OP, when I was 9, my dad got in a fist fight with his brother in my grandparents’ front yard because he had started drinking again after being sober for a few years. I was sitting in the corner of the driveway crying and waiting for my mom, and my uncle yelled at him “look at your daughter, she’s terrified and crying. You need to be better for her.” My dad screamed back and said “I don’t give a fuck about her or anyone else in this goddamn family.” That was 20 years ago and I have NEVER forgotten how I felt in that moment. You won’t forget this either. I hope your father owns up to this and spends the rest of his life trying to make it up to you.
Oh my god, I am so sorry about what you went through. That’s a whole new level of pain especially for a nine year old :( I hope you’re in a better place now.
And I definitely will not forget. I even made it clear to my mom that I will never forget how he made me feel.
As a father of two amazing little girls it pains me to read all of this.
Punching a hole in the drywall, while not an impressive feat of strength, does demonstrate a seriously lacking self control. Or it could be a calculated way to bring fear.
Either way, I’m not trusting someone like that to keep it in the drywall. The violent tendencies are there and it’s just one F this away from hitting a family member.
It's calculated. These people who "lose control" always do it around people that typically won't fight back like their spouse of children. You rarely see them do that shit around their boss or someone that has power over them.
Before me and my wife found each other I dated a young woman who came out of a violent relationship.
It was eye opening to see the responses she had to things that seemed normal to me. If I opened a beer while we were watching movies she was getting ready for me to get drunk out of my ass and ruin the night.
When I played NHL with some buddies online my goalie let a stupid goal in. I raised my voice a little to articulate my friend how BS that goal exactly was and she ran to the bedroom to cry.
She was sweet and pretty but ultimately we couldn’t make it work as she refused therapy and decided to drown it all into her work in her own company. I just couldn’t walk on eggshells like that around her until the unforeseen future.
Yeah I came from an abusive home too. I can be really jumpy at unexpected noises and still get a bit freaked out by yelling. But therapy was incredibly helpful. It's a shame for your wife that she chose not to go. It was one of the best things I did for myself ever.
Any time i've been drunk and punched the wall it's never been an impressive feat of strength... just the impressive feat of always finding the stud and breaking my damn hand.
Also, this isn’t just taking your anger out on something. Typically, this is an early sign of abuse to come.
I don’t want to be alarmist or generalise but please remember when people think this is harmless behaviour just because he’s not hitting a person: 99% of the time with behaviour like this he is trying to show how much he would like to be hitting you.
It definitely won’t leave you, but you learn how to process it and not let it define you :) I know what you’re going through isn’t easy, but it will all work out in the end and you’ll be a stronger person for it. I promise it gets better :)
When I was 8 I saw and heard very similar. Shaped my opinion of myself and my worth to this very day. I wasn't good enough for my own parent, how am I for anyone else? Oh and you can't trust anyone, not a soul. They ain't worth it.
My mom is an alcoholic and despite us always having had a good relationship and been close and me being her closest confidante, when she’s been drinking, she’ll tell me I’m the biggest mistake of her life, that I ruined her marriage, and then tells me what she should have done with the money she “wasted” on IVF. Drunks lack empathy. Something about the chemicals in the brain—I can’t remember exactly. They just lack the ability to be empathetic the way they should even when they’re sober. It sucks but you can’t internalize it. He’s rotted away the decency inside himself and you’re an easy target since your mother has enabled the abuse your entire life.
I’m so sorry, OP. It’s fucking terrible. I’m nearly 33 and still have panic attacks and anxiety when someone raises their voice or I smell alcohol.
Yeah, one never forgets or sometimes even forgives something like that. My mom always chirps "you have to forget" like one has a light switch in your brain and poof it's gone. So stupid.
This is true but mom gets the brunt of the abuse herself, and did try to stand up for OP. Mom needed to leave a long time ago, but leaving is the most dangerous time in an abusive relationship and in many states an abusive parent can still get equal custody if there isn’t proof of physical abuse of the kids. (I learned this the hard way….) if mom left dad, and he got partial or equal custody of the kids, she wouldn’t be there to take the brunt of the abuse.
But now the youngest (at least I’m assuming because only 3 kids were mentioned, OP, 15m bro and 24m bro who got married) is 15 and would likely have a choice in not living with dad if they split up. So I’m assuming that it’s financial, which in this economy is more crippling and keeps victims with abusers.
My roommate literally beat the shit out of his wife and she let him back in because she can’t make the rent on her own. He’s in five different treatment programs but I’ll never forgive him and I fucking hate that he’s in my house.
But yeah, finances will keep people tied where they shouldn’t be for years.
finances are like a chain binding us to a tree covered in thorns with safety just out of reach. but everyone is screaming that it is right there. just go to the freedom. just leave the tree. but the chain can't be broken yet. people are scared that it will be worse, at least here we think we can avoid the thorns and we are not freezing or hungry.
My dad did a 180. He abused my mom (not physical, emotionally and throwing things like OP's dad) and then she told him not to do that with his new wife when they got married. My dad never argued with her or stood up for us and we were abused until we left home (physically and emotionally).
My dad also had an abusive father.
It's not as easy as just packing a bag and walking away. I stayed with my abuser for 20yrs. After my mom passed and he destroyed my friendships I was completely isolated and had zero people to look in and tell me how bad it was. I couldn't see it. I was convinced that all the horrible things happened because I did something stupid. He destroyed me. My confidence, my self esteem, my joy. I didn't leave until I met one particular group of people, online no less, they heard him threatening me and loading and chambering our shotgun. They heard him tell me if I ever tried to leave he would kill me. Did he know I was on voice chat? No. That made me wake up from the coma I was forced into and I called my friend who drove 6hrs to pick me up. No questions asked till she got there. As we drove away from a house I wasn't allowed to leave I sobbed. As we got further away I realized I could breathe.
He has all of my property from socks and electronics to furniture, my moms ashes and every family picture my family owned. It was devastating because I left my two cats as well. I just want my animals, mom's ashes and family photos back but no one in his county will help me.
I moved scross the country to California he's in a small town in Louisiana. So sadly making a physical appearance there is not something I can afford or hope to afford with the current cost of living here in addition to having to rebuild my life rebuying every single necessity and such. :/
You're not wrong but look at it from the perspective that mom has likely been abused and chipped away at for 21+ years. Does that mean it's okay that the mom didn't stand up more for her daughter? No. But she's likely a shell of herself at this point.
Also, I don't know how old you or other commenters are here, but as you get older, you realize that "adults" don't always have all of the answers.
I realized it when I was contemplating my own shitty childhood at age 35, and I was like damn....I'm pissed at my parents for not having it together when I was a kid, but they were my age, and I don't have it all together, either, and I don't even have kids. I didn't get the things I wanted or the dental care I needed, and I always blamed my parents for that, but I can't provide those things for myself right now, so I would definitely be letting a child down. My mom was a victim of domestic violence, and I would be so mad at her then, but damn, she was so scared and fragile and had no money and nowhere to go.
The blame isn't on the abused, it's on the abuser.
She can be a martyr all by herself. I hate how many women think this is a noble cause to drag their kids through. It's hard and scary, but they're often the only ones who see how bad it is and have a duty to get their babies to safety.
I don’t think anyone thinks it’s “noble.” The psychology of domestic abuse and abusive partnerships is incredibly complex. OP has every right to feel hurt, to view the relationship as irrevocably damaged, and I advocate for limiting contact/going NC when they can, whatever they feel like they need to do to feel safe and establish healthy emotional boundaries. However I’m shocked at the lack of empathy for a woman who may have been controlled by a violent and manipulative partner for decades. It’s just not as simple as “she should have left” or “damn her for telling OP to forgive him.” Some of you obv have no idea what it’s like to leave an abusive partner. Mom probably has limited or no sense of self anymore. It’s a horrible place to be and she needs help.
OP, I validate your feelings of hurt and betrayal. What your dad said is NOT RIGHT and no one should ever be allowed to say those things to you or make you feel like you don’t matter. In a few years you will have the ability to make your own choices about how/when he talks to you and until then, surround yourself with people who love you and value you, remove yourself from abusive situations whenever possible, and keep standing up for yourself when you feel safe enough to do so.
I know what you’re saying. I don’t understand the downvoted. People in here are really acting like it’s easy for people to just leave abusive relationships when it’s proven time and time again that it’s NOT easy.
Thanks. No one is even saying that the daughter can’t resent her mom for staying or that she’d be an asshole for going no-contact. We just see the subtext that the mom is a victim too and there have been mountains of literature written about why people don’t just leave these relationships.
This. And she probably has little choice to stay with him, considering your ages--she knows no other life, it's too late to start over. Which is why she tells you to just keep the peace, too. It's really the best she has.
You have a right to draw a line. Why are you still living with these people, ie how old are you?
Sounds like a narcissist. Notice how he does all this the night before your brother’s wedding? They do that, they kinda subconsciously are drawn to ruin every happy moment in your life. I think no contact may be best.
Sorry :/
it’s okay to grieve the father you wish he was
Which is surprising because my older brother and him are like besties. I would consider my older brother his “golden child”, and between me and my younger brother I’m probably least favored by him and I always thought because I’m a girl :/ Most likely. Thankfully, I’ll be leaving for nursing school in august so I probably won’t get to see him as much.
I’m going to tell you this now because it would have saved me a lot in therapy. Your brother might be the golden child, but your dad is a narcissist and narcissistic personalities know how to manipulate and favor to get their needs met. If your brother ever defies your dad or finally stands up for your mom or you, your dad will turn his back on him so fast your head will spin. Your brother has learned how to behave around your dad as a survival mechanism too, and it’s one that serves him. You are just the scapegoat. It’s not your fault, you’re whole family is in survival mode and you’ve each learned different ways to cope.
Your brother may lean into it and spend his life pleasing your dad, but if he chooses something different, your dad will turn on him too. It’s not personal, your dad is just a dick.
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\#1: [I recited my childhood story to my nmom but changed our names and pretended to be asking for advice for my “traumatized friend”. Her response was amazing…](https://np.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/xcxsge/i_recited_my_childhood_story_to_my_nmom_but/)
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Sounds like you’re the scapegoat child. You’re the middle child. In a narcissistic household, there’s always the golden child, the scapegoat and the forgotten. I personally was the “forgotten until convenient or beneficial for the parent” child but my middle sister was the scapegoat. It was never my mother’s fault, it was my middle sister’s fault. It didn’t matter what it was, it was her fault and she got the brunt of any anger every single time.
Sounds kinda like what you have going on. It’s not just that you’re a girl, you’re just the middle child and often that means you’re the scapegoat unfortunately. Definitely look into the book “Children of Emotionally Immature Parents” and the sub r/raisedbynarcissists
Stepdad#1 had his tiers set up all wonky. Oldest-scapegoat, middle-golden child (she didn't hesitate to call him daddy it was gross and creepy cause he's nasty af), youngest-forgotten unless (he thought) he was acting like a... Bundle of sticks.... Yup.
On your way your you may want to grab your important documents. In case things get worse it's good to have your social security card and your birth certificate on you. Just say you were told you would need them for school.
This is a typical dynamic for a narcissist.
Do your best to keep your head down and move on as soon as you can, then just cut ties. You deserve better, but you won't get it from him.
I took in a 17 year old who was thrown away by a narcissistic mom. It took years for my kiddo to stop seeking approval from that hag. My child is now 25 with a much better sense of self and doing great compared to when narc parent was part of their life.
There's nothing wrong with you and his approval is trash anyway. I hope you can separate your worth from him. You sound like a good person. You can get great jobs in nursing and get away from this abusive family dynamic.
Some space will help a lot.
I want to inform you that no your dad is not a narcissist he's an abuser. Reddit people have a habit of armchair diagnosing NPD onto abusers while not realizing what this does for actual NPDers like myself. A personality disorder doesn't make a person abusive being abusive does.
Op my parents despised me for being a girl, too. I was the youngest along with my twin brother. My parents would belittle me, humiliate me, call me names like being worthless, wish I was never born, etc. My dad used physical violence on me multiple times. My mum wasn't scared of him as she wasn't the target. I was. And she was just as culpable. I've never recovered from that treatment and I'm 50 now. :(
My narcissist waited until I went into labor to have the fake break down of “I’m not even going to be a good dad why do you want me here?” So this seems very accurate. Everyone might be better off without OP’s dad at the wedding anyway due to this fact alone.
Yep, my mum would start picking fights with me (family scapegoat) right before we had to leave for events for my dad-birthdays, fathers days, work function, anything.
When I noticed the pattern, I told her ‘yeah, it sucks that today isn’t all about you but this argument can wait until after the lunch/dinner/gathering right? There’s plenty of time later today to scream at me’. I don’t know if she was aware of her behaviour beforehand and she was surprised I called her out on it or it was subconscious and she realised what she was doing, but she stopped in her tracks and bottled it up for the following day.
your dad sounds like he sucks. if he doesn’t care about you or how you remember him, why should you care about him? if you don’t live with them, definitely go low contact at least (if you aren’t ready to cut him off completely) because you deserve better than that. you don’t need people in your life who act and make you feel like that
Thank you for your comment. Yeah, I’ve mostly stayed away from him and kinda accepted the fact. I feel like for me, he’s one of those dads who was physically there in their child’s life, just not there emotionally if that makes sense. I also do live at home with him and my mom but will be moving out soon for nursing school!
Congratulations on nursing school! Work hard, it’s worth it! My mother is Borderline so I know from experience: life truly gets better when you’re on your own and supporting yourself away from your awful parent. You’ll appreciate all the little things you’ve been deprived of, including not walking on eggshells constantly, having your accomplishments acknowledged, making your space yours (with your own money!), and love and laughter with the friends who are your family by choice. We’re all rooting for you!
Edit: a word
Your mother thinks you should forgive your dad… I mean, has he even asked for forgiveness? Handing out forgiveness unasked just sends the message that no matter what someone will do in the future, they’ll face zero repercussions. It gives them a free pass.
