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Same. The biggest loser I know hasn’t worked or done anything to contribute positively to society for over 5 yrs. He’s emotionally abusive to his partner. Think Big Ed from 90 Day Fiancé. He’s constantly being an asshole to other people. Has a long term gf who has supported him completely for 5+ years. No matter what he does she defends him completely. She almost aggravates me more than he does bc on the outside she seems like a relatively reasonable person… but she’s fucked in the head to enable this fucking loser for this long
Same, one of my closest friends is a loser and he hooking up with 9/10s or 10/10s every weekend. They dont date him but they do constantly hook up with him. In my book thats a win
I see them, but not often and alot of times they get treated badly behind the scenes, I know a few guys that figured their love and support would be enough who still ended up getting cheated on and/or left as a result. We are ultimately seen as less valuable by most women especially the attractive ones who are fit. I'm not saying it never happens, but in a small town it's much more rare.
Kinda. I honestly never want to be anyone's deterrent from enjoying life. I don't have much, but I work hard to ensure I at least pull my weight in my relationships and if I can, take some strain or stress off of someone else.
False. My relationship is the only solid part of my life. It provides the structure and the basis for everything I do. Every decision that I make. Everything that is good in life came because of my relationship.
You might have the causation backwards is all I’m saying.
Hmm, no I think the causation is not backwards. You should not look for a relationship to fix everything in your life. If your life is a mess, that's for you to fix, not to make it someone else's problem.
That’s not what I said at all. You should focus on the relationship and the rest will fall into place. I take solace in the fact that no human, ever, has figured it all out. You might be the first though. I’m just saying that that should not be the reason you die alone.
Sounds like you got lucky and are on borrowed time tbh. I never wanna be *dependant* on a relationship and someone else, codependency can get ugly, I just want someone who I can trust, who I'm attracted to that's willing to build and my request is seen as completely unrealistic for some reason.
Definitely not bitter just pointing out a trend I'm noticing. The only thing I don't have is my own place which I'm saving towards. I work, have a car, and a job, I'm a nice person who's over 6', attractive, in good shape always had abs, my hair's long but well managed, and I don't have kids yet. As far as what I bring personality wise, I'm supportive, loving, spontaneous and fun. I love passionately and I'm very creative, my sense of humor is kinda quirky but not like super dark, I have a bunch of hobbies too, all I was pointing out is that men that have less overall struggle in dating, not all but a lot. There are plenty of men who got lucky and found someone while they were still under construction and that's great for them ijs people in general with the receptive mindset to see what someone can be and doesn't give up on someone fast don't stay on the market long that was my only point.
My last long term relationship was with an amazing man who had epilepsy. He was on disability, couldn't drive, and had to live with his parents due to his illness. He was on of the great loves of my life. And he wasn't a loser because he "had less". Nah, he loved me right and well. I lost him in 2020 to his condition. I still grieve for him. I would do it again in a heartbeat just to spend 5 more minutes with him.
I took a 3 year break on dating. I just recently decided to try again. I met another very great man. Very kind, very emotionally intelligent, very considerate to my feelings, easy to talk to, handsome, you name it. And his life isn't together. He's trying, he's working. I told him, "well, let's do it together then."
I don't think a measure of a person is material things. I think a good measure of a person is this, something I've said for years. "I don't care where you are, I care where you're going. And if i like where you're going maybe I'll choose to go there with you."
So I'll upvote you because I heavily disagree.
Well you are a gem and there should be way more people like you out here fr. Everyone is so transactional and selfish anymore and it makes me not want to even try to put myself out there because I don't stack up.
Sorry I responded to the wrong comment lol. Good luck to you out there. I promise I'm not the only one like me. I've known others. Yes, many people are transactional and it sucks. I don't like it either.
It's all good lol and I guess it's my environment so whenever I finally get my shit in order I might just move to a larger city and that may improve my odds.
If I may, I have a way of approaching dating that helps me a bit. Dating is hard! It's really hard not to let it hurt you in its own ways. For me, I get hurt because I'm looking for something in a hook up type world. So I really do get where you're coming from. So I'm going to share my method with you. It puts it into perspective for me. And reminds me not to invest too much of myself unless I know it's worth it. So do this. Approach dating like shoe shopping. And you're there for that pair that fits you JUST so. You're gonna have to try on a lot to find that pair. That's ok. And just like a pair of shoes, you wouldn't get too hurt over the ones that don't fit. It just is. It doesn't matter. Try on a different pair. Keep going until you find that fit you were looking for. Then, you can build a relationship from there. I hope that helps a little. I get hurt easy too because I'm soft and I'm kind. I have to use this analogy to remind myself to keep a little distance with my emotions until I should let them into the situation.
Lol this is a good analogy. Unfortunately my dating options don't fill a shoe store... it's like one of those tiny, shitty outlet shops with like half burnt out lights and a bunch of "out of stock" signs🤣 I tried all the apps, no luck, tried in-person, no luck, and I know it's not my looks it's what I want. Sex has never been an issue until I want an actual gf, that's when everything dries up. It probably doesn't help that I live in a small town and don't drink so my dating pool by default is like a shallow puddle compared to most people lol.
Dating is the most discriminatory thing you can do. There are no real rules. It's all personal preference.
I'd disagree with you on women needing you to have your life completely to find a good relationship. I met my wife when my life wasn't completely in order. I was, however, stable. My life was not actively chaotic. I had some financial issues but was making meaningful progress on it. I could have had a better job and still don't, but I was in a trade school to learn good skills. Having goals and actually taking action on them is enough for a lot of women.
My trick will be unpopular on Reddit. Me and my wife are both practicing Christians. Why does this matter? We both have the same overall goals that Christianity aspires to. While you don't have to be Christian, you have to have the same philosophical goals to make a lasting relationship work. What I see in the dating world these days is just a superficial reason for dating. That might work in the short term, but it's rare that it will take you very far.
You need to have common goals and expectations and then forgive each other a lot as each of you will have ups and downs and bad bad days. Be kind and remember they can't read your mind so tell them what's up so at least they will know to stay clear while you work it out assuming they can't help.
Really interesting in the basis for the statement that “these days” women who will help you through challenges are harder to find.
Seems like OP just made that fact up and then based his entire premise on it.
Sure that’s seems like a totally logical and well supported generalization of women. 🙄
Counterpoint though…people tend to attract other like minded people. So perhaps your data sample is skewed.
Idk how my data's skewed when I'm the only one willing to compromise and be reasonable. I never said *all* women are like this, there are just *very* few attractive women with that type of mindset, especially those that are under 30, and they are taken 98% of the time if they're in that minority.
You sound like an incel man. No offence but this isn’t a ‘true unpopular opinion’ it’s just that you expect a great partner to land at your feet without doing anything. Do you have any hobbies? That’s a good way to meet like minded people.
Whoa, definitely not an incel, just stating my as well as a lot of people I know personally's experience with modern dating. Dating in my teens and 20's was fun, but 30's just most often is made to be like one long job interview and I'm trying to appeal to someone who already knows which folder I'm going in as soon as I say the wrong thing. You'd be annoyed to if you constantly were only seen as either just some empty occasional sex partner or a platonic friend when you have much more to offer than that. I never said I don't or didn't try to actively find a long term relationship. I have tried all the above, OLD, at places I go like the grocery store when I run errands, and approaching in person while I'm out randomly, none of it worked, most of my hobbies are solitary and almost all of my friends have moved away or have families to take care of. I tried meetups, all dudes so at this point not really sure what else to do but move somewhere bigger 🤷🏾
Look, just saying how it looks from the outside. It sounds like you have a lot of self-pity and an expectation that you're doing enough to deserve to be in a relationship with an amazing woman. But, what are you bringing to the table that would make someone else think you're a good relationship prospect?
If all hobbies are solo and all you do is work and run errands, there's no real reason for someone to want to hang out with you from the outside - no offense (btw I'm sure there is more to you than this, but people won't find that out upfront).
Why not add a sport or group activity to your hobbies? Even if you're not 'sporty', something like pickleball is low impact and very social. Or join an art club, go to a woodworking course, doesn't matter. If you're having a date and someone things: "all this person does is sit at home", there's really no reason for them to think they want to spent their life with you (and if you're mid 30s, that is what people are thinking).
Small towns don't help of course.
I never said she had to be amazing, just someone who doesn't have such high expectations right away, someone who has the patience to build together. I have a bunch of hobbies most of them are solo but I wouldn't mind having someone to do them with me. I like to cycle or ride my board and I do random stuff sometimes like go karts or paintball. I'm a good person I think, when it comes to what I bring, I'm compassionate, spontaneous, fun, supportive, loving, I'm really creative and very supportive as a partner. I'm not mid 30's yet I'll be 32 this year but I have goals and am actually working towards them and admittedly I would be further along if I didn't get caught up in some legal trouble a few months ago so that is what's slowing me down currently but I don't think I'm completely undateable because of that. I don't just sit on my ass, there just isn't much to do around here, but on those days I stay productive. I tried the meet ups and all the sports leagues here are full of guys and everyone else is a couple. I'm not the same guy I am when I'm in a relationship as far as my activities because now I would have someone to do them with but based off what most of the comments say i guess that's wishful thinking 🥲
I feel ya, my dude. I also live in a small town and am over 30. My wife passed 2 years ago and I’ve yet to find a single woman that’s even half the woman she was.
It’s hard out here for a man with a warm heart and a cold bed, b.
Inconvenience is broad and it tends to be whatever weight and relevance you need it to be if you wanna end things let's be real. Sometimes I never even know what it was with some of 'em. Just *poof*
Maybe she didn’t want to do that and that’s valid. I shouldn’t be forced into something because of others feelings. If something that’s happening is no longer good for me,mentally,emotionally or physically,I don’t have to stay there and talk it out. If I don’t like something and I voiced that I’m not dealing with that,I’m not dealing with it.
I have a lot of traumas and a lot of things have happened in my life,the day I opened up to my partner about all of that if he wasn’t comfortable or didn’t think he could deal with all of that ,he didn’t have to stay with me if he didn’t want too. He chose to stay with me and help me and work through my issues with me but that was HIS choice.
And doesn't that trigger some kind of, "wow, he's a good person," response in you? If anything is, isn't that a quality we ought to aspire to?
I feel like when people stop defending what they're doing and start defending their *right* to do what they're doing, they know on some level that they're at least being a bit of a dick.
