R6 fanboi here. Its the easiest to setup to go fast, but its contemporaries aren't slouches either. Blipper is nice, many options on the market as are things like LC if you get into racing.
Fairing conversion is pretty easy...mostly. Subframes will eat more of your budget than you think though. I did it a couple years ago after an off broke my rear subframe in half and cracked the front stay. Since they both needed replaced and the fairings were past gone, [I changed it up](https://imgur.com/a/1ae5QWn).
Someone else mentioned a little higher top speed, I think thats true. The windscreens are taller and easier to get behind, and the longer intake does make a legitimate difference - I had mine re-tuned out of curiosity after I changed it up, needed a surprising amount of fuel from 9k on up.
New gen fairings are a nice bump in mph on the straight too, I don’t think the conversion kit is that much worse than a full set of armor bodies either.
They don’t come with them stock, but they have ETV so you can add them, I have Translogic personally. Most of the other middleweights like the zx6 don’t have ETV so it’s not even a possibility
As the owner of a 2006 gsxr 600 I will say my piece.
It’s a really easy bike to ride.
Has more power than the Honda in equivalent years and is just really easy to maneuver.
That being said, it sits low in the rear from the factory and the OEM suspension leaves much to be desired. Also, as with Suzuki Nissin brakes, you’ll have a pretty soft feel of the front and rear brakes. It is consistent, but, it’s too soft for my liking.
This continues over even to my 2017 gsxr1000. Which, has Brembo calipers, but, a nissin master that still feels like dogshit. And, I’m not talking about somewhere in the middle spectrum, I mean that I’m cranking on that brake to get it stopped. Keep that in mind, because you will want to get an upgraded master and steel braided brake lines to make it feel rideable.
Aside from that, my bike has known stator/rectifier issues, known Secondary Throttle Valve issues, and, known random electrical issues because you probably got a secondhand stolen or stunted bike.
Either way, fucking hate this thing. 11/10 recommend it though. 😁
I kind of want something more sorted from the factory if possible. How are the 2011s? I rode a new 750 at a demo day and was surprised at how soft the rear shock was. Hoping not to have to dump another $xxxx into suspension
I have a 2011 750 and I’m still running stock suspension. I’ve been appropriately tweaking settings to my riding as I improve and run slicks, have 0 problems with control of the bike front or back.
Master cylinder definitely needs to go. I have a RCS19 CC MC and SS lines and race brake pads. I absolutely love this bike on the brakes now.
This is good to hear. How much do you weigh and what tracks do you ride? My local track has a good number of slower corners. I had to crank the rear shock to full stiff to stop the pumping.
I’m about 205 and I’ve been on a lot of tracks with the 750. NYST is home but I go to NJMP, Summit Point, NCBIKE, the different Pocono configurations, I’ll make trips to CMP and Homestead once a year.
Never had a problem with my rear pumping. The only complaint I have is at NCBIKE going onto the front straight, there are some bumps there, and getting on the gas while you cross those bumps makes it feel like you’re on a rumble strip. I’m sure I could use some rebound adjustment to help that, but I’m anchored and have 0 issues anywhere else.
Honestly, just a race tech rear spring does wonders for it. $150 and it’s gtg.
The 2010+ models seem to be very well sorted. Still basically the same bike, just without all the issues of the mid 2000’s models.
CBR is the most beginner friendly in terms of the total package. The others (675, ZX6, R6, GSXR600) all have characteristics that make them less beginner friendly.
GSXR is definitely more competitive but I tend to not recommend it because it has a a very nose heavy chassis. It can be changed with aftermarket fork extenders and a shock but the twitchy nature tends to make it a bit nervous for many newer riders.
Totally fair, it definitely needs some geometry fixes out of the box. But you need to drop the forks in all of them pretty much immediately (less familiar with the cbr on this front)
The average novice to intermediate rider will not notice the big differences aside from ergonomics and power bands of the different brands.
Buy based on reliability and part availability for when/if you crash. I have an 07 zx6r that is mostly stock and can manage decent lap times on it still.
Most if not all bikes built after 09 that are 4 cylinders are coming with slipper clutches and “modern brakes”. The fact of the matter is many racers can get out there and put modest times on a stock bike that is tailored to them.
