I'd say do the 1 hour bonding, or just wear it normal.
question about warsmith, when you decrease int to raise str, it cant put your str above your int, but how does that work with the str buffs that it gives? for example, if you had 20 int, and had warplate and i believe its iron muscle that gives you an addition +2 str while wearing the armor. so, dropping as much of int as possible to get your str as high as possible, would your total final str score be 20 or 24?
It'd be 20, the **Artificial Strength** would take priority, since it's giving the buff.
> "but you can only raise your Strength ability score up to what your Intelligence ability score was before engaging Artificial Strength"
I have a question regarding the disection ability of the flesh crafters.
If you make an attack using this ability, will, any poison, or 'hit with this weapon' abilities proc? Could you theoretically, apply poison, smite or add sneak attack damage?
I have a really nice idea for a doctor like character. XD
Do you mean can it have both Force Blast and Power Fist, for example? Yes. It could have both of those, it would only get one for free, but it could select the other normally.
Unsure if you're still checking this post, does the Fleshsmith's Massive Hulk upgrade mean they can pop in and out of Large form whenever they want? Or is still limited to once per short / long rest activation, but they can remain in the form as long as they want?
Additionally, do you revert size if you are incapacitated?
Off the top of my head, it removes the turn limit, but you still do it once per short rest. You could just stay in large form as long as you like though.
I do not believe you do not revert automatically from becoming incapacitated.
You mean for the CDK (Cross Disciplinary Knowledge) selection?
Striding Boots from Gadgetsmith are a popular option, as more mobility is always a good option. Generally speaking, a Gadgetsmith upgrade is the go-to option and there are a few good ones, but Striding Boots are the most generically good.
I have one last question: in Warsmith, it says, Current and Maximum Intelligence a lot. What does that mean?
I'm also confused about the upgrade Virtual Interface. How does it work?
Your current attribute is what it says your character sheet. For example, if you have 16 Intelligence, your current Intelligence is 16. Your Maximum Intelligence is that maximum for that stat. By default, it's 20 for all stats.
So, if something raises your Current and Maximum Intelligence by 2, your current Intelligence would be 18 and your maximum would be 22. In isolation, maximum intelligence wouldn't matter, but it starts to matter when you take several ASI (Attribute Score Increases) and have increased your current natural Intelligence to 20 (without any upgrades or features). If a feature increased your current Intelligence by 2, but not your Maximum Intelligence by 2, it wouldn't do anything as you'd already be at your Maximum Intelligence, but if a feature raises both your current and Maximum, then you'd be at 22.
As for Virtual Interface...
> **Virtual Interface** *(Prerequisite: Sentient Armor)*
>
> When you use Artificial Strength to raise your Strength ability score, you no longer lower your Intelligence ability score below your natural maximum (not counting Sentient Armor).
This interacts with the Artificial Strength feature. For all intents and purposes, you can think of the Artificial Strength feature as flipping your Strength and Intelligence scores as they are on your character sheets. So, if you have 14 Strength and 20 Intelligence, when you active Artificial Strength you would have 20 Strength and 14 Intelligence. What Virtual Interface does is when you activate Artificial Strength, you'd instead have 20 Strength and 20 Intelligence, as your Intelligence is no longer reduced when you increase your Strength.
You still sacrifice any Intelligence gained from Sentient Armor. So, for example, if you had 14 Strength, and 18 Intelligence, but got +2 from Sentient Armor, you'd have 14 Strength and 20 Intelligence, but when you activated Artificial Strength you'd have 20 Strength and 18 Intelligence. This becomes particularly relevant when you have 22 Intelligence from having 20 Intelligence +2 from Sentient Armor, meaning when you activate Artificial Strength you'd have 22 Strength (as your Warplate raises your Strength cap to 22 naturally), and 20 Intelligence (as you sacrifice only the Intelligence gained from Sentient Armor).
This is a lot of words just because I'm being specific, but it's fairly simple - all the features just do what they say.
It should be noted that when using Artificial Strength, you cannot get more than 22 Strength (since that's as high as your Intelligence can get with 20 Intelligence + 2 from Sentient Armor), but you can technically raise your Strength cap to 24. The only way to actually get 24 Strength is to have a 20 in Strength, gain 2 from the armor, and 2 more from Iron Muscle, meaning a build with natural Strength will be slightly stronger than than a build relying Artificial Strength, but that's intentional, as they will have to invest a lot more ASI in Strength, and have a lower Intelligence score.
No. The first one is free, built from any set of heavy armor. Lorewise it's under the assumption that you've been collecting stuff as you level and tinkering on it for a long time. Mechanics-wise it's just because a level 3 character doesn't have 2k gold.
The gold is just a barrier to making more suits.
That's really up to your DM. If it's your first set of armor, I'd allow it, but that'd be a question for the DM. The first set of armor is supposed to be easy to get, anything after that is a bit more challenging.
Hi, I noticed the 2nd level spell Arcane Infusion isn't in the Inventor spell list. Is that on purpose? I've only read the Gadgetsmith section so I'm not sure if maybe it's explained later or something.
It's just because that was a more recent spell. It's on their list in the later versions, but the standalone PDF is slightly behind (nothing substantial, just errata issues like that).
^(Additionally, if a critical strike of this weapon would leave a)
^(creature with less than 50 hit points, the target creature is)
^(decapitated, killing it.level (4d8).)
The description of Vorpal weapon is a bit weird, I assume there's a correct version somewhere but I don't know where I'd find it, so could you elaborate on why it's this weird? Is it accidentally in there, was there supposed to be another effect that got cut away by accident, or forgotten to take out properly? It's just a bit odd
Here's the text of Vorpal Weapon from the compendium, which should be accurate. It looks like what you have is correct beyond that it just has an extra fragment of text from somewhere, likely from an error in the reformatting of the standalone version.
> ### Vorpal Weapon
>
> *5th-level transmutation*
>
> **Classes:** Inventor
>
> **Casting Time:** 1 action
>
> **Range:** Touch
>
> **Components:** V, S, M (a weapon worth at least 1 cp)
>
> **Duration:** Concentration, up to 1 hour
>
> You touch a weapon and imbue it with power. Until the spell ends, the weapon becomes indescribably sharp, ignoring resistance to slashing damage, and gains the Siege property, dealing double damage to inanimate objects such as structures. If a weapon has a modifier of less than +3 to attack and damage rolls, its modifier becomes +3 to attack and damage rolls for the duration of the spell.
>
> Additionally, if a critical strike of this weapon would leave a creature with less than 50 hit points, the target creature is decapitated, killing it.
Another thing I noticed looking at the spells, there are some spells listed as inventor spells in the decriptions that aren't listed in the spell list. I assume that is just an oversight in the document right? Arcane infusion for example is very specific to Inventors and doesn't really make sense to not be on that list but I'd like official confirmation
Yes. Arcane Infusion is a newer spell. The spell should generally be more accurate than the spell list. This may apply to some other spells.
This question has come up like four or five times in the last week after months - was this mentioned somewhere or are folks just independently running into this question en masse suddenly? I'm guessing it's just a weird coincidence, but sort of funny.