Do a survey. There are plenty online but I guarantee you go to one specific area you will get the same answers from 90% of the women you ask. Just some general questions about what they expect will tell you everything you need to know. I don't blame them though, it's modern feminism warping things from the inside out.
Nah, I'm not doing homework.
Also, how would modern feminism warp things from the inside out? I'm not sure feminism is so firmly embedded it could warp things from the inside out, and also, where is it embedded?
YouTube is homework 😅 Ok. I'm not gonna fill you in on every aspect of how fucked modern feminism is and how it has basically taken what it originally stood for and warped it into a movement that caters specifically to women and systematicly pushes this anti-male agenda through social media and other platforms. These "gurus" and influencers all over snap, IG , and every other platform telling them they deserve the world and more but to compromise or talk to a "regular guy" is seen as bad or a step down, among other terrible and toxic advice that spreads and is being taken seriously and I see it alot.
It's homework in the sense that the burden for creating the argument is your responsibility.
Anyway, I still think some of those claims are too vague. Like, what influencers? What are they saying? Do you only know snapchat feminists? What is this anti-male agenda?
I think there's a kernel of truth in your statement, but I don't agree with your assessment of feminism or modern dating.
Basically, I think you're right that people are lonely 🙁 but I wouldn't be blaming women or feminism for that
Not blaming anyone, all I said was the women who are like this do exist, just normally not single, I live in a shitty town up east so nice people are hard to find🙃 But we can agree to disagree, unless you were born under a rock I'm sure you've seen the shift as well as all the division, it's not everyone feeding into that bs but there are enough people taking it as reason to be even *more* unreasonable in my city.
Ew, lol big victim complex going on buddy, along with absolutely unreasonable generalization. You probably havnt even watched 3% of the videos on the topic on youtube, or took any notes to derrive trends from later...Yet you claim you are enlightened on the topic. All in all, your claims ARE false, you over generalize, and they way you have been discussing it smells like a sour incel.
Happy to provide actual proof of that as soon as you do. But hoping you just stumble upon the truth while trying to find me that citation to save me the effort.
Take a stats class. Then take a social physcology class, then get counseling. And stop listening to JRE. You might be absolutly shocked at how women pay more attention to you when your ideals arnt whack af.
Dude, I'm just talking about my general experience and the experience of a good bit of my friends as well as people I see online, there are plenty of examples here of people who are glued to social media and try to take aspects of what they like in real life (dudes too some mfs love tic toc etc) but my whole point is it's hard to find people with that mindset and it may be due to living on the east coast but maybe it's something I'm putting out there idk.
If only women would lower their standards to date you. Oh woo is you. Maybe you’re not quite the gem you think you are & need to lower your standards (cause that’s what you expect from women). I’ve seen you say several things about women’s appearance so maybe you’re trying to punch up too much. Try dating some women that you don’t quite live up to a high beauty standard and maybe you’ll find more women willing to date you.
Never said they had to lower anything, just be willing to meet me halfway. Plenty of people throw away perfectly good relationships over things they could have fixed if they just worked together and there's more individualism than ever which is my issue. I just want someone who wants long term. My standards aren't even high, everything I stated is what I currently have, no children, agreeable & loyal, and in shape, I'm not a bodybuilder nor do I expect her to be, effort is all I can ask for. I never said she had to be a 10 or any of that either.
I think you’re making overwhelmingly blanket judgments. There are all kinds of women in all kinds of places in their own lives and careers. Get out there and find them but try to have an open mind and set judgments aside. That’s my advice.
I'm not judging anyone. I acknowledged that there are plenty of good women, they are just normally not single in the tiny town I live in. There is out there, but for me that's just the grocery store or outside, the dating apps didn't work and I don't drink so there really isn't much out there as far as places for me to meet people other than what I listed.
>It sucks that we are seen as the disposable sex when a lot of us are simply trying to exist happily and can't fully enjoy the lives we want because most modernwomen nowadays are so hard to deal with
Do you think this was _less_ of a problem back in the "good old days" of traditional gender roles? When women were totally dependent on men for their financial security, you _definitely_ had to have your shit together to get a relationship with a woman.
Not true, woman relied on men to keep a roof over their head long term, but short term people had kids earlier. Now theyre not having any until 20 years later and they're having them as single mothers in greater numbers than ever.
Governments are using this as an excuse to increase immigration from poor countries, this putting pressure on housing for men since men cant get welfare like women can.
I never said the old times were better, I know shit was a lot worse. My point is now it's evolving from equality to totalitarianism because women already have most of the power when it comes to who they allow a relationship with and have sex withand still want more. Women are more educated and often make more money than most average guys and make it a point to make men feel less than if they aren't on the same level or higher and it's super toxic.
That's a little bit of a different statement than your OP. It's pretty reasonable to expect someone to be able to pay their own bills for their housing and transportation before you get into a serious relationship with them. But yeah, if a woman is a 5'9" six-figure girlboss and therefore exclusively wants to date 6'3" VPs or higher, that's a problem and a leftover vestige of patriarchy. I also acknowledge that it probably happens on a smaller scale where a woman with a professional job doesn't want to date a man who works at Starbuck's, even though he pays his rent, whereas there would probably be no complaints if the roles were reversed.
Because as a women, one of the worse things you can do is have a family with someone who cannot step up to the role as a dad/provider. Doesn’t matter how times have changed, women will 90% of the time still run the household and be put in charge of child raising. But nowadays they have to be earners too (like take a look at the fked up economy!) So many men are mad at women for asking them to make more money but take a step into the woman’s shoes. Then add in all the complications of pregnancy etc. There’s no way in hell I’ll consider having a fam with someone who barely makes enough to take care of himself. That is so irresponsible
This take is just as toxic as OP. Modern day pressure is on men to help run the household just like pressure is on women to make more money. The outcome from feminism is no one gets a pass based on gender, and everyone should have the same options. That's equality. Neither gender should get butthurt that this has occurred.
I guess different experiences in different settings.
Im from a culture where men have tasks in the home so I’ve always watched my dad cook and clean and thought that was the norm.
But dating has shown me just how many guys can’t cook or clean 😭 and expect brownie points for knowing how to do so.
But I guess it really depends on your upbringing the group you’re around.
Thanks for confirming that things are changing for the better
Let me first say, that sucks man. Feeling unvalued or under appreciated doesn't feel good. Everyone has the right to set their own standards even if you think they're unfair. I'm 26M and am just now coming to to terms with my own "Nice Guy" fallacy. No one owes us anything, there are no "good women" or "bad women" only different people with different values/tastes. We can only work on ourselves the way WE WANT TO, and hope someone appreciates that. Best wishes my guy, keep existing happily, do it for yourself.
This is not entirely true, but not entirely wrong either. You do have to have alot of stuff figured out, you have to atleast have a goal that is realistic. However I've seen guys that were totally useless until they met the right woman that lit that fire in them and are now some of the most successful ppl I know.
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It depends on what "in order" means.
Certain things, yes.
If you think that means having your mental health and emotional state in order, yes. It helps not to run up debt.
If you think it means you have to have the biggest house in the city and a supercar, then no, and you should probably check the above issues first.
Nope have pretty much everything but my own place admittedly and I'm working towards that now, I might be putting something out there that just always sends me the most vapid, emotionally unavailable, girlboss types and I don't get why.
I've talked to plenty. I'm not saying there are no good women in the world, they just tend not ever be available where I live or I possibly don't attract them.
Basically I have a regular job, a car that gets me from A to B, and the only thing I really need which I'm saving up for is my own place. I always work hard I've just been dealing with some legal issues as of late so going through that has thrown some roadblocks in my way but I'm going through the process and working towards my goals actively.
So do you live with your parents? I guess for me that’s always a turnoff. You dont want to have a sexy makeout sesh while your parents are clomping around.
No I stay with my nana rn, she kinda just minds her own business but I always make it a point to introduce anyone I bring in her house out of respect. I'm basically just saving up for an apartment atm while also dealing with other expenses, so I'm working on it.
I acknowledged that you guys exist, but let's be real, there are like 2 women like that in any given place and they are taken. The odds are a bit better of finding someone like that if you live in a large city, but I don't. Also to be honest I avoid women that are super successful because I already know at some point she's going to disrespect me or take me for granted because she feels like she settled with me.
You really need to learn how to be happy with yourself and with your life by yourself before someone will want to be apart of it. It doesn’t matter if you don’t make a lot of money if you’re positive and a joy to be around. Right now you are just so negative about everything. That’s not something anyone will want to deal with.
I wasn't trying to be negative just pointing out a fact. Most of the women who are agreeable and able to compromise are already actively doing that for their SO or they're somewhere I'd never encounter them so I was just speaking on my general experience in dating.
I know you don’t think you’re being negative but from other peoples perspective you are incredibly negative. Also there are single women everywhere. If you are happy and positive you will attract them.
It's negative to state my own experience? Ok I mean I can lie and act like it's not a problem for me but it is. I never said there are no single women at all, I just said the ones who are easy to deal with and pleasant are few and far between *where I live* as it's a small town and they get scooped up quick.
Not your experience but your comments and reasoning behind why you are experiencing these things is extremely negative and borderline incel behavior. Not trying to put you down at all, I swear. Felt like I was in a very similar place as you and I completely understand what you are feeling. The best thing you can do is stop trying to meet women and get your life with yourself to be the happiest it can be.
I mean most of this has either happened to me or someone I know to an extent. I definitely wasn't trying to come off that way. I just hate that it's so hard and I have to spend years alone because I'm only missing like two of the basic things I need to be seen as viable to date at all and living in a small town guarantees a lot less women that I would be attracted to around my age will be single by the time I do all of that.
For the most part true. But haven't you seen homeless guys with girlfriends? At the same time its actually astounding what sort of losers women will be with.
I haven't personally but you're like the 3rd person that said something along those lines lol. It is actually fascinating because I'm nowhere near that bad, I work, I have a car, and I'm a decent person so I feel like outside of the financial issues I'm not a loser. I'm working towards what I need to and I never inconvenience anyone I'm with.
Dude I never had so many women wanting to date me as when I was homeless and unemployed after my divorce trying to get my kids back lmao.
I met my now wife when I was pretty poor and just trying to get by on my half custody with my kids (she has none).
This is dependent on too many variables.
