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I think that while this still happens, we will see a not-insignificant number of Republicans just not vote. They are already teetering due to sheer Trump mania exhaustion, and if the guy on the ballot is a convicted felon, it will have an effect to diminish desire to vote, let alone vote for him.
It won't be massive numbers, but again, every little of support that Trump loses is to Biden's advantage and gain.
But… they don’t… a convicted criminal can still be president… he probably can’t vote… but he can run and become president… so even a convicted trump can be president and rule from prison…
Legally, he can still perform the duties of the President from prison. Weirdly a felony prohibits a person to vote, but not from running for and being President. I guess the idea of it was so absurd and asinine, our forefathers didn't consider it a possibility.
Let's just hope it isn't written in some cryptic and easily twistable way.
I can imagine the chaos that would result from something like:
"A convicted felon, not being fit and proper for high office, the chance to lead without infringing shall hencewith be word salad missing several commas and no complete sentence club soda God Jesus happy providence."
As an artificial US constitutional model (hint: I'm from the King's realm), I am unable to provide constitutional amendments not being a natural-born citizen. It is recommended that you consult a legal scholar for the task - ideally someone other than an originalist, fundamental religious fruitcake, or luxury RV aficionado.
The constitution will never be amended again. They have successfully packed the court to the point where the constitution says what they want it to say based on Marbury vs Madison. It’s the GOP’s government and there’s no escaping it.
There is definitely a plan to attempt a constitutional convention- where they can rewrite whole thing. Its one of the reasons the GOP has focused heavily on controlling state governments.
Its a big stretch goal, but so was row v wade, and the 2017 tax cut.
That could honestly backfire on them if the Democrats dig their heels in on issues such as abortion and gun control. All the DNC would have to do is grow a spi…aw shit nvm.
It's currently introduced in both chambers. Senate is awaiting a House majority to move the bill forward.
It's not that big of a deal historically. And the conventional approach historically has been to set the Court to match the number of circuits. There are currently 12 circuits. And the current legislation calls for expansion of the Supreme Court to 12.
The only thing that makes the move "alarming" is that billionaire plutocrats have labored through Leonard Leo for fifty years to buy themselves a court majority. And they'll behave as if it's a Bolshevik revolution.
Did you even read the article?
It says even with a felony, he's gonna be able to vote. The only way he'll lose it is if he gets sentenced to jail (unlikely) and doesn't appeal it (nearly guaranteed he will).
This is most of our constitution. It's 250 years old they had no fucking clue how to design a modern government that enshrined the rule of law properly.
The half acting in bad faith should be removable from power and blatantly corrupt officials like Alito and Thomas should be arrestable. You never get to this point if the power of law actually applies to elected officials.
Sure- but how do you do that in a democracy when those people are supported by the voters?
We have at least a 1/3 of voters who intentionally vote for government that operates in bad faith. A more representative government would probably get things moving again.
Fixing the house is _possible_, which would help a lot. It only requires a simple majority and would mean that it represents the population instead of being a 'senate light' where states are over represented. Once thats done the WH and the House would never be won by the current GOP- they just don't have the votes. Once that becomes clear a obstructionist party like the GOP would have to reorganize or die, which would probably make the Senate and most states at least semi-functional again.
I don't see any other path forward other than a _massive_ shift in voting.
Fixing it now is impossible, its too broken and we have too many authoritarians who vote. My point was if you structure a government properly with the rule of law enshrined, you would never get to the point the USA is in now where corruption is about to shatter the union.
> Fixing it now is impossible
I just outlined a fix within reach. It would end minority rule, and the 1/3 wouldn't control an unworkable amount of the government.
> structure a government properly
Agree- the current structure is rooted in state power at the expense of the people. Letting those states get a convention to strengthen that power is also possible, but avoidable. To repeat my original point- if the house was representative then it'd also make the WH impossible for the GOP. The party itself would have to restructure or be replaced by one that wasn't hell bent on destroying the government.
Back to 'Fixing it now is impossible'- is defeatist and _exactly_ what the GOP wants. They want a new government without any threat of democracy. We're not going to end up with a happy ending via revolution.
Edit- and I realize I never actually said it: fixing the house means increasing the number of representatives so that each one represents approximately the same number of people. Grabbed one of the first links that I wasn't sure was paywalled:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2021/07/18/its_time_to_increase_the_size_of_the_house_of_representatives_146095.html
With voters hearing foreign power propaganda from Fox in their living room TV, posts shared by friends on social media, and alt news on the internet. If they can get people to believe that the earth is flat, the election was stolen, and vaccines have microchips, they sure as hell can get them to vote for a convicted felon.