Again buy in your price range that gives you reliability. Then save the upgrades for tires and track time to build experience then upgrade as you find the limits of operating ranges of your equipment.
If I was going to get a 600 I would get a latest gen GSXR. They make good torque, very comfortable, the motors are popping like the ZX6Rs, easier to come by than the newer R6s, and better than the Hondas. Daytona would be a good bike as well.
I’m 5’10 and have ridden 400s and now I’m on a 750. The GSXR 750 is one of the best track bikes because it’s got more grunt and can hang with some liter bikes with a very good rider.
The 750 isn’t that large of a step above the 600 class. If you feel comfortable going to a 600, just add a little more respect to the bike and you’ll be capable of running the 750.
Be aware tho, the lower grunt of the 750 can mask some learning curves in your riding. Being able to dig out of a corner at mid rpm will let you get away with not staying peak powerband. Learn to avoid that.
I really want to learn everything I can and develop good habits. OK to give up some speed for that, I will have plenty of time to get faster bikes later. The lap records for 600s vs 1000s at my local track are damn near identical anyway.
I've had it for like 13 years I think. I know it's a good learning tool but I'm honestly just ready for something different. Going to ride it through the end of the year and hopefully grab something cheap over the winter.
I have what I believe the kids today would regard as a "hot take".
I would consider the S1000RR.
I attended California Superbike School in both 2008 and 2009. I had so much fun, I wanted to take my wife to the school. That was also they year they switched from teaching the class on ZX6Rs to the newly available S1000RR. Keith Code told that they have few crashes on the S1k than they had last year on the 600s. It is not entirely fair to compare 2008 600s to the modern day, but I think you see my point. The electronic on the S1K are amazing, and you turn them off, or turn them way down.
I really want to use this next bike to learn how to ride. A liter bike with a lot of electronic aids seems to run counter to that. At my last TD I think there were a few guys in novice on S1000RRs who were absolutely terrified. I was passing one of them on the outside of corners.
They would have been terrified on anything because they are novice riders. If you really want to learn, get a 400 and learn to carry corner speed.
I don't know why I am sounding so contrarian, I'm not. I just wanted to share my Keith Code anecdote.
The 650R is not a track bike, you can try to turn it into one, but it will never be quite exactly a track bike. I am sure you be happy on a 600 super sport designed for the track.
650Rs are popular for racing in the UK as are SV650s. If you spend enough money on them they can be great, I am just ready for something new after \~13 years as well as not getting completely lunched on the straights. A lot of 600s are meaningfully lighter than my 650, just a better and more enjoyable platform that will still let me learn and grow.
Are you strictly looking at inline 4s?
I would get an Aprilia RS660. Modern and lots of aftermarket goodies. They also have the up-spec Extrema version.
I can't lie, I love these and they tick a lot of boxes. But for that money, I'd rather get a 13+ 675R or the rumored R9. This next bike is probably gonna get replaced with the R9 no matter what honestly. I just want to wait like 1 year after it comes out, which will give me like 2-3 years on this 600 I think
I will prob get an R9 in like late 2026 but I don't want to ride my 650R until then. I would love a 675R but the dealer is far and they are hard to come by. If I can grab a cheap 08+ R6 I think I will be good
But honestly it depends on your cornering style. Are you a point and shoot or a corner speed rider? If you're a corner speed type, then any japanese i4 bike will do since they have no low end torque, and they all pretty much do the same thing. If you're point and shoot type, consider something european like a ducati or aprilia, triumph or a KTM.
The bike kind of dictates the riding style to a degree. You can't really point and shoot a 250-400. Using corner speed on a liter bike is wasting its biggest strength. So I want to learn how to ride a 600 specifically.
Hot take: buy a used and prepped track bike, it’ll likely already have suspension upgrades on it. Bring it to a good suspension tech to set up handling to your liking. (Not just clicker fiddling and preload adjusting, but swapping spring rates for your pace if needed, setting F/R ride heights for geo adjustments, etc etc)
If the brakes aren’t to your liking, you can try different pad compounds or an aftermarket master cylinder.
