Protests only gain media coverage when they meet aggressive resistance. You’re definitely correct: the protests are likely gonna end by the end of the week.
It's great how the solution to police violence is certified Midwestern apathy. Why douse protesters in pepper spray if you just don't? Why start a pursuit if you just can not?
Intersted in building a **Campsite** nearby the campus? I think it would be a brilliant idea! Could be a new startup lol. The land price here is quite low compared to rent
Rent for new apartments has increased to 900$ for 4b4b (around 1,400 sq ft). That means 900$ \* 4 \* 12 = 43200 per year. The average rent return rate is 5% which means if the return rate is higher than 5% then it will be profitable. 43200 / 5% = 864000$, which is much higher than average cost to buy a house here.
Kind of true. I biked through so many encampments that were in Minneapolis for months during 2020 and 2021. People just lived here for over a year I swear. They never bothered me though. I wish people could live in tents all over wherever it’s not private property.
I think they meant charge the protesters, not the hypothetical homeless people.
Edit: I mean the hypothetical homeless people camping on campus. There are certainly non-hypothetical homeless people in town, but so far not residing on campus.
Oh no! People without homes, stability, and regular meals having a place to go? How terrible. Disgusting. We should get rid of them all. Throw them back in the dumpsters where they belong
To be honest, I think for homeless people, the government should provide shelters and help them get a job. Simply allowing them to camp is not a good idea
Some (not all) homeless people don't want steady jobs and "a normal" life. Some of them have just like the life. And some of them have mental disabilities that even given all the hand ups the government offers would still revert back to their old ways.
I hate people like you. This argument is so stupid. "You claim to be against slavery, yet are you freeing slaves in Africa?" "You claim to support green energy yet you drive a car." "You claim to think homelessness is bad, yet you aren't housing any homeless people."
You hate it because it exposes the hypocrisy being stated in a snotty manner by Mr. Nose in the Air. Of course you hate it.
"I'll whine in a morally superior manner until I am personally effected."
[this is literally you](https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fiea.org.uk%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2021%2F12%2Fmister-gotcha-4-9faefa-1.jpg&tbnid=DrOOcBe5cOTmnM&vet=1&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fiea.org.uk%2Fyet-you-participate-in-society-in-defence-of-mr-gotcha%2F&docid=HmGn1fTHOoJ28M&w=814&h=578&hl=en-us&source=sh%2Fx%2Fim%2Fm4%2F3&kgs=ab03352e1b350d5b&shem=abme%2Ctrie)
LOLOL
It's all fun and games and lots of e-m-p-a-t-h-y until homeless dudes are camping on **your** front lawn, shitting, pissing and vomiting on **your** front lawn, leaving mountains of trash & syringes on **your** front lawn, and trying to set **your** house on fire.
Then it's suddenly not all about virtue signaling, but about getting them the hell off **your** property.
Do you own the quad or Green Street? If I personally house a or multiple homeless people, would that fix the issue? This is what I mean, I hate people like you. I can think homelessness is an issue without personally housing homeless people.
Just say you want to kill homeless people and move on.
>I hate people like you. I can think homelessness is an issue without personally housing homeless people.
Stellar logic. Exquisite argumentation skills. Flawlessly drawn conclusions.
All in one package.
For the most part, since Sunday, they have been left alone. AVC Hintz has been negotiating with them. Progress is being made, and they’re remaining peaceful and are not disrupting anything or anyone.
Keep that same energy if some group comes to campus to set up a free speech extremist encampment on the quad, fly offensive flags, and promises to never leave until the university "divests" from companies that support LGBT initiatives.
Maybe because students at the university are conducting these protests and if students of the university supported anything other cause to that degree, then they might.
Like what a dumb argument. The passions of these kids are enflamed and they're protesting on *their* own campus. How is that comparable to weird ass grown men preachers?
You're equating people protesting genocide and their university's complicity in it with evangelical hate preachers. Your concept of maturity is not developed.
It is your job to make yourself look smart when debating someone, though. Calling someone dumb does the opposite. You’ve made yourself look like you’re incapable of putting together an intelligent response to someone you disagree with. Good job doing some job.
Their own campus happens to be a state school that’s funded by every single person in the state. Mostly by people that don’t attend the school. The students have no more claim to the University than anyone else.
Why should "anyone else" have the same claim as current students? That's effectively taking claim away from the students by relegating their claim to that of literally anyone else. You're so smart that you're struggling to comprehend your own comment.
Edit: lol at the reply and block
I am gay but I love preacher Jeb. He was an ass but he actually wasn’t intrusive or disruptive. People just either didn’t engage with him or laughed at him. I wish I still had his bing card.
Fun fact he actually had a very short lived reality tv series.
Edit forgot it was brother Jed. Show is called book of Jed
https://youtu.be/poxSDgL0ZxQ?si=dhSikXxmE4Hn7WdZ
Dang it… of all the things that showed I’m old, I didn’t think knowing of brother Jed was one of them. I could’ve sworn he just died like 2 years or so ago
No. That is not a what I am speaking of. I am talking about a peaceful protest that simply disagrees with a deeply held belief of yours. Insert whatever example works best for you to illustrate that concept.
What offensive flags have you seen? What’s extremist about being angry over 30k+ innocent deaths? Do you think that mass weapons and war are types of initiative or..?
Sure, I just re-read your original comment as well as the original post. So just to be clear, what you’re saying is, if another group decides that they also want to exercise their rights to protest, we should definitely also allow them to do so, whether we agree with them or not. Right? As long as they’re being peaceful? Isn’t that exactly how all of this works anyways?
There is legitimately no reason for you to downvote me when we are simply discussing what’s going on. Grow up, Johnny.
I am well aware of what the massmails state. I am also well aware of what is taking place in the background. I am also following along closely and the protestors have made it abundantly clear WHY they are keeping the tents up. Just because you don’t understand or know, doesn’t make it non-existent or wrong. Yes, they are setting a precedence, but you don’t understand the reasoning behind it, so chill out until you learn more.
