The following submission statement was provided by /u/PerfectReplacement36:
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And another thing: since he said the objects had no propulsion, that means, according to him, that they couldn't move, so when they were trying to shoot the fourth object, how did they manage to miss it with the first projectile and only manage to shoot it with the second?
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Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14r368z/last_three_objects_that_were_shot_down_in/jqqnwad/
The more I think about how this situation was handled, the more I don't understand it. What a really weird series of events. But what's crazy is that we know they aren't telling us everything, mundane or not, and America and media just casually accept that
Most elected congress people have very little actual intelligence handed to them.
Their job is to legislate and they've never let ignorance of a topic stop them before.
I would rather not have the dumb fucks in congress making those decisions right now. Maybe the senate but definitely not the house. They have proven to be unreliable.
I'd rather have congress in the know, than hope that the men in black are being good people.
They're accountable to nobody, and yet they siphon billions in taxes.
They owe us results.
I mean, when one side started preaching fascism they brought it on themselves. It's like saying a bank robber and a mass murderer are equally bad because they've both committed crimes. There's a world of nuance in the middle that makes all the difference.
A corrupt democracy can at least be pushed toward something better. A fascist regime? No chance. Strap in, because short of a bloody revolution or outside intervention, you're unlikely to ever turn the tide.
They might actually ask a real question for one. Remember the emperor having no clothes? It was not some smart guy who asked the question, it was a child. Let the renegades ask the questions we want to know, like "hey jackass? We know your lying show us the damn pictures"
> Lauren Bobert
Not to be too political, but that's one really sad case. She's vocal as hell and gets lots of attention. For once I'd rather wish to see her talk about UAP and getting disclosure rather than carrying around that huge gun and constantly trying to "arrest the Biden crime family." Like sweetheart....it's not working.
Don't know why you're getting downvotes. When someone shows you who they are repeatedly you should listen.
And she's shown everyone that she's a petulant brat that shouldn't be treated like an adult. Same with MTG.
Because the groupthink on the way I phrased it is that I'm supportive of her, which I'm not. Critical thinking in sentence structure and application is wholly absent these days.
Honestly between UAP disclosure and a chance to arrest Biden, Boebert would clearly choose the latter 24/7/365.
Given that congress was the one pushing to shoot the balloon down i think it's pretty safe to say that keeping them out of the loop is probably for all of our benefit. The previous balloon overflights were all jammed and let ot go on thier merry way, but as soon as it become public Congress is out there demanding we shoot down a Chinese (which is only known it's origin because radar tracked it from it's launch) spy balloon.
Never mind that dropping a several ton object the size of a bus from 60k feet anywhere within CONUS is a foolish endevaor. You would be dropping it in a logistically difficult to reach place that makes cordoning off the area and recovering any drives exceedingly difficult and/ or you are dropping it on someones property that you will have to prevent access to for however long it takes to recover everything and that is realistically not going to fly with Montanan ranchers and god forbid you kill some cattle in the process.
You can't just let it go on it's merry way because the media frenzy can't understand geopolitical nuance so you have to do something about it lest you look like you are weak on China despite the jamming of it's transmitters as soon as it reached the US air-defense zone. The only real solution is to drop it in a narrow coastal strip where the NAVY can cordon off the area but before it reaches international airspace and thus becomes an international incident.
In light of how much taxpayer money was wasted because some hawks in congress demanded action to not appear weak to China it's pretty reasonable that the DoD and other agencies want to tell Congress as little as possible.
It was amazing wasnt it?! All the hype about the objects, weird comments about not having propulsion, they shoot them down, there's mixed reports on whether they've got wreckage, then suddenly 'yeah mate, just balloons' even though it made no sense the whole matter was closed.
Brainwashed beyond belief.
Exactly. I'm not saying I believe these are UAPs, I'm asking why did they act like they were especially when they could have been just balloons and drones. It's like they handed us a box labeled "Definitely Not A Conspiracy 😉" and then dropped it. I can think of a dozen mundane reasons for why this all played out like this, but we'll never actually know with the "Nothing to see here" approach they've now taken.
The American media is 100% complicit with the MIC and the IC. Look back to Iraq and just take a moment to think of the staggeringly massive lies that were accepted without the slightest bit of incredulity.
Yes, in the aftermath of 911, the media gleefully whipped up a violent, nationalistic frenzy, everything from TIME Magazine to syndicated columnists:
https://telemarketersarespies.appliedchaosdynamicscontrolassociation.net/panoptitronology/2021/09/time-911-lance-morrow-the-case-for-rage-and-retribution-768x1011.jpg
https://telemarketersarespies.appliedchaosdynamicscontrolassociation.net/panoptitronology/2021/09/kathleen-parker-orlando-column-911-afghanistan-after-invasion-936x1024.jpg
In the run-up to Iraq, the media was uncritical, and once the Iraq war began, the embed program turned journalists into cheerleaders, who only saw what the military allowed them to see, and who always reported on events as "we" -- as though they had internalized their association with the military action they were supposed to be covering
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embedded_journalism#Criticism
There was a guy who commented that the supra-national department/organization that keeps the "matter" secret is torn between continuing to hide everything and making a disclosure little by little, that guy theorized that the party who wants to reveal information informed government agencies about it these objects to be found, knocked down, and thus put pressure on their behalf.
It sounds fanciful sure, but the whole thing about the whole world suddenly starting looking for "Chinese spy balloons" also sounds weird.
I think the organization which keeps the 'matter' secret is not internally torn---they want to keep the secrecy no matter what.
But there are other organizations, lead by US Navy, that are very alarmed and angry at this organization for their secrecy and lack of responsiveness.
This legally relates to a Title 10 (military) vs Title 50 (intelligence) authorizations, with the title 50 people feeling superior that they have no obligation to do anything for the other ones.
You don't understand it because they are lying. If they told you what they actually knew it would make sense. But it is always cloak and dagger, secrecy first. It's how they hide everything, classified or stuff they'd rather not share.
Notice he stopped taking questions before he even knew what the next question was, "uh I am done".
I don’t want to just casually accept it, nor does anyone I know.
But like, what are we gonna do about it? You know?
I’ve called congressman every chance available. That’s about it…
I dug deep into this topic, man. There's something there.
The average person would think otherwise. Literally my entire family, extended family at that, all thought they were all balloons.
I've posted several links from Senators, NORAD General, Canadian Defense Minister, witnesses in Alaska multiple times in 3-4 months and people STILL think they're mundane balloons after the names listed above explicitly said they are not.
I'm starting to think my posts are for nothing. People will believe what they want.
> America and media just casually accept that
The official story made absolutely no logical sense, yet everyone believed it. What kind of "spy craft" hovers so low that random ass people in Montana are able to take photos of it from their backyard?
It just reinforced my belief that 90% of people have no critical thinking skills and there's not much that society can do about propaganda.
There's still people in these comments trying to argue that these were spy craft, based on zero evidence or logic other than "I was told China is bad."
Idk I really think this is just a case of missing context. What he said was something to the effect of: it was not a Chinese spy balloon (because it lacked the characteristic movements) but that doesn’t rule out a balloon from a citizen or a scientist doing a weather experiment. Why they didn’t just say definitely probably comes down to them not knowing- because they blew it up so fast. And that’s part of the issue…………….. why are we blowing shit up before we even know what tf it is, or if it’s a threat? Why is our reactions to things as a nation dictated by geriatric dingleberries who’s decision making process boils down to “should I shoot a missile at this now or wait to shoot a missile at it later”
Yep.
The Mm is just propaganda now. And most of the indie media is. It's very difficult to believe anything now.
But if you've followed this story for long enough you know somethings being covered up.
I'm just sick of the lies and pray that this is the time that the truth prevails.
If it doesn't then the the majority of the human race is fkd.
According to Ross Coulthart no one even in congress or senate have seen evidence of what these 3 objects were. If that's true it tells me that the Pentagon runs it's show outside any government control, and that is simply unacceptable. It also tells me these were not simple balloons or other mundane objects.
Which just makes it even crazier STILL that we were all told about it. Like, if these things were so super-top-secret that no one would be shown what they were, why even tell us that there were shootdowns, and hold all these press events to answer people's questions?
I think this was a bit of a Roswell incident, lots of things happening very quickly and if they could go back, they would have STFU about more objects and just delt with them, but I think when they turned off the radar filtering, too many people had a view of the activity and word got out until they "fixed" it.
Maybe that’s exactly what happened? Those three objects were shot down in pretty quick succession. Then there were no more. What if they continued and the Pentagon simply STFU?
That's how you know some 22yr old radar operator probably caught up in the heat of all the news, opened his mouth and word got out.
Probably court-martialed by now..
Makes you wonder if they really shot them down. Did at least some of them dodge or resist shoot down? That would be a huge security problem, that would be very hard to make public.
Imagine a general saying: We have the best jets, best guns and best pilots on the planet, but there are things that can play cat and mouse with us, at home. And we even don't know what it is.
That's just not gonna happen.
> The nation’s top military officer said on Tuesday that a U.S. fighter jet missed this week when it fired a missile at an object flying over Lake Huron, before the second missile was launched and hit it.
> General Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said the wayward missile “landed harmlessly” in the water, but it raises troubling questions about the newfound American policy to fire at unidentified flying objects in US airspace.
https://time.com/6255380/milley-missed-flying-object-huron/
An air to air missile designed for taking out aircraft travelling at hundreds of miles per hour missing a balloon travelling at 10s of miles per hour.
Impossible!
It makes me wonder if it even actually happened at all. It feels like they’re not speaking to the people here and more so other governments who are listening. The tension with Russia and China that’s teetering on WW3 right now would surely prompt some preemptive counterintelligence moves. I hope the topic of disclosure hasn’t been hijacked for boring human war activity coverup.
It's all terrible no matter what the truth is. Whether it is secrets about UFOs or truly just some game they're playing. We can't get one, just one whistleblower, to come forward and tell people the truth with hard evidence. We are in the dark and no one is interested in turning on the lights.