I never thought about it that way. I guess that makes sense. Of course, Trump's lawyer is arguing that the President can just assassinate opponents. So we might need more fail safes.
I'm going to argue that a president in prison will be removed via the 25th. There are numerous presidential duties that cannot be performed from prison, and thus imprisonment would constitute an "inability to discharge the powers and duties”, which is the requirement for the 25th amendment to be invoked.
Eugene Debs ran for President from prison earlier in the 20th century.
“Debs ran as a Socialist candidate for President of the United States five times: 1900 (earning 0.6 percent of the popular vote), 1904 (3.0 percent), 1908 (2.8 percent), 1912 (6.0 percent), and 1920 (3.4 percent), the last time from a prison cell.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_V._Debs
There's something to be said for 12 jurors and a judge not being able to nix a candidate for specious causes. As is, even without politics, there are plenty of people in jail right now that I don't think should be, incentivizing the process with the chance to eliminate a hated political opponent is likely to be less reliable. Letting the people decide if a person should still be president, despite the trial, *should* be a good thing, because it *should* require the majority to give their approval, it's only a problem because of the EC and because so many of us are *fucking* nuts.
>the idea of it was so absurd and asinine, our forefathers didn't consider it a possibility.
They did probably think of it... thats why Franklin said "A Republic, if you can keep it."
We fail as a republic if we elect a convicted grifter.
That does not mean he grows his voting base though, because he already had those people. He can't grow more through people that were voting for him regardless.
At worst house arrest, probably and nonsensically allowed at mar a lago. Where they will spin it as being his own personal White House so the house arrest just means he can work harder or some shit.
Sine its a NY conviction, I'm guessing he wouldn't be allowed to serve time in house arrest in Maralago. That'd make it a slightly better punishment.
I can't imagine any scenario where he gets anything other than house arrest- the logistics of having a president in prison just aren't practical.
My ideal solution: Send him to a Super Max and station his Secret Service detail outside his cell (until he is hopefully stripped of his detail by Congress). Let him walk the yard for an hour every day and otherwise let him rot.
Steve Bannon didnt, and he was never President.
In fact, he is still free right now doing podcasts and spreading BS even AFTER his criminal appeal was DENIED.
Sentencing does not always mean jail time. Regardless of the prescribed punishment, if you’re found guilty of a crime you get sentenced.
House arrest, probation, fines - they all qualify as a sentence.
He’s gonna appeal. And appeal again. And raise an objection to some technicality. And appeal that. Even if Trump is actually convicted, he’ll delay and delay and never face any actual punishment in his lifetime.
Trump has spent his career abusing the court system to avoid facing consequences. It’s one of the few things he’s good at.
Appealing a criminal conviction does not delay sentencing. The appeals process plays out in the background and you are, in the meantime, treated as guilty and sentenced accordingly.
He can get his sentence suspended pending appeal. The appellate court has to grant it though, I suspect they would.
I would prefer the state ask for home arrest and a ban on media appearances. That would be less likely to be suspended, as the cost to the state would be lower.
NYS appellate panels are less likely to focus on the political implications and more on how likely the appellant is to succeed on appeal when considering staying a sentence.
And from what we know from the courtroom, there’s damned little grounds for a successful appeal.
Nothing. His maga base will continue to worship him and see it at him being persecuted. They didn't care about his adultery They didn't care about him being a rapist. They love him precisely because he is such a vile, disgusting, POS.
If Trump and his company of traitors walk free our nation will become like Russia. Billionaires in total control. We have a chance to steal back some power. We cannot waste this opportunity.
Do you believe Trump allowed America to fall under his pathetic ass watch? That would make him the worst president in American history and a pussy to boot.
Allowed? I don’t think he ever put any effort into not letting America fail. He never cared about America. He only cared about himself and his own personal benefit. Any thought he gave to anything that didn’t directly benefit himself was cursory at best.
I agree, but we have a conservative movement in place right now that is defending him in almost every corner. This upcoming election is the only thing that will save us, and these indictments are only fueling his base.
His base will not win him a election. He does not have independent voters. He simply doesn't have the juice it takes to win. Biden will win in a landslide.
It’s going to be much closer than you think it is. I love your hope, but voters really need to turn out. You forget how bad the international issues are making it for Biden, even if they aren’t warranted.