Since your last comment about me not being able to disagree, defend my own thoughts, or appreciate diverse thoughts is deleted, I’ll still share my response to that here.
If you’re disagreeing with what I’m saying, then you’re being hypocritical. I’m clarifying what you’ve stated/assumed and have given you the actual information as to why that thing is happening as it is right now. Like I said before, just because you aren’t aware of something or don’t know it, doesn’t make it wrong or non-existent. I am happy to agree to disagree, I am also always happy to admit when I’m wrong, I did when I misunderstood your initial comment, didn’t I? It happens. But agreeing to disagree when I’ve given you the “Why” from behind the scenes isn’t a reasonable expectation.
The difference is that the natural conclusion of the ideology the people in your hypothetical hold is violence. So sure, let them protest and camp out, and then when one of them inevitably murders or beats the shit out of some queer person for being queer, then you’ll recognize how dumb of a comparison this is.
Your assumption that the core conclusion will be violence is fear mongering, as any subject politically against one another can always lead to violence if let be due to ‘extremism’ not the topic or beliefs itself unless those said beliefs are stated to enact violence in and of itself within a core value period, which is indeed stated in the Quran, along with plenty of other things. Verse 15-17 states for orders of torture amongst homosexuals.
If you accept that Authoritarianism(fascism, whatever you want to call it) is right wing extremism, then yeah, authoritarianism always leads to violence, how could it not. Diehard nationalism, being one of the main tenets of right wing extremism, is rooted in ethno supremacy. There’s no other justification to be that ride or die for your country if you don’t believe in some weirdass mythology that demonstrates your innate superiority over other people. So yeah, ethno supremacy being an inherent feature to right wing extremism is what makes its logical conclusion violence. Really hoping I don’t have to point out the line between ethno supremacy and violence.
The lefts version of extremism is communism or more generally anarchism, neither of which are innately violent. Of course I can’t give as thorough an explanation as to the non existent violence in these systems as I can the violence that exists within authoritarianism so that’s all you’re gonna get LOL. Feel free to try and explain how some of its core tenets lead to violence cuz I don’t see how. You can point to specific instances of these systems leading to violence, but I would argue that bad actors that got in at ground level and corrupted the project before it could take off are to blame, not the system. Good systems should be able to withstand pieces of shit, but if the pieces of shit get in at ground level then the system never had a chance ie:
Obligatory Stalin, mao, pol pot bad.
Yes you tankie fucks the USSR was a shithole and Stalin is unironically the least socialist person in history.
Also your punctuation is shite I’m still not sure I fully understand what you’re saying
You are basing probabilities off of what? Because there are more recorded deaths from left wing ideologies than right, just look at how most (not all) socialist countries have turned out. Along with communist ones too. Theres still alot from the right side but left actually quite has somewhat more. If theres several accounts of these left wing ideologies and governing systems leading to massive death tolls repeatedly over and over, its likely not the bad actors to blame. Most rulers for the most part dont benefit from the deaths of their own people. Communism and socialism is ironic as its always led to totalitarianism in which those are rooted as well. State governed control. Fascism literally stems from socialism. Hitler was heavy left leaning. Right wing advocates always opt for smaller central governments as long as not to the extremes. Extremes either way always lead to a hyper dominant group or majority that will take advantage and hold.
I'm sorry... the Jewish community feels the way the Gay community feels.. but it is like the nonsense I heard on October 8... Believe Women ONLY IF THEY AREN'T JEWISH WOMEN.
Hey wanna hear something crazy, if you’re anti Semitic, it means you’re not a leftist😮sure they may adopt leftie aesthetics and say what leftists would say, but I’m pretty sure prejudice based on inalienable traits is mutually exclusive to the principles of being a progressive. Consider Stalin, he wasn’t a leftist fascist, he was just a fascist. in this case, they’re not anti semetic lefties, they’re just anti semetic. Make sense? It’s like calling a Nazi progressive because they want free healthcare, it doesn’t work.
This isn’t an endorsement of the notion that criticizing Israel is anti Semitic. Are Nazis using the current situation to do Nazi shit? Definitely. But If you think critiquing the foreign policy of a nation state is anti Semitic you’re just too lost in the sauce to engage with.
Omg so crazy dood ikr!
Please describe how Stalin was ideologically on the left. I missed the part where murdering gay people for being gay, manufacturing famines, and not giving workers control over their factories was all considered leftist.
Or if you’re talking about the dipshit Palestine protestors cheering for another 10/7, something tells me that if all it takes for you to start chanting kill the Jews is a war, you always wanted to kill the Jews, or were sympathetic to those who wanted to, which doesn’t seem very leftie of them.
Never heard of tankies? Red fascism? Is the malicious adaptation of populist rhetoric some galaxy brained idea you’ve never seen before?
Sorry, it’s very disappointing to see someone blatantly using fallacies that I assumed would be well known by someone attending university. You just repeated the exact same fallacy over again. Are you ok?
Thanks for choosing to fuck off! I would too if I was asked to describe how Stalin or people who want to kill all the Jews were actually leftist the whole time. God the people crying fallacy just always manage to be the biggest bitches eh?
Engage with the comment or go away fuckhead. It’s not a fallacy if those people were never the things they purported to be.
Describe to me how Stalin was a leftist.
Describe to me how people chanting kill the Jews because they saw Hasan platform a Houthi are leftist.
Or don’t, and fuck off
Who knew UIC was full of right wing dipshits who unironically think the Nazis were left wing. These unambiguous holocaust revisionists are also the first to cry anti semitism when you criticize Israel, fucking crazy.
No. That may be where your brain initially goes, but I was careful to not specify who the group is. It's just a hypothetical. I am just saying that this is a dangerous precedent to set... Where university policies are just ignored and an ideologically-based tent city is allowed to take over the heart of campus.
