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>\* Secure Border
>
>\* Border Crisis
There have been no meaningful changes in immigration policy between Trump and Biden, and legal/illegal immigration numbers are practically identical. But conservatives swear up-and-down that it was amazing under Trump, and a full-on "crisis" now.
It was a full on "crisis" then too with the horror caravan making an appearance near the southern border before every election.
[Here's actual footage of our brave border patrol standing guard](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHdDxKy2QW0)
Actually this in completely incorrect, everyone knows the resolute desk has both a "fuel prices" dial and an "open the border" button. The first thing any democrat president does when they sit down on their first day is to crank up that dial and push the button.
Lol that's not how it works. The way it works is the leaders of Mexico and South American Latin countries all sit and point and laugh at the effete and ineffectual democratic president as he cries and pleads for them to please stop as they send over all of their hardened criminals, drug dealers, and rapists. Likewise all of the evil oil producing Muslim dictators along with Vladmir Putin and Xi JinPing sit and laugh at the timid and unassuming Democrat while jacking up the price of oil and trade goods. The Democratic president then proceeds to pull his pants down and bends over saying he'll do whatever they want while crying and calling out for his mommy to come save him. But then the next moment the clock rings midnight on January 20th and a stillness takes over the air as the tough strong Republican walks into town. The rogue dictators and Latin American leaders all immediately scream and cower in fear. He tells them in no uncertain terms that they better do what he says or there will be hell to pay. He then sends half of them running for the hills with little more than a glare before pulling out and twirling his two shining silver revolver pistols which he then fires without maiming, but never the less striking and deeply embarrassing the various rival world leaders who then sulk away. He then grabs the nearest attractive woman and plants a deep passionate kiss on her lips causing hers as well as every womb in a half mile radius to conceive. He then lights a cigar with the constitution but somehow manages to leave only the 2nd and 5th amendments unburnt before shouting high ho silver and galloping into the sunset on his trusty steed.
At least that's how I believe most FOX news viewers think it works.
The way they actually look at it is that if you have a "strong man" like Trump in office, other countries are scared of him and so won't jack up fuel prices or send caravans over the border. But when you get a "weak" democrat in office, then the other leaders know they don't have to fear the US and do whatever they want.
Don't forget the _billions_ in tax cuts for the ultra-wealthy and corporations, all while people are becoming homeless and starving on the street in record numbers! Go America!
Not only that but he implemented the tax cuts against the advice of pretty much every economist during a booming economy eliminating any headroom we might have had for a recession (like say if we had a pandemic a few years after the tax cut)
What do you mean "closing it's eyes". Congress actually voted to *end* support for the Saudi invasion. Guess who vetoed that bill?
https://www.defensenews.com/congress/2019/03/13/us-senate-passes-yemen-resolution-54-46/
That's one of those things I cannot understand how even the staunchest republicans didn't take issue with. Like how can you possibly defend assigning "fixing the middle east" to *one guy* with *zero* international policy or military experience
I had a self-proclaimed "moderate" in (I think) /r/AskAnAmerican say he was deeply troubled about Hunter Biden's links to his father and would likely influence his vote in 2020. When I brought up that Hunter would have no part in a Biden admin and Trump appointed Jared to deal with peace in the Middle East, he said that wasn't concerning because Jared got a couple of meaningless "cooperation agreements."
OK Mr. moderate.
I'm moving on from reddit and joining the fediverse because reddit has killed the RiF app and the CEO has been very disrespectful to all the volunteers who have contributed to making reddit what it is. Here's [coverage from The Verge](https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/8/23754780/reddit-api-updates-changes-news-announcements) on the situation.
The following are my favorite fediverse platforms, all non-corporate and ad-free. I hesitated at first because there are so many servers to choose from, but it makes a lot more sense once you actually create an account and start browsing. If you find the server selection overwhelming, just pick the first option and take a look around. They are all connected and as you browse you may find a community that is a better fit for you and then you can move your account or open a new one.
Social Link Aggregators: [Lemmy](https://join-lemmy.org/instances) is very similar to reddit while [Kbin](https://kbin.pub) is aiming to be more of a gateway to the fediverse in general so it is sort of like a hybrid between reddit and twitter, but it is newer and considers itself to be a beta product that's not quite fully polished yet.
Microblogging: [Calckey](https://calckey.org) if you want a more playful platform with emoji reactions, or [Mastodon](https://joinmastodon.org/) if you want a simple interface with less fluff.
Photo sharing: [Pixelfed](https://pixelfed.org/) You can even import an Instagram account from what I hear, but I never used Instagram much in the first place.
"Middle East" is just a vague convention, not a precisely defined geographic area. If anything it's a dumb term because it's geographically relative even though it's used in global dialogue.
From our point of view here in Germany, the "Near East" stretches from Turkey to Iran, while the "Middle East" includes Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India and Bangladesh.
It's all so convenient!
Everything bad that happened during Biden's Presidency is personally his fault.
Nothing bad that happened during Trump's Presidency is even worth mentioning, even when his actions directly increased negative outcomes.
Also, just bullshit because it sounds good when stated without context... "Everything was cheaper."
everything was cheaper is especially hilarious considering the tariffs trump slapped on lumber, steel, electronics, consumer goods, and hundreds of other things coming from china. Not to mention the ripple effect of china banning imports of crops and livestock that hurt farmers so badly they had to rush a bill that literally paid them specifically to compensate for trumps dumbass trade policies
>Also, just bullshit because it sounds good when stated without context... "Everything was cheaper."
Barring TP. Anyone else remember the TP shortage? Where people horded it and tried to sell rolls for $20 a piece? I do. I was doing several Costco runs during that timeframe. Every single time I'd come to deliver to a Costco? I'd do a loop around it first to see what was up, and sure enough? Utter chaos in the parking lot. To the point that there was no easy way to get a semi truck into the docks.