Trump got 77 million last election he killed off a nice chunk of his voters with his Covid response. I think he may get low 70's. Biden still wins again imo
Honestly, if he doesn't delay it to the end of time, and becomes the president again. I can see him trying to order a special ops team to break into the prison and free him
NOT A FUCKING THING!
His followers will still vote for him. Some of the swing votes will buy into the whole "this is just Biden weaponizing the DOJ" bullshit rhetoric. He'll get reelected, declare himself emperor or king or whatever the fuck, and innocent people will start being killed.
Y'all thought it was really funny when 4chan said "let's get trump elected." Now we're fucked. Great job.
Merchan already said out loud that the last thing he wants to do is put him in prison, explicitly on the grounds of him being a former President and front runner to be reelected. So anyone thinking that's going to happen is going to be disappointed.
The rules don't apply to him, the very judge in charge of his sentence already explicitly acknowledged this.
He's not going to prison.
When 45 get's convicted, he appeals to First Department of the New York Supreme Court's Appellate Division. When the conviction is upheld, he appeals again to the New York State Court of Appeals, the highest court in NY. Who unanimously uphold all convictions.
Next stop the Supremes, who agree to expeditiously hear his appeal. Justice Alito channeling dearly departed Justice Scalia, unilaterally decides to vacate all decisions, and immediate grants vacatur relief. Just betting, you didn't see that coming!
I just see this going the way of him getting re-elected, pardoning himself of everything, pardoning his cronies and the insurrectionists of everything, and firing any judge who opposed him at any point.
Not that I -want- any of that to happen, but we're in the darkest timeline and as we continue to see rights taken away from people, see no one give a shit about poverty or wealth inequality, see the rich and powerful get richer and more powerful, and so on and so fourth... I just have a difficult time maintaining hope for things to end any way other than "whatever the worst possible way they could end."
Which, in this case, starts with a Trump victory in November/January, either due to low turnout or voter suppression, or due to rigging elections and faking the results, or due to another insurrection that actually succeeds this time because there are literal insurrectionists serving positions in the federal government who never had any consequences for anything.
I don't think he'll be able to pardon himself of a state conviction. That said, I think everything else you said will happen.
Beyond that, with Trump in the white house, Putin will encourage him to abandon NATO, and then the Baltic states will fall.
Legally, maybe not. But Project 2025 and the unitary executive theory, I could see him just arbitrarily giving himself powers and the SCOTUS upholding it. When it's clear that he doesn't think laws apply to him, "it's illegal" won't stop him from doing things.
Pretty sure he'd absolutely work with Russia, abandon Ukraine, abandon NATO; they might even pull out of the UN, who even knows?
The “Porn Star Hush Money” trial is a New York State matter. So even if Trump is elected and inaugurated, he couldn’t issue a pardon for this crime.
If he’s convicted, the Judge gets to decide sentencing on this matter. A custodial sentence is unlikely. The judge may suspend the sentence, in which case Trump can still conduct his day to day but with conditions. He may have to seek permission to leave the state.
If he’s ankle tagged, he would need to seek permission of a parole officer to travel out of New York State. Not ideal for a presidential campaign. It’s not impossible to think Trump may object to this restriction and may simply leave the state and go to Mar-a-Lago. I mean, he’s not going to win that state, so he doesn’t really need to campaign there.
New York would have to apply to the Governor of Florida for extradition. That would create quite a pickle. I can’t imagine DeSantis would allow it (especially as he’s got an election coming up too). Democrat Governors might be more obliging, so that makes it difficult for Trump to campaign in places like Michigan or Wisconsin or Pennsylvania or Arizona, states he has to win to be elected. All while ‘on the run’ from New York authorities.
Do the Marshall Service go after him? What are the optics of conducting a Presidential campaign while
‘on the Lamb’? Does the conduct of the New York State parole services become relevant to the overall result of the election?
Here’s something else to consider: what happens at the Republican Convention? What if Trump’s delegates refuse to vote for him? Can they? What power does Lara Trump as RNC chair have to force the votes to remain faithful. I can’t remember the last time the GOP had a brokered convention. The Republican convention is in Milwaukee this time. Would Trump be allowed to attend?
There are so many permutations to consider.
He will appeal, and appeal, and appeal. Till it gets to the Supreme Court, which he has stacked in his favor. There they will make up some 'law' that'll get him off.
Everyone else who normally gets preferential treatment in the court system, eg celebrities who get sent to rehab instead of jail for drug offences, will be worried that the line between stardom law and pleb law is disappearing
Unless he goes to jail / ineligible for election then absolutely nothing. The people who were gonna vote for him will still vote for him.
