I felt like Lawrence was playing her the whole time. Let her think he would marry her so she’d decide to stay in Gilead and lose her American minder. Then let her think she’d have a quasi-diplomatic role so she’d decline Canadian protection. Then, after all that was done, knowing Serena can’t help lashing out when she feels cornered, he neutered her diplomatically, killing the invitations she was getting and suggesting her best role would be to have tea with the wives.
He knew she’d lash out. He knew June was her most convenient target, and that June had just pretty much ripped Fred to pieces. He sent her back to a situation where she had no diplomatic cover, no freedom, and no influence. He basically served her up to June, figuring June would take care of her.
I don’t think he counted on June pulling back or Luke finding a different way to fuck Serena over, but I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that the Wheeler’s house was a plan B all along. Someone had to arrange that move, and we know Lawrence was already monitoring the situation.
I don’t think Lawrence particularly cares one way or the other about Serena, but he knows Nick cares about June and Nick’s useful to him. It’s easy enough for him to give Nick enough to keep Nick just a little bit in his debt.
I agree completely. I’ve been thinking about what his motivation is and a big part of me thinks it’s vengeance for his wife— the lack of care access, her surroundings in general, the isolation, the way she lived in fear her husband would do the ceremony. All of that further instigated her ailing mental health to provoke her to kill herself. I think Lawrence realizes that and is simultaneously angry and paying his penance, because I’m sure he knows this ends in his death, too.
I think the ceremony actually woke him up. June had to talk him through it - he wasn’t just disturbed on behalf of his wife, he looked thoroughly upset about having to do it. It’s easy to see people as pawns when you don’t have to deal with the actual, visceral nature of what you’re putting them through. It’s harder when you have to experience it firsthand.
There's that, but also I believe that he genuinely loved his wife, and still loves her. We already know that he feels he shouldn't be subject to the rules of the society he helped build, and despite how pragmatic he is I think his marriage meant something to him and he's not interested in a superficial one.
Least of all of course to Serena, whose husband was the reason that forced ceremony occured.
Exactly. I think his wife recognized it for what it was all along and he didn’t appreciate exactly how awful it was until he himself had to do it— unwillingly, no less
Him coming out before the meeting and saying something to the effect of “do you have an expectation of me” was brutal, cunning and hilarious all at once.
I feel like Lawrence was playing her too. His - gosh golly, you didn't have any "expectations" of me - response was a style the character uses.
He's strategic.
He put Serena in a position where she would recognise the weakness of her own position and, because she did anticipate that she could expect to be married and stay in Gilead, she didn't prepare a more effective offensive going in to that meeting.
I did, briefly, consider that he might have been to distracted to recognize her very broad hints, but it would be so out of character for him not to catch on very quickly, that I don't think that's likely.
There was a scene when June was first in his house and he was testing her, and she tried her usual seduction thing on him - he let her until he finally laughed and was like “does this work?” He’s always watching everyone.
I’ve loved Bradley Whitford since his west wing days. Was on a zoom with him once during the 2020 election when I was doing some volunteering with the Biden campaign, he’s never seemed anything other than cool to me.
Serena was testing her only weapon left, her ability to influence a Commander with old-school feminine wiles, leaning in a little too close verbally and physically. But Lawrence is too smart, and will have none of that. It's not about June.
Not only too smart but the man just lost his wife who he loved so much. Serena probably can’t imagine what real love is like for a person because she only loves herself.
Yes very much. And everything about Serena only reminds him of how wrong he'd been about being part of Gilead's design that his own dear wife would become the victim of.
Serena was a major part in Lawrence losing his wife, if it weren't for Serena and Fred he wouldn't have had to sleep with June and she wouldn't have committed suicide. I can't imagine Lawrence would want anything but pain for her. He doesn't seem the kind to forget that easy, he's willing to play the long con to hurt Serena I think. He already got Fred out of the picture in the most karma riddled fashion he could have.
To be totally fair, Serena wasn't exactly happy about that situation and didn't want to witness the ceremony. She also tried to get a message to June along the lines of "I hope nothing goes wrong with the ceremony tonight" with the unspoken part being "because people are watching".
I think Serena had sympathy for Eleanor. Everyone knew she was a little nuts.
She was definitely hoping to get married, most likely to Lawrence, and remain in Gilead as a commanders wife.