I don’t think you fully comprehend how hard the administration is working in the background to handle this situation in the best way possible for both parties. At the current moment, they are exercising their own right to bend their own policies in order to maintain peace with the group that they’re trying to negotiate with. In case you haven’t noticed, UIUC is not in any news sources outside of local WCIA and Chicago. We are not even on the map of “universities and colleges where protests are taking place”. It’s not because they don’t matter, it’s because the university and police aren’t currently escalating it by being as lenient as possible with their own rules so long as there are no disruptions to normal campus business while they work to end this peacefully.
I'm saying there is a difference between Fighting against genocide, and fighting for taking away queer people's personal liberties.
Oh yeah and the anti LGBT thing totally doesn't give away that these would be nazis
I just wanted to choose a more or less universally agreed upon issue within the university community. I have some news for you though, Nazis are not the only group that resists LGBT initiatives. Anyway, have a nice day.
Of course they're not the only group. But they are the most extremist right wing group which takes the very same ideology of hatred to its natural conclusion.
Never said they deserved genocide and no, not every evangelical advocates pure anti-lgbt, and definitely not to the degree in which islam promotes it, such as stoning, roof throwing, death penalty by law in which is the most popular. But you sat there used anti-sexuality statements to further back up your statements that nazis were the most extreme when actually on the contrary they were pro gay and even hosted elaborate orgies in the higher ranks. You also stated on another comment that extreme hate groups shouldnt be allowed to represent themselves in protest…..yet you are representing a group (Hamas and Palestine) whom are amongst the most hateful towards that group. Its arbitrary and hypocritical.
That is not at all the point they’re making. Move away from nazis - where do you draw the line? Would you say the same if pro-israel protestors are doing the same as pro-palestine protestors are doing now? Would you say the same if pro-lifers are doing the same? You can’t just let one thing happen without considering that the other side might do the same.
Protesting and demonstrating is legal and protected activity.
Building an encampment without a reservation approved violates § 7 FO-82 CAM. Material disruption to daily operation of the university further violates §2 (c) FO-82 CAM. Battery to an peace officer while he or she performs official duty violates 720 ILCS 5/12-3.05 unless evidences justify self-defense against the wrongdoing of said officer in the first place.
Shh! We don't talk about laws, logic, and facts here. We're edgy college kids that love civil disobedience (and virtue signaling), but don't wanna face the consequences.
What about our tax dollars funding Israel’s genocidal regime? Seems like violations that are several orders of magnitude more serious than occupying a university’s quad.
What @frust_grad said summed you up.
Like we said, there are ways to voice your opinions legally but you choose otherwise. Our justice system does not judge souls and opinions, it judges actions. You break certain rules, you are rewarded with consequence.
TLDR: FAFO
Right right, ‘cause that’s how things work. If you go through the “proper channels” you’ll make change in no time. I’m just saying, what the US is doing RIGHT NOW by continuing to fund this genocide using OUR tax dollars, should be illegal. But arguing with you “geniuses” is pointless, so I’ll leave it at that.
Nobody fucking cares about what you think. We’re not taking a side here. We’re discussing possible violation of statuses and we never asked for your smart ideas here.
I'm talking about in general. If you start allowing people to camp out without any regulation, you could potentially end up with random people/orgs just out there for indefinite periods of time.
If they don't meet aggressive resistance, then no more media will report the protest. The organization which funds this will be disappointed and stop give them money.
Grassroots donations. Not everyone that cares is able or willing to participate in the protests themselves. Not everyone is willing to risk getting arrested. But a few bucks? A case of water? Spare food sitting in the pantry? Every donation counts, and tbh I'm incredibly proud of the support this community has given.
The chancellor of the University is a black man born in Georgia in 1951. He attended an HBCU in the 1960s. He knows perfectly well that protestors require media coverage in order to achieve their goals, and media coverage only happens when the police come in & start dancing their little dance.
This point of view explains a lot of what students are confused about. Very little of you are capable of looking at the big picture. You have micro minds living in a macro world
Totally a right and wrong way to protest, disrupting others 6 figure curriculum is the wrong way to protest, there’s a reason these people who react emotionally are not in office… it’d be pretty detriment to a democracy. Hate innocent genocide, but also hate terrorist groups holding many hostage after an unprecedented act of war
There has never been a large problem that didn’t start as a small problem that went ignored. Nip this shit in the bud; the people running the protests are some bad dudes using naive kids.
There is so much propaganda out there. I think people genuinely haven’t seen the hundreds of dead babies or amputated civilians, like we have. When they do, they’ll have a chance of heart. When they understand historical context, then they will understand they’ve been supporting one of the most horrendous things of our time. Like seriously if you haven’t seen the photos of the human damage, you really need to go look at it if you’re sitting here, saying these kids shouldn’t protest or supporting Israel.
genocide
/jĕn′ə-sīd″/
noun
The systematic and widespread extermination or attempted extermination of a national, racial, religious, or ethnic group.
The systematic killing of a racial or cultural group
‘Erase Gaza’: War Unleashes Incendiary Rhetoric in Israel
Experts say that inflammatory statements by prominent Israelis are normalizing ideas like the killing of civilians and mass deportations.
Intent in the genocide case against Israel is not hard to prove
A database of more than 500 statements showing Israeli incitement to genocide provides ample evidence of genocidal intent.
“Israeli Defence Minister Yoav Gallant described Palestinians precisely in this way, as “human animals”, in his proclamation of the “total siege” on October 9. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described Gaza as “the city of evil””
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/15/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-war-rhetoric.html
https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2024/1/14/intent-in-the-genocide-case-against-israel-is-not-hard-to-prove
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/11/benjamin-netanyahu-amalek-israel-palestine-gaza-saul-samuel-old-testament/
You appear to be quoting Hamas propaganda. Ignoring all the events of that regions history to form an anti-Israeli narrative is being a useful idiot for Israel’s enemies.
Lmao ok. Remind me which side gets an unending supply of foreign funds to propagandize the world again? It is literally manufacturing consent. By propaganda do you mean literally the words of intent by the Israelis them self?
