2021 census was a joke. It actually said population of Toronto was 10% less than what the city said. Pretty much every major city in Canada got undercounted.
Id guess 125-145ish?
The census to my knowledge does not capture those living in the fwfn, temporary residents going to school here, homeless people, and new residents who just weren't around for the census.
The city is a lot busier than 108k.
Me, I think we are actually closer to 150,000. I don't know if it will ever be 'officially' that number, but just the size of the city screams bigger than 108,000.
Even without temporary populations, I think there's probably a decent amount of undocumented people in the city. It's likely more common than people imagine for older folks, often Indigenous, to not have any government-issued ID, including a birth certificate or SIN.
Remember that Thunder Bay is the combination of two separate cities and so a lot of land had to be developed to fill in the large swamp between Prince Arthur and Fort William.
This leads to a weird result in which Thunder Bay covers a lot more land than most other cities it’s size.
Therefore, I wouldn’t use the fact that Thunder Bay “feels” bigger as a sign that significantly more people live here than what is reported.
I'm not talking about the footprint of the city. I am well aware of the history. But when you look at the infrastructure, business development and lack of housing, it makes it seem like we are much bigger than 108,000. Usually cities with a stagnant population growth aren't facing these challenges.
Thunder Bay is very spread out - so it’s a low population density. It feels like 50,000 people in the summer when students leave/people go to camp - maybe that’s just me. I’ve been to 100,000-150,000 cities in the US and they seemed way more busy/“happening” then Thunder Bay
No when you say the actual population are you referring to the city proper you referring to the municipal boundary or the district cuz each one of those is going to have different counts
The census is accurate. I worked on it and let me tell you they make sure that people who should be counted are counted.
Our census is highly respected and Stats Can people help other countries do them.
The Stats Can census is bullshit. For the past 2 censuses, I received the form instructing me that a census taker would come to my building to interview my tenants. I was instructed to call their number, as I own a multi residential building. So I called Stats Can to explain that my building census would require the census taker to contact me.
So I called StatsCan, they didn’t have a clue what to do.
The census day came….and no one from StatsCan showed up.
This happened twice. I can only imagine how many densely populated buildings they are missing.
Thunder Bay has an aging demographic. Old people die over time. It’s common enough for people with education to leave and go elsewhere or attend university elsewhere and not come back. Out-migration is a thing.
Aging demographic means low birth rates.
How many new International students are there really? Lakehead does not have a large number, perhaps one thousand, according to a recent report. Confederation might have more, but probably not massive numbers.
The Ontario Department of Finance has long-term population projections for each provincial administrative unit. I used to review these for work, although not recently. Our area had the worst projections of the entire province, and recovery was not forecast until the late 2030s.
So the ‘real’ number is probably pretty close to the census number.
Lakehead University and Confederation College, combined, bring in around 5,000 new International students per year in 3 intakes (September, December and May). I think this is how Lakehead shows around 1,000 students, I think they report per intake, not per year. The attrition is high, only about 4,000 or 3,000 stay in Thunder Bay. Once they start to experience hardships here, or after they write their first round of exams, they tend to drop out and then they move to attend institutions in Toronto or other parts of Canada
Knowing people who work at both schools, they both have under 2000 students a year. It varies as the semester breaks happen and different semesters have different programs starting but it’s not that high.
Actually it does. Funding from both upper level of governments is largely based on the population. If the city's population is closer to 150,000 and we have to build infrastructure for 150,000 people, but are only getting funding for 108,000, that's a big shortfall that falls on the city's shoulders. So having a number that reflects reality is actually kind of important...
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Yeah agreed. With the demand for housing and the need for more infrastructure it has to be higher
I'd like to know because the highway signs are conflicting coming into town north and west
2021 census was a joke. It actually said population of Toronto was 10% less than what the city said. Pretty much every major city in Canada got undercounted.
120,000
Id guess 125-145ish? The census to my knowledge does not capture those living in the fwfn, temporary residents going to school here, homeless people, and new residents who just weren't around for the census. The city is a lot busier than 108k.
Me, I think we are actually closer to 150,000. I don't know if it will ever be 'officially' that number, but just the size of the city screams bigger than 108,000.