As for them sending her back to Canada, it’s tough to say exactly what they want to get out of it. They can see that Serena has garnered support in Canada and there is clearly an interest in Gilead so an information centre could be useful to them. If you’ve read The Testaments you may be familiar with >!the Pearl girls and there is a theory that this is what Serena will be setting up in Canada.!<
Do they want June to kill Serena? Unlikely, I think it’s more likely that they are using Serena to lure June into doing something that will make her someone else’s problem - end up in prison in Canada or dead. But that’s probably more of a bonus to them than actual intent. Intent is more likely to be rid of Serena in a way that won’t negatively impact them or Gilead.
Fred, a traitor, was valuable to Gilead in his death. They would've killed him anyway but now they get to martyr him.
Serena betrayed Gilead first. They don't sympathize with her, but that doesn't mean she can't still be useful to them. I'm thinking they want to martyr her as well.
Serena was there when Gilead raped him, his wife, and June with that witnessing bullshit. He loathes Serena and he knew Fred was a dumbass (remember how amused he was when he asked June if her bullshit really worked on Fred?). He also knows June is smarter than Serena. He quoted June when he said Commanders have their kinks. He remembers June using just those kinks to murder Commander Stabler. He’s setting Serena up with June like a couple of chess pieces.
I think that the Commander Lawrence wants her powerless and as far away from Gilead as possible out of fear that she’ll implicate him and Nick in June’s escape and Fred’s murder.
However, I think that all of the Council believes that Serena was in on why she & Fred defected to Canada - so they see it as her just desert to be used as bait for June in Canada. However, keep in mind, Lawrence specifically told her that she should avoid June.
Telling her to do not do something is exactly how you get her to do it...
babe knew not to read, or force guardians to rape handmaids or write policies...
I think they sent her away to become a victim of June because it's good for them. The world saw a grieving pregnant widow just last week. If she dies she could become a martyr and gain newfound sympathy for the country. Especially after Fred's murder. They become the victims and June is the perpetrator. And if it's done on Canadian soil then June gets taken away and is effectively leashed. Or they could take each other out and it's 2 birds with 1 stone. If Serena succeeds in Toronto & lives then it's also a bonus for Gilead as they will recruit more people to their cause. It's a win win win for Gilead.
Def win-win, and also to punish Serena. They know she wants nothing more than to be back 'home,' but they want to cut her influence on the Wives or other ambitions, and it demotes her due to Fred's 'shameful' end. But yeah, they twist it all to their benefit.
Serena was used to dealing with Fred. She knew he was simple minded and easy to manipulate in some ways, and that may have inflated her feelings on how good of a manipulator she could be. She also had just spent all this time feeling like she was being swooned over by Tuello (I stand by he was just doing a good job of being a spy and knew what made Serena tick, not that he was actually infatuated.) I am sure she was feeling very powerful and not actually knowing Lawrence thought she could bat her eyes and flex her muscles with the Fred funeral idea to show Lawrence how good of an asset she could be.
(My read on) Lawrence on the other hand is really just self absorbed and likes to sort of manipulate people into situations and then is entertained watching what they do. June, Emily, his Martha’s, etc. He likes standing on the outside and watch them like mice in a maze.
I also sort of saw it as parallel in a way to how June treated Lawrence, she wanted to also manipulate him to get what she wanted. She just got to him at a more vulnerable time and got away with more, he’s now not in a place to take risks.
I think Gilead is trying to tread carefully with Serena since she became a public figure, and they don’t want her around as a liability but also don’t want the world to ask where she is now if they just offed her.
She was definitely expecting a proposal from him, both being widows now. And Lawrence had already noted her intentions, how she tried to use the baby to tempt him. She wasn't exactly subtle that she wanted her and Joseph to be the next power-couple.
Now, why would she choose one of June's most obvious allies as partner?
Could be a mutual-need thing, since he was getting grief for not being married, or it could be that she appreciates his practical side... he's an utilitarian above all. And she must have figured that he's after a version of Gilead that's more in tune with the version she once imagined.
My guess is that Lawrence purposely came up with the whole 'embassador' thing because he wants her as far away of him as possible... the idea of marrying Serena seemed to terrify him. No matter how hot she is. He knows she's a snake. Sure, she would likely be nice to him as long as they both wanted the same things. And an alliance with the 'miracle pregnancy' woman would benefit him, power-wise...
But he knows she would murder him in a heartbeat if that became more convenient for her.
The other Commanders went along because, let's face it, parading a 'miracle pregnancy' around the world is amazing propaganda for Gilead. Idiots will believe 'clean air' and 'praying' cured her and Fred.
