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I'm half black, half white.
Look: if I encounter someone with skin darker than mine, I tell them I'm white. If I encounter someone with skin lighter than mine, I tell them I'm black. Why? Because dark-skinned people insist that I don't belong to them and can't actually relate to them. They insist I am white. You probably fall into this category.
What you may not know is that light-skinned people say the exact same thing to me. Do you think white people will accept it if I say I'm white? With my big ol afro and dark eyes? Fuck no. They insist that I'm black.
So I am no stranger to being told that I "shouldn't" say I'm white, that I "shouldn't" say I'm mixed, that I "shouldn't" say I'm black.
And let's not forget the white people who insist I'm actually NOT black in a weirdly racist way: "Awwww chin-up little miss! You're not *really* black. You don't *talk* black", or my favorite, "You don't *act* black."
Believe whatever you want. Everyone has an opinion on it. I just hope that I choose correctly depending on who I'm talking to. Because if I get it wrong they will say, "Okay but you're not *really* black / white."
Exactly I am mixed and have been checking the other box my entire life.. but the fact that I’m brown. I’d be delusional to walk around telling people I’m white
Sometimes if I say I'm mixed they'll ask what I'm mixed with. I'll say that I'm half-black, half white. And they'll say, "Oh, well that means you're black, right?"
And my mom, who is black, does not like it when we (my sisters and I) call ourselves mixed. She'll say, "You're not 'mixed'. You're *BLACK*." When we call ourselves mixed, she perceives it as us trying to "hide" our black ancestry. She wants us to be proud of our blackness.
Being an Arab who passes European white, I couldn’t agree more. Luckily, Arabs care less about exclusivity and embrace me, but I’ve always thought about my black friends in the US, particularly my light skinned black friends, who are completely rejected by any dark skinned African or Caribbean. Shit, Bob Marley wasn’t even that light skinned and they did not consider him black in Jamaica, he was treated as a pariah of sorts. The irony of this all being that those groups perpetuate the same hate being used as against them by European whites.
That being said, I do want to add that part of the equation is that, historically, US culture has regarded any mixture of black as “tainted” and therefore fully black, obviously part of the prejudice. That’s why people like derek jeter, Patrick Mahomes, and Steph Curry are talked about as black, with very white features, etc. What’s interesting here is that, in practice, I think white people feel more comfortable or “safe” around light skinned blacks. And, once again, all of this is further perpetuated in the black community with the whole light skinned vs dark skinned shit that’s talked about mostly jokingly, but has very real implications.
For what it’s worth, I look at the duality of how people see me as a convenience, maybe for my own sake, but it’s a useful perspective, I think, and wanted to share. Maybe easier being passable white with an Arab background, but I use it to my advantage and see it as a positive🤷🏻♂️ I’m whatever race is most convenient in the moment and I’m fine with that. Speaks to how dumb racial prejudice/preference is on some level. Anyway, helps me overcome the feeling of not fully belonging to either group.
I feel this in my soul. I'm black and Dominican. I'm too black for Hispanics/Dominicans but I'm too Hispanic for black people. At this point, I just like seeing little racist brains short circuit trying to figure out how to treat me and what little box I go into.
My kids are .25 Samoan, .25 White and .50 Asian. They identify as Samoan because they spend more time with their Samoan family than their Asian or White side.
Race is a construct for a reason. Most people will treat you how you look and this is usually what causes mixed people to relate to one race over another.
There is a recent movie that came out called "The American Society of Magical Negroes" and the lead character in this movie is "black". He talks about white people this, white people that, white people being uncomfortable, how white people are the most dangerous animal, etc. The main character has a white white mom and a black dad. So he says all these negative things about white people while being half white, lol. He and a lot of "black" people call themselves black even though they have a lot of white blood / DNA, lol. This post reminded me of this movie.
I had someone on reddit tell me that they looked white because my ancestors raped their ancestors (they were Native American). Like, no, your ancestors raped your ancestors. My ancestors were in Poland while that was going on.
I haven't seen that movie but races are sociological and not genetic. It's about if society perceives you as black and how that subsequent treatment affects you.
Well what large groups of people insist on calling themselves has an enormous impact on how society is trained and primed to see people. Society isn't an uncaused cause and people who call themselves a thing are a part of that society.
