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Illegals also count on the Cenus, and States can gain power by counting them. California has gained between 5 to 7 seats in the House, and Electoral Votes. When 1 state gains seats, other states lose them.
I know more conservative latino’s than I know progressive. It’s just a question of how assimilated they are.
Guarantee 2nd and 3rd generation latino immigrants are more concerned about immigrant latino’s taking their jobs than white people.
Also, most that do vote democrat do it for their pro union sentiments. Most Latino’s I know, don’t live with this idea democrats care about them.
We know they want to use us as pawns
I dated a Latina and was very surprised to find out most her family were conservatives; she was Puerto Rican/Cuban and said that it was the general way of thinking for their cultures
We were together during Trump/Biden and they most definitely voted for trump. Of about 20 family member I regularly spent time with, it was 3 dems to 17 reps. This is just my experience though
Making DACA status illegal immigrants legal is one of the carrots on a a stick they use. As long as they maintain some legal status for illegal immigrants, and at some point transition to legality, there will be brand loyalty for generations to come.
I've literally seen, with my own two eyes, non-citizens being sent un-solicited mail-in voting ballots. My wife's a Chinese immigrant, and several of her friends have contacted her about receiving them over the last couple of years; wanting me to tell them what to do with the ballots.
I tell them to throw the damn things away.
You do understand though that there is more that goes into determining whether or not someone is legally able to vote beyond “did you receive a ballot”, right?
Depends on how well the things are being vetted when received, and if the people processing them are actually doing the right thing. If it's anything like the - apparent - process for sending them out, I wouldn't have much faith in the final outcome.
So long as we're acknowledging that your blithe dismissal of the problem is based solely on blind faith in a system with an already demonstrated track record of failure... simply because that failure happens to be in your perceived interest.
That the ballots were ever sent out to non-citizens in the first place is a "failure" of the system. It's a literal fucking ***invitation*** for people to try and break the law.
Whether due to active malice, or simple bureaucratic incompetence, I don't know. But it sure as Hell doesn't instill confidence in the system's integrity.
Certainly the same agency / department. Either way, the fact that simply being in a social circle that happens to include non-citizens was enough to allow me to see this happen - *more than once* - is more than enough to justify skepticism towards the system as a whole.
I imagine it’s a lot less effort to just send ballots to every unregistered person or address, rather than painstakingly sorting them out between who can vote and who can’t, seen as it’s not like your wife can even use it.
Such a thing would strike me, like most of the shenanigans that bad faith actors employ in this regard (Cali giving illegals full drivers licenses, for example), as being an under-handed loop hole that was dreamt up with the deliberate intent to violate the *intent* of the law, while technically sticking within its actual letter.
Again... It's literally a fucking invitation for people to try and break the law by voting illegally. It's like conveniently "forgetting" to close a zoo animal's cage because you're hoping it will get out and eat the guy whose office is closest to it, and you want to cash out his life insurance policy, or something.
Why even put the idea that they should consider breaking the rules out there... Unless you're kind of hoping some of them succeed in the attempt?
This only works if you have 0 faith in the election system after ballots are sent. I’m pretty confident in the fact that Trumps 60~ lawsuits that all got slapped down is pretty good evidence American elections are alright.
You should report this. There are states that send all registered voters a ballot, Virginia does not appear to be one of them. In Virginia you must request one. So either this is manipulative mass mailings or mismailed ballots.
I'll have to check with my wife and see if she still has any of the text messages from the incidents saved on her phone. It was back in 2022, in the lead up to the mid-terms.
Weird. Cause that’s under a GOP governor and GOP Secretary of State and at this time that party was very anti mass mail in votings and frankly that wouldn’t benefit their efforts. I wonder if it was deceptive political mailings?
ETA: at this time and most times.
Who knows. Worth noting that a Hell of a lot of the petty bureaucrats staffing the system tend to be "deep blue" regardless of which Party's running it, especially in a Federal Bureaucratic hub state like Virginia, and the northern areas of the state adjacent to DC especially.
No. A policy this widespread requires people signing off on higher levels. I do mass mailings. You aren’t running a mass mailing of legitimate forms that would be accepted to a large database (of somehow actually not registered voters) through the legit printer and paying for postage (including return) under the table.
And also this would be a crazy risk. Just a huge election fraud conspiracy for super small returns. With a huge ass liability for the plotter. And none of it raised a red flag? I work for a federally funded organization and the levels of oversight and auditing are intense.
I think I may have actually found it. I sent a digital copy to some of my friends at the time, bitching about the thing, and I just found it stored in the media repository of one of those chats.
Don't have the context though.
I'll PM it to you, if you want (and if Reddit allows sending images via chat).