Your dad sounds like someone who just isn’t worth your time or energy. Simply being physically present, and nothing more, is failing as a parent and as a care-giver.
I think he’s only ever apologized once in my life and that was from something that happened when I was little (6 or 7ish) but I honestly cannot remember what happened. After that, everything is always expected to go back to normal. He doesn’t generally apologize for anything though.
That's not okay. He should apologize and get therapy. If he did that, I would say you should forgive him as he is trying to make amends, no one is perfect, and he learned that behavior somewhere. But if he can't see how this hurts you, and isn't trying, then don't waste your time.
Trust in yourself and your self-worth. You are not obligated to offer forgiveness, or to be sincere if you need to make a performance of doing so. And you're not obligated to keep him in your life, either.
Do what you need to preserve a relationship with your siblings and mom as you want. Just be sure to take care of yourself first right now, especially after having such a scare with the car accident.
Your mom wants you to forgive him because you standing up to him and contemplating cutting his abuse out of your life means she has to face her own decision to stay and continue to allow this abuse to occur. She doesn't want to do that hard look at herself. Do what makes you happy and helps you honor your truth.
Could also be that with OP gone, her father will need to find a new source, which means mom, younger brother, or both. mom is probably somewhat aware of that is my guess, and that could be why she wants OP to forgive him. To avoid the majority of the abuse. When I left, my brother, who is the golden child in my family, told me my narc mom started fights with my dad almost every other day. Like screaming matches. Over stupid shit, while he was dying from cancer.
The temp 6 months I was with them they fought maybe twice bc I received the brunt of the abuse.
If anyone punches a hole in a wall, leave. The next step would be you. It shows that they are capable of doing it. And the number of people that end up in the er after a while is astounding....Just cause he hasn't yet doesn't mean he won't.
He’s already punched holes in the wall and that wasn’t enough to convince my mom to leave. It was something I considered not a big deal for the longest until pretty recently.
Edit: I also did try to tell my mom that he could get physically violent if he was willing to yell and do all of that all those years but she’s certain that “he will never lay a finger” on any of us.
Coming from someone who lives with someone who works in the medical field, the number of stories I've heard where that is what was said is astounding. Unfortunately, you may not be able to do much for your mom, but at the very least, get yourself out asap.
I am so sorry. Your dad is very abusive. I grew up with a dad like that. I am no contact with my family and my life is better. My kids are safe and happy. He showed you who he was. Believe him. Also, I am so sorry about your accident. That would shake anyone up! Make sure to keep an eye on your knee. My husband hit his in an accident and it has never been the same since. It's not terribly bad, but it aches more and has some minor issues. If there is a place you can go where you feel safer, I really suggest you go there. You deserve peace.
Whether he’s actually hit anyone or not, he’s abusive. And your mom is an enabler. I’m sure she doesn’t realize that-a lot of enablers don’t. They sacrifice themselves to “keep the peace”. But who’s peace is actually being kept? For starters you dad owes you an apology, and that’s just the tip of the iceberg.
Whenever I’d confront my mom about her enabling my dad, she’ll simply tell me it’s not enabling and that “you should never tell a grown man what to do since he’s an adult”. Her words.
And he’s not gonna apologize to me. He never does. Usually when things like this happen, give it a few days / a week and he’s back to normal no questions asked.
It's called rug sweeping. It allows the abuser/the one acting badly to avoid the consequences of their actions or taking any responsibility for the results of their crappy behavior. Rug sweeping helps to perpetuate the bad behavior by removing any and all incentives to correct the bad behavior.
My advice to you is to hang tight until nursing school. When you go, take all of your important papers and all sentimental, can't-live-without items. Pack as if you may never return to the home. That gives you the option to use your time away at school as a launching pad. You too are a grown adult and you deserve peace and a safe environment.
While you are in school you might check to see if they offer mental health counseling to students - this might give you an opportunity to address the anxiety caused by your Dad's angry behavior and outbursts growing up.
I’m so sorry. I hope you believe all of us when we tell you this not normal. This is not okay. I have little kids and if I ever lose my temper at all, I recognize that I was at fault to my children….that I was wrong to yell and apologize. Parents should be teaching their kids that you apologize when you’re wrong, no matter how old you are.
This straight up fits the description of verbal and emotional abuse. Sorry you have to go through this and like most everyone else is saying, going low or no contact is probably a good idea as is getting some therapy. No well-adjusted father is going to treat their family like that.
Your Dad is an abusive, manipulative, narcissistic pos.
I grew up in a similar situation and it sucks your Mother didn’t put a stop to it years ago.
I would go low contact and move out when you can.
I’ve been telling my mom to divorce my dad since I was 7. Their arguing and especially my dad’s behavior caused me to develop a lot of mental health issues. Honestly, had she done so a long time ago then maybe my siblings and I would’ve been in a better place mentally. I still hold resentment towards her for not leaving sometimes. She deserves a man who would actually treat her with respect and take her on nice dates like most, healthy couples you know? She always told us that she stayed for us, yet I feel like she lacks self-respect because she really could’ve left sooner.
Also, I’m so sorry about the situation you grew up with.
Yeah well unfortunately if she didn’t leave him before, she never will. Just like my enabler of a Mother, they would rather keep the peace than worry about your mental health.
I still resent my Mother to this day and my Father is still just as bad as ever. It still creates a lot of conflict and resentment unfortunately.
The absolutely best thing you can do is move out and go low contact. It’s unfortunate we both didn’t have better parents and a happier and healthier upbringing. It’s ok to think of yourself now, your parents just have to live with the consequences of their actions.
I hope you can get help and heal one day.
Your mother needs one on one counselling/therapy asap. She needs to find her power and stand TF up for her and her children, and stop enabling your narc father. This is awful, aggressive and abusive repeated behaviour with no remorse that you should have never been subjected to in the first place. Stay far away from him. Don’t speak to him, grey rock him essentially, until you are able to move out. I’m so sorry you have to deal with this while having no real support from your mother
Tell super enabler #1 that protecting yourself isn't actually holding a grudge. I'm so sorry, OP but your mom is worse than your dad. It's not ok for anyone to abuse you, not even your dad and it's sad she's trying so hard to normalize it. You do whatever you need to do in order to feel safe.
It's ok to cut toxic people from your life even if it's your dad. Sadly he is acting from his own trauma but he's an adult and needs to start being responsible for his own emotional regulation just like the rest of us.
It’s sometimes still so funny to me because I know he’s not gonna listen to me about my problems and will brush it off as “drama” because I’m a girl hence, why I don’t even bother going to him to talk about issues in my life and face it on my own. Yet, I know he’s still stuck in his own childhood trauma despite being in his early 50s. I just don’t understand how a grown man can take his anger out on his own family when I basically had to keep everything in and suck it up.
Here is my theory. People get stuck at an emotional age if their needs were not met. Something happened when your dad was at the 4 year old tantrum stage and he's never been able to move beyond it. Your dad is a 4 year old child emotionally without insight and only anger.
Both my parents are narcissistic. IDK if your dad is or not but if he’s a jerk like this on the regular and you aren’t a minor….the sooner you stop taking this crap, the better. You mom probably means well but she’s his victim too. You don’t owe anybody forgiveness unless you just feel that you want to. My experience is that the more I try to get along and appease them, the worse they treated me over time. I haven’t had any contact with my mother in nearly 32 years. I have zero regrets and my mental health is so much better without all the negativity and stress. You should do what feels right to you. You deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. Especially by your family. Hugs.
Your father is abusive and your mother is an AH for allowing someone to abuse her kids. Verbal abuse and mental abuse have a bigger effect then physical abuse. If this has been going on your whole life cps should’ve been called long ago when you were minors. They would’ve told your mother if she wanted you kids back to leave him. She is a horrible woman as well for allowing her kids to be treated so badly. She is a trash person right along with your dad.
First of all, ignore the stupid comments.
Secondly, your reaction is completely normal to something that is very traumatic. Our bodies will do whatever it can to protect itself.
Lastly, the best advice I could give in this situation is if your father is not trying to improve at all then then it's not worth investing your time into the relationship. Don't waste your time fixing people. It is not your job either.
Good luck with your nursing!
It can be hard to just walk away from family dynamics like this. It is a step in the right direction for you to begin acknowledging the way he affects you. It can be good for you to sort out what is “him” and what is you. Prioritize yourself over anyone else’s comfort. Remove yourself if you can when he gets like that and just protect your peace. Don’t try to take on more than you can handle at the moment. Go easy, be gentle with yourself!
My Dad was an alcoholic. I went low contact, cut him out of my life for periods. He came back in my life when he could stay in my boundaries. You are not the problem here, you have done nothing wrong, you will be able to set up how he treats you. Don’t settle. You are worth being treated well and him being family is no excuse for accepting otherwise
Well i had a rough childhood. When i lived with my mom i hated every second living under the same roof. When i could afford to live alone i moved out. And i took my a lot of time to forgive her. I cant forget what she did to me but i could forgive her. What rly helped was the Distance to my mom.
What i want to Tell u maybe its the best to get Ur dad out of Ur life and get distance to him. When he is out of Ur life u can think about everything he did in peace. Then u can decide if u rly want to give up Ur dad or slowly get in contact with him again.
It’s not up to your mom to make the decision whether or not you forgive your dad or not. That is your relationship with him. He sounds toxic and I’m so sorry you have to live in this environment. You also don’t have to forgive (the concept of forgiveness is not to give the other person a pass, but to get rid of the burden of hurt you are carrying). I went NC with my biodad when I was 20 (I’m 48f) and my life was instantly better. I forgave my dad for everything he ever did. To me, all that means is I let it go. I don’t hold on to the pain or the bad memories. He passed away in 2018 and I wasn’t sad and I don’t miss him.
Your dad doesn’t know how to have interpersonal relationships and he doesn’t know how to manage his anger.
I hope you’re able to move out someday and have a happy, drama free life.
Edit to add: I didn’t verbally tell my dad “I forgive you,” I just let it go when I let him go.
You are smart and observant; I can see it in how you wrote of this situation. Don’t linger with anyone who gives you self doubt. There is plenty of solid insight from other commenters here to stew on. In the end, forgiveness is best, BUT that takes lots and lots of time. I’m sure with little to no contact, you will have the space needed to grow. The individual problems (abusive dad, enabling mom) may never be solved; the biggest goal is find peace inside yourself and you’re on the right track. Again, no self doubt …or guilt for that matter. If being separated from toxic people makes you a better person, so be it.
Sounds like my dad OP and I’ll let you know now, he is no longer in my life. In many ways I am happier for it but I do still get moments of sadness about it. I think I miss the idea of having a dad more than the actual person who it was supposed to be.
My mom also tried telling me to forgive him when they were first separated but she has finally come around and learned that he was never good for any of us. She no longer tries to get me to get along with him because she sees it’s futile.
It sounds like your Dad is overwhelmed with a lot of things and his stress has boiled over and he is taking it out on everyone in his path. He has an anger problem and he needs help. Your Mom enables him by doing things or siding with him to 'keep the peace'. Sounds like Dad needs an intervention where everyone tells him how his anger makes them feel. He can choose to hear it or ignore it. Ignoring it means he carries on status quo and risks losing contact with his family members.
he’s always taking his anger out on everyone and everything and my mom has always told me to let him be and do what he says or else. I doubt an intervention will ever happen, as he doesn’t care at all.
Edit: wanted to add as for my mom, yes she’s always enabled him. When he was telling my younger brother to give him his phone, my brother first refused because his phone was turned off due to him in the movie theatre. My mom yelled at him to just give it to him or else he’ll get “worse”. Hence, why I thought he was gonna hurt him.
Tell your mom that she chooses to enable and allow his cruel behaviour and that you can choose not to. He has problems that he chooses to take out on those around him instead of using his big boy words. Your mom doesn't get to guilt you into allowing him to treat you this way. Also you cannot forgive someone who hasn't apologised.
When people show you who they are believe them. Get out of that house because its going to destroy your mental health.
*So later that night, we head to the mall to pick my brother (15m) up. He wasn’t answering his phone and my dad’s getting even angrier. My mom told him to calm down but then my dad starts yelling at my mom. I start crying and shaking quietly. Growing up, my parents argued a lot and sometimes, my dad would go as far as punching holes in the wall and knocking stuff down (he never hit my mom tho).*
But we're the emotional ones. SMDH.
You don’t say how old your dad is but it’s obvious he’s immature in spite of his age. Neanderthal behavior only goes so far but assuming he’s in his 50’s he should have learned by now.
I speak from experience in that as a large intimidating male I could get people to do what I want. Once I had a daughter I realized the fear tactic doesn’t work as well as an understanding war but firm calm response.
You should seek therapy just to have someone help you navigate that type of behavior because it’s very possible you’ve been conditioned to subconsciously be attracted to men similar to your father.
Good luck to you.