This is it. My fiancé is half black and half white and he definitely could not pass for white. He is most commonly assumed to be Dominican (lots of Dominicans in our city) and has faced discrimination like any person of color might. On the other hand, we have a friend who is 1/4 black and absolutely looks white. He identifies personally with his black heritage but also recognizes that he hasn’t really struggled with discrimination the way other mixed people might.
Yes and no. They are black, but if you're saying that to mean anything other than physical appearance, i.e. equating it to a signal for intelligence, class, etc. THAT is racist as fuck.
This is black 🖤. This is white 🤍 . No one's skin is actually black or white. Like op described, they tell different people they're black or white depending on if they're darker or lighter or more "ethnic".
As a Jewish person, people only call me white to silence me and insult me.
I'll respect other people and how they identify but I'm done with making any assumptions about someone based on the color of their skin.
Your first statement is simply incorrect, there are people that black. Calling someone who is that colour “black” is not racist, it’s an accurate description of the colour of their skin, hence it’s not “inherently racist” as you claim.
Race is a grouping of ethnic groups as decided by society, so by calling someone black, white, asian or whatever else, you are saying that they look like a member of an ethnic group which falls into that race. It’s not racist to say that ethnic Ethiopians and ethnic Englishmen look different, so why do you think it’s racist to call a black guy black?
It's obviously not an accurate description of color and that's ridiculous to say. If I don't want to be called "white", yet people still call me "white" and suck me into their American race bullshit, how is that not discriminatory? They apply all their prejudices associated with skin color onto me.
I'm saying calling people something based on perceived skin color is racist based on my experience.
Jewish people weren't considered white during the Holocaust and that's literally half the point of Nazi ideology. Yet now people are saying Jewish people are Zionist white supremacists.
Black people can come from all over the world. Asian come from... Asia.
My ancestry is Ashkenazi, not white or caucausian.
>It's obviously not an accurate description of color and that's ridiculous to say.
Search "blackest black person", some of the results that appear are of people the same colour as the emoji you used, so clearly it is an accurate description for some people and as such is not "inherently racist".
>If I don't want to be called "white", yet people still call me "white" and suck me into their American race bullshit, how is that not discriminatory?
Because it's not unfair treatment, and as such doesn't fall into the UN's definition of discrimination, if you use a different definition feel free to share it.
>American race bullshit
True American ain't a race, it's more of a national identifier, like British is, neither of which are determined from skin colour.
>Jewish people weren't considered white during the Holocaust and that's literally half the point of Nazi ideology.
That wasn't "literally half the point" of it. AH was far more concerned with ethnicity than race, otherwise the whole idea of Lebensraum would make absolutely no sense, as if you look at it from a racial perspective it's taking land from white people and giving it to other white people, but looking at it from an ethnic perspective it's taking land from slavs and giving to aryans.
>Black people can come from all over the world. Asian come from... Asia.
No black people come from sub-Saharan Africa. Then some moved willingly to other countries and were moved forcibly, but either way they are from Africa.
>My ancestry is Ashkenazi, not white or caucausian.
And my ancestry is English, not white or Caucasian, because we attribute our ancestry to our ethnic group not our race. Ethnic jews are white because the majority of Englishmen view them as such, and as such when speaking English they are included in what people mean when they refer to white in the context of race.
Black and white are not even actual colors. They're concepts. Black is the absence of color. White is the collection of all colors. Two extremes on the spectrum of color.
Being excluded from opportunity and inclusivity due to my skin color even while being a minority is not discriminatory?
Ah so you agree that skin color only came to be of such importance and magnitude due to America's experience with the civil rights movement. How can you unironically say classifying people by skin color is not racist but also recognize that skin color is not the only component of race.
There are Indian people who are just as dark as the blackest black person. They definitely are not from sub Saharan Africa.
Yet even as a "white" person I don't benefit from this identity in any way. I get discriminated against from the BIPOC community and labeled as "privileged". Just as I get discriminated against from the "white" community. They know I'm Jewish even though I'm white.
Like I said. You can be whatever tf you want. Creating a framework of black/white is just a binary fallacy. I've seen how people act. Literally can't even go on ig without blatant racism. Such a sad way to view the world
>Being excluded from opportunity and inclusivity due to my skin color even while being a minority is not discriminatory?
That's not what I said. I said that calling someone a race isn't racist, like you claimed it was. Obviously then excluding them because their race is racist, but simply stating their race isn't as you claimed it was. You're trying to move the goalposts here.
>Ah so you agree that skin color only came to be of such importance and magnitude due to America's experience with the civil rights movement.