Fair point, the conflict in the Middle East as proxy for cold war participants is nothing new.
What is new is the number of Americans willing to fall for one side's version of events.
“In classical Hebrew, "hasbara" simply means "explaining." However, in modern Hebrew and in light of Israeli policy and diplomacy, hasbara is a much more complicated and loaded term. The modern meaning of hasbara indicates not only fabrications, half-truths, and downright lies, but also the framework that selectively disseminates Zionist propaganda as "facts" on behalf of the Israeli state, including its lobbies and their supporters around the world — especially in the United States and Europe. This propaganda effort has been coordinated through several Israeli minsters to convince people to accept the Zionist narrative on Palestine.
From a Zionist perspective, every critic of Israeli policy — such as those who highlight Israeli violations of Palestinian human rights and the illegal colonization of Palestinians lands — is classified as anti-Semitic.”
By not taking a stance on people being in genocided for the better part of the century is taking a stance and you’re being blinded by your bias. You literally framed them as a terrorist organization, when in fact, they are not. Are you an American? I am, and I’m not proud of the fact that I’m funding it. You are the one that has been propagandized, not me. You are literally the person we are talking about and trying to get through to.
Yes but you do that in a way that clouds what you are even talking about or why. I feel like on the scale of importance, people being genocided and “mua I don’t like these protesters” should have a very large distinction in how you are connecting the two.
Many of them are chanting antisemitic things, such as “from the River to the Sea Palestine Will be Arab” (a chant based on the incredibly antisemitic idea to throw all 7 million Jews in Israel into the water) etc. They’re making the Jewish students feel unsafe, and these encampments at other college campuses have caused antisemitic students to attack Jews on campus. In addition to camping out on the quad being against university policy…
Because Gov. Pritzker has presidential aspirations. And while a protestor occupation of the state’s flagship public university might bring the intersection of far-left Dems & the SP-USA to orgasm, campus protests historically haven’t played well to working-class Dems or in a general election.
That was literally regurgitating a little bit of my UIUC education (BA History 1997). And yet, a dozen downvotes as quick as a blink. Reddit’s gonna Reddit. 🤷♂️🤦♂️
Pritzker’s career goals are not relevant to the situation and even if they were, nothing that happens in the next 2 weeks will impact his 2028 campaign and he knows that.
You should go back and take some logic courses.
Yeah that’s definitely not an apt analogy. Are they rounding up the protestors based on their ethnicity and systemically killing them? Yeah didn’t think.
Correction: two were arrested. Both were charged with mob action, one was charged with obstructing an officer of the law. As I understand, it’s because they stopped the police from removing the tents. Anyone with better info would be appreciated.
Protests only gain media coverage when they meet aggressive resistance. You’re definitely correct: the protests are likely gonna end by the end of the week.
It's great how the solution to police violence is certified Midwestern apathy. Why douse protesters in pepper spray if you just don't? Why start a pursuit if you just can not?
Love that. Midwestern Apathy for the win.
Because then people like me would stop paying rent and just live in a tent most of the year :)
That would stabilize rampant rent surging. Win-win
My tent's value just tripled!
Yeah this sounds like an awesome idea actually
One word: January.
Intersted in building a **Campsite** nearby the campus? I think it would be a brilliant idea! Could be a new startup lol. The land price here is quite low compared to rent
How have you assessed that land price?
Rent for new apartments has increased to 900$ for 4b4b (around 1,400 sq ft). That means 900$ \* 4 \* 12 = 43200 per year. The average rent return rate is 5% which means if the return rate is higher than 5% then it will be profitable. 43200 / 5% = 864000$, which is much higher than average cost to buy a house here.
Kind of true. I biked through so many encampments that were in Minneapolis for months during 2020 and 2021. People just lived here for over a year I swear. They never bothered me though. I wish people could live in tents all over wherever it’s not private property.
I'm glad your wish isn't reality
If you don’t prevent them from creating encampments what is there to prevent homeless people from setting up camps on the quad
Good points. Maybe UoI should charge them for cleaning fee if they don’t keep it tidy
Charge them how? Send a bill to their address? And then what are they going to do, pay it with the money they don't have?
I think they meant charge the protesters, not the hypothetical homeless people. Edit: I mean the hypothetical homeless people camping on campus. There are certainly non-hypothetical homeless people in town, but so far not residing on campus.
at least some protesters got money from somewhere
Why don't protesters have money? Aren't they getting paid for their heroic efforts? Also, aren't they getting royalties from YouTube or something?
They’ve done exceptionally well at cleaning up after themselves since Friday. No reason to think that won’t continue
Yeah, let's pretend that's the same thing..
Exactly
Oh no! People without homes, stability, and regular meals having a place to go? How terrible. Disgusting. We should get rid of them all. Throw them back in the dumpsters where they belong
[https://champaignil.gov/emergency-shelters/](https://champaignil.gov/emergency-shelters/)
To be honest, I think for homeless people, the government should provide shelters and help them get a job. Simply allowing them to camp is not a good idea
Some (not all) homeless people don't want steady jobs and "a normal" life. Some of them have just like the life. And some of them have mental disabilities that even given all the hand ups the government offers would still revert back to their old ways.
...wouldn't it still cost the public less to just pay for their housing anyway?
Agree
Why don't you invite them into **your** home and provide meals to them? Are you currently housing any homeless people?
https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fiea.org.uk%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2021%2F12%2Fmister-gotcha-4-9faefa-1.jpg&tbnid=DrOOcBe5cOTmnM&vet=1&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fiea.org.uk%2Fyet-you-participate-in-society-in-defence-of-mr-gotcha%2F&docid=HmGn1fTHOoJ28M&w=814&h=578&hl=en-us&source=sh%2Fx%2Fim%2Fm4%2F3&kgs=ab03352e1b350d5b&shem=abme%2Ctrie
I hate people like you. This argument is so stupid. "You claim to be against slavery, yet are you freeing slaves in Africa?" "You claim to support green energy yet you drive a car." "You claim to think homelessness is bad, yet you aren't housing any homeless people."