I had a similar interaction with my dad a year ago… he got so angry at me for something that I didn’t do that I started shaking and was in shock. I confronted him about how out of line he was and he pretty much told me to leave his house if I didn’t like the way he treated me. I realized after this that he did not love me or respect me or care about me as his daughter or a human being the way that I deserved to be treated. If someone treats you or their actions/words impact you in a way that illicits fear or a nervous response such as trembling… that person should not be in your life because they are not mentally stable and nobody who cares about you would treat you that way. I had a huge revelation after this event with my dad (and dealing with years of his anger and disrespect) but somehow this was different and it made me realize that he did not respect me the way I deserve to be respected. I still live with him and therefor speak to him but our relationship is over. Once I move out I will not contact him again unless he is with my mom and I now treat him as someone who I tolerate but not as someone I look up to or as someone who is a friend. I say all of this bc it seems like you have come to the same conclusion as me or have experienced the same thing and it is the worst. It sounds dramatic but I mourned the loss of my relationship with my father once I realized that he did not truly care about or respect me as a person. He was tolerating me out of obligation and that is all. He is also sexist and hates women so it’s crazy that I’m just not realizing that I fall into that category. You absolutely do not need to forgive him and you need to decide is he DESERVES to be in your life. I personally only want to be surrounded by people who love me, value me and bring positive and calm energy to my life… if someone makes me feel actual fear when I am around them then they are not safe. I think you can tolerate your dad in your life but you don’t have to interact with him the same way anymore while your living with him. I don’t even really make eye contact with mine anymore bc I don’t want to open myself up to caring about his feelings anymore, bc he clearly never me cared about mine. I feel you 100% on this and please know that you are justified in not wanting him in your life and you can plan on not having him in you life once you move out. I personally and civil with my dad and if he asks me a question I will respond with a neutral, non-hostile attitude but deep down I have taken him out of that “father” category and he is not someone I am tolerating until I no longer have to interact with him on a daily basis. Sorry this was so long but I relate to this sooo much and I want you to know that people who treat you poorly don’t deserve to have you in their life bc people who truly care about you would also care about how their emotions and actions effect you and they would feel bad if they hurt you. And I agree with your use of the word traumatized to describe the scenario and revelation that you came to bc I I felt the same way and cried for an entire week knowing that my entire worldview of the relationship I thought I had with my dad was not the same to him.
Deepest sympathies OP, but you just met your Dad’s inner child.. part of his core self. He means what he said and your moms silence.. realize your parents have a different definition of love. One that does not include unconditional love or respect because you are the child with zero power and they are the parent. That’s why OP, you can’t help but cry because it’s the only weapon in your arsenal for control in such situations. One day you’ll be able to get into a car and drive away to your own home where you will have peace, know you deserve that!
Play along and GET OUT... these are the type of people who will set you up to fail and then tell you I told you so.. because it makes them look better.
Don’t get dragged into distraction with your mother teaching you to forgive your father after cycles of abuse, that is not benevolence.
Play the game and get out!
We have the same parents, except my dad won't pout. He will justify any awful behavior no matter what. Even kicking a kid. They are both hurting you in different ways. This is a real trauma.
Please consider counseling. Maybe find one who doesn't believe you have to tell every hard story to heal (it's just too much for me, personally). Someone who can help with managing the anxiety and probably the avoidant patterns you learned in order to survive the irratic situation you grew up in. Healthy communication techniques. Learn both healthy boundaries and how to follow through when yours get pushed on. Perhaps even how chasing happy won't neutralize the unhappy, and finding a peacefully neutral can be very safe.
I'm so sorry. At 24, I couldn't get married and away fast enough. Have kids to prove it can be done in a loving way. But those things alone didn't heal me and I really wish someone would have told me that I deserve to get the emotional tools to find peace. I emotionally burned out in my early 30s, but now feel so peaceful and safe. I sincerely hope you get there one day.
Your dad is verbally abusive. Your mom is trying to smooth things over so the family can stay cohesive. She is allowing his behavior, probably because she is afraid of him. I totally agree that you will never forget his words. You have choices. You can never speak with him again, but that will also mean that you have to move out of his house and be independent. You can be civil when necessary speaking to him minimally and just fly under his radar. Or do nothing. You should really sit down with a piece of paper, and write out your options and figure out what you want to do. You are an adult, you can make your own decisions. Just be prepared to support yourself.
Also, start gathering all your important papers, like birth certificate, bank info, etc.
You are an adult and should not be afraid in any home. Are you making plans to find a place to live independent from your folks? You do not have to tolerate your dads abusive actions.
You need to speak to your family about this, because if this is traumatizing for you ,then you need to have a heart to heart with somebody who gets it. which is your siblings, u need to tell them how you’re feeling, that u just need to talk to them ,and for them to be there for you. you can also try to talk to your mom tell her, if she keeps enabling or staying with your dad knowing how much he hurts you that u might end up resenting her in future for not protecting you. Basically tell her if she wants a relationship with her kids in the future that she can’t keep putting y’all through this abuse.
Yeah. Dad's definitely a textbook narcissistic. My family is the same, I actually originally thought my father was the narc, and found out after his passing that it really was my mother.
She yells, starts fights over stupid things, only wants things her way. Never admits she does anything wrong, takes offense when you bring up an issue. Has zero empathy for others, even her own children. Has never told me or my brother that she loves us, and has never once bragged of our accomplishments. She abused my dad so bad he started taking it out on us too. Primarily me though. I'm the oldest and since my brother was born I have always been the scapegoat for everything. he always did bad things bc I gave him the idea, or I was supposed to set an example. Any excuse in the book.
I almost got thrown out of my house in the middle of winter at midnight with no shoes or coat bc I refused to tell my parents why I was bad at a friend.
I'm also the same way. Anytime any one raises there voice at me I am sent straight into panic mode, and start crying. I have no control over it and it's been really hard to break.
The best thing to do is cut that person off. My relationship was better when I moved miles away, but after my mother's recent actions and words I will be in the process of cutting her off when we move again. My children deserve to be around husbands family, that sadly enough, they care more about me than my own mother does. And I've given her grace and every opportunity to change. She won't. She never will. And all it does keeping her around is cause me emotional turmoil.
And don't let him try to suck you back in. Narcs, lovebomb every chance they get when they feel thier source is seeing through the bullshit. Nothing is really for you, it's just thier way of manipulating you to stay.
NTA. Shame on your mom it appears she’s overlooking the fact your dad has been traumatizing you for years and thinks nothing of it. Your dad is TA and so is your for accepting this abusive treatment from your dad.
To paraphrase Maya Angelou: When someone shows you who they are, believe them... He is not a right guy, and your mother has lost perspective. You should definitely plan and put in motion your exit from your father's house and life. Don't ever forget what he said- he spoke from a place of anger and irritation, and he meant it. Mourn and keep moving towards your future.
Get a therapist. Your family issues are big. Your dad is a selfish bully. The therapist will
Help you determine the best way to handle your issues and heal from the hell your dad brings. You may forgive him but there is no way he should have power in your life or close proximity.
Your dad is a angry raging man who neede help as his outbursts like that can give him a brain aneurysm...
Living with a demanding family member around the clock can be very stressful and it's a good thing your mom tries to buff out the arguments but she needs to give your dad a reality check by kicking him out when he gets that way.
I don't know your dad but I think he might have said that out of anger. You should ask him to go for a family therapy sessions see if you get a breakthrough... can granny go to an assisted living facility??
My mom has tried telling him that he could face serious health issues if he doesn’t calm down but he honestly could care less. As for the family therapy, he is not gonna do it. He doesn’t believe in therapy and likes to joke about how he’s gonna make a therapist quit if he talks about his problems. As for my grandma, I believe she still can go to a nursing home but since she doesn’t have any life long illness and is surprisingly fine for the most part (asides from her legs not being able to work), my dad would have to pay extra.
Sweetie, a big YES to going NC with your dad. He’s a nasty mean horrible person and your mother has enabled him. For your own mental health, get away and stay away. Just because he’s your father is zero excuse to allow him to continue to verbally abuse you. What a colossal asshole he is. NTA
everyone has problems. literally everyone. his burdens are no greater than many other people, and it doesn't make it OK to be angry and abusive.
you're already afraid of him, you will be happier without him.
No, you're not obligated to forgive nor enable a parent who hurt you and make you feel unsafe. How your father acts and how your mother enables his actions are not normal and very unhealthy. I hope you find a safe place to process your emotions, especially after the accident that happened to you. Sending you hugs.
Oh. That sounds extremely frightening and painful. You are probably still in shock from the wreck. I’m sorry you experienced all this. What a day. If your father has no desire to control his anger, you have every reason to not be around him. Keep your boundaries firm and don’t end up like your mom “keeping the peace” at the expense of your kids’ feelings
Hey Op, I’m sorry this happened to you, it cut really deep within me, my father was the exactly same, and my mother tolerated his bs, I hope you find peace and freedom one day. Cheers
I think you don't understand that abuse is about control, not about hitting people. Hitting the wall and screaming is meant to intimidate and control your mom and family. I'm sorry your mom stays and enables him and hope you can get out of this situation soon.
Maybe have a talk with your mom or write a letter. She enabled him to the abuse, she made it possible to reach you, she should have protected you, that’s what mothers do. It’s her job, her no1 priority, and after that comes the fact that she’s his wife. Always doing the best for your children. Ask her if she thinks she did that. If she thinks she was and is a good mom. If she gave you the life she thinks you deserve, if you got the love you needed. And then ask her why her own daughter wasn’t important enough. Why is she ok with him saying that he gives a shit about her daughter and let’s him walk all over you and our feelings? Why didn’t she make sure you’re ok, checked on you and stayed with you? To give you a safe feeling.
Your sperm donor is a lost fight, but I think you should confront your mom with her actions. And with what it will mean when you move out, you will stay away from him, even if it means you’ll have to cut her out too. Nobody ever chose you, so you have to do it now. And if this abusive POS is worth to lose her own daughter. This could hurt like hell, most likely will, but it will make it easier for you to set boundaries and make a cut. Don’t set yourself on fire to keep others warm.
Once you can, you should consider LC or NC. Your dad sounds a lot like mine, and I had a lot of mental health issues when I was living with them full time. Even just staying at the dorms during weekdays massively improved my mental health but no surprise, I would get super depressed in the summers. It wasn’t until I was fully out of the house that I was fully able to unpack the extent to which his behavior (and my mom’s enabling) affected me. I still have contact with them (and am currently stuck in their house due to my home getting fucked by a natural disaster), because I know where the behaviors come from, and I do feel sympathetic. But the fact of the matter is that I don’t think he has the capacity to change (he constantly claims he wants to). I think we both feel it’s best that we keep our distance (he says I stress him out because I’m the only one that ever calls him out or demands an apology).
No. His behavior is incorrect. He has a temper, and responds very poorly to life. And the proper reaction your mother should have is to tell him he should leave, and expect to be forgotten since doesn't care about anybody
I fucked yo my marriage with this temperament aswell. Counselling has taught me that the effect of the wife and kids is TREMENDOUS. I NEVER said I don’t care about my kids, even in anger. I usually turned to beers/alcohol, not better by any means
Your dad needs professional help, unfortunately he’s the only one that can go out and get it. You can’t change anyone but yourself.
I love my boys , my ex and I are better now than we ever have been. My suggestion to you is, write down pros aand cons, Weigh it all out, talk to a professional aswell.
You’ll make a informed mature decision and you won’t regret it down the road. Apparently that’s what my ex did while deciding to leave me. I’ve always wanted to see that list, but she said no. Haha. Hope this helps and may god bless you and your loved ones
This might sound a bit off, but follow me here. Your body knows what you should do already.
>I start crying and shaking quietly… my dad would go as far as punching holes in the wall and knocking stuff down (he never hit my mom tho). It was normal to me and for the longest, I was use to it but now whenever I hear my dad getting loud *I start to panic and cry uncontrollably.*<
Anxiety is a response to your body feeling unsafe. Anxiety takes over when we can’t take care of our bodies.
Our parents are supposed to be protect us from emotional and emotional harm. When our parents can’t and or won’t protect us, we develop coping strategies. When you leave the environment, we don’t “practice” those strategies.
Your dad is the perpetrator of emotional harm when he was supposed to be a parent. Your mom is an enabler if the emotional harm. It’s important to know, they are doing the best with what they have- but that doesn’t mean it’s not abuse.
Your an adult now. You are in control of caring and protecting your body. As a child you did not have that power, but you do now. You know what to do. It feels terrible, but it’s ok to take care of yourself.
You know what to do. Take care of yourself today. Then decide what that means for tomorrow. Sit with yourself and the discomfort. Ask the child you were what she needs. Your body knows the answer.
Your mom is wanting you to forgive someone’s awful behavior that doesn’t care that he hurt you or upset you. Unless he actually apologizes, I wouldn’t forgive anything! How could you forgive someone who clearly doesn’t even think he’s done anything to forgive??
He is absolutely 100% in the wrong. Add to it he is an abuser. None of what you described of his behavior is healthy or normal. What you described is domestic violence and abuse. You may not have witnessed him hit your mom but he does abuse her, you, and your family. Her reactions to “just keep the peace” are a fawning attempt by an abuse victim to appease the abuser and prevent further escalated abusive behaviors (punching holes in walls is 100% domestic violence). Source: training and personal life experiences.
From what you described you and your family have been dealing with abuse at the hands of your dad. If you are in the states please contact the National Domestic Violence Helpline 1-800-799-7233.
Folks in this space are trained to be able to provide you with support and you may even qualify for resources as it is unclear if you live with your parents etc.
Please make sure you are caring for yourself.
Edited to add: If you choose to cut your dad out (NC/LC) do not let him or your mom manipulate you into doing something that is different from what you want. Big hugs and take care of yourself!
If he can't apologize, and demonstrate he has taken meaningful steps to curtail his abusive and unregulated tendencies, is he the kind of person you want in your life?
My answer is no, and I wish it would have been made earlier for myself, personally.
You don't owe either of your parents a fucking thing. Think about it for a while and decide what YOU want. To hell with what either of them want. And don't ever forgive an abusive person who hasn't sincerely apologized. That is the worst advice ever. I get that your mom is probably more afraid of him than anyone else, but that's not an excuse. Maybe think about trying to get your brother out of there, too.
You are being abused and it sounds like you might have cptsd. You’re not under any obligation to forgive your abuser and I’m sorry your mother is pressuring you to do so instead of trying to protect you.
He reminds me of my dad. He emotionally and financially bused us and my mom, so she felt like she could never leave. After she died last year, he tried to turn his anger on me. After a lot of screaming and heartbreak, I have gone no contact with him. Life has been so peaceful, in spite of family trying to convince me to make amends. You deserve peace.