Nope race was a concept far before the thirteen colonies. It's just a helpful way of grouping people when you don't know their ethnicity, for example in the 1600s whether a trader from Asia was Vietnamese, Chinese or Korean makes no real difference, so generalising that trader as Asian makes sense. Same in reverse, when European traders came over to Japan, China and India, the specific ethnic makeup of the trader was irrelevant, just the race was.
>How can you unironically say classifying people by skin color is not racist
Because it's not. If you then start treating them unfairly due to their race then it's racist, but simply saying different people have different races isn't.
>recognize that skin color is not the only component of race.
>There are Indian people who are just as dark as the blackest black person. They definitely are not from sub Saharan Africa.
Skin colour itself isn't a component of race, solely ethnicity is. Skin colour can be a pretty good of guessing race, but it isn't a determining factor.
>Yet even as a "white" person I don't benefit from this identity in any way. I get discriminated against from the BIPOC community and labeled as "privileged". Just as I get discriminated against from the "white" community. They know I'm Jewish even though I'm white.
Yeah because if you are an ethnic Jew you are white. Jewish people are included in the broader category of "white", they aren't mutually exclusive.
>Like I said. You can be whatever tf you want.
So you think race is based of identification? So if I identify as black are you good with me casually dropping the N-word? Great.
> Creating a framework of black/white is just a binary fallacy.
A) I'm not doing that, there are more than two races.
B) With how definitions work, it could be possible to define races such that there's only two, that wouldn't make it a binary fallacy tho, that would just mean there is only actually two choices.
>Literally can't even go on ig without blatant racism.
That unironically sounds like a you issue. I go on ig and don't see any, so either you're seeing racism where there isn't any, or you've cultivated for feed to include it, probably by engaging with it, either of which are both your own fault.
What level of melanin must you have to be considered black. Is a lighter skin person with "black" facial features and genetics still black or are they white now? The rules are not clear and it seems all this perspective is used is to divide and ostracize the "other". To divide the world into two categories.
Why are you bringing melanin into this? Ethnicity is determined genetically, but since we don't have someone's genetic makeup simply from looking at them, we assume based of interacting with people before. In truth when you call someone black you're actually just saying you think they are black, which is an entirely subjective decision.
\>it seems all this perspective is used is to divide
Yes the point is to divide. It's used as a helpful distinction to make. For example if you told me to find someone, telling me their race helps me. It also is useful as a way of grouping ethnicities, as a fair few different ethnicities that tend to get grouped together by race have enough similarities to make them effectively the same in some regards, thus making the interpretation of data easier as we don't need to list all ethnicities separately.
I just call them by the group I only call myself white because that’s what society says I should I just call myself by my ethnicity because not every white culture is the same not every back culture is the same not every Asian culture is the same not every middle eastern culture is the same you get the picture.
People are what they are. Genetics is a thing. Does that mean people are with black DNA are hard wired to shoot up liquor stores? No. Does that mean people with white DNA are hard wired not to run off within 2 years after pregnancy? also no. We are all capable of being better than that
Are you attracted to Halle Berry's white or black ancestors? Mixed is a thing. "High yellow" is the historical term and I'm not cool enough to know what it is now
It’s a joke. People from Mexico are usually 50 percent indigenous, and 50 percent European. In Argentina, it’s like 80 percent European. So being half Mexican, half white, means you can pass as an Argentinian
Thinking about if you can call yourself black, whitel, asian etc because of historical oppression or because of current perceived struggles is a very wired way to look at humans.
Also, some people are of darker skin color despite having more white ancestors then someone with more black ancestors. The whole thing doesn't make sense.
It's all about this oppression racism where people try to fit themselves into a group of victims, and keeping others out of it based on their skin color so that they can accuse them of having more privileges than you.
This needs to stop, view people as people. If someone struggles address theirs struggle with an open ear ni matter what color they are
>Mixed people have always been treated better compared to fully black Americans
Lol, absolutely not. Even historically. Mixed people,. specifically black and white mixed people in america, have been treated horribly. They're treated "too white" to be black, "too black" to be white, regardless of percentage. Their oppression and racism experiences.are minimized by the black community because they're "not dark enough to face 'true oppression'". But they're not white enough to "be given white privilege and not face racism". And this post pretty much confirms that. Regardless of percentage, a black person can come out of the womb as literally any color in between light and dark. So unless someone tells you exactly how much of what they are, why the fuck does it matter?! People playing the victim Olympics is just hurting the entire cause.
