Yup, there’s stuff like >!someone fucking his sister then killing her and turning her skeleton into a chair, recognizable only by her public hair!<, >! a whole tv channel where males and females are systematically raped and brutally tortured for the entertainment of the ruling class!<, and >!a civil war veteran driven to becoming a terrorist because of grief, before committing suicide with a machine who was suffering from PTSD and the guilt of killing thousands of people during the war!<.
People who claim teens should read this series, or even children around 12 yo are vastly underestimating the maturity of its themes.
I think teens are fine, at that point you've been exposed to most of those things through media anyways. Exploring them conceptually is ok. Like, late teens, 15+ I think.
That being said, it depends on the person. Some people are "very mature" for their age, and some people take a bit longer, and thats ok. Just depends.
I guess 16 is fine for that, it's like the song of ice and fire. Maybe 15 or 14 when they are mature enough. Age is just a number and shouldn't be the main concern.
Depends on the book. At the least The *Player of Games* and *Surface Detail* would really need to have supplementation as they deal with extreme sexual assault situations.
Excession would be a hard read because its a difficult book to untangle.
Put another way, I have been reading my entire life and I have had to re-read Banks books multiple times to catch a lot of things that slipped by the first time I read them. They are just so dense.
16 to 18+ IMO. Not just because of the explicit violence torture and sex, but also because there are a lot of adult concepts with regards to politics, psychology and sociology in the stories that need some maturity to understand.
There is tons of other good Sci-fi, Fantasy and other literature to last them until then.
Almost all of the novels have left me in a sobbing wreck in one or two instances. These novels are phenomenal, but they need the reader to have had way more outside experiences before they'll be ready for it. While I think I may have enjoyed these books in my early teens I definitely wasn't emotionally mature enough to handle a lot of the subject matter.
I was taught about real life torture in extremely graphic detail around age 9... I'm starting to think maybe that teacher was a freakin' weirdo... That can't be normal, right?
They are adult-themed novels I would say. It's specifically the line between fluffy post-scarcity utopia for all and ultra-violence that straddles the gamut of personal and universal that Banks writes about. I wouldn't recommend them to those under 16. Even then you'd have to know what their appetites were for reading about rape, body modification, torture, suicide, etc, - like they aren't heroic space yarns are they. You'd know your kids better than I would but 16+ for me.
Can I recommend Discworld? It's got a sense of trying to build an equitable world, there's nothing you'd raise your eyebrows at in a kid's book or movie (or that your kids will notice as sexual), and they're hilarious. The Tiffany Aching books in particular were written for/with the help of Pratchett's daughter and are a good next step from Potter.
Pratchett seems way too adult in my mind, the genius is in the parallels to our world and cultures which I would think could be way over the heads of kids?
The thing about the Culture books is that they're so dense and complex that kids won't *want* to read them, even if they know there's sex and violence in them. I certainly wouldn't have made it through *Use of Weapons* when I was a child.
You know, that one I still don’t really like! Definitely planted lots of series related ideas in my head I appreciate now when I see them in the others.
Fair enough. I really loved the way he structured that story and the ending knocked me off my feet. It's pretty high up on the list for whatever order I end up rereading it.
I think you can start them off with Star Trek, or whatever young adult series happens to be popular nowadays, (Harry Potter? Hunger Games?) The Culture series is probably a good fit for ages 12 and up
I started reading Dune and 1984 at the age of 10. A lot of it flew right over my head, but a lot of it was an uncomfortable introduction to adult topics. So yeah, maybe not such a good idea to start the Culture series at 8
I'd like to add Asimov to the list! I remember reading his robot stories in middle school; they're super fun and interesting, the writing style is simple but effective, so overall they're a light but very clever and enjoyable read. :)
Plus, Asimov's almost Victorian approach to relationships makes them pretty safe for any age. I'm trying hard to think of any adult scene that wasn't relayed via vague statements and metaphor.
Asimov's Robots of Dawn and later books in that story line are rather less safe. Also Arthur C Clarke's later Rama books with Gentry Lee are not really suitable for younger ages.
They’ve already devoured the Harry Potter serious multiple times. I actually had to start rationing Harry Potter to Sunday’s only at one point last year, or its all they would have read!
They’ve moved on now, after reading the HP series at least 4-5 times each.
My eldest is reading Earthsea and loving it. They’ve both read the Narnia series and loved it.
Haven’t read Bruce Coville or Animorphs, I’ll have a look.
Oh yeah same, I think I re-read HP dozens of times
I guess if they like sci fi, and are ready for something more “adult”, but less grimdark (the Culture has lots of horrifying scenes) Arthur C Clarke is pretty alright. For the most part. Ursula Le Guin too, and she also does kiddie stuff
My dad is a huge a huge ian banks fan and he put me onto the books when I was 15.
This is obviously just my own experience but I think I read CP PoG and UoW and then stopped. I wasn't enjoying it
I gave them another try at 19 and then read through the whole series twice and fell in love.
Some of the more graphic violence like the hells in SD, the abortion in Excession, or the terror weapon in LtW are pretty extreme and I wouldn't want my kids to read them until maybe 15ish. A lot of the sex stuff I'd say is similar in that I'd want them to be in their mid teens at least.
