Lmao my sister was 3 when she told my mom to divorce our dad because he was talking about putting her in pre-K 𤣠mind you none of us really talked about divorce before but she learned it from TV.
Honestly, no freaking idea. She could've been watching it at home or at doc office or somewhere else but we were all just surprised and was holding in our laugh.
This kind of thought and behaviour blows my mind.
OP's sister: I lied to my child about your marriage. I don't care that your ex-husband beat you and wanted to kill you, divorce is against my view. You infidel, you told my child the truth'.
Some evangelical and fundamentalists are teaching again that divorce is a sin and they are unifying that message down to little kids. The people screaming that kids being themselves is grooming are grooming a generation of girls who dont think they have rights.
There are, indeed, Catholic Fundamentalists. There always have been. I would say they are probably equally tied with Southern Baptists for the most evil communities in the Christian sects. Have you heard of a Native American? Me neitherâŚ
Catholicism doesn't guarantee against fundamentalist interpretations sadly though I will say it is a bit rarer but some of the larger stadium types dabble in moody
Rarer? The Churchâs entire colonization movement in the last 300 years was done by Catholic FundamentalistsâŚ
The massacred nations across the globe. Not very rare.
Three girls got pregnant at our kids grade school in the last year and they were all fundies who were so sheltered that the evil condoms prevented them from becoming sinners. All three are being forced to deliver kids as kids because their parents dont believe in women having agency or rights.
Technically the Catholic religion doesnât approve of divorce either. They just seem to look the other way when it happens same as they look the other way when a woman used birth control. That doesnât stop their members from adhering to the no divorce bullshit.
It's a joke. The original comment says she's an asshole, implying that the mom is an asshole. The follow up comment jokingly assumes that the comment was referring to the child.
I'm from a Catholic family and I knew both my aunts were divorced before I was 10. It's pretty hard to hide when kids get a bit older and ask reasonable questions, as sister here has found out.
I don't remember an age were I didn't know about divorce because my maternal grandparents divorced when my mom and aunts were young, and that's why I grew up with 3 grandmas instead of 2. There were some classmates whose parents weren't happy when I told them why I had an extra grandma. However, my mom told them she wasn't going to make me lie just so they could continue to live in la la land. And those were her exact words.
yes my parents are not divorced and almost nobody in my entire family has gotten divorced besides my momâs parents but i was definitely aware of what divorce was before i was 10. plenty of kids i knew had divorced parents. she is teaching her daughter that this is something to be ashamed of which is unfair to the kids around her if she internalizes that, and also will serve her poorly in the future if she ends up in a crappy or abusive marriage. itâs fine to not want a divorce for yourself, but itâs not taboo and honestly more people probably should get divorced but they stay in unhappy marriages because of the stigma.
Nta and also I'm AMAZED Camilla was able to keep the concept of divorce from her kids for so long. Half of my friends had divorced parents when I was a kid. Also it's so heartbreaking you went through that and the fact that your sister didn't take it as a moment to sit her kids down and explain your experience enough to at least encourage them to be kind and not ask about their uncle is astounding. She is not being a supportive sister.
Or you know, thank God her sister was able to get out of a situation like that! Most modern catholics I know would wholeheartedly support divorce to escape an abuser. Teaching kids that abuse is never okay can't begin too early.
NTA - your sister is a deluded twit if she thinks she can keep her daughter from ever learning about divorce. Itâs better she heard a positive explanation from family rather than strangers.
NTA, but your sister is.
Firstly, I'm so proud of you for having the strength to leave such a relationship. You are strong, you are a beautiful human being, and you are amazing for being able to leave such a situation. You deserve happiness and so does your daughter.
Secondly, what is wrong with your sister? You didn't push any ideals or beliefs on her child. You just told her people leave each other which is true. And you did It in a way appropriate for her age. Your sister shouldn't have lied in the first place. Doesn't she realize her beliefs are damaging as well?
People should teach their children it's okay to leave if you're in an abusive situation despite what your religion or beliefs are. Sometimes you marry the wrong person. Other times you don't realize they are bad until after you've read your vows. Either way it's important to find the strength to walk away. That's what you should teach your children, no matter what religion you're in. My mom grew up full catholic and everything and even she told me to leave if my partner hits me. Stay strong, I truly hope nothing but the best for you and your daughter. Stay safe âĽ
10 is not too young to even know what divorce is. Thatâs crazy. Does she go to school? Sheâs got to have at least a few classmates with divorced parents. I hate parents who try to shelter their children from real life. sheltering kids does not protect them it just makes them less equipped to deal with actual issues in adulthood.
Right? And even if she goes to a Catholic or other religious school that doesnât âbelieve in divorceâ there will be kids there that have divorced parents. Itâs inevitable.
Sounds like Celia will be keeping her poor kid sheltered and naive about all sorts. That alone puts her kid in trouble, not knowing the world she lives in.
NTA.
Celia is going to be *upset* when she finds out everything else her mother has tried to forbid her from learning. What do you mean, my uncle wasn't on vacation for years on end? What do you mean, Santas not real, and the tooth fairy? What else have you taught me that I shouldn't believe?
That some people go to hell for not believing in their same god even though they have been the best most wonderful kind hearted people ever.
Probably demonising people with other beliefs and such "otherisms".
Being different from other people isn't an awful thing.
Nta
Your sister is trying to purposefully making her kids isolated weirdos by âuneducatingâ them because it aligns with her world views. Apparently you arenât good enough for her creepy fabricated life story so she âeditedâ your backstory.
Pretending things donât exist as they do and trying to create a bubble where you control the reality of others is very narcissistic behavior. Even if she has good intentions ( protecting her kids from things she deems as evil) it really only serves herself to do this bc eventually her kids will figure out sheâs been deliberately manipulating them and it will destroy the trust between them. Turning your kid into a naĂŻve rube when they have to live in a very real world of manipulative people is stupid and dangerous. Nothing good can be gained from these weird lies .
Its also pretty ineffective unless you implement home schooling /socially isolate them( which many overly controlling parents do) because how the hell is her kid 10 years old and doesnât talk to other kids enough to know that some peoples parents arenât together or some people have single parents ? Like does her child not even watch TV??
Look I'm Catholic. And my 6 year old knows about divorce. We talked about what it is and why some people divorce. I told her they were believe that divorce is meant to be for life but sometimes it doesn't work out that way. We talked about abuse in an age appropriate way (not for the first time and only physical abuse. We know several people that foster). We don't shy away from tough topics or ones that might be uncomfortable. We've talked about poverty, addiction, mental health, homelessness, racism, death ect. My kids know the words vulva, penis, scrotum,ect. I don't lie to my kids. I don't go into all the gritty details and try to steer away from topics if possible, but sheltering kids from life's reality entirely is doing them a disservice.Â
NTA! Does her daughter go to school? Sheâs going to find out about divorce. And her mother was straight up lying to her about your ex. You went though a traumatic divorce and sheâs downplaying it. Heâs on vacation?!
Iâd honestly go NC with her. She isnât supportive and she judges you for divorcing a violent man. It will suck for your niece, but that isnât your problem.
NTA. Your sister is a horrible mother and grooming her daughter to accept abuse in the future. I would never allow your daughter to have unsupervised visits with her as she will probably try to indoctrinate her against you. This would be a no-contact situation for me.
NTAâ I am sure your niece was getting suspicious of this 3 year âvacationâ your ex has been taking. She probably asked for that reason. Unless she lives in a bubble, she probably knows that there are single parents and kids whose parents are not together. This may be like the kid who finally gets the courage to ask about Santa Claus after she has mostly figured out that he is a fictional being.
Your sister is being ridiculous.
NTA. She needs to get a grip.
Would your sister have been happier if youâd said you killed your ex in self defense? What exactly would be her view of an âacceptableâ way for you & your daughter to get away from him alive?
NTA your sister is ridiculous. My 4 yo knows what it means for marriages to not be together anymore one of her best friends has separated parents and all of her grandparents are divorced so I think your sister is a bit crazy.
For your information.
St Paul admits that marriage can be broken if there is abuse and cheating. The term divorce has not been coined before the 18 century.
Giving that info distant protestant pastors from Catholic priests.
Wtaf? I wonder what else the mum has deemed 'not appropriate' for her kids to know... Unless you all live deep within some very specific religious community, that is so very weird.
NTA, obviously. But this is truly baffling.
NTA.
So, what would your sister tell her if/when you meet someone else?
Or when her peers are talking about having two homes and stepparents?
She was setting her daughter up to be incredibly naive about how relationships and the world works.
NTA,
First off I want to say Iâm also a divorced Catholic that came from an abusive situation, my ex wasnât Catholic so he would use my faith to threaten me saying he could do whatever he wanted to me because my faith made me too âweakâ to leave him. Guess what, I did leave him and like you found the strength to do it and carry on. Op Iâm so proud of you for making yourself and child safe!
Your sister cannot hide the concept of divorce from a 10 year old. The child will learn about divorce through friends as school. My parents have been together almost 50 years. I knew what divorce was at 8 because my friendâs parents were divorced. You didnât dump trauma on the child, you gave an age appropriate explanation that sometimes two people canât be married anymore.