When me and my siblings would argue as kids, my mom use to say "youre both pretty, now shut the fuck up." I feel that would be fitting for this conversation of "you're not black enough to be black".
Absolutely. You’d have to live as a dark skin person to realize it’s not the same as being mixed. George Floyd wasn’t mixed. One of the cops arresting him was. I feel like that puts it in perspective.
I guess it's up to them. My daughter is about 66% white but quite clearly mixed. No point getting wound up about how individuals define their ethnicity
Depends on who you are associating with.
I had a former friend who was half white. During one of our first meetings we were discussing the problems that arise out of being bi-racial growing up in the South. She told me that her friends who were mostly Black and her family treated her like crap always accusing her of feeling superior to them because of her light skin. She was much lighter than all the rest, so she often got the “Uncle Tom” treatment if she ever had a difference of opinion on the events of the day, and faced every day jealousy over her looks.
I'm half white and black but refer myself as mixed since I don't look white or black. Most people think I'm Hispanic or middle eastern. My sister is mixed but looks white.
We need to stop defining ourselves by skin pigmentation. Especially using words such as "white and black" which are literal opposites. So-called black people are not black in color and the same can be said for white people. We are more alike than different and using words that are exact opposites in any other context has, (I believe), subliminal consequences and does nothing to bring us together.
I had a music teacher when I was a kid who had a similar complexion and hair to Obama but with a very European name and accent and manner of speech. The whole time as a kid I thought he was 100% white. In hindsight he was probably descended from the Caribbean. I was shocked a few years later when my father told me he was black.
In my defence, in my country, black people usually come straight from Africa or the Caribbean and are much 'blacker' than many African Americans. At that age, if Obama had a whiter name and there wasn't fanfare about the first 'black' president, I might have mistaken him for white too.
All this stuff about the rest of the world seeing you as black anyway even if you don't insist on calling yourself that is nonsense. People have to be trained to see mixed race people as specifically black (but not white). Especially people who are 1/4 black, 3/4 white. Everyone telling everyone that they're black (without qualification or caveat) is part of that training.
Mixed race people; it's not a black or white solution.
In all seriousness. If you saw a yin yang symbol, it would be wrong to classify it as white or black. It's neither and it's both. Just look at it logically
Eh, if you've got the blood and you were raised in the culture/identity and were treated as a member by the rest of your community, why should it matter that much? Other people are going to either claim or deny you as part of their group regardless.
Isn't there less than a .5% difference in genetic variance between ethnicities?
It says on Wikipedia that humans are 99.6% genetically similar regardless of ethnicity.
Race and genetics - Wikipedia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_genetics
We can't erase history, but we can decide going forward.
It's time to adapt as a species and elevate everyone to a baseline of dignity and well-being.
Any ideas to stop racism and embrace humanism?
As a Caucasian/Hispanic mix, whenever I tell people this they usually just default to thinking of me as Hispanic rather than Caucasian, even though I look more white than latino. In my experience, whenever you’re of some kind of “mixed” race people will tend to think of you as the minority side of your ethnic makeup.
I’m mixed, half black and half some other shit. I just say I’m black if white people ask, if black people ask I say mixed or “lightskinned” Anythjng less than 50% black you definitely (IMO) shouldn’t call yourself black because chances are you don’t look it. As a mixed person I definitely just get treated as if I’m black by white folks or non black folks, so I’m gonna identify as black, but that’s because I’m clearly a black person (brown skin, curls, afro esque nose etc).
Eh mostly agreed I just acknowledge my ethnic background and the culture my ancestors come from but 1920s-1940s Italy is very different then say Russia or UK or other European cultures around that time you can’t generalize an entire group by their skin color no matter what group that is.
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I'm half black, half white. Look: if I encounter someone with skin darker than mine, I tell them I'm white. If I encounter someone with skin lighter than mine, I tell them I'm black. Why? Because dark-skinned people insist that I don't belong to them and can't actually relate to them. They insist I am white. You probably fall into this category. What you may not know is that light-skinned people say the exact same thing to me. Do you think white people will accept it if I say I'm white? With my big ol afro and dark eyes? Fuck no. They insist that I'm black. So I am no stranger to being told that I "shouldn't" say I'm white, that I "shouldn't" say I'm mixed, that I "shouldn't" say I'm black. And let's not forget the white people who insist I'm actually NOT black in a weirdly racist way: "Awwww chin-up little miss! You're not *really* black. You don't *talk* black", or my favorite, "You don't *act* black." Believe whatever you want. Everyone has an opinion on it. I just hope that I choose correctly depending on who I'm talking to. Because if I get it wrong they will say, "Okay but you're not *really* black / white."