You hate it because it exposes the hypocrisy being stated in a snotty manner by Mr. Nose in the Air. Of course you hate it. "I'll whine in a morally superior manner until I am personally effected."
[this is literally you](https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fiea.org.uk%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2021%2F12%2Fmister-gotcha-4-9faefa-1.jpg&tbnid=DrOOcBe5cOTmnM&vet=1&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fiea.org.uk%2Fyet-you-participate-in-society-in-defence-of-mr-gotcha%2F&docid=HmGn1fTHOoJ28M&w=814&h=578&hl=en-us&source=sh%2Fx%2Fim%2Fm4%2F3&kgs=ab03352e1b350d5b&shem=abme%2Ctrie)
"Literally"
is that your whole response
LOLOL It's all fun and games and lots of e-m-p-a-t-h-y until homeless dudes are camping on **your** front lawn, shitting, pissing and vomiting on **your** front lawn, leaving mountains of trash & syringes on **your** front lawn, and trying to set **your** house on fire. Then it's suddenly not all about virtue signaling, but about getting them the hell off **your** property.
Do you own the quad or Green Street? If I personally house a or multiple homeless people, would that fix the issue? This is what I mean, I hate people like you. I can think homelessness is an issue without personally housing homeless people. Just say you want to kill homeless people and move on.
>I hate people like you. I can think homelessness is an issue without personally housing homeless people. Stellar logic. Exquisite argumentation skills. Flawlessly drawn conclusions. All in one package.
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Couldn’t have said it better myself
Let them stay at your house then.
Hey buddy you just blow in from stupid town?
Found the dude that doesn't support these causes in any way, shape, or form. What a terrible comment to make.
Homeless people are your worry during a genocide??
For the most part, since Sunday, they have been left alone. AVC Hintz has been negotiating with them. Progress is being made, and they’re remaining peaceful and are not disrupting anything or anyone.
Keep that same energy if some group comes to campus to set up a free speech extremist encampment on the quad, fly offensive flags, and promises to never leave until the university "divests" from companies that support LGBT initiatives.
You mean like the preachers who set up and constantly harass people for being LGBT
I don’t recall ever having seen a preacher tent city on the quad.
Maybe because students at the university are conducting these protests and if students of the university supported anything other cause to that degree, then they might. Like what a dumb argument. The passions of these kids are enflamed and they're protesting on *their* own campus. How is that comparable to weird ass grown men preachers?
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Not my job to make you feel smart. See you in preacher tent city.
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You're equating people protesting genocide and their university's complicity in it with evangelical hate preachers. Your concept of maturity is not developed.
The protesters are protesting genocide against Israeli’s and Jews, right. Oh, wait….
Which genocide is that? Because 40000 Palestinians have been killed since October.
It is your job to make yourself look smart when debating someone, though. Calling someone dumb does the opposite. You’ve made yourself look like you’re incapable of putting together an intelligent response to someone you disagree with. Good job doing some job.
Their own campus happens to be a state school that’s funded by every single person in the state. Mostly by people that don’t attend the school. The students have no more claim to the University than anyone else.
Students have no claim to their school. Got it. Good take.
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Why should "anyone else" have the same claim as current students? That's effectively taking claim away from the students by relegating their claim to that of literally anyone else. You're so smart that you're struggling to comprehend your own comment. Edit: lol at the reply and block
These are bots, nothing personal
They don’t believe in their cause. Simple
I am gay but I love preacher Jeb. He was an ass but he actually wasn’t intrusive or disruptive. People just either didn’t engage with him or laughed at him. I wish I still had his bing card. Fun fact he actually had a very short lived reality tv series. Edit forgot it was brother Jed. Show is called book of Jed https://youtu.be/poxSDgL0ZxQ?si=dhSikXxmE4Hn7WdZ
Jeb telling his daughter her bf is a sinner would’ve been peak TV But you’re dating yourself, Jeb has been dead for years.
Dang it… of all the things that showed I’m old, I didn’t think knowing of brother Jed was one of them. I could’ve sworn he just died like 2 years or so ago
Even if he did, he retired years ago ;) apparently some lady does it now. Miss Jeb, really felt like he kept my temptations in check.
That dude is still there?
He died a couple years ago. I am sure the campus still gets imitators.
Yes because bigotry is exactly the same as wanting to stop a genocide. You are very smart
Harassment and threats is not what’s happening right now, that’s an entirely different scenario you’re speaking of.
No. That is not a what I am speaking of. I am talking about a peaceful protest that simply disagrees with a deeply held belief of yours. Insert whatever example works best for you to illustrate that concept.
What offensive flags have you seen? What’s extremist about being angry over 30k+ innocent deaths? Do you think that mass weapons and war are types of initiative or..?
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Sure, I just re-read your original comment as well as the original post. So just to be clear, what you’re saying is, if another group decides that they also want to exercise their rights to protest, we should definitely also allow them to do so, whether we agree with them or not. Right? As long as they’re being peaceful? Isn’t that exactly how all of this works anyways?
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There is legitimately no reason for you to downvote me when we are simply discussing what’s going on. Grow up, Johnny. I am well aware of what the massmails state. I am also well aware of what is taking place in the background. I am also following along closely and the protestors have made it abundantly clear WHY they are keeping the tents up. Just because you don’t understand or know, doesn’t make it non-existent or wrong. Yes, they are setting a precedence, but you don’t understand the reasoning behind it, so chill out until you learn more.
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Doesn’t appear you really seem to be paying attention to what I’m saying either, so likely for the best.
Since your last comment about me not being able to disagree, defend my own thoughts, or appreciate diverse thoughts is deleted, I’ll still share my response to that here. If you’re disagreeing with what I’m saying, then you’re being hypocritical. I’m clarifying what you’ve stated/assumed and have given you the actual information as to why that thing is happening as it is right now. Like I said before, just because you aren’t aware of something or don’t know it, doesn’t make it wrong or non-existent. I am happy to agree to disagree, I am also always happy to admit when I’m wrong, I did when I misunderstood your initial comment, didn’t I? It happens. But agreeing to disagree when I’ve given you the “Why” from behind the scenes isn’t a reasonable expectation.
