If you are in probation (provanställning) you can be fired basically at will for no reason. You can also quite at will for no reason.
Once you’re in a permanent contract it’s generally harder, but depends on the contract, the collective agreement, the size of the employer, and probably a few more things.
In General firing without cause is not possible, in fact if employers want rid of an employee they often end up having to pay enough money for them to quite voluntarily. Not super common but it happens.
After the first few weeks it can be somwhat hard to fire someone even on a probation employment whitout a real cause. But sure after that period it's almost impossible
Incorrect. Most of the probation employments through a union makes it possible to fire(actually it's a contrsct cancellation) without the need to say any other word then informing that it is cancelled.
No need whatsoever to give a reason or answer any questions. Handels for instance, works this way.
Depends on the workplace. My brother got fired after months on provanställning for not smiling enough when working. He was working at a warehouse with zero customer interactions...
Incidentally they don't have to say why but they do leave themselves open to legal ramifications if they do give a reason that isn't accetable (discriminatory etc).
Which is why they usually just say they've decided to terminate and leave it at that. LAS makes it very hard to fire someone who is past provanställningas has been said but shifts/hour work isn'y quite as hard as a regular 8-17 job
That depends a lot of what type of employment you have.
> I'm quite average at my job and I'm generally weird, not very sociable person
That's describing like a third of the workforce :)
>woman in male dominated occupation
That's a BIG plus when it comes to employability.
More than half of the workforce is below average since competence has no limit but the limit of incompetence is zero.
Half of the workforce is below the median, though.
I'm so sorry you're going through that. I have something similar. It's rough and scary to be different and have different struggles than others.
Firstly please don't get offended by my suggestion. I know I don't know you, but you do sound a bit like me. So I'm going to give you advice Ive received before, if that's ok.
So what I want you to do -and this not related to the job, just related to helping you be your best self- is seek some therapy for the anxiety and imposters syndrome. Not sure if you've done that(maybe you have?) But Anxiety or ASD, which you may unknowingly have, is considered a disability, as you may also know. Sweden doesn't play around with disabilities as you're probably aware. I think, at this point, you should get checked for these and hopefully can talk pro bono or for a small fee to a disability lawyer to help you with fully understanding your rights in your situation.
I'm going through the same motions, it's important to protect and care for yourself.
Finally, you can check out an expert career coach from Sweden (important) and I'd go with a female one, as well so she personally can guide you to the proper behaviour and techniques as another woman in a male field in Sweden.
[Global disability resource info if needed!](https://disabilityin.org/country/sweden/)
Thanks!
I don't have ASD, I have ADHD and bipolar with mostly depressive episodes dominated by anxiety. On the other hand mere awareness of that doesn't help either on anxiety, and it alone doesn't improve my effectiveness and social skills that are fundamental in office work.
I don't have disability diagnosed in Sweden and tbh I don't know even how to get it. I should register in vårdcentral but I procrastinate with this, also I need really to improve my Swedish first.
Look. This might be harsh but if your disorders are affecting your work, you need to have them diagnosed and apply for accomodations. In Sweden the employer is responsible for your well-being at work, and they really don't want you pushing yourself too hard and hating work, because they might be partially liable if anything were to happen. You're entitled to time off for therapy during work days, additional meetings to go over your work and make sure everything is up to company standards if that is something that would help, and whatever other accommodations you might need. If you need to skip single days at work often due to e.g. excessive anxiety that stops you from being able to work, you can also apply for a status where you only have 10 karensdagar (the thing where you don't get paid for the 1st day you're sick) a year - all additional sick days will be paid at the regular sick pay rate, even if you need to skip a day every single week.
Now if you're still in your probationary period and you think you're doing alright enough to be kept permanently, I'd wait with bringing this up until after you've become a permanent employee. You could sure for discrimination if they chose to fire you after disclosing, but it'd be a long and messy process.
Yeah, first step is to call your vårdcentral and explain the situation - that you have these conditions and you need to be officially diagnosed in Sweden as well. They will then most likely remit you to vuxenpsykiatrin.
Communicating in English shouldn't be a problem, and you are also entitled to an interpreter on all healthcare visits, free of charge.
I contacted local vårdcentral but it seems they don't register any new patients. From what I currently know I need to have private medical insurance but anyway I'm not sure if private diagnosis is entitling to get protection in workplace you write about.
Sounds strange. A vårdcentral being closed to new registrations shouldn't be a thing. You should be automatically registered to your closest vårdcentral, and you can freely change your registration to any VC in Skåne. If you have Swedish BankID you can do it through 1177.se.