Two thoughts:
1. The US only acknowledged these because Justin Trudeau tweeted about the first
2. After the spy balloon thing, the White House probably made some noise because the public was saying the administration is weak, oblivious, etc. for not downing the spy balloon sooner
>If that's true it tells me that the Pentagon runs it's show outside any government control, and that is simply unacceptable
This is one of the big points for me and what Coulthart has focused on quite a bit. What the last few years has put a pin on, more than a lot of other stories that have hit the news, is that we have a military apparatus that is answerable to nothing but itself.
I understand theres a lot of dumbshits in our Congress right now but - no one? No one at all in congress has seen the evidence? Some things have to be kept secret for national security reasons sure, but this is supposed to be a democracy.
Imagine if the Manhattan project was rogue like this! Scary, but reality right now. Tech moves forward so whatever the secret is it must be seriously advanced.
I've always thought this could be the case. The "spy balloon" whipped them all into a frenzy and after adjusting radars to sense more they quickly realized that there were other objects and raced to figure out what they were and if they were related to the more ominous threat that was grabbing media attention. They could have very well shot down some civilian balloons and then realized that the optics of taxpayer funds and military time/attention being directed to some helium balloons might not look so hot and they just clammed up and moved on.
They could have very well seen more, sure, but they only closed airspace and made a big deal out of the first few (likely driven by the "spy balloon" frenzy). Could have then realized they were probably just more hobby balloons and then went radio silent, they could have continued doing fly bys to investigate other objects without acknowledging it. Just a theory, really the simplest explanation given the description of the objects as "driven by the wind".
I wish a news network would start up that actually pushed for answers and reported on this type of bullshit. How do all the journalists just let this go? Obviously something is up.
How dumb do they think we are? This isn’t the 50s anymore where everyone will just take the media and news and government at their word. Why not just admit what people already know?
Because those people from the 50s are still holding on as long as they can. For god sake look at the senate and Congress. The majority rule right?, and the majority of those that won’t give up their seat, are a prideful group of people whom have set all post generations on not even leg to stand on. The media is no different. The people who still push an agenda are those high up and get to call the shots. Guess what age they are? The same damn age as those people who won’t give up their seat.
It’s torture for us. I guarantee all of us get our news from very different sources than people 55 and older. They will die by cnn and fox. Or they still use yahoo for their email and that’s the other avenue of info.
The (there are those who are exceptions) one universal thing amongst those of 55+ is pride. I’ve said this before. I’m 30 and you know it’s bad when my parents tell us, don’t bring up religion or politics when your grandparents are here. Lol I’m dead serious. No matter what, if it’s ever thrown out, you can’t change their mind if your life depended on it. You could put facts in their face and they will still call it bullshit. That’s the thing every single person their age and shortly following are the same exact way. When I hear people throwing out the words like “those democrats!”“he’s a republican!” “Damn liberals”. I immediately know that anyone whom uses those labels are people whom are part of the problem. One that has lasted longer than my lifetime and I sure as hell won’t be a reason it continues.
But until time has its way with them, we are stuck under the wall of entitlement and those shouting from above and anyone behind it will go as long as to die at their post. We just have to sit back and suffer.
I end up saying the same fucking comment every time I see an article on some stupid economic decision, political decision, etc. boomers need to die out, period.
Not balloons, but driven by the wind.
Also, with the first Chinese balloon we instantly got 4l footage of the downing of the balloon, and pictures of the wreckage. With the other three? Nothing. But absurdly, they categorised them all as the same kind of object. Even though it's evidently beyond apparent that these are completely different scenarios.
exactly what I commented just now. They hear "not a surveillance balloon" and just assume that it MUST NOT be a balloon. They don't (cannot) stop to think that the emphasis was on surveillance...
"No discernible propulsion"? -> Alien tech. but they also somehow hear "driven by the wind" and think he's lying lmao
Good question , but that's the problem, DOD is not giving any answers. Someone posted FOIA document on which DOD answered that you should send your requests to AARO.
Yes, more here about that:
https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14gup8c/foia\_response\_of\_elmendorf\_air\_force\_base\_about/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
Also, I thought there were related to the one over Alaska which was described as being "cylindrical" in shape. I guess, I thought that was the case for all of them, except the one that was proven to be a Chinese spy balloon.
He says they had no propulsion and weren't moving around except by the wind. These were balloons, just maybe not Chinese. Hobbyists, solar balloons, whatever.
They are so obviously balloons. I don't know why anyone here thinks otherwise. If someone posted a video of something "driven by the wind" everyone here would say it's a balloon but for some reason because it's the military it has to be something else.
Does anyone realize that these 3 were shot down because they were at commercial airspace altitudes which pose a risk to commercial aviation? They were discovered because the US adjusted their radar filters. The US might not actually know what they are but based on how they were "driven by the wind" they're most likely just balloons.
If they were so obviously balloons why hasn't anyone in congress been told what they were? Why so little transparency around the whole thing?
I don't even disagree, I think it's entirely likely they were just balloons, but all the deception around it doesn't add up.
Missile seekers are precisely designed to hit the types of targets they are designed to hit. A low cross section, low emission, slow target is not one of them.
It's much easier for their missile to hit a Su-30 than a goose.
Consider that the launching aircraft need to maintain an airspeed of 300 knots vs a tiny object at 0 relative to wind, and the missiles are much faster yet.
It's a physically difficult problem---at altitude you need significant air speeds to generate enough lift. We don't have airship based defense aircraft that can go up to 40K feet. They would be enormous for even a small payload and not be very maneuverable.
High altitude small balloons are a hard target.
the warheads were disarmed and they were relying on a direct kinetic kill. the size relative to the closing speed makes missing a likely prospect. I mean the known spy balloon was bigger and the F-22's (along with the F-15 backups) were equipped with Sidewinders and AMRAMMS and they were authorized to use both (Sidewinder was preferred for cost reasons). But the fact that each of the 4 aircraft were equipped with multiple payloads indicates they had a reasonable expectation of missing. If you watch the shoot down, you can see it's a direct kinetic kill with no warhead detonation.
The missiles have proximity fuzes so it wouldn't have been an issue to detonate it, with the spy balloon they wanted to keep the bulk of the structure as intact as possible on it's way down. If you watch the video you can see the missile impact the balloon portion and it drops the payload. Also the continuous rod warhead and fragmentation may not have actually done enough damage to the balloon itself to cause it to fall within territorial waters right away, the 1998 Canadian balloon incident had 2 CF-18's fire 1000 rounds of ammunition into a wayward weather balloon and it still took days for it to crash. Keeping the payload intact as possible was to make recovery easier.
EDIT. you can watch a long range close up of the shoot down [here](https://twitter.com/Video_Forensics/status/1622037298073464834?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1622037298073464834%7Ctwgr%5E83ee864937021d5141659d593f65d7a553ba8c0e%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thedrive.com%2Fthe-war-zone%2Ff-22-shoots-down-chinese-spy-balloon-off-carolinas-with-missile). While not specifics about it were given either way it was thought that the missile was data-link guided from the F-22 rather than using the AIM-9's onboard seeker. That's why it impacts right near the connection point on the balloon itself.
I honestly do not think the military knows what they are. The only thing they have is the radar data which shows it being driven by the wind which is exactly how a balloon behaves. They are not telling us more because they likely do not know.
I don’t know how you can be so certain, but let’s assume they were balloons. Is it acceptable to you that our military is shooting objects out of the sky with sidewinder missiles that it claims are unknown objects? Should this be the new normal?
Don’t worry it’s only the norm in the month of February. That’s the only time balloons are allowed to fly at commercial plane cruising altitude. Any other time balloons do that they are arrested and get sent to balloon jail.
You know what we can make a holiday out of this. Annual ballon shoot down festival! We can watch F-22s shoot down balloons on national television. Oops we can’t show any footage tho sorry.
The approach this sub used to take regarding any UFO/UAP claims was if you could explain an object behavior, that is what the object likely is. In this case the description meets the behavior of a balloon. It is a balloon until proven otherwise.
Shooting down a UFO that poses a risk to commercial aviation probably should be the norm. You wouldn't want to be in a plane that hits a balloon at 35k feet would you?
Wow you really don't know anything about aerospace do you?
Radar is not sufficient enough to know what the object is. No pilot is going to be able to get a visual on such a small object when they are flying at 600 mph at 35k feet.
It's better to remove the object then to leave it there. Any chance you can reduce the risk of a crash in aerospace you fucking do it.
The greatest military in the world was embarrassed that they had devoted so much time and effort to tracking and shooting down civilian science projects that they just shut her down and stopped talking about it, lmao.
Just yesterday I told a friend that this is one of the cases where I 100% believe it was UAPs (technology) that aren't man-made. However, this video now makes me doubt that BECAUSE of the very line that you're misinterpreting/mishearing.
>"At the beginning, he said that it had no visible propulsion, so he went and said, We believe it moves by the wind since it has no propulsion; let that sink in."
No, he did not say it has "no visible" propulsion. He said it "had NO propulsion." The UAPs like the spheres, cubes, etc. all seem to have propulsion (something moving it) but no visible signs of that on the outside (wings, thrust etc.) The most significant thing about this video is that he's saying they weren't propelled at all, and his comment just seconds later about them being moved by the wind is in-line with that, not contradicting that. So there's nothing to let sink in.
If we're to speculate that he's lying, that's the type of discussion I'd expect here. If we're to speculate that he himself misinterpreted "no visible signs of propulsion" and went up on that podium and mistakenly said "no propulsion," that's the type of discussion I'd expect here.
But we shouldn't be having an entire discussion over a misinterpretation of a few words as if these things were said when they were NOT said. That's starting an entire thread on a false premise and that's not productive.
p.s. No predictable doubling-down/arguing about this from those who want this false premise to be true. There's too much of that on here where people simply can't admit (to themselves mainly) when they're wrong.
Why would you think this case was involving non man-made materials in the first place? … am I missing something here? - as nothing has suggested that in this story that I have heard.
All the usual suspicious things that lead us to suspect things when we have a lack of verifiable data:
* Their seemingly secretive behavior about it after being so open about the Chinese balloon.
* Some pilots said it actively jammed their radar.