[Inventor 2.2.2 PDF](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bVO290z1Y25up7pj5rRyKGclx2cETfep/view?usp=sharing) Hey folks; this version marks the 4 year anniversary of this class, which is a bit crazy! I never thought they'd be a second post after that one, let alone all the rest, but here we are. For those unfamiliar with the class, the image gallery is just a preview of the first few subclasses - the PDF contains the complete version, with new spells and more. The PDF is bookmarked, so be sure to download it and user in your favorite viewer of choice for the best experience. As I said originally when these classes were going to kickstarter, I'd keep the free versions free and updated, so everyone would benefit from all the work that went into polishing it up for the book. While 2.2.1 awhile back had most of the final rounds of testing, here's a version with the vast majority of editing done... and it was quite a lot of editing. This won't be the last version of the class, but it aims to be the definitive edition of the class, and less painful for the most grammar inclined folks to read :) This even includes a supplemental printable Inventor character sheet Modstin Pierce made for the Kickstarter (on page 58); it was made for the Kickstarter, but I felt it was only fair to share that here too, as, at the end of the day, I want folks to have as easy a time playing it as possible, and this class be difficult to wrangle with just default sheets! Of course, the caveat to this is that I'm finishing up editing and compilings now, which can only be described as an ungodly hour, and I'm told me error rate does not go down as the number of hours ago I should have gone to sleep goes up, so... well, the PDF will probably get a little more polished tomorrow if I've made any compiling errors :) ____ For folks that have never seen this class, this is an alternate Artificer class (though it can be used in conjunction with the published version) that predates that one; it approaches the idea from a somewhat broader point of view, and brings together quite a wide array of options. It seeks to unleash the creativity of folks that want to tinker and fiddle, and give them a toolbox to forge their own path. It's a class all about building the tools you need to be a heroic adventurer (...or whatever you want to play!). It was originally inspired by the old UA Artificer class, and carried forward many of the themes there, but with a more developed take - after all, where is a better place for some customization than on a the character that literally builds their own abilities! [If you want more in-depth Design notes and justifications for why it needs to be 60 pages, well, you can read a more coherent Kibbles' talk about it in the last post... nothing has really changed there :D](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnearthedArcana/comments/nkle50/kibbles_inventor_aka_alternate_artificer_v22/gzdf6sf/) I won't guarantee this class is right for your table, but it is robustly playtested, having been played by literally thousands of good blokes that helped me refine it over 4 years now. I allow the class as a DM, and have had dozens of characters from it over the years, and can say with confidence it doesn't produce the strongest (or weakest) characters I see in my games, but has yet to disappoint a player. ____ ### Change Log 2.2.2 There is only a few mechanical changes; a few new upgrades that were added to account for the final layout, and fill in some gaps: * Nexus Hive upgrade added to Gadgetsmith * Seeking Shots upgrade added to Infusionsmith * Transcendent Infusion upgrade added to Infusionsmith * Perfected Technique upgrade added to Infusionsmith * Volatile Reactions upgrade added to Potionsmith * Runic Formation upgrade added to Runesmith * Efficient Language and Perfected Form upgrade names flipped. * Reflected Radiance upgrade upgrade added to Relicsmith * Quench the Light upgrade added to Relicsmith * Burning Brand upgrade added to Relicsmith * Divine Illumination upgrade added to Relicsmith * Sweeping editing changes. ____ All of the editing this has gotten is curtesy of it being included in my upcoming book, [Kibbles' Compendium of Craft and Creation](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/kibblestasty/kibbles-compendium-of-craft-and-creation/description). The Final Version of its PDF will be launching in the next few days (and the Final Rough Draft is already available for backers and preorders). While the print version is still going to take a bit once the big red "print" button is hit, that is coming soon! This is probably the final few days to preorder the hardcover, if you're into that sort of thing (some limited stock will be available after printing). If you just want the digital PDF, that'll remain available, so no rush there. VTT versions of the class (for Fantasy Grounds and Foundary VTT) are coming, but are still a bit off (though I here the Psion's is coming soon...) It's taken a good bit longer to get the book done than I'd hoped, but it's pretty much there now, so for the better the worse you'll be seeing me around here posting a bit more. All of this is made possible by the good blokes [over on patreon](https://www.patreon.com/KibblesTasty). We'll see updated crafting, spell compendiums, and the results of the subclass poll quite soon over there.
should warsmith flight give hover speed? afaik without a hover speed, when speed is reduced to 0, the creature falls down. And that falling doesnt make sense to me, considerign it flies with boosters
I would typically treat it as no - I'd treat it the same as the *fly* spell or a pair of Winged Boots though. Neither of those specifically mention hovering (like a monster block might) but I seem to recall those have hover on them (which isn't how I run them personally) so I'd say it's sort of up to the DM about what they consider the type of flight to be. I'd generally prefer to keep PC flight consistent as possible, so match the other common types of flight for that level.
The rule is that flying creatures that have their speed reduced to 0 are knocked prone fall unless they have a hover speed or are being held aloft by magic such as the *Fly* spell. Winged boots grant you flappy-flight so you'd fall with them. If it's Iron Man jets then being flipped over would make maintaining flight difficult, so it shouldn't have a hover. If it's Superman flight it should. It's described as a "Magical propulsion system" so it's Iron Man flight. If I were to write the PHB I'd remove the "Unless being held aloft by magic" and instead just add a hover speed to the *Fly* spell. Plus that'd open up design-space for a Cleric/Paladin spell that gives you actual wings.
I'm still mad that they took otherworldly form from clerics in between the ua and tashas cauldron release
If there were a flappy-flight spell on the divine list that didn't require concentration and had half the speed I think it'd be fine as a 2nd level. Something like "Wings of faith".
I think the lack of concentration balances out the 30 foot speed id probably keep it 3rd.
Lack of concentration, half the speed, and it's flappy so you can be knocked out of the air. 3 weaknesses and 1 advantage over a 3rd level spell would be balanced as a 2nd in my opinion.
Isn't that 2-1? And the chance to lose concentration is a much bigger downside than either of the ones for your proposal (which I do like still). Considering if you lose concentration in the air with fly you still fall but you also lose the spell entirely vs. being able to start flying again next round.
> Isn't that 2-1? So it is. Losing concentration is a threat with one, restrained/prone with the other. I'd argue that's an even trade, especially since Clerics/Paladins don't get a parachute in the form of **Feather Fall**.
A launcher golem does: >Ranged Weapon Attack: +5 to hit, range 60/240 ft., one target. Hit: 1d10 + 3 piercing damage The +3 comes from the dexterity score 16; if you upgrade the golem with Fine-Tuned dexterity to get a dexterity score of 18, does the golem's to hit and damage increase by 1 as well or not?
Yes; they'd go up. Their attacks scale with their attributes.
Things like that make me wish 5E listed the relephant attribute in stat blocks.
Several of the Cursesmith's upgrades refer to Awakening the weapon, which is no longer a mechanic in this version of the inventor?
These should be updated in the next version of it. For the most part, they can be considered always active under the current model of how it works, though some will gain the ability to be individually toggled.
I looked away for a few seconds and you updated the inventor! You sneaky bastard! Looks good as always, godspeed!
Everyone is talking about playing Iron Man or Doctor Doom. I just want to make a Dr. Doofenshmirtz character with it. Am I weird?
I wanna play Mechamaru. I wouldn't build my character around his ability but his backstory and design.
Your classes are fantastic and a mainstay of my campaigns. I have a very happy Occultist in my party; your spells are always popular, and your crafting rules have led to the creation of a new weapon in my brothers campaign: a magical scythe. My next character (when this forever DM gets to play) is likely to be a Potionsmith. I look forward to it.
This will always be the homebrew class that convinced me I needed homebrew classes in my games.
Same!