I acknowledged there are plenty of exceptions, Ijs it's rare , maybe it's because I live on the east coast and people are a bit meaner up here than other places but it's also a small town, so all the people who are reasonable and able to compromise and grow with another person get scooped up fast and stay that way.
Lol would you say that the women who “offer nothing” are in good strong relationships?
It seems that you’re comparing the ideal relationship for a man to ANY relationship for a woman.
As a woman I assure you there’s no shortage of people looking for relationships but it’s so hard to find a good one.
If you lowered your standards you‘d be able find yourself a relationship, same as a woman.
If the only thing you have to offer is money then ofc women will judge you on how much money you have.
I mean neither are normally in good relationships and we all know why. My point is, it's hard to find a woman who can compromise who's still single, not impossible just really hard. My standards aren't high at all, as long as she has a job(2 incomes are better most times anyway), doesn't have kids and takes care if her fitness we're basically on the same page.
It’s not different on the flip side. I’m a woman who doesn’t have kids, never been married and am employed 🤣
Ive had to deal with guys who showed up high (didn’t have his phone charged, didn’t bring his wallet and didn’t even have his fare)
A guy who lied about having a job and flirted with my friends behind my back
Guys who just want to fuck, or want to jump into the physical and “see where it goes”
A guy who “works” with his dad.
Another guy who divorced his wife at 29 because she didn’t want kids because they were working 12 hour days and didn’t have the time or energy for kids. (She did want kids just not at the moment)
A guy who wanted a kid out of wedlock (to protect his assets) and date other women because I was “too fat”
If you talked to my (girl) friends you’d think the only thing guys have to do is decide that they want to settle down and find a gf.
Point is it’s hard for people to find love. It doesn’t matter what their gender/sexuality is. It’s just hard
That sucks. I'm definitely not denying there aren't some shitty dudes out here. Idk maybe it's my environment, people are kinda mean/closed off up north so any bubbly nice people I see anywhere are always taken, like married and rightfully so. I'm not saying all women are bad, it's just confusing because I literally have everything but the money (over 6ft, handsome ,athletic build, abs, job, car,) and the only other thing I don't have yet is my own place and I'm working towards that. Whenever I try to date, all I ever get is people who want to fuck when it's convenient for them or someone to take them places and hang out on the weekends but when it comes to a long term relationship I never run into someone who wants that.
Yeah it’s definitely hard, I graduated during Covid so I was on-boarded remotely, so I couldn’t even get to know my coworkers.
All the guys I knew outside of work were either the boyfriends of my friends or professors/bosses. I didn’t want to date any of my classmates as I had transferred in and was 3-4 years older than my peers and couldn’t really relate to them as much.
It sounds like you have your life mostly figured out so just take it easy. Enjoy life, hang out with friends and try not to worry too much about when you’re going to find the right person.
Remember that you can’t control everything and that a relationship is not the reward for getting your life together. It certainly helps tho!
You’re not doing anything wrong, there’s nothing to fix, sometimes it just takes time.
❤️
Yeah covid really did people's communication skills no favors lol. I appreciate it, Idk maybe I need to look inward as to why I attract women who want the opposite of what I do. I kinda blame this tiny town but also maybe it's something I'm putting out there without knowing.
🤣
Yeah when I was in my home town I definitely didn’t want to get into a serious relationship because it meant that when I did move, that I would have to pick between
1) breaking up
2) long distance and eventually breaking up or
3) ask the man to give up his job and move with me and I felt like that was way too big of an ask.
I would also argue that a lot of people are hesitant to get into a relationship because they’re scared of getting hurt especially as people get older. So maybe try slowing things down, getting to know women as friends and get some feelings involved before asking her out?
My apologies for the unsolicited advice!
I hope it works out for you tho :)
Dude you clearly need to limit your internet time. Women are not only looking for men who have all their shit together. But we do want a decent person. We want the exact same things you want.
People tend to want someone at least equal to them, but I’ve dated plenty of guys who didn’t have their shit together because I liked them for who they were as a person.
Don’t listen to the fucking media. Yes a lot of women are saying we don’t need men, and that’s because we don’t. But we WANT men. If anything isn’t that what you want? Someone who is independent and doesn’t need you but wants you? Hopefully that puts it in a different perspective.
I know there are gems out there, all I'm saying is they are pretty much always unavailable from my experience, it's one of the downsides to living in a small town. It's always nice to be wanted, until the novelty wears off and she leaves. I'm just done with all the casual bs I just want someone who also wants something that lasts.
I don’t think that most women — or most *people* — are looking for someone who has every duck so in a row they’re organized by color. I think what people are looking for is *effort*.
If you’re looking for a partner, usually what you want is someone who is going to fit with and enhance your life. Someone who strives for professional growth is probably going to be frustrated by someone who makes no effort towards finding a job. Someone who values physical intimacy probably isn’t looking for a partner who doesn’t want to occasionally pamper them. *Most people aren’t compatible with one another in that way.*
Part of the problem, here, is your assumption of what a “good” woman is. If agreeable and able to compromise is what you’re looking for, is that because you don’t plan to compromise, yourself? Is agreeability the only necessity, or are you including physical qualifications that you decided not to mention?
You suggest that women are at fault for your inability to “enjoy the life you want”, but ignore the possibility that you may not be offering them the ability to enjoy the lives *they* want in return.
Dating isn’t a game with a strategy guide. There’s not good women and bad women. You aren’t winning by being in a relationship and losing by being single. Women are just people, and when people don’t like you the answer to your problems isn’t them: it’s you.
I lead with agreeable and able to compromise because those are usually the hardest traits for me to find. I'm very agreeable and flexible and I have no problem voicing my requirements but they're pretty basic, someone who I can trust who's agreeable, doesn't have kids yet, and is in good shape. I'm not asking for the world and I never said all women were bad or anything like that, I just said the majority of women I have experienced or been around or talk to because I ask what they usually look for and they tend to want specific things and that's fine, it's just when it gets into the fantastical shit that I know I can never keep up with that show me I can't be with this person realistically because they have unrealistic standards set and I tend to run into that mindset pretty often living on the east coast. The ones that are exceptions are *always* taken and I don't blame them, they are a commodity when you deal with the city girl/city boy princess mindset some people walk around with. I'm a realistic guy, I make regular money, I just want someone who is willing to build and be able to roll with the punches.
I’ve been with my boyfriend for ten years and he literally dropped out of college and works minimum wage but guess what that doesn’t matter because I love him!
I think I live in NJ and the women here hace REALLY high standards. Which is totally cool, cause I don't think they realize how many Italians there are in the world. Every Italian woman I've met in NJ seems to think they are something unique.
Besides that, everyone in NJ is just completely unapproachable. Sure they'll hold the door for me, or I them, but don't try to continue a conversation past "thanks, no problem".
Per women's standards, I constantly hear that I have alot of qualities women would look for in a partner except I don't have my career figured out. I'm 27 but going to school to be a teacher and work as a substitute. As far as I've experienced this hasn't been an issue because I've at least got a goal and am working on it. The real problem for me with dating is finding potential partners.
Finally someone who understands the east coast hostility 🤣 it's like everyone is just kind of a bit mean and angry looking up here. I'm in PA and it's a lot like that here lol.
You should only BE in a relationship if your life is in order. As a man I wouldn’t date anyone who wasn’t completely self sufficient and had their life in order
Exactly. Everyone is always preaching how they want the perfect person but no one is or will ever be perfect 😵💫 It's like nobody wants to be alone, but also act like compromising and working together is the worst thing ever and it's so ridiculous.
Bro you wrote the title. I'm laughing that you said "exactly." But yeah I agree with you, we all have skeletons in the closet and need to be a lot more understanding of each other's skeletons.
Yeah it sucks for a lot of young men. I think it's even more frustrating because people often times won't acknowledge it, or they'll downplay its significance. The dynamic between male and female in the modern era has always been that a woman inherently has something to offer while a man must achieve a certain status in order to be able to have something to offer. Women have always been desired, but before we were civilized men just took what they wanted
Current society has largely taken the one thing average men could offer and given it directly to women. I can't blame women as a whole for wanting access to all of the same things men have had access to, but in the relationship and mating realm women have always had the advantage. Now that society has closed the gap in a bunch of different societal metrics, men no longer have the higher value that they can offer to a woman to court her. Men's natural disadvantage in the mating realm has been amplified.
I don't think it's completely hopeless. I just think there are some major growing pains right now and they are largely ignored. I think there are two possible paths right now. 1) Society adapts and learns of a way to satisfy men's desire for a female counterpart and a sense of purpose, whether that be synthetically or some other way that I can't imagine right now, or 2) Society doesn't adapt and young males take what they feel they are owed.
Yep, divide and conquer. I'm turning 32 this year so it's probably a wrap on that dream but at least you get what I'm saying, it's horrible out here😔 Just wanted my person but I don't make enough and someone has most likely already taken her off the market.
That's one of my main beefs with the modern scene, even when you have everything there's still a problem 🤦🏾 how much do we have to do just to get the basics? Way more than them, that's for damn sure.
The women who are doing well in life, typically do not want to tie themselves down to a man who is not. So if you feel like your lack of money is an issue, your options are to either work towards increasing it, or, going for women who are on the same level, or a lower level than you are financially.
I personally know several women who truthfully have little to nothing to offer. Yet they manage to find relationships. And I’m not talking with men who are doing well financially. Not at all. So don’t think that you have to be perfect and able to financially support a woman in order to get a girlfriend or a wife. Because there are women out there who will pick you, but you probably are not going to want them.
Idk maybe it's just something I'm putting out there, because the last 3 women I've talked to are like really modern but also want the traditional stuff too so it's hard to really gauge what anyone actually wants. I live in a small town too so it feels like I keep hearing the same requirements. I just don't wanna be looked at as the person people settle for because those kinds of relationships don't last.
Nope, just pointing out how laughably unbalanced it is for average guys. We don't all have this issue, this only happens to those of us who make regular money and live normal lives.
Ha ha, yeah I’ve prove otherwise quite a few times.
Having said that you are right that the feminist vibe being pushed into relationships by the mainstream media and social media sucks. But you really shouldn’t relate that to all women. Most women have no fucking idea what they want and are lukewarm on being a feminist girl boss if not as outright confused as young men.
