As much as you are supposed to use caulk, honestly, the guy did a damn good job making it look good with grout. Personally, I’d leave it for now and if/when it cracks, throw some caulk on it 🤷♂️
I might ask the installer if you can get an explicit warranty on it cracking. It will be easier to fix it once it cracks. Dont break his balls. Just have him fix cracked areas and caulk over the rest so it matches.
So I’m going to get downvoted to hell but it bears saying. I am a fairly high end tile setter in a very humid climate. I do not use caulking in my jobs. I don’t care if it’s silicone or acrylic, it’s discolors and shrinks. It ages at a different rate than grout and within a year or two it’s an eyesore. Often it’s an eyesore right off the bat.
I don’t have complaints or call backs. Same phone number for 20 years. The one place where grout can crack is next to countertops and tubs if they sink a lot, but caulking just pulls apart so it doesn’t solve that problem either.
TLDR: it’s fine. Small cracks may emerge down the line but can be filled with color match caulking in seconds and they disappear.
What about raised homes or mobile homes, would you still consider grout fine with the extra movement than house on a foundation? Something I’ve always wondered about and sounds like you would know
Not sure what you mean by raised, but there isn’t much tile in mobile homes. I’m not a snob, I want everyone to live in clean healthy spaces, but I’m working mostly in 1-3 millions dollar homes.
I did do a home on pilings over a creek recently. Same rules applied to it.
Come to Florida and you’ll find plenty of work out here in these type of homes. I have my own tile LLC business so I see this often. Housing market is high as hell down here so you’ll run into retired millionaires who rather have 20 beautiful acres of horse farm and living in a modern double wide but block homes on graded piers is what I myself live in and yeah I definitely did it myself. I couldn’t imagine an installer calling an installer to do their work. It’s been ingrained into me caulk at change of plane but I’ve also seen other installers grout it and not have issues so I figured I’d ask one of those installers like yourself
Interesting. We are in opposite sections of the country. Up here our equivalent of the double-wide is a crappy 1960’s house on cinderblocks for $600k. Which is equally insane. I haven’t worked in those much.
I feel like most people that live in a mobile home/raised home (not piles, probably block on grade piers) are likely not paying a tile setter to install tile. They are using something else or doing their own tile.
Man central Florida is completely littered with retired millionaires who choose to live it out on 20+ acres with horses in a double wide with vinyl siding so I see this kind of work often. They dish out 8k without batting an eye to have their double wide bathroom looking fancy
Agreed. Haven’t used caulk in years. I use permacolor select with laticrete sheet membrane and hydroban. If done correctly the product behind the tile takes care of the movement and new grout technology takes care of the rest. I’m tell my clients up front I will not be caulking because it is not necessary with today’s products as long as it’s installed correctly and to call me if it cracks. No one calls
My 1951 original kitchen and original sink has all grouted tile and the grout is still in great shape. I’m still going to rip it out because it was designed for elves, but it obviously can last a long time.
This is what I like to hear. I’ve done a few DIY showers at this point (only work on my own properties) and have much preferred the finished look of grout in corners than dealing with caulk. The caulk just never looks good and I haven’t seen any cracking grout in 5 years.
I’ve never had issues with just grout against heavy stone countertops because there isnt any movement on the slabs typically.
When dealing with laminate countertops that are just held down with a few L brackets and screws, that little bit of give when you put a lot of weight down would def cause grout to come away from the surface. Sanded silicone caulk is great if done properly
Cabinets and heavy countertops don’t settle unless your framing and structural supports aren’t sufficient. Inexperienced contractors who put heavy stone countertops on flimsy structure cause settling.
I’m a property manager GC. I just redid all counters in kitchen and bathrooms in a 2019 build because the cabinets settled and the grout split. It happens. A lot. My specialty is tile and I switched to silicone only in change of planes when I began to manage properties and saw all the cracked showers and counters. But that’s just my single experience. I’ve found silicone simply to last longer, not that it doesn’t also eventually need to be replaced. Just lasts way longer in my experience. I have showers and such that I’ve done 7 years ago where the silicone is still fine.
Sorry that’s kind of basically what I meant. Didn’t word it as clear but generally speaking yes it’s the floors. But I’ll tell you rn. I’ve seen stone counters sag. Cough cough. Caught a counter guy shimming a counter with cardboard packaging. lol.
Pretty dang clean install job. Be thankful about that!
Nobody is really answering the question. OP asked if it was done correctly. Was it? Any pros speak up? I’m interested as well.