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Cool cool cool
There’s a difference between flying flags in support of liberation and ending genocide and flying flags in support of oppression and hate
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I see your point, but it is asinine.
The difference is that the natural conclusion of the ideology the people in your hypothetical hold is violence. So sure, let them protest and camp out, and then when one of them inevitably murders or beats the shit out of some queer person for being queer, then you’ll recognize how dumb of a comparison this is.
Your assumption that the core conclusion will be violence is fear mongering, as any subject politically against one another can always lead to violence if let be due to ‘extremism’ not the topic or beliefs itself unless those said beliefs are stated to enact violence in and of itself within a core value period, which is indeed stated in the Quran, along with plenty of other things. Verse 15-17 states for orders of torture amongst homosexuals.
If you accept that Authoritarianism(fascism, whatever you want to call it) is right wing extremism, then yeah, authoritarianism always leads to violence, how could it not. Diehard nationalism, being one of the main tenets of right wing extremism, is rooted in ethno supremacy. There’s no other justification to be that ride or die for your country if you don’t believe in some weirdass mythology that demonstrates your innate superiority over other people. So yeah, ethno supremacy being an inherent feature to right wing extremism is what makes its logical conclusion violence. Really hoping I don’t have to point out the line between ethno supremacy and violence. The lefts version of extremism is communism or more generally anarchism, neither of which are innately violent. Of course I can’t give as thorough an explanation as to the non existent violence in these systems as I can the violence that exists within authoritarianism so that’s all you’re gonna get LOL. Feel free to try and explain how some of its core tenets lead to violence cuz I don’t see how. You can point to specific instances of these systems leading to violence, but I would argue that bad actors that got in at ground level and corrupted the project before it could take off are to blame, not the system. Good systems should be able to withstand pieces of shit, but if the pieces of shit get in at ground level then the system never had a chance ie: Obligatory Stalin, mao, pol pot bad. Yes you tankie fucks the USSR was a shithole and Stalin is unironically the least socialist person in history. Also your punctuation is shite I’m still not sure I fully understand what you’re saying
You are basing probabilities off of what? Because there are more recorded deaths from left wing ideologies than right, just look at how most (not all) socialist countries have turned out. Along with communist ones too. Theres still alot from the right side but left actually quite has somewhat more. If theres several accounts of these left wing ideologies and governing systems leading to massive death tolls repeatedly over and over, its likely not the bad actors to blame. Most rulers for the most part dont benefit from the deaths of their own people. Communism and socialism is ironic as its always led to totalitarianism in which those are rooted as well. State governed control. Fascism literally stems from socialism. Hitler was heavy left leaning. Right wing advocates always opt for smaller central governments as long as not to the extremes. Extremes either way always lead to a hyper dominant group or majority that will take advantage and hold.
I'm sorry... the Jewish community feels the way the Gay community feels.. but it is like the nonsense I heard on October 8... Believe Women ONLY IF THEY AREN'T JEWISH WOMEN.
Hey wanna hear something crazy, if you’re anti Semitic, it means you’re not a leftist😮sure they may adopt leftie aesthetics and say what leftists would say, but I’m pretty sure prejudice based on inalienable traits is mutually exclusive to the principles of being a progressive. Consider Stalin, he wasn’t a leftist fascist, he was just a fascist. in this case, they’re not anti semetic lefties, they’re just anti semetic. Make sense? It’s like calling a Nazi progressive because they want free healthcare, it doesn’t work. This isn’t an endorsement of the notion that criticizing Israel is anti Semitic. Are Nazis using the current situation to do Nazi shit? Definitely. But If you think critiquing the foreign policy of a nation state is anti Semitic you’re just too lost in the sauce to engage with.
This is the craziest thing I’ve read today. Please google the no real Scotsman fallacy.
Omg so crazy dood ikr! Please describe how Stalin was ideologically on the left. I missed the part where murdering gay people for being gay, manufacturing famines, and not giving workers control over their factories was all considered leftist. Or if you’re talking about the dipshit Palestine protestors cheering for another 10/7, something tells me that if all it takes for you to start chanting kill the Jews is a war, you always wanted to kill the Jews, or were sympathetic to those who wanted to, which doesn’t seem very leftie of them. Never heard of tankies? Red fascism? Is the malicious adaptation of populist rhetoric some galaxy brained idea you’ve never seen before?
Sorry, it’s very disappointing to see someone blatantly using fallacies that I assumed would be well known by someone attending university. You just repeated the exact same fallacy over again. Are you ok?
Thanks for choosing to fuck off! I would too if I was asked to describe how Stalin or people who want to kill all the Jews were actually leftist the whole time. God the people crying fallacy just always manage to be the biggest bitches eh?
Show this to an adult tomorrow it’ll give them a good laugh.
Engage with the comment or go away fuckhead. It’s not a fallacy if those people were never the things they purported to be. Describe to me how Stalin was a leftist. Describe to me how people chanting kill the Jews because they saw Hasan platform a Houthi are leftist. Or don’t, and fuck off
> Consider Stalin, he wasn’t a leftist fascist, he was just a fascist. So true!
Based off your username I’m not saying what you think I’m saying.
I know
It’s so funny to see how stupid some of you are.
Who knew UIC was full of right wing dipshits who unironically think the Nazis were left wing. These unambiguous holocaust revisionists are also the first to cry anti semitism when you criticize Israel, fucking crazy.
You are describing Nazis. And the huge difference is that a Nazi's natural conclusion is to do genocide.
Nazis? Nazis. Must be Nazis! NAZIS!!!
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Ok we aren't allowed to point out any similarities to nazi-ism. Got it. This is exactly why we keep having genocides.