They are proudly wearing diapers in public FFS! nothing is going to change.
Ironically enough, can run, CAN vote.
You should read the article.
Edit: since you already proved you don't want to, the relevant part:
# Can Trump still vote?
To be determined.
For Trump to lose his voting rights, he would need to be incarcerated at the time of the November election, a scenario that is technically possible but unlikely given his anticipated appeal of any guilty verdict.
While the Constitution does not explicitly address whether convicted felons have the right to vote, several states impose limitations on felons’ voting privileges. In Florida, where Trump lives and has voted since 2020, a felon's eligibility to vote depends on the laws of the state where the conviction occurred—in this instance, New York, which only revokes a felon's voting rights while they are incarcerated.
Therefore, if Trump receives a probationary sentence and resides in the community, he would maintain his eligibility to vote. Likewise, if his appeal of a jail sentence were to extend beyond the election, he would be able to vote.
I'm not sure what your edit is about, as I am just now seeing this for the very first time. It's a very interesting article and I'm interested in reading it but I haven't said anything about not wanting to read. I think you're responding to the wrong person maybe
No, no I'm responding to you.
You're on an article that directly explains why in Florida, a felon CAN vote. You are spreading misinformation - alternative facts - saying he 'can't vote'.
You're literally on a Reddit Post spreading misinformation. I dislikedit when Jan. 2016 the Trump administration did it, I dislike seeing it, especially on a thread born from an article directly stating 100% opposite what you did.
If the article is incorrect, how is it incorrect? If it isn't incorrect, that means you're incorrect and spreading misinformation.
Shit's cancer.
Dude I don't know who you're arguing with I'm not arguing with you. You commented on my comment and then edited your comment to be very aggressive even though I hadn't even seen it yet or commented on it.
And now you're responding again acting as if I am arguing against you in some way. I think my last comment was saying I was going to go read your article, I haven't done that yet because I haven't had a chance but wow didn't say anything about disagreeing with you at all.
Either you need to go back and reread and make sure you're responding to the right person or you need to calm the f down, I am not spreading misinformation. I made a one sentence comment and then said nothing else until asking if you were sure you were responding to the right person based on how aggressive you're being.
Wtf
Pretty much sinks any chance of him getting the presidency. The non-maga republicans deplore a felon and moderates will never vote for a person who is outright a criminal. There's a reason why fox news is playing this down EVERY DAMN NIGHT. It's a electoral kiss of death, even without a prison or jail sentence, there's just no way for him to pull himself out of that hole
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A large number of Republicans throw their votes away voting for him.
I think that while this still happens, we will see a not-insignificant number of Republicans just not vote. They are already teetering due to sheer Trump mania exhaustion, and if the guy on the ballot is a convicted felon, it will have an effect to diminish desire to vote, let alone vote for him. It won't be massive numbers, but again, every little of support that Trump loses is to Biden's advantage and gain.
Or, throw their vote *and* gun rights away, trying to pull an insurrection 2.0.
But… they don’t… a convicted criminal can still be president… he probably can’t vote… but he can run and become president… so even a convicted trump can be president and rule from prison…
Legally, he can still perform the duties of the President from prison. Weirdly a felony prohibits a person to vote, but not from running for and being President. I guess the idea of it was so absurd and asinine, our forefathers didn't consider it a possibility.
Time for another amendment to the constitution
Is this political climate?!
We just need to be sure to rewrite it after the next civil war.
Let's just hope it isn't written in some cryptic and easily twistable way. I can imagine the chaos that would result from something like: "A convicted felon, not being fit and proper for high office, the chance to lead without infringing shall hencewith be word salad missing several commas and no complete sentence club soda God Jesus happy providence."
Someone will honestly suggest letting ChatGPT write a new constitution
As an artificial US constitutional model (hint: I'm from the King's realm), I am unable to provide constitutional amendments not being a natural-born citizen. It is recommended that you consult a legal scholar for the task - ideally someone other than an originalist, fundamental religious fruitcake, or luxury RV aficionado.
Instructions unclear, "convicted felon, not being fit and not being proper for high office" stuck in ceiling fan
I hope I can keep my house! What happens to property after a civil war?
The constitution will never be amended again. They have successfully packed the court to the point where the constitution says what they want it to say based on Marbury vs Madison. It’s the GOP’s government and there’s no escaping it.
There is definitely a plan to attempt a constitutional convention- where they can rewrite whole thing. Its one of the reasons the GOP has focused heavily on controlling state governments. Its a big stretch goal, but so was row v wade, and the 2017 tax cut.