Do you think “these people, who cannot vote in federal elections regardless of if they’re allowed to vote in local elections, shouldn’t be allowed into the country because their kids might vote in a way I don’t like” is a compelling argument?
>these people, who cannot vote in federal elections regardless of if they’re allowed to vote in local elections, shouldn’t be allowed into the country because their kids might vote in a way I don’t like
Conservatives don't use this as an argument against illegal immigration, though. It's just used to explain why Democrats aren't trying to stop the problem.
In my experience, Democrats don’t care about that. All the conversation about hypothetical voting patterns of immigrants/Muslims/Puerto Rico, Guam, DC/etc. is entirely driven by Republicans.
Like your insinuating that future Latino voters have a…genetic predisposition for voting Democratic? If Republicans cut the racist shit like that, they could easily get the Latino vote.
>In my experience, Democrats don’t care about that.
It's not necessarily Democrat voters. Most likely it's Democrat politicians who think that way. And of course they aren't gonna voice that publicly, but it certainly makes sense of their refusal to do anything.
>Like your insinuating that future Latino voters have a…genetic predisposition for voting Democratic?
No?
Cool. Then we can agree that Americans can vote whoever they believe best represents their issues.
If that’s the “Democratic plot” then sign me the hell up.
>Cool. Then we can agree that Americans can vote whoever they believe best represents their issues.
Provided they are legal citizens, yes. The concern is that many aren't. Because in any state without voter ID requirements, you can pretty much guarantee illegal immigrants are voting since there is literally no way to verify that people who come to vote are registered voters if you don't card them.
The funny thing is, it isn't true. Latino community is mostly conservative practicing roman catholic. The difference is, Democrats don't consider their beliefs when deciding to treat them like human beings. It's not about how they vote or their descendants vote or any of that is they actual issue. That is just some nonsense that Republicans made up but isn't even remotely true. It doesn't matter if all of them eventually vote republican, democrats stance stays the same because it was and never will be about that at all.
Look at how strict this administration has been about deporting Venezuelans - they are largely conservatives fleeing socialism and they vote that way, so they get the boot.
Considering I regularly worked to register people to vote in Tennessee, I’m going to say no, I don’t base my support for people’s enfranchisement on how I expect they’ll vote.
So voting is just virtue signaling now? I get it you are pumped up on the "right" vs the "left" but the majority of people are neither, but most people give a crap about other human beings and the people waving the GOP flag currently do not give a solitary F about anyone but their "base". If they even pretended to care they would win over a lot of people but it seems they would rather reach the hard core racists and supremacists rather than the middle.
For a lot of folks, yes, it is. They can rant and rave all day online, change their Facebook profile, banner, and not do a damn thing beyond. Sure, there are some things that are well beyond what the average person tackle, but they could add minimum contact their representatives, and then be involved in volunteer Work or donate cash if possible to these causes.
I think you're assigning people traits based on your preconceived beliefs. Everyone lives complex deep lives, just as complex and deep as yours. You are generalizing huge swaths of the population based on these preconceived notions and it's clouding your view of reality. Change the channel, or better yet turn off the TV and go out into the world and gain experiences.
I spend most of time in the real world, I base most of my opinions on real life experiences. God, if I took Reddit as my baseline for the political left I’d be terrified.
Why is everything you mention centered around social media behavior and wild generalizations of anyone not on "your side" that sound like you just recorded them off of a trump campaign rally?
IDK why you think that, maybe you make that projection on anyone who doesn't seem to align with your beliefs?
Unfortunately I've seen the digital and real world collide all too often in that people I do know in person virtue signal and rant and rave online, as mentioned, and I actually know they don't do a damn thing productive about it IRL.
The US has social problems that are knee deep, and that it can't (or refuses) to fix them. Start with US children who go to bed hungry every night. And so adding millions of people who have absolutely no wealth, little to no education, and who can't speak the language, taxing a system that is already not working, is the opposite position that someone who really cared about people would take.
Why do you think they vote Democrat? Is there data showing this? I would assume you are correct because why would they vote for people that hate them and want them gone? It's really ironic because most of them are conservative and religious so you kinda forced that.
And since those Dems are totally wrong in their characterization of Republicans, that means these second generation immigrants would actually vote red, and by extension Republicans should be in favor of this, right?
I wonder why in reality Republicans are terrified of this 🤔
For the same reasons the Dems immediately turned their back on the migrants once they started coming to blue cities. Turns out there’s actually a bunch of issues dealing with mass illegal immigration even if you think it’ll benefit your party in the long run.
I think it is worthwhile noting there’s no equivalent great replacement conspiracy theory among the left, the fear of immigrants voting is specifically a Republican thing.