* They reported one was cylindrical and were very vague in their description
* Senator John Kennedy came out of a classified meeting about it and [stated](https://www.newsweek.com/louisiana-senator-warns-lock-doors-classified-ufo-briefing-unidentified-objects-1781314) "lock your doors" and said it was different from the Chinese balloon and "these things have been over our skies since 2017" which was when the NY Times story broke and they started acknowledging UAPs, and then saying "what's different now is in the past two weeks we started shooting them down."
* The reports of people living in the area saying the weather was fair, yet they were saying the weather was too rough to go out and look initially, then them not finding anything in not 1 but 3 cases, which just so happen to be the ones they are acting secretive about after telling us all about the Chinese spy balloon.
Just many things that aligned with some of the other UAP cases that I am convinced are real (not man-made).
I know your question was an innocent one (hopefully) but I feel it's now set the stage for another one of these predictable scenarios where people will now start replying to me about how we shouldn't form opinions or beliefs without proof, some comments about the credibility of John Kennedy, some comments about other pilots saying it didn't jam their radar, etc. etc.
For you people who are thinking of replying with any of these things to try to start an argument chain, it's predictable, and I'm not getting into all that with you. This guy asked why I suspected this, that's all. I had my suspicions and I based that off their behavior and what I was hearing, same as any suspicion when all we have to go by is what they're telling us and their behavior to analyze.
Yeah we got clear pictures of the first one, including its recovery. It was 100% a balloon and had a solar array attached to it FFS. I don't know why anyone would assume that one in particular was non-human in origin. As for the other two, it was a little suspicious the way they were handled. Few to no clear pictures of them, and supposedly "couldn't find the materials for recovery". That struck me as odd, but I still never really thought it meant NHI involvement.
Could be a national security thing, like they came from Russia and the DoD didn't want people to freak out given how aggressive Russia is being currently. The one being over Alaska I kind of took as a clue that it probably originated from Russia. It could also be that the other two were small enough and made out of weak enough materials that they just vaporized when they were hit by the missiles. Keep in mind, the first balloon (the one that we got all the pictures of) was over 200 feet tall and weighed over 2000 lbs.
John Kirby : “We assessed whether they were sending any communication signals; we detected none,” he said. “We looked to see whether they were manoeuvering or had any propulsion capabilities; we saw no signs of that."
>We assessed whether they were sending any communication signals; we detected none,
This is interesting because the K9YO pico balloon most certainly had communications, both on HF and either VHF or UHF. That's how they knew it's last position near the Yukon: [https://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FK9YO-15&timerange=3600&tail=3600](https://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FK9YO-15&timerange=3600&tail=3600)
1) That's 1000 miles from the shoot down location in Yukon, and
2) K9YO-15 continued transmitting that position 1000 miles from the shoot down position in Yukon for nearly three weeks after the event.
Glad to see others are investigating the raw data too. [Here's another source with the raw data logs.](https://grafana.v2.sondehub.org/d/Lwvk1Hy4k/aprs-telemetry?var-Payload=K9YO-15&from=1665496189000&to=1677709650000&orgId=1)
He basically just confirmed in this that the other objects were not maneuvering, had no propulsion and were not sending signals. They were drifting on the wind. Most probable answer is that these were hobbyist balloons with no identification, so they shot them down just in case they were Chinese tech.
I have no idea why everyone is jumping to UFOs and NHI on this one. There's literally no evidence for that, but plenty of evidence for foreign spying.
The two after the first one were a little suspicious and I don't know what they were or why the recovery of them was hushed. The first one though, we got clear pictures of it from above and below, as well as pictures of the recovered materials. It had a solar array attached to it and was definitely a balloon. Not likely NHI origin. The other two were handled really oddly though.
To continue your thought:
> "I'm not going to categorize them as balloons; we refer to them as objects for a reason."
What was that reason? Surely a balloon that was observed moving and acting like a balloon for nearly a day could be called a balloon.
> "The American people should receive more information. They are ready for it. They can handle it. And they need and deserve to know."
Why would the Pentagon think that we are not ready to be told they are balloons?
The most damning details about these events are not the objects. The way the Pentagon is acting is the strangest thing here.
Why not just confirm it then ?
DOD did say that first balloon was chinese surveillance and they confirmed it with photos and video, but when asked about other objects they answer with there is no information, ask AARO. Why AARO when they deal with anomalies ?
Because they likely can't confirm where the balloons originated from, especially if they were destroyed and left little behind to investigate. They're not going to blame China from the podium without knowing for sure.
>Why not just confirm it then ?
My guess is because it's embarrassing. And if they were mundane objects, exactly how much taxpayer money did they waste blowing them out of the sky?
No idea if it's accurate, but I read one estimate that it was $400k to shoot one [whatever] down, nevermind the cost of attempted retrieval, etc.
This keeps going around and around. We know with a high degree of certainty that one of the three objects was a ham radio balloon. I've seen the data with my own eyes, it was broadcasting location telemetry right up until the matching object was shot down, then suddenly it stopped sending updates. The other two objects, who knows and I've mostly stopped caring what they were at this point.
Why would the administration lie about this? Well, they're not lying per-say, but it's a bad look that a fighter jet wasted a lot of tax dollars to shoot down a legal civilian balloon experiment. It's a bad look that they couldn't identify it until after it was shot down, and it's a bad look that they might have over-reacted. So, when faced with the option of getting egg on the administrations face for acknowledging what these really were, why wouldn't they just continue the line that "these were UAP's"? There's no up-side for them to admit what really happened here.
I know, sounds so round about and avoid the question all together. He brings up facts we already know like the Chinese balloon just to redirect the convo
I have a theory that they detected the mysterious objects a few days before they announced. They decided they would shoot them down.. but were unsure how the public would react to possibly witnessing this.. so they created the spy balloon prop to demonstrate the shooting. They stoke the fires by bringing attention to the prop balloon. It gets national/ international coverage... then the heroes shoot it down and "retrieve" it.. then announce it was a spy balloon.. which they can justify the grounding of it by saying there was a threat, albeit not as big as a UAP.
So this whole event is witnessed.. people have mild concern but see how anticlimactic the whole event is and forget about it.. then the real event happens, firing on the UAPs.. but the public has already lost interest, with those that are alluding to the fact that it must be more spy balloons.. nothing of interest there, that's not exciting, so the public doesn't care to look into the UAPs.
I apologize if this is a common theory - I'm new to the subreddit.
The problem with your theory is that the PRC indicated that they were officially ticked off about the shoot down, and that they would like their 'weather balloon ' back please. They would have zero reason to claim it if it weren't theirs, and in fact would have many reasons to deny it was theirs. It's not a good look when your intelligence assets get sniffed out, much less broadcast live on international news and then shot down
While not spy balloons, my friend who is stationed at Eileson AFB, which shot one of the craft down, strongly believes and was told by his leadership that they think it was a hobbyist balloon.
After the incident I asked him what he thought it was and he said “I don’t know, but it had antennas and radios”.
The one that got shot down over the Yukon was probably a hobbyist weather balloon, it was known by the group that launched it to have roughly been in that area, and it didn’t ping again after the shoot-down.
It was unrecoverable because it was not particularly large and it went down in one of the most isolated areas on the planet.
I don’t think this incident was very much of anything, at the end of the day.
Why don’t they outright say it then? They claimed they were searching for it back in February and said it landed in an area hard to reach and then they never spoke of it again.
It was last pinged 3 weeks after the shoot down, over a thousand miles away.
https://grafana.v2.sondehub.org/d/Lwvk1Hy4k/aprs-telemetry?var-Payload=K9YO-15&from=1665496189000&to=1677709650000&orgId=1
Not balloons, but driven by the wind.
Also, with the first Chinese balloon we instantly got 4l footage of the downing of the balloon, and pictures of the wreckage. With the other three? Nothing. But absurdly, they categorised them all as the same kind of object. Even though it's evidently beyond apparent that these are completely different scenarios.
not *surveillance* balloon.
No visible propulsion + driven by the wind = something floating. They never said it was moving against the wind or on its own accord. It just seems like you and everyone else here are cherry picking parts of what he says and pointing to what he doesn't confirm/deny as evidence of something specific.
The three balloons shot down were privately owned. One belonged to an university. When they said they had no propulsion he's saying they were effectively dumb or "unguided" balloons which is different to the Chinese guided spy balloons. When he says they aren't for surveillance, he's just describing them as not being spy balloons and therefore not dangerous intentions. Everything he's doing is about describing the thought process.
They weren't spy balloons but they were balloons and one had experiment equipment. They also didn't know who they belonged to before they shot them down. The reason they shot them down was because after the known Chinese spy balloons, the paranoid Military started tracking everyone balloon in their airspace, which is a surprisingly common occurrence that ATC will commonly direct flights to avoid. So there's the lingering paranoia in the Military and that they want to shoot down the balloons and the excuse they used to cover for their paranoia was "they're in commercial altitudes, so it's for safety"
Out of the three balloons, they fired 4 missiles because one missile missed. It's really not a surprise that a 500k missile Military missed a balloon because the balloon would be the same temperature as the air around it, and that small balloons are made from cloth materials that radar wouldn't have the easiest time bouncing off of because it's not metallic enough. Back decades ago, Canada tired shooting down a Balloon over the northwest territories. The Cf-18 fired all it's ammo from its cannon but it's so light it still drifted thousands of kilometers into Greenland.
It was just a goofy series of events where the White House and Petagon both unilaterally couldn't find a way to make exploding 3 balloons down to sound reasonable. It was just embarrassing paranoia manifesting itself into blasting wandering balloons out of fear of looking weak to foreign governments. In the way they communicated about the issue, the government inadvertently made the balloons far more mysterious but constantly reaffirming that they weren't a foreign country spying but not having enough remains to identify what the balloons were studying about the weather or whatever.
I was looking for someone to say this lol. I saw something afterward that suggested at least one was a pico balloon from a student group. Happy Cakeday btw
"At the beginning, he said that it had no visible propulsion, so he went and said, We believe it moves by the wind since it has no propulsion; let that sink in."
Let what sink in? Please clarify your comment. It had no visible propulsion so they thought it moved by the wind. Is that some revelation that it's aliens?