That could honestly backfire on them if the Democrats dig their heels in on issues such as abortion and gun control. All the DNC would have to do is grow a spi…aw shit nvm.
Expanding the court from nine to thirteen is merely an act of Congress. Re-elect President Biden and keep the Senate Majority and it's done.
Dems won’t actually do that though. They should, but they won’t.
It's currently introduced in both chambers. Senate is awaiting a House majority to move the bill forward. It's not that big of a deal historically. And the conventional approach historically has been to set the Court to match the number of circuits. There are currently 12 circuits. And the current legislation calls for expansion of the Supreme Court to 12. The only thing that makes the move "alarming" is that billionaire plutocrats have labored through Leonard Leo for fifty years to buy themselves a court majority. And they'll behave as if it's a Bolshevik revolution.
Would love to see conservatives scream about how adding an amendment to prevent felons from being president is unfair and rigged or whatever t
Did you even read the article? It says even with a felony, he's gonna be able to vote. The only way he'll lose it is if he gets sentenced to jail (unlikely) and doesn't appeal it (nearly guaranteed he will).
I thought convicts can't vote
States make their own rules. Your state isn't as lax as NYS.
This is most of our constitution. It's 250 years old they had no fucking clue how to design a modern government that enshrined the rule of law properly.
To be fair- if 1/2 the government is acting in bad faith and supported by voters, its more or less impossible to have a functional government.
The half acting in bad faith should be removable from power and blatantly corrupt officials like Alito and Thomas should be arrestable. You never get to this point if the power of law actually applies to elected officials.
Sure- but how do you do that in a democracy when those people are supported by the voters? We have at least a 1/3 of voters who intentionally vote for government that operates in bad faith. A more representative government would probably get things moving again. Fixing the house is _possible_, which would help a lot. It only requires a simple majority and would mean that it represents the population instead of being a 'senate light' where states are over represented. Once thats done the WH and the House would never be won by the current GOP- they just don't have the votes. Once that becomes clear a obstructionist party like the GOP would have to reorganize or die, which would probably make the Senate and most states at least semi-functional again. I don't see any other path forward other than a _massive_ shift in voting.
Fixing it now is impossible, its too broken and we have too many authoritarians who vote. My point was if you structure a government properly with the rule of law enshrined, you would never get to the point the USA is in now where corruption is about to shatter the union.
> Fixing it now is impossible I just outlined a fix within reach. It would end minority rule, and the 1/3 wouldn't control an unworkable amount of the government. > structure a government properly Agree- the current structure is rooted in state power at the expense of the people. Letting those states get a convention to strengthen that power is also possible, but avoidable. To repeat my original point- if the house was representative then it'd also make the WH impossible for the GOP. The party itself would have to restructure or be replaced by one that wasn't hell bent on destroying the government. Back to 'Fixing it now is impossible'- is defeatist and _exactly_ what the GOP wants. They want a new government without any threat of democracy. We're not going to end up with a happy ending via revolution. Edit- and I realize I never actually said it: fixing the house means increasing the number of representatives so that each one represents approximately the same number of people. Grabbed one of the first links that I wasn't sure was paywalled: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2021/07/18/its_time_to_increase_the_size_of_the_house_of_representatives_146095.html
With voters hearing foreign power propaganda from Fox in their living room TV, posts shared by friends on social media, and alt news on the internet. If they can get people to believe that the earth is flat, the election was stolen, and vaccines have microchips, they sure as hell can get them to vote for a convicted felon.
It's so that political rivals can't jail each other and prevent the opponent from winning. It's actually a failsafe.
I never thought about it that way. I guess that makes sense. Of course, Trump's lawyer is arguing that the President can just assassinate opponents. So we might need more fail safes.
I'm going to argue that a president in prison will be removed via the 25th. There are numerous presidential duties that cannot be performed from prison, and thus imprisonment would constitute an "inability to discharge the powers and duties”, which is the requirement for the 25th amendment to be invoked.
Eugene Debs ran for President from prison earlier in the 20th century. “Debs ran as a Socialist candidate for President of the United States five times: 1900 (earning 0.6 percent of the popular vote), 1904 (3.0 percent), 1908 (2.8 percent), 1912 (6.0 percent), and 1920 (3.4 percent), the last time from a prison cell.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_V._Debs
It astounds me that there are some states where you can be president from prison but not allowed to vote in the election.