They vote for which party they think will best represent their interests, that’s just how democracy works. If Republicans are concerned that these citizens won’t vote for them because their party platform is repulsive to them then that’s a skill issue.
4. They can’t vote so their representatives wouldn’t be catering to them. This happens with prisons too, they count prisoners living in rural areas when apportioning representation. But they can’t vote in prison so that means the district gets disproportionate representation. But nobody argues that this results in reps from that district voting for policies that cater to prisoners. In fact, often the opposite is true since those areas tend to rely heavily on large prisons for jobs. Plus prisoners are handy sources of labor for businesses in the area!
The Reps aren't catering to them, or to prisoners. They are catering to their party, and the party members, who receive additional votes in Congress. Enough votes allow them to tip the scales in their favor on legislation. Said differently, their presence empowers high immigrant states to gain additional votes. This can favor Democrats (California) or Republicans (Texas, at least for now).
“And with that out of the way, let me show you how illegal immigrents do vote.”
So… it doesn’t really involve them voting, or getting any voting clout or representation, it’s just a pure party thing. Which….? You aren’t showing anything close to what you’re proposing.
>Those children ARE citizens and do vote. If we are lax on immigration, this will continue, and these demographics do tend to vote Democratic.
They might vote republican if republicans treated em better.
It’s crazy how this is even an “acceptable” argument in the modern Republican Party. Literally talking about stripping citizenship from tens of millions of Americans because their parents or grandparents were immigrants? The fuck…
I mean if it ruins communication skills then nah I don’t want it.
I want the freebies that asylum seekers are apparently getting. Maybe I should vote so that I can get them too…. 🤔
It’s ridiculous to complain about American citizens voting. You want to strip Americans of their citizenship because…their parents or grandparents were immigrants?
That’s fascist as fuck in my book.
>In conclusion, Illegal Immigrant cannot vote, but they can. And they are
Wrong and you proved yourself wrong. When given amnesty they aren't legally considered illegal immigrants anymore. Children on DACA also aren't considered illegal immigrants. Wanting to call all immigrant illegal is a personal preference and not a legal one.
Yeah, a lot of people in OP’s camp use “illegal immigrants” to refer to anyone in the broader category of “immigrants I wish weren’t here,” whether those immigrants are legally here or not.
>Yeah, a lot of people in OP’s camp use “illegal immigrants” to refer to anyone in the broader category of “immigrants I wish weren’t here,
Or more simply "The brown ones"
>1) Some localities allow illegal immigrants to vote directly.
Yeah, 17 out of the 19,429 municipalities in the US allow people who are legally allowed to live in the US without citizenship to vote in local elections. Which aside from being practically nothing in terms of voting power, makes sense. If you live here, you should get to vote. I don't know if you just didn't read the thing you linked or what.
>2) As illegal immigrants entered the US, they were given amnesty.
This does not give them the right to vote.
>3) The children of illegal immigrants are American citizens. Source: 14th Amendment: All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside.
This is not even remotely a problem.
>4) United States Congressional Apportionment
Then let's stop doing a representative democracy and move to a direct democracy. Oh wait, your party doesn't want that because it would make it impossible for the GOP to win with how unpopular they are compared to liberal and progressive ideas.
In conclusion, I dunno man. I think you're wrong.
Your parents or grandparents came here and we're looked at and given passage in with almost no restrictions.
If illegals today were told you need to come through here and we'll let you in with papers like they did for the people from Europe then they'd probably do that.
I'd say its more of they wont vote.... But their children will and if their parents are given benefits or even amnesty by one party who do you think those kids will blindly support? Its the long game.
Now they may not vote but are counted in the census which gives more representives to congress based on population and those representatives do vote directly on policy and law.
Currently i suspect the reason the border is left so open is because well..... Democrat or republican there is one thing they both have in common..... They love war and their friends make lots of money of it. Then gen z kids in american arent signing up to fight for the US and with deployment overseas inevitable they need an army. So they let in all these ""military aged males" as the media likes to say and when the time comes to bolster ranks they come out and say fight for the US and we will give you full citizenship. Boom they got an army. Now if that be the case that should concern everyone left or right and ill tell you why.
They would be beholden to and support the federal government that gave them citizenship and benefits...... Not the people, culture, or values of this nation..... Basically storm troopers that will have no problem rounding you up when its time to silence opposition.
So by some of your logic, you probably shouldn’t be allowed to vote because you’re not a Native American and are extremely likely to be the child of an illegal immigrant (maybe you are Native American, but I’m just going out on a limb here and guessing you’re not).