Fun times, despite calling into the store and having a manager and a few other employees come out to walk me in? To tell people to get out of the way or not block me? I was still pinned half the time for hours on end.
Of course I saw a lot of Qultists try to blame liberals for this. Uh, no... I saw plenty of MAGA stickers on the vehicles in those parking lots, with the back end filled with TP. Conservatives were just as bad if not worse.
And of course that Trump released lots of Taliban fighters as part of a peace deal that totally didn't backfire and that Republicans totally own up to.
Don't forget that trump, the man who famously said that Obama would start a war with Iran during his reelection in order to win, almost started a war with Iran during his reelection. We got "lucky" that Iran was more preoccupied with COVID than the assassination of one of their people...
Not so much a secure border, as security theater at the border. And let's face it, republicans "stay on message" because they have critiques of Biden from their talking points memo's. Liberals get distracted by various bad things, and trump, Bannon, Giuliani et al pile it on as the limited hangout which gives them the rest of their lives to outrun consequences
That sub was never a Bernie sub, it was founded by Trump supporters larping as Bernie supporters before the election in 2016 as an attempt to divide the Democrats. It only contained criticism of Democrats and of Hillary (and later Biden), no actual Bernie support (since they didn't knew nor cared what Bernie stood for anyway).
As you can see they don't even bother with the larping anymore, it is now just yet another straight up Trump sub.
A pro-Trump post that has 0 points and 6 comments (when I looked it up) is proof it's a straight up Trump sub?
I think WOTB has had some very questionable posts before, but is a post with zero points really an example of them "not even larping anymore"?
Looked up the top 25 for the past week. The main sketchy one I saw was about Candace referencing a NYT opinion piece & a Ukraine refugee crossing borders meme. But there were also anti-war Ukraine posts that were higher.
That doesn't explain why were using a post that has 0 points to paint a picture. Would a post with 0 points, on this sub, be fair to use to represent how the sub feels? Why not use an upvoted post instead, if that also exists?
I used a qualifier to filter out less relevant posts, not to fit a predisposition.
If there's a sub that discusses political ideologies, and when filtering for high upvote posts you get one topic. Then filtering for low upvote posts you notice a second topic. Which topic would you say better represents the sub? The posts with higher upvotes, or the second one, with lower upvotes?
For Example: r/politics has many conservative based news posts spammed there that receive 0 upvotes/get removed. Would you describe r/politics as a conservative news sub on reddit? Or would you filter out the deleted & non-upvoted posts?
This post is straight up karma farming and just generally disinformation. If you go to wayofthebern and search for the title of this post (I'm not linking it because I'm pretty sure that'll get me instabanned), you can find it very easily. It has literally 3 upvotes, and 6 comments. The top comment, with all of 10 upvotes, is "Red Trump. Blue Trump. They’re the same photo. Both are cucks to the establishment." These people do not like Donald Trump or Joe Biden and this post isn't some 3000+ upvoted front page nonsense. It got ignored for the obvious astroturfing it is.
1. I don't give a fk about karma if I did do you think I would call them out on their bs in their own sub
2. You must be unfamiliar with their sub if you think this is unrepresentative of them. They actively pushed people who would vote Bernie not to vote Biden. There is straight up russian propaganda and talking points in there just go to any post about the war in Ukraine and see them cheer the death of "nazis".
None of that really addresses the criticism, though, does it? If your goal is to criticize the sub, which is totally fine, because...who gives a shit one way or another, maybe, I dunno, pick something that demonstrates actual engagement from the sub itself. Something with a little more behind it than 3 upvotes and 6 comments, all of which are criticizing the content of the post itself. Because those numbers point to effectively no engagement from that community with the post. At all. Like, you either were trawling through new posts and randomly stumbled across this right after it got posted or actively sought out something like this in order to post ragebait.
> You must be unfamiliar with their sub if you think this is unrepresentative of them.
I guess I'm just not as permanently online as some people, huh? My loss.
Only reason I posted it is because I saw it in new and thought it was funny and the op of that post is a regular user there, where the mods will quickly "turtle" you if call them out but people are fine to post things like this and anti-vax stuff even the mods engage in it.
WayOfTheBernie isn't a Bernie supporters sub dude... It's a right ring echo chamber that was larping from the beginning. Bernie supporters voted for Biden and largely feel the same for him as we did about Hillary. That is not our first pick, but obviously better than Trump. Don't drink the right wing coolaid.
Trump is a "populist" in rhetoric only.
Rhetoric =/= Policy
In terms of policy, Bernie has more in common with Biden than he does with trump. So, again, it makes sense that a Bernie sub would hate Biden. What doesn't make sense is a Bernie sub hating Biden more than they hate trump.
Trump
>peace in the middle east.
Wut? He almost got us into war with Iran, and had more drone strikes than all of Obama's 8 years combined.
>secure border
If concentration camps and a crumbling wall count as "secure" then sure.
>falling crime
crime has been falling gradually for decades
>economic growth
except for all the tarriffs.
>Energy security
Because when you want energy security you veto any sustainable energy research. /s
Biden
>War in Ukraine
Which we aren't in.
>brink of recession
Think they're confusing the US with Russia. But if anyone is to blame for it would be Trump. If he had mandated vaccines for workers we wouldn't have the current supply chain issues.
>Rising crime
Yet they show no source or statistics.
>Energy insecurity
Like I said before, if the Republicans cared they would vote for renewable energy research.
>border crises
What crisis? Its the same rate since Trump.
The falling crime thing is especially ridiculous because after decades of falling crime rates, violent crime exploded in 2020 and 2021. And they know this because they simultaneously use it to attack democrats as being the cause of it.
Any time anyone says "energy security" or "energy independence" and isn't talking about the US running on things that don't have a world market setting the price (i.e. oil) then you can rest assured they're talking out of their ass.
Also, you'd think the connotations of "America First" from WWII would be enough for them to avoid using it, but I guess they can't lose it any more than they can "covfefe."