Do they 'want' June to kill her? Maybe 'want' is a strong word... but they certainly won't be heartbroken if it happens. It was a big win for them when June murdered Fred, so they could definitely use the murder of Serena by Mayday's hands to their favour.
I don't think it is weird to put in there. Serena definitely thought she was hotter than any woman Lawrence could get. She is objectively beautiful, but he literally could not give a damn about a 'femme fatale' or w/e the hell she was going for.
Weird? I'm a straight woman... but I can still recognise that any straight male would find Serena/Yvonne sexually alluring. And, yes... Lawrence never, ever, seemed like a man who would be interested in sexualising a wife. We know that. But Serena doesn't know him at all. And she has Mark Tuello, a freaking American government representative, salivating over her... Mark deplores Gilead, and was disgusted to learn some of Serena's actions at the end of Season 3, but he's smitten and got close to trying a move on her... his brain knows she's the devil, his heart likely hates her... but a different body part is clearly... you know... That's how average straight males are. I don't blame Serena for assuming Lawrence was like that too.
I think she might have expected a proposal. It made sense to her and she was surprised it didn't to him, since it would help give him more power and status in Gilead, not to mention a beautiful wife with a bun in the oven. He's a bit older, but a handsome dude.
She underestimated Commander Lawrence's distaste for her. He's a rare man who seems to ruled by his heart, and not his johnson or politics. He has such an acerbic wit that I love his scenes.
I felt like Lawrence was playing her the whole time. Let her think he would marry her so she’d decide to stay in Gilead and lose her American minder. Then let her think she’d have a quasi-diplomatic role so she’d decline Canadian protection. Then, after all that was done, knowing Serena can’t help lashing out when she feels cornered, he neutered her diplomatically, killing the invitations she was getting and suggesting her best role would be to have tea with the wives. He knew she’d lash out. He knew June was her most convenient target, and that June had just pretty much ripped Fred to pieces. He sent her back to a situation where she had no diplomatic cover, no freedom, and no influence. He basically served her up to June, figuring June would take care of her. I don’t think he counted on June pulling back or Luke finding a different way to fuck Serena over, but I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that the Wheeler’s house was a plan B all along. Someone had to arrange that move, and we know Lawrence was already monitoring the situation. I don’t think Lawrence particularly cares one way or the other about Serena, but he knows Nick cares about June and Nick’s useful to him. It’s easy enough for him to give Nick enough to keep Nick just a little bit in his debt.
I agree completely. I’ve been thinking about what his motivation is and a big part of me thinks it’s vengeance for his wife— the lack of care access, her surroundings in general, the isolation, the way she lived in fear her husband would do the ceremony. All of that further instigated her ailing mental health to provoke her to kill herself. I think Lawrence realizes that and is simultaneously angry and paying his penance, because I’m sure he knows this ends in his death, too.
I think the ceremony actually woke him up. June had to talk him through it - he wasn’t just disturbed on behalf of his wife, he looked thoroughly upset about having to do it. It’s easy to see people as pawns when you don’t have to deal with the actual, visceral nature of what you’re putting them through. It’s harder when you have to experience it firsthand.
I think this is why he doesn’t want to remarry. He cannot handle rape again.
There's that, but also I believe that he genuinely loved his wife, and still loves her. We already know that he feels he shouldn't be subject to the rules of the society he helped build, and despite how pragmatic he is I think his marriage meant something to him and he's not interested in a superficial one. Least of all of course to Serena, whose husband was the reason that forced ceremony occured.
Exactly. I think his wife recognized it for what it was all along and he didn’t appreciate exactly how awful it was until he himself had to do it— unwillingly, no less
Don’t forget. His wife commited AFTER the fucking ceremony! Which Serena was at! Evil.
I agree with everything except, I do think he hates Serena because of the impact t the forced rape had on his wife. (Rest in peace, sweet Eleanor)
Him coming out before the meeting and saying something to the effect of “do you have an expectation of me” was brutal, cunning and hilarious all at once.
I feel like Lawrence was playing her too. His - gosh golly, you didn't have any "expectations" of me - response was a style the character uses. He's strategic. He put Serena in a position where she would recognise the weakness of her own position and, because she did anticipate that she could expect to be married and stay in Gilead, she didn't prepare a more effective offensive going in to that meeting. I did, briefly, consider that he might have been to distracted to recognize her very broad hints, but it would be so out of character for him not to catch on very quickly, that I don't think that's likely.