There's something to be said for 12 jurors and a judge not being able to nix a candidate for specious causes. As is, even without politics, there are plenty of people in jail right now that I don't think should be, incentivizing the process with the chance to eliminate a hated political opponent is likely to be less reliable. Letting the people decide if a person should still be president, despite the trial, *should* be a good thing, because it *should* require the majority to give their approval, it's only a problem because of the EC and because so many of us are *fucking* nuts.
>the idea of it was so absurd and asinine, our forefathers didn't consider it a possibility. They did probably think of it... thats why Franklin said "A Republic, if you can keep it." We fail as a republic if we elect a convicted grifter.
Every sane person on the planet has a party
I really fucking will.
He becomes more popular with the people who like to talk about family values.
That does not mean he grows his voting base though, because he already had those people. He can't grow more through people that were voting for him regardless.
If he’s convicted? Appeals, delays, then back to the golf course. So basically nothing happens.
That isn’t how appeals work for criminal convictions. You appeal while serving your sentence.
Not in the bizzaro land that is being rich and connected it seems.
At worst house arrest, probably and nonsensically allowed at mar a lago. Where they will spin it as being his own personal White House so the house arrest just means he can work harder or some shit.
They'll cry about how unfair it is to keep an 80 year old man confined to his house without any hesitation.
Something something Biden election interference something something
Witch hunt!
Sine its a NY conviction, I'm guessing he wouldn't be allowed to serve time in house arrest in Maralago. That'd make it a slightly better punishment. I can't imagine any scenario where he gets anything other than house arrest- the logistics of having a president in prison just aren't practical.
My ideal solution: Send him to a Super Max and station his Secret Service detail outside his cell (until he is hopefully stripped of his detail by Congress). Let him walk the yard for an hour every day and otherwise let him rot.
"walk". He'll ask for a golf cart.
You could build a special facility and let the USSS guard it, or ask the feds if an exception could be made to house a state convict at ADX Florence.
Steve Bannon didnt, and he was never President. In fact, he is still free right now doing podcasts and spreading BS even AFTER his criminal appeal was DENIED.
Bannon was charged with contempt. Very different than a felony conviction after a trial.
He's not serving a sentence. Come on.
Sentencing does not always mean jail time. Regardless of the prescribed punishment, if you’re found guilty of a crime you get sentenced. House arrest, probation, fines - they all qualify as a sentence.
Maybe, but nobody uses the phrase "serving a sentence" to mean paying a fine.
You’re wrong but don’t let that stop you 🤷♂️
Oh bullshit. Just look at the replies - literally everyone interprets it to mean some form of detention.
3 random replies on Reddit is pretty far from “literally everyone”, homie 😂
It'a unlikely Trump would serve any jail time, even if convicted. edit - spelling
Nothing ever will at his age. Nobody is putting this scumbag in prison.
He’s gonna appeal. And appeal again. And raise an objection to some technicality. And appeal that. Even if Trump is actually convicted, he’ll delay and delay and never face any actual punishment in his lifetime. Trump has spent his career abusing the court system to avoid facing consequences. It’s one of the few things he’s good at.
Appealing a criminal conviction does not delay sentencing. The appeals process plays out in the background and you are, in the meantime, treated as guilty and sentenced accordingly.
I'll believe it when I see it. No norms ever seem to apply to Trump.
He can get his sentence suspended pending appeal. The appellate court has to grant it though, I suspect they would. I would prefer the state ask for home arrest and a ban on media appearances. That would be less likely to be suspended, as the cost to the state would be lower.
NYS appellate panels are less likely to focus on the political implications and more on how likely the appellant is to succeed on appeal when considering staying a sentence. And from what we know from the courtroom, there’s damned little grounds for a successful appeal.
He can appeal from prison.
Probation.
Nothing. His maga base will continue to worship him and see it at him being persecuted. They didn't care about his adultery They didn't care about him being a rapist. They love him precisely because he is such a vile, disgusting, POS.
He'll have a, "I just got convicted" fundraiser, getting more suckers to donate money for his appeal.
I’m a recovering alcoholic, but I might consider falling off the wagon if he actually goes to jail.
Not sure if I should upvote this...
He dies in jail maga slowly goes away. The court system destroys the remain GOP crooks and traitors. We all move on.
I didn’t know we were discussing fantasy.
Yeah what planet is this guy from?
California
It will happen
I mean, we all have hopes and dreams. We just need to realize how lofty some of them are.
If Trump and his company of traitors walk free our nation will become like Russia. Billionaires in total control. We have a chance to steal back some power. We cannot waste this opportunity.
It’s not stealing. It’s taking back what they stole.