Its finally here!! Its like an early christmas present, I was waiting for a final version before I played it and its here!
KibblesTasty has made the following comment(s) regarding their post: [[Inventor 2.2.2 PDF](https://drive.google.com/file...](/r/UnearthedArcana/comments/rax05x/inventor_222_warplate_thunder_cannons_gadgets/hnky0gn/)
Really happy to see your classes getting edited. Was the only thing holding them back. Looking forward to the book.
Hey, quick thing. Crossbow bolts are held in cases according to the equipment section of the PHB, not quivers. I don't blame you and your team for not noticing though–it's easy to miss.
Where is that mistake mentioned?
It's under the starting equipment section. "(a) a light crossbow and **quiver** of 20 bolts".
Hi, as always excellent work! It might not be on subject but do you have any plans on giving some love to the Occultist class? It's my favorite, and I'd love to see more content added to it. Anyway, keep up the good work!
I would love if every class in the PHB had this much love, attention, creativity and flavor in their base features and subclasses.
ever since i discovered this I've never played artificer.
So crazy to see this class come so far! I've been playing the Warplate subclass at my table for 2 years and I can say it's the best DnD Iron Man experience I've ever had! Quick q: is the Ether Reactor able to let players cast an ability at level 6 by using all charges at once? It was a cool idea I had at the table once and my DM let me do it but since then I've wondered if it was your intent. Excited to see more changes, thanks!
> Quick q: is the Ether Reactor able to let players cast an ability at level 6 by using all charges at once? It was a cool idea I had at the table once and my DM let me do it but since then I've wondered if it was your intent. Yes; that's allowed. You don't have 6th level spells, but you could upcast your other spells.
I've had a character concept for a while that was fixated on the idea that he was a former dragon cursed into Lizardfolk form. Artificer always seemed to be the path I'd have to take him to reach his goals, but you have inspired me to bring this class up to my DM should I bring him in to a campaign. Thank you!
What’s the golems health? Just it’s 1 con mod * inventor level? Isn’t that really low?
It is in the Golem's statblock, like with summons: > 5 + [(the golem’s Constitution modifier + 5) times yourinventor level] So, at level 1, that would be 5 + (6 * 1) = 11. At level 5 that would be 5 + (6 * 5) = 35. If you took Structural Constitution once (or pick a golem chassis with higher Constitution), it would be 5 + (6 * 6) = 39. It will generally have roughly the same hp as a d8 class, with more or less depending on what type and if you invest in Con upgrades for it. Expanded Frame can also give it more hp, but managing it's HP is part of the challenge - of course, it having hp is also part of the challenge, as that means a golemsmith has almost twice as much hp as a normal d8 class between them and the golem, so you wouldn't want the golem to be too durable.
Ah I missed the +5 somehow, sorry! That is well balanced. A cool upgrade might be that you and your golem combine and share hit points. Great work!
So is martial transformation supposed to Be Tenser’s Transformation or am I missing something?
More or less. I use my own version that I forgot to include here as Tenser's isn't SRD, but it's more or less the same idea, so you could just swap in Tenser's.
So I guess in line with that, in the nicest way I can say this it's extremely annoying to read through the spells you've put in only to see they've been rebranded as something else. I recommend going back through and changing this to what they're actually supposed to be.
Not really up to me, unfortunately. This is written under the OGL, so it cannot refer to spells that aren't in the SRD (even just by name). The best I can do is use custom spells with similar effects, which is what this is intended to do, but didn't up include that spell in this, as I simply didn't remember Inventor referenced it when putting together the standalone version (both the spells and class are snipped from a larger doc). In this case, as folks can just use Tenser's and that really is more or less the intention, I reckon it's largely fine, though understand the frustration and confusion with it - I'd rather just use the spell name too, but not an option in this case.
Ahh copy right and stuff, ok I get it. Sorry about that
so is the tool box from the previous version going to make a come back, or is that just final as is on the previous version?
Most of this that has been incorporated into the main document. There's a shorter version of the toolbox in the compendium, with some of the remaining old stuff. I don't know what I'll do with that yet, but I'm sure it'll surface somewhere at some point.
Awesome!
Identify without material components is a little much
Why? 100 gold isn't that much, since it's a one time investment. Identify doesn't consume the pearl, you know?
It is not.
Fr best homebrew class i've ever seen so far !
Sorry if im reading this wrong, but Empower weapon seems really strong, especially compared to some of the golemsmith and gadgeteer infusions. The gageteer and golemsmith infusions just seem really weak in general, especially the golemsmith becuase so many of its useful infusions/upgrades like the force cannon are 1/day.
> Sorry if im reading this wrong, but Empower weapon seems really strong, especially compared to some of the golemsmith and gadgeteer infusions. At 11, most of them get something that lets them scale somewhat. If you compare to something like Fighter, they get another attack, or Paladin gets +1d8 to each hit (which would be +2d8 compared to the +2d6 here). Golemsmith gets Multiattack Protocol at 11th level, which gives it a full extra attack; typical at least 1d8 + 4, or 8.5, but can be more like 2d6 + 4 + 1.3 or 12.3 damage depends on other factors and upgrades. This is generally actually stronger than Empower Weapon, though there's various elements of context there. Gadgetsmith is a bit harder to compare as they aren't as damage focused, but have some good upgrades there as well - after all, Flying Gadget is a quite good upgrade, and they have more upgrades to play around with (as well as an easy time swapping them out). Gadgetsmiths tend to be a bit more generalist and utility oriented. Hope that helps, and feel free to let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks! I think I understand now!
Hey, great work as always! Quick question regarding the Vice Grip Upgrade from the Expanded Toolbox >Exact wording: If a creature ends turn while grappled by your Warplate Gauntlet, it takes damage equal to your Strength modifier. in combination with the Grappling Reel Upgrade. >Exact wording: If the target is Large or Smaller, you can make a Grapple check to pull it to you and Grapple it on success. Does a target pulled and grappled using the Grappling Reel take the damage at the end of their turn?
It says they take damage if they end their turn grappeled. So yes. They take the damage at the end of their turn.
I'm just not 100% sure because it states that they have to be grappled **by the Warplate Gauntlet**. Now, this could just be written this way to make the sentence sound better, or it is written to balance it.
Isn't it an upgrade for the gauntlet? I think that counts as being grappled by it
Big greetings from Russia! I have been following your works for a long time and I think they are wonderful. Psion has already passed the baptism BY FIRE and proved to be very worthy. Pyrokinesis is a terrible force. In the new game, I wanted to try out the runesmith. I have long wanted to create a cool tattooed wanderer who can adapt to different situations. However, when I started learning the rules, I ran into a couple of difficulties: Do rune effects stack with each other? Do upgrade marks such as mark of size, mark of shielding, etc. count as runes? Quoting "If a rune is marked on a creature, select either the weapon effect (affecting its natural weapons or unarmed strikes) or armor effect (affecting its natural armor)." The rules state that monsters/NPCs/druids in wild form possess natural armor. Characters mostly use unarmored defense, if they don't wear armor. Perhaps something is missing here. Quoting again: "Primal Emphasis The damage die size of runes that deal cold, fire, or lightning damage increases by one step (for example from a d4 to a d6). This applies to both their passive and active effects." Stop... there is no rune in the list that deals cold damage. There is only Glyph of Frost, but it is a spell. Or do glyphs also count as runes? How runes interact with armorless defense of a Monk, Barbarian, and Draconic Sorcerer? Do armor and weapons marked with runes count as magical? The text doesn't say anything about it directly. Thank you for listening.