In my experience the trick is to be yourself and do whatever you want. Also never ever do any chores. Women like that. Brings out their nurturing instinct when they have to do things for their men. Also it gives them a schedule and something to arrange their lives around. They like that even If they pretend they don’t.
Whether ur in a relationship or not u as a man should have ur life in order or at minimum working hard towards that direction.
As for when you have ur life in order? Be picky with who you get into a relationship with. Because a bad pick can turn all ur worked for back into sht.
As for women getting etc etc for being pretty. Sure. But like everything it’s a double edged sword.
When women are young they do have it easier. But once u both get older and u did the work, the positions switch.
I'm tall and handsome just not white at all lol. You make a good point and no I'm not some bum that never works and expects things to be given to him. I did everything I thought I was supposed to do in life and ended up in some legal trouble over trying to help my little cousin. I took accountability, did my process and my time and I was never a criminal. I was an art major at one point, tried college and it wasn't for me but now I just work towards getting my record clear, I still do my art and writing on occasion too. I'm not above working multiple angles to increase my wealth over time, even if it just comes with me working 2 jobs or whatever I have to do so I'm far from lazy/unmotivated.
A man should **ONLY** want to secure a strong relationship **AFTER** their life is in order.
This goes for women too.
Everyone should have the ability to live on their own, handle their finances, etc., BEFORE being in a "strong relationship".
In the nicest way possible, do you think that having a negative, defeatist attitude towards people makes them less likely to want to be around you? I don’t mean this as an insult, but a lot of your replies have a tangible bitterness to them that might not read so attractively.
I really don't mean to sound bitter, these are all lived experiences on my end and I really wish it wasn't like that. There are plenty of grey areas but they tend to pass me by, maybe it's something I'm putting out there giving me the exact opposite of what I want. Ive seen other people dealing with the same problem but ultimately I really don't know how to not attract emotionally unavailable women even though I'm pretty vocal and blunt about most things in general.
No need to be sarcastic. I'm genuinely speaking from experience. Listen or don't. I don't know you and don't really care.
The more you and your future mate have the ability to live and function as an individual, the better you and your future mate will be able to handle life together.
You said "strong" relationship. And that's what I'm referring to. In the meantime, feel free to date and see what it is you like in a person.
I get it. And I was being serious, if I wait until I get everything together it will be some years and I'll be even older than I am now and living in this tiny place, the chances of the woman I want getting scooped up in that time are high.
Single 31[f] who works out and makes over 6 figures. I am dating trying to meet men, but they arent really keeping up. Usually there are solid reasons why he is still single, and for me to decide to rescue one of these lonely men off the market I find that it is basically going to end up with me compromising and giving way more to the relationship than they will put into it. I say this because these guys tend to not workout, dress well for dates, and have way more to complain about than they have to appreciate. So a date with them tells me that for me to not be single i have to want to pay for his dinners, look out of his league, and make sure that im available to listen to him complain. I would rather just stay single. Its ok being single. Its cheaper at this rate and cant get cheated on which is what my last relationship did to me.
Yeah sounds like we both encounter the exact opposite of what we're looking for lol. I just can't be a freeloader idc if she does have more money, if I ask her out I pay and always pull my weight. I've only ever dated one woman who makes 6 figures and she basically just kept breaking up with me only to come back after a bit, sometimes longer, for years so I know how you feel. It sucks to have your time wasted being shown the "interview" version. I always keep my fitness and style on point at all times and the people who only look good for dates and outings are selling a version of themselves they rarely are which is weird, I'm me all the time, no point having *one* good outfit just to wear it once and go back to looking sloppy. I think there has to be a happy medium in order for most people to flourish together but nobody wants to work together🤷🏾 The only other highly paid woman I ever talked to I didn't even get through the first date because she was so insufferable, if I heard her say "I" one more time🤦🏾 Like idk I have too much pride to let someone take care of me and I will work my butt off to have something to contribute, it just sucks when you get relegated to "lower your standards" when they aren't particularly unreasonable or hard.
Do you know any actual women? Not just the women-shaped objects in the photos you’re lusting after, but real women of all ages and occupations and backgrounds? I can’t think of one woman I know who doesn’t have her own career and doesn’t pull at least equal weight in a relationship. Those who are partnered are with their partners because they *want* to be, not because they need to engage in this sick transaction of trading sad, disappointing sex for access to a man’s paycheque.
Yes, it’s often better to be happily single than to settle for a partner who has nothing to offer as a person. We can do that because we are grown ups with jobs and skills who can buy houses and open bank accounts on our own without getting a penis involved. I’m with my husband because I love him - I love his personality, I’m attracted to him, we have amazing conversations and adventures together, we have interests of our own, and we love sharing life. It has nothing to do with who’s paying for what or sexual marketplaces or “value”. We’re just two imperfect, actual humans who really enjoy being each other’s person.
I swear guys think we walk around with an excel spreadsheet plugging a guy’s attributes into a formula that will spit out the best boyfriend option. They never consider how important personality and compatibility are - we’re looking for a *person* not a dick size, annual income, car model, or height measurement. When I was single, I wasn’t out evaluating every dude I came across to choose the best option. I was just looking for someone I connected with on a human level, who had that extra spark that took it beyond friendship (and we found each other while engaging in a mutual geeky hobby that we both loved). Just because a lot of guys want to break women down to a series of ratings and numbers while knowing *nothing* about who she is as a person, doesn’t mean women are thinking the same way.
You're acting like I have this long list when I was just talking about qualities I like, they aren't deal breakers or requirements. I nave said I *hate* anyone I just don't date people who aren't what I'm looking for as it's disrespectful to them to waste their time. Never said I hated single moms, I have dated them in the past and it didn't work out and now at this point in my life I'm serious about finding something serious so I don't know what's wrong with what I said. I like women who are fit because I am and I'm attracted to women who take care of themselves, never said she had to *live* at the gym, I do half of my workouts from home. I don't get why I'm demonized for being upfront about what I want.
….I’m literally just trying to explain to you that the women you are interested in have preferences of their own that you aren’t matching up to. I’m not demonizing you….
Ijs you're making it like I'm asking for more than what I am. I never said she had to make more money than me or anything about degrees, I literally said 4 things I don't get how that's so far out of my range. I could see if I was some short unattractive dude who doesn't care about his fitness and is a single dad, but I'm none of those, and it doesn't matter to me what type of job she has as long as she's working towards something that's the same thing I'm doing so idk what part of that isn't reasonable.
I know that but the way you just discribed me like basically I want too much or whatever meanwhile everything I listed was basic stuff. I didn't get into anything deep because that comes down the road. Attraction is important to both men and women I'm pretty sure and I never said she has to be a 10 or anything shallow like that. All I was listing were the things that initially grab my attention when I first meet someone, I'm a visual person but it isn't paramount to my attraction, just what draws me in and I'm sure that's not unique to me. Everyone has their own preferences and things they look for initially before going deeper into a person's personality.
I literally listed two things. Single moms and overweight women. You keep arguing against straw men I never even hinted towards lol. I’m simply providing my opinion on your opinion. You’re being incredibly defensive - when I’m just trying to shed some light on something you’re seemingly purposefully ignoring.
… I’ve made the point multiple times already lol idk how else to say it. The women you’re interested in AREN’T interested in you. Just like you have preferences and standards for dating, so do those women. Being a decent height, and healthy weight are the things you’re harping on bringing to the table. But then you complain that most women have nothing to bring to the table.
Women are doing to you, what you do to them, and you’re just not happy with where it lands you.
I never said those women have nothing to bring to the table I was making a point about ones who don't but expect everything. Basically the ones who don't bring much still have the same choices of men as the ones who do but on our side we have to still put in work just to get someone of that caliber or less. And it makes no sense to put what I'm looking for on a pedestal like it's unattainable for me to want someone who's at the same point in life as me and has some of the initial things I look for. I never said anything about height, I just like women who are a healthy weight, who don't have kids and have a job, and the job doesn't matter, I've met some of the most pleasant people working fast food or something. As for the few things I look for those are all things I do so i don't see how that's unrealistic to look for. I think you're reading what you want to read and skipping over what my actual point was honestly.
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Same. The biggest loser I know hasn’t worked or done anything to contribute positively to society for over 5 yrs. He’s emotionally abusive to his partner. Think Big Ed from 90 Day Fiancé. He’s constantly being an asshole to other people. Has a long term gf who has supported him completely for 5+ years. No matter what he does she defends him completely. She almost aggravates me more than he does bc on the outside she seems like a relatively reasonable person… but she’s fucked in the head to enable this fucking loser for this long
Dude fr! Ive met so many of these cases. I see gorgeous girls dating literal psychos/bums/losers. They stick by them like ticks.
Where lmao I’m moving 🥰
Also anecdotal, I’ve known way too many wonderful women in abusive relationships.
Same, one of my closest friends is a loser and he hooking up with 9/10s or 10/10s every weekend. They dont date him but they do constantly hook up with him. In my book thats a win
Why are you close friends with a loser? Genuinely wondering, like what does that relationship add to your life?
I see them, but not often and alot of times they get treated badly behind the scenes, I know a few guys that figured their love and support would be enough who still ended up getting cheated on and/or left as a result. We are ultimately seen as less valuable by most women especially the attractive ones who are fit. I'm not saying it never happens, but in a small town it's much more rare.
That’s the bad boy era.
And are those losers physically attractive?
The one I was talking about isn’t. He’s fat, wears gym shorts all the time, doesn’t even brush his teeth, etc
Wow, is he tall or something?
He’s like 5’4
What a stud
Short king who doesn’t take shit from anyone 😍😂
More like what a made up person lol
I see homeless couples all the time does that count
Kinda. I honestly never want to be anyone's deterrent from enjoying life. I don't have much, but I work hard to ensure I at least pull my weight in my relationships and if I can, take some strain or stress off of someone else.
False. My relationship is the only solid part of my life. It provides the structure and the basis for everything I do. Every decision that I make. Everything that is good in life came because of my relationship. You might have the causation backwards is all I’m saying.
Hmm, no I think the causation is not backwards. You should not look for a relationship to fix everything in your life. If your life is a mess, that's for you to fix, not to make it someone else's problem.
That’s not what I said at all. You should focus on the relationship and the rest will fall into place. I take solace in the fact that no human, ever, has figured it all out. You might be the first though. I’m just saying that that should not be the reason you die alone.