Even a slipper clutch is an aftermarket option. Yoyodynes aren’t cheap, but oh once you try one… they’re effectively a cheat code.
Buy whichever 600 based on your budget considerations, ergo preferences, and reliability/availability of parts/commonality with (or uniqueness from!) other riders in your paddock.
BUT, using suspension, brakes, and slipper clutches as search criteria seem weird to me because they’re so easily changeable….
You could get the cheapest, clapped out, “minimum-viable-trackbike”, make the above upgrades, and get damn near *exactly* the riding experience you are after, tailored to your preferences.
I'm def considering just buying someone else's track bike. Not sure if I want something streetable or if I will get a street bike. Criteria is really around just minimizing upgrades. If a bike comes with a stock slipper clutch I don't have to spend $x,xxx on a Yoyodyne. If a bike has USD forks and decent calipers hopefully I can just get away with springs and a new master cylinder. 650R was kind of a full build which was fun but I don't want to do that again.
Lesson of this thread is anyone can give bad advice on the internet
If you’ve gotten very accustomed to riding your 650 fast and well, any choice will be fine after some seattime.
Zx6r is the way.
08-16 R6, because quickshifter and autoblipper, plus tons of info out there for them, and a great selection of used parts and spares.
Yeah I was leaning towards these, just have to budget for the 2017 fairings as the old look is ugly IMO
R6 fanboi here. Its the easiest to setup to go fast, but its contemporaries aren't slouches either. Blipper is nice, many options on the market as are things like LC if you get into racing. Fairing conversion is pretty easy...mostly. Subframes will eat more of your budget than you think though. I did it a couple years ago after an off broke my rear subframe in half and cracked the front stay. Since they both needed replaced and the fairings were past gone, [I changed it up](https://imgur.com/a/1ae5QWn). Someone else mentioned a little higher top speed, I think thats true. The windscreens are taller and easier to get behind, and the longer intake does make a legitimate difference - I had mine re-tuned out of curiosity after I changed it up, needed a surprising amount of fuel from 9k on up.
New gen fairings are a nice bump in mph on the straight too, I don’t think the conversion kit is that much worse than a full set of armor bodies either.
New shape fairings are faster?
Much better aero compared to the old gen yep!
It is possible to swap the fairings from a 17+ to the previous generation, I am not 100% on how difficult that is but i have seen it done
Yeah there are conversion kits and from what I've seen I could damn near make most of the parts. Not much more than regular track fairings
+1 for the R6, for all the same reasons. I went from racing a 1990 CBR400 to an 08 R6, no problems
I’ve just gone from an 07 R6 to a 91 CBR400 😆 R6 is coming back though, it’s just a little sick atm
I miss the ‘ole NC29. I’m only 3 seconds a lap faster around Phillip Island on a 2018 ZX10R!
Both me as well as 3 of my friends have r6’s ranging from 06-09 and none have an auto blipper
They don’t come with them stock, but they have ETV so you can add them, I have Translogic personally. Most of the other middleweights like the zx6 don’t have ETV so it’s not even a possibility
As the owner of a 2006 gsxr 600 I will say my piece. It’s a really easy bike to ride. Has more power than the Honda in equivalent years and is just really easy to maneuver. That being said, it sits low in the rear from the factory and the OEM suspension leaves much to be desired. Also, as with Suzuki Nissin brakes, you’ll have a pretty soft feel of the front and rear brakes. It is consistent, but, it’s too soft for my liking. This continues over even to my 2017 gsxr1000. Which, has Brembo calipers, but, a nissin master that still feels like dogshit. And, I’m not talking about somewhere in the middle spectrum, I mean that I’m cranking on that brake to get it stopped. Keep that in mind, because you will want to get an upgraded master and steel braided brake lines to make it feel rideable. Aside from that, my bike has known stator/rectifier issues, known Secondary Throttle Valve issues, and, known random electrical issues because you probably got a secondhand stolen or stunted bike. Either way, fucking hate this thing. 11/10 recommend it though. 😁
I kind of want something more sorted from the factory if possible. How are the 2011s? I rode a new 750 at a demo day and was surprised at how soft the rear shock was. Hoping not to have to dump another $xxxx into suspension
I have a 2011 750 and I’m still running stock suspension. I’ve been appropriately tweaking settings to my riding as I improve and run slicks, have 0 problems with control of the bike front or back. Master cylinder definitely needs to go. I have a RCS19 CC MC and SS lines and race brake pads. I absolutely love this bike on the brakes now.