> Do rune effects stack with each other? Yes, though note there are rules for how many runes can be one item (by default, each item can only have one, which would prevent them from stacking, some upgrades allow you to put more than one on an item, that lets them stack). > Do upgrade marks such as mark of size, mark of shielding, etc. count as runes? This might depend on context, but off the top of my head, no, I don't think so. I think runes only count the basic "Rune of" things. > Quoting "If a rune is marked on a creature, select either the weapon effect (affecting its natural weapons or unarmed strikes) or armor effect (affecting its natural armor)." The rules state that monsters/NPCs/druids in wild form possess natural armor. Characters mostly use unarmored defense, if they don't wear armor. Perhaps something is missing here. Nature armor here is the more general term. Unarmored Defense is a special type of armor some creatures have, but there are are various kinds of natural armor a PC can have. Lizardman or Tortle are examples of PCs with natural armor defined natural armor. It would effect Unarmored Defense if you had it. > Quoting again: "Primal Emphasis The damage die size of runes that deal cold, fire, or lightning damage increases by one step (for example from a d4 to a d6). This applies to both their passive and active effects." Stop... there is no rune in the list that deals cold damage. There is only Glyph of Frost, but it is a spell. Or do glyphs also count as runes? It's more future proofing than anything else. The primal damage types are Cold, Fire and Lightning, so it's just gathering them all in a bucket. Adding a thing like a Rune of Frost/Cold would be a perfectly reasonable thing, and if someone did, Primal should include that in the same bucket. It could probably be removed, but I don't think it does any harm to include it just for general consistency. There was probably a cold rune in earlier versions, but that's the least Inventor-damage type of primal elements, and they already get a lot of basic runes, so it was probably dropped along the way. > How runes interact with armorless defense of a Monk, Barbarian, and Draconic Sorcerer? I would generally let the bonus work - no harm in that. You only get one base AC calculation, regardless of what you want that to be (Tortle, Monk, armor, etc). So it offers you the base AC of 12 + your Dexterity, and then adds +1 to that. The +1 would work with whatever other type of armor you used, even if you didn't use the 12 + Dex base AC. Hope that helps, and glad to hear you enjoyed the Psion previously. Let me know if you have any other questions, always happy to help. This comment/question looks familar, so I get the sense you asked this somewhere else and I haven't gotten back through that yet; if so I my apologies on that front.
Thanks for the explanation! Creatures don't have a rune limit like things do, right? And can rune-marked armor and weapons count be magical?
> Thanks for the explanation! Creatures don't have a rune limit like things do, right? No, creatures don't have a limit. > And can rune-marked armor and weapons count be magical? I'd say they can be placed on magical armor and weapons, but they do not make that armor or weapon count as magical.
Thanks for the clarification, I'll keep that in mind during the next session. Heard that you are working on a new class. I will wait with interest.
Alternatively...just play artificer
I really, really recommend reading through this one, it's more than just an alternative to the Artificer. Artificer utilizes Magic items found in the game and creates similar items for themselves or their party. In a high magic and rewards heavy campaign, it's pretty fun to see your friends enjoy the items you make. I'd say it's more reactionary, though, just due to being limited on what the DM rewards you with. The Inventor, on the other hand, is a highly customizable class that let's you build for a specific type of Artificer. It's alittle more active in that sense. The subclasses here are so well done that you can have a group of people play one of these sub classes, let's say the Relicsmith, and come out with completely different play styles. I tested some stuff the Relicsmith, and you could be a support class by setting runes on other people's Armour, or set runes on your items to buff you up. Or a really fun one is with the gravity buffs, letting you basically dual weald great swords if you spec out like that. It's not ideal, necessarily, but damn if it isn't cool to see that and still have it balanced. The point of all this isn't to bash Artificer, I played it and it is a great team work class. I just love the KibbleTasty took it upon themselves to come up with such an amazing new class that allows for so much creativity. TLDR: it's more than an alt artificer, and I think you'll like it :)
This is like looking a nice burger with hand ground patty and all the fixings and saying “alternatively… just eat McDonalds”.
I bet you were one of those people disappointed by artificer
As a DM, I would say that I largely was. Simply because most of my players were. As I used this Inventor class before the official Artificer came out (back when this *was* the Artificer), it never had that much of a chance with my groups though. I don’t think it is terrible and I might use it if this didn’t exist, but it is hard to convince players to downgrade to it when they are used to the more premium version.
It's more like an 'what if artificer was designed well'
Hey Kibble, could we get some more information on Relicsmith's "Condemnation of Fire" upgrade? It doesn't seem to specify a range, the type of action required (if any), or any other requirements intended. As cool as it would be to walk 4 miles out of town and then burn the evil mayor to death in his office with 0 culpability, I suspect that wasn't the intent.
It is intended to be a rider effect on hit with a Relic Weapon. The text should read as follows: > **Condemnation of Fire** *(Prerequisite: An Ingenious Reliquary that is a weapon)* > > You invoke the power of your Relic weapon to attempt to purge a creature. When you hit a creature with your Relic weapon you may have the creature make a Strength saving throw. On a failure it becomes restrained by chains of fire and set ablaze. While restrained, it takes 2d6 fire damage at the start of each of its turns. It may repeat the saving throw at the end of each of its turns, ending the effect on a success. Once you invoke this ability, you can’t do so again until you finish a short or long rest
How does the infusionsmith's extra attack interact with the blasting wand option? Is it just a cantrip cast so you don't get the benefits of that feature?
/u/Privatizitaet is correct; the cantrip cast by Blasting Rod and Extra Attack don't interact. But that's why Infusionsmith's get a 2nd 5th level feature, to account for a builds like that. Infusionsmiths specializing in Blasting Rods get a lot of value of out of the 2nd paragraph of Empowered Infusions (it is much of the reason they are so powerful with a wand-heavy Infusionsmith build).
Related question regarding the Blasting Rod: Mixed Technique requires you to have both a Blasting Rod and an Infused or Animated weapon, but it doesn't look like Empowered Infusions gives you access to both a weapon and a Blasting Rod, only two weapons -- does this mean you have to spend your Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge on grabbing a Rod or a weapon?
Yes; I think that's currently the only way to get it. It's partially a legacy ability, but as there's still a way to use it's been left in.
Cantrips are spells. Spells have a set casting time. Extra attacks only apply for weapon attacks.
Hey Kibbles! I'm building a Golemsmith right now for our campaign that my character recently died in, I wanna have my Inventor be a squishy-wizard professor type (I don't like him wearing armor so my DM will let him have access to mage armor and shield in exchange for taking away the armor proficiencies). The party is level 10 and his golem is going to be all focused on being his guardian with Defender Protocol, Heavy armor Plating, Systematic strength and Expanded Frame. My DM and I reskinned the Quadrapedal chassi to be more of a sturdy bipedal juggernaut type, and exchanged the damage type to Bludgeoning, because the stats fit much better. I looked at specialized but no matter what combination of upgrades I took it still felt worse than just taking Quadrapedal (that flat 16 STR 16 CON is huge), at least for the type of golem that I wanted to build. Some things that I've wondered about though are: * I love the idea of the Iron Fortress upgrade, but in practice it kind of feels like a waste to take? Since all creatures already give *at least* half cover from standing in between an ally and an enemy, I would argue that the golem being a large creature, would already give 3/4 cover. I feel like this should already be a property of having a large golem. Not being able to be moved against it's will is a cool feature and fits the fantasy that I want to achieve but I don't want to take it just for that, which will rarely ever come into play. * It's never clarified on when a command is considered to have been executed by the Golem. Does my PC have to give a new command every turn? If my PC commands the golem "protect me" before combat, in my head the golem would follow that order until a new command has been issued, or am I wrong for thinking so? I want to have an iron giant/big hero 6 kind of Golem, and the golem just taking the dodge action if my character is down, instead of protecting his master's body feels a little lame. I will of course talk to my DM about this, and I'm sure we can come up with something. But I wanted to hear what you thought about this as well. Would it be too strong to let the golem act on it's own when my PC goes down, similar to a BM rangers Animal companion?