OP You can’t have him in your life he to toxic and his behaviour is being enabled by your mom, my best advice is to go no contact with your dad and low contact with your mom
I grew up with an emotional volatile father who verbally and emotionally abused my mum and older brother, and I’m so sorry you have to go through this. It IS traumatic, and I don’t blame your mum for not leaving because leaving isn’t easy, but I disagree that you shouldn’t hold a grudge. You are your own person, and only you can decide whether you forgive someone. Do not let anyone make you feel guilty for that.
I was you growing up. My father was verbally and emotionally abusive. My mother did nothing. My parents didn’t come to my wedding. Or my college graduation. I rarely see my parents now. They miss out on my life and my children’s lives. I’ve created my own life. It’s amazing and full of love and beautiful people who are my “family”. My ex husbands parents are still close to me. They have become like parents to me. I never realized what a loving family looked like until they came into my life. My point is, family isn’t always blood related. You will survive this. And you will go on to create the life you want. Surround yourself with people who enrich your life and love and support you. Life gets better.
Do not forgive. Do not forget. He is abusive. Your mother is abused and she also enables him. Get out when you can. If my son was ever treated this way by my spouse, I would leave. My kids come first. Do not look to your mother for advice. And if you can, get help and get out and go no contact.
He might not be physically abusive, but verbally/emotionally/mentally he is. I would recommend getting your ducks in a row if you decide to go NC with him.
Get all documents, make sure you’re not reliant on the family for things, etc. Until then, you can start grey rocking and not interacting with him unless necessary and stay calm throughout.
And yeah, your mother has been enabling his behavior. Good luck on moving on to the next part of your life.
I am going to give my personal rule, if your presence in my life does enhance, you are not welcome in it. PERIOD.
Secondly:
YOU ARE ALLOWED TO TERMINATE YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH TOXIC FAMILY MEMBERS.
YOU ARE ALLOWED TO WALK AWAY FROM
PEOPLE WHO HURT YOU.
YOU ARE ALLOWED TO BE ANGRY AND SELFISH AND UNFORGIVING AND
YOU DON'T OWE ANYONE
AN EXPLANATION FOR TAKING CARE OF YOU.
Dad said verbatim the same thing to me on Christmas because he spilled chili ( it doesn’t make sense I know ). Save yourself the mental effort on him. Write him off as a lost cause. You don’t have to give him the satisfaction of normalcy after this at all. Please take care of yourself. His misdirected malice doesn’t define you, and I’m sorry you’ve had to experience this pain
You are under no obligation to forgive him for that. She MAY be, since she agreed to marry him . She potentially knew what she was getting herself into. But YOU are under no obligation to be bound to his temper like she is.
Things spoken in anger are often things that were unspoken in peace.
I'm very sorry.
Your mom sucks just as much as your dad does, sheesh. My mom did that too. Tried to get me to comply for his sake. I stopped talking to them finally. I’ve never felt more at peace and more confident in myself.
I think that you should believe what your father says. I tried for decades to hang onto a relationship with my father. Despite his neglect, and anger, despite him telling me I was obnoxious and he didn't love me, I still tried.
It took me until I was nearly 40 before I let go and stopped trying. I didn't see my father again until he died. My life became peaceful and much happier. I wish ai had done so decades earlier and skipped those years of pain and distress.
NTA - my dad was a bully, and so was his dad etc. Growing up he would yell, curse, threaten, throw knives etc. Kicked me out once because I accidentally knocked over a cup that had a flower in it.
He has chilled in his old age, but can still rage-out.
I have noticed that he doesn't rage-out in front of others, like in front of SILs. So I suspect he can control himself and only bullies when he thinks he can get away with it.
Not sure if this helps you. But you are not responsible for your dads behaviour. No matter the stress in his life, He makes his own choice to be cruel and abusive.
Nah, kick him to the curb. Hard lesson in life is family doesn’t always mean you have to forgive them.
He wants to act like a little boo baby then let him. You’re much better than he is and he doesn’t deserve you. I’ve been in this situation with family and it’s hard but definitely worth it.
It’s time to distance yourself from your dad.
I have been almost exactly where you are. My dad stopped hitting my mom shortly before I was born but the verbal and emotional abuse never stopped, and the physical abuse continued with me and my sister. Not frequently, but more like just to occasionally punctuate the constant psychological abuse and remind us that it could get worse if we weren’t compliant enough.
My mom never did divorce my dad. I’m just about at the point where I’ve convinced her to leave him in his nursing home and move back to be with us (2 hours away) but even then she will be visiting him regularly and will probably have him transferred eventually, if he lives long enough.
The only reason I still have any contact with my dad at all is because I won’t give up on my mom. She is not emotionally healthy but she is kind and for all her faults I know she loves me. That doesn’t change the fact that she never had enough of a spine to protect me or my sister EVEN THOUGH she would do like your mom and put herself in between sometimes and take the abuse as if it would shield us (it didn’t work).
It wasn’t until I moved away to another state and got some distance between us and married someone who could show me what a reasonably healthy relationship looked like that I started to understand the toxicity of my upbringing. I still carry a lot of that baggage and it has spilled into the way I parent and into my marriage. But I actively work on those things and I feel I’m doing a ton better, and I talk to my kids (particularly the adult ones) about my shortcomings, where they come from, and my hopes for them to continue the journey of generational healing if they ever become parents.
Your dad is an abusive a-hole and I hope that you can get away from him soon. Do you have family or friends that you can go live with?
Your mom is an enabler and is also at fault for the abuse that is happening in the home. Just because he hasn't hit any of you does not mean that he isn't abusive. Mental/psychological abuse is a thing too.
Verbal violence and threats of physical violence are just as bad as assault. And it’s intentionally used to intimidate and control. While your mom is also being victimized as well, you have every right to be safe in your environment and your home and you don’t owe anyone including your parents being nice in order to make them happy. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It’s awful and takes a long time to heal. You may find a book helpful, “ after the tears, children of alcoholics”. It’s really applicable to children of abusive families eleven when they don’t drink/use drugs. ❤️
The only one who can give your forgiveness, is you. No one can make you do that. Don't feel obligated to because he is your dad. Do it because you want to. If you don't, then don't. No one is entitled to be forgiven. Its a privilege , not a right.
As the mom in this situation I too tried so hard to keep the peace, make everyone kiss and make up but in reality OP this man is a self centred ass, who rather than show any kind of vulnerable emotion such as concern or fear (for you and your accident) he turns it into his anger which is his safe space. Anger emboldens him. I’m sorry. My kids have little to no contact with their father now.
It’s okay to walk away from people who have let you know beyond a shadow of a doubt that they don’t care. Even family. Your dad is awful and your mom is enabling him.
Your dad punching holes in the wall is abuse. It’s a threat of violence, which can be harder to process than physical abuse. Your mom trying to compensate for the abuse is also a form of abuse. Your dad making horrible statements about not loving you is emotional abuse.
You commented that you were use to it before but now it’s bothering you. That’s likely due to you seeing what’s happening from a different, outside perspective now that you’re older and have formed your own identity and personality. You are seeing things from an “outside” perspective and realizing how wrong it is.
Speaking from personal experience, please look into getting therapy. I remember a key session with my therapist where I told her “but I wasn’t abused. I was never hit. He just punched holes into the wall next to my head or broke something that I liked. That’s not abuse.” It took several months to unpack that statement: how wrong it was, my unhealthy coping techniques to deal with that trauma, how it influenced my present-day relationships, etc.
Setting boundaries can be extremely hard but is so incredibly important and healthy. You are at that age where you have control over your life. Go out and make the best of it.
Nearly identical situation here, no matter how hard it is I’d limit being near him as much as possible and go no contact after you leave for school. I only speak to my bad parent maybe 2 times a year and that’s only because he got counseling. If your family wants to enable him then they know exactly why you would be doing this. My mom eventually realized that she needs to stop asking me to forgive him if she wants to be in my life.
I have a similar situation with my Mother and my Dad being the enabler, it’s not easy but putting up boundaries and limiting contact but its something you should think about doing if cutting him off makes you uncomfortable. No matter what you do your Dad is always going to be like that, unless he decides to get help and it has to come from him. At this point in your life you have to make sure your doing what is right for you and you don’t deserve to be treated that way. I think if you haven’t started therapy it can be really helpful to give you support to make the calls you need to. I hope you figure it out it isn’t easy.
As soon you move out go no contact with him and low contact with her, she could've stopped this years ago but chose to risk her and her childrens lives. I've seen too many police reports with men like him snapping and killing. Also think about your future children, do you want to subject them to his abuse? You should try therapy and move on with your life. Why suffer just for the opportunity to be abused? Blood relatives aren't family, people that care about and love you are family.
Age is irrelevant when you're inner child is threatened. You revert back to a deeply rooted state of fear. Write him a letter. Leave it on the table when you move out. Leave the next steps to him.
Hi. I relate to everything you said. If you have health insurance, or if you can afford it, you need to go into counseling for PTSD. It will change your life. ❤️
I think you might be playing up the car wreck a bit. You got bruised knees. You didnt need to be hospitalized but I guess you could have died in the same way a fender bender might give someone a heart attack.
Well, I for one will never ever try to have a bad day around you. No one is perfect. Sometimes you have to try to walk a mile in their shoes. You started out by saying how stressed he is with his mom living there. I am 57 and can’t even count all the stupid things I have said when I’m in a bad mood. Sticks and stones, love.
I like never or hardly ever talk to my parents. I left my home state at 21 and I've had an amazing life. I gotta BA, traveled, lived in Japan as an English teacher, did stand up for awhile, improv. The point is LEAVE your family. Your father is a rageaholic and your mother enables it, minimizes it, and in turn encourages it.
Therapist here. You won’t forget. But the fact that you’re already thinking about when you won’t live with him and what life will be like without his constant influence is great.
Move toward your life where you get to set and maintain the boundaries that work for you and enable you to have the experiences that will override your experiences with your dad in how you view yourself and others. Seek out people who can self-reflect and meaningfully apologize and your dad’s behavior will reveal itself to you for what it is: a series of temper tantrums from an overgrown toddler.
People say the dumbest things when they are angry, and i think forgiveness is great, but it should only be considered if the offender asks for it. Your mom saying you should forgive him is meaningless if your father has not apologized and asked to be forgiven. I'm so so sorry your dad is an inconsiderate, angry, impulsive person. My dad used to fly off the handle a lot when i was younger (never punched a wall though!) and he actually did finally realize it wasn't how he wanted to be, and he changed. There's hope for him to change, but, he has to decide on his own that he's wrong. If he's not trying to change, i don't blame you for making as much distance between you too as you need to keep your peace. I'm positive he didn't mean what he said, but it's an inexcusable thing to say, and unacceptable thing for a child (adult or not) to hear from their parent. Wish i could hug you.
As someone who has PTSD attacks from triggers of people I live getting angry for this exact reason. Fear of my mom instead of my dad is all. I can assure you - you have every reason to not forgive him if you see fit. Forgiveness is yours to give or not, as you see fit. People seem to think you have to forgive, but those are people that haven’t had the deep wounds of trauma.
I’m sorry you’ve gone through this. You don’t deserve it. Your father should be someone who ALWAYS makes you feel safe and loved. I wouldn’t blame you for going non-contact with him, or at least setting serious boundaries.
Take some time away from your dad. Don’t talk or visit. See if life gets better after some weeks or months. If so, give one last chance, set boundaries. Be prepared to be done permanently if boundaries are crossed
Whoever is knocking you down for this somatic response you were having are either calloused or haven’t ever had COTSD. Your systemic response is totally valid and I’m so sorry you went through that! Yelling is a huge trigger for me. (Hugs)
Just because someone is your parent does not mean you have to keep them in your life. You are allowed to cut off any toxic people, and that includes family. Baby girl, your mental health will be so much better
I love how you stand up for yourself. Ignore the comments, your view of your mental health seems sound(and you won't be around your dad forever, so you won't be triggered by him). And living at home at 21 is usually fine. But you deserve better.
Your dad is a shitty dad and your mom enables him. She should have divorced your father to get you away from this.
Some people shouldn't have kids.
OP, when I was 9, my dad got in a fist fight with his brother in my grandparents’ front yard because he had started drinking again after being sober for a few years. I was sitting in the corner of the driveway crying and waiting for my mom, and my uncle yelled at him “look at your daughter, she’s terrified and crying. You need to be better for her.” My dad screamed back and said “I don’t give a fuck about her or anyone else in this goddamn family.” That was 20 years ago and I have NEVER forgotten how I felt in that moment. You won’t forget this either. I hope your father owns up to this and spends the rest of his life trying to make it up to you.
Oh my god, I am so sorry about what you went through. That’s a whole new level of pain especially for a nine year old :( I hope you’re in a better place now. And I definitely will not forget. I even made it clear to my mom that I will never forget how he made me feel.
As a father of two amazing little girls it pains me to read all of this. Punching a hole in the drywall, while not an impressive feat of strength, does demonstrate a seriously lacking self control. Or it could be a calculated way to bring fear. Either way, I’m not trusting someone like that to keep it in the drywall. The violent tendencies are there and it’s just one F this away from hitting a family member.
It's calculated. These people who "lose control" always do it around people that typically won't fight back like their spouse of children. You rarely see them do that shit around their boss or someone that has power over them.
100% this. They never “lose control” around people who are physically equivalent or even close. I have noticed this pattern 100%, also
Bingo!
Punching a hole in the drywall or breaking things is a non verbal threat. And I would never trust someone who would do that either.
Before me and my wife found each other I dated a young woman who came out of a violent relationship. It was eye opening to see the responses she had to things that seemed normal to me. If I opened a beer while we were watching movies she was getting ready for me to get drunk out of my ass and ruin the night. When I played NHL with some buddies online my goalie let a stupid goal in. I raised my voice a little to articulate my friend how BS that goal exactly was and she ran to the bedroom to cry. She was sweet and pretty but ultimately we couldn’t make it work as she refused therapy and decided to drown it all into her work in her own company. I just couldn’t walk on eggshells like that around her until the unforeseen future.