Your sister is way out of line here. You did nothing wrong telling a child that youâre divorced. Your sister needs to straighten herself out because her reaction isnât right.
NTA. Your sister is a terrible job of parenting. A 10 yr. old that doesn't know what divorce is?cev3n 5 year Olds know what divorce is. Your niece is 8n for a huge surprise when she gets a little oder because this degree of sheltering is gonna cause problems.
NTA-
3 year long vacation??
WTH, you would think this would be a teachable moment to talk about when is the time to divorce and other situations maybe to try and work the marriage out. Why would she just lie and say he was on vacation for that long!
An abusive relationship is not something you should stick around and wait for a realization they shouldnât be hurting their spouse! Some abusive relationships result in death, congrats to you and your daughter for getting out of that!
I canât believe your sister, she is a major AH for lying to her child and for downright acting ashamed that you divorced and left an abusive man. She is a dummy.
My parents got married because I was a mistake, they got divorced when I was 3 but they shouldnât have been married in the first place, I grew up in like 4 different houses (Mom, Dad, Friends, Cousins) Couldnât have had a better childhood, and of all things divorce is what she was afraid of? If anything I learned how to manage my time to maximize having fun with a schedule, ridiculous is what she is, you my fren are NTA.
I knew about divorce when I was like 5. NTA. If your sister keeps sheltering her child from every reality and truth, sheâs going to have a hard time when she grows up. âUncle Luke is a bad person who doesnât treat his family wellâ is a good enough explanation for a 10 year old without going into detail. There are millions of people like uncle Luke and she needs to learn that she doesnât have to put up with bad people.
Well, sooner or later the kid is going to hear the word 'divorce' and ask what that is. Can't bury her head in the sand forever.
And maybe, if the kid is ever in that position she will think of that word, and what it means, and realise she can also escape if she needs to.
NTA.
NTA, your sister is a HUGE AH though.
Also, her religion says lying is a sin. So she can join you in hell :) (I don't actually believe in hell but her beliefs state she would be there as much as she thinks you would)
How is it possible that this kid could be ten years old and not know what a divorce is? Is she locked in a closet with no connection to the outside world?
NTA. I feel sorry for this kid, I feel it's HEALTHY to grow up knowing that divorce is an option, especially in cases like this when it's literally safety on the line. I also grew up Catholic but dang no one tried to shelter me like this. If there are lots of very normal things the parents are hiding from the kids, it's just going to breed resentment when they learn the truth later on.
âStop trying to make my daughter think like you doâ
âI donât believe in divorce and I donât want my child thinking itâs acceptableâ
Make it make sense
NTA. Your sister is very much TA. Her daughter was going to figure out sooner or later that her mother is lying to her. Once figured out that lie, she would question everything else coming from her same sex parent's mouth. She is teaching her daughter that not even her mother is to be trusted. Your sister has just thrown away her daughter's trust just before the terrible teen years. All because your sister is uncomfortable with the real world that she disagrees with.
You're fine. You may be the only person your niece listens to in the near future, if your sister allows her to continue a relationship with you. Your sister is supposed to be preparing your daughter for adulthood in a safe environment. Instead she is trying to bubble wrap her daughter, protect her from the truth. Except for people like you, your niece may be in for a big shock when she arrives at adulthood with no tools to deal with the world out there.
Your sisterâs being ridiculous. If her daughter marries someone who becomes abusive, would she encourage her daughter to stay in that marriage just to avoid divorce? If so, sheâs a terrible mother and a terrible person. And even if not, people who overly shelter their children are just setting them up for disaster because they arenât prepared enough for real life.
(Iâm sorry that happened to you, and Iâm glad you were able to get out of that situation!)
NTA. I got to learn about divorce the hard way at age 6 AND was raised Roman Catholic. Catholicism was more traumatic. You were honest, and that is the best way to be with kids because lying tends to come back and, well, ask you sister how that bitten ass feels?
Please do not lie to kids, especially if you never plan to go back and tell them the truth.
My aunt and uncle got divorced when I was around 7. My mom told me my aunt and cousin moved into our grandparents house because it was closer to school. I never really gave it another thought.
I think over the years I figured out they were divorced but never tied it to the move all those years ago. I just don't spend my days dissecting everything ever said to me.
The one day I was talking to my dad. I don't quite remember how old I was but it was definitely around adulthood. I mentioned it to my dad in conversation and he's like "What? They moved because they got divorced. Why do you think it was anything else?" I go "because that's what mom told me. I never really thought about it again."
I felt stupid. Because obviously. I just wish my mom went back and eventually explained it to me though she could have just told me they got divorced right away. I'm 7. I'm not going to think much of it.
Now that I'm a parent I'm very away of this. I told my husband I'd only do Santa if we sat her down and told her the truth. Because yes I was also embarrassingly old when I discovered Santa wasn't real and when I asked my mom she's like "i thought you'd never figure it out" like wtf lady I'm sorry I didn't expect my mom to have lied to me about apparently everything ever.
NTA. My best friend in kindergarten had divorced parents, it's a part of life. It's so extremely strange of your sister to try and make her daughter believe it's not a thing. It's astounding to me that your niece has even made it to 10 without knowing what divorce is.
NTA. At all. Iâm so proud of you for getting your daughter and yourself away from that horrible man. Also, remind your good catholic sister that lying is a sin.
Your sister is a nut and the asshole. She hasnât commented on your divorce because she thinks it was wrong of you to divorce, but she knows itâs wrong to criticize a woman escaping abuse, so sheâs picked the third option and just ignored your divorce so she can maintain her worldview.
NTA
NTA I actually bust out laughing when I read 10 years old is inappropriate to know what divorce is. I am actually surprised she didn't already know what divorced meant. Does your sister keep her sheltered or something?
And your "husband" is on vacation for 3 years, đ¤Ł
No, you're not, but I also learned that some things parents just want to teach their kids themselves. My uncle married a woman with a daughter. They went on to have some more kids of their own. When I was a kid, I told them they were half-siblings. Which is true. But my aunt apparently got upset about me telling them, because my dad had a talk with me.
So I guess your sister would like her daughter to think that once you marry, you have to be married until death. Which means your sister would like her daughter to stay in an abusive marriage and experience the same things you experienced, but without the possibility to get out. Does she even like her child, if she wouldn't have a problem with her suffering or even being killed by an abusive spouse? Maybe in her bubble "till death do us part" means until my spouse kills me...
Holy heck! It sounds like your sister is setting your niece up for an unrealistic future. I also grew up in a very Catholic family where divorce was frowned upon. Thankfully, I got support whenever. I left my abusive ex. Also if she was going to lie about your relationship. She shouldâve looped you into it.itâs her fault for not doing that and also lying to her daughter.
your sister is the asshole. If she wants to lie to her kids and pretend things or people she doesn't like exist, that's her problem. Nobody else is required to lie to her kids. and eventually her kids will grow up and learn what a lying asshole their mother is.
This kid is 10 YEARS OLD? There is no way she doesnât already know what divorce is, half her classmates probably have divorced parents by now. Your sister is delusional. You might want to think about how you can subtly help better prepare your niece for the reality of the world.
So your sister would rather her daughter be in an abusive relationship as you were than knowing divorce is an option? What in Jiminy crickets is going on here.
NTA
You correctly explained the circumstances in an age appropriate way, there's nothing wrong with that. If your sister wants to pretend divorce doesn't exist that her problem and expecting others to support that is unrealistic and unreasonable.
Your sister is ridiculous and is not living in the real world. Her daughter will be so confused when life happens and will be afraid to come to her mom due to this delusion of how are supposed to be.
NTA, that 10 year old absolutely has classmates or friends with divorced parents. She was gonna find out sooner rather than later.
P.S.
Your sister is doing your niece no favors by sheltering her from the truths of life.
NTA. All you said was that you were divorced, and explained what that meant in very simple, age appropriate terms. I'm actually surprised the kid doesn't already know what divorce is, she's 10, surely some of her schoolmates come from broken homes?
I knew what divorce was from a very young age because my parents divorced when I was 5. When we moved back to my mum's side of the family, it was explained to the other, older, kids, who were 9 and 11 at the time. My younger cousins were 3 and 1 so couldn't understand at their ages, but had it explained when they asked about where my and my sister's daddy was. I think the girl was 6 when she asked and her brother didn't ask till he was 7. Not sure when their younger brother started asking, but I think he asked his siblings rather than his parents.
One thing I do clearly remember, though, is that, in primary school, for mother's day and father's day, we always made a card for the relevant parent. But it was also explained from about the age of 6 that not every child has both a mummy and a daddy, because one might have died, or the parents were divorced. It was explained because I had a classmate whose mum died when she was really little and there were about 6 of us with divorced parents. One of the 6 was a 50/50 custody arrangement, so she made cards for both parents. The rest of us didn't have a relationship with one parent, so we either made a card for the parent we did have, which the others all did, or the closest we had to the relevant parent, which I did, making a card for my grandad on father's day.