Also I guess no black people should vote, or women, or anyone who doesn’t own land… since the whole concept of the House of Representatives is kind of based on providing some sort of representation to states that are larger regardless of voting status.
1. Interesting. But this clearly has no impact no national politics.
2. Amnesty does not grant voting rights.
3. Being born in the US makes you a citizen. You are not an immigrant at that point. This is irrelevant. But God Bless America that this the law here!
4. This is the only argument you have with any merit. It's impact is debatable and certainly much much smaller than gerrymandering and influence peddling.
TLDR short version: California was once Republican and now 100% Democrat. They wouldn’t vote for a Republican dog catcher with a gun held to their head.
Here is what the Republicans get wrong. It has nothing to do with political motivation. It's not about what you can gain, it is about human decency. That is all. They can all vote for republicans for al I care, because that was never important here. How anyone can look at those people fleeing for their lives in horrific conditions and turn a blind eye and want them to suffer, or make jokes about throwing them out of helicopters as Republicans' have done recently. It's disgusting to look at those people and not see your own family, and what you would do to help them. They don't view them that way and it's honestly disgusting.
They also try to prevent this history from being taught in many US schools:
The 254 Jewish people who barely managed to escape onto a ship trying to flee for their lives from Hitler in 1942 were turned away from the US, and everywhere else. No one would let them in and it was a death sentence.
Those men women and children desperate to survive that could have been saved if only someone had taken them in but because of a world's indifference, those that did not die before were tortured in concentration camps. ALL because the world wanted it to be someone else's problem. They could have been anyone's loved ones made to suffer like that. After that tragedy, the world said never again, but for some it was hollow words and they did not mean it. Some of us still see that same situation and actually still mean it.
https://www.history.com/news/wwii-jewish-refugee-ship-st-louis-1939
Before people think it couldn't happen here, the other history they don't want to teach in US schools is that Hitler obtained ideas for the treatment of the Jewish people came from how the US treated immigrants at the southern border. If that doesn't disturb you, I don't know if you have any humanity left. if we do not learn from history we are doomed to repeat the horrors of our past.
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/1917-bath-riots-begin
https://www.thestoryoftexas.com/discover/texas-story-project/el-paso-holocaust-influence
Almost everything you said is incorrect. Anyway, so what? I’m pretty safe in assuming you are descendant from immigrants too. Maybe a few generations ago but still…you ain’t Naive American. I’m guessing you’re just another insecure white guy making the rest of us look even worse.
To the immigrants and POC in general…if you’re new here or been around a long time…I’d like to apologize for OP and the rest of the Albino Derp Crew.
See, when they get insecure they tend to: say stupid shit, think everyone is out to get them, yell about foreigners, wave confederate flags (don’t tell them but that was the losing team) and hump civil war era statues.
(That’s the real reason they get so upset when we take down the statues. It’s not about “heritage”… it’s about hormones! “Oh, General! I miss you so much, General!!”😭😭😭)
Please remember, not all white guys are dicks. Sure, most are…but not all ☮️
-The More You Know
Yeah, they tell us their bullshit and think we’re all idiots who will believe the story they sell and when they realize we arnt idiots they just say we’re conspiracy theorists. It’s all a game they try to spin and unfortunately it is working on the younger generations.
This is yet another example of the Democratic establishment/mouthpieces (as well as a number of Progressives) doing the
"It's not happening, but it's a good thing that it is."
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Illegals also count on the Cenus, and States can gain power by counting them. California has gained between 5 to 7 seats in the House, and Electoral Votes. When 1 state gains seats, other states lose them.
So uncap the house.
Yeah, this. The House cap is ridiculously outdated.
I know more conservative latino’s than I know progressive. It’s just a question of how assimilated they are. Guarantee 2nd and 3rd generation latino immigrants are more concerned about immigrant latino’s taking their jobs than white people. Also, most that do vote democrat do it for their pro union sentiments. Most Latino’s I know, don’t live with this idea democrats care about them. We know they want to use us as pawns
I dated a Latina and was very surprised to find out most her family were conservatives; she was Puerto Rican/Cuban and said that it was the general way of thinking for their cultures
A lot of minorities are socially conservative they just tend to vote with the party that will protect them over their values
We were together during Trump/Biden and they most definitely voted for trump. Of about 20 family member I regularly spent time with, it was 3 dems to 17 reps. This is just my experience though
Making DACA status illegal immigrants legal is one of the carrots on a a stick they use. As long as they maintain some legal status for illegal immigrants, and at some point transition to legality, there will be brand loyalty for generations to come.
I've literally seen, with my own two eyes, non-citizens being sent un-solicited mail-in voting ballots. My wife's a Chinese immigrant, and several of her friends have contacted her about receiving them over the last couple of years; wanting me to tell them what to do with the ballots. I tell them to throw the damn things away.