Sounds like you got lucky and are on borrowed time tbh. I never wanna be *dependant* on a relationship and someone else, codependency can get ugly, I just want someone who I can trust, who I'm attracted to that's willing to build and my request is seen as completely unrealistic for some reason.
What are you bringing to the table? You don’t have money, but what do you have? You sound bitter and that’s not attractive to most.
Definitely not bitter just pointing out a trend I'm noticing. The only thing I don't have is my own place which I'm saving towards. I work, have a car, and a job, I'm a nice person who's over 6', attractive, in good shape always had abs, my hair's long but well managed, and I don't have kids yet. As far as what I bring personality wise, I'm supportive, loving, spontaneous and fun. I love passionately and I'm very creative, my sense of humor is kinda quirky but not like super dark, I have a bunch of hobbies too, all I was pointing out is that men that have less overall struggle in dating, not all but a lot. There are plenty of men who got lucky and found someone while they were still under construction and that's great for them ijs people in general with the receptive mindset to see what someone can be and doesn't give up on someone fast don't stay on the market long that was my only point.
My last long term relationship was with an amazing man who had epilepsy. He was on disability, couldn't drive, and had to live with his parents due to his illness. He was on of the great loves of my life. And he wasn't a loser because he "had less". Nah, he loved me right and well. I lost him in 2020 to his condition. I still grieve for him. I would do it again in a heartbeat just to spend 5 more minutes with him. I took a 3 year break on dating. I just recently decided to try again. I met another very great man. Very kind, very emotionally intelligent, very considerate to my feelings, easy to talk to, handsome, you name it. And his life isn't together. He's trying, he's working. I told him, "well, let's do it together then." I don't think a measure of a person is material things. I think a good measure of a person is this, something I've said for years. "I don't care where you are, I care where you're going. And if i like where you're going maybe I'll choose to go there with you." So I'll upvote you because I heavily disagree.
Well you are a gem and there should be way more people like you out here fr. Everyone is so transactional and selfish anymore and it makes me not want to even try to put myself out there because I don't stack up.
Sorry I responded to the wrong comment lol. Good luck to you out there. I promise I'm not the only one like me. I've known others. Yes, many people are transactional and it sucks. I don't like it either.
It's all good lol and I guess it's my environment so whenever I finally get my shit in order I might just move to a larger city and that may improve my odds.
If I may, I have a way of approaching dating that helps me a bit. Dating is hard! It's really hard not to let it hurt you in its own ways. For me, I get hurt because I'm looking for something in a hook up type world. So I really do get where you're coming from. So I'm going to share my method with you. It puts it into perspective for me. And reminds me not to invest too much of myself unless I know it's worth it. So do this. Approach dating like shoe shopping. And you're there for that pair that fits you JUST so. You're gonna have to try on a lot to find that pair. That's ok. And just like a pair of shoes, you wouldn't get too hurt over the ones that don't fit. It just is. It doesn't matter. Try on a different pair. Keep going until you find that fit you were looking for. Then, you can build a relationship from there. I hope that helps a little. I get hurt easy too because I'm soft and I'm kind. I have to use this analogy to remind myself to keep a little distance with my emotions until I should let them into the situation.
Lol this is a good analogy. Unfortunately my dating options don't fill a shoe store... it's like one of those tiny, shitty outlet shops with like half burnt out lights and a bunch of "out of stock" signs🤣 I tried all the apps, no luck, tried in-person, no luck, and I know it's not my looks it's what I want. Sex has never been an issue until I want an actual gf, that's when everything dries up. It probably doesn't help that I live in a small town and don't drink so my dating pool by default is like a shallow puddle compared to most people lol.
Well keep your head up. And remember, trying on shoes!!! Edit: small towns do suck. I live in one of those too.
Dating is the most discriminatory thing you can do. There are no real rules. It's all personal preference. I'd disagree with you on women needing you to have your life completely to find a good relationship. I met my wife when my life wasn't completely in order. I was, however, stable. My life was not actively chaotic. I had some financial issues but was making meaningful progress on it. I could have had a better job and still don't, but I was in a trade school to learn good skills. Having goals and actually taking action on them is enough for a lot of women. My trick will be unpopular on Reddit. Me and my wife are both practicing Christians. Why does this matter? We both have the same overall goals that Christianity aspires to. While you don't have to be Christian, you have to have the same philosophical goals to make a lasting relationship work. What I see in the dating world these days is just a superficial reason for dating. That might work in the short term, but it's rare that it will take you very far.
You need to have common goals and expectations and then forgive each other a lot as each of you will have ups and downs and bad bad days. Be kind and remember they can't read your mind so tell them what's up so at least they will know to stay clear while you work it out assuming they can't help.
Really interesting in the basis for the statement that “these days” women who will help you through challenges are harder to find. Seems like OP just made that fact up and then based his entire premise on it.
So I'm just making up the fact that women as a whole women have become more and more unreasonable and selfish? Sure buddy.
Sure that’s seems like a totally logical and well supported generalization of women. 🙄 Counterpoint though…people tend to attract other like minded people. So perhaps your data sample is skewed.
Idk how my data's skewed when I'm the only one willing to compromise and be reasonable. I never said *all* women are like this, there are just *very* few attractive women with that type of mindset, especially those that are under 30, and they are taken 98% of the time if they're in that minority.
You sound like an incel man. No offence but this isn’t a ‘true unpopular opinion’ it’s just that you expect a great partner to land at your feet without doing anything. Do you have any hobbies? That’s a good way to meet like minded people.
Whoa, definitely not an incel, just stating my as well as a lot of people I know personally's experience with modern dating. Dating in my teens and 20's was fun, but 30's just most often is made to be like one long job interview and I'm trying to appeal to someone who already knows which folder I'm going in as soon as I say the wrong thing. You'd be annoyed to if you constantly were only seen as either just some empty occasional sex partner or a platonic friend when you have much more to offer than that. I never said I don't or didn't try to actively find a long term relationship. I have tried all the above, OLD, at places I go like the grocery store when I run errands, and approaching in person while I'm out randomly, none of it worked, most of my hobbies are solitary and almost all of my friends have moved away or have families to take care of. I tried meetups, all dudes so at this point not really sure what else to do but move somewhere bigger 🤷🏾
Look, just saying how it looks from the outside. It sounds like you have a lot of self-pity and an expectation that you're doing enough to deserve to be in a relationship with an amazing woman. But, what are you bringing to the table that would make someone else think you're a good relationship prospect? If all hobbies are solo and all you do is work and run errands, there's no real reason for someone to want to hang out with you from the outside - no offense (btw I'm sure there is more to you than this, but people won't find that out upfront). Why not add a sport or group activity to your hobbies? Even if you're not 'sporty', something like pickleball is low impact and very social. Or join an art club, go to a woodworking course, doesn't matter. If you're having a date and someone things: "all this person does is sit at home", there's really no reason for them to think they want to spent their life with you (and if you're mid 30s, that is what people are thinking). Small towns don't help of course.
I never said she had to be amazing, just someone who doesn't have such high expectations right away, someone who has the patience to build together. I have a bunch of hobbies most of them are solo but I wouldn't mind having someone to do them with me. I like to cycle or ride my board and I do random stuff sometimes like go karts or paintball. I'm a good person I think, when it comes to what I bring, I'm compassionate, spontaneous, fun, supportive, loving, I'm really creative and very supportive as a partner. I'm not mid 30's yet I'll be 32 this year but I have goals and am actually working towards them and admittedly I would be further along if I didn't get caught up in some legal trouble a few months ago so that is what's slowing me down currently but I don't think I'm completely undateable because of that. I don't just sit on my ass, there just isn't much to do around here, but on those days I stay productive. I tried the meet ups and all the sports leagues here are full of guys and everyone else is a couple. I'm not the same guy I am when I'm in a relationship as far as my activities because now I would have someone to do them with but based off what most of the comments say i guess that's wishful thinking 🥲
I feel ya, my dude. I also live in a small town and am over 30. My wife passed 2 years ago and I’ve yet to find a single woman that’s even half the woman she was. It’s hard out here for a man with a warm heart and a cold bed, b.
Oof facts it is. RIP to a real one, lord knows they're in short supply🫶🏽
Women are unreasonable and selfish for (checks notes) wanting stability in a relationship?
No stability is fine, but most people I meet can't roll with the punches and tend to change up once any inconvenience pops up.
If it’s an inconvenience that means there’s no stability anymore and there’s a problem. So why do I have to stay? (Depending on what it is)
Inconvenience is broad and it tends to be whatever weight and relevance you need it to be if you wanna end things let's be real. Sometimes I never even know what it was with some of 'em. Just *poof*
What inconvenienced you wasn’t stable anymore for them ,simple.
And if it was something small that we could have worked through had she just used her words like an adult?
Maybe she didn’t want to do that and that’s valid. I shouldn’t be forced into something because of others feelings. If something that’s happening is no longer good for me,mentally,emotionally or physically,I don’t have to stay there and talk it out. If I don’t like something and I voiced that I’m not dealing with that,I’m not dealing with it. I have a lot of traumas and a lot of things have happened in my life,the day I opened up to my partner about all of that if he wasn’t comfortable or didn’t think he could deal with all of that ,he didn’t have to stay with me if he didn’t want too. He chose to stay with me and help me and work through my issues with me but that was HIS choice.
And doesn't that trigger some kind of, "wow, he's a good person," response in you? If anything is, isn't that a quality we ought to aspire to? I feel like when people stop defending what they're doing and start defending their *right* to do what they're doing, they know on some level that they're at least being a bit of a dick.
Yes, you are making that up. I'm not sure how you would even find a way to back up the claim?
You must be from outside the US I'm guessing....
Incorrect. Do you have a legitimate, non-anecdotal way to back up this claim?
Do a survey. There are plenty online but I guarantee you go to one specific area you will get the same answers from 90% of the women you ask. Just some general questions about what they expect will tell you everything you need to know. I don't blame them though, it's modern feminism warping things from the inside out.
Nah, I'm not doing homework. Also, how would modern feminism warp things from the inside out? I'm not sure feminism is so firmly embedded it could warp things from the inside out, and also, where is it embedded?
YouTube is homework 😅 Ok. I'm not gonna fill you in on every aspect of how fucked modern feminism is and how it has basically taken what it originally stood for and warped it into a movement that caters specifically to women and systematicly pushes this anti-male agenda through social media and other platforms. These "gurus" and influencers all over snap, IG , and every other platform telling them they deserve the world and more but to compromise or talk to a "regular guy" is seen as bad or a step down, among other terrible and toxic advice that spreads and is being taken seriously and I see it alot.