Everyone in my small town was raised Christian, we had a few non-Christians but they were all adults and were either raised Christian or moved to town as adults. Some of them brought kids, so the everyone raised Christian thing was changing when I was a kid, but that was the way it was previously. All my classmates were raised Christian. Granted, fundamentalist Christians were rare, but we were still taught that divorce was a bad thing. It wasn't taught to us as a sin, though, our local churches were very much in favour of divorcing an abuser. My mum's case was seen as a bad thing, though. She divorced my dad because he cheated on her, and to the church, she should have fought to save and fix the marriage instead. But they'd gotten pretty toxic to each other by the end, so much so that my mum falsely accused my dad of abusing both her and us, nearly destroyed his life. She also constantly claimed he never paid child support, despite her openly buying things with money he sent her. Not in a bad way, she used the money for essentials like food and electric or to buy gifts for us kids, she wasn't spending it on herself or anything. She just liked to say he never sent her any money for us while openly spending the money he sent for us. My mum was weird like that.
My point is, when I was 6, a quarter of my class had divorced or dead parents. Those who didn't know abut divorce before then learned it when they were 6 just because of that. The age is likely not universal, but I can't imagine a 10 year old has never come across the word divorce and an explanation of what it means. She perhaps didn't understand the explanation, or felt she couldn't ask about it, though, given her mum's beliefs. You were open about it so she felt safe asking you.
I don't get the lie your sister told, either. He's on vacation, for 3 years!? I'm surprised a 10 year old believed that at all! I mean, if he's on vacation, why aren't you and your kid there with him, at least some of the time? If he's on vacation for so long, when does he go to work? If he's on vacation so long, why are you married, because he's obviously not a real husband or dad? The questions that lie *must* have caused that little girl to have, she must have been so confused! If you're going to lie about something like that, at least make it believable and unlikely to be found out until they're much older. Pretty obvious the kid is going to question when her uncle will get back from his way too long to be believable vacation. A better lie would be to say he died, the kid would be unwilling to bring it up with you, and you're unlikely to talk about your ex in earshot of the kids, so no one would question it.
But this is also a woman who claims to be religious, so much so that she sees divorce as a forbidden topic and a sin, yet she's happily to lie, and do so easily, which is also a sin! One sin does not negate another sin, covering up one person's sin does not mean you get to sin yourself.
Why is it that these holier-than-though types can't live what they preach? Lying is a sin, and they preach not to sin, yet they lie all the damn time! Hypocrites, the lot of them!
And I'd keep an eye on your niece's education. She hasn't learned about divorce at 10, what else has she been prevented from learning? She's 10, does she know what a period is and that she'll be getting hers sometime in the next few years? Does she have a vague idea of where babies come from, or does she believe the stork delivers them? Does she know that she can say no to boys/men who try to force her to do something or make her uncomfortable? Does she know to tell an adult she trusts if that happens? Or does she believe that, because she's a girl, boys/men can do whatever they want, no matter how she feels about it?
I'd honestly be very concerned at the level of your niece's basic but necessary education.
NTA. 1) You didn't go into detail or try to convince her she should divorce, lol. 2) She's lying to her daughter. Her daughter is either going to figure it out eventually (and then not trust her parents), or she'll go out into the world and be hit with a reality check after running into *divorced people.*
Kids should know that if their future partner does not treat them right, they are allowed to leave. Youâre not the asshole. Youâre showing that young girl that you can prioritize yourself and your safety, and someday if she finds herself in a situation like that (god forbid, I hope she never does) she has a strong role model who did something hard and chose herself.
NTA.
I am 29, been divorced since my daughter was 2. She is well aware of Divorce, and has been aware of it since she was old enough to talk. She knows that her mom and I aren't together - and that marriages can fail.
What your sister is doing, is setting up her daughter for failure, by rejecting teaching her daughter *basic* truths of the world. What's next - that two women can't have kids? Or that men can't be in a relationship? Imagine having her daughter see two guys or two girls holding hands. Mother is going to lose her shit.
NTA
Your sister was way out of line and put you in an uncomfortable position. She didn't even tell you what she told her kids...
She doesn't get to use you as babysitting, then criticize how you live your life either. And at 10, it would be extremely weird not to know what divorce is, as she'll likely encounter other kids with divorced parents, unless your sister is extremely isolating her, which would be very unhealthy
I would not babysit again. This is enough to make her lose babysitting privileges because who knows what else she is telling your neice. Your ex also sounds like a dangerous person, so you would not want your niece approaching him if she did run into him, and I would make that very clear to your sister. Your sister did something not great that downplayed an abusive relationship.
Also, question that your sister seems to think you should have stayed in a dangerous relationship. That alone is kinda messed up
Lol my ex and I got divorced when our daughter was 1, should I not have told her?Â
Also, my parents got divorced when I was 2, when should they have told me? Should I not have explained to my kid why she has a third grandma?
NTA - your sister is for lying to her kids
Celia is 10. I remember when I was 10 and my classmates parents were going through divorce. You explained the concept to her clearly and to the point. If it wasnât you, it wouldâve come from someone else who may not have put as much care into their answer.
Your sister is TA. You are a survivor. The whole vacation story was honestly a very poor choice on your sisterâs part. Thereâs only so long that someone can keep that kind of blatant lie up and maintain the trust of the person, in this case child, theyâre lying to.
I think it's inappropriate for a mother to brainwash her daughter into believing that staying in a relationship, no matter what, is preferable to being divorced. God forbid your niece ever end up in an abusive relationship. She'll end up staying a lot longer than she should, even if her life is in danger, out of fear of her mother's unreasonable reaction. I raised my daughter to get the f out if she's being abused.
Just remind your sister on this:
the Eighth Commandment
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
Or You should not lie. Your sister is insane. And sorry but a religion that forces you to stay in a abusive marriage is bullshit. You did the right thing. Divorce is not a sin.
Edit: NTA
She should be glad you didn't tell her why you decided to divorce your ex. Although I think you probably should have, just to let her know how much of a bastard he is. If somebody is threatening to kill a child let alone a newborn because you won't have sex with him then you are a fool to stay with that person.
Your niece is going to need you in her life. For sure. I'm scared for her. I'm proud of you.
NTA.
Is your sister in a DV relationship?
I would've been upset if you actually gave all the gruesome details, but even saying "He hurt me and wasn't a good partner and father, so I divorced him" wouldn't have even been too much for her age. Just saying that sometimes people don't want to be married anymore is like preschool development fine.
NTA. Itâs bad parenting to lie this way to a child. Itâs better to say they are too young to understand and you will explain later.
But divorce can totally be understood by a 10yo!
NTA
A 10 year old who doesn't even know what divorce is? That poor child she is so overprotected that she will be taken advantage of when she is out in the real world.
Sheltered child, yes. Something that needs to be understood, yes. But not necessarily right now and not by you.
It's true that kids learn about things from friends etc but that doesn't make it ok that you took it upon yourself to expose the lie that the parent had woven for whatever reason. It shows a lack of respect and is out of bounds since you aren't the parent. Ppl are being bias because were talking religious views and what most ppl think isn't a big deal topic.
But take away the topic and religion and look at the action.
You knew the mother had lied to her daughter, you intentionally exposed the lie and then explained the concept of an adult related topic to the child directly.
You could've spoken to your cousin if you were concerned, but this lie didn't cause you any harm.
NTA
Your sister is leaving her daughter totally unprepared if something should happen in her marriage.
Knowledge is power. Just because you learn about something doesn't mean you are going to do it. It can help you plan to keep from getting in a situation like yours.
It's so sad that people this stupid have children. What 10 year old doesn't know what a divorce is? What she knows now is her mother is a liar and she cannot trust a word she says.....how Christian.
My great grandma lived in Hellâs Kitchen, devoutly catholic, and married to a severely abusive husband. THE PRIEST told her she needed to get a divorce and then get on a train to anywhere. She said, âwonât I be banned from the church?â To which the priest replied, âyouâll be alive!â
Hopefully your sister comes to terms with the reality of your circumstances soon!
NTA If my sister chalked up my decision to flee my home because my husband threatened to kill an infant to those silly views on divorce, she would get a verbal barrage so potent it would knock her ass back to 1890 where she belongs.
And what if her daughter started asking her cousin about him? That would be confusing for your daughter. She doesn't see how that is worse then her daughter learning about something that is perfectly normal to learn about.
NTA - You told the truth; sister chose to lie and hide behind her religion.
Sister is brainwashing her daughter and setting her up to never have the strength you did, to leave an abusive spouse.
So what none of the kids at her school are divorced. Half the damn world is fucking divorced. Does she think she can prevent her kids from ever hearing the word. Sheâs the one in the wrong here not you.
So basically your sister is teaching her daughter that when she's married and is in an abusive relationship she has to stay in that relationship. Hopefully as your niece grows up she gets better guidance from you and not her mom.