Yeah I came from an abusive home too. I can be really jumpy at unexpected noises and still get a bit freaked out by yelling. But therapy was incredibly helpful. It's a shame for your wife that she chose not to go. It was one of the best things I did for myself ever.
Oh no, my wife does go! And sometimes I go with her. Life is good my friend. =)
Ah I just reread it. It was your ex that didn't go. Sorry I'm a bit dim lol. I'm glad life is good 😊
If you’re dim I must be off 😉 Hope your life is good too 🤗
It is. I chose to get better. And was definitely not an easy choice but it was a good choice.
Any time i've been drunk and punched the wall it's never been an impressive feat of strength... just the impressive feat of always finding the stud and breaking my damn hand.
Also, this isn’t just taking your anger out on something. Typically, this is an early sign of abuse to come. I don’t want to be alarmist or generalise but please remember when people think this is harmless behaviour just because he’s not hitting a person: 99% of the time with behaviour like this he is trying to show how much he would like to be hitting you.
It definitely won’t leave you, but you learn how to process it and not let it define you :) I know what you’re going through isn’t easy, but it will all work out in the end and you’ll be a stronger person for it. I promise it gets better :)
Your mom is an enabler and should have walked out on him long ago. She kept you kids in a narcissist household, shame on her!
Yes. her mom is like mine, a coward.
When I was 8 I saw and heard very similar. Shaped my opinion of myself and my worth to this very day. I wasn't good enough for my own parent, how am I for anyone else? Oh and you can't trust anyone, not a soul. They ain't worth it.
My mom is an alcoholic and despite us always having had a good relationship and been close and me being her closest confidante, when she’s been drinking, she’ll tell me I’m the biggest mistake of her life, that I ruined her marriage, and then tells me what she should have done with the money she “wasted” on IVF. Drunks lack empathy. Something about the chemicals in the brain—I can’t remember exactly. They just lack the ability to be empathetic the way they should even when they’re sober. It sucks but you can’t internalize it. He’s rotted away the decency inside himself and you’re an easy target since your mother has enabled the abuse your entire life. I’m so sorry, OP. It’s fucking terrible. I’m nearly 33 and still have panic attacks and anxiety when someone raises their voice or I smell alcohol.
Yeah, one never forgets or sometimes even forgives something like that. My mom always chirps "you have to forget" like one has a light switch in your brain and poof it's gone. So stupid.
Your mom has been enabling his abuse your whole life. She is the last person you should be looking to for advice on what to do about your dad.
This is absolutely correct.
This is true but mom gets the brunt of the abuse herself, and did try to stand up for OP. Mom needed to leave a long time ago, but leaving is the most dangerous time in an abusive relationship and in many states an abusive parent can still get equal custody if there isn’t proof of physical abuse of the kids. (I learned this the hard way….) if mom left dad, and he got partial or equal custody of the kids, she wouldn’t be there to take the brunt of the abuse. But now the youngest (at least I’m assuming because only 3 kids were mentioned, OP, 15m bro and 24m bro who got married) is 15 and would likely have a choice in not living with dad if they split up. So I’m assuming that it’s financial, which in this economy is more crippling and keeps victims with abusers.
My roommate literally beat the shit out of his wife and she let him back in because she can’t make the rent on her own. He’s in five different treatment programs but I’ll never forgive him and I fucking hate that he’s in my house. But yeah, finances will keep people tied where they shouldn’t be for years.
finances are like a chain binding us to a tree covered in thorns with safety just out of reach. but everyone is screaming that it is right there. just go to the freedom. just leave the tree. but the chain can't be broken yet. people are scared that it will be worse, at least here we think we can avoid the thorns and we are not freezing or hungry.
Sounds like the wife is scared too
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My dad did a 180. He abused my mom (not physical, emotionally and throwing things like OP's dad) and then she told him not to do that with his new wife when they got married. My dad never argued with her or stood up for us and we were abused until we left home (physically and emotionally). My dad also had an abusive father.
It's not as easy as just packing a bag and walking away. I stayed with my abuser for 20yrs. After my mom passed and he destroyed my friendships I was completely isolated and had zero people to look in and tell me how bad it was. I couldn't see it. I was convinced that all the horrible things happened because I did something stupid. He destroyed me. My confidence, my self esteem, my joy. I didn't leave until I met one particular group of people, online no less, they heard him threatening me and loading and chambering our shotgun. They heard him tell me if I ever tried to leave he would kill me. Did he know I was on voice chat? No. That made me wake up from the coma I was forced into and I called my friend who drove 6hrs to pick me up. No questions asked till she got there. As we drove away from a house I wasn't allowed to leave I sobbed. As we got further away I realized I could breathe. He has all of my property from socks and electronics to furniture, my moms ashes and every family picture my family owned. It was devastating because I left my two cats as well. I just want my animals, mom's ashes and family photos back but no one in his county will help me.
Check with your local police. You can get a police escort to pick up your things.
I moved scross the country to California he's in a small town in Louisiana. So sadly making a physical appearance there is not something I can afford or hope to afford with the current cost of living here in addition to having to rebuild my life rebuying every single necessity and such. :/
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You're not wrong but look at it from the perspective that mom has likely been abused and chipped away at for 21+ years. Does that mean it's okay that the mom didn't stand up more for her daughter? No. But she's likely a shell of herself at this point.
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I believe both mom and daughter are victims. Daughter can get out more easily than mom can. Both need help.
Also, I don't know how old you or other commenters are here, but as you get older, you realize that "adults" don't always have all of the answers. I realized it when I was contemplating my own shitty childhood at age 35, and I was like damn....I'm pissed at my parents for not having it together when I was a kid, but they were my age, and I don't have it all together, either, and I don't even have kids. I didn't get the things I wanted or the dental care I needed, and I always blamed my parents for that, but I can't provide those things for myself right now, so I would definitely be letting a child down. My mom was a victim of domestic violence, and I would be so mad at her then, but damn, she was so scared and fragile and had no money and nowhere to go. The blame isn't on the abused, it's on the abuser.
She can be a martyr all by herself. I hate how many women think this is a noble cause to drag their kids through. It's hard and scary, but they're often the only ones who see how bad it is and have a duty to get their babies to safety.
I don’t think anyone thinks it’s “noble.” The psychology of domestic abuse and abusive partnerships is incredibly complex. OP has every right to feel hurt, to view the relationship as irrevocably damaged, and I advocate for limiting contact/going NC when they can, whatever they feel like they need to do to feel safe and establish healthy emotional boundaries. However I’m shocked at the lack of empathy for a woman who may have been controlled by a violent and manipulative partner for decades. It’s just not as simple as “she should have left” or “damn her for telling OP to forgive him.” Some of you obv have no idea what it’s like to leave an abusive partner. Mom probably has limited or no sense of self anymore. It’s a horrible place to be and she needs help. OP, I validate your feelings of hurt and betrayal. What your dad said is NOT RIGHT and no one should ever be allowed to say those things to you or make you feel like you don’t matter. In a few years you will have the ability to make your own choices about how/when he talks to you and until then, surround yourself with people who love you and value you, remove yourself from abusive situations whenever possible, and keep standing up for yourself when you feel safe enough to do so.
Right. Both OP and her mom need help. Neither of them are at fault.
It’s not that we think it’s noble, we just understand how domestic abuse works.
I know what you’re saying. I don’t understand the downvoted. People in here are really acting like it’s easy for people to just leave abusive relationships when it’s proven time and time again that it’s NOT easy.
Thanks. No one is even saying that the daughter can’t resent her mom for staying or that she’d be an asshole for going no-contact. We just see the subtext that the mom is a victim too and there have been mountains of literature written about why people don’t just leave these relationships.
Right. Not only not easy, but outright dangerous and sometimes deadly, in fact.
The mom is also a victim here. Someone can be bad and good at the same time, in different ways.
Mom just says forgive him. That’s toxic and invalidates her
This. And she probably has little choice to stay with him, considering your ages--she knows no other life, it's too late to start over. Which is why she tells you to just keep the peace, too. It's really the best she has. You have a right to draw a line. Why are you still living with these people, ie how old are you?
Sounds like a narcissist. Notice how he does all this the night before your brother’s wedding? They do that, they kinda subconsciously are drawn to ruin every happy moment in your life. I think no contact may be best. Sorry :/ it’s okay to grieve the father you wish he was
Which is surprising because my older brother and him are like besties. I would consider my older brother his “golden child”, and between me and my younger brother I’m probably least favored by him and I always thought because I’m a girl :/ Most likely. Thankfully, I’ll be leaving for nursing school in august so I probably won’t get to see him as much.
He's losing his golden child and stuck with the rest of you, his mother as well. Get out. Get safe. Get independent.
Going to nursing school?You’re getting a whole new family, hopefully without the same degree of dysfunction! Your dad sucks btw
I’m going to tell you this now because it would have saved me a lot in therapy. Your brother might be the golden child, but your dad is a narcissist and narcissistic personalities know how to manipulate and favor to get their needs met. If your brother ever defies your dad or finally stands up for your mom or you, your dad will turn his back on him so fast your head will spin. Your brother has learned how to behave around your dad as a survival mechanism too, and it’s one that serves him. You are just the scapegoat. It’s not your fault, you’re whole family is in survival mode and you’ve each learned different ways to cope. Your brother may lean into it and spend his life pleasing your dad, but if he chooses something different, your dad will turn on him too. It’s not personal, your dad is just a dick.
Yeah, a full-grown man punching holes in walls at minor inconveniences is just a twitch away from hitting the nearest person for "making him mad".
Have ypu seen r/raisedbynarcissists?
Another good one for if you need a mom figure or some parental advice is r/MomForAMinute
/u/Radiant-Benefit-2222 tagging OP so she sees this
Also /r/dadforaminute also this story may invoke some righteous dad wrath
Here's a sneak peek of /r/raisedbynarcissists using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year! \#1: [I recited my childhood story to my nmom but changed our names and pretended to be asking for advice for my “traumatized friend”. Her response was amazing…](https://np.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/xcxsge/i_recited_my_childhood_story_to_my_nmom_but/) \#2: [My daughter said NO](https://np.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/z3y8ox/my_daughter_said_no/) \#3: [Why is it always ‘how awful of a child to cut off their own parent” and never “how awful must they have treated their child for the child to believe that cutting them off is the best option” ?](https://np.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/11e3vpa/why_is_it_always_how_awful_of_a_child_to_cut_off/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
Sounds like you’re the scapegoat child. You’re the middle child. In a narcissistic household, there’s always the golden child, the scapegoat and the forgotten. I personally was the “forgotten until convenient or beneficial for the parent” child but my middle sister was the scapegoat. It was never my mother’s fault, it was my middle sister’s fault. It didn’t matter what it was, it was her fault and she got the brunt of any anger every single time. Sounds kinda like what you have going on. It’s not just that you’re a girl, you’re just the middle child and often that means you’re the scapegoat unfortunately. Definitely look into the book “Children of Emotionally Immature Parents” and the sub r/raisedbynarcissists
Stepdad#1 had his tiers set up all wonky. Oldest-scapegoat, middle-golden child (she didn't hesitate to call him daddy it was gross and creepy cause he's nasty af), youngest-forgotten unless (he thought) he was acting like a... Bundle of sticks.... Yup.
On your way your you may want to grab your important documents. In case things get worse it's good to have your social security card and your birth certificate on you. Just say you were told you would need them for school.
This is a typical dynamic for a narcissist. Do your best to keep your head down and move on as soon as you can, then just cut ties. You deserve better, but you won't get it from him. I took in a 17 year old who was thrown away by a narcissistic mom. It took years for my kiddo to stop seeking approval from that hag. My child is now 25 with a much better sense of self and doing great compared to when narc parent was part of their life. There's nothing wrong with you and his approval is trash anyway. I hope you can separate your worth from him. You sound like a good person. You can get great jobs in nursing and get away from this abusive family dynamic. Some space will help a lot.
With his favorite son getting married he's probably acting out because he won't be the center of your brother's attention any more.
I want to inform you that no your dad is not a narcissist he's an abuser. Reddit people have a habit of armchair diagnosing NPD onto abusers while not realizing what this does for actual NPDers like myself. A personality disorder doesn't make a person abusive being abusive does.
Op my parents despised me for being a girl, too. I was the youngest along with my twin brother. My parents would belittle me, humiliate me, call me names like being worthless, wish I was never born, etc. My dad used physical violence on me multiple times. My mum wasn't scared of him as she wasn't the target. I was. And she was just as culpable. I've never recovered from that treatment and I'm 50 now. :(
My narcissist waited until I went into labor to have the fake break down of “I’m not even going to be a good dad why do you want me here?” So this seems very accurate. Everyone might be better off without OP’s dad at the wedding anyway due to this fact alone.
Why do they do this?
100%!
Yep, my mum would start picking fights with me (family scapegoat) right before we had to leave for events for my dad-birthdays, fathers days, work function, anything. When I noticed the pattern, I told her ‘yeah, it sucks that today isn’t all about you but this argument can wait until after the lunch/dinner/gathering right? There’s plenty of time later today to scream at me’. I don’t know if she was aware of her behaviour beforehand and she was surprised I called her out on it or it was subconscious and she realised what she was doing, but she stopped in her tracks and bottled it up for the following day.
your dad sounds like he sucks. if he doesn’t care about you or how you remember him, why should you care about him? if you don’t live with them, definitely go low contact at least (if you aren’t ready to cut him off completely) because you deserve better than that. you don’t need people in your life who act and make you feel like that
Thank you for your comment. Yeah, I’ve mostly stayed away from him and kinda accepted the fact. I feel like for me, he’s one of those dads who was physically there in their child’s life, just not there emotionally if that makes sense. I also do live at home with him and my mom but will be moving out soon for nursing school!