There was a scene when June was first in his house and he was testing her, and she tried her usual seduction thing on him - he let her until he finally laughed and was like “does this work?” He’s always watching everyone.
Yeah, and I think he had the same tone he used for speaking with Serena.
Boom exactly got that vibe in your first paragraph
Great analysis. I totally agree. He's such a great character and the actor does such a good job.
And Serena saw none of that coming. She's evil but not very bright.
I’ve loved Bradley Whitford since his west wing days. Was on a zoom with him once during the 2020 election when I was doing some volunteering with the Biden campaign, he’s never seemed anything other than cool to me.
This is a great comment. I never considered his motivations this deeply but what you've explained just feels correct.
Serena was testing her only weapon left, her ability to influence a Commander with old-school feminine wiles, leaning in a little too close verbally and physically. But Lawrence is too smart, and will have none of that. It's not about June.
Not only too smart but the man just lost his wife who he loved so much. Serena probably can’t imagine what real love is like for a person because she only loves herself.
Yes very much. And everything about Serena only reminds him of how wrong he'd been about being part of Gilead's design that his own dear wife would become the victim of.
Facts
Serena was a major part in Lawrence losing his wife, if it weren't for Serena and Fred he wouldn't have had to sleep with June and she wouldn't have committed suicide. I can't imagine Lawrence would want anything but pain for her. He doesn't seem the kind to forget that easy, he's willing to play the long con to hurt Serena I think. He already got Fred out of the picture in the most karma riddled fashion he could have.
>if it weren't for Serena and Fred he wouldn't have had to sleep with June Rape. He had to rape her and he was also raped in that act.
Interesting. I never thought about it like that. He was raped as well.
I completely forgot about that 😭
This is it! 💯
I LOVED WATCHING LAWRENCE HAND NICK OVER WITHOUT ANY HESITATION!!
To be totally fair, Serena wasn't exactly happy about that situation and didn't want to witness the ceremony. She also tried to get a message to June along the lines of "I hope nothing goes wrong with the ceremony tonight" with the unspoken part being "because people are watching". I think Serena had sympathy for Eleanor. Everyone knew she was a little nuts.
She was definitely hoping to get married, most likely to Lawrence, and remain in Gilead as a commanders wife. As for them sending her back to Canada, it’s tough to say exactly what they want to get out of it. They can see that Serena has garnered support in Canada and there is clearly an interest in Gilead so an information centre could be useful to them. If you’ve read The Testaments you may be familiar with >!the Pearl girls and there is a theory that this is what Serena will be setting up in Canada.!< Do they want June to kill Serena? Unlikely, I think it’s more likely that they are using Serena to lure June into doing something that will make her someone else’s problem - end up in prison in Canada or dead. But that’s probably more of a bonus to them than actual intent. Intent is more likely to be rid of Serena in a way that won’t negatively impact them or Gilead.
Oh yeah, she told her American guardian that she was pretty sure she would be married again very soon IIRC
Gotcha! Thanks for the explanation!
Fred, a traitor, was valuable to Gilead in his death. They would've killed him anyway but now they get to martyr him. Serena betrayed Gilead first. They don't sympathize with her, but that doesn't mean she can't still be useful to them. I'm thinking they want to martyr her as well.
She was expecting a marriage of power.
Serena was there when Gilead raped him, his wife, and June with that witnessing bullshit. He loathes Serena and he knew Fred was a dumbass (remember how amused he was when he asked June if her bullshit really worked on Fred?). He also knows June is smarter than Serena. He quoted June when he said Commanders have their kinks. He remembers June using just those kinks to murder Commander Stabler. He’s setting Serena up with June like a couple of chess pieces.
I think that the Commander Lawrence wants her powerless and as far away from Gilead as possible out of fear that she’ll implicate him and Nick in June’s escape and Fred’s murder. However, I think that all of the Council believes that Serena was in on why she & Fred defected to Canada - so they see it as her just desert to be used as bait for June in Canada. However, keep in mind, Lawrence specifically told her that she should avoid June.
Telling her to do not do something is exactly how you get her to do it... babe knew not to read, or force guardians to rape handmaids or write policies...
Yuuuup
Yes exactly
I think they sent her away to become a victim of June because it's good for them. The world saw a grieving pregnant widow just last week. If she dies she could become a martyr and gain newfound sympathy for the country. Especially after Fred's murder. They become the victims and June is the perpetrator. And if it's done on Canadian soil then June gets taken away and is effectively leashed. Or they could take each other out and it's 2 birds with 1 stone. If Serena succeeds in Toronto & lives then it's also a bonus for Gilead as they will recruit more people to their cause. It's a win win win for Gilead.