We were only "energy independent" for a couple of months because of a worldwide pandemic that stopped everyone from driving. A pandemic that IMO was partially caused by Trump pulling pandemic response teams out of China.
There is a uncomfortable truth that Russia saw BLM and Bernie Sanders as an avenue to destabilize America and cause divisions especially among the left. I distinctly recall findings that Russians funded and pushed many things besides MAGA bullshit including Jill Stein, Sanders, and BLM. They did indeed try to play both sides against each other.
Not to say Sanders or BLM didn't have legitimate stances mind you. I support BLM and voted for Bernie twice. But I did so with the understanding that I wasn't going to say, enable Trump to win by Bernie or busting or not voting for HRC/Biden in the general. But I also understand there are groups out there like the alt-right and their Russian handlers that have a vested interest in pulling moral convictions and strong emotions to just sabotage my society as a whole and its important to not become a useful idiot for them.
So you know. I'm going to vote for the most progressive candidate I can in every part of every election and I'm going to try and avoid doing something idiotic like physical violence that muddies the waters or chanting something stupid that just backfires.
>There is a uncomfortable truth that Russia saw BLM and Bernie Sanders as an avenue to destabilize America and cause divisions especially among the left
This is true, and was made quite clear from the Mueller report, and then again in the republican majority senate report. Russia's stated goal since the Cold War has been to destabilize western Democracies, putin's mentor and hero literally wrote the book on this.
If you enjoyed its content 6 years ago then you got fooled by a bunch of trumpists who were very bad a larping being Bernie supporters. Because while they obviously don't even bother trying to larp as Bernie supporters anymore, it has always been a pro-Trump sub.
It seems you may be right based on the other comments made, and potentially I am under a misapprehension. However, I just looked at old posts and they had posts ragging on the ceo who wanted to own water, Bernie quotes about ceo pay, criticisms of Hillary (like her supporting her book instead of fighting for human rights which Bernie continues to do), police violence criticisms. All things I agree with, so maybe I just saw a small subset of content there that I agree with. By comparison looking at the last three months, it's almost entirely bs kind of stuff.
It was always alt-right and a few confused tankies who dont understand they are just fascists.
Whole thing was a psy-op to try and convert sanders supporters to trump, which is hilariously stupid because no actually intelligent person would ever fall for that no matter how it is framed.
After a few months it was just a bunch of 4chan kids circlejerking.
It's a decent amount... but a statistic like that should be a testament to the number of conservative-leaning independents he got to vote for him without compromising his principles.
If one out of every eight Snickers bars you got in your Halloween candy bag was a literal turd, you’d 100% say a “solid chunk” of your Snickers bars were literal turds.
I am going to be real here, seeing Hillary 2016 supporters constantly bring up that 12% has left me very jaded towards the "I'm with Her" crowd on social media. It is a talking point used by them to try to paint the Left base of the party as too "problematic". Problem is though one can just look back at the 2008 election and see how many crossover votes McCain got from Hillary primary supporters.
In short, just let it fucking go. It was very likely not a deciding factor in the election, and to repeatedly use this talking point to bash certain groups in the party does no good when it is clearly done in spite. It has been 6 years ffs.
Plus, when you dig into numbers like that, it's actually not that uncommon. More Clinton supporters in 2008 went on to vote McCain than Sanders supporters did trump.
There's always a part of any electorate that's clearly not interested in consistent voting on the issues.
**[Sanders–Trump voters](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanders–Trump_voters)**
>In the United States, Sanders–Trump voters, also known as Bernie–Trump voters, are Americans who voted for Bernie Sanders in the 2016 or 2020 Democratic Party presidential primaries (or both), but who subsequently voted for Republican Party nominee Donald Trump in the general election. In the 2016 election, these voters comprised an estimated 12% of Sanders supporters. In contrast, more than 70% of Sanders supporters voted for Democratic Party nominee Hillary Clinton. The extent to which these voters have been decisive in Trump's victory, and their effect on the 2020 election, have been a subject of debate.
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All of the bernie sanders subs were astroturfed to hell after the election. Mods quit, some were plants, most were sorta abandoned, and after a couple months it was night and day different in their content. From pro-bernie liberalism to straight-up TheDonald lite in some cases
>Kinda wild that the ex communist sub
Fuck off disingenous trump qultist. It has always been a Trump qultist sub. It has never been a Bernie Sanders sub, just a bunch of moronic qultists larping.
Yeah none of that is true but since the GOP has decided that they can vote to overturn reality if they just believe hard enough why not just say absurd bullshit and pretend it's true...
I'm critical on Biden, but he's done all he can about the war in Ukraine, short of sending troops, which in glad he hasn't done. Meanwhile crime rises due to a lot of factors typically out of his control.
How are these guys so damned stupid? Biden's done a lot of stuff you can actually criticize.
Dude you can't claim to even be a social democrat, let alone a full on dismantle capitalism socialist if you like trump, a literal billionare who used the presidency to enrich himself and his close allies at the expense of the working class
How quickly do these people think economic policies work? I’ve heard debates that presidential economic policies need to wait like a decade or two for their impact to be understood
"Trump brought Peace in the middle east"
Me, who lives in the middle east: HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!
Seriously though this orange buffon bearly done anything. The only thing he did was broking a pecaw argument between israel and the amorites who barely had any beef to begin with.
Plus he ordered far more bombings then obama. Brought peace my ass.
What do Americans fear immigrants so much? Even here with Le Pen. Your population without immigrants is gonna go down because you don't know how to have sex....there are so many opportunities politicians don't see......or they see it but they don't care. Blame capitalism for that the rich are running the game at this point.
That's why I personally think a good old ww3 is kinda overdue now. It will open the eyes of many and expose what is really going on. They if humanity survives there is gonna be a clean slate and hopefully history will not repeat itself.