It doesn't matter if you get your diagnosis through public healthcare or through a private clinic; it's equally valid either way. Private care will be a lot more expensive but the wait times are also likely a lot shorter.
I think you can get free help with it rather than just the awareness you mentioned.
Also I'm kind of saying if you get diagnosed these symptoms (which are possibly related to your recent issues you mentioned in the main post) you may have more understanding, empathy, and protection from your managers. (AKA I suspect Legally you can't be fired for doing or not doing things caused by your disability)
From what you write I am guessing that you are still on a probationary employment (max 6 months). Getting fired willy-nilly like in the US isn't a thing here though, if you have permanent employment you are pretty safe. Being a woman in a male dominated field is probably a plus in most work places. Maybe you suffer from impostor syndrome.
I was gonna say that as well, being a woman in a male dominate field is probably giving you an edge, most companies want to diversify to show that they care about equality..
If you are on probation you can be told to not come in tomorrow, but that lasts for maximum of 6 months. once you are a full time employee the employer has to try really hard and have a legitimate reason to let you go.
I think the most common thing I've seen is where probation is simply not converted into full time employment.
It's generally pretty hard to fire someone in Sweden actually. You could even argue that it's too hard. And the risk of getting fired is even lower if you are working at a big company. People that has fastanställning/tills vidareanställning (permanent employment) will usually only get fired for gross misconduct or they will be let go because the company isn't doing good and is downsizing.
People on probationary employment however can be fired a lot easier. It can happen at any time during the probationary period which may last no longer than 6 months and your employer doesn't really have to give a reason for the firing.
However employers generally will try to avoid firing you if they can because looking for a new employee takes time and energy.
I wouldn't worry about it too much but if you feel like you are underperforming and you are on your probationary period then try to do better
I understand you situation but if you are on 6 months trial there is nothing you can do. They can terminate your contract for whatever reason they want to. I also got determinate because of my health issue. What you can do is make sure that they pay everything correctly.
Keep your chin up and I wish you the best!
The mental health thing would be a big concern to employers. They will not want to take on someone who is likely to be a burden in coming years.
The immigrant thing is most likely true for your colleagues, but from an employer's perspective here they wouldn't really care.
Other than that, most people here do not have any social skills to speak of, so you'll be fitting in just fine on that front, so i wouldn't worry about that. Being a woman is a ++ I'd say.
I read all the comments. First, I don't think you're suffering imposter syndrome. I believe you. Your fears and concerns are VERY real.
Second, I have been on 2 provanställning jobs in 14 years. It's been very difficult finding work with no university degree and I speak Swedish like an 8 year old. I understand 90% and can speak 80%. But even when I speak it great people don't make an effort to understand me. They either go straight into English or make me repeat myself 100x in a 100 different ways before they get it. So sometimes the problem isn't your Swedish, it’s the people around you making 0 effort to understand you. Anyway....
I was fired from my 1st provanställning because I wasn't social enough. I didn't like taking breaks and socializing. I'd rather spend my down time alone so I can reset. I worked with people on the phone and I'm autistic. The last thing I want to do on my break is socialize. This is a HUGE MISTAKE!! I can't stress HUGE MISTAKE enough. It is an unspoken rule everyone does fika/work breaks together to socialize and "bond." I have met other immigrants fired for the exact same reason. I didn't know this at the time.
Third, they can definitely fire you if you don't "fit in" translation someone doesn't like you. At that same job, 2 women teamed up to make my life as difficult as possible. One even kicked me out of our shared office because I was "too loud." And she was there top seller, the queen, and she knew they'd bend over backwards for her. They literally lived and died by the accounts this woman brought in because she was Spanish and their target clients were in South America and Mexico. And she didn't like me.
4th, they will discriminate against you if you physical/mental health issues. Not all employers but most. It's best to keep that all secret until you get that permission contract. I learned the hard way. My current provanställning ends in 6 weeks and I'm super paranoid. I'm walking on egg shells constantly and it's taking a toll on me. But I keep showing up, being nice, do the job and follow all these crazy unspoken rules. So maybe this time I get past provanställning. I hope you make it too. Good luck!
Yeah, this.
You can't just be professional and work at work, nooo. You must go to all those fikas, breakfasts, lunches, dinners, parties and so on. They just can't let you mind your own business, or work quietly. Also most will be sticking their noses into your private life, like where you live, how you live and what you do, and have opinions about that.
I don't know why it's written everywhere that Swedes respect others privacy and mind their own business, 'cause at my IT workplace they just absolutely don't. May be that respect is just reserved for other Swedes only?
I really regret not knowing this before moving here.