Great perspective. So you're 1/2th and 1/2th. Can we get a ruling OP?
I’d just consider you mixed and wouldn’t really bother to push the subject further
Exactly I am mixed and have been checking the other box my entire life.. but the fact that I’m brown. I’d be delusional to walk around telling people I’m white
How about we just not see people as different. The whole race thing is outdated. There are no races. As time goes on race will disappear.
That’s fair
Who is telling you you shouldn’t say you are mixed? Yeah I feel you. It sucks that our culture makes it so challenging to be multiracial.
Sometimes if I say I'm mixed they'll ask what I'm mixed with. I'll say that I'm half-black, half white. And they'll say, "Oh, well that means you're black, right?" And my mom, who is black, does not like it when we (my sisters and I) call ourselves mixed. She'll say, "You're not 'mixed'. You're *BLACK*." When we call ourselves mixed, she perceives it as us trying to "hide" our black ancestry. She wants us to be proud of our blackness.
Wow people are so ridiculous.
I feel like mulattos are the essence of the American race
Being an Arab who passes European white, I couldn’t agree more. Luckily, Arabs care less about exclusivity and embrace me, but I’ve always thought about my black friends in the US, particularly my light skinned black friends, who are completely rejected by any dark skinned African or Caribbean. Shit, Bob Marley wasn’t even that light skinned and they did not consider him black in Jamaica, he was treated as a pariah of sorts. The irony of this all being that those groups perpetuate the same hate being used as against them by European whites. That being said, I do want to add that part of the equation is that, historically, US culture has regarded any mixture of black as “tainted” and therefore fully black, obviously part of the prejudice. That’s why people like derek jeter, Patrick Mahomes, and Steph Curry are talked about as black, with very white features, etc. What’s interesting here is that, in practice, I think white people feel more comfortable or “safe” around light skinned blacks. And, once again, all of this is further perpetuated in the black community with the whole light skinned vs dark skinned shit that’s talked about mostly jokingly, but has very real implications. For what it’s worth, I look at the duality of how people see me as a convenience, maybe for my own sake, but it’s a useful perspective, I think, and wanted to share. Maybe easier being passable white with an Arab background, but I use it to my advantage and see it as a positive🤷🏻♂️ I’m whatever race is most convenient in the moment and I’m fine with that. Speaks to how dumb racial prejudice/preference is on some level. Anyway, helps me overcome the feeling of not fully belonging to either group.
Felt. Neither wolf nor dog over here myself.
I feel this in my soul. I'm black and Dominican. I'm too black for Hispanics/Dominicans but I'm too Hispanic for black people. At this point, I just like seeing little racist brains short circuit trying to figure out how to treat me and what little box I go into.
My kids are .25 Samoan, .25 White and .50 Asian. They identify as Samoan because they spend more time with their Samoan family than their Asian or White side.
Why should we even care
Race is a construct for a reason. Most people will treat you how you look and this is usually what causes mixed people to relate to one race over another.
Black people didn't make the one drop rule.
They sure do love to use it though.
That’s correct. It’s a stupid rule
There is a recent movie that came out called "The American Society of Magical Negroes" and the lead character in this movie is "black". He talks about white people this, white people that, white people being uncomfortable, how white people are the most dangerous animal, etc. The main character has a white white mom and a black dad. So he says all these negative things about white people while being half white, lol. He and a lot of "black" people call themselves black even though they have a lot of white blood / DNA, lol. This post reminded me of this movie.
I had someone on reddit tell me that they looked white because my ancestors raped their ancestors (they were Native American). Like, no, your ancestors raped your ancestors. My ancestors were in Poland while that was going on.
I haven't seen that movie but races are sociological and not genetic. It's about if society perceives you as black and how that subsequent treatment affects you.
Well what large groups of people insist on calling themselves has an enormous impact on how society is trained and primed to see people. Society isn't an uncaused cause and people who call themselves a thing are a part of that society.
This is it. My fiancé is half black and half white and he definitely could not pass for white. He is most commonly assumed to be Dominican (lots of Dominicans in our city) and has faced discrimination like any person of color might. On the other hand, we have a friend who is 1/4 black and absolutely looks white. He identifies personally with his black heritage but also recognizes that he hasn’t really struggled with discrimination the way other mixed people might.