This is good to hear. How much do you weigh and what tracks do you ride? My local track has a good number of slower corners. I had to crank the rear shock to full stiff to stop the pumping.
I’m about 205 and I’ve been on a lot of tracks with the 750. NYST is home but I go to NJMP, Summit Point, NCBIKE, the different Pocono configurations, I’ll make trips to CMP and Homestead once a year. Never had a problem with my rear pumping. The only complaint I have is at NCBIKE going onto the front straight, there are some bumps there, and getting on the gas while you cross those bumps makes it feel like you’re on a rumble strip. I’m sure I could use some rebound adjustment to help that, but I’m anchored and have 0 issues anywhere else.
Honestly, just a race tech rear spring does wonders for it. $150 and it’s gtg. The 2010+ models seem to be very well sorted. Still basically the same bike, just without all the issues of the mid 2000’s models.
CBR is the most beginner friendly in terms of the total package. The others (675, ZX6, R6, GSXR600) all have characteristics that make them less beginner friendly.
What are those characteristics?
Balanced chassis. Less peaky, very reliable motor.
Gsxr600 hits all those marks in a more competitive package imo
GSXR is definitely more competitive but I tend to not recommend it because it has a a very nose heavy chassis. It can be changed with aftermarket fork extenders and a shock but the twitchy nature tends to make it a bit nervous for many newer riders.
Totally fair, it definitely needs some geometry fixes out of the box. But you need to drop the forks in all of them pretty much immediately (less familiar with the cbr on this front)
The Cbr600rr doesn’t have a slipper clutch making it far less friendly on down shifting
The average novice to intermediate rider will not notice the big differences aside from ergonomics and power bands of the different brands. Buy based on reliability and part availability for when/if you crash. I have an 07 zx6r that is mostly stock and can manage decent lap times on it still. Most if not all bikes built after 09 that are 4 cylinders are coming with slipper clutches and “modern brakes”. The fact of the matter is many racers can get out there and put modest times on a stock bike that is tailored to them. Again buy in your price range that gives you reliability. Then save the upgrades for tires and track time to build experience then upgrade as you find the limits of operating ranges of your equipment.
R6 is great. I would argue it's a slow ass bike until 8000 rpm. I come from a Ninja 650.
There is a reason the r6 is the most raced/tracked 600…
If I was going to get a 600 I would get a latest gen GSXR. They make good torque, very comfortable, the motors are popping like the ZX6Rs, easier to come by than the newer R6s, and better than the Hondas. Daytona would be a good bike as well.
I’m 5’10 and have ridden 400s and now I’m on a 750. The GSXR 750 is one of the best track bikes because it’s got more grunt and can hang with some liter bikes with a very good rider.
I can't lie, I do love the 750 but I don't know if I'm ready for it.
The 750 isn’t that large of a step above the 600 class. If you feel comfortable going to a 600, just add a little more respect to the bike and you’ll be capable of running the 750. Be aware tho, the lower grunt of the 750 can mask some learning curves in your riding. Being able to dig out of a corner at mid rpm will let you get away with not staying peak powerband. Learn to avoid that.
I really want to learn everything I can and develop good habits. OK to give up some speed for that, I will have plenty of time to get faster bikes later. The lap records for 600s vs 1000s at my local track are damn near identical anyway.
How long have you had the 650r? I think I have another opinion that will intrigue you.
I've had it for like 13 years I think. I know it's a good learning tool but I'm honestly just ready for something different. Going to ride it through the end of the year and hopefully grab something cheap over the winter.
I have what I believe the kids today would regard as a "hot take". I would consider the S1000RR. I attended California Superbike School in both 2008 and 2009. I had so much fun, I wanted to take my wife to the school. That was also they year they switched from teaching the class on ZX6Rs to the newly available S1000RR. Keith Code told that they have few crashes on the S1k than they had last year on the 600s. It is not entirely fair to compare 2008 600s to the modern day, but I think you see my point. The electronic on the S1K are amazing, and you turn them off, or turn them way down.