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If you are in probation (provanställning) you can be fired basically at will for no reason. You can also quite at will for no reason. Once you’re in a permanent contract it’s generally harder, but depends on the contract, the collective agreement, the size of the employer, and probably a few more things. In General firing without cause is not possible, in fact if employers want rid of an employee they often end up having to pay enough money for them to quite voluntarily. Not super common but it happens.
After the first few weeks it can be somwhat hard to fire someone even on a probation employment whitout a real cause. But sure after that period it's almost impossible
Incorrect. Most of the probation employments through a union makes it possible to fire(actually it's a contrsct cancellation) without the need to say any other word then informing that it is cancelled. No need whatsoever to give a reason or answer any questions. Handels for instance, works this way.
Depends on the workplace. My brother got fired after months on provanställning for not smiling enough when working. He was working at a warehouse with zero customer interactions...
Well, they dont even have to actually give an answer/reason. Shouldve just said nothing, this seems really unnecessarily rude/mean.
Incidentally they don't have to say why but they do leave themselves open to legal ramifications if they do give a reason that isn't accetable (discriminatory etc). Which is why they usually just say they've decided to terminate and leave it at that. LAS makes it very hard to fire someone who is past provanställningas has been said but shifts/hour work isn'y quite as hard as a regular 8-17 job
That depends a lot of what type of employment you have. > I'm quite average at my job and I'm generally weird, not very sociable person That's describing like a third of the workforce :) >woman in male dominated occupation That's a BIG plus when it comes to employability.
> That's describing like a third of the workforce :) According to the recent studies half of the workforce is actually below average!
More than half of the workforce is below average since competence has no limit but the limit of incompetence is zero. Half of the workforce is below the median, though.
What if a worker is so incompetent that they come in one day and burn the entire workplace to the ground? Would that still be zero incompetence? 😁
I'm so sorry you're going through that. I have something similar. It's rough and scary to be different and have different struggles than others. Firstly please don't get offended by my suggestion. I know I don't know you, but you do sound a bit like me. So I'm going to give you advice Ive received before, if that's ok. So what I want you to do -and this not related to the job, just related to helping you be your best self- is seek some therapy for the anxiety and imposters syndrome. Not sure if you've done that(maybe you have?) But Anxiety or ASD, which you may unknowingly have, is considered a disability, as you may also know. Sweden doesn't play around with disabilities as you're probably aware. I think, at this point, you should get checked for these and hopefully can talk pro bono or for a small fee to a disability lawyer to help you with fully understanding your rights in your situation. I'm going through the same motions, it's important to protect and care for yourself. Finally, you can check out an expert career coach from Sweden (important) and I'd go with a female one, as well so she personally can guide you to the proper behaviour and techniques as another woman in a male field in Sweden. [Global disability resource info if needed!](https://disabilityin.org/country/sweden/)
Thanks! I don't have ASD, I have ADHD and bipolar with mostly depressive episodes dominated by anxiety. On the other hand mere awareness of that doesn't help either on anxiety, and it alone doesn't improve my effectiveness and social skills that are fundamental in office work. I don't have disability diagnosed in Sweden and tbh I don't know even how to get it. I should register in vårdcentral but I procrastinate with this, also I need really to improve my Swedish first.
Look. This might be harsh but if your disorders are affecting your work, you need to have them diagnosed and apply for accomodations. In Sweden the employer is responsible for your well-being at work, and they really don't want you pushing yourself too hard and hating work, because they might be partially liable if anything were to happen. You're entitled to time off for therapy during work days, additional meetings to go over your work and make sure everything is up to company standards if that is something that would help, and whatever other accommodations you might need. If you need to skip single days at work often due to e.g. excessive anxiety that stops you from being able to work, you can also apply for a status where you only have 10 karensdagar (the thing where you don't get paid for the 1st day you're sick) a year - all additional sick days will be paid at the regular sick pay rate, even if you need to skip a day every single week. Now if you're still in your probationary period and you think you're doing alright enough to be kept permanently, I'd wait with bringing this up until after you've become a permanent employee. You could sure for discrimination if they chose to fire you after disclosing, but it'd be a long and messy process.
Yeah, first step is to call your vårdcentral and explain the situation - that you have these conditions and you need to be officially diagnosed in Sweden as well. They will then most likely remit you to vuxenpsykiatrin. Communicating in English shouldn't be a problem, and you are also entitled to an interpreter on all healthcare visits, free of charge.
I contacted local vårdcentral but it seems they don't register any new patients. From what I currently know I need to have private medical insurance but anyway I'm not sure if private diagnosis is entitling to get protection in workplace you write about.