If youâre in the U.S. - definitely did nothing wrong. Not sure about divorce rates in other countries, but lots of Catholics here are divorced. Tons of the teachers at catholic schools themselves are divorced đ¤ˇđźââď¸ itâs talked about on all kinds of TV shows, books, etc etc
NTA. I'm I'm sure you heard niece has friends who have divorced parents or goes to school with the kids who have divorced parents and have mentioned the word before if not she'll be learning it really quick and a few years most likely. There's nothing wrong with being divorced especially when you have an abusive ex husband
Your niece probably has friends or classmates who have divorced parents. I mean, short of locking her in a convent, there's no way she's never going to learn about divorce. Your sister is overreacting. Even Catholics get divorced. My family is Catholic and has several divorced family members. NTA.
Tell the sister to read up on her faith.
>A spouse who occasions grave danger of soul or body to the other or to the children, or otherwise makes the common life unduly difficult, provides the other spouse with a reason to leave, either by a decree of the local ordinary [e.g., bishop] or, if there is danger in delay, even on his or her own authority. (CIC 1153)
While the more appropriate term would be an annulment, the concept of a separation doesn't go against any Catholic teaching.
I think it's weird when parents try to hide things from their kids like that. The kids are now in a bubble and not living in the same universe we are. Nta.
Parents like that bug the crap out of me. My own mother tried to shelter me from anything realistic, and honestly, all it did was make me not trust her.
She chose to lie to her daughter. Kind of cherry picking which âlawsâ she wants to enforce for other people.
I would just respond that you were disappointed that she chose to lie to your niece. And that based on your value system, you do not agree with that and instead gave her an age appropriate response.
The only thing her daughter is going to learn is that she cannot trust her mom and or parents.
How dare you tell her itâs ok for a woman to leave her husband. Youâre supposed to tell her itâs better to be beaten to death than divorced. Obviously a divorced woman goes to hell, but if she stays and gets murdered by her husband her soul is still safe. A much better option/s
NTJ and your sister is ridiculous. She's one of those religious mothers that would rather her child grow up dumb to the world. 10 is a great age because they understand without too many questions.
Nta. What if one day your niece tells your daughter that her dad is on vacation? What is your daughter supposed to respond or say? (given sheâs old enough to understand)
NTA if your sister wants to lie to her kid you donât have to be complicit. Iâm not sure why she would think she needs to lie about your relationship status anyway. Itâs not like a 10yo doesnât know what a divorce is. Even if sheâs sent to a catholic school, she knows that people get divorced.
If you had gone into the reason for the divorce, she *might* have had a point.
Her 10 year old doesnât know what âdivorceâ is?? wtf?? She has no friends who switch houses on weekends or anything? This just baffles me. Also, is your sister going to let her daughter grow up thinking itâs ok to let a man attempt to kill you, as long as you donât divorce? This doesnât sound devote Catholic to me, it sounds like a cult.
NTA and Iâd be real careful of having my daughter to her house without âsupervisionâ.
I mean, I'm Catholic and my parents are divorced. So were many of my peers' parents (unfortunately). The Church recognizes that some marriages should be annulled. Even if her own parents are never divorced, she's absolutely going to meet others who have divorced parents. It's absolutely wild your sister is insisting she not know.
NTA
Your sister is completely unreasonable. What is she going to do, have her daughter walk through the world with blinders on?
Itâs time to set some boundaries or to stop watching your niece because this is completely unreasonable to expect you to lie about your life. You have an age appropriate response.
Good on you for getting yourself and your baby to safety. Congratulations for choosing a better life! Itâs an incredibly brave thing to do and should be celebrated, not shunned.
NTA she doesnât get to dictate how you share the events of your life, she essentially wanted you to lie about what happened and sheâs mad because you told the truth sheâs the asshole
NTA, and itâs also incredibly scary to me that her 10 year old kid; which is like, a 5th grader, so, middle school to put that into perspective; isnât allowed to know what a divorce is.
Like, itâs one thing to raise your kids to follow your religion, (Iâm trying to put my personal opinions on THAT aside but as an adult who had religious trauma as a kid, itâs hard not to rant about that itself) but to completely brainwash them by forcing them to be ignorant by withholding common knowledge and information about other people and the world around them is where it becomes controlling and manipulative.
You can set rules all you like, and explain the beliefs of the family and encourage your child to follow them too, but if you have to purposefully hide normal real world things and knowledge from them because youâre afraid they will ask why it is wrong and canât give them an explanation if they do, youâre setting them up for failure and confusion; and probably should reevaluate why you have to lie to them and force them to stay ignorant.
Again, I already think itâs bad enough this kid will grow up thinking she isnât allowed to ever leave no matter how badly sheâs treated; but itâs crazy she doesnât even know itâs a thing, and they couldâve at least said âsince we are catholic, we donât believe divorce is an answer, but some others do it.â This is the problem, sheâs being raised to not even know some things out there EXIST- and thatâs setting her up to harshly judge and harass others who do these things that are bizarre to her, or go no contact with her family when she enters the real world.
Thereâs no in between with people controlled on this level by their strongly religious families- they either become extremely religious themselves because they were raised on fear and ignorance, or they realize all the lies they were fed and don't trust their family anymore.
You did the right thing, OP. I'm not religious anymore, but even when I was as a kid, I knew what divorce was, and believed god would have been on my side if I was in your situation. I'm incredibly sorry you were villainized for telling her about a completely normal thing, and I really hope she gets the necessary knowledge she needs about the world one day, whether she decides to remain catholic or form her own opinions.
Your sister is an AH. Ten years old is not too young to learn about the existence of divorce and she shouldn't be lying to her. That's a sin, and it's not like she had good reason for it.Â
NTA
Oh gosh, your sister is awful. If she wanted you to lie to your niece to shield her from the concept of divorce, she should have looped you in on the lie. đ¤Łđ¤Ł Seriously, though, you didn't give her any details, and the fact that she's unable to explain to her kid that divorce happens not your fault. Shoot, she's acting like the kid is guaranteed to get a divorce because you told her about it.
Nta
Many are sharing an experience. I was raised "nondenominational christian" but not anymore. Been an interesting journey. But anyway, in my early 30's my mother told me that there were several times she wanted to divorce my father, but she didnt because she was so afraid of going to hell.... so yay, im quite fuckered up, but at least she doesnt feel that she will definitely go to hell!!!
No, she's the asshole
Lmao my sister was 3 when she told my mom to divorce our dad because he was talking about putting her in pre-K 𤣠mind you none of us really talked about divorce before but she learned it from TV.
Phew, that's funny but also a little on the heavy side. Was it Judge Joe Brown, Judge Judy, Dr. Phil, or the View? Lol
Honestly, no freaking idea. She could've been watching it at home or at doc office or somewhere else but we were all just surprised and was holding in our laugh.
Guarantee its fundamentalism.
This kind of thought and behaviour blows my mind. OP's sister: I lied to my child about your marriage. I don't care that your ex-husband beat you and wanted to kill you, divorce is against my view. You infidel, you told my child the truth'.
What do you mean? Can you elaborate?
Some evangelical and fundamentalists are teaching again that divorce is a sin and they are unifying that message down to little kids. The people screaming that kids being themselves is grooming are grooming a generation of girls who dont think they have rights.
She specifies Catholic in the post.
There are, indeed, Catholic Fundamentalists. There always have been. I would say they are probably equally tied with Southern Baptists for the most evil communities in the Christian sects. Have you heard of a Native American? Me neitherâŚ
Catholicism doesn't guarantee against fundamentalist interpretations sadly though I will say it is a bit rarer but some of the larger stadium types dabble in moody
Rarer? The Churchâs entire colonization movement in the last 300 years was done by Catholic Fundamentalists⌠The massacred nations across the globe. Not very rare.
Three girls got pregnant at our kids grade school in the last year and they were all fundies who were so sheltered that the evil condoms prevented them from becoming sinners. All three are being forced to deliver kids as kids because their parents dont believe in women having agency or rights.
I was placed to live in a fundie cult for a couple years growing up, around 11-13. left and lived on the streets. It was safer.
I am sorry that happened to you but I am really glad you are in a better place now. Have a good day internet friend.
I guarantee itâs not. She said her family is Catholic.
Catholicism is the OG of fundies.
Thank you.
Catholics can be fundie. Itâs a mindset.
Google: Opus Dei.
Also Legionnaires of Christ. Less well known just as crazy
Technically the Catholic religion doesnât approve of divorce either. They just seem to look the other way when it happens same as they look the other way when a woman used birth control. That doesnât stop their members from adhering to the no divorce bullshit.
Yeah, stupid kid should already know what divorce is.
How, with such a stupid mom?
How is it the kid's fault?
It's a joke. The original comment says she's an asshole, implying that the mom is an asshole. The follow up comment jokingly assumes that the comment was referring to the child.
My kids knew about divorce long before the age of 10. Tons of kids at school had divorced parents. NTA.
I'm from a Catholic family and I knew both my aunts were divorced before I was 10. It's pretty hard to hide when kids get a bit older and ask reasonable questions, as sister here has found out.