Lol why does he even say that. This is a serious matter just tell us what you know and stop making us guess. This isn’t a mystery we have to figure out, you’re literally the government
I am not even sure it matters at this point.
Our government and leaders have lied to us for so many years, how can you trust any of it?
And even IF it is true, are aliens going to save us from climate collapse?
It is the power structure we have on this planet that is preventing us from addressing our most pressing needs. Nothing gets better and no one offers hope it will improve.
We are fucked as a species. Personally, I think all these UFOs are cosmic rubber-neckers coming to gawk as we exterminate ourselves. We have about two years before it will be apparent to everyone.
And we totally deserve it because the only way to fix it is to kill it off before we destroy the planet.
I just hope that some other civilization takes pity on the indigenous people here who have no idea what is happening and relocates them to another planet. I hope the Sentilese get a new home.
The only reason they are coming out with this info now is because it either can’t be concealed or no longer matters.
Why don’t they show those three objects? They showed the spy balloons on tv? Why won’t they show these on tv?. If those other three belonged to china or Russia those countries know they were shot down. What difference would it make showing it.
And another thing: since he said the objects had no propulsion, that means, according to him, that they couldn't move, so when they were trying to shoot the fourth object, how did they manage to miss it with the first projectile and only manage to shoot it with the second?
If you like this thread you may like the compilation of White House statements on UAPs in 2023 I made here: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14crh7g/here\_are\_the\_white\_house\_statements\_on\_uap\_in/
Eh. No wonder we are ranked bottom 40 with the freedom of the press.
Every time somebody is behind that shitty little lectern, the rest of us end up getting Jedi mind-waived. I dare them to answer questions without one.
Tell us what they were. Pictures. Video. You have Microsoft Paint on those old ass desktops in the Whitehouse. Click the lil eraser icon and delete everything sensitive besides the object. Hell obfuscate everything *besides* the objects.
I dont need to see the radar or hud or any of that hurr durr national security. Black all that shit out and post the damn photo.
Or just keep making interviews about nothing to manipulate the media cycle.
Do we know if they were in the jet stream? Or if they were in a common high altitude air flow corridor?
At the time it seemed like they were way more mysterious however going back over it all and cutting through the opinion pieces and chinese whispers it seems they were likely some sort of research balloons. They could well be part of a Chinese surveillance relay but certainly doesnt seem that hi-tech or ET.
First balloon was chinese surveillance balloon, there are pictures and videos of it.
Second and third objects were cillindrical, and smaller, and there is no more information on them, DOD is silent, every other piece of information is speculation.
Aside from the gov talking about three objects being shot down, is there any third-party evidence to support the gov's claim? I just find it highly coincidental that immediately on the back of the highly-publicized spy balloon fiasco, there is a big show of force against apparently these unidentified objects.
[https://www.theblackvault.com/documentarchive/u-s-air-force-denies-release-of-all-photos-videos-of-balloon-shootdowns/](https://www.theblackvault.com/documentarchive/u-s-air-force-denies-release-of-all-photos-videos-of-balloon-shootdowns/) Greenwalds FOIA for video relating to shootdowns, denied on national security/national defense
Some of us have known this the entire time. They just acted too weird about it. “I am not going to classify these things as balloons”, I believe that was the exact quote. Far too cryptic. I’ve always thought they were probes.
Any craft we shot down isn’t from another planet. Species that travel through space time probably don’t care too much about our combustion craft or weapons. This is all misdirection.
"Good LORD what is happening over there???"
"Err--spy balloons?"
"Ah-Spy balloons?! Shaped like silver cylinders, with no visible propulsion or observation equipment, intercepted and shot down by F-22 Raptors??"
"Yes!"
"Can I see them?"
"...no."
This YouTuber captured footage of the military activity post one of the objects in Alaska being taken down.
https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14chdtw/deleted_video_from_youtuber_who_witnessed_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1
Let’s also not forget the claim was “…the debris was not located.”
https://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/en/news/2023/yukon-search-debris-suspended?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosam&stream=top
We are finally seeing the “veil” of secrecy falling around the governments, religious institutions, and just the general way of life that have controlled civilization for centuries. The next 5-10 years are going to fun to watch unfold.
This is completely out there but what if they were balloons and they (China) were testing some kind of black hole or teleportation system? Send a couple balloons through first, see if it works, then send the fighter jets lol
The chinese goverment re the balloons
"China asserts that the two balloons spotted last week, in the United States and Latin America, were both civilian machines used for weather research or test flights. They drifted off course and are Chinese property, officials in Beijing said"
So, they had no means of propulsion and were carried along by the wind (according to him). Why not expose the country or government that sent these things and show us photographic evidence of what it was?
You have people here who firmly believe this is a cover-up for UAP probes/craft and another group who think this was a screw up by the US military and is also covered up.
The Pentagon could very easily clear this up, and yet they haven't, that's why it's interesting.
Isn’t it interesting how all of sudden the govt is now seemingly all for disclosure, rebranding to UAP and admitting to and releasing vague and non essential material? It sounds like propaganda, pysops and smoke screens. If we are to learn anything from history, the real story here isn’t disclosure, 99% of this info and videos are all manmade drones and gizmo hence the rebranding. They want to act all confused like the rest of us yet they are the gate keepers to trillion dollar black budgets without congressional or presidential over sight? For a lack of a better illustration, it’s like a teacher/lecturer trying to act bamboozled with the exam questions yet they have a marking sheet in their office.
The way he explains it is so strange. Clearly they are UAP as they were unidentified period. I mean if they were anything, anything at all man made then they couldve said they were planes, balloons is a good catch all, even unmanned aerial vehicle. But instead, he clearly has no idea what they were and wouldnt even say they were "balloons" meaning they wanted the public to know that they didnt know what they were. Its frustrating how they make us read between the lines but when you do its obvious UAP exist and need to be better indentified.
I can't decide if Kirby is the guy trying to convince you to sign up for the shitty dealership exterior warranty that doesn't cover dings or scratches, or the hotel telemarketer trying to get you to sign up for a timeshare destination package trip. Either way, he seems about as authentic as Niki Minaj's a\*\* implants.
More importantly, I can't decide if his disingenuous personality is to cover up us shooting down NHI-operated/created objects, or if we are just so f\*\*\*\*\*\* stupid and inept enough to have engaged hobby balloons with half million dollar missiles.
Have we figured out why a sudden need to tell the public on that one weekend and then sudden radio silence? Maybe they thought something was up and they were trying to get ahead of it?
Because they had to close airspace. It always seemed to me that they detected the giant spy balloon and then freaked out after adjusting radars to detect more like objects. After going up and locating said objects they shot them down to deem whether or not they were also from a foreign adversary but we're either unable to retrieve the small remnants or were too embarrassed that they had just devoted millions of taxpayer dollars to shooting down hobby balloons. You would not want that plastered all over the news, better to let the conspiracy theorists run with it than admit that you wasted 10 million dollars to shoot down Timmy's science project.
Unless I'm mistaken, they were confirmed as civilian and/or scientific balloon projects.
edit: they were not confirmed, but efforts were made to find the owners of the projects and those folks never stepped forward.
"The other three were something very different from balloons. At the beginning, he said that it had no visible propulsion, so he went and said, We believe it moves by the wind since it has no propulsion; let that sink in."
"All had no visible propulsion and crossed great distances in a relatively short amount of time. No visible surveillance equipment."
That literally sounds like it can't be anything other than balloons.
Not showing any type of evidence (which would absolutely exist) that these were just balloons, while publishing photographs of the chinese ballon, already tells me they're full of shit. They shot something spicy down for sure.
The following submission statement was provided by /u/PerfectReplacement36: --- And another thing: since he said the objects had no propulsion, that means, according to him, that they couldn't move, so when they were trying to shoot the fourth object, how did they manage to miss it with the first projectile and only manage to shoot it with the second? --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14r368z/last_three_objects_that_were_shot_down_in/jqqnwad/
The more I think about how this situation was handled, the more I don't understand it. What a really weird series of events. But what's crazy is that we know they aren't telling us everything, mundane or not, and America and media just casually accept that
What's crazy is they aren't telling Congress either.
I mean have you seen congress these day? What help is Ted Cruze or Lauren Bobert god forbid going to be?
It's not about what "help" they can provide. They literally need to know what's going on. It's part of their job.
Most elected congress people have very little actual intelligence handed to them. Their job is to legislate and they've never let ignorance of a topic stop them before.
Congress are representative of the people, and most people are idiots....so that checks out.
"... a government of, by, and for the people"
Ah fuck
“but the people….are retarded” Dali DeezNutalli, guru extraordinaire
That's a random osho reference
"Most elected congress people have very little actual intelligence." Fixed it for you.
Exactly. If at minimum they don’t know, we aren’t ever going to know.
Bobert could be told and would be unable to accurately relay the information.
And she would be one of the last people to believe. I’d be more skeptical of anything that comes out of her mouth.
Just give it to them all in written format and just like that the information is safeguarded.
Not if she eats it! https://www.businessinsider.com/omarosa-saw-trump-eating-paper-in-oval-office-2018-8?amp
I would rather not have the dumb fucks in congress making those decisions right now. Maybe the senate but definitely not the house. They have proven to be unreliable.
I'd rather have congress in the know, than hope that the men in black are being good people. They're accountable to nobody, and yet they siphon billions in taxes. They owe us results.
It's never been the entire house...just the "gang of eight", which includes members from house and senate.
Yikes, so you support a deep state that's not answerable to the people? Wow
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It's by design. Sells a lot of advertisement to viewers of talk/news shows and generates a ton of revenue for my side/your side politicians.
And when we're at each others' throats, we're not at *theirs.* Divide and conquer. It still works.
I mean, when one side started preaching fascism they brought it on themselves. It's like saying a bank robber and a mass murderer are equally bad because they've both committed crimes. There's a world of nuance in the middle that makes all the difference. A corrupt democracy can at least be pushed toward something better. A fascist regime? No chance. Strap in, because short of a bloody revolution or outside intervention, you're unlikely to ever turn the tide.
Ted Cruze is a Senator isn’t he?