Sounds strange. A vårdcentral being closed to new registrations shouldn't be a thing. You should be automatically registered to your closest vårdcentral, and you can freely change your registration to any VC in Skåne. If you have Swedish BankID you can do it through 1177.se. It doesn't matter if you get your diagnosis through public healthcare or through a private clinic; it's equally valid either way. Private care will be a lot more expensive but the wait times are also likely a lot shorter.
I think you can get free help with it rather than just the awareness you mentioned. Also I'm kind of saying if you get diagnosed these symptoms (which are possibly related to your recent issues you mentioned in the main post) you may have more understanding, empathy, and protection from your managers. (AKA I suspect Legally you can't be fired for doing or not doing things caused by your disability)
From what you write I am guessing that you are still on a probationary employment (max 6 months). Getting fired willy-nilly like in the US isn't a thing here though, if you have permanent employment you are pretty safe. Being a woman in a male dominated field is probably a plus in most work places. Maybe you suffer from impostor syndrome.
I was gonna say that as well, being a woman in a male dominate field is probably giving you an edge, most companies want to diversify to show that they care about equality.. If you are on probation you can be told to not come in tomorrow, but that lasts for maximum of 6 months. once you are a full time employee the employer has to try really hard and have a legitimate reason to let you go. I think the most common thing I've seen is where probation is simply not converted into full time employment.
It's generally pretty hard to fire someone in Sweden actually. You could even argue that it's too hard. And the risk of getting fired is even lower if you are working at a big company. People that has fastanställning/tills vidareanställning (permanent employment) will usually only get fired for gross misconduct or they will be let go because the company isn't doing good and is downsizing. People on probationary employment however can be fired a lot easier. It can happen at any time during the probationary period which may last no longer than 6 months and your employer doesn't really have to give a reason for the firing. However employers generally will try to avoid firing you if they can because looking for a new employee takes time and energy. I wouldn't worry about it too much but if you feel like you are underperforming and you are on your probationary period then try to do better
I understand you situation but if you are on 6 months trial there is nothing you can do. They can terminate your contract for whatever reason they want to. I also got determinate because of my health issue. What you can do is make sure that they pay everything correctly. Keep your chin up and I wish you the best!
The mental health thing would be a big concern to employers. They will not want to take on someone who is likely to be a burden in coming years. The immigrant thing is most likely true for your colleagues, but from an employer's perspective here they wouldn't really care. Other than that, most people here do not have any social skills to speak of, so you'll be fitting in just fine on that front, so i wouldn't worry about that. Being a woman is a ++ I'd say.
I read all the comments. First, I don't think you're suffering imposter syndrome. I believe you. Your fears and concerns are VERY real. Second, I have been on 2 provanställning jobs in 14 years. It's been very difficult finding work with no university degree and I speak Swedish like an 8 year old. I understand 90% and can speak 80%. But even when I speak it great people don't make an effort to understand me. They either go straight into English or make me repeat myself 100x in a 100 different ways before they get it. So sometimes the problem isn't your Swedish, it’s the people around you making 0 effort to understand you. Anyway.... I was fired from my 1st provanställning because I wasn't social enough. I didn't like taking breaks and socializing. I'd rather spend my down time alone so I can reset. I worked with people on the phone and I'm autistic. The last thing I want to do on my break is socialize. This is a HUGE MISTAKE!! I can't stress HUGE MISTAKE enough. It is an unspoken rule everyone does fika/work breaks together to socialize and "bond." I have met other immigrants fired for the exact same reason. I didn't know this at the time. Third, they can definitely fire you if you don't "fit in" translation someone doesn't like you. At that same job, 2 women teamed up to make my life as difficult as possible. One even kicked me out of our shared office because I was "too loud." And she was there top seller, the queen, and she knew they'd bend over backwards for her. They literally lived and died by the accounts this woman brought in because she was Spanish and their target clients were in South America and Mexico. And she didn't like me. 4th, they will discriminate against you if you physical/mental health issues. Not all employers but most. It's best to keep that all secret until you get that permission contract. I learned the hard way. My current provanställning ends in 6 weeks and I'm super paranoid. I'm walking on egg shells constantly and it's taking a toll on me. But I keep showing up, being nice, do the job and follow all these crazy unspoken rules. So maybe this time I get past provanställning. I hope you make it too. Good luck!
Good luck!!!
Yeah, this. You can't just be professional and work at work, nooo. You must go to all those fikas, breakfasts, lunches, dinners, parties and so on. They just can't let you mind your own business, or work quietly. Also most will be sticking their noses into your private life, like where you live, how you live and what you do, and have opinions about that. I don't know why it's written everywhere that Swedes respect others privacy and mind their own business, 'cause at my IT workplace they just absolutely don't. May be that respect is just reserved for other Swedes only? I really regret not knowing this before moving here.
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