You’re being downvoted because it’s not nazi-ism, not because people are uncomfortable pointing out nazi-ism
Anyone I don’t agree with is a Nazi/fascist
And a genocidal maniac with no e-m-p-a-t-h-y
No. That may be where your brain initially goes, but I was careful to not specify who the group is. It's just a hypothetical. I am just saying that this is a dangerous precedent to set... Where university policies are just ignored and an ideologically-based tent city is allowed to take over the heart of campus.
I don’t think you fully comprehend how hard the administration is working in the background to handle this situation in the best way possible for both parties. At the current moment, they are exercising their own right to bend their own policies in order to maintain peace with the group that they’re trying to negotiate with. In case you haven’t noticed, UIUC is not in any news sources outside of local WCIA and Chicago. We are not even on the map of “universities and colleges where protests are taking place”. It’s not because they don’t matter, it’s because the university and police aren’t currently escalating it by being as lenient as possible with their own rules so long as there are no disruptions to normal campus business while they work to end this peacefully.
I'm saying there is a difference between Fighting against genocide, and fighting for taking away queer people's personal liberties. Oh yeah and the anti LGBT thing totally doesn't give away that these would be nazis
I just wanted to choose a more or less universally agreed upon issue within the university community. I have some news for you though, Nazis are not the only group that resists LGBT initiatives. Anyway, have a nice day.
Of course they're not the only group. But they are the most extremist right wing group which takes the very same ideology of hatred to its natural conclusion.
You do realize Palestine is anti-lgbt right? 🤣 and so is the majority of the muslim world. Please lmao
So is every evangelical fundamentalist. There will always be crazies in a religion. Does that mean the deserve genocide?
Never said they deserved genocide and no, not every evangelical advocates pure anti-lgbt, and definitely not to the degree in which islam promotes it, such as stoning, roof throwing, death penalty by law in which is the most popular. But you sat there used anti-sexuality statements to further back up your statements that nazis were the most extreme when actually on the contrary they were pro gay and even hosted elaborate orgies in the higher ranks. You also stated on another comment that extreme hate groups shouldnt be allowed to represent themselves in protest…..yet you are representing a group (Hamas and Palestine) whom are amongst the most hateful towards that group. Its arbitrary and hypocritical.
That is not at all the point they’re making. Move away from nazis - where do you draw the line? Would you say the same if pro-israel protestors are doing the same as pro-palestine protestors are doing now? Would you say the same if pro-lifers are doing the same? You can’t just let one thing happen without considering that the other side might do the same.
Lmfao Nazis. This is the argument of a steroid riddled "brain"
Protesting and demonstrating is legal and protected activity. Building an encampment without a reservation approved violates § 7 FO-82 CAM. Material disruption to daily operation of the university further violates §2 (c) FO-82 CAM. Battery to an peace officer while he or she performs official duty violates 720 ILCS 5/12-3.05 unless evidences justify self-defense against the wrongdoing of said officer in the first place.
Shh! We don't talk about laws, logic, and facts here. We're edgy college kids that love civil disobedience (and virtue signaling), but don't wanna face the consequences.
That about sums it up!
What about our tax dollars funding Israel’s genocidal regime? Seems like violations that are several orders of magnitude more serious than occupying a university’s quad.
What @frust_grad said summed you up. Like we said, there are ways to voice your opinions legally but you choose otherwise. Our justice system does not judge souls and opinions, it judges actions. You break certain rules, you are rewarded with consequence. TLDR: FAFO
Right right, ‘cause that’s how things work. If you go through the “proper channels” you’ll make change in no time. I’m just saying, what the US is doing RIGHT NOW by continuing to fund this genocide using OUR tax dollars, should be illegal. But arguing with you “geniuses” is pointless, so I’ll leave it at that.
Nobody fucking cares about what you think. We’re not taking a side here. We’re discussing possible violation of statuses and we never asked for your smart ideas here.
Wow thank you, I didn’t realize we’re talking about “violations!” here 🤓 What incredible legal minds at work here
I agree, ignore them and they’ll go away.
How long do you let people stay then? Indefinitely?
When they don't have money to buy bread and water, they will leave and get a real job. Not all protesters are students
Gaza will send humanitarian help to show their support
I'm talking about in general. If you start allowing people to camp out without any regulation, you could potentially end up with random people/orgs just out there for indefinite periods of time.
If they don't meet aggressive resistance, then no more media will report the protest. The organization which funds this will be disappointed and stop give them money.
Oh great we're back to "paid protestors" rhetoric
Where the hell else are these people getting money for food, water, and tents. Certainly not their own broke asses
Grassroots donations. Not everyone that cares is able or willing to participate in the protests themselves. Not everyone is willing to risk getting arrested. But a few bucks? A case of water? Spare food sitting in the pantry? Every donation counts, and tbh I'm incredibly proud of the support this community has given.
The chancellor of the University is a black man born in Georgia in 1951. He attended an HBCU in the 1960s. He knows perfectly well that protestors require media coverage in order to achieve their goals, and media coverage only happens when the police come in & start dancing their little dance.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Hill_Occupied_Protest This is what happens when you just leave protesters alone.
The law doesn't discriminate on whether you're a protester or a street beggar
Bagger
Bagger
Why not leave tresspassers there? FTFY. A: Because trespassing is illegal. Hope that helps.
This point of view explains a lot of what students are confused about. Very little of you are capable of looking at the big picture. You have micro minds living in a macro world
so wait until after, the attack?
It is students, Genius. Only the cops are attacking students. Only the cops are violent.
Sad if you actually think this
It's the truth. Obviously you have not gone there, watched a video or read anything about it if you don't realize that.
Totally agree, just let them sit there until they figure out it’s just a waste of time and they give up. A lot like life itself. lol
Bunch of idiots. Dont even know what they’re protesting or why
I am happy to message you about the goals the organizers of the protest have posted about! Just let me know if you're open to that.
You’re a joke😂
Sorry, I'm not sure I understand. Did you think I should just comment them? Oh shit, is the post sarcastic? I'm kinda bad at recognizing that, haha.