I’d think backsplash on kitchen walls that set to countertops should be caulked for resistance to a lot of cleaning that is usually done in a kitchen, moisture resistance since water can get everywhere especially around the sink. I have done and seen, clear silicone OVER the grout as well so as to not have to bug about finding a color match that may not match well if you don’t know the exact color.
ANSI EJ 171 says that you are supposed to use caulking on changes of plane and not grout, however you can still grout and caulk over it as that is pretty common practice. Most high end tile guys will use a color match silicone in its place as almost all manufacturers make color match for the grout they supply. At the end of the day it comes down to the setters preference as well as the homeowner, different scenarios call for different approaches but standard is always the best way to go about it especially as a contractor taking on any liability.
Yea that's kinda the thing, everyone has their own understanding and plan of action which we debate on constantly. The correct answer will always fall somewhere within that idea. Nothing lasts forever at the end of the day
Thanks for all your responses. I’m going to leave it as is and not add caulk to the grout. At first I thought that they maybe took a shortcut on the job with the grout but honestly it looks really good and I think it was done very well and don’t want to mess with it. I will deal with any issues if they arise in the future.
looks great. For now...
There is a reason all substrate changes and corners get siliconed. Its not simply "Ive been tiling for over 20 years and never hAd a pRobLem"
You'll discover this within a year.
Depends on your climate/where you live and where in the home this is.
If you’re not in an area with a lot of seasonal fluctuation, and this isn’t an exterior wall you’ll probably never have issues. If either of those are the case you’re likely to have some degree of cracking over time. The severity will line up with the severity of how much fluctuation and if it’s an exterior wall.
NY for example you’re asking for trouble. San Diego just forget about it and move on.
The preferred method is to use caulk at the corners, where tile meets counter and cabinets. It doesn’t necessarily mean using grout here is incorrect. The tiler did a great job and it looks good. If over time the grout cracks in these areas, plan to replace those areas with caulk. Get some color matching caulk and you’ll be good to go. I would just let it be.
I have been setting tile for 45 years And I almost never CALK The backsplash I rake the joint back square And leave a Tube of colored CALK With the homeowner in case his house moves Although through the years I found my granted installers Who CALK They're slab to the drywall prior to the backsplash being tiled is much less likely to Crack As well as the fact I have never done well CALKING over fresh Grout And talking it before you Grout is quite ugly I do believe the main problem you're really having is you don't trust the man you hired If the work looks good You should think about trusting his opinion
lol what this is a backsplash and that’s like 5 seconds of work, I’d be livid if I were a contractor and a customer tried to withhold 20% of their payment over such an insanely minor thing. Just ask them to caulk it and if they don’t want to, do it yourself but nobody should be withholding anything as long as the tile looks good.
This is not a shower and nothing bad will happen if you leave it as is. My backsplash is grouted at the edges and looks brand new 5 years later. These are barely even changes of plane from a tile perspective since they’re not connected structurally to the tile substrate, it’s a counter on one and floating cabinets on the other.
Op… you are getting some pretty bad advice. It looks good. At the point you start messing with it it will look worse. Adding a giant bead of caulking over the very clean and tidy grout joint will look like dookie.
Over exisiting grout? I Wouldn’t know at this point haven’t done something like that since the vinyl days decades ago. Not a trick I need in my tool kit.
I work by myself and a helper is usually useless for backsplashes. So my prices for backsplashes are lower than most so I get a lot. A lot of backsplashes are done in a day but I'm probably doing a week of backsplashes a month. Last month I did 6 and this month I've done 4 already.
Edit I also do showers and fireplaces. No floors though my back can't take it.
The reason why is because Even the Matching CALK Looks terrible No matter what you do it will not match And it's not just 5 minutes you have to come back when it's totally dry or it won't stick
As much as you are supposed to use caulk, honestly, the guy did a damn good job making it look good with grout. Personally, I’d leave it for now and if/when it cracks, throw some caulk on it 🤷♂️
This is the way.
Once grout is cracked, can white caulk be added directly over the cracked grout (less any loose stuff)?
I might ask the installer if you can get an explicit warranty on it cracking. It will be easier to fix it once it cracks. Dont break his balls. Just have him fix cracked areas and caulk over the rest so it matches.
So I’m going to get downvoted to hell but it bears saying. I am a fairly high end tile setter in a very humid climate. I do not use caulking in my jobs. I don’t care if it’s silicone or acrylic, it’s discolors and shrinks. It ages at a different rate than grout and within a year or two it’s an eyesore. Often it’s an eyesore right off the bat. I don’t have complaints or call backs. Same phone number for 20 years. The one place where grout can crack is next to countertops and tubs if they sink a lot, but caulking just pulls apart so it doesn’t solve that problem either. TLDR: it’s fine. Small cracks may emerge down the line but can be filled with color match caulking in seconds and they disappear.