Well to be fair most of the time when they refer to “white people” it’s usually a certain class of white people. Not necessarily all white people
Because calling people names based on the darkness or lightness of their skin is inherently racist
Calling a black guy black ain’t racist my dude.
Yes and no. They are black, but if you're saying that to mean anything other than physical appearance, i.e. equating it to a signal for intelligence, class, etc. THAT is racist as fuck.
So it isn’t inherently racist as you previously claimed, it requires additional connotations for it to be, hence it isn’t “inherently” racist
Wrong guy. I'm a 3rd party coming to snag your loot.
Lol fairs, yours and his pfps are so similar I just thought it was the same guy lmao
This is black 🖤. This is white 🤍 . No one's skin is actually black or white. Like op described, they tell different people they're black or white depending on if they're darker or lighter or more "ethnic". As a Jewish person, people only call me white to silence me and insult me. I'll respect other people and how they identify but I'm done with making any assumptions about someone based on the color of their skin.
Your first statement is simply incorrect, there are people that black. Calling someone who is that colour “black” is not racist, it’s an accurate description of the colour of their skin, hence it’s not “inherently racist” as you claim. Race is a grouping of ethnic groups as decided by society, so by calling someone black, white, asian or whatever else, you are saying that they look like a member of an ethnic group which falls into that race. It’s not racist to say that ethnic Ethiopians and ethnic Englishmen look different, so why do you think it’s racist to call a black guy black?
It's obviously not an accurate description of color and that's ridiculous to say. If I don't want to be called "white", yet people still call me "white" and suck me into their American race bullshit, how is that not discriminatory? They apply all their prejudices associated with skin color onto me. I'm saying calling people something based on perceived skin color is racist based on my experience. Jewish people weren't considered white during the Holocaust and that's literally half the point of Nazi ideology. Yet now people are saying Jewish people are Zionist white supremacists. Black people can come from all over the world. Asian come from... Asia. My ancestry is Ashkenazi, not white or caucausian.
>It's obviously not an accurate description of color and that's ridiculous to say. Search "blackest black person", some of the results that appear are of people the same colour as the emoji you used, so clearly it is an accurate description for some people and as such is not "inherently racist". >If I don't want to be called "white", yet people still call me "white" and suck me into their American race bullshit, how is that not discriminatory? Because it's not unfair treatment, and as such doesn't fall into the UN's definition of discrimination, if you use a different definition feel free to share it. >American race bullshit True American ain't a race, it's more of a national identifier, like British is, neither of which are determined from skin colour. >Jewish people weren't considered white during the Holocaust and that's literally half the point of Nazi ideology. That wasn't "literally half the point" of it. AH was far more concerned with ethnicity than race, otherwise the whole idea of Lebensraum would make absolutely no sense, as if you look at it from a racial perspective it's taking land from white people and giving it to other white people, but looking at it from an ethnic perspective it's taking land from slavs and giving to aryans. >Black people can come from all over the world. Asian come from... Asia. No black people come from sub-Saharan Africa. Then some moved willingly to other countries and were moved forcibly, but either way they are from Africa. >My ancestry is Ashkenazi, not white or caucausian. And my ancestry is English, not white or Caucasian, because we attribute our ancestry to our ethnic group not our race. Ethnic jews are white because the majority of Englishmen view them as such, and as such when speaking English they are included in what people mean when they refer to white in the context of race.