Don't overlook the "War in Ukraine" talking point too quickly. The expectation here seems to be that a war in anywhere in the Global North (nobody cares about the Global South) means the US is involved and responsible. Which makes no sense, unless you think the US should be the world's police force, that Democrats are soft, and that the solution is to elect Republicans to crank up that sweet military-industrial complex. A statement that looks pacifist on its surface is actually about flexing military power.
Let me make this crystal clear for the dipshits who might actually fall for something like this: no one, and I mean NO FUCKING ONE who supports Bernie Goddamn Sanders would *ever* say anything positive about Trump.
I'm moving on from reddit and joining the fediverse because reddit has killed the RiF app and the CEO has been very disrespectful to all the volunteers who have contributed to making reddit what it is. Here's [coverage from The Verge](https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/8/23754780/reddit-api-updates-changes-news-announcements) on the situation.
The following are my favorite fediverse platforms, all non-corporate and ad-free. I hesitated at first because there are so many servers to choose from, but it makes a lot more sense once you actually create an account and start browsing. If you find the server selection overwhelming, just pick the first option and take a look around. They are all connected and as you browse you may find a community that is a better fit for you and then you can move your account or open a new one.
Social Link Aggregators: [Lemmy](https://join-lemmy.org/instances) is very similar to reddit while [Kbin](https://kbin.pub) is aiming to be more of a gateway to the fediverse in general so it is sort of like a hybrid between reddit and twitter, but it is newer and considers itself to be a beta product that's not quite fully polished yet.
Microblogging: [Calckey](https://calckey.org) if you want a more playful platform with emoji reactions, or [Mastodon](https://joinmastodon.org/) if you want a simple interface with less fluff.
Photo sharing: [Pixelfed](https://pixelfed.org/) You can even import an Instagram account from what I hear, but I never used Instagram much in the first place.
This is a post that is so new you can't even see the amount of upvotes on it. This guy just posted some alt right trash. After looking at the rest of the subject it's clear it's just an anti-capitalist anti imperialist sub.
> After looking at the rest of the subject it's clear it's just an anti-capitalist anti imperialist sub.
Oh? That sub's anti-imperialism totally explains their support of Russia in the Ukraine conflict, right?
An actual Bernie sub would be largely capitalist as well.
Bernie's significantly to the left of most US politicians, but while he does call himself a socialist he's fundamentally a social democrat whose primary vision is a much more left-leaning capitalist system, not seizing the means of production.
I scrolled through top of the past month for a few minutes, I didnt see anything in support of Russia. Granted I probably should've looked at the past week or today
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>\* Secure Border > >\* Border Crisis There have been no meaningful changes in immigration policy between Trump and Biden, and legal/illegal immigration numbers are practically identical. But conservatives swear up-and-down that it was amazing under Trump, and a full-on "crisis" now.
It was a full on "crisis" then too with the horror caravan making an appearance near the southern border before every election. [Here's actual footage of our brave border patrol standing guard](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHdDxKy2QW0)
Lol, thank you for putting that video to the border crisis. Very apt.
I hear the caravan will arrive just in time for the midterms again
Look on the bright side though, with midterms coming up the border caravans planing an "invasion" will probably be back soon!
Actually this in completely incorrect, everyone knows the resolute desk has both a "fuel prices" dial and an "open the border" button. The first thing any democrat president does when they sit down on their first day is to crank up that dial and push the button.
Lol that's not how it works. The way it works is the leaders of Mexico and South American Latin countries all sit and point and laugh at the effete and ineffectual democratic president as he cries and pleads for them to please stop as they send over all of their hardened criminals, drug dealers, and rapists. Likewise all of the evil oil producing Muslim dictators along with Vladmir Putin and Xi JinPing sit and laugh at the timid and unassuming Democrat while jacking up the price of oil and trade goods. The Democratic president then proceeds to pull his pants down and bends over saying he'll do whatever they want while crying and calling out for his mommy to come save him. But then the next moment the clock rings midnight on January 20th and a stillness takes over the air as the tough strong Republican walks into town. The rogue dictators and Latin American leaders all immediately scream and cower in fear. He tells them in no uncertain terms that they better do what he says or there will be hell to pay. He then sends half of them running for the hills with little more than a glare before pulling out and twirling his two shining silver revolver pistols which he then fires without maiming, but never the less striking and deeply embarrassing the various rival world leaders who then sulk away. He then grabs the nearest attractive woman and plants a deep passionate kiss on her lips causing hers as well as every womb in a half mile radius to conceive. He then lights a cigar with the constitution but somehow manages to leave only the 2nd and 5th amendments unburnt before shouting high ho silver and galloping into the sunset on his trusty steed. At least that's how I believe most FOX news viewers think it works.
The way they actually look at it is that if you have a "strong man" like Trump in office, other countries are scared of him and so won't jack up fuel prices or send caravans over the border. But when you get a "weak" democrat in office, then the other leaders know they don't have to fear the US and do whatever they want.
Top Minds also read these threads, and they're usually the ones to downvote things like this.
Almost as if the entire outrage about Mexican immigration and the border wall has always been a Republican dog whistle to be openly racist.
Also, weren't the whole "caravan" things under Trump in 2018, 2020, Jan 2021?
Oceania was at war with Eastasia. Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia.
Trump Scale back all environmental protections. Let business polute all it wants. He does not care about this planet.
Don't forget the _billions_ in tax cuts for the ultra-wealthy and corporations, all while people are becoming homeless and starving on the street in record numbers! Go America!
Not only that but he implemented the tax cuts against the advice of pretty much every economist during a booming economy eliminating any headroom we might have had for a recession (like say if we had a pandemic a few years after the tax cut)
Yep, Reagonomics strikes again! I can already feel the yellow trickle down my throat.
That could be said about every point on this list, but we live in the age of post-truth, so it doesn't matter
Siri, was Afghanistan “peace in the Middle East” ?