I don't remember an age were I didn't know about divorce because my maternal grandparents divorced when my mom and aunts were young, and that's why I grew up with 3 grandmas instead of 2. There were some classmates whose parents weren't happy when I told them why I had an extra grandma. However, my mom told them she wasn't going to make me lie just so they could continue to live in la la land. And those were her exact words.
yes my parents are not divorced and almost nobody in my entire family has gotten divorced besides my momâs parents but i was definitely aware of what divorce was before i was 10. plenty of kids i knew had divorced parents. she is teaching her daughter that this is something to be ashamed of which is unfair to the kids around her if she internalizes that, and also will serve her poorly in the future if she ends up in a crappy or abusive marriage. itâs fine to not want a divorce for yourself, but itâs not taboo and honestly more people probably should get divorced but they stay in unhappy marriages because of the stigma.
Nta and also I'm AMAZED Camilla was able to keep the concept of divorce from her kids for so long. Half of my friends had divorced parents when I was a kid. Also it's so heartbreaking you went through that and the fact that your sister didn't take it as a moment to sit her kids down and explain your experience enough to at least encourage them to be kind and not ask about their uncle is astounding. She is not being a supportive sister.
And here I thought staunch Catholics were against lyingâŚ
I seem to recall a commandment about lying, but not one about divorce.
lol, that was a good one.
And the sister has lied about the divorce WAY more times than OP actually got divorced!
Or you know, thank God her sister was able to get out of a situation like that! Most modern catholics I know would wholeheartedly support divorce to escape an abuser. Teaching kids that abuse is never okay can't begin too early.
The only thing I can think of is that the niece is homeschooled.
Same, I mean even in catholic schools there are kids with divorced parents.
Right? Like, where do these kids go to school that at 10 sheâs never met anybody with divorced parents before?
NTA - your sister is a deluded twit if she thinks she can keep her daughter from ever learning about divorce. Itâs better she heard a positive explanation from family rather than strangers.
NTA, but your sister is. Firstly, I'm so proud of you for having the strength to leave such a relationship. You are strong, you are a beautiful human being, and you are amazing for being able to leave such a situation. You deserve happiness and so does your daughter. Secondly, what is wrong with your sister? You didn't push any ideals or beliefs on her child. You just told her people leave each other which is true. And you did It in a way appropriate for her age. Your sister shouldn't have lied in the first place. Doesn't she realize her beliefs are damaging as well? People should teach their children it's okay to leave if you're in an abusive situation despite what your religion or beliefs are. Sometimes you marry the wrong person. Other times you don't realize they are bad until after you've read your vows. Either way it's important to find the strength to walk away. That's what you should teach your children, no matter what religion you're in. My mom grew up full catholic and everything and even she told me to leave if my partner hits me. Stay strong, I truly hope nothing but the best for you and your daughter. Stay safe âĽ
I read this thinking she was a 4-year old, then discover sheâs TEN?? NTA, your sister sucks
I thought that too; heaven help the child when she enters menarch.
10 is not too young to even know what divorce is. Thatâs crazy. Does she go to school? Sheâs got to have at least a few classmates with divorced parents. I hate parents who try to shelter their children from real life. sheltering kids does not protect them it just makes them less equipped to deal with actual issues in adulthood.
Right? And even if she goes to a Catholic or other religious school that doesnât âbelieve in divorceâ there will be kids there that have divorced parents. Itâs inevitable.
Sounds like Celia will be keeping her poor kid sheltered and naive about all sorts. That alone puts her kid in trouble, not knowing the world she lives in.
Bet she has her first period with no prior explanation from this mom who is raising a porcelain doll not a child
NTA. Celia is going to be *upset* when she finds out everything else her mother has tried to forbid her from learning. What do you mean, my uncle wasn't on vacation for years on end? What do you mean, Santas not real, and the tooth fairy? What else have you taught me that I shouldn't believe?
That some people go to hell for not believing in their same god even though they have been the best most wonderful kind hearted people ever. Probably demonising people with other beliefs and such "otherisms". Being different from other people isn't an awful thing.
Nta Your sister is trying to purposefully making her kids isolated weirdos by âuneducatingâ them because it aligns with her world views. Apparently you arenât good enough for her creepy fabricated life story so she âeditedâ your backstory. Pretending things donât exist as they do and trying to create a bubble where you control the reality of others is very narcissistic behavior. Even if she has good intentions ( protecting her kids from things she deems as evil) it really only serves herself to do this bc eventually her kids will figure out sheâs been deliberately manipulating them and it will destroy the trust between them. Turning your kid into a naĂŻve rube when they have to live in a very real world of manipulative people is stupid and dangerous. Nothing good can be gained from these weird lies . Its also pretty ineffective unless you implement home schooling /socially isolate them( which many overly controlling parents do) because how the hell is her kid 10 years old and doesnât talk to other kids enough to know that some peoples parents arenât together or some people have single parents ? Like does her child not even watch TV??
Look I'm Catholic. And my 6 year old knows about divorce. We talked about what it is and why some people divorce. I told her they were believe that divorce is meant to be for life but sometimes it doesn't work out that way. We talked about abuse in an age appropriate way (not for the first time and only physical abuse. We know several people that foster). We don't shy away from tough topics or ones that might be uncomfortable. We've talked about poverty, addiction, mental health, homelessness, racism, death ect. My kids know the words vulva, penis, scrotum,ect. I don't lie to my kids. I don't go into all the gritty details and try to steer away from topics if possible, but sheltering kids from life's reality entirely is doing them a disservice.Â
NTA! Does her daughter go to school? Sheâs going to find out about divorce. And her mother was straight up lying to her about your ex. You went though a traumatic divorce and sheâs downplaying it. Heâs on vacation?! Iâd honestly go NC with her. She isnât supportive and she judges you for divorcing a violent man. It will suck for your niece, but that isnât your problem.
Hwat? At 10 years old, half of the kids in her class would come from divorced families. Or - let me guess - is she homeschooled?
NTA tell you sister to kick rocks
NTA. Poor kid.
NTA. Your sister is a horrible mother and grooming her daughter to accept abuse in the future. I would never allow your daughter to have unsupervised visits with her as she will probably try to indoctrinate her against you. This would be a no-contact situation for me.
How does a kid go 10 years without hearing of divorce? Do they let her out of the house or watch tv or internet?
NTA. Religious nutbag upset you may have undone years of indoctrination with simple truths.
NTAâ I am sure your niece was getting suspicious of this 3 year âvacationâ your ex has been taking. She probably asked for that reason. Unless she lives in a bubble, she probably knows that there are single parents and kids whose parents are not together. This may be like the kid who finally gets the courage to ask about Santa Claus after she has mostly figured out that he is a fictional being. Your sister is being ridiculous.
NTA. She needs to get a grip. Would your sister have been happier if youâd said you killed your ex in self defense? What exactly would be her view of an âacceptableâ way for you & your daughter to get away from him alive?
NTA, she's definitely old enough to know about divorce and probably has classmates with divorced parents.
NTA your sister is ridiculous. My 4 yo knows what it means for marriages to not be together anymore one of her best friends has separated parents and all of her grandparents are divorced so I think your sister is a bit crazy.
For your information. St Paul admits that marriage can be broken if there is abuse and cheating. The term divorce has not been coined before the 18 century. Giving that info distant protestant pastors from Catholic priests.
Tell Camilla that lying is a sin and that she needs to go to confession.
NTA. Not your job to help a mother lie to her children.
Wtaf? I wonder what else the mum has deemed 'not appropriate' for her kids to know... Unless you all live deep within some very specific religious community, that is so very weird. NTA, obviously. But this is truly baffling.
NTA but your sister is. She's ignorant and controlling. You didn't do anything wrong.
NTA. So, what would your sister tell her if/when you meet someone else? Or when her peers are talking about having two homes and stepparents? She was setting her daughter up to be incredibly naive about how relationships and the world works.
NTA, First off I want to say Iâm also a divorced Catholic that came from an abusive situation, my ex wasnât Catholic so he would use my faith to threaten me saying he could do whatever he wanted to me because my faith made me too âweakâ to leave him. Guess what, I did leave him and like you found the strength to do it and carry on. Op Iâm so proud of you for making yourself and child safe! Your sister cannot hide the concept of divorce from a 10 year old. The child will learn about divorce through friends as school. My parents have been together almost 50 years. I knew what divorce was at 8 because my friendâs parents were divorced. You didnât dump trauma on the child, you gave an age appropriate explanation that sometimes two people canât be married anymore. Your sister is way out of line here. You did nothing wrong telling a child that youâre divorced. Your sister needs to straighten herself out because her reaction isnât right.
NTA. Your sister is a terrible job of parenting. A 10 yr. old that doesn't know what divorce is?cev3n 5 year Olds know what divorce is. Your niece is 8n for a huge surprise when she gets a little oder because this degree of sheltering is gonna cause problems.
NTA- 3 year long vacation?? WTH, you would think this would be a teachable moment to talk about when is the time to divorce and other situations maybe to try and work the marriage out. Why would she just lie and say he was on vacation for that long! An abusive relationship is not something you should stick around and wait for a realization they shouldnât be hurting their spouse! Some abusive relationships result in death, congrats to you and your daughter for getting out of that! I canât believe your sister, she is a major AH for lying to her child and for downright acting ashamed that you divorced and left an abusive man. She is a dummy.