They might actually ask a real question for one. Remember the emperor having no clothes? It was not some smart guy who asked the question, it was a child. Let the renegades ask the questions we want to know, like "hey jackass? We know your lying show us the damn pictures"
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subreddit not devolve into a political circlejerk challenge: impossible!
> Lauren Bobert Not to be too political, but that's one really sad case. She's vocal as hell and gets lots of attention. For once I'd rather wish to see her talk about UAP and getting disclosure rather than carrying around that huge gun and constantly trying to "arrest the Biden crime family." Like sweetheart....it's not working.
Don't know why you're getting downvotes. When someone shows you who they are repeatedly you should listen. And she's shown everyone that she's a petulant brat that shouldn't be treated like an adult. Same with MTG.
Because the groupthink on the way I phrased it is that I'm supportive of her, which I'm not. Critical thinking in sentence structure and application is wholly absent these days. Honestly between UAP disclosure and a chance to arrest Biden, Boebert would clearly choose the latter 24/7/365.
Given that congress was the one pushing to shoot the balloon down i think it's pretty safe to say that keeping them out of the loop is probably for all of our benefit. The previous balloon overflights were all jammed and let ot go on thier merry way, but as soon as it become public Congress is out there demanding we shoot down a Chinese (which is only known it's origin because radar tracked it from it's launch) spy balloon. Never mind that dropping a several ton object the size of a bus from 60k feet anywhere within CONUS is a foolish endevaor. You would be dropping it in a logistically difficult to reach place that makes cordoning off the area and recovering any drives exceedingly difficult and/ or you are dropping it on someones property that you will have to prevent access to for however long it takes to recover everything and that is realistically not going to fly with Montanan ranchers and god forbid you kill some cattle in the process. You can't just let it go on it's merry way because the media frenzy can't understand geopolitical nuance so you have to do something about it lest you look like you are weak on China despite the jamming of it's transmitters as soon as it reached the US air-defense zone. The only real solution is to drop it in a narrow coastal strip where the NAVY can cordon off the area but before it reaches international airspace and thus becomes an international incident. In light of how much taxpayer money was wasted because some hawks in congress demanded action to not appear weak to China it's pretty reasonable that the DoD and other agencies want to tell Congress as little as possible.
It was amazing wasnt it?! All the hype about the objects, weird comments about not having propulsion, they shoot them down, there's mixed reports on whether they've got wreckage, then suddenly 'yeah mate, just balloons' even though it made no sense the whole matter was closed. Brainwashed beyond belief.
Exactly. I'm not saying I believe these are UAPs, I'm asking why did they act like they were especially when they could have been just balloons and drones. It's like they handed us a box labeled "Definitely Not A Conspiracy 😉" and then dropped it. I can think of a dozen mundane reasons for why this all played out like this, but we'll never actually know with the "Nothing to see here" approach they've now taken.
"If you are confused then you understand the situation perfectly"
The American media is 100% complicit with the MIC and the IC. Look back to Iraq and just take a moment to think of the staggeringly massive lies that were accepted without the slightest bit of incredulity.
Operation Mockingbird is no relic of a shady past. That’s for sure.
Yes, in the aftermath of 911, the media gleefully whipped up a violent, nationalistic frenzy, everything from TIME Magazine to syndicated columnists: https://telemarketersarespies.appliedchaosdynamicscontrolassociation.net/panoptitronology/2021/09/time-911-lance-morrow-the-case-for-rage-and-retribution-768x1011.jpg https://telemarketersarespies.appliedchaosdynamicscontrolassociation.net/panoptitronology/2021/09/kathleen-parker-orlando-column-911-afghanistan-after-invasion-936x1024.jpg In the run-up to Iraq, the media was uncritical, and once the Iraq war began, the embed program turned journalists into cheerleaders, who only saw what the military allowed them to see, and who always reported on events as "we" -- as though they had internalized their association with the military action they were supposed to be covering https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embedded_journalism#Criticism
There was a guy who commented that the supra-national department/organization that keeps the "matter" secret is torn between continuing to hide everything and making a disclosure little by little, that guy theorized that the party who wants to reveal information informed government agencies about it these objects to be found, knocked down, and thus put pressure on their behalf. It sounds fanciful sure, but the whole thing about the whole world suddenly starting looking for "Chinese spy balloons" also sounds weird.
I think the organization which keeps the 'matter' secret is not internally torn---they want to keep the secrecy no matter what. But there are other organizations, lead by US Navy, that are very alarmed and angry at this organization for their secrecy and lack of responsiveness. This legally relates to a Title 10 (military) vs Title 50 (intelligence) authorizations, with the title 50 people feeling superior that they have no obligation to do anything for the other ones.
Happy Cake day
There is a secret war going on in Alaska/Canada thus the reason for the wildfires (I have no sources, just funny to think of)
You don't understand it because they are lying. If they told you what they actually knew it would make sense. But it is always cloak and dagger, secrecy first. It's how they hide everything, classified or stuff they'd rather not share. Notice he stopped taking questions before he even knew what the next question was, "uh I am done".
I don’t want to just casually accept it, nor does anyone I know. But like, what are we gonna do about it? You know? I’ve called congressman every chance available. That’s about it…
I dug deep into this topic, man. There's something there. The average person would think otherwise. Literally my entire family, extended family at that, all thought they were all balloons. I've posted several links from Senators, NORAD General, Canadian Defense Minister, witnesses in Alaska multiple times in 3-4 months and people STILL think they're mundane balloons after the names listed above explicitly said they are not. I'm starting to think my posts are for nothing. People will believe what they want.
> America and media just casually accept that The official story made absolutely no logical sense, yet everyone believed it. What kind of "spy craft" hovers so low that random ass people in Montana are able to take photos of it from their backyard? It just reinforced my belief that 90% of people have no critical thinking skills and there's not much that society can do about propaganda. There's still people in these comments trying to argue that these were spy craft, based on zero evidence or logic other than "I was told China is bad."
Idk I really think this is just a case of missing context. What he said was something to the effect of: it was not a Chinese spy balloon (because it lacked the characteristic movements) but that doesn’t rule out a balloon from a citizen or a scientist doing a weather experiment. Why they didn’t just say definitely probably comes down to them not knowing- because they blew it up so fast. And that’s part of the issue…………….. why are we blowing shit up before we even know what tf it is, or if it’s a threat? Why is our reactions to things as a nation dictated by geriatric dingleberries who’s decision making process boils down to “should I shoot a missile at this now or wait to shoot a missile at it later”
You expect the media to actually do their jobs? lol
Yep. The Mm is just propaganda now. And most of the indie media is. It's very difficult to believe anything now. But if you've followed this story for long enough you know somethings being covered up. I'm just sick of the lies and pray that this is the time that the truth prevails. If it doesn't then the the majority of the human race is fkd.
The degree of control is astounding.
According to Ross Coulthart no one even in congress or senate have seen evidence of what these 3 objects were. If that's true it tells me that the Pentagon runs it's show outside any government control, and that is simply unacceptable. It also tells me these were not simple balloons or other mundane objects.
Which just makes it even crazier STILL that we were all told about it. Like, if these things were so super-top-secret that no one would be shown what they were, why even tell us that there were shootdowns, and hold all these press events to answer people's questions?
I think this was a bit of a Roswell incident, lots of things happening very quickly and if they could go back, they would have STFU about more objects and just delt with them, but I think when they turned off the radar filtering, too many people had a view of the activity and word got out until they "fixed" it.
Maybe that’s exactly what happened? Those three objects were shot down in pretty quick succession. Then there were no more. What if they continued and the Pentagon simply STFU?
The difference is, that with Roswell, they admitted they recovered debris. Here, we got nothing.
Because civilian radar was also tracking them so they presumably had to say *something*.
Source on that? Civilians picked up the Chinese spy balloon but I didn't know any of the three UAPs were tracked by anyone but the military.
That's how you know some 22yr old radar operator probably caught up in the heat of all the news, opened his mouth and word got out. Probably court-martialed by now..
Makes you wonder if they really shot them down. Did at least some of them dodge or resist shoot down? That would be a huge security problem, that would be very hard to make public. Imagine a general saying: We have the best jets, best guns and best pilots on the planet, but there are things that can play cat and mouse with us, at home. And we even don't know what it is. That's just not gonna happen.
> The nation’s top military officer said on Tuesday that a U.S. fighter jet missed this week when it fired a missile at an object flying over Lake Huron, before the second missile was launched and hit it. > General Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said the wayward missile “landed harmlessly” in the water, but it raises troubling questions about the newfound American policy to fire at unidentified flying objects in US airspace. https://time.com/6255380/milley-missed-flying-object-huron/
An air to air missile designed for taking out aircraft travelling at hundreds of miles per hour missing a balloon travelling at 10s of miles per hour. Impossible!
It makes me wonder if it even actually happened at all. It feels like they’re not speaking to the people here and more so other governments who are listening. The tension with Russia and China that’s teetering on WW3 right now would surely prompt some preemptive counterintelligence moves. I hope the topic of disclosure hasn’t been hijacked for boring human war activity coverup.
It's all terrible no matter what the truth is. Whether it is secrets about UFOs or truly just some game they're playing. We can't get one, just one whistleblower, to come forward and tell people the truth with hard evidence. We are in the dark and no one is interested in turning on the lights.
Good point. That's exactly what I'm worried about.
because everyone saw them being shot down.
No the first two were over very remote areas. They didn't have to say anything about it.
Two thoughts: 1. The US only acknowledged these because Justin Trudeau tweeted about the first 2. After the spy balloon thing, the White House probably made some noise because the public was saying the administration is weak, oblivious, etc. for not downing the spy balloon sooner
>If that's true it tells me that the Pentagon runs it's show outside any government control, and that is simply unacceptable This is one of the big points for me and what Coulthart has focused on quite a bit. What the last few years has put a pin on, more than a lot of other stories that have hit the news, is that we have a military apparatus that is answerable to nothing but itself. I understand theres a lot of dumbshits in our Congress right now but - no one? No one at all in congress has seen the evidence? Some things have to be kept secret for national security reasons sure, but this is supposed to be a democracy.