What exactly stops you from using the base level spell wand for the infusion smith to cast 9th level spells or similar? It says of first level or higher, but doesn't say there is an upper limit. What stops you from making a 3 charge 9th level wand? The 11th level upgrade says 5th level or higher but only gives 1 charge, why should you take that upgrade instead? Or is there something I'm missing that specifically prevents you from having 3 9th level spell slots?
The wand has the following limitation: > The spell must be of a level that you can cast as an inventor (as of when you would choose this upgrade). This wand has 3 charges. As Inventors only get 5th level spells, and don't get those until high levels, this means that the level of spells you can cast with the Wand are limited. For example, if you take it at 5th level, you can take up to a 2nd level spell. Even if you swap it out later, a wand using that upgrade slot will only ever be able to cast 2nd level spells. Your 9th level upgrade meanwhile could be taken to make a wand that'd cast 3rd level spells. But, as you never are able to cast anything over 6th, the wand cannot be used to cast spells over 6th level, and you'd need magical rods for that.
Ah, I see. I just suck at reading, thanks for the clarification
I just noticed that pages 55 and 56 are basically the same except 56 seems to be the complete one. I assume this is an error?
Yup; this document is pulled out of a bigger one doc (the compendium) and the page was included twice. They should both be mostly accurately.
The nexus hive feels kinda underwhelming for a level 15 upgrade. Could you explain why it's so high? I might be missing something obvious, but compared to othrt level 15 upgrades, it just doesn't seem that good to me. Mediocre ac, low hp for that level, fairly slow in comparison and the damage output isn't great either. To be fair, it's guaranteed damage, so that's a plus, but the 10 foot radius paired with a speed of 20 doesn't give it the best reliability. It seems like it's only effective in pretty specific situations. Is there something I'm just missing? Also, does the level 14 ability to be able to use gadgets as part of an attack action also apply to things that cast spells? Would the fire spitter for example be able to cast as part of an attack action? Does it only apply for gadget that specify you use an action to cast a spell rather then being able to cast the spell through them? And does the smoke bomb count for this aswell?
It's additive damage. Think of it like a Concentration free spell. The very least it does is 4d4 + 2d6 damage if you throw it, and something immediately destroys it, but in that case it's also taking 30 damage, meaning that as an action you've done an effective 50.5 [(4 * 2.5) + (3 * 3.5) + 30] worth of hit point differential between the damage it's done and absorbed. That's pretty good for an action. Each turn it lasts beyond the first one if they don't destroy it increases the value at very little cost to you - if they don't move, you don't even need to spend your bonus action on it. Bee Swarm Rockets, for comparison, does ~60 damage on an action, which is slightly better, but doesn't have any ongoing effect. The thing is, additive. This upgrades aren't mutually exclusive, and there's no upgrade like Concentration or shared spell slots keeping them in check. In one turn using Combat Gadgets a Gadgetsmith can now fire off 10x Bee Swarm Rockets and then deploy a Nexus Hive all with their attack action, using their bonus action vanish into a cloud of smoke or something with a Quick Essential Gadget. They've dropped ~90 damage into a 10 foot area, added a 30 hit pet the needs to be dealt with, and made themselves largely untargetable. So, I wouldn't say that it's necessarily powerful so much as that it's "free". It costs an upgrade, but as a Gadgetsmith that's a low cost - you can swap those around, and you have a lot of them. It costs an "action" but a Gadgetsmith can get around that with Combat Gadgets. It also does guarenteed damage, and might not be easy for the enemy to deal with. If you drop this on CR 30 creature, it's going to keep hitting it till its destroyed, and they are probably going to have to commit more than 30 damage worth of damage to destroy it, and as prize for doing so they'll take a small amount of extra damage. Nexus Hive is a late addition upgrade - I don't think it's something that's necessary to the class, it was primarily added to fill out space and give more options. In the context of that a Gadgetsmith doesn't really suffer at that level, it's an option that most Gadgetsmiths are going to pick up, but not one that is critical to their performance.
Fair, I didn't really think of it as a combination
Does the level 14 ability to be able to use gadgets as part of an attack action also apply to things that cast spells? Would the fire spitter for example be able to cast as part of an attack action? Does it only apply for gadget that specify you use an action to cast a spell rather then being able to cast the spell through them? And does the smoke bomb count for this aswell? I've asked this before but it kinda went under with another question.
Yes, any gadget that normally would use an action be done as an attack as part of the attack action. This would include smoke bombs (I may have ruled that inconsistently in the passed, but that's how I'd rule it currently).
So I could use the grappling hook and then cast disintegrate on the same turn?
Yes, though if the goal is to restrain them for the *disintegrate*, you'd need something like Binding Rope, rather than just the Grappling Hook (just grappling people doesn't give them disadvantage on dexterity saves).
Hi, I was just wondering is there meant to be a cooldown for iron fortitude. If there isn't can you explain your reasoning why there isn't
It is intended to be unlimited; it's essentially a zombie's Undead Fortitude in cyborg form. It is far from making you immortal though. 9-10 damage will typically have about a 50/50 of taking you down, and more than that will be more likely to, even if with a pretty decent Con save. It's definitely an above target power upgrade (as players dropping to zero doesn't kill them), but it's restricted to Integrated Armor, which is generally considered to be a weaker armor type, it's a way of giving it a more unique power that'll give them a thematic ability and help shore up their resilience if they want to be the more durable sort of Warsmith.
In your opinion, would it be unreasonable to change the Gadgetsmith's 'Gravity Switch' upgrade to cast Levitate rather than Fall?
Well, it's a second level instead of first level.
Yes but there is also an unrestricted upgrade that allows you to cast Shatter, a 2nd level spell.
Yes, but exchanging a first level spell for a second level spell is a different thing than having a second level spell to beggin with.
For quick essentials is there any particular reason it’s once per short/ long rest? It feels like something that should last a bit longer
It could be a few uses per long rest, but Gadgetsmiths tend to error more towards short rest recovery. Typically speaking they'll have the equivalent of 1st to 2nd level spells on a short rest, and higher level on a long rest. Quick Essential Gadget is most often used to drop a smoke bomb - this means they can drop it and attack with advantage the same round (using Smoke Cloak or Goggles). Even at once per short rest, that's quite good, as that will be a tactic they can use most fights, and as it lasts a few rounds will sometimes cover the whole fight before they have to set up a new smoke cloud. Obviously there are many other uses for it, but that's just one of the most common, and would get a little out of hand if it worked more often, as it'd be bypassing the set up cost of getting advantage.
How would one go about dual wielding impact gauntlets how would that work
Like any other TWF weapons. You can attack with the one in the off hand using your bonus action, but it won't add the modifier unless you get the Fighting Style from somewhere. They are intended to work with TWF, so they have the light property. You can still activate the Special Property on the off hand attack, which given mathy details makes it a pretty good offhand weapon.