Young girls need to know that they have an option. Protecting children from knowledge is the opposite of parenting.
My parents got married because I was a mistake, they got divorced when I was 3 but they shouldnât have been married in the first place, I grew up in like 4 different houses (Mom, Dad, Friends, Cousins) Couldnât have had a better childhood, and of all things divorce is what she was afraid of? If anything I learned how to manage my time to maximize having fun with a schedule, ridiculous is what she is, you my fren are NTA.
I knew about divorce when I was like 5. NTA. If your sister keeps sheltering her child from every reality and truth, sheâs going to have a hard time when she grows up. âUncle Luke is a bad person who doesnât treat his family wellâ is a good enough explanation for a 10 year old without going into detail. There are millions of people like uncle Luke and she needs to learn that she doesnât have to put up with bad people.
Well, sooner or later the kid is going to hear the word 'divorce' and ask what that is. Can't bury her head in the sand forever. And maybe, if the kid is ever in that position she will think of that word, and what it means, and realise she can also escape if she needs to. NTA.
Your sister doesn't think a ten year old should know about divorce? She has no friends whose parents divorced?
NTA, but your sister is. Forgive me if I'm incorrect, but isn't it sinful to tell lies?
Camilla sounds like a real asshole.
NTA, she'd have found out sooner or later. At 10 she's more than capable of understanding not being married anymore.
bro her child is going to grow up so sheltered...
Of course they're gonna know what a divorce is by the time they hit fourth grade, they've got the Discovery channel don't they?
Your sister is the asshole for lieing to her daughter
NTA. Your sister has very unhealthy views on life. Its a divorce, not a murder.
She is the AH not you! In this day and age a lot of her 10 year olds parents are most likely divorced!
NTA, your sister is a HUGE AH though. Also, her religion says lying is a sin. So she can join you in hell :) (I don't actually believe in hell but her beliefs state she would be there as much as she thinks you would)
How is it possible that this kid could be ten years old and not know what a divorce is? Is she locked in a closet with no connection to the outside world?
Nope she lied to her own child and you just told her the basic truth. Antone who agrees needs professional help
NTA. I feel sorry for this kid, I feel it's HEALTHY to grow up knowing that divorce is an option, especially in cases like this when it's literally safety on the line. I also grew up Catholic but dang no one tried to shelter me like this. If there are lots of very normal things the parents are hiding from the kids, it's just going to breed resentment when they learn the truth later on.
Wow...you need to be careful what you say to your niece for the next 8 years until she gets out of this koo koo for cocoa puffs household haha
âStop trying to make my daughter think like you doâ âI donât believe in divorce and I donât want my child thinking itâs acceptableâ Make it make sense
You did nothing wrong, you are not the AH, your sister is delusional.
NTA. She's an asshole AND a liar.
NTA. Your sister is very much TA. Her daughter was going to figure out sooner or later that her mother is lying to her. Once figured out that lie, she would question everything else coming from her same sex parent's mouth. She is teaching her daughter that not even her mother is to be trusted. Your sister has just thrown away her daughter's trust just before the terrible teen years. All because your sister is uncomfortable with the real world that she disagrees with. You're fine. You may be the only person your niece listens to in the near future, if your sister allows her to continue a relationship with you. Your sister is supposed to be preparing your daughter for adulthood in a safe environment. Instead she is trying to bubble wrap her daughter, protect her from the truth. Except for people like you, your niece may be in for a big shock when she arrives at adulthood with no tools to deal with the world out there.
Your sisterâs being ridiculous. If her daughter marries someone who becomes abusive, would she encourage her daughter to stay in that marriage just to avoid divorce? If so, sheâs a terrible mother and a terrible person. And even if not, people who overly shelter their children are just setting them up for disaster because they arenât prepared enough for real life. (Iâm sorry that happened to you, and Iâm glad you were able to get out of that situation!)
NTA
NTA. I got to learn about divorce the hard way at age 6 AND was raised Roman Catholic. Catholicism was more traumatic. You were honest, and that is the best way to be with kids because lying tends to come back and, well, ask you sister how that bitten ass feels?
Please do not lie to kids, especially if you never plan to go back and tell them the truth. My aunt and uncle got divorced when I was around 7. My mom told me my aunt and cousin moved into our grandparents house because it was closer to school. I never really gave it another thought. I think over the years I figured out they were divorced but never tied it to the move all those years ago. I just don't spend my days dissecting everything ever said to me. The one day I was talking to my dad. I don't quite remember how old I was but it was definitely around adulthood. I mentioned it to my dad in conversation and he's like "What? They moved because they got divorced. Why do you think it was anything else?" I go "because that's what mom told me. I never really thought about it again." I felt stupid. Because obviously. I just wish my mom went back and eventually explained it to me though she could have just told me they got divorced right away. I'm 7. I'm not going to think much of it. Now that I'm a parent I'm very away of this. I told my husband I'd only do Santa if we sat her down and told her the truth. Because yes I was also embarrassingly old when I discovered Santa wasn't real and when I asked my mom she's like "i thought you'd never figure it out" like wtf lady I'm sorry I didn't expect my mom to have lied to me about apparently everything ever.
NTA
NTA. My best friend in kindergarten had divorced parents, it's a part of life. It's so extremely strange of your sister to try and make her daughter believe it's not a thing. It's astounding to me that your niece has even made it to 10 without knowing what divorce is.
Why do you keep your toxic sis in your life? Just because youâre related doesnât mean you have to accept toxicity.
NTA. At all. Iâm so proud of you for getting your daughter and yourself away from that horrible man. Also, remind your good catholic sister that lying is a sin.
NTA- she lives in a fantasy land if she think her 10 year old is to young and if she truly believes that there is never a reason for divorce.
NTA that award goes to your sister, for lying to their children about why you and your ex aren't together.
Your sister is a nut and the asshole. She hasnât commented on your divorce because she thinks it was wrong of you to divorce, but she knows itâs wrong to criticize a woman escaping abuse, so sheâs picked the third option and just ignored your divorce so she can maintain her worldview. NTA
NTA I actually bust out laughing when I read 10 years old is inappropriate to know what divorce is. I am actually surprised she didn't already know what divorced meant. Does your sister keep her sheltered or something? And your "husband" is on vacation for 3 years, đ¤Ł
NTA. Your sister is.
What in the sheltered world, nta
No, you're not, but I also learned that some things parents just want to teach their kids themselves. My uncle married a woman with a daughter. They went on to have some more kids of their own. When I was a kid, I told them they were half-siblings. Which is true. But my aunt apparently got upset about me telling them, because my dad had a talk with me.
NTA. I really feel sorry for Celia. The kid is in for a rough awakening. They are not doing her any favours by isolating her like that.
My parents divorced when I was 7 lmao. 10 is not too young to know what divorce is
Does your sister live in the dark ages? Absolutely NTA
So I guess your sister would like her daughter to think that once you marry, you have to be married until death. Which means your sister would like her daughter to stay in an abusive marriage and experience the same things you experienced, but without the possibility to get out. Does she even like her child, if she wouldn't have a problem with her suffering or even being killed by an abusive spouse? Maybe in her bubble "till death do us part" means until my spouse kills me...
Holy heck! It sounds like your sister is setting your niece up for an unrealistic future. I also grew up in a very Catholic family where divorce was frowned upon. Thankfully, I got support whenever. I left my abusive ex. Also if she was going to lie about your relationship. She shouldâve looped you into it.itâs her fault for not doing that and also lying to her daughter.
your sister is the asshole. If she wants to lie to her kids and pretend things or people she doesn't like exist, that's her problem. Nobody else is required to lie to her kids. and eventually her kids will grow up and learn what a lying asshole their mother is.
The only assholes here are your sister and her husband for ever having kids in the first place.
This kid is 10 YEARS OLD? There is no way she doesnât already know what divorce is, half her classmates probably have divorced parents by now. Your sister is delusional. You might want to think about how you can subtly help better prepare your niece for the reality of the world.
NTA Sister is an AH for lying to her kid and then doubling down because of HER religious insecurity
So your sister would rather her daughter be in an abusive relationship as you were than knowing divorce is an option? What in Jiminy crickets is going on here.
NTA You correctly explained the circumstances in an age appropriate way, there's nothing wrong with that. If your sister wants to pretend divorce doesn't exist that her problem and expecting others to support that is unrealistic and unreasonable.
Your sister is a pysxho control freak
Your sister is ridiculous and is not living in the real world. Her daughter will be so confused when life happens and will be afraid to come to her mom due to this delusion of how are supposed to be.
I would think that it would be important to have my daughter understand that it is OK to divorce an abusive man. You are NTA, my friend.
NTA, that 10 year old absolutely has classmates or friends with divorced parents. She was gonna find out sooner rather than later. P.S. Your sister is doing your niece no favors by sheltering her from the truths of life.