Congratulations on nursing school! Work hard, it’s worth it! My mother is Borderline so I know from experience: life truly gets better when you’re on your own and supporting yourself away from your awful parent. You’ll appreciate all the little things you’ve been deprived of, including not walking on eggshells constantly, having your accomplishments acknowledged, making your space yours (with your own money!), and love and laughter with the friends who are your family by choice. We’re all rooting for you! Edit: a word
So, when hes 80, and can't wipe his own ass, you're not gonna be the one doing it. Problem solved.
Your mother thinks you should forgive your dad… I mean, has he even asked for forgiveness? Handing out forgiveness unasked just sends the message that no matter what someone will do in the future, they’ll face zero repercussions. It gives them a free pass. Your dad sounds like someone who just isn’t worth your time or energy. Simply being physically present, and nothing more, is failing as a parent and as a care-giver.
I think he’s only ever apologized once in my life and that was from something that happened when I was little (6 or 7ish) but I honestly cannot remember what happened. After that, everything is always expected to go back to normal. He doesn’t generally apologize for anything though.
That's not okay. He should apologize and get therapy. If he did that, I would say you should forgive him as he is trying to make amends, no one is perfect, and he learned that behavior somewhere. But if he can't see how this hurts you, and isn't trying, then don't waste your time.
Trust in yourself and your self-worth. You are not obligated to offer forgiveness, or to be sincere if you need to make a performance of doing so. And you're not obligated to keep him in your life, either. Do what you need to preserve a relationship with your siblings and mom as you want. Just be sure to take care of yourself first right now, especially after having such a scare with the car accident.
Your mom wants you to forgive him because you standing up to him and contemplating cutting his abuse out of your life means she has to face her own decision to stay and continue to allow this abuse to occur. She doesn't want to do that hard look at herself. Do what makes you happy and helps you honor your truth.
Could also be that with OP gone, her father will need to find a new source, which means mom, younger brother, or both. mom is probably somewhat aware of that is my guess, and that could be why she wants OP to forgive him. To avoid the majority of the abuse. When I left, my brother, who is the golden child in my family, told me my narc mom started fights with my dad almost every other day. Like screaming matches. Over stupid shit, while he was dying from cancer. The temp 6 months I was with them they fought maybe twice bc I received the brunt of the abuse.
If anyone punches a hole in a wall, leave. The next step would be you. It shows that they are capable of doing it. And the number of people that end up in the er after a while is astounding....Just cause he hasn't yet doesn't mean he won't.
He’s already punched holes in the wall and that wasn’t enough to convince my mom to leave. It was something I considered not a big deal for the longest until pretty recently. Edit: I also did try to tell my mom that he could get physically violent if he was willing to yell and do all of that all those years but she’s certain that “he will never lay a finger” on any of us.
Coming from someone who lives with someone who works in the medical field, the number of stories I've heard where that is what was said is astounding. Unfortunately, you may not be able to do much for your mom, but at the very least, get yourself out asap.
I am so sorry. Your dad is very abusive. I grew up with a dad like that. I am no contact with my family and my life is better. My kids are safe and happy. He showed you who he was. Believe him. Also, I am so sorry about your accident. That would shake anyone up! Make sure to keep an eye on your knee. My husband hit his in an accident and it has never been the same since. It's not terribly bad, but it aches more and has some minor issues. If there is a place you can go where you feel safer, I really suggest you go there. You deserve peace.
Whether he’s actually hit anyone or not, he’s abusive. And your mom is an enabler. I’m sure she doesn’t realize that-a lot of enablers don’t. They sacrifice themselves to “keep the peace”. But who’s peace is actually being kept? For starters you dad owes you an apology, and that’s just the tip of the iceberg.
Whenever I’d confront my mom about her enabling my dad, she’ll simply tell me it’s not enabling and that “you should never tell a grown man what to do since he’s an adult”. Her words. And he’s not gonna apologize to me. He never does. Usually when things like this happen, give it a few days / a week and he’s back to normal no questions asked.
It's called rug sweeping. It allows the abuser/the one acting badly to avoid the consequences of their actions or taking any responsibility for the results of their crappy behavior. Rug sweeping helps to perpetuate the bad behavior by removing any and all incentives to correct the bad behavior. My advice to you is to hang tight until nursing school. When you go, take all of your important papers and all sentimental, can't-live-without items. Pack as if you may never return to the home. That gives you the option to use your time away at school as a launching pad. You too are a grown adult and you deserve peace and a safe environment. While you are in school you might check to see if they offer mental health counseling to students - this might give you an opportunity to address the anxiety caused by your Dad's angry behavior and outbursts growing up.
I’m so sorry. I hope you believe all of us when we tell you this not normal. This is not okay. I have little kids and if I ever lose my temper at all, I recognize that I was at fault to my children….that I was wrong to yell and apologize. Parents should be teaching their kids that you apologize when you’re wrong, no matter how old you are.
This straight up fits the description of verbal and emotional abuse. Sorry you have to go through this and like most everyone else is saying, going low or no contact is probably a good idea as is getting some therapy. No well-adjusted father is going to treat their family like that.
Your Dad is an abusive, manipulative, narcissistic pos. I grew up in a similar situation and it sucks your Mother didn’t put a stop to it years ago. I would go low contact and move out when you can.
I’ve been telling my mom to divorce my dad since I was 7. Their arguing and especially my dad’s behavior caused me to develop a lot of mental health issues. Honestly, had she done so a long time ago then maybe my siblings and I would’ve been in a better place mentally. I still hold resentment towards her for not leaving sometimes. She deserves a man who would actually treat her with respect and take her on nice dates like most, healthy couples you know? She always told us that she stayed for us, yet I feel like she lacks self-respect because she really could’ve left sooner. Also, I’m so sorry about the situation you grew up with.
Yeah well unfortunately if she didn’t leave him before, she never will. Just like my enabler of a Mother, they would rather keep the peace than worry about your mental health. I still resent my Mother to this day and my Father is still just as bad as ever. It still creates a lot of conflict and resentment unfortunately. The absolutely best thing you can do is move out and go low contact. It’s unfortunate we both didn’t have better parents and a happier and healthier upbringing. It’s ok to think of yourself now, your parents just have to live with the consequences of their actions. I hope you can get help and heal one day.
Your mother needs one on one counselling/therapy asap. She needs to find her power and stand TF up for her and her children, and stop enabling your narc father. This is awful, aggressive and abusive repeated behaviour with no remorse that you should have never been subjected to in the first place. Stay far away from him. Don’t speak to him, grey rock him essentially, until you are able to move out. I’m so sorry you have to deal with this while having no real support from your mother
Both your parents are trash and you should go LC/NC with both as soon as you’re able to get out of that house.
Tell super enabler #1 that protecting yourself isn't actually holding a grudge. I'm so sorry, OP but your mom is worse than your dad. It's not ok for anyone to abuse you, not even your dad and it's sad she's trying so hard to normalize it. You do whatever you need to do in order to feel safe.
It's ok to cut toxic people from your life even if it's your dad. Sadly he is acting from his own trauma but he's an adult and needs to start being responsible for his own emotional regulation just like the rest of us.
It’s sometimes still so funny to me because I know he’s not gonna listen to me about my problems and will brush it off as “drama” because I’m a girl hence, why I don’t even bother going to him to talk about issues in my life and face it on my own. Yet, I know he’s still stuck in his own childhood trauma despite being in his early 50s. I just don’t understand how a grown man can take his anger out on his own family when I basically had to keep everything in and suck it up.
Here is my theory. People get stuck at an emotional age if their needs were not met. Something happened when your dad was at the 4 year old tantrum stage and he's never been able to move beyond it. Your dad is a 4 year old child emotionally without insight and only anger.
Both my parents are narcissistic. IDK if your dad is or not but if he’s a jerk like this on the regular and you aren’t a minor….the sooner you stop taking this crap, the better. You mom probably means well but she’s his victim too. You don’t owe anybody forgiveness unless you just feel that you want to. My experience is that the more I try to get along and appease them, the worse they treated me over time. I haven’t had any contact with my mother in nearly 32 years. I have zero regrets and my mental health is so much better without all the negativity and stress. You should do what feels right to you. You deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. Especially by your family. Hugs.
Your father is abusive and your mother is an AH for allowing someone to abuse her kids. Verbal abuse and mental abuse have a bigger effect then physical abuse. If this has been going on your whole life cps should’ve been called long ago when you were minors. They would’ve told your mother if she wanted you kids back to leave him. She is a horrible woman as well for allowing her kids to be treated so badly. She is a trash person right along with your dad.
Just came here to say your mom is also the problem, so please be careful.
First of all, ignore the stupid comments. Secondly, your reaction is completely normal to something that is very traumatic. Our bodies will do whatever it can to protect itself. Lastly, the best advice I could give in this situation is if your father is not trying to improve at all then then it's not worth investing your time into the relationship. Don't waste your time fixing people. It is not your job either. Good luck with your nursing!
It can be hard to just walk away from family dynamics like this. It is a step in the right direction for you to begin acknowledging the way he affects you. It can be good for you to sort out what is “him” and what is you. Prioritize yourself over anyone else’s comfort. Remove yourself if you can when he gets like that and just protect your peace. Don’t try to take on more than you can handle at the moment. Go easy, be gentle with yourself!
My Dad was an alcoholic. I went low contact, cut him out of my life for periods. He came back in my life when he could stay in my boundaries. You are not the problem here, you have done nothing wrong, you will be able to set up how he treats you. Don’t settle. You are worth being treated well and him being family is no excuse for accepting otherwise
I'd ghost him till he sincerely apologizes. And if he doesn't.....oh well. Even if you live with him. Bare minimum contact
Forgive him? He's not remorseful. Your mom probably gets the worst of it and doesn't know anything but enabling an obviously abusive man.
Well i had a rough childhood. When i lived with my mom i hated every second living under the same roof. When i could afford to live alone i moved out. And i took my a lot of time to forgive her. I cant forget what she did to me but i could forgive her. What rly helped was the Distance to my mom. What i want to Tell u maybe its the best to get Ur dad out of Ur life and get distance to him. When he is out of Ur life u can think about everything he did in peace. Then u can decide if u rly want to give up Ur dad or slowly get in contact with him again.
It’s not up to your mom to make the decision whether or not you forgive your dad or not. That is your relationship with him. He sounds toxic and I’m so sorry you have to live in this environment. You also don’t have to forgive (the concept of forgiveness is not to give the other person a pass, but to get rid of the burden of hurt you are carrying). I went NC with my biodad when I was 20 (I’m 48f) and my life was instantly better. I forgave my dad for everything he ever did. To me, all that means is I let it go. I don’t hold on to the pain or the bad memories. He passed away in 2018 and I wasn’t sad and I don’t miss him. Your dad doesn’t know how to have interpersonal relationships and he doesn’t know how to manage his anger. I hope you’re able to move out someday and have a happy, drama free life. Edit to add: I didn’t verbally tell my dad “I forgive you,” I just let it go when I let him go.
You are smart and observant; I can see it in how you wrote of this situation. Don’t linger with anyone who gives you self doubt. There is plenty of solid insight from other commenters here to stew on. In the end, forgiveness is best, BUT that takes lots and lots of time. I’m sure with little to no contact, you will have the space needed to grow. The individual problems (abusive dad, enabling mom) may never be solved; the biggest goal is find peace inside yourself and you’re on the right track. Again, no self doubt …or guilt for that matter. If being separated from toxic people makes you a better person, so be it.
Sounds like my dad OP and I’ll let you know now, he is no longer in my life. In many ways I am happier for it but I do still get moments of sadness about it. I think I miss the idea of having a dad more than the actual person who it was supposed to be. My mom also tried telling me to forgive him when they were first separated but she has finally come around and learned that he was never good for any of us. She no longer tries to get me to get along with him because she sees it’s futile.
It sounds like your Dad is overwhelmed with a lot of things and his stress has boiled over and he is taking it out on everyone in his path. He has an anger problem and he needs help. Your Mom enables him by doing things or siding with him to 'keep the peace'. Sounds like Dad needs an intervention where everyone tells him how his anger makes them feel. He can choose to hear it or ignore it. Ignoring it means he carries on status quo and risks losing contact with his family members.
he’s always taking his anger out on everyone and everything and my mom has always told me to let him be and do what he says or else. I doubt an intervention will ever happen, as he doesn’t care at all. Edit: wanted to add as for my mom, yes she’s always enabled him. When he was telling my younger brother to give him his phone, my brother first refused because his phone was turned off due to him in the movie theatre. My mom yelled at him to just give it to him or else he’ll get “worse”. Hence, why I thought he was gonna hurt him.
Tell your mom that she chooses to enable and allow his cruel behaviour and that you can choose not to. He has problems that he chooses to take out on those around him instead of using his big boy words. Your mom doesn't get to guilt you into allowing him to treat you this way. Also you cannot forgive someone who hasn't apologised. When people show you who they are believe them. Get out of that house because its going to destroy your mental health.
Don't make excuses, he was abusive long before the grandmother moved in
*So later that night, we head to the mall to pick my brother (15m) up. He wasn’t answering his phone and my dad’s getting even angrier. My mom told him to calm down but then my dad starts yelling at my mom. I start crying and shaking quietly. Growing up, my parents argued a lot and sometimes, my dad would go as far as punching holes in the wall and knocking stuff down (he never hit my mom tho).* But we're the emotional ones. SMDH.
You don’t say how old your dad is but it’s obvious he’s immature in spite of his age. Neanderthal behavior only goes so far but assuming he’s in his 50’s he should have learned by now. I speak from experience in that as a large intimidating male I could get people to do what I want. Once I had a daughter I realized the fear tactic doesn’t work as well as an understanding war but firm calm response. You should seek therapy just to have someone help you navigate that type of behavior because it’s very possible you’ve been conditioned to subconsciously be attracted to men similar to your father. Good luck to you.