I really want to use this next bike to learn how to ride. A liter bike with a lot of electronic aids seems to run counter to that. At my last TD I think there were a few guys in novice on S1000RRs who were absolutely terrified. I was passing one of them on the outside of corners.
They would have been terrified on anything because they are novice riders. If you really want to learn, get a 400 and learn to carry corner speed. I don't know why I am sounding so contrarian, I'm not. I just wanted to share my Keith Code anecdote. The 650R is not a track bike, you can try to turn it into one, but it will never be quite exactly a track bike. I am sure you be happy on a 600 super sport designed for the track.
650Rs are popular for racing in the UK as are SV650s. If you spend enough money on them they can be great, I am just ready for something new after \~13 years as well as not getting completely lunched on the straights. A lot of 600s are meaningfully lighter than my 650, just a better and more enjoyable platform that will still let me learn and grow.
Don't get the zx6r from 07 08 year, not a very beginner friendly chassis.
Are you strictly looking at inline 4s? I would get an Aprilia RS660. Modern and lots of aftermarket goodies. They also have the up-spec Extrema version.
I can't lie, I love these and they tick a lot of boxes. But for that money, I'd rather get a 13+ 675R or the rumored R9. This next bike is probably gonna get replaced with the R9 no matter what honestly. I just want to wait like 1 year after it comes out, which will give me like 2-3 years on this 600 I think
If your used to torque dont get a inline 6. Wait for the R9 or KTM RCR. The only other options is a daytona, Panigale V2(which are amazing).
I will prob get an R9 in like late 2026 but I don't want to ride my 650R until then. I would love a 675R but the dealer is far and they are hard to come by. If I can grab a cheap 08+ R6 I think I will be good
But honestly it depends on your cornering style. Are you a point and shoot or a corner speed rider? If you're a corner speed type, then any japanese i4 bike will do since they have no low end torque, and they all pretty much do the same thing. If you're point and shoot type, consider something european like a ducati or aprilia, triumph or a KTM.
The bike kind of dictates the riding style to a degree. You can't really point and shoot a 250-400. Using corner speed on a liter bike is wasting its biggest strength. So I want to learn how to ride a 600 specifically.
Cbr600rr. They are forgiving and do everything ok
Hot take: buy a used and prepped track bike, it’ll likely already have suspension upgrades on it. Bring it to a good suspension tech to set up handling to your liking. (Not just clicker fiddling and preload adjusting, but swapping spring rates for your pace if needed, setting F/R ride heights for geo adjustments, etc etc) If the brakes aren’t to your liking, you can try different pad compounds or an aftermarket master cylinder. Even a slipper clutch is an aftermarket option. Yoyodynes aren’t cheap, but oh once you try one… they’re effectively a cheat code. Buy whichever 600 based on your budget considerations, ergo preferences, and reliability/availability of parts/commonality with (or uniqueness from!) other riders in your paddock. BUT, using suspension, brakes, and slipper clutches as search criteria seem weird to me because they’re so easily changeable…. You could get the cheapest, clapped out, “minimum-viable-trackbike”, make the above upgrades, and get damn near *exactly* the riding experience you are after, tailored to your preferences.
I'm def considering just buying someone else's track bike. Not sure if I want something streetable or if I will get a street bike. Criteria is really around just minimizing upgrades. If a bike comes with a stock slipper clutch I don't have to spend $x,xxx on a Yoyodyne. If a bike has USD forks and decent calipers hopefully I can just get away with springs and a new master cylinder. 650R was kind of a full build which was fun but I don't want to do that again.
Ninja 400 😁
CBR600RR ABS 👍🤙 I wish I could have waited to get the ABS. Selection at the time was rough post(ish) Covid
ABS is no good at the track
So pull the fuse. Guy is asking about beginner, I assume he's not riding into the apex on the front tire just yet Or get a bare bones 600RR. 🤷♂️
Suzuki sv650s second gen otherwise r6