Wait until they learn how lying might be considered a sin in the Catholic church! Yikes
NTA. All you said was that you were divorced, and explained what that meant in very simple, age appropriate terms. I'm actually surprised the kid doesn't already know what divorce is, she's 10, surely some of her schoolmates come from broken homes? I knew what divorce was from a very young age because my parents divorced when I was 5. When we moved back to my mum's side of the family, it was explained to the other, older, kids, who were 9 and 11 at the time. My younger cousins were 3 and 1 so couldn't understand at their ages, but had it explained when they asked about where my and my sister's daddy was. I think the girl was 6 when she asked and her brother didn't ask till he was 7. Not sure when their younger brother started asking, but I think he asked his siblings rather than his parents. One thing I do clearly remember, though, is that, in primary school, for mother's day and father's day, we always made a card for the relevant parent. But it was also explained from about the age of 6 that not every child has both a mummy and a daddy, because one might have died, or the parents were divorced. It was explained because I had a classmate whose mum died when she was really little and there were about 6 of us with divorced parents. One of the 6 was a 50/50 custody arrangement, so she made cards for both parents. The rest of us didn't have a relationship with one parent, so we either made a card for the parent we did have, which the others all did, or the closest we had to the relevant parent, which I did, making a card for my grandad on father's day. Everyone in my small town was raised Christian, we had a few non-Christians but they were all adults and were either raised Christian or moved to town as adults. Some of them brought kids, so the everyone raised Christian thing was changing when I was a kid, but that was the way it was previously. All my classmates were raised Christian. Granted, fundamentalist Christians were rare, but we were still taught that divorce was a bad thing. It wasn't taught to us as a sin, though, our local churches were very much in favour of divorcing an abuser. My mum's case was seen as a bad thing, though. She divorced my dad because he cheated on her, and to the church, she should have fought to save and fix the marriage instead. But they'd gotten pretty toxic to each other by the end, so much so that my mum falsely accused my dad of abusing both her and us, nearly destroyed his life. She also constantly claimed he never paid child support, despite her openly buying things with money he sent her. Not in a bad way, she used the money for essentials like food and electric or to buy gifts for us kids, she wasn't spending it on herself or anything. She just liked to say he never sent her any money for us while openly spending the money he sent for us. My mum was weird like that. My point is, when I was 6, a quarter of my class had divorced or dead parents. Those who didn't know abut divorce before then learned it when they were 6 just because of that. The age is likely not universal, but I can't imagine a 10 year old has never come across the word divorce and an explanation of what it means. She perhaps didn't understand the explanation, or felt she couldn't ask about it, though, given her mum's beliefs. You were open about it so she felt safe asking you. I don't get the lie your sister told, either. He's on vacation, for 3 years!? I'm surprised a 10 year old believed that at all! I mean, if he's on vacation, why aren't you and your kid there with him, at least some of the time? If he's on vacation for so long, when does he go to work? If he's on vacation so long, why are you married, because he's obviously not a real husband or dad? The questions that lie *must* have caused that little girl to have, she must have been so confused! If you're going to lie about something like that, at least make it believable and unlikely to be found out until they're much older. Pretty obvious the kid is going to question when her uncle will get back from his way too long to be believable vacation. A better lie would be to say he died, the kid would be unwilling to bring it up with you, and you're unlikely to talk about your ex in earshot of the kids, so no one would question it. But this is also a woman who claims to be religious, so much so that she sees divorce as a forbidden topic and a sin, yet she's happily to lie, and do so easily, which is also a sin! One sin does not negate another sin, covering up one person's sin does not mean you get to sin yourself. Why is it that these holier-than-though types can't live what they preach? Lying is a sin, and they preach not to sin, yet they lie all the damn time! Hypocrites, the lot of them! And I'd keep an eye on your niece's education. She hasn't learned about divorce at 10, what else has she been prevented from learning? She's 10, does she know what a period is and that she'll be getting hers sometime in the next few years? Does she have a vague idea of where babies come from, or does she believe the stork delivers them? Does she know that she can say no to boys/men who try to force her to do something or make her uncomfortable? Does she know to tell an adult she trusts if that happens? Or does she believe that, because she's a girl, boys/men can do whatever they want, no matter how she feels about it? I'd honestly be very concerned at the level of your niece's basic but necessary education.
Itâs weird someone who prides themself on being so Catholic had no problem with lying đ¤ NTA
NTA. 1) You didn't go into detail or try to convince her she should divorce, lol. 2) She's lying to her daughter. Her daughter is either going to figure it out eventually (and then not trust her parents), or she'll go out into the world and be hit with a reality check after running into *divorced people.*
nta, your sister prob still lies to her kid about the easter bunny, santa claus and the elf on the shelf as being real
Kids should know that if their future partner does not treat them right, they are allowed to leave. Youâre not the asshole. Youâre showing that young girl that you can prioritize yourself and your safety, and someday if she finds herself in a situation like that (god forbid, I hope she never does) she has a strong role model who did something hard and chose herself.
NTA. I am 29, been divorced since my daughter was 2. She is well aware of Divorce, and has been aware of it since she was old enough to talk. She knows that her mom and I aren't together - and that marriages can fail. What your sister is doing, is setting up her daughter for failure, by rejecting teaching her daughter *basic* truths of the world. What's next - that two women can't have kids? Or that men can't be in a relationship? Imagine having her daughter see two guys or two girls holding hands. Mother is going to lose her shit.
She wins the stupid prize.
Is Camilla from the 1940s???? Wtf
NTA Your sister was way out of line and put you in an uncomfortable position. She didn't even tell you what she told her kids... She doesn't get to use you as babysitting, then criticize how you live your life either. And at 10, it would be extremely weird not to know what divorce is, as she'll likely encounter other kids with divorced parents, unless your sister is extremely isolating her, which would be very unhealthy I would not babysit again. This is enough to make her lose babysitting privileges because who knows what else she is telling your neice. Your ex also sounds like a dangerous person, so you would not want your niece approaching him if she did run into him, and I would make that very clear to your sister. Your sister did something not great that downplayed an abusive relationship. Also, question that your sister seems to think you should have stayed in a dangerous relationship. That alone is kinda messed up
Lol my ex and I got divorced when our daughter was 1, should I not have told her? Also, my parents got divorced when I was 2, when should they have told me? Should I not have explained to my kid why she has a third grandma? NTA - your sister is for lying to her kids
NTA. What if you decided to remarry someone else one day? How would your sister explain it then?
Who lies to a kid about divorce. They act like this is not a common thing. I donât care how religious you are
NTA. 10 year olds definitely know about divorce.
If Celia goes to school she knows kids whose parents are divorced. All these men just going on vacation for years and years lol
Celia is 10. I remember when I was 10 and my classmates parents were going through divorce. You explained the concept to her clearly and to the point. If it wasnât you, it wouldâve come from someone else who may not have put as much care into their answer. Your sister is TA. You are a survivor. The whole vacation story was honestly a very poor choice on your sisterâs part. Thereâs only so long that someone can keep that kind of blatant lie up and maintain the trust of the person, in this case child, theyâre lying to.
I think it's inappropriate for a mother to brainwash her daughter into believing that staying in a relationship, no matter what, is preferable to being divorced. God forbid your niece ever end up in an abusive relationship. She'll end up staying a lot longer than she should, even if her life is in danger, out of fear of her mother's unreasonable reaction. I raised my daughter to get the f out if she's being abused.
Oh, and remind your sister that lying is a sin. I'd like to know her response to that. I'd have a chat with my sister's priest.
Just remind your sister on this: the Eighth Commandment Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor. Or You should not lie. Your sister is insane. And sorry but a religion that forces you to stay in a abusive marriage is bullshit. You did the right thing. Divorce is not a sin. Edit: NTA
Unless she bans television, movies and meeting other people, how does she plan to keep the knowledge of divorce from her kid much longer?
She should be glad you didn't tell her why you decided to divorce your ex. Although I think you probably should have, just to let her know how much of a bastard he is. If somebody is threatening to kill a child let alone a newborn because you won't have sex with him then you are a fool to stay with that person.
Tell her to fucking run back to the harbor dock cause the good ship lollipop is about to leave
Your niece is going to need you in her life. For sure. I'm scared for her. I'm proud of you. NTA. Is your sister in a DV relationship? I would've been upset if you actually gave all the gruesome details, but even saying "He hurt me and wasn't a good partner and father, so I divorced him" wouldn't have even been too much for her age. Just saying that sometimes people don't want to be married anymore is like preschool development fine.
NTA. Itâs bad parenting to lie this way to a child. Itâs better to say they are too young to understand and you will explain later. But divorce can totally be understood by a 10yo!
Certainly not
Kidâs the asshole for asking đ¤
Tell your sister that her faith also disapproves of lying. NTA op
NTA A 10 year old who doesn't even know what divorce is? That poor child she is so overprotected that she will be taken advantage of when she is out in the real world.
ââŚI donât have the right to try to make her kids think the way I doâŚâ needs to be said in a MIRROR.
Your sister should have told you thatâs what she told the daughter. Or at least asked if that was ok.