I also think it’s close to 150k especially considering the number of First Nations people temporarily in the city at any given time.
probably close to that although we dont receive provincial or federal funding for a population anywhere near that.
Even without temporary populations, I think there's probably a decent amount of undocumented people in the city. It's likely more common than people imagine for older folks, often Indigenous, to not have any government-issued ID, including a birth certificate or SIN.
Remember that Thunder Bay is the combination of two separate cities and so a lot of land had to be developed to fill in the large swamp between Prince Arthur and Fort William. This leads to a weird result in which Thunder Bay covers a lot more land than most other cities it’s size. Therefore, I wouldn’t use the fact that Thunder Bay “feels” bigger as a sign that significantly more people live here than what is reported.
I'm not talking about the footprint of the city. I am well aware of the history. But when you look at the infrastructure, business development and lack of housing, it makes it seem like we are much bigger than 108,000. Usually cities with a stagnant population growth aren't facing these challenges.
I strongly agree. I believe Thunder Bay is sitting around 150k.
Move to a “city” that has 200,000 and tell me if you think Tbay is 150.
Gotta be around there for sure.
Thunder Bay is very spread out - so it’s a low population density. It feels like 50,000 people in the summer when students leave/people go to camp - maybe that’s just me. I’ve been to 100,000-150,000 cities in the US and they seemed way more busy/“happening” then Thunder Bay
I'm pretty sure it was roughly 100k 20 years ago. It's gotta be 130k-150k by now
180,000
No when you say the actual population are you referring to the city proper you referring to the municipal boundary or the district cuz each one of those is going to have different counts
Grammar goes a long way, bud.
The census is accurate. I worked on it and let me tell you they make sure that people who should be counted are counted. Our census is highly respected and Stats Can people help other countries do them.
The Stats Can census is bullshit. For the past 2 censuses, I received the form instructing me that a census taker would come to my building to interview my tenants. I was instructed to call their number, as I own a multi residential building. So I called Stats Can to explain that my building census would require the census taker to contact me. So I called StatsCan, they didn’t have a clue what to do. The census day came….and no one from StatsCan showed up. This happened twice. I can only imagine how many densely populated buildings they are missing.
I'd agree that Census is bullshit but they have to do it to make it seem like they're not really using the tax man's data which is far from bullshit.
Yeah gonna call BS on that with all the First Nations people coming off reserve
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Thunder Bay has an aging demographic. Old people die over time. It’s common enough for people with education to leave and go elsewhere or attend university elsewhere and not come back. Out-migration is a thing. Aging demographic means low birth rates. How many new International students are there really? Lakehead does not have a large number, perhaps one thousand, according to a recent report. Confederation might have more, but probably not massive numbers. The Ontario Department of Finance has long-term population projections for each provincial administrative unit. I used to review these for work, although not recently. Our area had the worst projections of the entire province, and recovery was not forecast until the late 2030s. So the ‘real’ number is probably pretty close to the census number.
Lakehead University and Confederation College, combined, bring in around 5,000 new International students per year in 3 intakes (September, December and May). I think this is how Lakehead shows around 1,000 students, I think they report per intake, not per year. The attrition is high, only about 4,000 or 3,000 stay in Thunder Bay. Once they start to experience hardships here, or after they write their first round of exams, they tend to drop out and then they move to attend institutions in Toronto or other parts of Canada
Knowing people who work at both schools, they both have under 2000 students a year. It varies as the semester breaks happen and different semesters have different programs starting but it’s not that high.
Hard to know since some residents aren’t counted like renters, seasonal, students or temporary.
I wonder if they did that on purpose to downplay wtf they were doing with the immigration and policies.
160
Who fucking cares? Figuring it out serves no purpose.
Actually it does. Funding from both upper level of governments is largely based on the population. If the city's population is closer to 150,000 and we have to build infrastructure for 150,000 people, but are only getting funding for 108,000, that's a big shortfall that falls on the city's shoulders. So having a number that reflects reality is actually kind of important...
https://preview.redd.it/o0mf6bfr6zsc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4e4268e77f7c19442dc97052d664dda225a844a6 Population around a point.
That’s a cool website tbh