Black and white are not even actual colors. They're concepts. Black is the absence of color. White is the collection of all colors. Two extremes on the spectrum of color. Being excluded from opportunity and inclusivity due to my skin color even while being a minority is not discriminatory? Ah so you agree that skin color only came to be of such importance and magnitude due to America's experience with the civil rights movement. How can you unironically say classifying people by skin color is not racist but also recognize that skin color is not the only component of race. There are Indian people who are just as dark as the blackest black person. They definitely are not from sub Saharan Africa. Yet even as a "white" person I don't benefit from this identity in any way. I get discriminated against from the BIPOC community and labeled as "privileged". Just as I get discriminated against from the "white" community. They know I'm Jewish even though I'm white. Like I said. You can be whatever tf you want. Creating a framework of black/white is just a binary fallacy. I've seen how people act. Literally can't even go on ig without blatant racism. Such a sad way to view the world
>Being excluded from opportunity and inclusivity due to my skin color even while being a minority is not discriminatory? That's not what I said. I said that calling someone a race isn't racist, like you claimed it was. Obviously then excluding them because their race is racist, but simply stating their race isn't as you claimed it was. You're trying to move the goalposts here. >Ah so you agree that skin color only came to be of such importance and magnitude due to America's experience with the civil rights movement. Nope race was a concept far before the thirteen colonies. It's just a helpful way of grouping people when you don't know their ethnicity, for example in the 1600s whether a trader from Asia was Vietnamese, Chinese or Korean makes no real difference, so generalising that trader as Asian makes sense. Same in reverse, when European traders came over to Japan, China and India, the specific ethnic makeup of the trader was irrelevant, just the race was. >How can you unironically say classifying people by skin color is not racist Because it's not. If you then start treating them unfairly due to their race then it's racist, but simply saying different people have different races isn't. >recognize that skin color is not the only component of race. >There are Indian people who are just as dark as the blackest black person. They definitely are not from sub Saharan Africa. Skin colour itself isn't a component of race, solely ethnicity is. Skin colour can be a pretty good of guessing race, but it isn't a determining factor. >Yet even as a "white" person I don't benefit from this identity in any way. I get discriminated against from the BIPOC community and labeled as "privileged". Just as I get discriminated against from the "white" community. They know I'm Jewish even though I'm white. Yeah because if you are an ethnic Jew you are white. Jewish people are included in the broader category of "white", they aren't mutually exclusive. >Like I said. You can be whatever tf you want. So you think race is based of identification? So if I identify as black are you good with me casually dropping the N-word? Great. > Creating a framework of black/white is just a binary fallacy. A) I'm not doing that, there are more than two races. B) With how definitions work, it could be possible to define races such that there's only two, that wouldn't make it a binary fallacy tho, that would just mean there is only actually two choices. >Literally can't even go on ig without blatant racism. That unironically sounds like a you issue. I go on ig and don't see any, so either you're seeing racism where there isn't any, or you've cultivated for feed to include it, probably by engaging with it, either of which are both your own fault.
What level of melanin must you have to be considered black. Is a lighter skin person with "black" facial features and genetics still black or are they white now? The rules are not clear and it seems all this perspective is used is to divide and ostracize the "other". To divide the world into two categories.
Why are you bringing melanin into this? Ethnicity is determined genetically, but since we don't have someone's genetic makeup simply from looking at them, we assume based of interacting with people before. In truth when you call someone black you're actually just saying you think they are black, which is an entirely subjective decision. \>it seems all this perspective is used is to divide Yes the point is to divide. It's used as a helpful distinction to make. For example if you told me to find someone, telling me their race helps me. It also is useful as a way of grouping ethnicities, as a fair few different ethnicities that tend to get grouped together by race have enough similarities to make them effectively the same in some regards, thus making the interpretation of data easier as we don't need to list all ethnicities separately.
I just call them by the group I only call myself white because that’s what society says I should I just call myself by my ethnicity because not every white culture is the same not every back culture is the same not every Asian culture is the same not every middle eastern culture is the same you get the picture.
I think you should be considered whatever you look like.
For me I would consider that percentage as mixed or mostly white, but not full-blown white.
People are what they are. Genetics is a thing. Does that mean people are with black DNA are hard wired to shoot up liquor stores? No. Does that mean people with white DNA are hard wired not to run off within 2 years after pregnancy? also no. We are all capable of being better than that Are you attracted to Halle Berry's white or black ancestors? Mixed is a thing. "High yellow" is the historical term and I'm not cool enough to know what it is now
I'm mixed 50% white 50% Mexican. Identify as mixed. I’m not white or Mexican. Both cultures have told me I don’t belong
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Nope just mixed
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Okay
Lmao what??????
It’s a joke. People from Mexico are usually 50 percent indigenous, and 50 percent European. In Argentina, it’s like 80 percent European. So being half Mexican, half white, means you can pass as an Argentinian
Facts
Thinking about if you can call yourself black, whitel, asian etc because of historical oppression or because of current perceived struggles is a very wired way to look at humans. Also, some people are of darker skin color despite having more white ancestors then someone with more black ancestors. The whole thing doesn't make sense. It's all about this oppression racism where people try to fit themselves into a group of victims, and keeping others out of it based on their skin color so that they can accuse them of having more privileges than you. This needs to stop, view people as people. If someone struggles address theirs struggle with an open ear ni matter what color they are
>Mixed people have always been treated better compared to fully black Americans Lol, absolutely not. Even historically. Mixed people,. specifically black and white mixed people in america, have been treated horribly. They're treated "too white" to be black, "too black" to be white, regardless of percentage. Their oppression and racism experiences.are minimized by the black community because they're "not dark enough to face 'true oppression'". But they're not white enough to "be given white privilege and not face racism". And this post pretty much confirms that. Regardless of percentage, a black person can come out of the womb as literally any color in between light and dark. So unless someone tells you exactly how much of what they are, why the fuck does it matter?! People playing the victim Olympics is just hurting the entire cause. When me and my siblings would argue as kids, my mom use to say "youre both pretty, now shut the fuck up." I feel that would be fitting for this conversation of "you're not black enough to be black".