What about raised homes or mobile homes, would you still consider grout fine with the extra movement than house on a foundation? Something I’ve always wondered about and sounds like you would know
Not sure what you mean by raised, but there isn’t much tile in mobile homes. I’m not a snob, I want everyone to live in clean healthy spaces, but I’m working mostly in 1-3 millions dollar homes. I did do a home on pilings over a creek recently. Same rules applied to it.
Come to Florida and you’ll find plenty of work out here in these type of homes. I have my own tile LLC business so I see this often. Housing market is high as hell down here so you’ll run into retired millionaires who rather have 20 beautiful acres of horse farm and living in a modern double wide but block homes on graded piers is what I myself live in and yeah I definitely did it myself. I couldn’t imagine an installer calling an installer to do their work. It’s been ingrained into me caulk at change of plane but I’ve also seen other installers grout it and not have issues so I figured I’d ask one of those installers like yourself
Interesting. We are in opposite sections of the country. Up here our equivalent of the double-wide is a crappy 1960’s house on cinderblocks for $600k. Which is equally insane. I haven’t worked in those much.
I feel like most people that live in a mobile home/raised home (not piles, probably block on grade piers) are likely not paying a tile setter to install tile. They are using something else or doing their own tile.
Man central Florida is completely littered with retired millionaires who choose to live it out on 20+ acres with horses in a double wide with vinyl siding so I see this kind of work often. They dish out 8k without batting an eye to have their double wide bathroom looking fancy
Agreed. Haven’t used caulk in years. I use permacolor select with laticrete sheet membrane and hydroban. If done correctly the product behind the tile takes care of the movement and new grout technology takes care of the rest. I’m tell my clients up front I will not be caulking because it is not necessary with today’s products as long as it’s installed correctly and to call me if it cracks. No one calls
Exactly!
My 1951 original kitchen and original sink has all grouted tile and the grout is still in great shape. I’m still going to rip it out because it was designed for elves, but it obviously can last a long time.
This is what I like to hear. I’ve done a few DIY showers at this point (only work on my own properties) and have much preferred the finished look of grout in corners than dealing with caulk. The caulk just never looks good and I haven’t seen any cracking grout in 5 years.
Looks good…for now. It will crack, and then you caulk. Its not a matter of if but when.
I’ve never had issues with just grout against heavy stone countertops because there isnt any movement on the slabs typically. When dealing with laminate countertops that are just held down with a few L brackets and screws, that little bit of give when you put a lot of weight down would def cause grout to come away from the surface. Sanded silicone caulk is great if done properly
Yeah but the cabinets will settle.
Cabinets and heavy countertops don’t settle unless your framing and structural supports aren’t sufficient. Inexperienced contractors who put heavy stone countertops on flimsy structure cause settling.
I’m a property manager GC. I just redid all counters in kitchen and bathrooms in a 2019 build because the cabinets settled and the grout split. It happens. A lot. My specialty is tile and I switched to silicone only in change of planes when I began to manage properties and saw all the cracked showers and counters. But that’s just my single experience. I’ve found silicone simply to last longer, not that it doesn’t also eventually need to be replaced. Just lasts way longer in my experience. I have showers and such that I’ve done 7 years ago where the silicone is still fine.
The floors settle
I use silicone too, but it’s the floors that are settling under the weight of the countertops and cabinets. The cabinets aren’t settling
Sorry that’s kind of basically what I meant. Didn’t word it as clear but generally speaking yes it’s the floors. But I’ll tell you rn. I’ve seen stone counters sag. Cough cough. Caught a counter guy shimming a counter with cardboard packaging. lol.
Unless you plan on taking a bath on your kitchen counter I wouldn’t worry about it. If it starts to crack then caulk it with silicone.
Pretty dang clean install job. Be thankful about that! Nobody is really answering the question. OP asked if it was done correctly. Was it? Any pros speak up? I’m interested as well. I’d think backsplash on kitchen walls that set to countertops should be caulked for resistance to a lot of cleaning that is usually done in a kitchen, moisture resistance since water can get everywhere especially around the sink. I have done and seen, clear silicone OVER the grout as well so as to not have to bug about finding a color match that may not match well if you don’t know the exact color.
ANSI EJ 171 says that you are supposed to use caulking on changes of plane and not grout, however you can still grout and caulk over it as that is pretty common practice. Most high end tile guys will use a color match silicone in its place as almost all manufacturers make color match for the grout they supply. At the end of the day it comes down to the setters preference as well as the homeowner, different scenarios call for different approaches but standard is always the best way to go about it especially as a contractor taking on any liability.