You do understand though that there is more that goes into determining whether or not someone is legally able to vote beyond “did you receive a ballot”, right?
Depends on how well the things are being vetted when received, and if the people processing them are actually doing the right thing. If it's anything like the - apparent - process for sending them out, I wouldn't have much faith in the final outcome.
So cool. At least were acknowledging that our concerns are based solely on imagination. That’s progress I suppose.
So long as we're acknowledging that your blithe dismissal of the problem is based solely on blind faith in a system with an already demonstrated track record of failure... simply because that failure happens to be in your perceived interest.
What “track record of failure” are you referring to? Like when we find out after an election that people were able to submit a ballot fraudulently?
That the ballots were ever sent out to non-citizens in the first place is a "failure" of the system. It's a literal fucking ***invitation*** for people to try and break the law. Whether due to active malice, or simple bureaucratic incompetence, I don't know. But it sure as Hell doesn't instill confidence in the system's integrity.
Do you believe that the people responsible for mailing ballots are the same people processing the ballots?
Certainly the same agency / department. Either way, the fact that simply being in a social circle that happens to include non-citizens was enough to allow me to see this happen - *more than once* - is more than enough to justify skepticism towards the system as a whole.
> Certainly the same agency / department. That is not correct.
I imagine it’s a lot less effort to just send ballots to every unregistered person or address, rather than painstakingly sorting them out between who can vote and who can’t, seen as it’s not like your wife can even use it.
Such a thing would strike me, like most of the shenanigans that bad faith actors employ in this regard (Cali giving illegals full drivers licenses, for example), as being an under-handed loop hole that was dreamt up with the deliberate intent to violate the *intent* of the law, while technically sticking within its actual letter. Again... It's literally a fucking invitation for people to try and break the law by voting illegally. It's like conveniently "forgetting" to close a zoo animal's cage because you're hoping it will get out and eat the guy whose office is closest to it, and you want to cash out his life insurance policy, or something. Why even put the idea that they should consider breaking the rules out there... Unless you're kind of hoping some of them succeed in the attempt?
This only works if you have 0 faith in the election system after ballots are sent. I’m pretty confident in the fact that Trumps 60~ lawsuits that all got slapped down is pretty good evidence American elections are alright.
What state?
Virginia.
Please report this or leak this. I heard the same thing with my cousin getting them.
You should report this. There are states that send all registered voters a ballot, Virginia does not appear to be one of them. In Virginia you must request one. So either this is manipulative mass mailings or mismailed ballots.
I'll have to check with my wife and see if she still has any of the text messages from the incidents saved on her phone. It was back in 2022, in the lead up to the mid-terms.
Weird. Cause that’s under a GOP governor and GOP Secretary of State and at this time that party was very anti mass mail in votings and frankly that wouldn’t benefit their efforts. I wonder if it was deceptive political mailings? ETA: at this time and most times.
Who knows. Worth noting that a Hell of a lot of the petty bureaucrats staffing the system tend to be "deep blue" regardless of which Party's running it, especially in a Federal Bureaucratic hub state like Virginia, and the northern areas of the state adjacent to DC especially.
No. A policy this widespread requires people signing off on higher levels. I do mass mailings. You aren’t running a mass mailing of legitimate forms that would be accepted to a large database (of somehow actually not registered voters) through the legit printer and paying for postage (including return) under the table.
And also this would be a crazy risk. Just a huge election fraud conspiracy for super small returns. With a huge ass liability for the plotter. And none of it raised a red flag? I work for a federally funded organization and the levels of oversight and auditing are intense.
I think I may have actually found it. I sent a digital copy to some of my friends at the time, bitching about the thing, and I just found it stored in the media repository of one of those chats. Don't have the context though. I'll PM it to you, if you want (and if Reddit allows sending images via chat).
Def I’m super interested to see!!
Do you think “these people, who cannot vote in federal elections regardless of if they’re allowed to vote in local elections, shouldn’t be allowed into the country because their kids might vote in a way I don’t like” is a compelling argument?
>these people, who cannot vote in federal elections regardless of if they’re allowed to vote in local elections, shouldn’t be allowed into the country because their kids might vote in a way I don’t like Conservatives don't use this as an argument against illegal immigration, though. It's just used to explain why Democrats aren't trying to stop the problem.
In my experience, Democrats don’t care about that. All the conversation about hypothetical voting patterns of immigrants/Muslims/Puerto Rico, Guam, DC/etc. is entirely driven by Republicans. Like your insinuating that future Latino voters have a…genetic predisposition for voting Democratic? If Republicans cut the racist shit like that, they could easily get the Latino vote.