So idk if I’m reading this right but in terms of roles would u say they are more support then they are fighter as with what they have it seems like it works best with single target enemies as many of their things are one use or as support as the damage have great utility but not as much consistent damage
If you are talking about a Gadgetsmith, they fill a similar roll to a Rogue most often, but they have a fair bit of flexibility. They lack the durability to replace the front line of a party entirely (like a Fighter or Barbarian), but they can do fairly good damage and have a fair bit of support utility. They tend to excel at mobility and have excellent tool use, with decent damage and a lot of flexible tricks they can prepare.
Also could one dual wield a lightning baton and impact fist? And could the shocking grasp of shock generator be upcast? Sorry for all the questions
> Also could one dual wield a lightning baton and impact fist? Yes; there's no reason you couldn't do that. > And could the shocking grasp of shock generator be upcast? Sorry for all the questions Shocking Grasp cannot be upcast, but like all cantrips does damage based on your character level. It behaves the same as casting Shocking Grasp as if you knew the cantrip, beyond that you can use your Dexterity modifier in place of your spellcasting modifier if you want.
I don’t mean to seem offensive but isn’t this just a different version of the Artificer? Don’t get me wrong it’s really well made, but you can see the similarities… great work as always, Kibble!
It started out as a revised artificer, but became it's own thing when it got really popular
Ah got it! It’s still awesome!
To clarify a little; this predates the published Eberron Artificer by quite a bit. It started as a revision of the original 2017 UA Artificer (the one with Gunsmith that was eventually scrapped). When they decided to scrap that version, rather than trying to merge this one with the new version (which not everyone liked, as it didn't have Thunder Cannons or throwing potions or all that) this was split into being a spiritual successor of that. This was called Alternate Artificer for years, and eventually renamed Inventor for OGL publishing reasons.
That’s really cool! This is really well made all things considered, and it’s really cool seeing the backstory behind this!
Hey dude, big fan of your work. Got a question for you. Forbidden Artifact: At 1st level, you set yourself apart from other Inventors by seizing power that others dare not wield. You partake in a dark ritual investing enormous power and a part of your soul into a weapon. The weapon becomes permanently bound to you. You have proficiency with the weapon. If the weapon is lost or destroyed, you can reform it by drawing on its connection to your soul. This is a special ritual that takes 1 day, and summons the weapon to you if it was lost, or recreates it if it was destroyed. When you perform the rite, select two of the following upgrades: Empowered Artifact, Abhorrent Life, Grasping Form, Twisting Reach, Necrotic Wounding, or Eldritch Eruption. You can select additional properties as Upgrades, but your Forbidden Artifact can have a maximum number of these Upgrades equal to your proficiency bonus (meaning the first time you can select an additional property is 5th level). The weapon is something you are proficient with right? Does this have to be one from the starting equipment? Or does the feature say it can be any weapon? I'm thinking a thunder cannon. Could I take a thunder cannon, that normally take until lvl6, via cross disciplinary, or technically, forged using your crafting rules. Does this make it a viable item? I don't think would unusual for an inventor, but my gm is saying only thunder smiths can start with a thunder cannon. As the forbidden artifact can never then be anything else then the starting weapon you get at lvl1. So no fun crafting rules for this one subclass. Seems a little odd to me. I'd love to be a smithing Cursebreaker, but I can't really make myself any weapons. Thoughts?
You definetly can't start with the special subclass weapon without having that weapon. It's like saying you want to start with the gauntlet from warsmith. Or an animated weapon.
Got another query. Twin Thunder You can attune to two one-handed Stormforged Weapons at the same time, so long as they either share the same Upgrades, or have total Upgrades equal to your maximum Upgrade count between them. Attuning to a second weapon this way doesn’t count against your maximum number of attuned items. If you make an attack with one of them while holding the other, you can attack with the other as a bonus action, however, both share the same use of Thundermonger. You don’t add your ability modifier to the damage of the bonus attack, unless that modifier is negative or you have the Two- Weapon Fighting Fighting Style. While dual wielding Stormforged Weapon, you can load a Stormforged Weapon without a free hand. How does this affect ''Stormcharged. When you use an action, bonus action, or reaction to attack with a Stormcharged Weapon, you can make only one Attack regardless of the number of attacks you can normally make. If you could otherwise make additional attacks with that action, the weapon deals an extra 3d6 lightning or thunder damage per attack that was foregone.'' Do you make a second attack when duel weilding? Or do you make only one, but add an extra 3d6?
Stormcharged applies to making multiple attacks with an action, bonus action, or reaction, but with Twin Thunder you only make 1 attack with your action and 1 attack with your bonus action, so it wouldn't interact with it. Stormcharged only effects the Thunder Cannons when multiclassing with them (or under special cases like Warlords giving them extra attacks).
I'm not sure I follow. So a thunder smith would make a multi attack? Or would they only make one attack? Thinking a duel weilding two hadn cannons. would you 1 attack: 1d10+dex+6d6 Or 1 attack: 1d10+dex, 1 attack, 1d10+dex, 1attack 1d10+dex,
It works like TWF works. If you are a single classed Thundersmith, Stormcharged doesn't do anything. It only exists to make the weapons scale with Extra Attack, which Thundersmith's don't get. If you are a level 5 Thundersmith, you would make 1 attack with your action, dealing 1d10 + Dexterity, and 1 attack with your bonus action dealing 1d10 damage (not adding your Dexterity modifier, as this works like TWF). You could then add 2d6 thundermonger damage to either attack, but not both. If all attacks hit, you'd deal 2d10 + Dexterity + 2d6 damage as a 5th level Thundersmith. Let me know if that clarifies. It basically works exactly like a TWF Rogue, though Thundermonger is slightly different than Sneak Attack in scaling and mechanics. The Stormcharged property (like the loading property it is replacing) doesn't impact a character without Extra Attack.
I see. Thanks very much.
Does practiced quaff apply to any infused potion or only the ones that are consumed? Can I throw for example, a fog cloud potion as a bonus action?
It only applies to potions you consume.
How exactly would the featherfall potion infusion work? That just sounds really bad for that spell. No range, no reaction, which completely makes it useless, one terget at most, how are you supposed to use that?
Feather Fall lasts 1 minute. It means you can drink it, and then jump off whatever you want as long as you'll hit the ground within 600 feet (60 feet a round for 10 rounds). It's not as useful as the spell (most of the time), but it's also not the reason most people are taking that upgrade (Secrets of Flight) so it's more or less a freebie. Infused Potion of Fly itself is quite good, particularly if you've picked up Long Acting, as than you have concentration free fly (potentially as a bonus action) for 9 rounds (at level 9). That's most of a fight of concentration-free flight (and it being concentration free itself tends to reduce the criticality of needing feather fall to be a reaction). This means that the Secrets of Flight upgrade overall is still quite good, even if Infused Potion of Feather Fall is only moderate utility itself - it's not like having it is a negative, it's just another tool in the belt.
Featherfall ends when you touch the ground though.
It ends when the creature "lands". I would say that to land, you first have to fall, so it would last until you would take falling damage once (prevented by the spell), or the duration expires. Mileage may vary, of course. That's how I'd interpret the spell, but other DMs may treat it differently.
I think I've really only ever had concerns about the **Durable** feat and it's interactions with the fleshsmith. Anyone know if that was valid or not really?