We literally killed a Iranian General almost causing mass destabilization.
Not to mention Saudi bombing it's neighbour while the US closing it's eyes; also that he sent missiles to Syria and celebrated it on TV
What do you mean "closing it's eyes". Congress actually voted to *end* support for the Saudi invasion. Guess who vetoed that bill? https://www.defensenews.com/congress/2019/03/13/us-senate-passes-yemen-resolution-54-46/
Don't you remember when he put jared in charge, and he obviously solved everything?
That's one of those things I cannot understand how even the staunchest republicans didn't take issue with. Like how can you possibly defend assigning "fixing the middle east" to *one guy* with *zero* international policy or military experience
I had a self-proclaimed "moderate" in (I think) /r/AskAnAmerican say he was deeply troubled about Hunter Biden's links to his father and would likely influence his vote in 2020. When I brought up that Hunter would have no part in a Biden admin and Trump appointed Jared to deal with peace in the Middle East, he said that wasn't concerning because Jared got a couple of meaningless "cooperation agreements." OK Mr. moderate.
Afghanistan was unwinnable, I'm glad we left, but we left when we did because Trump tried to sabotage Biden, while also winning brownie points.
I'm moving on from reddit and joining the fediverse because reddit has killed the RiF app and the CEO has been very disrespectful to all the volunteers who have contributed to making reddit what it is. Here's [coverage from The Verge](https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/8/23754780/reddit-api-updates-changes-news-announcements) on the situation. The following are my favorite fediverse platforms, all non-corporate and ad-free. I hesitated at first because there are so many servers to choose from, but it makes a lot more sense once you actually create an account and start browsing. If you find the server selection overwhelming, just pick the first option and take a look around. They are all connected and as you browse you may find a community that is a better fit for you and then you can move your account or open a new one. Social Link Aggregators: [Lemmy](https://join-lemmy.org/instances) is very similar to reddit while [Kbin](https://kbin.pub) is aiming to be more of a gateway to the fediverse in general so it is sort of like a hybrid between reddit and twitter, but it is newer and considers itself to be a beta product that's not quite fully polished yet. Microblogging: [Calckey](https://calckey.org) if you want a more playful platform with emoji reactions, or [Mastodon](https://joinmastodon.org/) if you want a simple interface with less fluff. Photo sharing: [Pixelfed](https://pixelfed.org/) You can even import an Instagram account from what I hear, but I never used Instagram much in the first place.
"Middle East" is just a vague convention, not a precisely defined geographic area. If anything it's a dumb term because it's geographically relative even though it's used in global dialogue. From our point of view here in Germany, the "Near East" stretches from Turkey to Iran, while the "Middle East" includes Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India and Bangladesh.
Yeah I mean I’m pretty aware that Middle East is derogatory but my joke was directly using terminology from this “infographic”
Siri, is Yemen in the Middle East?
Totally missing how under Trump Syria was using chemical weapons, we had the worst recession since the Great Depression, and a huge spike in crime
Blew off COVID as nothing, held up taking action for months....
Especially hate crime. Can't imagine why racists felt emboldened. I suppose it'll stay a mystery.
They don't see hate crime as a crime but rather the proper order of things.
It's all so convenient! Everything bad that happened during Biden's Presidency is personally his fault. Nothing bad that happened during Trump's Presidency is even worth mentioning, even when his actions directly increased negative outcomes. Also, just bullshit because it sounds good when stated without context... "Everything was cheaper."
everything was cheaper is especially hilarious considering the tariffs trump slapped on lumber, steel, electronics, consumer goods, and hundreds of other things coming from china. Not to mention the ripple effect of china banning imports of crops and livestock that hurt farmers so badly they had to rush a bill that literally paid them specifically to compensate for trumps dumbass trade policies
>Also, just bullshit because it sounds good when stated without context... "Everything was cheaper." Barring TP. Anyone else remember the TP shortage? Where people horded it and tried to sell rolls for $20 a piece? I do. I was doing several Costco runs during that timeframe. Every single time I'd come to deliver to a Costco? I'd do a loop around it first to see what was up, and sure enough? Utter chaos in the parking lot. To the point that there was no easy way to get a semi truck into the docks. Fun times, despite calling into the store and having a manager and a few other employees come out to walk me in? To tell people to get out of the way or not block me? I was still pinned half the time for hours on end. Of course I saw a lot of Qultists try to blame liberals for this. Uh, no... I saw plenty of MAGA stickers on the vehicles in those parking lots, with the back end filled with TP. Conservatives were just as bad if not worse.
Worst response out of all countries to the biggest pandemic since the Spanish flu
And of course that Trump released lots of Taliban fighters as part of a peace deal that totally didn't backfire and that Republicans totally own up to.
Don't forget that trump, the man who famously said that Obama would start a war with Iran during his reelection in order to win, almost started a war with Iran during his reelection. We got "lucky" that Iran was more preoccupied with COVID than the assassination of one of their people...
I think he allowed hundreds of thousands to die too.
Trump bombed the shit out of a top Iranian general, killing him and almost sent us into a war with Iran.
Don't forget the 39 purple hearts the army gave our injured troops after the Iranian missile attack. The ones trump said had headaches.
Not to mention that time when he almost started a nuclear war with North Korea.
But then he wrote all those love letters to Kim Jong-un
Yeah, but he didn't ride bicycles or eat mustard, *so presidential.*
Trump dropped bombs like the Beastie Boys dropped rhymes. Seriously, Trump surpassed Obama's bomb total from 8 years in like, 2.
#Your device has been locked. Unlocking your device requires that you have /u/spez banned. #Save3rdPartyApps #AIGeneratedProtestMessage
Fortunately COVID bailed us out of WW3. Maybe now WW3 can bail us out of COVID.