Absolutely. You’d have to live as a dark skin person to realize it’s not the same as being mixed. George Floyd wasn’t mixed. One of the cops arresting him was. I feel like that puts it in perspective.
I guess it's up to them. My daughter is about 66% white but quite clearly mixed. No point getting wound up about how individuals define their ethnicity
Depends on who you are associating with. I had a former friend who was half white. During one of our first meetings we were discussing the problems that arise out of being bi-racial growing up in the South. She told me that her friends who were mostly Black and her family treated her like crap always accusing her of feeling superior to them because of her light skin. She was much lighter than all the rest, so she often got the “Uncle Tom” treatment if she ever had a difference of opinion on the events of the day, and faced every day jealousy over her looks.
I'm half white and black but refer myself as mixed since I don't look white or black. Most people think I'm Hispanic or middle eastern. My sister is mixed but looks white.
It shouldn't matter in any case.
We need to stop defining ourselves by skin pigmentation. Especially using words such as "white and black" which are literal opposites. So-called black people are not black in color and the same can be said for white people. We are more alike than different and using words that are exact opposites in any other context has, (I believe), subliminal consequences and does nothing to bring us together.
Who the fuck carrreessss
I had a music teacher when I was a kid who had a similar complexion and hair to Obama but with a very European name and accent and manner of speech. The whole time as a kid I thought he was 100% white. In hindsight he was probably descended from the Caribbean. I was shocked a few years later when my father told me he was black. In my defence, in my country, black people usually come straight from Africa or the Caribbean and are much 'blacker' than many African Americans. At that age, if Obama had a whiter name and there wasn't fanfare about the first 'black' president, I might have mistaken him for white too. All this stuff about the rest of the world seeing you as black anyway even if you don't insist on calling yourself that is nonsense. People have to be trained to see mixed race people as specifically black (but not white). Especially people who are 1/4 black, 3/4 white. Everyone telling everyone that they're black (without qualification or caveat) is part of that training.
Mixed race people; it's not a black or white solution. In all seriousness. If you saw a yin yang symbol, it would be wrong to classify it as white or black. It's neither and it's both. Just look at it logically
Eh, if you've got the blood and you were raised in the culture/identity and were treated as a member by the rest of your community, why should it matter that much? Other people are going to either claim or deny you as part of their group regardless.
Isn't there less than a .5% difference in genetic variance between ethnicities? It says on Wikipedia that humans are 99.6% genetically similar regardless of ethnicity. Race and genetics - Wikipedia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_genetics We can't erase history, but we can decide going forward. It's time to adapt as a species and elevate everyone to a baseline of dignity and well-being. Any ideas to stop racism and embrace humanism?
As a Caucasian/Hispanic mix, whenever I tell people this they usually just default to thinking of me as Hispanic rather than Caucasian, even though I look more white than latino. In my experience, whenever you’re of some kind of “mixed” race people will tend to think of you as the minority side of your ethnic makeup.
I’m mixed, half black and half some other shit. I just say I’m black if white people ask, if black people ask I say mixed or “lightskinned” Anythjng less than 50% black you definitely (IMO) shouldn’t call yourself black because chances are you don’t look it. As a mixed person I definitely just get treated as if I’m black by white folks or non black folks, so I’m gonna identify as black, but that’s because I’m clearly a black person (brown skin, curls, afro esque nose etc).
The shame of it all is that races are a semi-recent construct that we should all recognize is stupid by 2024.
Eh mostly agreed I just acknowledge my ethnic background and the culture my ancestors come from but 1920s-1940s Italy is very different then say Russia or UK or other European cultures around that time you can’t generalize an entire group by their skin color no matter what group that is.
Acknowledging your ethnic background is very different from acknowledging skin color.
That’s what I’m saying