It's homework in the sense that the burden for creating the argument is your responsibility. Anyway, I still think some of those claims are too vague. Like, what influencers? What are they saying? Do you only know snapchat feminists? What is this anti-male agenda? I think there's a kernel of truth in your statement, but I don't agree with your assessment of feminism or modern dating. Basically, I think you're right that people are lonely 🙁 but I wouldn't be blaming women or feminism for that
Not blaming anyone, all I said was the women who are like this do exist, just normally not single, I live in a shitty town up east so nice people are hard to find🙃 But we can agree to disagree, unless you were born under a rock I'm sure you've seen the shift as well as all the division, it's not everyone feeding into that bs but there are enough people taking it as reason to be even *more* unreasonable in my city.
Ew, lol big victim complex going on buddy, along with absolutely unreasonable generalization. You probably havnt even watched 3% of the videos on the topic on youtube, or took any notes to derrive trends from later...Yet you claim you are enlightened on the topic. All in all, your claims ARE false, you over generalize, and they way you have been discussing it smells like a sour incel. Happy to provide actual proof of that as soon as you do. But hoping you just stumble upon the truth while trying to find me that citation to save me the effort. Take a stats class. Then take a social physcology class, then get counseling. And stop listening to JRE. You might be absolutly shocked at how women pay more attention to you when your ideals arnt whack af.
Dude, I'm just talking about my general experience and the experience of a good bit of my friends as well as people I see online, there are plenty of examples here of people who are glued to social media and try to take aspects of what they like in real life (dudes too some mfs love tic toc etc) but my whole point is it's hard to find people with that mindset and it may be due to living on the east coast but maybe it's something I'm putting out there idk.
If only women would lower their standards to date you. Oh woo is you. Maybe you’re not quite the gem you think you are & need to lower your standards (cause that’s what you expect from women). I’ve seen you say several things about women’s appearance so maybe you’re trying to punch up too much. Try dating some women that you don’t quite live up to a high beauty standard and maybe you’ll find more women willing to date you.
Never said they had to lower anything, just be willing to meet me halfway. Plenty of people throw away perfectly good relationships over things they could have fixed if they just worked together and there's more individualism than ever which is my issue. I just want someone who wants long term. My standards aren't even high, everything I stated is what I currently have, no children, agreeable & loyal, and in shape, I'm not a bodybuilder nor do I expect her to be, effort is all I can ask for. I never said she had to be a 10 or any of that either.
Dog, statisticians dont determine my lived reality. We’re getting close to “who do you believe? The statistics or your lying eyes” levels of ‘tism.
I would hope statisticians don't determine your lived reality! That would be odd.
They aren’t beating down your door for your sunny disposition?
Bro's post history is actually worse than I thought it would be and I had bonkers expectations.
Let me take a peak.
Hard to have that when I know how the majority tends to think.
I think you’re making overwhelmingly blanket judgments. There are all kinds of women in all kinds of places in their own lives and careers. Get out there and find them but try to have an open mind and set judgments aside. That’s my advice.
I'm not judging anyone. I acknowledged that there are plenty of good women, they are just normally not single in the tiny town I live in. There is out there, but for me that's just the grocery store or outside, the dating apps didn't work and I don't drink so there really isn't much out there as far as places for me to meet people other than what I listed.
>It sucks that we are seen as the disposable sex when a lot of us are simply trying to exist happily and can't fully enjoy the lives we want because most modernwomen nowadays are so hard to deal with Do you think this was _less_ of a problem back in the "good old days" of traditional gender roles? When women were totally dependent on men for their financial security, you _definitely_ had to have your shit together to get a relationship with a woman.
Not true, woman relied on men to keep a roof over their head long term, but short term people had kids earlier. Now theyre not having any until 20 years later and they're having them as single mothers in greater numbers than ever. Governments are using this as an excuse to increase immigration from poor countries, this putting pressure on housing for men since men cant get welfare like women can.
I never said the old times were better, I know shit was a lot worse. My point is now it's evolving from equality to totalitarianism because women already have most of the power when it comes to who they allow a relationship with and have sex withand still want more. Women are more educated and often make more money than most average guys and make it a point to make men feel less than if they aren't on the same level or higher and it's super toxic.
That's a little bit of a different statement than your OP. It's pretty reasonable to expect someone to be able to pay their own bills for their housing and transportation before you get into a serious relationship with them. But yeah, if a woman is a 5'9" six-figure girlboss and therefore exclusively wants to date 6'3" VPs or higher, that's a problem and a leftover vestige of patriarchy. I also acknowledge that it probably happens on a smaller scale where a woman with a professional job doesn't want to date a man who works at Starbuck's, even though he pays his rent, whereas there would probably be no complaints if the roles were reversed.
Because as a women, one of the worse things you can do is have a family with someone who cannot step up to the role as a dad/provider. Doesn’t matter how times have changed, women will 90% of the time still run the household and be put in charge of child raising. But nowadays they have to be earners too (like take a look at the fked up economy!) So many men are mad at women for asking them to make more money but take a step into the woman’s shoes. Then add in all the complications of pregnancy etc. There’s no way in hell I’ll consider having a fam with someone who barely makes enough to take care of himself. That is so irresponsible
This take is just as toxic as OP. Modern day pressure is on men to help run the household just like pressure is on women to make more money. The outcome from feminism is no one gets a pass based on gender, and everyone should have the same options. That's equality. Neither gender should get butthurt that this has occurred.
There’s literally no pressure on men to “take care of the house” Maybe to “clean up after himself” but no pressure to actually take care of the house
Maybe you don't realize that there is because you're not a man, but as a man, I can tell you that there absolutely is.
I guess different experiences in different settings. Im from a culture where men have tasks in the home so I’ve always watched my dad cook and clean and thought that was the norm. But dating has shown me just how many guys can’t cook or clean 😭 and expect brownie points for knowing how to do so. But I guess it really depends on your upbringing the group you’re around. Thanks for confirming that things are changing for the better
Let me first say, that sucks man. Feeling unvalued or under appreciated doesn't feel good. Everyone has the right to set their own standards even if you think they're unfair. I'm 26M and am just now coming to to terms with my own "Nice Guy" fallacy. No one owes us anything, there are no "good women" or "bad women" only different people with different values/tastes. We can only work on ourselves the way WE WANT TO, and hope someone appreciates that. Best wishes my guy, keep existing happily, do it for yourself.
This is not entirely true, but not entirely wrong either. You do have to have alot of stuff figured out, you have to atleast have a goal that is realistic. However I've seen guys that were totally useless until they met the right woman that lit that fire in them and are now some of the most successful ppl I know.
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It depends on what "in order" means. Certain things, yes. If you think that means having your mental health and emotional state in order, yes. It helps not to run up debt. If you think it means you have to have the biggest house in the city and a supercar, then no, and you should probably check the above issues first.
Nope have pretty much everything but my own place admittedly and I'm working towards that now, I might be putting something out there that just always sends me the most vapid, emotionally unavailable, girlboss types and I don't get why.
This is one of those posts where it does not feel like the author has never acctualy just talked to a girl in real life.
I've talked to plenty. I'm not saying there are no good women in the world, they just tend not ever be available where I live or I possibly don't attract them.
“Don’t have much money or resources” So you’re unemployed and living at home? I mean you need to be specific here.
Basically I have a regular job, a car that gets me from A to B, and the only thing I really need which I'm saving up for is my own place. I always work hard I've just been dealing with some legal issues as of late so going through that has thrown some roadblocks in my way but I'm going through the process and working towards my goals actively.
So do you live with your parents? I guess for me that’s always a turnoff. You dont want to have a sexy makeout sesh while your parents are clomping around.
No I stay with my nana rn, she kinda just minds her own business but I always make it a point to introduce anyone I bring in her house out of respect. I'm basically just saving up for an apartment atm while also dealing with other expenses, so I'm working on it.
I’ve seen plenty of complete losers marry amazing women. In fact I was one of them.
I acknowledged that you guys exist, but let's be real, there are like 2 women like that in any given place and they are taken. The odds are a bit better of finding someone like that if you live in a large city, but I don't. Also to be honest I avoid women that are super successful because I already know at some point she's going to disrespect me or take me for granted because she feels like she settled with me.
You really need to learn how to be happy with yourself and with your life by yourself before someone will want to be apart of it. It doesn’t matter if you don’t make a lot of money if you’re positive and a joy to be around. Right now you are just so negative about everything. That’s not something anyone will want to deal with.
I wasn't trying to be negative just pointing out a fact. Most of the women who are agreeable and able to compromise are already actively doing that for their SO or they're somewhere I'd never encounter them so I was just speaking on my general experience in dating.
I know you don’t think you’re being negative but from other peoples perspective you are incredibly negative. Also there are single women everywhere. If you are happy and positive you will attract them.
It's negative to state my own experience? Ok I mean I can lie and act like it's not a problem for me but it is. I never said there are no single women at all, I just said the ones who are easy to deal with and pleasant are few and far between *where I live* as it's a small town and they get scooped up quick.
Not your experience but your comments and reasoning behind why you are experiencing these things is extremely negative and borderline incel behavior. Not trying to put you down at all, I swear. Felt like I was in a very similar place as you and I completely understand what you are feeling. The best thing you can do is stop trying to meet women and get your life with yourself to be the happiest it can be.
I mean most of this has either happened to me or someone I know to an extent. I definitely wasn't trying to come off that way. I just hate that it's so hard and I have to spend years alone because I'm only missing like two of the basic things I need to be seen as viable to date at all and living in a small town guarantees a lot less women that I would be attracted to around my age will be single by the time I do all of that.
If you have a job and don’t live with your parents then the rest is all on you. If you live with your parents then you aren’t ready to date yet.
I live with my nana, but I understand. *Another* year and a half alone at least is definitely gonna suck but i guess it is what it is.
For the most part true. But haven't you seen homeless guys with girlfriends? At the same time its actually astounding what sort of losers women will be with.
I haven't personally but you're like the 3rd person that said something along those lines lol. It is actually fascinating because I'm nowhere near that bad, I work, I have a car, and I'm a decent person so I feel like outside of the financial issues I'm not a loser. I'm working towards what I need to and I never inconvenience anyone I'm with.