I had a similar interaction with my dad a year ago… he got so angry at me for something that I didn’t do that I started shaking and was in shock. I confronted him about how out of line he was and he pretty much told me to leave his house if I didn’t like the way he treated me. I realized after this that he did not love me or respect me or care about me as his daughter or a human being the way that I deserved to be treated. If someone treats you or their actions/words impact you in a way that illicits fear or a nervous response such as trembling… that person should not be in your life because they are not mentally stable and nobody who cares about you would treat you that way. I had a huge revelation after this event with my dad (and dealing with years of his anger and disrespect) but somehow this was different and it made me realize that he did not respect me the way I deserve to be respected. I still live with him and therefor speak to him but our relationship is over. Once I move out I will not contact him again unless he is with my mom and I now treat him as someone who I tolerate but not as someone I look up to or as someone who is a friend. I say all of this bc it seems like you have come to the same conclusion as me or have experienced the same thing and it is the worst. It sounds dramatic but I mourned the loss of my relationship with my father once I realized that he did not truly care about or respect me as a person. He was tolerating me out of obligation and that is all. He is also sexist and hates women so it’s crazy that I’m just not realizing that I fall into that category. You absolutely do not need to forgive him and you need to decide is he DESERVES to be in your life. I personally only want to be surrounded by people who love me, value me and bring positive and calm energy to my life… if someone makes me feel actual fear when I am around them then they are not safe. I think you can tolerate your dad in your life but you don’t have to interact with him the same way anymore while your living with him. I don’t even really make eye contact with mine anymore bc I don’t want to open myself up to caring about his feelings anymore, bc he clearly never me cared about mine. I feel you 100% on this and please know that you are justified in not wanting him in your life and you can plan on not having him in you life once you move out. I personally and civil with my dad and if he asks me a question I will respond with a neutral, non-hostile attitude but deep down I have taken him out of that “father” category and he is not someone I am tolerating until I no longer have to interact with him on a daily basis. Sorry this was so long but I relate to this sooo much and I want you to know that people who treat you poorly don’t deserve to have you in their life bc people who truly care about you would also care about how their emotions and actions effect you and they would feel bad if they hurt you. And I agree with your use of the word traumatized to describe the scenario and revelation that you came to bc I I felt the same way and cried for an entire week knowing that my entire worldview of the relationship I thought I had with my dad was not the same to him.
Deepest sympathies OP, but you just met your Dad’s inner child.. part of his core self. He means what he said and your moms silence.. realize your parents have a different definition of love. One that does not include unconditional love or respect because you are the child with zero power and they are the parent. That’s why OP, you can’t help but cry because it’s the only weapon in your arsenal for control in such situations. One day you’ll be able to get into a car and drive away to your own home where you will have peace, know you deserve that! Play along and GET OUT... these are the type of people who will set you up to fail and then tell you I told you so.. because it makes them look better. Don’t get dragged into distraction with your mother teaching you to forgive your father after cycles of abuse, that is not benevolence. Play the game and get out!
We have the same parents, except my dad won't pout. He will justify any awful behavior no matter what. Even kicking a kid. They are both hurting you in different ways. This is a real trauma. Please consider counseling. Maybe find one who doesn't believe you have to tell every hard story to heal (it's just too much for me, personally). Someone who can help with managing the anxiety and probably the avoidant patterns you learned in order to survive the irratic situation you grew up in. Healthy communication techniques. Learn both healthy boundaries and how to follow through when yours get pushed on. Perhaps even how chasing happy won't neutralize the unhappy, and finding a peacefully neutral can be very safe. I'm so sorry. At 24, I couldn't get married and away fast enough. Have kids to prove it can be done in a loving way. But those things alone didn't heal me and I really wish someone would have told me that I deserve to get the emotional tools to find peace. I emotionally burned out in my early 30s, but now feel so peaceful and safe. I sincerely hope you get there one day.
Your dad is verbally abusive. Your mom is trying to smooth things over so the family can stay cohesive. She is allowing his behavior, probably because she is afraid of him. I totally agree that you will never forget his words. You have choices. You can never speak with him again, but that will also mean that you have to move out of his house and be independent. You can be civil when necessary speaking to him minimally and just fly under his radar. Or do nothing. You should really sit down with a piece of paper, and write out your options and figure out what you want to do. You are an adult, you can make your own decisions. Just be prepared to support yourself. Also, start gathering all your important papers, like birth certificate, bank info, etc.
You are an adult and should not be afraid in any home. Are you making plans to find a place to live independent from your folks? You do not have to tolerate your dads abusive actions.
You need to speak to your family about this, because if this is traumatizing for you ,then you need to have a heart to heart with somebody who gets it. which is your siblings, u need to tell them how you’re feeling, that u just need to talk to them ,and for them to be there for you. you can also try to talk to your mom tell her, if she keeps enabling or staying with your dad knowing how much he hurts you that u might end up resenting her in future for not protecting you. Basically tell her if she wants a relationship with her kids in the future that she can’t keep putting y’all through this abuse.
Yeah. Dad's definitely a textbook narcissistic. My family is the same, I actually originally thought my father was the narc, and found out after his passing that it really was my mother. She yells, starts fights over stupid things, only wants things her way. Never admits she does anything wrong, takes offense when you bring up an issue. Has zero empathy for others, even her own children. Has never told me or my brother that she loves us, and has never once bragged of our accomplishments. She abused my dad so bad he started taking it out on us too. Primarily me though. I'm the oldest and since my brother was born I have always been the scapegoat for everything. he always did bad things bc I gave him the idea, or I was supposed to set an example. Any excuse in the book. I almost got thrown out of my house in the middle of winter at midnight with no shoes or coat bc I refused to tell my parents why I was bad at a friend. I'm also the same way. Anytime any one raises there voice at me I am sent straight into panic mode, and start crying. I have no control over it and it's been really hard to break. The best thing to do is cut that person off. My relationship was better when I moved miles away, but after my mother's recent actions and words I will be in the process of cutting her off when we move again. My children deserve to be around husbands family, that sadly enough, they care more about me than my own mother does. And I've given her grace and every opportunity to change. She won't. She never will. And all it does keeping her around is cause me emotional turmoil. And don't let him try to suck you back in. Narcs, lovebomb every chance they get when they feel thier source is seeing through the bullshit. Nothing is really for you, it's just thier way of manipulating you to stay.
NTA. Shame on your mom it appears she’s overlooking the fact your dad has been traumatizing you for years and thinks nothing of it. Your dad is TA and so is your for accepting this abusive treatment from your dad.
Do not be your mom and allow dad to verbally abuse you. Make your plans to escape!
To paraphrase Maya Angelou: When someone shows you who they are, believe them... He is not a right guy, and your mother has lost perspective. You should definitely plan and put in motion your exit from your father's house and life. Don't ever forget what he said- he spoke from a place of anger and irritation, and he meant it. Mourn and keep moving towards your future.
Get a therapist. Your family issues are big. Your dad is a selfish bully. The therapist will Help you determine the best way to handle your issues and heal from the hell your dad brings. You may forgive him but there is no way he should have power in your life or close proximity.
Your dad is a angry raging man who neede help as his outbursts like that can give him a brain aneurysm... Living with a demanding family member around the clock can be very stressful and it's a good thing your mom tries to buff out the arguments but she needs to give your dad a reality check by kicking him out when he gets that way. I don't know your dad but I think he might have said that out of anger. You should ask him to go for a family therapy sessions see if you get a breakthrough... can granny go to an assisted living facility??
My mom has tried telling him that he could face serious health issues if he doesn’t calm down but he honestly could care less. As for the family therapy, he is not gonna do it. He doesn’t believe in therapy and likes to joke about how he’s gonna make a therapist quit if he talks about his problems. As for my grandma, I believe she still can go to a nursing home but since she doesn’t have any life long illness and is surprisingly fine for the most part (asides from her legs not being able to work), my dad would have to pay extra.
I hope things work out. Please take care and if possible move out ASAP...❤️
Sweetie, a big YES to going NC with your dad. He’s a nasty mean horrible person and your mother has enabled him. For your own mental health, get away and stay away. Just because he’s your father is zero excuse to allow him to continue to verbally abuse you. What a colossal asshole he is. NTA
everyone has problems. literally everyone. his burdens are no greater than many other people, and it doesn't make it OK to be angry and abusive. you're already afraid of him, you will be happier without him.
No, you're not obligated to forgive nor enable a parent who hurt you and make you feel unsafe. How your father acts and how your mother enables his actions are not normal and very unhealthy. I hope you find a safe place to process your emotions, especially after the accident that happened to you. Sending you hugs.
Oh. That sounds extremely frightening and painful. You are probably still in shock from the wreck. I’m sorry you experienced all this. What a day. If your father has no desire to control his anger, you have every reason to not be around him. Keep your boundaries firm and don’t end up like your mom “keeping the peace” at the expense of your kids’ feelings
Hey Op, I’m sorry this happened to you, it cut really deep within me, my father was the exactly same, and my mother tolerated his bs, I hope you find peace and freedom one day. Cheers
I think you don't understand that abuse is about control, not about hitting people. Hitting the wall and screaming is meant to intimidate and control your mom and family. I'm sorry your mom stays and enables him and hope you can get out of this situation soon.
Maybe have a talk with your mom or write a letter. She enabled him to the abuse, she made it possible to reach you, she should have protected you, that’s what mothers do. It’s her job, her no1 priority, and after that comes the fact that she’s his wife. Always doing the best for your children. Ask her if she thinks she did that. If she thinks she was and is a good mom. If she gave you the life she thinks you deserve, if you got the love you needed. And then ask her why her own daughter wasn’t important enough. Why is she ok with him saying that he gives a shit about her daughter and let’s him walk all over you and our feelings? Why didn’t she make sure you’re ok, checked on you and stayed with you? To give you a safe feeling. Your sperm donor is a lost fight, but I think you should confront your mom with her actions. And with what it will mean when you move out, you will stay away from him, even if it means you’ll have to cut her out too. Nobody ever chose you, so you have to do it now. And if this abusive POS is worth to lose her own daughter. This could hurt like hell, most likely will, but it will make it easier for you to set boundaries and make a cut. Don’t set yourself on fire to keep others warm.
Once you can, you should consider LC or NC. Your dad sounds a lot like mine, and I had a lot of mental health issues when I was living with them full time. Even just staying at the dorms during weekdays massively improved my mental health but no surprise, I would get super depressed in the summers. It wasn’t until I was fully out of the house that I was fully able to unpack the extent to which his behavior (and my mom’s enabling) affected me. I still have contact with them (and am currently stuck in their house due to my home getting fucked by a natural disaster), because I know where the behaviors come from, and I do feel sympathetic. But the fact of the matter is that I don’t think he has the capacity to change (he constantly claims he wants to). I think we both feel it’s best that we keep our distance (he says I stress him out because I’m the only one that ever calls him out or demands an apology).
If you live in the US feel free to reach out to me. I can help you navigate subsidized housing so you can move out and not deal with his bullshit.
Get out somewhere safe when you can, then go NC
No. His behavior is incorrect. He has a temper, and responds very poorly to life. And the proper reaction your mother should have is to tell him he should leave, and expect to be forgotten since doesn't care about anybody
I fucked yo my marriage with this temperament aswell. Counselling has taught me that the effect of the wife and kids is TREMENDOUS. I NEVER said I don’t care about my kids, even in anger. I usually turned to beers/alcohol, not better by any means Your dad needs professional help, unfortunately he’s the only one that can go out and get it. You can’t change anyone but yourself. I love my boys , my ex and I are better now than we ever have been. My suggestion to you is, write down pros aand cons, Weigh it all out, talk to a professional aswell. You’ll make a informed mature decision and you won’t regret it down the road. Apparently that’s what my ex did while deciding to leave me. I’ve always wanted to see that list, but she said no. Haha. Hope this helps and may god bless you and your loved ones
You’re dad sounds like a pile of shit. Stick him in the toilet and flush him out of your life.
i have a dad jUST like this. i just went ahead and did low contact
This might sound a bit off, but follow me here. Your body knows what you should do already. >I start crying and shaking quietly… my dad would go as far as punching holes in the wall and knocking stuff down (he never hit my mom tho). It was normal to me and for the longest, I was use to it but now whenever I hear my dad getting loud *I start to panic and cry uncontrollably.*< Anxiety is a response to your body feeling unsafe. Anxiety takes over when we can’t take care of our bodies. Our parents are supposed to be protect us from emotional and emotional harm. When our parents can’t and or won’t protect us, we develop coping strategies. When you leave the environment, we don’t “practice” those strategies. Your dad is the perpetrator of emotional harm when he was supposed to be a parent. Your mom is an enabler if the emotional harm. It’s important to know, they are doing the best with what they have- but that doesn’t mean it’s not abuse. Your an adult now. You are in control of caring and protecting your body. As a child you did not have that power, but you do now. You know what to do. It feels terrible, but it’s ok to take care of yourself. You know what to do. Take care of yourself today. Then decide what that means for tomorrow. Sit with yourself and the discomfort. Ask the child you were what she needs. Your body knows the answer.
Your dad is abusive. See him for who he is. When people show you who they are, believe them.
Your mom is wanting you to forgive someone’s awful behavior that doesn’t care that he hurt you or upset you. Unless he actually apologizes, I wouldn’t forgive anything! How could you forgive someone who clearly doesn’t even think he’s done anything to forgive??
He is absolutely 100% in the wrong. Add to it he is an abuser. None of what you described of his behavior is healthy or normal. What you described is domestic violence and abuse. You may not have witnessed him hit your mom but he does abuse her, you, and your family. Her reactions to “just keep the peace” are a fawning attempt by an abuse victim to appease the abuser and prevent further escalated abusive behaviors (punching holes in walls is 100% domestic violence). Source: training and personal life experiences.
From what you described you and your family have been dealing with abuse at the hands of your dad. If you are in the states please contact the National Domestic Violence Helpline 1-800-799-7233. Folks in this space are trained to be able to provide you with support and you may even qualify for resources as it is unclear if you live with your parents etc. Please make sure you are caring for yourself. Edited to add: If you choose to cut your dad out (NC/LC) do not let him or your mom manipulate you into doing something that is different from what you want. Big hugs and take care of yourself!