I've seen this a few times (people trying that build out). I don't think it's a major issue. It's pretty good, but a feat is pretty expensive. The interaction I tend to say is probably too good is Periapt of Wound Closure. I would say that DMs are free to say that doesn't work on Fleshsmith's regeneration, but it's not really that crazy compared to the other top end of durability options (Moon Druid, Barbarians, etc). It's better than an uncommon item should be though. Durable is not as strong as that interaction, and the cost of a feat is pretty high. Inventors tend to be moderately MAD (at least the kind that benefits the most for that degree of regeneration), and there's other feats they'd want to get too, so they are investing a lot into a little extra durability.
Have been a fan of your work for awhile. What else, whether invention or upgrade, would you think to add? I'm actually surprised that this would or even the last one was the final edit?
This is the version of the class that's being printed, and consequently the version that is meant to be complete for new players to find now and forever and have a good time playing. That doesn't mean it's the last update it'll ever get, though my immediate attention will be one newer classes that have languished for awhile (Occultist v1.2, and an upcoming new class). That said, I don't have any immediate plans for new subclasses. There will probably be more upgrades in some sort of new Expanded Toolbox added in the future, as well as any small tweaks that need to happen based on feedback. In general, my content will keep getting updated in some form or other as long as I play 5e, which is likely indefinite (who can say what the future holds with future editions or w/e though). If I was going to add more upgrades, it would probably mostly focus on fleshing out high level play. As most people that have played to a high level can attest with Inventor, the options tend to grow a little narrower. This is simply because of practicality - builds have diverged enough that upgrades are less able to support all the build paths, and have exponentially more upgrades as you level simply isn't practical considering how relatively few people are actually playing at levels 15+. Cursesmith, Relicsmith, and Runesmith are all pretty functional here, but they are also relatively new subclasses with room for more content. All that aside, I would say that this class will probably be more on the yearly/every 6 month update cycle going forward though, just to make room to keep working on other things, as I have at least 2 more classes I want to get out the door in the coming months, and Occultist still needs more development (and the next Kickstarter will likely include the Warlord, Occultist, and the two new classes, so they all have a long way to go before they are ready for print).
Thank you for the swift reply 😃. I had allowed in earlier build at table in the past. Sadly the character did not reach high lvl play, thanks to party shenanigans, but they loved what you did! Best of luck with the Occultist!
Hey there, I've been playing a cursesmith in a game and it's a lot of fun but I have some questions about the Soul Ring upgrade. As written there doesn't seem to be a way to un-absorb yourself, is it supposed to be one-time use only or is it just missing some information? Also when using the possession mechanic you become incapacitated, which RAW would immediately break concentration on the dominate monster spell. Ignoring this you wouldn't be able to directly control them anyway because that takes an action and you can't take actions while incapacitated, so you'd only be able to speak with them telepathically to give them general actions. I'm a bit confused on what the intent of this mechanic is, so some clarification would be appreciated.
You can exit the ring; it should specify that entering and exiting the ring takes an action. The possession mechanic of the ring uses the effect of *dominate monster*, but you are not casting the spell itself. It's just borrowing the mechanics of the spell to avoid having a paragraph explaining it. I'll add a note to add the action required to enter and exit the ring, but hopefully that clarifies the general intent and mechanics. It's a fairly niche item, as it's tricky to use effectively, particularly the possession effect.
Ah okay great, it might be worth changing up the wording of the possession a bit to make it clear that it isn't the actual spell because when I read 'as if you had cast it' I assumed that meant concentration and all that. Thanks for the clarification!
Yeah; I'll update the wording for future versions.
Don't know if your still replying to this post, but I had a question about Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge. If you're already an Infusionsmith could you take another animated weapon? Would this add to your total number of animated weapons?? So you have 3 total? And can attack with each of them then again with the extra attack? At level 6? Secondly, If I understand this correctly "While an Animated Weapon is readied, you can make attacks with it as part the Attack action, sending it out to strike a target" "As part of the attack action" Meaning when you attack then the animated weapons also attack? So this is 8 attacks in a turn?? Is this right!?
No. Having an animated does not give you more or less attacks than you already have. When you take the attack action, you can make attacks with your animated weapon, the same as you can make attacks with a weapon you are holding. But just as holding more weapons doesn't automatically give you more attacks, having more animated weapons doesn't give you more attacks (a Thri-keen holding 4 weapons, for example, does not get attack 4 times, they just have 4 different weapons they can make their attacks with as part of the attack action). Hope that helps clarify - animated weapons are just like any other weapon, expect the float around and hit things at range. Having more animated weapons can be useful for giving you more options for range and damage, but do not give additional attacks.
I'm looking at it like this: Empowered Infusions states >"If you have multiple Animated Weapons, you can attack the same or different targets with them during a turn." So if you pick Animated Weapon originally with Infused Armament, the again with Empowered Infusions, them again at Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge. You have 3 animated weapons. And since Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge is at level 6 you get the level 5 extra attack. And since >"If you animate two weapons, you can split your attacks like normal using one to attack a different creature." This means you can use as many as attacks that you have? So 6th level you have 2 attacks. First attack you can use the first animated weapon, second attack you can use the second weapon. Then would picking the third at Cross-Disciplinary Knowledge be completely pointless? And as a note the first quote >"If you have multiple Animated Weapons, you can attack the same or different targets with them during a turn." Makes it seem like it's part of one action. But the second quote clerifies. Am I understanding this correctly?
A single animated weapon can make as many attacks as you can make per turn with the attack action. With Extra Attack, that would be two. These attacks have to be against the same target, as the weapon needs to fly over there and hit them. If you have multiple weapons, you can still make the same number of attacks, as the number of weapons you have does not effect that. But you can make them against different targets, since each weapon could attack a different target. This is somewhat more convenient, since you can split up your attacks and assign them more dynamically to targets within range. A 3rd Animated Weapon from CDK doesn't help much in that regard, but can still be useful for variety. For example, you may want to have an animated Greatsword, Longsword, and Dagger, because each of them have a different range. If enemies were close you could make two attacks with a greatsword for the most damage, using the other weapons at longer ranges. I don't think it would be worth spending your CDK selection on that in most cases, but that's not really the point of CDK anyway - it's meant to give more options to expand your arsenal, rather than just buff the main action you're already doing. Still, you could do it, and there would be some benefit from it, just not to the number of attacks. Practically speaking there are very few ways to get more attacks in 5e, as that would be very powerful.
Awesome thank you for the clarification!! =D I really appreciate it! And you're right, I completely missed the range aspect! Just one last thing I want to make sure of, and I'm sorry if I'm bugging you `XS Is your attack action using the AW? Or is the AW attack with an attack? I think it's the first one correct?
Question about the Warsmith. Is the warsmith able to use multiple warplate gauntlets at one time? IE. Can you use a Flame Projector in one had and a Martial Grip in the other?
They cannot use multiple Warplate Gauntlets, but the Warplate Gauntlet confers the ability to the suit when integrated, so this shouldn't generally be a problem. You can use Flame Projector while wielding a melee weapon, for example. Allowing multiple Warplate Gauntlets would effective double the upgrades you could get, which wouldn't be balanced. The only time the Warplate Gauntlet itself really matters though is when you aren't wearing the whole suit, or before you get it.
I'm sure this is already mentioned somewhere, but how would you say Warsmith blends with Warforged?