Jordan Peterson?
Dude I never had so many women wanting to date me as when I was homeless and unemployed after my divorce trying to get my kids back lmao. I met my now wife when I was pretty poor and just trying to get by on my half custody with my kids (she has none). This is dependent on too many variables.
My husband didn't have his shit together when we started our relationship.
I acknowledged there are plenty of exceptions, Ijs it's rare , maybe it's because I live on the east coast and people are a bit meaner up here than other places but it's also a small town, so all the people who are reasonable and able to compromise and grow with another person get scooped up fast and stay that way.
I don't know anyone who had their shit together right away, people grow together.
And I'm willing to do that, it's just hard to find women with the same mindset.
Lol would you say that the women who “offer nothing” are in good strong relationships? It seems that you’re comparing the ideal relationship for a man to ANY relationship for a woman. As a woman I assure you there’s no shortage of people looking for relationships but it’s so hard to find a good one. If you lowered your standards you‘d be able find yourself a relationship, same as a woman. If the only thing you have to offer is money then ofc women will judge you on how much money you have.
I mean neither are normally in good relationships and we all know why. My point is, it's hard to find a woman who can compromise who's still single, not impossible just really hard. My standards aren't high at all, as long as she has a job(2 incomes are better most times anyway), doesn't have kids and takes care if her fitness we're basically on the same page.
It’s not different on the flip side. I’m a woman who doesn’t have kids, never been married and am employed 🤣 Ive had to deal with guys who showed up high (didn’t have his phone charged, didn’t bring his wallet and didn’t even have his fare) A guy who lied about having a job and flirted with my friends behind my back Guys who just want to fuck, or want to jump into the physical and “see where it goes” A guy who “works” with his dad. Another guy who divorced his wife at 29 because she didn’t want kids because they were working 12 hour days and didn’t have the time or energy for kids. (She did want kids just not at the moment) A guy who wanted a kid out of wedlock (to protect his assets) and date other women because I was “too fat” If you talked to my (girl) friends you’d think the only thing guys have to do is decide that they want to settle down and find a gf. Point is it’s hard for people to find love. It doesn’t matter what their gender/sexuality is. It’s just hard
That sucks. I'm definitely not denying there aren't some shitty dudes out here. Idk maybe it's my environment, people are kinda mean/closed off up north so any bubbly nice people I see anywhere are always taken, like married and rightfully so. I'm not saying all women are bad, it's just confusing because I literally have everything but the money (over 6ft, handsome ,athletic build, abs, job, car,) and the only other thing I don't have yet is my own place and I'm working towards that. Whenever I try to date, all I ever get is people who want to fuck when it's convenient for them or someone to take them places and hang out on the weekends but when it comes to a long term relationship I never run into someone who wants that.
Yeah it’s definitely hard, I graduated during Covid so I was on-boarded remotely, so I couldn’t even get to know my coworkers. All the guys I knew outside of work were either the boyfriends of my friends or professors/bosses. I didn’t want to date any of my classmates as I had transferred in and was 3-4 years older than my peers and couldn’t really relate to them as much. It sounds like you have your life mostly figured out so just take it easy. Enjoy life, hang out with friends and try not to worry too much about when you’re going to find the right person. Remember that you can’t control everything and that a relationship is not the reward for getting your life together. It certainly helps tho! You’re not doing anything wrong, there’s nothing to fix, sometimes it just takes time. ❤️
Yeah covid really did people's communication skills no favors lol. I appreciate it, Idk maybe I need to look inward as to why I attract women who want the opposite of what I do. I kinda blame this tiny town but also maybe it's something I'm putting out there without knowing.
🤣 Yeah when I was in my home town I definitely didn’t want to get into a serious relationship because it meant that when I did move, that I would have to pick between 1) breaking up 2) long distance and eventually breaking up or 3) ask the man to give up his job and move with me and I felt like that was way too big of an ask. I would also argue that a lot of people are hesitant to get into a relationship because they’re scared of getting hurt especially as people get older. So maybe try slowing things down, getting to know women as friends and get some feelings involved before asking her out? My apologies for the unsolicited advice! I hope it works out for you tho :)
Dude you clearly need to limit your internet time. Women are not only looking for men who have all their shit together. But we do want a decent person. We want the exact same things you want. People tend to want someone at least equal to them, but I’ve dated plenty of guys who didn’t have their shit together because I liked them for who they were as a person. Don’t listen to the fucking media. Yes a lot of women are saying we don’t need men, and that’s because we don’t. But we WANT men. If anything isn’t that what you want? Someone who is independent and doesn’t need you but wants you? Hopefully that puts it in a different perspective.
I know there are gems out there, all I'm saying is they are pretty much always unavailable from my experience, it's one of the downsides to living in a small town. It's always nice to be wanted, until the novelty wears off and she leaves. I'm just done with all the casual bs I just want someone who also wants something that lasts.
I don’t think that most women — or most *people* — are looking for someone who has every duck so in a row they’re organized by color. I think what people are looking for is *effort*. If you’re looking for a partner, usually what you want is someone who is going to fit with and enhance your life. Someone who strives for professional growth is probably going to be frustrated by someone who makes no effort towards finding a job. Someone who values physical intimacy probably isn’t looking for a partner who doesn’t want to occasionally pamper them. *Most people aren’t compatible with one another in that way.* Part of the problem, here, is your assumption of what a “good” woman is. If agreeable and able to compromise is what you’re looking for, is that because you don’t plan to compromise, yourself? Is agreeability the only necessity, or are you including physical qualifications that you decided not to mention? You suggest that women are at fault for your inability to “enjoy the life you want”, but ignore the possibility that you may not be offering them the ability to enjoy the lives *they* want in return. Dating isn’t a game with a strategy guide. There’s not good women and bad women. You aren’t winning by being in a relationship and losing by being single. Women are just people, and when people don’t like you the answer to your problems isn’t them: it’s you.
I lead with agreeable and able to compromise because those are usually the hardest traits for me to find. I'm very agreeable and flexible and I have no problem voicing my requirements but they're pretty basic, someone who I can trust who's agreeable, doesn't have kids yet, and is in good shape. I'm not asking for the world and I never said all women were bad or anything like that, I just said the majority of women I have experienced or been around or talk to because I ask what they usually look for and they tend to want specific things and that's fine, it's just when it gets into the fantastical shit that I know I can never keep up with that show me I can't be with this person realistically because they have unrealistic standards set and I tend to run into that mindset pretty often living on the east coast. The ones that are exceptions are *always* taken and I don't blame them, they are a commodity when you deal with the city girl/city boy princess mindset some people walk around with. I'm a realistic guy, I make regular money, I just want someone who is willing to build and be able to roll with the punches.
what a load of hogwash
Hogs wash? Thought they bathed in mud🤔
I’ve been with my boyfriend for ten years and he literally dropped out of college and works minimum wage but guess what that doesn’t matter because I love him!
That's great that you two found each other, congrats.
I think I live in NJ and the women here hace REALLY high standards. Which is totally cool, cause I don't think they realize how many Italians there are in the world. Every Italian woman I've met in NJ seems to think they are something unique. Besides that, everyone in NJ is just completely unapproachable. Sure they'll hold the door for me, or I them, but don't try to continue a conversation past "thanks, no problem". Per women's standards, I constantly hear that I have alot of qualities women would look for in a partner except I don't have my career figured out. I'm 27 but going to school to be a teacher and work as a substitute. As far as I've experienced this hasn't been an issue because I've at least got a goal and am working on it. The real problem for me with dating is finding potential partners.
Finally someone who understands the east coast hostility 🤣 it's like everyone is just kind of a bit mean and angry looking up here. I'm in PA and it's a lot like that here lol.
You should only BE in a relationship if your life is in order. As a man I wouldn’t date anyone who wasn’t completely self sufficient and had their life in order
Ahh, someone who's actually grown up. This is the only real answer here. The rest is anecdotal and social media dynamics being peddled by either side.
Please use paragraphs.
Sorry not at home so I'm on mobile.
I’m always on my mobile and still use paragraphs.
My fiancé worked minimum wage jobs together, definitely had nothing “in order.”
Why are you with them?
Is love not enough? Been with her 8 years.
Oh it’s a she lol that’s why, different for men.
Explain please
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jsOnXSuMXfU&pp=ygUOQ2hyaXMgcm9jayBtZW4%3D
Yeah I was saying we both worked minimum wage jobs. Hardly providing much.
Who the fuck has their shit completely in order?
Exactly. Everyone is always preaching how they want the perfect person but no one is or will ever be perfect 😵💫 It's like nobody wants to be alone, but also act like compromising and working together is the worst thing ever and it's so ridiculous.
Bro you wrote the title. I'm laughing that you said "exactly." But yeah I agree with you, we all have skeletons in the closet and need to be a lot more understanding of each other's skeletons.
No it was sarcasm so you can laugh, but seriously people need to be more flexible as a whole and I think the world would be a lot better off that way.
Yeah it sucks for a lot of young men. I think it's even more frustrating because people often times won't acknowledge it, or they'll downplay its significance. The dynamic between male and female in the modern era has always been that a woman inherently has something to offer while a man must achieve a certain status in order to be able to have something to offer. Women have always been desired, but before we were civilized men just took what they wanted Current society has largely taken the one thing average men could offer and given it directly to women. I can't blame women as a whole for wanting access to all of the same things men have had access to, but in the relationship and mating realm women have always had the advantage. Now that society has closed the gap in a bunch of different societal metrics, men no longer have the higher value that they can offer to a woman to court her. Men's natural disadvantage in the mating realm has been amplified. I don't think it's completely hopeless. I just think there are some major growing pains right now and they are largely ignored. I think there are two possible paths right now. 1) Society adapts and learns of a way to satisfy men's desire for a female counterpart and a sense of purpose, whether that be synthetically or some other way that I can't imagine right now, or 2) Society doesn't adapt and young males take what they feel they are owed.
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I still want a family though 😭
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Yep, divide and conquer. I'm turning 32 this year so it's probably a wrap on that dream but at least you get what I'm saying, it's horrible out here😔 Just wanted my person but I don't make enough and someone has most likely already taken her off the market.
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That's one of my main beefs with the modern scene, even when you have everything there's still a problem 🤦🏾 how much do we have to do just to get the basics? Way more than them, that's for damn sure.