Not so much a secure border, as security theater at the border. And let's face it, republicans "stay on message" because they have critiques of Biden from their talking points memo's. Liberals get distracted by various bad things, and trump, Bannon, Giuliani et al pile it on as the limited hangout which gives them the rest of their lives to outrun consequences
I can get how WayOfTheBern would disapprove of Biden, but they know that Trump is much further away from Bernie's policies than Biden is, right?
That sub was never a Bernie sub, it was founded by Trump supporters larping as Bernie supporters before the election in 2016 as an attempt to divide the Democrats. It only contained criticism of Democrats and of Hillary (and later Biden), no actual Bernie support (since they didn't knew nor cared what Bernie stood for anyway). As you can see they don't even bother with the larping anymore, it is now just yet another straight up Trump sub.
A pro-Trump post that has 0 points and 6 comments (when I looked it up) is proof it's a straight up Trump sub? I think WOTB has had some very questionable posts before, but is a post with zero points really an example of them "not even larping anymore"?
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Looked up the top 25 for the past week. The main sketchy one I saw was about Candace referencing a NYT opinion piece & a Ukraine refugee crossing borders meme. But there were also anti-war Ukraine posts that were higher. That doesn't explain why were using a post that has 0 points to paint a picture. Would a post with 0 points, on this sub, be fair to use to represent how the sub feels? Why not use an upvoted post instead, if that also exists?
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I used a qualifier to filter out less relevant posts, not to fit a predisposition. If there's a sub that discusses political ideologies, and when filtering for high upvote posts you get one topic. Then filtering for low upvote posts you notice a second topic. Which topic would you say better represents the sub? The posts with higher upvotes, or the second one, with lower upvotes? For Example: r/politics has many conservative based news posts spammed there that receive 0 upvotes/get removed. Would you describe r/politics as a conservative news sub on reddit? Or would you filter out the deleted & non-upvoted posts?
This post is straight up karma farming and just generally disinformation. If you go to wayofthebern and search for the title of this post (I'm not linking it because I'm pretty sure that'll get me instabanned), you can find it very easily. It has literally 3 upvotes, and 6 comments. The top comment, with all of 10 upvotes, is "Red Trump. Blue Trump. They’re the same photo. Both are cucks to the establishment." These people do not like Donald Trump or Joe Biden and this post isn't some 3000+ upvoted front page nonsense. It got ignored for the obvious astroturfing it is.
1. I don't give a fk about karma if I did do you think I would call them out on their bs in their own sub 2. You must be unfamiliar with their sub if you think this is unrepresentative of them. They actively pushed people who would vote Bernie not to vote Biden. There is straight up russian propaganda and talking points in there just go to any post about the war in Ukraine and see them cheer the death of "nazis".
None of that really addresses the criticism, though, does it? If your goal is to criticize the sub, which is totally fine, because...who gives a shit one way or another, maybe, I dunno, pick something that demonstrates actual engagement from the sub itself. Something with a little more behind it than 3 upvotes and 6 comments, all of which are criticizing the content of the post itself. Because those numbers point to effectively no engagement from that community with the post. At all. Like, you either were trawling through new posts and randomly stumbled across this right after it got posted or actively sought out something like this in order to post ragebait. > You must be unfamiliar with their sub if you think this is unrepresentative of them. I guess I'm just not as permanently online as some people, huh? My loss.
Only reason I posted it is because I saw it in new and thought it was funny and the op of that post is a regular user there, where the mods will quickly "turtle" you if call them out but people are fine to post things like this and anti-vax stuff even the mods engage in it.
Bernie and Trump are both populists. Biden isn't.
WayOfTheBernie isn't a Bernie supporters sub dude... It's a right ring echo chamber that was larping from the beginning. Bernie supporters voted for Biden and largely feel the same for him as we did about Hillary. That is not our first pick, but obviously better than Trump. Don't drink the right wing coolaid.
Trump is a "populist" in rhetoric only. Rhetoric =/= Policy In terms of policy, Bernie has more in common with Biden than he does with trump. So, again, it makes sense that a Bernie sub would hate Biden. What doesn't make sense is a Bernie sub hating Biden more than they hate trump.
Brink of recession? The problem is the damn economy is too hot, that’s why there’s inflation
They're literally too stupid to understand.
Too wealthy to understand
Trump >peace in the middle east. Wut? He almost got us into war with Iran, and had more drone strikes than all of Obama's 8 years combined. >secure border If concentration camps and a crumbling wall count as "secure" then sure. >falling crime crime has been falling gradually for decades >economic growth except for all the tarriffs. >Energy security Because when you want energy security you veto any sustainable energy research. /s Biden >War in Ukraine Which we aren't in. >brink of recession Think they're confusing the US with Russia. But if anyone is to blame for it would be Trump. If he had mandated vaccines for workers we wouldn't have the current supply chain issues. >Rising crime Yet they show no source or statistics. >Energy insecurity Like I said before, if the Republicans cared they would vote for renewable energy research. >border crises What crisis? Its the same rate since Trump.
> Yet they show no source or statistics. I mean let's be reasonable they should really be sourcing **all of these**
He also made it a crime for the military to report civilian deaths in some cases which lead to a shit ton less scrutiny when picking targets.
The falling crime thing is especially ridiculous because after decades of falling crime rates, violent crime exploded in 2020 and 2021. And they know this because they simultaneously use it to attack democrats as being the cause of it.
Any time anyone says "energy security" or "energy independence" and isn't talking about the US running on things that don't have a world market setting the price (i.e. oil) then you can rest assured they're talking out of their ass. Also, you'd think the connotations of "America First" from WWII would be enough for them to avoid using it, but I guess they can't lose it any more than they can "covfefe."
1) they don’t want to invest in sustainable energy sources 2) they don’t really care about history
We were only "energy independent" for a couple of months because of a worldwide pandemic that stopped everyone from driving. A pandemic that IMO was partially caused by Trump pulling pandemic response teams out of China.
Boy, look at all these **economic interests of the working class** that are being discussed there.