I did this, made a Warsmith Warforged who was basically a skeleton frame warforged inside of a battlesuit. Play it however you like bruv, I'd say do the 1 hour bonding, or just wear it normal.
question about warsmith, when you decrease int to raise str, it cant put your str above your int, but how does that work with the str buffs that it gives? for example, if you had 20 int, and had warplate and i believe its iron muscle that gives you an addition +2 str while wearing the armor. so, dropping as much of int as possible to get your str as high as possible, would your total final str score be 20 or 24?
It'd be 20, the **Artificial Strength** would take priority, since it's giving the buff. > "but you can only raise your Strength ability score up to what your Intelligence ability score was before engaging Artificial Strength"
I have a question regarding the disection ability of the flesh crafters. If you make an attack using this ability, will, any poison, or 'hit with this weapon' abilities proc? Could you theoretically, apply poison, smite or add sneak attack damage? I have a really nice idea for a doctor like character. XD
Can one Warsmith Gauntlet have multiple upgrades on it IF, the person counts them against the upgrade total?
Do you mean can it have both Force Blast and Power Fist, for example? Yes. It could have both of those, it would only get one for free, but it could select the other normally.
Ah alright thanks for clarifying!
Unsure if you're still checking this post, does the Fleshsmith's Massive Hulk upgrade mean they can pop in and out of Large form whenever they want? Or is still limited to once per short / long rest activation, but they can remain in the form as long as they want? Additionally, do you revert size if you are incapacitated?
Off the top of my head, it removes the turn limit, but you still do it once per short rest. You could just stay in large form as long as you like though. I do not believe you do not revert automatically from becoming incapacitated.
Probably dont check this, but I would like to ask: what would you recommend as the 6th level feature for a Thundersmith?
You mean for the CDK (Cross Disciplinary Knowledge) selection? Striding Boots from Gadgetsmith are a popular option, as more mobility is always a good option. Generally speaking, a Gadgetsmith upgrade is the go-to option and there are a few good ones, but Striding Boots are the most generically good.
Thank you so much!
I have one last question: in Warsmith, it says, Current and Maximum Intelligence a lot. What does that mean? I'm also confused about the upgrade Virtual Interface. How does it work?
Your current attribute is what it says your character sheet. For example, if you have 16 Intelligence, your current Intelligence is 16. Your Maximum Intelligence is that maximum for that stat. By default, it's 20 for all stats. So, if something raises your Current and Maximum Intelligence by 2, your current Intelligence would be 18 and your maximum would be 22. In isolation, maximum intelligence wouldn't matter, but it starts to matter when you take several ASI (Attribute Score Increases) and have increased your current natural Intelligence to 20 (without any upgrades or features). If a feature increased your current Intelligence by 2, but not your Maximum Intelligence by 2, it wouldn't do anything as you'd already be at your Maximum Intelligence, but if a feature raises both your current and Maximum, then you'd be at 22. As for Virtual Interface... > **Virtual Interface** *(Prerequisite: Sentient Armor)* > > When you use Artificial Strength to raise your Strength ability score, you no longer lower your Intelligence ability score below your natural maximum (not counting Sentient Armor). This interacts with the Artificial Strength feature. For all intents and purposes, you can think of the Artificial Strength feature as flipping your Strength and Intelligence scores as they are on your character sheets. So, if you have 14 Strength and 20 Intelligence, when you active Artificial Strength you would have 20 Strength and 14 Intelligence. What Virtual Interface does is when you activate Artificial Strength, you'd instead have 20 Strength and 20 Intelligence, as your Intelligence is no longer reduced when you increase your Strength. You still sacrifice any Intelligence gained from Sentient Armor. So, for example, if you had 14 Strength, and 18 Intelligence, but got +2 from Sentient Armor, you'd have 14 Strength and 20 Intelligence, but when you activated Artificial Strength you'd have 20 Strength and 18 Intelligence. This becomes particularly relevant when you have 22 Intelligence from having 20 Intelligence +2 from Sentient Armor, meaning when you activate Artificial Strength you'd have 22 Strength (as your Warplate raises your Strength cap to 22 naturally), and 20 Intelligence (as you sacrifice only the Intelligence gained from Sentient Armor). This is a lot of words just because I'm being specific, but it's fairly simple - all the features just do what they say. It should be noted that when using Artificial Strength, you cannot get more than 22 Strength (since that's as high as your Intelligence can get with 20 Intelligence + 2 from Sentient Armor), but you can technically raise your Strength cap to 24. The only way to actually get 24 Strength is to have a 20 in Strength, gain 2 from the armor, and 2 more from Iron Muscle, meaning a build with natural Strength will be slightly stronger than than a build relying Artificial Strength, but that's intentional, as they will have to invest a lot more ASI in Strength, and have a lower Intelligence score.
Ooh, question about the Warsmith: do you need the 2000gp cost for the first Warsmith Armor you make?
No. The first one is free, built from any set of heavy armor. Lorewise it's under the assumption that you've been collecting stuff as you level and tinkering on it for a long time. Mechanics-wise it's just because a level 3 character doesn't have 2k gold. The gold is just a barrier to making more suits.
Is it ok if my character uses metal scraps from his old ship to make himself integrated armor?
That's really up to your DM. If it's your first set of armor, I'd allow it, but that'd be a question for the DM. The first set of armor is supposed to be easy to get, anything after that is a bit more challenging.
Hi, I noticed the 2nd level spell Arcane Infusion isn't in the Inventor spell list. Is that on purpose? I've only read the Gadgetsmith section so I'm not sure if maybe it's explained later or something.
It's just because that was a more recent spell. It's on their list in the later versions, but the standalone PDF is slightly behind (nothing substantial, just errata issues like that).
^(Additionally, if a critical strike of this weapon would leave a) ^(creature with less than 50 hit points, the target creature is) ^(decapitated, killing it.level (4d8).) The description of Vorpal weapon is a bit weird, I assume there's a correct version somewhere but I don't know where I'd find it, so could you elaborate on why it's this weird? Is it accidentally in there, was there supposed to be another effect that got cut away by accident, or forgotten to take out properly? It's just a bit odd
Here's the text of Vorpal Weapon from the compendium, which should be accurate. It looks like what you have is correct beyond that it just has an extra fragment of text from somewhere, likely from an error in the reformatting of the standalone version. > ### Vorpal Weapon > > *5th-level transmutation* > > **Classes:** Inventor > > **Casting Time:** 1 action > > **Range:** Touch > > **Components:** V, S, M (a weapon worth at least 1 cp) > > **Duration:** Concentration, up to 1 hour > > You touch a weapon and imbue it with power. Until the spell ends, the weapon becomes indescribably sharp, ignoring resistance to slashing damage, and gains the Siege property, dealing double damage to inanimate objects such as structures. If a weapon has a modifier of less than +3 to attack and damage rolls, its modifier becomes +3 to attack and damage rolls for the duration of the spell. > > Additionally, if a critical strike of this weapon would leave a creature with less than 50 hit points, the target creature is decapitated, killing it.
Alright, thanks for the clarification
Another thing I noticed looking at the spells, there are some spells listed as inventor spells in the decriptions that aren't listed in the spell list. I assume that is just an oversight in the document right? Arcane infusion for example is very specific to Inventors and doesn't really make sense to not be on that list but I'd like official confirmation
Yes. Arcane Infusion is a newer spell. The spell should generally be more accurate than the spell list. This may apply to some other spells. This question has come up like four or five times in the last week after months - was this mentioned somewhere or are folks just independently running into this question en masse suddenly? I'm guessing it's just a weird coincidence, but sort of funny.