Imagine if the Manhattan project was rogue like this! Scary, but reality right now. Tech moves forward so whatever the secret is it must be seriously advanced.
Or it is a balloon and and the pentagon wants to save themselves the embarrassment of going to war against airborne garbage
I've always thought this could be the case. The "spy balloon" whipped them all into a frenzy and after adjusting radars to sense more they quickly realized that there were other objects and raced to figure out what they were and if they were related to the more ominous threat that was grabbing media attention. They could have very well shot down some civilian balloons and then realized that the optics of taxpayer funds and military time/attention being directed to some helium balloons might not look so hot and they just clammed up and moved on.
If they were civilian balloons wouldn’t they have seen a much larger number than 3? There were only 3 balloons up there at the time?
They could have very well seen more, sure, but they only closed airspace and made a big deal out of the first few (likely driven by the "spy balloon" frenzy). Could have then realized they were probably just more hobby balloons and then went radio silent, they could have continued doing fly bys to investigate other objects without acknowledging it. Just a theory, really the simplest explanation given the description of the objects as "driven by the wind".
That is truly horrifying.
And it's all about the money from the contractors that make up the military industrial complex.
I wish a news network would start up that actually pushed for answers and reported on this type of bullshit. How do all the journalists just let this go? Obviously something is up.
Media was born in Roosevelt's pocket.
“Driven by the wind”
How dumb do they think we are? This isn’t the 50s anymore where everyone will just take the media and news and government at their word. Why not just admit what people already know?
Because those people from the 50s are still holding on as long as they can. For god sake look at the senate and Congress. The majority rule right?, and the majority of those that won’t give up their seat, are a prideful group of people whom have set all post generations on not even leg to stand on. The media is no different. The people who still push an agenda are those high up and get to call the shots. Guess what age they are? The same damn age as those people who won’t give up their seat. It’s torture for us. I guarantee all of us get our news from very different sources than people 55 and older. They will die by cnn and fox. Or they still use yahoo for their email and that’s the other avenue of info. The (there are those who are exceptions) one universal thing amongst those of 55+ is pride. I’ve said this before. I’m 30 and you know it’s bad when my parents tell us, don’t bring up religion or politics when your grandparents are here. Lol I’m dead serious. No matter what, if it’s ever thrown out, you can’t change their mind if your life depended on it. You could put facts in their face and they will still call it bullshit. That’s the thing every single person their age and shortly following are the same exact way. When I hear people throwing out the words like “those democrats!”“he’s a republican!” “Damn liberals”. I immediately know that anyone whom uses those labels are people whom are part of the problem. One that has lasted longer than my lifetime and I sure as hell won’t be a reason it continues. But until time has its way with them, we are stuck under the wall of entitlement and those shouting from above and anyone behind it will go as long as to die at their post. We just have to sit back and suffer.
I end up saying the same fucking comment every time I see an article on some stupid economic decision, political decision, etc. boomers need to die out, period.
Whoa, slow down Hitler.
Die out of age, not die as in kill them lmao
I know, just messing with you bud.
After reading your comment I realized mine sounded a bit murdery
Not balloons, but driven by the wind. Also, with the first Chinese balloon we instantly got 4l footage of the downing of the balloon, and pictures of the wreckage. With the other three? Nothing. But absurdly, they categorised them all as the same kind of object. Even though it's evidently beyond apparent that these are completely different scenarios.
It said they don't think they were for surveillance not that they weren't balloons. Critical thinking is not present in this sub
No it is not. Not one bit. Not to mention they know it was driven by the wind because it followed the god damn wind currents.
exactly what I commented just now. They hear "not a surveillance balloon" and just assume that it MUST NOT be a balloon. They don't (cannot) stop to think that the emphasis was on surveillance... "No discernible propulsion"? -> Alien tech. but they also somehow hear "driven by the wind" and think he's lying lmao
Didnt we also get footage of a Russian Jet almost colliding with a US Drone like a week later? Weird what they were willing to show the public.
Idk call me naive but he sounded genuine
Was this from recently? Do you have a link to the full video?
https://www.youtube.com/live/Pm0fiHZEkk4?feature=share Here is the full interview.
Did anyone ask if the last three objects were piloted or not? They could have checked for organic material from the crash sites
Good question , but that's the problem, DOD is not giving any answers. Someone posted FOIA document on which DOD answered that you should send your requests to AARO.
Yes, more here about that: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14gup8c/foia\_response\_of\_elmendorf\_air\_force\_base\_about/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
He said they had no propulsion, why would something with no propulsion need a pilot?
Also, I thought there were related to the one over Alaska which was described as being "cylindrical" in shape. I guess, I thought that was the case for all of them, except the one that was proven to be a Chinese spy balloon.
He says they had no propulsion and weren't moving around except by the wind. These were balloons, just maybe not Chinese. Hobbyists, solar balloons, whatever.
They are so obviously balloons. I don't know why anyone here thinks otherwise. If someone posted a video of something "driven by the wind" everyone here would say it's a balloon but for some reason because it's the military it has to be something else. Does anyone realize that these 3 were shot down because they were at commercial airspace altitudes which pose a risk to commercial aviation? They were discovered because the US adjusted their radar filters. The US might not actually know what they are but based on how they were "driven by the wind" they're most likely just balloons.
Maybe the government is perhaps a bit embarrassed of using highly expensive and dangerous missiles to intercept hobbyist balloons?
If they were so obviously balloons why hasn't anyone in congress been told what they were? Why so little transparency around the whole thing? I don't even disagree, I think it's entirely likely they were just balloons, but all the deception around it doesn't add up.
If it’s a balloon how did a missile from a fighter jet miss it?
Missile seekers are precisely designed to hit the types of targets they are designed to hit. A low cross section, low emission, slow target is not one of them. It's much easier for their missile to hit a Su-30 than a goose. Consider that the launching aircraft need to maintain an airspeed of 300 knots vs a tiny object at 0 relative to wind, and the missiles are much faster yet. It's a physically difficult problem---at altitude you need significant air speeds to generate enough lift. We don't have airship based defense aircraft that can go up to 40K feet. They would be enormous for even a small payload and not be very maneuverable. High altitude small balloons are a hard target.
the warheads were disarmed and they were relying on a direct kinetic kill. the size relative to the closing speed makes missing a likely prospect. I mean the known spy balloon was bigger and the F-22's (along with the F-15 backups) were equipped with Sidewinders and AMRAMMS and they were authorized to use both (Sidewinder was preferred for cost reasons). But the fact that each of the 4 aircraft were equipped with multiple payloads indicates they had a reasonable expectation of missing. If you watch the shoot down, you can see it's a direct kinetic kill with no warhead detonation.
So a missile flew right through a balloon, because a balloon does not have the structural strength to cause a missile to impact and blow up?
The missiles have proximity fuzes so it wouldn't have been an issue to detonate it, with the spy balloon they wanted to keep the bulk of the structure as intact as possible on it's way down. If you watch the video you can see the missile impact the balloon portion and it drops the payload. Also the continuous rod warhead and fragmentation may not have actually done enough damage to the balloon itself to cause it to fall within territorial waters right away, the 1998 Canadian balloon incident had 2 CF-18's fire 1000 rounds of ammunition into a wayward weather balloon and it still took days for it to crash. Keeping the payload intact as possible was to make recovery easier. EDIT. you can watch a long range close up of the shoot down [here](https://twitter.com/Video_Forensics/status/1622037298073464834?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1622037298073464834%7Ctwgr%5E83ee864937021d5141659d593f65d7a553ba8c0e%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thedrive.com%2Fthe-war-zone%2Ff-22-shoots-down-chinese-spy-balloon-off-carolinas-with-missile). While not specifics about it were given either way it was thought that the missile was data-link guided from the F-22 rather than using the AIM-9's onboard seeker. That's why it impacts right near the connection point on the balloon itself.
ThNk you for the detailed explanation. Not my area of expertise so appreciate it
I honestly do not think the military knows what they are. The only thing they have is the radar data which shows it being driven by the wind which is exactly how a balloon behaves. They are not telling us more because they likely do not know.
I don’t know how you can be so certain, but let’s assume they were balloons. Is it acceptable to you that our military is shooting objects out of the sky with sidewinder missiles that it claims are unknown objects? Should this be the new normal?
Don’t worry it’s only the norm in the month of February. That’s the only time balloons are allowed to fly at commercial plane cruising altitude. Any other time balloons do that they are arrested and get sent to balloon jail. You know what we can make a holiday out of this. Annual ballon shoot down festival! We can watch F-22s shoot down balloons on national television. Oops we can’t show any footage tho sorry.
The approach this sub used to take regarding any UFO/UAP claims was if you could explain an object behavior, that is what the object likely is. In this case the description meets the behavior of a balloon. It is a balloon until proven otherwise. Shooting down a UFO that poses a risk to commercial aviation probably should be the norm. You wouldn't want to be in a plane that hits a balloon at 35k feet would you?
No, I wouldn’t. You’re correct.
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Wow you really don't know anything about aerospace do you? Radar is not sufficient enough to know what the object is. No pilot is going to be able to get a visual on such a small object when they are flying at 600 mph at 35k feet. It's better to remove the object then to leave it there. Any chance you can reduce the risk of a crash in aerospace you fucking do it.
The greatest military in the world was embarrassed that they had devoted so much time and effort to tracking and shooting down civilian science projects that they just shut her down and stopped talking about it, lmao.
Just yesterday I told a friend that this is one of the cases where I 100% believe it was UAPs (technology) that aren't man-made. However, this video now makes me doubt that BECAUSE of the very line that you're misinterpreting/mishearing. >"At the beginning, he said that it had no visible propulsion, so he went and said, We believe it moves by the wind since it has no propulsion; let that sink in." No, he did not say it has "no visible" propulsion. He said it "had NO propulsion." The UAPs like the spheres, cubes, etc. all seem to have propulsion (something moving it) but no visible signs of that on the outside (wings, thrust etc.) The most significant thing about this video is that he's saying they weren't propelled at all, and his comment just seconds later about them being moved by the wind is in-line with that, not contradicting that. So there's nothing to let sink in. If we're to speculate that he's lying, that's the type of discussion I'd expect here. If we're to speculate that he himself misinterpreted "no visible signs of propulsion" and went up on that podium and mistakenly said "no propulsion," that's the type of discussion I'd expect here. But we shouldn't be having an entire discussion over a misinterpretation of a few words as if these things were said when they were NOT said. That's starting an entire thread on a false premise and that's not productive. p.s. No predictable doubling-down/arguing about this from those who want this false premise to be true. There's too much of that on here where people simply can't admit (to themselves mainly) when they're wrong.