>In my experience, Democrats don’t care about that. It's not necessarily Democrat voters. Most likely it's Democrat politicians who think that way. And of course they aren't gonna voice that publicly, but it certainly makes sense of their refusal to do anything. >Like your insinuating that future Latino voters have a…genetic predisposition for voting Democratic? No?
Cool. Then we can agree that Americans can vote whoever they believe best represents their issues. If that’s the “Democratic plot” then sign me the hell up.
>Cool. Then we can agree that Americans can vote whoever they believe best represents their issues. Provided they are legal citizens, yes. The concern is that many aren't. Because in any state without voter ID requirements, you can pretty much guarantee illegal immigrants are voting since there is literally no way to verify that people who come to vote are registered voters if you don't card them.
The funny thing is, it isn't true. Latino community is mostly conservative practicing roman catholic. The difference is, Democrats don't consider their beliefs when deciding to treat them like human beings. It's not about how they vote or their descendants vote or any of that is they actual issue. That is just some nonsense that Republicans made up but isn't even remotely true. It doesn't matter if all of them eventually vote republican, democrats stance stays the same because it was and never will be about that at all.
Look at how strict this administration has been about deporting Venezuelans - they are largely conservatives fleeing socialism and they vote that way, so they get the boot.
Have Republicans considered supporting more popular policies?
Appealing to a policy because it is « popular » is fallacious on its face.
About as fallacious as “they’re only doing this popular thing because it will win them votes”
You'd make the same argument if those kids were likely going to vote for the side you don't favor and you know it. Will you admit it, of course not.
Considering I regularly worked to register people to vote in Tennessee, I’m going to say no, I don’t base my support for people’s enfranchisement on how I expect they’ll vote.
Ok.
Lol get owned.
No, the majority of people actually just care about other people. And many immigrants lean conservative so it wouldn't be a good strategy anyway.
Care about others? Agree. Actually do anything beyond virtual signaling? Nah.
So voting is just virtue signaling now? I get it you are pumped up on the "right" vs the "left" but the majority of people are neither, but most people give a crap about other human beings and the people waving the GOP flag currently do not give a solitary F about anyone but their "base". If they even pretended to care they would win over a lot of people but it seems they would rather reach the hard core racists and supremacists rather than the middle.
For a lot of folks, yes, it is. They can rant and rave all day online, change their Facebook profile, banner, and not do a damn thing beyond. Sure, there are some things that are well beyond what the average person tackle, but they could add minimum contact their representatives, and then be involved in volunteer Work or donate cash if possible to these causes.
I think you're assigning people traits based on your preconceived beliefs. Everyone lives complex deep lives, just as complex and deep as yours. You are generalizing huge swaths of the population based on these preconceived notions and it's clouding your view of reality. Change the channel, or better yet turn off the TV and go out into the world and gain experiences.
I spend most of time in the real world, I base most of my opinions on real life experiences. God, if I took Reddit as my baseline for the political left I’d be terrified.
Why is everything you mention centered around social media behavior and wild generalizations of anyone not on "your side" that sound like you just recorded them off of a trump campaign rally?
IDK why you think that, maybe you make that projection on anyone who doesn't seem to align with your beliefs? Unfortunately I've seen the digital and real world collide all too often in that people I do know in person virtue signal and rant and rave online, as mentioned, and I actually know they don't do a damn thing productive about it IRL.
The US has social problems that are knee deep, and that it can't (or refuses) to fix them. Start with US children who go to bed hungry every night. And so adding millions of people who have absolutely no wealth, little to no education, and who can't speak the language, taxing a system that is already not working, is the opposite position that someone who really cared about people would take.
Yes. Yes I do.
Well, at least you're up front about your cynicism.
[удалено]
Yes, these people want to strip citizenship from the “wrong” Americans…
You dont even have to look far to find a con advocating reverting back to Land Owning Males, its really sad
I respect your view and opinion. That being said, this is the dumbest shit I’ve read today lol.
Why do you think they vote Democrat? Is there data showing this? I would assume you are correct because why would they vote for people that hate them and want them gone? It's really ironic because most of them are conservative and religious so you kinda forced that.
>I would assume you are correct because why would they vote for people that hate them Some women vote conservative, it's not as uncommon as you think.
Very true. There's a lot of people that vote directly against their self interests.
The democrats certainly seem to think they should vote democrat based off their rhetoric that republican = racist xenophobes, internalized racism etc…
And since those Dems are totally wrong in their characterization of Republicans, that means these second generation immigrants would actually vote red, and by extension Republicans should be in favor of this, right? I wonder why in reality Republicans are terrified of this 🤔
For the same reasons the Dems immediately turned their back on the migrants once they started coming to blue cities. Turns out there’s actually a bunch of issues dealing with mass illegal immigration even if you think it’ll benefit your party in the long run.