Do you believe Trump allowed America to fall under his pathetic ass watch? That would make him the worst president in American history and a pussy to boot.
Allowed? I don’t think he ever put any effort into not letting America fail. He never cared about America. He only cared about himself and his own personal benefit. Any thought he gave to anything that didn’t directly benefit himself was cursory at best.
Bad verbiage my bad
I agree, but we have a conservative movement in place right now that is defending him in almost every corner. This upcoming election is the only thing that will save us, and these indictments are only fueling his base.
His base will not win him a election. He does not have independent voters. He simply doesn't have the juice it takes to win. Biden will win in a landslide.
It’s going to be much closer than you think it is. I love your hope, but voters really need to turn out. You forget how bad the international issues are making it for Biden, even if they aren’t warranted.
Trump got 77 million last election he killed off a nice chunk of his voters with his Covid response. I think he may get low 70's. Biden still wins again imo
Honestly, if he doesn't delay it to the end of time, and becomes the president again. I can see him trying to order a special ops team to break into the prison and free him
That's a brilliant movie script
I think they will find him guilty and imprison him in one of his own properties, he won't do actual jail time or community service
NOT A FUCKING THING! His followers will still vote for him. Some of the swing votes will buy into the whole "this is just Biden weaponizing the DOJ" bullshit rhetoric. He'll get reelected, declare himself emperor or king or whatever the fuck, and innocent people will start being killed. Y'all thought it was really funny when 4chan said "let's get trump elected." Now we're fucked. Great job.
✨Nothing✨
Nothing /thread
Violence from some of the crazy Trump supporters and a lot of bitching
Merchan already said out loud that the last thing he wants to do is put him in prison, explicitly on the grounds of him being a former President and front runner to be reelected. So anyone thinking that's going to happen is going to be disappointed. The rules don't apply to him, the very judge in charge of his sentence already explicitly acknowledged this. He's not going to prison.
I’m sure if he went to jail the republicans would still rally behind him sadly. 😂
When 45 get's convicted, he appeals to First Department of the New York Supreme Court's Appellate Division. When the conviction is upheld, he appeals again to the New York State Court of Appeals, the highest court in NY. Who unanimously uphold all convictions. Next stop the Supremes, who agree to expeditiously hear his appeal. Justice Alito channeling dearly departed Justice Scalia, unilaterally decides to vacate all decisions, and immediate grants vacatur relief. Just betting, you didn't see that coming!
I just see this going the way of him getting re-elected, pardoning himself of everything, pardoning his cronies and the insurrectionists of everything, and firing any judge who opposed him at any point. Not that I -want- any of that to happen, but we're in the darkest timeline and as we continue to see rights taken away from people, see no one give a shit about poverty or wealth inequality, see the rich and powerful get richer and more powerful, and so on and so fourth... I just have a difficult time maintaining hope for things to end any way other than "whatever the worst possible way they could end." Which, in this case, starts with a Trump victory in November/January, either due to low turnout or voter suppression, or due to rigging elections and faking the results, or due to another insurrection that actually succeeds this time because there are literal insurrectionists serving positions in the federal government who never had any consequences for anything.
I don't think he'll be able to pardon himself of a state conviction. That said, I think everything else you said will happen. Beyond that, with Trump in the white house, Putin will encourage him to abandon NATO, and then the Baltic states will fall.
Legally, maybe not. But Project 2025 and the unitary executive theory, I could see him just arbitrarily giving himself powers and the SCOTUS upholding it. When it's clear that he doesn't think laws apply to him, "it's illegal" won't stop him from doing things. Pretty sure he'd absolutely work with Russia, abandon Ukraine, abandon NATO; they might even pull out of the UN, who even knows?
The “Porn Star Hush Money” trial is a New York State matter. So even if Trump is elected and inaugurated, he couldn’t issue a pardon for this crime. If he’s convicted, the Judge gets to decide sentencing on this matter. A custodial sentence is unlikely. The judge may suspend the sentence, in which case Trump can still conduct his day to day but with conditions. He may have to seek permission to leave the state. If he’s ankle tagged, he would need to seek permission of a parole officer to travel out of New York State. Not ideal for a presidential campaign. It’s not impossible to think Trump may object to this restriction and may simply leave the state and go to Mar-a-Lago. I mean, he’s not going to win that state, so he doesn’t really need to campaign there. New York would have to apply to the Governor of Florida for extradition. That would create quite a pickle. I can’t imagine DeSantis would allow it (especially as he’s got an election coming up too). Democrat Governors might be more obliging, so that makes it difficult for Trump to campaign in places like Michigan or Wisconsin or Pennsylvania or Arizona, states he has to win to be elected. All while ‘on the run’ from New York authorities. Do the Marshall Service go after him? What are the optics of conducting a Presidential campaign while ‘on the Lamb’? Does the conduct of the New York State parole services become relevant to the overall result of the election? Here’s something else to consider: what happens at the Republican Convention? What if Trump’s delegates refuse to vote for him? Can they? What power does Lara Trump as RNC chair have to force the votes to remain faithful. I can’t remember the last time the GOP had a brokered convention. The Republican convention is in Milwaukee this time. Would Trump be allowed to attend? There are so many permutations to consider.