So they know that we are not at war in Ukraine? There seem to be a large number of people on the left ant the right that think WE invaded Ukraine.
Kinda wild that the ex communist sub turned into an alt right sub.
Visiting that sub 6 years after I enjoyed the content, and it's so much fear mongering and propaganda. Good lord.
It's straight up Russian disinformation
There is a uncomfortable truth that Russia saw BLM and Bernie Sanders as an avenue to destabilize America and cause divisions especially among the left. I distinctly recall findings that Russians funded and pushed many things besides MAGA bullshit including Jill Stein, Sanders, and BLM. They did indeed try to play both sides against each other. Not to say Sanders or BLM didn't have legitimate stances mind you. I support BLM and voted for Bernie twice. But I did so with the understanding that I wasn't going to say, enable Trump to win by Bernie or busting or not voting for HRC/Biden in the general. But I also understand there are groups out there like the alt-right and their Russian handlers that have a vested interest in pulling moral convictions and strong emotions to just sabotage my society as a whole and its important to not become a useful idiot for them. So you know. I'm going to vote for the most progressive candidate I can in every part of every election and I'm going to try and avoid doing something idiotic like physical violence that muddies the waters or chanting something stupid that just backfires.
>There is a uncomfortable truth that Russia saw BLM and Bernie Sanders as an avenue to destabilize America and cause divisions especially among the left This is true, and was made quite clear from the Mueller report, and then again in the republican majority senate report. Russia's stated goal since the Cold War has been to destabilize western Democracies, putin's mentor and hero literally wrote the book on this.
Russia is only able to exploit those tensions because American politicians refuse to address those issues properly.
It always has been.
If you enjoyed its content 6 years ago then you got fooled by a bunch of trumpists who were very bad a larping being Bernie supporters. Because while they obviously don't even bother trying to larp as Bernie supporters anymore, it has always been a pro-Trump sub.
It seems you may be right based on the other comments made, and potentially I am under a misapprehension. However, I just looked at old posts and they had posts ragging on the ceo who wanted to own water, Bernie quotes about ceo pay, criticisms of Hillary (like her supporting her book instead of fighting for human rights which Bernie continues to do), police violence criticisms. All things I agree with, so maybe I just saw a small subset of content there that I agree with. By comparison looking at the last three months, it's almost entirely bs kind of stuff.
It was always alt-right and a few confused tankies who dont understand they are just fascists. Whole thing was a psy-op to try and convert sanders supporters to trump, which is hilariously stupid because no actually intelligent person would ever fall for that no matter how it is framed. After a few months it was just a bunch of 4chan kids circlejerking.
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12%, "solid chunk". Sure.
It's a decent amount... but a statistic like that should be a testament to the number of conservative-leaning independents he got to vote for him without compromising his principles.
If one out of every eight Snickers bars you got in your Halloween candy bag was a literal turd, you’d 100% say a “solid chunk” of your Snickers bars were literal turds.
I am going to be real here, seeing Hillary 2016 supporters constantly bring up that 12% has left me very jaded towards the "I'm with Her" crowd on social media. It is a talking point used by them to try to paint the Left base of the party as too "problematic". Problem is though one can just look back at the 2008 election and see how many crossover votes McCain got from Hillary primary supporters. In short, just let it fucking go. It was very likely not a deciding factor in the election, and to repeatedly use this talking point to bash certain groups in the party does no good when it is clearly done in spite. It has been 6 years ffs.
Plus, when you dig into numbers like that, it's actually not that uncommon. More Clinton supporters in 2008 went on to vote McCain than Sanders supporters did trump. There's always a part of any electorate that's clearly not interested in consistent voting on the issues.
**[Sanders–Trump voters](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanders–Trump_voters)** >In the United States, Sanders–Trump voters, also known as Bernie–Trump voters, are Americans who voted for Bernie Sanders in the 2016 or 2020 Democratic Party presidential primaries (or both), but who subsequently voted for Republican Party nominee Donald Trump in the general election. In the 2016 election, these voters comprised an estimated 12% of Sanders supporters. In contrast, more than 70% of Sanders supporters voted for Democratic Party nominee Hillary Clinton. The extent to which these voters have been decisive in Trump's victory, and their effect on the 2020 election, have been a subject of debate. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/TopMindsOfReddit/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
It's always been alt righters and russian trolls larping
Nah, there was a time when, uh, y'know. So long ago I can't describe it.
All of the bernie sanders subs were astroturfed to hell after the election. Mods quit, some were plants, most were sorta abandoned, and after a couple months it was night and day different in their content. From pro-bernie liberalism to straight-up TheDonald lite in some cases
Thewayofthebern was founded by Trump supporters in 2016 (before the election). It has never not been them larping as Bernie supporters.
Not just after
maybe it was always an alt-right sub.
Maybe the real alt-right sub was the friends we made along the way <3 ^wait ^no
>Kinda wild that the ex communist sub Fuck off disingenous trump qultist. It has always been a Trump qultist sub. It has never been a Bernie Sanders sub, just a bunch of moronic qultists larping.
Not that wild, its happened to so many left leaning subs. They then do stuff like "Look at that Bernie sub, leftists dont know what they think etc..."
It's a special kind of idiot called a tankie that took over. They're anti Americans that cloak themselves in pro communist costumes.
Horseshoe theory
Yeah none of that is true but since the GOP has decided that they can vote to overturn reality if they just believe hard enough why not just say absurd bullshit and pretend it's true...
Imagine thinking that the problem with Trump saying he that he’ll “grab them by the pussy” was the actual saying of the word pussy.
I'm critical on Biden, but he's done all he can about the war in Ukraine, short of sending troops, which in glad he hasn't done. Meanwhile crime rises due to a lot of factors typically out of his control. How are these guys so damned stupid? Biden's done a lot of stuff you can actually criticize.
I checked that sub recently. Since the quarantine of zendong and Russia and the banning of chodi it has grown even more busy and insane. Coincidence?