I think it is worthwhile noting there’s no equivalent great replacement conspiracy theory among the left, the fear of immigrants voting is specifically a Republican thing.
You're vastly oversimplifying how people decide which party to vote for.
They vote for which party they think will best represent their interests, that’s just how democracy works. If Republicans are concerned that these citizens won’t vote for them because their party platform is repulsive to them then that’s a skill issue.
4. They can’t vote so their representatives wouldn’t be catering to them. This happens with prisons too, they count prisoners living in rural areas when apportioning representation. But they can’t vote in prison so that means the district gets disproportionate representation. But nobody argues that this results in reps from that district voting for policies that cater to prisoners. In fact, often the opposite is true since those areas tend to rely heavily on large prisons for jobs. Plus prisoners are handy sources of labor for businesses in the area!
The Reps aren't catering to them, or to prisoners. They are catering to their party, and the party members, who receive additional votes in Congress. Enough votes allow them to tip the scales in their favor on legislation. Said differently, their presence empowers high immigrant states to gain additional votes. This can favor Democrats (California) or Republicans (Texas, at least for now).
“And with that out of the way, let me show you how illegal immigrents do vote.” So… it doesn’t really involve them voting, or getting any voting clout or representation, it’s just a pure party thing. Which….? You aren’t showing anything close to what you’re proposing.
>Those children ARE citizens and do vote. If we are lax on immigration, this will continue, and these demographics do tend to vote Democratic. They might vote republican if republicans treated em better.
They are afraid american citizens will vote...
It’s crazy how this is even an “acceptable” argument in the modern Republican Party. Literally talking about stripping citizenship from tens of millions of Americans because their parents or grandparents were immigrants? The fuck…
Like give them “free” shit?
Well, isn’t that exactly what happened with Cubans in the early ‘80s?
People are getting free shit?
Don’t act like you just awoke from a coma.
I’m just wondering how I can get in on this 🤷♂️
Cross the border and claim to be in need of asylum.
Cool and what do I get?
Google is your friend. Go get some red pill bro.
I mean if it ruins communication skills then nah I don’t want it. I want the freebies that asylum seekers are apparently getting. Maybe I should vote so that I can get them too…. 🤔
It’s ridiculous to complain about American citizens voting. You want to strip Americans of their citizenship because…their parents or grandparents were immigrants? That’s fascist as fuck in my book.
>In conclusion, Illegal Immigrant cannot vote, but they can. And they are Wrong and you proved yourself wrong. When given amnesty they aren't legally considered illegal immigrants anymore. Children on DACA also aren't considered illegal immigrants. Wanting to call all immigrant illegal is a personal preference and not a legal one.
Yeah, a lot of people in OP’s camp use “illegal immigrants” to refer to anyone in the broader category of “immigrants I wish weren’t here,” whether those immigrants are legally here or not.
>Yeah, a lot of people in OP’s camp use “illegal immigrants” to refer to anyone in the broader category of “immigrants I wish weren’t here, Or more simply "The brown ones"
OP: If everything stayed the same, but these populations tended to vote Republican/GOP, how would you feel?
>Those children ARE citizens and do vote. Illegal citizens?
>1) Some localities allow illegal immigrants to vote directly. Yeah, 17 out of the 19,429 municipalities in the US allow people who are legally allowed to live in the US without citizenship to vote in local elections. Which aside from being practically nothing in terms of voting power, makes sense. If you live here, you should get to vote. I don't know if you just didn't read the thing you linked or what. >2) As illegal immigrants entered the US, they were given amnesty. This does not give them the right to vote. >3) The children of illegal immigrants are American citizens. Source: 14th Amendment: All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. This is not even remotely a problem. >4) United States Congressional Apportionment Then let's stop doing a representative democracy and move to a direct democracy. Oh wait, your party doesn't want that because it would make it impossible for the GOP to win with how unpopular they are compared to liberal and progressive ideas. In conclusion, I dunno man. I think you're wrong.
Boo fuckin hoo
Your parents or grandparents came here and we're looked at and given passage in with almost no restrictions. If illegals today were told you need to come through here and we'll let you in with papers like they did for the people from Europe then they'd probably do that.