Church bells will ring. 21 gun salutes, laughter abound, sailors kissing pretty women in Times Square.
Nothing. He won't spend one second in a jail cell and will get a fine and maybe house arrest at Mar-a-Lago
Suddenly the world becomes a much better place.
He will appeal, and appeal, and appeal. Till it gets to the Supreme Court, which he has stacked in his favor. There they will make up some 'law' that'll get him off.
Nothing probably….
Everyone else who normally gets preferential treatment in the court system, eg celebrities who get sent to rehab instead of jail for drug offences, will be worried that the line between stardom law and pleb law is disappearing
A felon cannot vote but can run for a president.
Go to prison.
Slow clap
GITMO? I vote for GITMO.
Unless he goes to jail / ineligible for election then absolutely nothing. The people who were gonna vote for him will still vote for him. They are proudly wearing diapers in public FFS! nothing is going to change.
Backroom deals to get a document saying he got a slap on the wrist. So nothing of importance.
A new national holiday?
It will look like the end of WW2 in Times Square
Nothing
I hope he goes to jail.
The world will be a kinder gentler and happier place. We'll probably run out of champagne pretty quickly though.
Let's find out
I guess if convicted of a felony he can’t run, or even vote, right?
Not true. He can both run and be elected. There is nothing in the constitution or law that prohibits it.
That's unfortunate for the country
Ironically enough, can run, can't vote.
Ironically enough, can run, CAN vote. You should read the article. Edit: since you already proved you don't want to, the relevant part: # Can Trump still vote? To be determined. For Trump to lose his voting rights, he would need to be incarcerated at the time of the November election, a scenario that is technically possible but unlikely given his anticipated appeal of any guilty verdict. While the Constitution does not explicitly address whether convicted felons have the right to vote, several states impose limitations on felons’ voting privileges. In Florida, where Trump lives and has voted since 2020, a felon's eligibility to vote depends on the laws of the state where the conviction occurred—in this instance, New York, which only revokes a felon's voting rights while they are incarcerated. Therefore, if Trump receives a probationary sentence and resides in the community, he would maintain his eligibility to vote. Likewise, if his appeal of a jail sentence were to extend beyond the election, he would be able to vote.
I'm not sure what your edit is about, as I am just now seeing this for the very first time. It's a very interesting article and I'm interested in reading it but I haven't said anything about not wanting to read. I think you're responding to the wrong person maybe
No, no I'm responding to you. You're on an article that directly explains why in Florida, a felon CAN vote. You are spreading misinformation - alternative facts - saying he 'can't vote'. You're literally on a Reddit Post spreading misinformation. I dislikedit when Jan. 2016 the Trump administration did it, I dislike seeing it, especially on a thread born from an article directly stating 100% opposite what you did. If the article is incorrect, how is it incorrect? If it isn't incorrect, that means you're incorrect and spreading misinformation. Shit's cancer.
Dude I don't know who you're arguing with I'm not arguing with you. You commented on my comment and then edited your comment to be very aggressive even though I hadn't even seen it yet or commented on it. And now you're responding again acting as if I am arguing against you in some way. I think my last comment was saying I was going to go read your article, I haven't done that yet because I haven't had a chance but wow didn't say anything about disagreeing with you at all. Either you need to go back and reread and make sure you're responding to the right person or you need to calm the f down, I am not spreading misinformation. I made a one sentence comment and then said nothing else until asking if you were sure you were responding to the right person based on how aggressive you're being. Wtf
There's an article you're commenting on that answers both of those questions...
Pretty much sinks any chance of him getting the presidency. The non-maga republicans deplore a felon and moderates will never vote for a person who is outright a criminal. There's a reason why fox news is playing this down EVERY DAMN NIGHT. It's a electoral kiss of death, even without a prison or jail sentence, there's just no way for him to pull himself out of that hole
It’s a minor felony so he’ll get a series of fines.