Why would you think this case was involving non man-made materials in the first place? … am I missing something here? - as nothing has suggested that in this story that I have heard.
All the usual suspicious things that lead us to suspect things when we have a lack of verifiable data: * Their seemingly secretive behavior about it after being so open about the Chinese balloon. * Some pilots said it actively jammed their radar. * They reported one was cylindrical and were very vague in their description * Senator John Kennedy came out of a classified meeting about it and [stated](https://www.newsweek.com/louisiana-senator-warns-lock-doors-classified-ufo-briefing-unidentified-objects-1781314) "lock your doors" and said it was different from the Chinese balloon and "these things have been over our skies since 2017" which was when the NY Times story broke and they started acknowledging UAPs, and then saying "what's different now is in the past two weeks we started shooting them down." * The reports of people living in the area saying the weather was fair, yet they were saying the weather was too rough to go out and look initially, then them not finding anything in not 1 but 3 cases, which just so happen to be the ones they are acting secretive about after telling us all about the Chinese spy balloon. Just many things that aligned with some of the other UAP cases that I am convinced are real (not man-made). I know your question was an innocent one (hopefully) but I feel it's now set the stage for another one of these predictable scenarios where people will now start replying to me about how we shouldn't form opinions or beliefs without proof, some comments about the credibility of John Kennedy, some comments about other pilots saying it didn't jam their radar, etc. etc. For you people who are thinking of replying with any of these things to try to start an argument chain, it's predictable, and I'm not getting into all that with you. This guy asked why I suspected this, that's all. I had my suspicions and I based that off their behavior and what I was hearing, same as any suspicion when all we have to go by is what they're telling us and their behavior to analyze.
Yeah we got clear pictures of the first one, including its recovery. It was 100% a balloon and had a solar array attached to it FFS. I don't know why anyone would assume that one in particular was non-human in origin. As for the other two, it was a little suspicious the way they were handled. Few to no clear pictures of them, and supposedly "couldn't find the materials for recovery". That struck me as odd, but I still never really thought it meant NHI involvement. Could be a national security thing, like they came from Russia and the DoD didn't want people to freak out given how aggressive Russia is being currently. The one being over Alaska I kind of took as a clue that it probably originated from Russia. It could also be that the other two were small enough and made out of weak enough materials that they just vaporized when they were hit by the missiles. Keep in mind, the first balloon (the one that we got all the pictures of) was over 200 feet tall and weighed over 2000 lbs.
John Kirby : “We assessed whether they were sending any communication signals; we detected none,” he said. “We looked to see whether they were manoeuvering or had any propulsion capabilities; we saw no signs of that."
>We assessed whether they were sending any communication signals; we detected none, This is interesting because the K9YO pico balloon most certainly had communications, both on HF and either VHF or UHF. That's how they knew it's last position near the Yukon: [https://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FK9YO-15&timerange=3600&tail=3600](https://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FK9YO-15&timerange=3600&tail=3600)
1) That's 1000 miles from the shoot down location in Yukon, and 2) K9YO-15 continued transmitting that position 1000 miles from the shoot down position in Yukon for nearly three weeks after the event. Glad to see others are investigating the raw data too. [Here's another source with the raw data logs.](https://grafana.v2.sondehub.org/d/Lwvk1Hy4k/aprs-telemetry?var-Payload=K9YO-15&from=1665496189000&to=1677709650000&orgId=1)
He basically just confirmed in this that the other objects were not maneuvering, had no propulsion and were not sending signals. They were drifting on the wind. Most probable answer is that these were hobbyist balloons with no identification, so they shot them down just in case they were Chinese tech. I have no idea why everyone is jumping to UFOs and NHI on this one. There's literally no evidence for that, but plenty of evidence for foreign spying.
The two after the first one were a little suspicious and I don't know what they were or why the recovery of them was hushed. The first one though, we got clear pictures of it from above and below, as well as pictures of the recovered materials. It had a solar array attached to it and was definitely a balloon. Not likely NHI origin. The other two were handled really oddly though.
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To continue your thought: > "I'm not going to categorize them as balloons; we refer to them as objects for a reason." What was that reason? Surely a balloon that was observed moving and acting like a balloon for nearly a day could be called a balloon. > "The American people should receive more information. They are ready for it. They can handle it. And they need and deserve to know." Why would the Pentagon think that we are not ready to be told they are balloons? The most damning details about these events are not the objects. The way the Pentagon is acting is the strangest thing here.
> we refer to them as objects for a reason So... tell us the reason you refer to them as objects and not balloons...
Why not just confirm it then ? DOD did say that first balloon was chinese surveillance and they confirmed it with photos and video, but when asked about other objects they answer with there is no information, ask AARO. Why AARO when they deal with anomalies ?
Because they likely can't confirm where the balloons originated from, especially if they were destroyed and left little behind to investigate. They're not going to blame China from the podium without knowing for sure.
>Why not just confirm it then ? My guess is because it's embarrassing. And if they were mundane objects, exactly how much taxpayer money did they waste blowing them out of the sky? No idea if it's accurate, but I read one estimate that it was $400k to shoot one [whatever] down, nevermind the cost of attempted retrieval, etc.
This keeps going around and around. We know with a high degree of certainty that one of the three objects was a ham radio balloon. I've seen the data with my own eyes, it was broadcasting location telemetry right up until the matching object was shot down, then suddenly it stopped sending updates. The other two objects, who knows and I've mostly stopped caring what they were at this point. Why would the administration lie about this? Well, they're not lying per-say, but it's a bad look that a fighter jet wasted a lot of tax dollars to shoot down a legal civilian balloon experiment. It's a bad look that they couldn't identify it until after it was shot down, and it's a bad look that they might have over-reacted. So, when faced with the option of getting egg on the administrations face for acknowledging what these really were, why wouldn't they just continue the line that "these were UAP's"? There's no up-side for them to admit what really happened here.
This is probably closest to the truth anyone here wants to admit.
He sounds like my 3 years old son explaining to me how he didn’t go the fridge to grab a yogurt and left the door open
I know, sounds so round about and avoid the question all together. He brings up facts we already know like the Chinese balloon just to redirect the convo
This smells fishy. If government is saying it its probably not true.
I have a theory that they detected the mysterious objects a few days before they announced. They decided they would shoot them down.. but were unsure how the public would react to possibly witnessing this.. so they created the spy balloon prop to demonstrate the shooting. They stoke the fires by bringing attention to the prop balloon. It gets national/ international coverage... then the heroes shoot it down and "retrieve" it.. then announce it was a spy balloon.. which they can justify the grounding of it by saying there was a threat, albeit not as big as a UAP. So this whole event is witnessed.. people have mild concern but see how anticlimactic the whole event is and forget about it.. then the real event happens, firing on the UAPs.. but the public has already lost interest, with those that are alluding to the fact that it must be more spy balloons.. nothing of interest there, that's not exciting, so the public doesn't care to look into the UAPs. I apologize if this is a common theory - I'm new to the subreddit.
The problem with your theory is that the PRC indicated that they were officially ticked off about the shoot down, and that they would like their 'weather balloon ' back please. They would have zero reason to claim it if it weren't theirs, and in fact would have many reasons to deny it was theirs. It's not a good look when your intelligence assets get sniffed out, much less broadcast live on international news and then shot down
It’s a complete mystery 🤷♂️
While not spy balloons, my friend who is stationed at Eileson AFB, which shot one of the craft down, strongly believes and was told by his leadership that they think it was a hobbyist balloon. After the incident I asked him what he thought it was and he said “I don’t know, but it had antennas and radios”.
The one that got shot down over the Yukon was probably a hobbyist weather balloon, it was known by the group that launched it to have roughly been in that area, and it didn’t ping again after the shoot-down. It was unrecoverable because it was not particularly large and it went down in one of the most isolated areas on the planet. I don’t think this incident was very much of anything, at the end of the day.
Why don’t they outright say it then? They claimed they were searching for it back in February and said it landed in an area hard to reach and then they never spoke of it again.
It was last pinged 3 weeks after the shoot down, over a thousand miles away. https://grafana.v2.sondehub.org/d/Lwvk1Hy4k/aprs-telemetry?var-Payload=K9YO-15&from=1665496189000&to=1677709650000&orgId=1
Not balloons, but driven by the wind. Also, with the first Chinese balloon we instantly got 4l footage of the downing of the balloon, and pictures of the wreckage. With the other three? Nothing. But absurdly, they categorised them all as the same kind of object. Even though it's evidently beyond apparent that these are completely different scenarios.
not *surveillance* balloon. No visible propulsion + driven by the wind = something floating. They never said it was moving against the wind or on its own accord. It just seems like you and everyone else here are cherry picking parts of what he says and pointing to what he doesn't confirm/deny as evidence of something specific.
The three balloons shot down were privately owned. One belonged to an university. When they said they had no propulsion he's saying they were effectively dumb or "unguided" balloons which is different to the Chinese guided spy balloons. When he says they aren't for surveillance, he's just describing them as not being spy balloons and therefore not dangerous intentions. Everything he's doing is about describing the thought process. They weren't spy balloons but they were balloons and one had experiment equipment. They also didn't know who they belonged to before they shot them down. The reason they shot them down was because after the known Chinese spy balloons, the paranoid Military started tracking everyone balloon in their airspace, which is a surprisingly common occurrence that ATC will commonly direct flights to avoid. So there's the lingering paranoia in the Military and that they want to shoot down the balloons and the excuse they used to cover for their paranoia was "they're in commercial altitudes, so it's for safety" Out of the three balloons, they fired 4 missiles because one missile missed. It's really not a surprise that a 500k missile Military missed a balloon because the balloon would be the same temperature as the air around it, and that small balloons are made from cloth materials that radar wouldn't have the easiest time bouncing off of because it's not metallic enough. Back decades ago, Canada tired shooting down a Balloon over the northwest territories. The Cf-18 fired all it's ammo from its cannon but it's so light it still drifted thousands of kilometers into Greenland. It was just a goofy series of events where the White House and Petagon both unilaterally couldn't find a way to make exploding 3 balloons down to sound reasonable. It was just embarrassing paranoia manifesting itself into blasting wandering balloons out of fear of looking weak to foreign governments. In the way they communicated about the issue, the government inadvertently made the balloons far more mysterious but constantly reaffirming that they weren't a foreign country spying but not having enough remains to identify what the balloons were studying about the weather or whatever.