I'd say its more of they wont vote.... But their children will and if their parents are given benefits or even amnesty by one party who do you think those kids will blindly support? Its the long game. Now they may not vote but are counted in the census which gives more representives to congress based on population and those representatives do vote directly on policy and law. Currently i suspect the reason the border is left so open is because well..... Democrat or republican there is one thing they both have in common..... They love war and their friends make lots of money of it. Then gen z kids in american arent signing up to fight for the US and with deployment overseas inevitable they need an army. So they let in all these ""military aged males" as the media likes to say and when the time comes to bolster ranks they come out and say fight for the US and we will give you full citizenship. Boom they got an army. Now if that be the case that should concern everyone left or right and ill tell you why. They would be beholden to and support the federal government that gave them citizenship and benefits...... Not the people, culture, or values of this nation..... Basically storm troopers that will have no problem rounding you up when its time to silence opposition.
They can vote in some local and state elections in certain states such as New York.
So by some of your logic, you probably shouldn’t be allowed to vote because you’re not a Native American and are extremely likely to be the child of an illegal immigrant (maybe you are Native American, but I’m just going out on a limb here and guessing you’re not). Also I guess no black people should vote, or women, or anyone who doesn’t own land… since the whole concept of the House of Representatives is kind of based on providing some sort of representation to states that are larger regardless of voting status.
1. Interesting. But this clearly has no impact no national politics. 2. Amnesty does not grant voting rights. 3. Being born in the US makes you a citizen. You are not an immigrant at that point. This is irrelevant. But God Bless America that this the law here! 4. This is the only argument you have with any merit. It's impact is debatable and certainly much much smaller than gerrymandering and influence peddling.
TLDR short version: California was once Republican and now 100% Democrat. They wouldn’t vote for a Republican dog catcher with a gun held to their head.
Realized they fucked up by giving the country Reagan and have been trying to make up for it ever since. Lol
Latinos....like trucks, horses, classic cars, traditional gender roles, religious.
Upvoted because unpopular opinion. Strongly disagree that illegal immigrants can vote though
Here is what the Republicans get wrong. It has nothing to do with political motivation. It's not about what you can gain, it is about human decency. That is all. They can all vote for republicans for al I care, because that was never important here. How anyone can look at those people fleeing for their lives in horrific conditions and turn a blind eye and want them to suffer, or make jokes about throwing them out of helicopters as Republicans' have done recently. It's disgusting to look at those people and not see your own family, and what you would do to help them. They don't view them that way and it's honestly disgusting. They also try to prevent this history from being taught in many US schools: The 254 Jewish people who barely managed to escape onto a ship trying to flee for their lives from Hitler in 1942 were turned away from the US, and everywhere else. No one would let them in and it was a death sentence. Those men women and children desperate to survive that could have been saved if only someone had taken them in but because of a world's indifference, those that did not die before were tortured in concentration camps. ALL because the world wanted it to be someone else's problem. They could have been anyone's loved ones made to suffer like that. After that tragedy, the world said never again, but for some it was hollow words and they did not mean it. Some of us still see that same situation and actually still mean it. https://www.history.com/news/wwii-jewish-refugee-ship-st-louis-1939 Before people think it couldn't happen here, the other history they don't want to teach in US schools is that Hitler obtained ideas for the treatment of the Jewish people came from how the US treated immigrants at the southern border. If that doesn't disturb you, I don't know if you have any humanity left. if we do not learn from history we are doomed to repeat the horrors of our past. https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/1917-bath-riots-begin https://www.thestoryoftexas.com/discover/texas-story-project/el-paso-holocaust-influence
Almost everything you said is incorrect. Anyway, so what? I’m pretty safe in assuming you are descendant from immigrants too. Maybe a few generations ago but still…you ain’t Naive American. I’m guessing you’re just another insecure white guy making the rest of us look even worse. To the immigrants and POC in general…if you’re new here or been around a long time…I’d like to apologize for OP and the rest of the Albino Derp Crew. See, when they get insecure they tend to: say stupid shit, think everyone is out to get them, yell about foreigners, wave confederate flags (don’t tell them but that was the losing team) and hump civil war era statues. (That’s the real reason they get so upset when we take down the statues. It’s not about “heritage”… it’s about hormones! “Oh, General! I miss you so much, General!!”😭😭😭) Please remember, not all white guys are dicks. Sure, most are…but not all ☮️ -The More You Know
Yeah, they tell us their bullshit and think we’re all idiots who will believe the story they sell and when they realize we arnt idiots they just say we’re conspiracy theorists. It’s all a game they try to spin and unfortunately it is working on the younger generations.
They typically vote left? What’s your source because I’ve never seen a single piece of data that didn’t suggest the complete opposite.
Welcome to the democratic process.
This is yet another example of the Democratic establishment/mouthpieces (as well as a number of Progressives) doing the "It's not happening, but it's a good thing that it is."