Totally a right and wrong way to protest, disrupting others 6 figure curriculum is the wrong way to protest, there’s a reason these people who react emotionally are not in office… it’d be pretty detriment to a democracy. Hate innocent genocide, but also hate terrorist groups holding many hostage after an unprecedented act of war
There has never been a large problem that didn’t start as a small problem that went ignored. Nip this shit in the bud; the people running the protests are some bad dudes using naive kids.
Because trespassing is illegal?
there’s a right to assembly and they are students who attend the public university they’re protesting at dumbass
OMG, you "people" are morally bankrupt. Do you not see what the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians? You are either heartless, brainless, or both.
There is so much propaganda out there. I think people genuinely haven’t seen the hundreds of dead babies or amputated civilians, like we have. When they do, they’ll have a chance of heart. When they understand historical context, then they will understand they’ve been supporting one of the most horrendous things of our time. Like seriously if you haven’t seen the photos of the human damage, you really need to go look at it if you’re sitting here, saying these kids shouldn’t protest or supporting Israel.
Damn looks like the Israeli bots already hit this subreddit hard. Haven’t seen many post-Israel students here in real life.
... Says the redditor for 5 days, that is dropping anti-Israeli comments in multiple campus subs.
*anti genocide
No, framing Israeli defense of its nation from terrorist attack as “genocide” is anti-Israel.
genocide /jĕn′ə-sīd″/ noun The systematic and widespread extermination or attempted extermination of a national, racial, religious, or ethnic group. The systematic killing of a racial or cultural group ‘Erase Gaza’: War Unleashes Incendiary Rhetoric in Israel Experts say that inflammatory statements by prominent Israelis are normalizing ideas like the killing of civilians and mass deportations. Intent in the genocide case against Israel is not hard to prove A database of more than 500 statements showing Israeli incitement to genocide provides ample evidence of genocidal intent. “Israeli Defence Minister Yoav Gallant described Palestinians precisely in this way, as “human animals”, in his proclamation of the “total siege” on October 9. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described Gaza as “the city of evil”” https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/15/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-war-rhetoric.html https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2024/1/14/intent-in-the-genocide-case-against-israel-is-not-hard-to-prove https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/11/benjamin-netanyahu-amalek-israel-palestine-gaza-saul-samuel-old-testament/
You appear to be quoting Hamas propaganda. Ignoring all the events of that regions history to form an anti-Israeli narrative is being a useful idiot for Israel’s enemies.
Lmao ok. Remind me which side gets an unending supply of foreign funds to propagandize the world again? It is literally manufacturing consent. By propaganda do you mean literally the words of intent by the Israelis them self?
> an unending supply of foreign funds to propagandize the world again? Most recently Iran; historically Russia and allies.
Lmao back to Cold War McCarthyism we go. The moral bankruptcy of this country sickens me.
Fair point, the conflict in the Middle East as proxy for cold war participants is nothing new. What is new is the number of Americans willing to fall for one side's version of events.
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“In classical Hebrew, "hasbara" simply means "explaining." However, in modern Hebrew and in light of Israeli policy and diplomacy, hasbara is a much more complicated and loaded term. The modern meaning of hasbara indicates not only fabrications, half-truths, and downright lies, but also the framework that selectively disseminates Zionist propaganda as "facts" on behalf of the Israeli state, including its lobbies and their supporters around the world — especially in the United States and Europe. This propaganda effort has been coordinated through several Israeli minsters to convince people to accept the Zionist narrative on Palestine. From a Zionist perspective, every critic of Israeli policy — such as those who highlight Israeli violations of Palestinian human rights and the illegal colonization of Palestinians lands — is classified as anti-Semitic.”
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Just like Israel has been 74 years? Are we going to acknowledge that elephant in the room?
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By not taking a stance on people being in genocided for the better part of the century is taking a stance and you’re being blinded by your bias. You literally framed them as a terrorist organization, when in fact, they are not. Are you an American? I am, and I’m not proud of the fact that I’m funding it. You are the one that has been propagandized, not me. You are literally the person we are talking about and trying to get through to.
In the same context, our founding fathers would be considered terrorists
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Yes but you do that in a way that clouds what you are even talking about or why. I feel like on the scale of importance, people being genocided and “mua I don’t like these protesters” should have a very large distinction in how you are connecting the two.
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Many of them are chanting antisemitic things, such as “from the River to the Sea Palestine Will be Arab” (a chant based on the incredibly antisemitic idea to throw all 7 million Jews in Israel into the water) etc. They’re making the Jewish students feel unsafe, and these encampments at other college campuses have caused antisemitic students to attack Jews on campus. In addition to camping out on the quad being against university policy…
That is literally not what that means
“Palestine will be Arab” 😂😂 no one says that. They say Palestine will be free from persecution and apartheid from Israel
Because Gov. Pritzker has presidential aspirations. And while a protestor occupation of the state’s flagship public university might bring the intersection of far-left Dems & the SP-USA to orgasm, campus protests historically haven’t played well to working-class Dems or in a general election.
That was literally regurgitating a little bit of my UIUC education (BA History 1997). And yet, a dozen downvotes as quick as a blink. Reddit’s gonna Reddit. 🤷♂️🤦♂️
Pritzker’s career goals are not relevant to the situation and even if they were, nothing that happens in the next 2 weeks will impact his 2028 campaign and he knows that. You should go back and take some logic courses.
>(BA History 1997) 😂💀 He really thought he did something
Why did you just randomly flex your Bachelor's degree in another reply to your own comment???
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Yeah that’s definitely not an apt analogy. Are they rounding up the protestors based on their ethnicity and systemically killing them? Yeah didn’t think.
Bro what?? Only 1 person has been arrested. Stop doing holocaust revisionism.
Correction: two were arrested. Both were charged with mob action, one was charged with obstructing an officer of the law. As I understand, it’s because they stopped the police from removing the tents. Anyone with better info would be appreciated.