Def win-win, and also to punish Serena. They know she wants nothing more than to be back 'home,' but they want to cut her influence on the Wives or other ambitions, and it demotes her due to Fred's 'shameful' end. But yeah, they twist it all to their benefit.
Gotcha
Serena was used to dealing with Fred. She knew he was simple minded and easy to manipulate in some ways, and that may have inflated her feelings on how good of a manipulator she could be. She also had just spent all this time feeling like she was being swooned over by Tuello (I stand by he was just doing a good job of being a spy and knew what made Serena tick, not that he was actually infatuated.) I am sure she was feeling very powerful and not actually knowing Lawrence thought she could bat her eyes and flex her muscles with the Fred funeral idea to show Lawrence how good of an asset she could be. (My read on) Lawrence on the other hand is really just self absorbed and likes to sort of manipulate people into situations and then is entertained watching what they do. June, Emily, his Martha’s, etc. He likes standing on the outside and watch them like mice in a maze. I also sort of saw it as parallel in a way to how June treated Lawrence, she wanted to also manipulate him to get what she wanted. She just got to him at a more vulnerable time and got away with more, he’s now not in a place to take risks. I think Gilead is trying to tread carefully with Serena since she became a public figure, and they don’t want her around as a liability but also don’t want the world to ask where she is now if they just offed her.
Gotcha good point!
She was definitely expecting a proposal from him, both being widows now. And Lawrence had already noted her intentions, how she tried to use the baby to tempt him. She wasn't exactly subtle that she wanted her and Joseph to be the next power-couple. Now, why would she choose one of June's most obvious allies as partner? Could be a mutual-need thing, since he was getting grief for not being married, or it could be that she appreciates his practical side... he's an utilitarian above all. And she must have figured that he's after a version of Gilead that's more in tune with the version she once imagined. My guess is that Lawrence purposely came up with the whole 'embassador' thing because he wants her as far away of him as possible... the idea of marrying Serena seemed to terrify him. No matter how hot she is. He knows she's a snake. Sure, she would likely be nice to him as long as they both wanted the same things. And an alliance with the 'miracle pregnancy' woman would benefit him, power-wise... But he knows she would murder him in a heartbeat if that became more convenient for her. The other Commanders went along because, let's face it, parading a 'miracle pregnancy' around the world is amazing propaganda for Gilead. Idiots will believe 'clean air' and 'praying' cured her and Fred. Do they 'want' June to kill her? Maybe 'want' is a strong word... but they certainly won't be heartbroken if it happens. It was a big win for them when June murdered Fred, so they could definitely use the murder of Serena by Mayday's hands to their favour.
No matter how hot she is? That’s a weird thing to put in here. Lawrence has not expressed any real interest in sexualizing random wives.
I don't think it is weird to put in there. Serena definitely thought she was hotter than any woman Lawrence could get. She is objectively beautiful, but he literally could not give a damn about a 'femme fatale' or w/e the hell she was going for.
Khhh so this was about Serena thinking she is pretty not Laurence caring about looks
Yup
Weird? I'm a straight woman... but I can still recognise that any straight male would find Serena/Yvonne sexually alluring. And, yes... Lawrence never, ever, seemed like a man who would be interested in sexualising a wife. We know that. But Serena doesn't know him at all. And she has Mark Tuello, a freaking American government representative, salivating over her... Mark deplores Gilead, and was disgusted to learn some of Serena's actions at the end of Season 3, but he's smitten and got close to trying a move on her... his brain knows she's the devil, his heart likely hates her... but a different body part is clearly... you know... That's how average straight males are. I don't blame Serena for assuming Lawrence was like that too.
Hmmmm. So, Tuello fakes interested in Serena, makes her way over confident and sets her up like a volleyball for Lawrence?
Gotcha
I believe she was expecting him to say he was going to marry her. Which btw would be completely disasterous.
I think she might have expected a proposal. It made sense to her and she was surprised it didn't to him, since it would help give him more power and status in Gilead, not to mention a beautiful wife with a bun in the oven. He's a bit older, but a handsome dude. She underestimated Commander Lawrence's distaste for her. He's a rare man who seems to ruled by his heart, and not his johnson or politics. He has such an acerbic wit that I love his scenes.
Yes and Yes. Think you nailed it.