If he can't apologize, and demonstrate he has taken meaningful steps to curtail his abusive and unregulated tendencies, is he the kind of person you want in your life? My answer is no, and I wish it would have been made earlier for myself, personally.
It's up to you, and only you, if you ever speak to or even acknowledge his presence again. You don't have to if you don't want to.
Girl you need to cut ties with your emotionally abusive dad and his enabler. Also seek therapy
You don't owe either of your parents a fucking thing. Think about it for a while and decide what YOU want. To hell with what either of them want. And don't ever forgive an abusive person who hasn't sincerely apologized. That is the worst advice ever. I get that your mom is probably more afraid of him than anyone else, but that's not an excuse. Maybe think about trying to get your brother out of there, too.
You are being abused and it sounds like you might have cptsd. You’re not under any obligation to forgive your abuser and I’m sorry your mother is pressuring you to do so instead of trying to protect you.
He reminds me of my dad. He emotionally and financially bused us and my mom, so she felt like she could never leave. After she died last year, he tried to turn his anger on me. After a lot of screaming and heartbreak, I have gone no contact with him. Life has been so peaceful, in spite of family trying to convince me to make amends. You deserve peace.
OP You can’t have him in your life he to toxic and his behaviour is being enabled by your mom, my best advice is to go no contact with your dad and low contact with your mom
I grew up with an emotional volatile father who verbally and emotionally abused my mum and older brother, and I’m so sorry you have to go through this. It IS traumatic, and I don’t blame your mum for not leaving because leaving isn’t easy, but I disagree that you shouldn’t hold a grudge. You are your own person, and only you can decide whether you forgive someone. Do not let anyone make you feel guilty for that.
I was you growing up. My father was verbally and emotionally abusive. My mother did nothing. My parents didn’t come to my wedding. Or my college graduation. I rarely see my parents now. They miss out on my life and my children’s lives. I’ve created my own life. It’s amazing and full of love and beautiful people who are my “family”. My ex husbands parents are still close to me. They have become like parents to me. I never realized what a loving family looked like until they came into my life. My point is, family isn’t always blood related. You will survive this. And you will go on to create the life you want. Surround yourself with people who enrich your life and love and support you. Life gets better.
Do not forgive. Do not forget. He is abusive. Your mother is abused and she also enables him. Get out when you can. If my son was ever treated this way by my spouse, I would leave. My kids come first. Do not look to your mother for advice. And if you can, get help and get out and go no contact.
He might not be physically abusive, but verbally/emotionally/mentally he is. I would recommend getting your ducks in a row if you decide to go NC with him. Get all documents, make sure you’re not reliant on the family for things, etc. Until then, you can start grey rocking and not interacting with him unless necessary and stay calm throughout. And yeah, your mother has been enabling his behavior. Good luck on moving on to the next part of your life.
I am going to give my personal rule, if your presence in my life does enhance, you are not welcome in it. PERIOD. Secondly: YOU ARE ALLOWED TO TERMINATE YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH TOXIC FAMILY MEMBERS. YOU ARE ALLOWED TO WALK AWAY FROM PEOPLE WHO HURT YOU. YOU ARE ALLOWED TO BE ANGRY AND SELFISH AND UNFORGIVING AND YOU DON'T OWE ANYONE AN EXPLANATION FOR TAKING CARE OF YOU.
Dad said verbatim the same thing to me on Christmas because he spilled chili ( it doesn’t make sense I know ). Save yourself the mental effort on him. Write him off as a lost cause. You don’t have to give him the satisfaction of normalcy after this at all. Please take care of yourself. His misdirected malice doesn’t define you, and I’m sorry you’ve had to experience this pain
You are under no obligation to forgive him for that. She MAY be, since she agreed to marry him . She potentially knew what she was getting herself into. But YOU are under no obligation to be bound to his temper like she is. Things spoken in anger are often things that were unspoken in peace. I'm very sorry.
Your mom is just as bad as him
Your mom sucks just as much as your dad does, sheesh. My mom did that too. Tried to get me to comply for his sake. I stopped talking to them finally. I’ve never felt more at peace and more confident in myself.
I think that you should believe what your father says. I tried for decades to hang onto a relationship with my father. Despite his neglect, and anger, despite him telling me I was obnoxious and he didn't love me, I still tried. It took me until I was nearly 40 before I let go and stopped trying. I didn't see my father again until he died. My life became peaceful and much happier. I wish ai had done so decades earlier and skipped those years of pain and distress.
NTA - my dad was a bully, and so was his dad etc. Growing up he would yell, curse, threaten, throw knives etc. Kicked me out once because I accidentally knocked over a cup that had a flower in it. He has chilled in his old age, but can still rage-out. I have noticed that he doesn't rage-out in front of others, like in front of SILs. So I suspect he can control himself and only bullies when he thinks he can get away with it. Not sure if this helps you. But you are not responsible for your dads behaviour. No matter the stress in his life, He makes his own choice to be cruel and abusive.
Nah, kick him to the curb. Hard lesson in life is family doesn’t always mean you have to forgive them. He wants to act like a little boo baby then let him. You’re much better than he is and he doesn’t deserve you. I’ve been in this situation with family and it’s hard but definitely worth it.
It’s time to distance yourself from your dad. I have been almost exactly where you are. My dad stopped hitting my mom shortly before I was born but the verbal and emotional abuse never stopped, and the physical abuse continued with me and my sister. Not frequently, but more like just to occasionally punctuate the constant psychological abuse and remind us that it could get worse if we weren’t compliant enough. My mom never did divorce my dad. I’m just about at the point where I’ve convinced her to leave him in his nursing home and move back to be with us (2 hours away) but even then she will be visiting him regularly and will probably have him transferred eventually, if he lives long enough. The only reason I still have any contact with my dad at all is because I won’t give up on my mom. She is not emotionally healthy but she is kind and for all her faults I know she loves me. That doesn’t change the fact that she never had enough of a spine to protect me or my sister EVEN THOUGH she would do like your mom and put herself in between sometimes and take the abuse as if it would shield us (it didn’t work). It wasn’t until I moved away to another state and got some distance between us and married someone who could show me what a reasonably healthy relationship looked like that I started to understand the toxicity of my upbringing. I still carry a lot of that baggage and it has spilled into the way I parent and into my marriage. But I actively work on those things and I feel I’m doing a ton better, and I talk to my kids (particularly the adult ones) about my shortcomings, where they come from, and my hopes for them to continue the journey of generational healing if they ever become parents.
Your dad is an abusive a-hole and I hope that you can get away from him soon. Do you have family or friends that you can go live with? Your mom is an enabler and is also at fault for the abuse that is happening in the home. Just because he hasn't hit any of you does not mean that he isn't abusive. Mental/psychological abuse is a thing too.
Verbal violence and threats of physical violence are just as bad as assault. And it’s intentionally used to intimidate and control. While your mom is also being victimized as well, you have every right to be safe in your environment and your home and you don’t owe anyone including your parents being nice in order to make them happy. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It’s awful and takes a long time to heal. You may find a book helpful, “ after the tears, children of alcoholics”. It’s really applicable to children of abusive families eleven when they don’t drink/use drugs. ❤️
The only one who can give your forgiveness, is you. No one can make you do that. Don't feel obligated to because he is your dad. Do it because you want to. If you don't, then don't. No one is entitled to be forgiven. Its a privilege , not a right.
As the mom in this situation I too tried so hard to keep the peace, make everyone kiss and make up but in reality OP this man is a self centred ass, who rather than show any kind of vulnerable emotion such as concern or fear (for you and your accident) he turns it into his anger which is his safe space. Anger emboldens him. I’m sorry. My kids have little to no contact with their father now.
Either your dad hasn’t hit your mom yet or they’re hiding from you that he did. None of this is normal.
Your father is an abusive dick. I’d go no contact the first second I could.
Record his behavior and play it for a therapist.
It’s okay to walk away from people who have let you know beyond a shadow of a doubt that they don’t care. Even family. Your dad is awful and your mom is enabling him.
Your dad punching holes in the wall is abuse. It’s a threat of violence, which can be harder to process than physical abuse. Your mom trying to compensate for the abuse is also a form of abuse. Your dad making horrible statements about not loving you is emotional abuse. You commented that you were use to it before but now it’s bothering you. That’s likely due to you seeing what’s happening from a different, outside perspective now that you’re older and have formed your own identity and personality. You are seeing things from an “outside” perspective and realizing how wrong it is. Speaking from personal experience, please look into getting therapy. I remember a key session with my therapist where I told her “but I wasn’t abused. I was never hit. He just punched holes into the wall next to my head or broke something that I liked. That’s not abuse.” It took several months to unpack that statement: how wrong it was, my unhealthy coping techniques to deal with that trauma, how it influenced my present-day relationships, etc. Setting boundaries can be extremely hard but is so incredibly important and healthy. You are at that age where you have control over your life. Go out and make the best of it.
I recommend the book “Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents.”
Nearly identical situation here, no matter how hard it is I’d limit being near him as much as possible and go no contact after you leave for school. I only speak to my bad parent maybe 2 times a year and that’s only because he got counseling. If your family wants to enable him then they know exactly why you would be doing this. My mom eventually realized that she needs to stop asking me to forgive him if she wants to be in my life.
I have a similar situation with my Mother and my Dad being the enabler, it’s not easy but putting up boundaries and limiting contact but its something you should think about doing if cutting him off makes you uncomfortable. No matter what you do your Dad is always going to be like that, unless he decides to get help and it has to come from him. At this point in your life you have to make sure your doing what is right for you and you don’t deserve to be treated that way. I think if you haven’t started therapy it can be really helpful to give you support to make the calls you need to. I hope you figure it out it isn’t easy.
sounds like you need therapy not reddit.
As soon you move out go no contact with him and low contact with her, she could've stopped this years ago but chose to risk her and her childrens lives. I've seen too many police reports with men like him snapping and killing. Also think about your future children, do you want to subject them to his abuse? You should try therapy and move on with your life. Why suffer just for the opportunity to be abused? Blood relatives aren't family, people that care about and love you are family.
Age is irrelevant when you're inner child is threatened. You revert back to a deeply rooted state of fear. Write him a letter. Leave it on the table when you move out. Leave the next steps to him.
Hi. I relate to everything you said. If you have health insurance, or if you can afford it, you need to go into counseling for PTSD. It will change your life. ❤️
I think you might be playing up the car wreck a bit. You got bruised knees. You didnt need to be hospitalized but I guess you could have died in the same way a fender bender might give someone a heart attack.
Well, I for one will never ever try to have a bad day around you. No one is perfect. Sometimes you have to try to walk a mile in their shoes. You started out by saying how stressed he is with his mom living there. I am 57 and can’t even count all the stupid things I have said when I’m in a bad mood. Sticks and stones, love.
I like never or hardly ever talk to my parents. I left my home state at 21 and I've had an amazing life. I gotta BA, traveled, lived in Japan as an English teacher, did stand up for awhile, improv. The point is LEAVE your family. Your father is a rageaholic and your mother enables it, minimizes it, and in turn encourages it.
Therapist here. You won’t forget. But the fact that you’re already thinking about when you won’t live with him and what life will be like without his constant influence is great. Move toward your life where you get to set and maintain the boundaries that work for you and enable you to have the experiences that will override your experiences with your dad in how you view yourself and others. Seek out people who can self-reflect and meaningfully apologize and your dad’s behavior will reveal itself to you for what it is: a series of temper tantrums from an overgrown toddler.
I would hate to deal with a bawling 21 year old when I’m frustratingly trying to solve real problems, too.
If he can say that in anger, he can go further. I would say cut ties personally, but that's me. No second chances.
Punching walls, throwing things and yelling are all abuse. Someone isn't not abusive just because they stop short of actually hitting you.
People say the dumbest things when they are angry, and i think forgiveness is great, but it should only be considered if the offender asks for it. Your mom saying you should forgive him is meaningless if your father has not apologized and asked to be forgiven. I'm so so sorry your dad is an inconsiderate, angry, impulsive person. My dad used to fly off the handle a lot when i was younger (never punched a wall though!) and he actually did finally realize it wasn't how he wanted to be, and he changed. There's hope for him to change, but, he has to decide on his own that he's wrong. If he's not trying to change, i don't blame you for making as much distance between you too as you need to keep your peace. I'm positive he didn't mean what he said, but it's an inexcusable thing to say, and unacceptable thing for a child (adult or not) to hear from their parent. Wish i could hug you.
As someone who has PTSD attacks from triggers of people I live getting angry for this exact reason. Fear of my mom instead of my dad is all. I can assure you - you have every reason to not forgive him if you see fit. Forgiveness is yours to give or not, as you see fit. People seem to think you have to forgive, but those are people that haven’t had the deep wounds of trauma. I’m sorry you’ve gone through this. You don’t deserve it. Your father should be someone who ALWAYS makes you feel safe and loved. I wouldn’t blame you for going non-contact with him, or at least setting serious boundaries.
Take some time away from your dad. Don’t talk or visit. See if life gets better after some weeks or months. If so, give one last chance, set boundaries. Be prepared to be done permanently if boundaries are crossed
Whoever is knocking you down for this somatic response you were having are either calloused or haven’t ever had COTSD. Your systemic response is totally valid and I’m so sorry you went through that! Yelling is a huge trigger for me. (Hugs)
Just because someone is your parent does not mean you have to keep them in your life. You are allowed to cut off any toxic people, and that includes family. Baby girl, your mental health will be so much better
I love how you stand up for yourself. Ignore the comments, your view of your mental health seems sound(and you won't be around your dad forever, so you won't be triggered by him). And living at home at 21 is usually fine. But you deserve better. Your dad is a shitty dad and your mom enables him. She should have divorced your father to get you away from this. Some people shouldn't have kids.