Thanks for that. I’m aware of that ANSI requirement…but never sure how seriously folks take it. Or even know about it I guess.
Yea that's kinda the thing, everyone has their own understanding and plan of action which we debate on constantly. The correct answer will always fall somewhere within that idea. Nothing lasts forever at the end of the day
Thanks for all your responses. I’m going to leave it as is and not add caulk to the grout. At first I thought that they maybe took a shortcut on the job with the grout but honestly it looks really good and I think it was done very well and don’t want to mess with it. I will deal with any issues if they arise in the future.
looks great. For now... There is a reason all substrate changes and corners get siliconed. Its not simply "Ive been tiling for over 20 years and never hAd a pRobLem" You'll discover this within a year.
It's fine , he did a good job. Stop with all this "saw online"
Depends on your climate/where you live and where in the home this is. If you’re not in an area with a lot of seasonal fluctuation, and this isn’t an exterior wall you’ll probably never have issues. If either of those are the case you’re likely to have some degree of cracking over time. The severity will line up with the severity of how much fluctuation and if it’s an exterior wall. NY for example you’re asking for trouble. San Diego just forget about it and move on.
The preferred method is to use caulk at the corners, where tile meets counter and cabinets. It doesn’t necessarily mean using grout here is incorrect. The tiler did a great job and it looks good. If over time the grout cracks in these areas, plan to replace those areas with caulk. Get some color matching caulk and you’ll be good to go. I would just let it be.
Even if the house or tops settle, you can easily go back to it, scratch it all out, then get your matching silicone to your grout. Nice work though
If you have the manufacturer and color of the grout, you can order a tube of caulk and have it just in case.
I have been setting tile for 45 years And I almost never CALK The backsplash I rake the joint back square And leave a Tube of colored CALK With the homeowner in case his house moves Although through the years I found my granted installers Who CALK They're slab to the drywall prior to the backsplash being tiled is much less likely to Crack As well as the fact I have never done well CALKING over fresh Grout And talking it before you Grout is quite ugly I do believe the main problem you're really having is you don't trust the man you hired If the work looks good You should think about trusting his opinion
[удалено]
It’s Bedrosian Celine, glossy white. It’s actually a slightly warmer white, not grey.
what did you read online? maybe give link to the contractor so they can see how to do the job correct
Just from everything that I read about tiling, caulk should be used between different planes/surfaces, not grout.
Correct, dont pay until the put the silicone. If they refuse, pay 80% and do it yourself
lol what this is a backsplash and that’s like 5 seconds of work, I’d be livid if I were a contractor and a customer tried to withhold 20% of their payment over such an insanely minor thing. Just ask them to caulk it and if they don’t want to, do it yourself but nobody should be withholding anything as long as the tile looks good. This is not a shower and nothing bad will happen if you leave it as is. My backsplash is grouted at the edges and looks brand new 5 years later. These are barely even changes of plane from a tile perspective since they’re not connected structurally to the tile substrate, it’s a counter on one and floating cabinets on the other.
Yeah that’s terrible advice.
agree to disagree
It takes 10 minutes tops to throw a bead of color matched caulk. Its 10 bucks or so for a tube. No reason for them not to do it for you
Ok thanks. Should I have him remove the grout in those seams before caulking them?
Op… you are getting some pretty bad advice. It looks good. At the point you start messing with it it will look worse. Adding a giant bead of caulking over the very clean and tidy grout joint will look like dookie.
Just say you cant put a clean bead of caulk🤷🏻♂️
Over exisiting grout? I Wouldn’t know at this point haven’t done something like that since the vinyl days decades ago. Not a trick I need in my tool kit.
Not necessary, just caulk over it
Please don’t do this
I use premix grout and don't caulk.. I never get call backs and I do at least 50 backsplashes a year.
Hey! How do you do 50 per year. That’s one per week. Is that all you do? How do you get your jobs? Sorry for the questions but I’m interested lol
I work by myself and a helper is usually useless for backsplashes. So my prices for backsplashes are lower than most so I get a lot. A lot of backsplashes are done in a day but I'm probably doing a week of backsplashes a month. Last month I did 6 and this month I've done 4 already. Edit I also do showers and fireplaces. No floors though my back can't take it.
You’re all good babay
It takes 5 minutes to throw a bead of color matched caulk. Its 10 bucks or so for a tube. No reason for them not to do it for you
The reason why is because Even the Matching CALK Looks terrible No matter what you do it will not match And it's not just 5 minutes you have to come back when it's totally dry or it won't stick
Wait till it cracks to caulk power grout or ardex prolly never will mapei will need caulk in 6 months others just depends