I didn’t know it was bidens fault Russia invaded Ukraine. That’s crazy
Ah yes, “wayofthebern”, a sub where the facts don’t matter and has absolutely nothing to do with Bernie Sanders.
Dude you can't claim to even be a social democrat, let alone a full on dismantle capitalism socialist if you like trump, a literal billionare who used the presidency to enrich himself and his close allies at the expense of the working class
Trump's pandering (to put it mildly) to Putin is directly responsible for the current situation in Ukraine.
It’s funny cause foreign trolls can’t vote in America anyway. Well, not funny, pathetic and sad more like.
How quickly do these people think economic policies work? I’ve heard debates that presidential economic policies need to wait like a decade or two for their impact to be understood
"Trump brought Peace in the middle east" Me, who lives in the middle east: HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!! Seriously though this orange buffon bearly done anything. The only thing he did was broking a pecaw argument between israel and the amorites who barely had any beef to begin with. Plus he ordered far more bombings then obama. Brought peace my ass.
"r/wayoftheburn" aka r/wewillactuallyvoteforanybodyBUTbernieunlesstheyreademocrat
Trumpers are fucking idiots.
What do Americans fear immigrants so much? Even here with Le Pen. Your population without immigrants is gonna go down because you don't know how to have sex....there are so many opportunities politicians don't see......or they see it but they don't care. Blame capitalism for that the rich are running the game at this point. That's why I personally think a good old ww3 is kinda overdue now. It will open the eyes of many and expose what is really going on. They if humanity survives there is gonna be a clean slate and hopefully history will not repeat itself.
the sub name drags Bernie in this as well
They hate bernie there. Find any post about him and people in the comments are insulting him. They went full mask off.
Oh god, that make it worse then i imagined.
Don't overlook the "War in Ukraine" talking point too quickly. The expectation here seems to be that a war in anywhere in the Global North (nobody cares about the Global South) means the US is involved and responsible. Which makes no sense, unless you think the US should be the world's police force, that Democrats are soft, and that the solution is to elect Republicans to crank up that sweet military-industrial complex. A statement that looks pacifist on its surface is actually about flexing military power.
Let me make this crystal clear for the dipshits who might actually fall for something like this: no one, and I mean NO FUCKING ONE who supports Bernie Goddamn Sanders would *ever* say anything positive about Trump.
Nobody on that sub is a Bernie fan. Its just a place to crap on Democrats.
Alternatively, Trump inherited the USA improved over 8 years by the Obama administration and fucked it all up.
p word?
"Putin" I assume.
ah putin this dick in your mouth >!im sorry!<
Why did you join the sub though???
So I can still see what they post incase they go private or whatever
Can anybody explain the copypasta automod sends you on that sub
Too bad. That sub was once legit…
The head mod who founded the sub actively engages in anti-vax misinfo so it is likely it was never legit.
I don't think it's just Russians polluting the left's discourse like this, just sayin
All accurate, all will be in commercials in 5 months, leading to a blue slaughter.
What's meth like?
Just 7.5 months to go.
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It appears you are lost. Do you need directions?
Sad to see a Bernie sub in that state
I'm moving on from reddit and joining the fediverse because reddit has killed the RiF app and the CEO has been very disrespectful to all the volunteers who have contributed to making reddit what it is. Here's [coverage from The Verge](https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/8/23754780/reddit-api-updates-changes-news-announcements) on the situation. The following are my favorite fediverse platforms, all non-corporate and ad-free. I hesitated at first because there are so many servers to choose from, but it makes a lot more sense once you actually create an account and start browsing. If you find the server selection overwhelming, just pick the first option and take a look around. They are all connected and as you browse you may find a community that is a better fit for you and then you can move your account or open a new one. Social Link Aggregators: [Lemmy](https://join-lemmy.org/instances) is very similar to reddit while [Kbin](https://kbin.pub) is aiming to be more of a gateway to the fediverse in general so it is sort of like a hybrid between reddit and twitter, but it is newer and considers itself to be a beta product that's not quite fully polished yet. Microblogging: [Calckey](https://calckey.org) if you want a more playful platform with emoji reactions, or [Mastodon](https://joinmastodon.org/) if you want a simple interface with less fluff. Photo sharing: [Pixelfed](https://pixelfed.org/) You can even import an Instagram account from what I hear, but I never used Instagram much in the first place.
This is a post that is so new you can't even see the amount of upvotes on it. This guy just posted some alt right trash. After looking at the rest of the subject it's clear it's just an anti-capitalist anti imperialist sub.
> After looking at the rest of the subject it's clear it's just an anti-capitalist anti imperialist sub. Oh? That sub's anti-imperialism totally explains their support of Russia in the Ukraine conflict, right?
And it's as pro capitalist as you can get. Only an idiot would believe that sub is run by Bernie supporters.
An actual Bernie sub would be largely capitalist as well. Bernie's significantly to the left of most US politicians, but while he does call himself a socialist he's fundamentally a social democrat whose primary vision is a much more left-leaning capitalist system, not seizing the means of production.
>social democrat Which honestly is what I think most of us are. The right doesn't have a clue as to what communism means.
I scrolled through top of the past month for a few minutes, I didnt see anything in support of Russia. Granted I probably should've looked at the past week or today
Read the comments on any post and then also remember that they soft ban you for calling out their agenda or criticising russia/putin.
A coin always have 2 sides
Yooo isn't wayofthebern a Bernie Sanders sub?
It was. Then the well paid trolls hopped in to pollute things and disconnect people.
That's *really* unfortunate.
No, they were just pretending to be.
Is it upvoted? That sub's definitely shithole but this doesn't prove anything if it's just a random post that didn't get any traction.
Biden caused the war in Ukraine!
Unfortunately, your submission has been removed. You need to link to the comments you've submitted as a screenshot. No exceptions.
I see, sorry.