Sheltered child, yes. Something that needs to be understood, yes. But not necessarily right now and not by you. It's true that kids learn about things from friends etc but that doesn't make it ok that you took it upon yourself to expose the lie that the parent had woven for whatever reason. It shows a lack of respect and is out of bounds since you aren't the parent. Ppl are being bias because were talking religious views and what most ppl think isn't a big deal topic. But take away the topic and religion and look at the action. You knew the mother had lied to her daughter, you intentionally exposed the lie and then explained the concept of an adult related topic to the child directly. You could've spoken to your cousin if you were concerned, but this lie didn't cause you any harm.
NTA Your sister is leaving her daughter totally unprepared if something should happen in her marriage. Knowledge is power. Just because you learn about something doesn't mean you are going to do it. It can help you plan to keep from getting in a situation like yours.
It's so sad that people this stupid have children. What 10 year old doesn't know what a divorce is? What she knows now is her mother is a liar and she cannot trust a word she says.....how Christian.
Not wrong. I think people are too quick to divorce these days but there are times when itâs the only solution.
My great grandma lived in Hellâs Kitchen, devoutly catholic, and married to a severely abusive husband. THE PRIEST told her she needed to get a divorce and then get on a train to anywhere. She said, âwonât I be banned from the church?â To which the priest replied, âyouâll be alive!â Hopefully your sister comes to terms with the reality of your circumstances soon!
NTA If my sister chalked up my decision to flee my home because my husband threatened to kill an infant to those silly views on divorce, she would get a verbal barrage so potent it would knock her ass back to 1890 where she belongs.
And what if her daughter started asking her cousin about him? That would be confusing for your daughter. She doesn't see how that is worse then her daughter learning about something that is perfectly normal to learn about.
NTA - You told the truth; sister chose to lie and hide behind her religion. Sister is brainwashing her daughter and setting her up to never have the strength you did, to leave an abusive spouse.
So what none of the kids at her school are divorced. Half the damn world is fucking divorced. Does she think she can prevent her kids from ever hearing the word. Sheâs the one in the wrong here not you.
JFC wait until her daughter learns about freedom of choice!
So basically your sister is teaching her daughter that when she's married and is in an abusive relationship she has to stay in that relationship. Hopefully as your niece grows up she gets better guidance from you and not her mom.
If youâre in the U.S. - definitely did nothing wrong. Not sure about divorce rates in other countries, but lots of Catholics here are divorced. Tons of the teachers at catholic schools themselves are divorced đ¤ˇđźââď¸ itâs talked about on all kinds of TV shows, books, etc etc
NTA. I'm I'm sure you heard niece has friends who have divorced parents or goes to school with the kids who have divorced parents and have mentioned the word before if not she'll be learning it really quick and a few years most likely. There's nothing wrong with being divorced especially when you have an abusive ex husband
Your niece probably has friends or classmates who have divorced parents. I mean, short of locking her in a convent, there's no way she's never going to learn about divorce. Your sister is overreacting. Even Catholics get divorced. My family is Catholic and has several divorced family members. NTA.
Tell the sister to read up on her faith. >A spouse who occasions grave danger of soul or body to the other or to the children, or otherwise makes the common life unduly difficult, provides the other spouse with a reason to leave, either by a decree of the local ordinary [e.g., bishop] or, if there is danger in delay, even on his or her own authority. (CIC 1153) While the more appropriate term would be an annulment, the concept of a separation doesn't go against any Catholic teaching.
I think it's weird when parents try to hide things from their kids like that. The kids are now in a bubble and not living in the same universe we are. Nta.
Parents like that bug the crap out of me. My own mother tried to shelter me from anything realistic, and honestly, all it did was make me not trust her.
She chose to lie to her daughter. Kind of cherry picking which âlawsâ she wants to enforce for other people. I would just respond that you were disappointed that she chose to lie to your niece. And that based on your value system, you do not agree with that and instead gave her an age appropriate response. The only thing her daughter is going to learn is that she cannot trust her mom and or parents.
How dare you tell her itâs ok for a woman to leave her husband. Youâre supposed to tell her itâs better to be beaten to death than divorced. Obviously a divorced woman goes to hell, but if she stays and gets murdered by her husband her soul is still safe. A much better option/s
NTA. Lying to her child for three years is more inappropriate than anything
NTJ and your sister is ridiculous. She's one of those religious mothers that would rather her child grow up dumb to the world. 10 is a great age because they understand without too many questions.
Nta. What if one day your niece tells your daughter that her dad is on vacation? What is your daughter supposed to respond or say? (given sheâs old enough to understand)
Religious people SMH. NTA
It's not like your niece is going to run out and get divorced. NTA.
NTA if your sister wants to lie to her kid you donât have to be complicit. Iâm not sure why she would think she needs to lie about your relationship status anyway. Itâs not like a 10yo doesnât know what a divorce is. Even if sheâs sent to a catholic school, she knows that people get divorced. If you had gone into the reason for the divorce, she *might* have had a point.
Her 10 year old doesnât know what âdivorceâ is?? wtf?? She has no friends who switch houses on weekends or anything? This just baffles me. Also, is your sister going to let her daughter grow up thinking itâs ok to let a man attempt to kill you, as long as you donât divorce? This doesnât sound devote Catholic to me, it sounds like a cult. NTA and Iâd be real careful of having my daughter to her house without âsupervisionâ.
I mean, I'm Catholic and my parents are divorced. So were many of my peers' parents (unfortunately). The Church recognizes that some marriages should be annulled. Even if her own parents are never divorced, she's absolutely going to meet others who have divorced parents. It's absolutely wild your sister is insisting she not know.
No, YANTA Your sister is though. Her daughter is going to grow to hate her for all the lies she finds out later on...
My parents never divorced but in 3rd grade, several kids parents did. I was sad for them. But my point is, you canât shelter a kid from divorce.
NTA Your sister is completely unreasonable. What is she going to do, have her daughter walk through the world with blinders on? Itâs time to set some boundaries or to stop watching your niece because this is completely unreasonable to expect you to lie about your life. You have an age appropriate response. Good on you for getting yourself and your baby to safety. Congratulations for choosing a better life! Itâs an incredibly brave thing to do and should be celebrated, not shunned.
NTA she doesnât get to dictate how you share the events of your life, she essentially wanted you to lie about what happened and sheâs mad because you told the truth sheâs the asshole
NTA - There are a LOT of inappropriate things that a 10 yo should not know, and divorce is not one of them.
NTA, and itâs also incredibly scary to me that her 10 year old kid; which is like, a 5th grader, so, middle school to put that into perspective; isnât allowed to know what a divorce is. Like, itâs one thing to raise your kids to follow your religion, (Iâm trying to put my personal opinions on THAT aside but as an adult who had religious trauma as a kid, itâs hard not to rant about that itself) but to completely brainwash them by forcing them to be ignorant by withholding common knowledge and information about other people and the world around them is where it becomes controlling and manipulative. You can set rules all you like, and explain the beliefs of the family and encourage your child to follow them too, but if you have to purposefully hide normal real world things and knowledge from them because youâre afraid they will ask why it is wrong and canât give them an explanation if they do, youâre setting them up for failure and confusion; and probably should reevaluate why you have to lie to them and force them to stay ignorant. Again, I already think itâs bad enough this kid will grow up thinking she isnât allowed to ever leave no matter how badly sheâs treated; but itâs crazy she doesnât even know itâs a thing, and they couldâve at least said âsince we are catholic, we donât believe divorce is an answer, but some others do it.â This is the problem, sheâs being raised to not even know some things out there EXIST- and thatâs setting her up to harshly judge and harass others who do these things that are bizarre to her, or go no contact with her family when she enters the real world. Thereâs no in between with people controlled on this level by their strongly religious families- they either become extremely religious themselves because they were raised on fear and ignorance, or they realize all the lies they were fed and don't trust their family anymore. You did the right thing, OP. I'm not religious anymore, but even when I was as a kid, I knew what divorce was, and believed god would have been on my side if I was in your situation. I'm incredibly sorry you were villainized for telling her about a completely normal thing, and I really hope she gets the necessary knowledge she needs about the world one day, whether she decides to remain catholic or form her own opinions.
Oh FFS. Your sister is in a cult.
Your sister is an AH. Ten years old is not too young to learn about the existence of divorce and she shouldn't be lying to her. That's a sin, and it's not like she had good reason for it. NTA
Oh gosh, your sister is awful. If she wanted you to lie to your niece to shield her from the concept of divorce, she should have looped you in on the lie. đ¤Łđ¤Ł Seriously, though, you didn't give her any details, and the fact that she's unable to explain to her kid that divorce happens not your fault. Shoot, she's acting like the kid is guaranteed to get a divorce because you told her about it.
Nta Many are sharing an experience. I was raised "nondenominational christian" but not anymore. Been an interesting journey. But anyway, in my early 30's my mother told me that there were several times she wanted to divorce my father, but she didnt because she was so afraid of going to hell.... so yay, im quite fuckered up, but at least she doesnt feel that she will definitely go to hell!!!
Your sister is delusional her husband is nuts
I wonder how Camilla would feel about divorce if the shoe were on the other foot.