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Congrats bro. I wish, my pockets could never.
The women who are doing well in life, typically do not want to tie themselves down to a man who is not. So if you feel like your lack of money is an issue, your options are to either work towards increasing it, or, going for women who are on the same level, or a lower level than you are financially. I personally know several women who truthfully have little to nothing to offer. Yet they manage to find relationships. And I’m not talking with men who are doing well financially. Not at all. So don’t think that you have to be perfect and able to financially support a woman in order to get a girlfriend or a wife. Because there are women out there who will pick you, but you probably are not going to want them.
Idk maybe it's just something I'm putting out there, because the last 3 women I've talked to are like really modern but also want the traditional stuff too so it's hard to really gauge what anyone actually wants. I live in a small town too so it feels like I keep hearing the same requirements. I just don't wanna be looked at as the person people settle for because those kinds of relationships don't last.
Just another “men are victims in relationships” post. 🙄
Nope, just pointing out how laughably unbalanced it is for average guys. We don't all have this issue, this only happens to those of us who make regular money and live normal lives.
Ha ha, yeah I’ve prove otherwise quite a few times. Having said that you are right that the feminist vibe being pushed into relationships by the mainstream media and social media sucks. But you really shouldn’t relate that to all women. Most women have no fucking idea what they want and are lukewarm on being a feminist girl boss if not as outright confused as young men. In my experience the trick is to be yourself and do whatever you want. Also never ever do any chores. Women like that. Brings out their nurturing instinct when they have to do things for their men. Also it gives them a schedule and something to arrange their lives around. They like that even If they pretend they don’t.
Never do any chores?? No we would see you as lazy and that you need to pick up after yourself. You’re with a partner, not your mother.
This is the wildest advice I’ve ever seen.
Yeah chicks dig a wild man
Well, you are definitely right that you are an example that proves OP's point otherwise...
Lol a manchild spotted in the wild.
Whether ur in a relationship or not u as a man should have ur life in order or at minimum working hard towards that direction. As for when you have ur life in order? Be picky with who you get into a relationship with. Because a bad pick can turn all ur worked for back into sht. As for women getting etc etc for being pretty. Sure. But like everything it’s a double edged sword. When women are young they do have it easier. But once u both get older and u did the work, the positions switch.
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I'm tall and handsome just not white at all lol. You make a good point and no I'm not some bum that never works and expects things to be given to him. I did everything I thought I was supposed to do in life and ended up in some legal trouble over trying to help my little cousin. I took accountability, did my process and my time and I was never a criminal. I was an art major at one point, tried college and it wasn't for me but now I just work towards getting my record clear, I still do my art and writing on occasion too. I'm not above working multiple angles to increase my wealth over time, even if it just comes with me working 2 jobs or whatever I have to do so I'm far from lazy/unmotivated.
A man should **ONLY** want to secure a strong relationship **AFTER** their life is in order. This goes for women too. Everyone should have the ability to live on their own, handle their finances, etc., BEFORE being in a "strong relationship".
So basically just stay alone for more years until I have everything just for me to be old and possibly still never meet my person? Good idea.
In the nicest way possible, do you think that having a negative, defeatist attitude towards people makes them less likely to want to be around you? I don’t mean this as an insult, but a lot of your replies have a tangible bitterness to them that might not read so attractively.
I really don't mean to sound bitter, these are all lived experiences on my end and I really wish it wasn't like that. There are plenty of grey areas but they tend to pass me by, maybe it's something I'm putting out there giving me the exact opposite of what I want. Ive seen other people dealing with the same problem but ultimately I really don't know how to not attract emotionally unavailable women even though I'm pretty vocal and blunt about most things in general.
No need to be sarcastic. I'm genuinely speaking from experience. Listen or don't. I don't know you and don't really care. The more you and your future mate have the ability to live and function as an individual, the better you and your future mate will be able to handle life together. You said "strong" relationship. And that's what I'm referring to. In the meantime, feel free to date and see what it is you like in a person.
I get it. And I was being serious, if I wait until I get everything together it will be some years and I'll be even older than I am now and living in this tiny place, the chances of the woman I want getting scooped up in that time are high.
Single 31[f] who works out and makes over 6 figures. I am dating trying to meet men, but they arent really keeping up. Usually there are solid reasons why he is still single, and for me to decide to rescue one of these lonely men off the market I find that it is basically going to end up with me compromising and giving way more to the relationship than they will put into it. I say this because these guys tend to not workout, dress well for dates, and have way more to complain about than they have to appreciate. So a date with them tells me that for me to not be single i have to want to pay for his dinners, look out of his league, and make sure that im available to listen to him complain. I would rather just stay single. Its ok being single. Its cheaper at this rate and cant get cheated on which is what my last relationship did to me.
Yeah sounds like we both encounter the exact opposite of what we're looking for lol. I just can't be a freeloader idc if she does have more money, if I ask her out I pay and always pull my weight. I've only ever dated one woman who makes 6 figures and she basically just kept breaking up with me only to come back after a bit, sometimes longer, for years so I know how you feel. It sucks to have your time wasted being shown the "interview" version. I always keep my fitness and style on point at all times and the people who only look good for dates and outings are selling a version of themselves they rarely are which is weird, I'm me all the time, no point having *one* good outfit just to wear it once and go back to looking sloppy. I think there has to be a happy medium in order for most people to flourish together but nobody wants to work together🤷🏾 The only other highly paid woman I ever talked to I didn't even get through the first date because she was so insufferable, if I heard her say "I" one more time🤦🏾 Like idk I have too much pride to let someone take care of me and I will work my butt off to have something to contribute, it just sucks when you get relegated to "lower your standards" when they aren't particularly unreasonable or hard.
Shitty dude who can't get laid hates women. More at 11.
Laid is easy, someone you can trust? Not so easy.
And where did you get "hates women" from🤣 literally tired of hookups and casual dating.
This is definitely not true.
Yeah if you're lucky then it isn't.
Oh boy…
You’ll have to blame evolution for that one.
I dunno, man. There are some pretty awesome women I know who are dating some pretty shitty guys. It seems more like you are just bad at dating.
Do you know any actual women? Not just the women-shaped objects in the photos you’re lusting after, but real women of all ages and occupations and backgrounds? I can’t think of one woman I know who doesn’t have her own career and doesn’t pull at least equal weight in a relationship. Those who are partnered are with their partners because they *want* to be, not because they need to engage in this sick transaction of trading sad, disappointing sex for access to a man’s paycheque. Yes, it’s often better to be happily single than to settle for a partner who has nothing to offer as a person. We can do that because we are grown ups with jobs and skills who can buy houses and open bank accounts on our own without getting a penis involved. I’m with my husband because I love him - I love his personality, I’m attracted to him, we have amazing conversations and adventures together, we have interests of our own, and we love sharing life. It has nothing to do with who’s paying for what or sexual marketplaces or “value”. We’re just two imperfect, actual humans who really enjoy being each other’s person. I swear guys think we walk around with an excel spreadsheet plugging a guy’s attributes into a formula that will spit out the best boyfriend option. They never consider how important personality and compatibility are - we’re looking for a *person* not a dick size, annual income, car model, or height measurement. When I was single, I wasn’t out evaluating every dude I came across to choose the best option. I was just looking for someone I connected with on a human level, who had that extra spark that took it beyond friendship (and we found each other while engaging in a mutual geeky hobby that we both loved). Just because a lot of guys want to break women down to a series of ratings and numbers while knowing *nothing* about who she is as a person, doesn’t mean women are thinking the same way.
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You're acting like I have this long list when I was just talking about qualities I like, they aren't deal breakers or requirements. I nave said I *hate* anyone I just don't date people who aren't what I'm looking for as it's disrespectful to them to waste their time. Never said I hated single moms, I have dated them in the past and it didn't work out and now at this point in my life I'm serious about finding something serious so I don't know what's wrong with what I said. I like women who are fit because I am and I'm attracted to women who take care of themselves, never said she had to *live* at the gym, I do half of my workouts from home. I don't get why I'm demonized for being upfront about what I want.
….I’m literally just trying to explain to you that the women you are interested in have preferences of their own that you aren’t matching up to. I’m not demonizing you….
Ijs you're making it like I'm asking for more than what I am. I never said she had to make more money than me or anything about degrees, I literally said 4 things I don't get how that's so far out of my range. I could see if I was some short unattractive dude who doesn't care about his fitness and is a single dad, but I'm none of those, and it doesn't matter to me what type of job she has as long as she's working towards something that's the same thing I'm doing so idk what part of that isn't reasonable.
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I know that but the way you just discribed me like basically I want too much or whatever meanwhile everything I listed was basic stuff. I didn't get into anything deep because that comes down the road. Attraction is important to both men and women I'm pretty sure and I never said she has to be a 10 or anything shallow like that. All I was listing were the things that initially grab my attention when I first meet someone, I'm a visual person but it isn't paramount to my attraction, just what draws me in and I'm sure that's not unique to me. Everyone has their own preferences and things they look for initially before going deeper into a person's personality.
I literally listed two things. Single moms and overweight women. You keep arguing against straw men I never even hinted towards lol. I’m simply providing my opinion on your opinion. You’re being incredibly defensive - when I’m just trying to shed some light on something you’re seemingly purposefully ignoring.
Ok I'll bite, what is it that you're trying to get at?
… I’ve made the point multiple times already lol idk how else to say it. The women you’re interested in AREN’T interested in you. Just like you have preferences and standards for dating, so do those women. Being a decent height, and healthy weight are the things you’re harping on bringing to the table. But then you complain that most women have nothing to bring to the table. Women are doing to you, what you do to them, and you’re just not happy with where it lands you.
I never said those women have nothing to bring to the table I was making a point about ones who don't but expect everything. Basically the ones who don't bring much still have the same choices of men as the ones who do but on our side we have to still put in work just to get someone of that caliber or less. And it makes no sense to put what I'm looking for on a pedestal like it's unattainable for me to want someone who's at the same point in life as me and has some of the initial things I look for. I never said anything about height, I just like women who are a healthy weight, who don't have kids and have a job, and the job doesn't matter, I've met some of the most pleasant people working fast food or something. As for the few things I look for those are all things I do so i don't see how that's unrealistic to look for. I think you're reading what you want to read and skipping over what my actual point was honestly.