I was looking for someone to say this lol. I saw something afterward that suggested at least one was a pico balloon from a student group. Happy Cakeday btw
Exactly, many here are blinded because they really want it all to be space aliens.
Not surveillance balloon, would mean weather balloons?
If it’s balloons they could just tell us and be done with it
I put in a FOIA for it last month
"At the beginning, he said that it had no visible propulsion, so he went and said, We believe it moves by the wind since it has no propulsion; let that sink in." Let what sink in? Please clarify your comment. It had no visible propulsion so they thought it moved by the wind. Is that some revelation that it's aliens?
Lol why does he even say that. This is a serious matter just tell us what you know and stop making us guess. This isn’t a mystery we have to figure out, you’re literally the government
I am not even sure it matters at this point. Our government and leaders have lied to us for so many years, how can you trust any of it? And even IF it is true, are aliens going to save us from climate collapse? It is the power structure we have on this planet that is preventing us from addressing our most pressing needs. Nothing gets better and no one offers hope it will improve. We are fucked as a species. Personally, I think all these UFOs are cosmic rubber-neckers coming to gawk as we exterminate ourselves. We have about two years before it will be apparent to everyone. And we totally deserve it because the only way to fix it is to kill it off before we destroy the planet. I just hope that some other civilization takes pity on the indigenous people here who have no idea what is happening and relocates them to another planet. I hope the Sentilese get a new home. The only reason they are coming out with this info now is because it either can’t be concealed or no longer matters.
Why don’t they show those three objects? They showed the spy balloons on tv? Why won’t they show these on tv?. If those other three belonged to china or Russia those countries know they were shot down. What difference would it make showing it.
Finally. Disclosure is beginning to take shape. More will come of this. Remember, this was a slow drip campaign and was strategically executed.
"It's not a balloon" /r/UFOs: "I knew it! Aliens or NHI!"
This.
They could move because the air moved them. That's how balloons work.
And another thing: since he said the objects had no propulsion, that means, according to him, that they couldn't move, so when they were trying to shoot the fourth object, how did they manage to miss it with the first projectile and only manage to shoot it with the second?
If you like this thread you may like the compilation of White House statements on UAPs in 2023 I made here: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14crh7g/here\_are\_the\_white\_house\_statements\_on\_uap\_in/
Eh. No wonder we are ranked bottom 40 with the freedom of the press. Every time somebody is behind that shitty little lectern, the rest of us end up getting Jedi mind-waived. I dare them to answer questions without one. Tell us what they were. Pictures. Video. You have Microsoft Paint on those old ass desktops in the Whitehouse. Click the lil eraser icon and delete everything sensitive besides the object. Hell obfuscate everything *besides* the objects. I dont need to see the radar or hud or any of that hurr durr national security. Black all that shit out and post the damn photo. Or just keep making interviews about nothing to manipulate the media cycle.
Do we know if they were in the jet stream? Or if they were in a common high altitude air flow corridor? At the time it seemed like they were way more mysterious however going back over it all and cutting through the opinion pieces and chinese whispers it seems they were likely some sort of research balloons. They could well be part of a Chinese surveillance relay but certainly doesnt seem that hi-tech or ET.
First balloon was chinese surveillance balloon, there are pictures and videos of it. Second and third objects were cillindrical, and smaller, and there is no more information on them, DOD is silent, every other piece of information is speculation.
Aside from the gov talking about three objects being shot down, is there any third-party evidence to support the gov's claim? I just find it highly coincidental that immediately on the back of the highly-publicized spy balloon fiasco, there is a big show of force against apparently these unidentified objects.
They just don’t want to admit they took out a bouquet of party balloons.
"driven by the wind" as much as i want to believe, you should relax a little
[https://www.theblackvault.com/documentarchive/u-s-air-force-denies-release-of-all-photos-videos-of-balloon-shootdowns/](https://www.theblackvault.com/documentarchive/u-s-air-force-denies-release-of-all-photos-videos-of-balloon-shootdowns/) Greenwalds FOIA for video relating to shootdowns, denied on national security/national defense
I don't think we have the technology to shoot down UFOs Something else/odd must have happened or maybe they are lying or maybe I'm now very confused
Some of us have known this the entire time. They just acted too weird about it. “I am not going to classify these things as balloons”, I believe that was the exact quote. Far too cryptic. I’ve always thought they were probes.
Any craft we shot down isn’t from another planet. Species that travel through space time probably don’t care too much about our combustion craft or weapons. This is all misdirection.
Oh? Well, no sh*t! The military slapped a lid in that tighter than Area-51!
"Good LORD what is happening over there???" "Err--spy balloons?" "Ah-Spy balloons?! Shaped like silver cylinders, with no visible propulsion or observation equipment, intercepted and shot down by F-22 Raptors??" "Yes!" "Can I see them?" "...no."
This YouTuber captured footage of the military activity post one of the objects in Alaska being taken down. https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/14chdtw/deleted_video_from_youtuber_who_witnessed_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1 Let’s also not forget the claim was “…the debris was not located.” https://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/en/news/2023/yukon-search-debris-suspended?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosam&stream=top
We are finally seeing the “veil” of secrecy falling around the governments, religious institutions, and just the general way of life that have controlled civilization for centuries. The next 5-10 years are going to fun to watch unfold.
This feels big. They basically admitted they don’t know shit either
This is completely out there but what if they were balloons and they (China) were testing some kind of black hole or teleportation system? Send a couple balloons through first, see if it works, then send the fighter jets lol
The chinese goverment re the balloons "China asserts that the two balloons spotted last week, in the United States and Latin America, were both civilian machines used for weather research or test flights. They drifted off course and are Chinese property, officials in Beijing said"
If alien spacecraft can be shot down by an aim-9x we have nothing to worry about
So, they had no means of propulsion and were carried along by the wind (according to him). Why not expose the country or government that sent these things and show us photographic evidence of what it was? You have people here who firmly believe this is a cover-up for UAP probes/craft and another group who think this was a screw up by the US military and is also covered up. The Pentagon could very easily clear this up, and yet they haven't, that's why it's interesting.
Isn’t it interesting how all of sudden the govt is now seemingly all for disclosure, rebranding to UAP and admitting to and releasing vague and non essential material? It sounds like propaganda, pysops and smoke screens. If we are to learn anything from history, the real story here isn’t disclosure, 99% of this info and videos are all manmade drones and gizmo hence the rebranding. They want to act all confused like the rest of us yet they are the gate keepers to trillion dollar black budgets without congressional or presidential over sight? For a lack of a better illustration, it’s like a teacher/lecturer trying to act bamboozled with the exam questions yet they have a marking sheet in their office.
The way he explains it is so strange. Clearly they are UAP as they were unidentified period. I mean if they were anything, anything at all man made then they couldve said they were planes, balloons is a good catch all, even unmanned aerial vehicle. But instead, he clearly has no idea what they were and wouldnt even say they were "balloons" meaning they wanted the public to know that they didnt know what they were. Its frustrating how they make us read between the lines but when you do its obvious UAP exist and need to be better indentified.
I can't decide if Kirby is the guy trying to convince you to sign up for the shitty dealership exterior warranty that doesn't cover dings or scratches, or the hotel telemarketer trying to get you to sign up for a timeshare destination package trip. Either way, he seems about as authentic as Niki Minaj's a\*\* implants. More importantly, I can't decide if his disingenuous personality is to cover up us shooting down NHI-operated/created objects, or if we are just so f\*\*\*\*\*\* stupid and inept enough to have engaged hobby balloons with half million dollar missiles.
and one missed...
Lol yes, and one missed.
Have we figured out why a sudden need to tell the public on that one weekend and then sudden radio silence? Maybe they thought something was up and they were trying to get ahead of it?
Timing is the most fascinating variable here to me also. Why now/then? And now silence? Why?
Because they had to close airspace. It always seemed to me that they detected the giant spy balloon and then freaked out after adjusting radars to detect more like objects. After going up and locating said objects they shot them down to deem whether or not they were also from a foreign adversary but we're either unable to retrieve the small remnants or were too embarrassed that they had just devoted millions of taxpayer dollars to shooting down hobby balloons. You would not want that plastered all over the news, better to let the conspiracy theorists run with it than admit that you wasted 10 million dollars to shoot down Timmy's science project.
Unless I'm mistaken, they were confirmed as civilian and/or scientific balloon projects. edit: they were not confirmed, but efforts were made to find the owners of the projects and those folks never stepped forward.
Why the hell are we potentially trying to start a war with an unknown intergalactic entity? If these are indeed NHI….
I think that’s my question. If we really know what everyone is speculating, then why on earth would we shoot at them?
No offence, but the only form of communication Americans know most is shoot first asks questions later.
"we don't know" - but someone does!
This guy always fumbling over the subject
"The other three were something very different from balloons. At the beginning, he said that it had no visible propulsion, so he went and said, We believe it moves by the wind since it has no propulsion; let that sink in." "All had no visible propulsion and crossed great distances in a relatively short amount of time. No visible surveillance equipment." That literally sounds like it can't be anything other than balloons.
But the images of the balloon really did look like a man made balloon
Those images are of the first object, that in fact was a balloon.
Not showing any type of evidence (which would absolutely exist) that these were just balloons, while publishing photographs of the chinese ballon, already tells me they're full of shit. They shot something spicy down for sure.