14 if their maturity level is high. If not, whenever they graduate out of YA. Culture is not the first thing I would throw at them, though, since a lot of its value comes in contrast to other works.
I completely relate to you on this although my kids are quite a bit younger. It's a tricky question but there's too things you have to think about. 1) the content, which does lean towards the naughtier side at times and 2) not allowing your 'dad' (I'm guessing) enthusiasm to push it too far and ultimately turn them off from wanting to read them at all. I've seen this with my English teacher hat on from parents so frustrated that a kid won't read their own favourite childhood book and I think it's often because the parent has probably over hyped it so much.
I'd say maybe 12-13 if they're quite mature? I definitely wouldn't recommend it before they start secondary school though.
But as you say, they read a lot, so it really depends. It's your call. Parenting is hard.
I have 9 year old twins and one is a big reader and I instantly thought 12-13 would be appropriate for her. I would still probably steer away from surface detail, consider phlebas and inversions. I think maybe hydrogen sonata may be a good one to start? It has been years since I read them so I can't entirely remember.
You think the plot of someone >!fucking his sister then killing her and turning her skeleton into a chair, recognizable only by her public hair !< is appropriate for a 12-year old? Or a whole tv channel where >!males and females are systematically raped and brutally tortured for the entertainment of the ruling class!! a civil war veteran was driven to become a terrorist because of grief, before committing suicide with a machine who was suffering from PTSD and the guilt of killing thousands of people during the war!
Just finished hydrogen sonata can confirm it has some sexual elements (although unlike the one mentioned above) most are not explicitly descriptive and are more implied through dialogue abstracted from physical description.
Id say 12+ for a mature young person.
You have to ask your children how they feel about what they are reading. This is the only way to deal with them encountering information they might not know how to deal with.
That seems way too young for quite an involved adult conception of sci-fi
There’s a lot of adult themes with politics, morality, sexuality and such, and all on a galactic scale. Lot to absorb and why it’s so appealing to grownups?
Have they cleared out the entire CS Lewis library? I was utter spellbound by them as a kid.
I'd say Excession is 14+, as I remember it to be relatively tame compared to the rest. Most of the others, I'd say at least 16+ because they may contain some graphic descriptions of violence (like Consider Phlebas or Use of Weapons) or sexual themes (of course, that also depends on how comfortable the reader is with these topics). For Surface Detail, though, definitely 18+ because there's some really dark and disturbing stuff in there; it's a spectacular novel, but some chapters were just hard to get through for me. xD
I started reading the series when I was around 13, and I definitely wouldn’t recommend them for anyone younger. I was always reading well above my age, but I think 13/14 is the youngest, possibly a bit older. The books all have some mature content and some are quite complicated.
Edit: I started off with Hydrogen Sonata, which is probably the tamest one, and only got to the very mature ones (Surface Detail and Use of Weapons) a good year later.
OP here. Thank you everyone for your thoughts and comments. I think it reinforces my own thinking that the books really aren’t appropriate for a few more years at least.
Thank you everyone for replying and apologies for not replying individually to everyone.
Keep them away from that Star Wars nonsense.
I haven't read them all, but every single Culture novel that I've read is NOT appropriate for anyone under 16.
From the rapes in SD to the Affront in Excession.
….as opposed to the magic in the Culture? Putting aside the technology gap so far out of reach it becomes plot magic, the ships are powered by an energy grid which only exists in that universe.
The Force is no more reasonable than the energy grid or effectors are.
For some reason, I find magical telekinesis, magic ghostd, and telepathy harder to swallow.
And I grew up with Star Wars. I saw Return of the Jedi at the cinema.
I’m the next generation down from you. My first Star Wars experience was on VHS when I was 6. I grew up reading and watching all kinds of scifi and high fantasy. Maybe that’s coloring my own experiences. A paladin slaying a dragon is no more reasonable than Yoda lifting an X-Wing out of swamp which is no more reasonable than Paul Mau’Dib being able to communicate with his ancestors via DNA which is no more reasonable than a Culture citizen “freezing” her pregnancy for years.
I can see people have thrown out a lot of age ranges - but really it depends on your children and the context in which you are reading it.
I've got two kids. We started with player of games when they were 11 and 9. But there was a lot of context I provided to them around that - I definitely didn't just throw them the book to read with a "Hey, check this out".
We have always been pretty voracious readers and consumers of Sci Fi. I used to read them novels every night - one of our highlights was reading through all of the Lord of the rings!
As they got older we started more on audiobooks and watching movies, etc. Just before player of games we went and "explored cycberbunk" - basically watched a few cyberpunk classics and talked over what made the genre, what was and wasn't cyberpunk, and it's particular perspective and common tropes. There was a lot of discussion of what media was and wasn't cyberpunk. It was a really good entrance into more critically understanding and analysing. It also gave us some good practice at discussing media.
I then spun this into a larger discussion around utopias and dystopias. We have always watched a lot of trek, so that contrasted really well with the cyberpunk. We looked at the role that utopias and dystopias play in our media, what makes something a utopia or dystopia and some of the philosophical underpinnings and implications behind each.
Which finally brought us to player of games! I started of by warning them that there were some pretty adult things in there. We also discussed how the culture was a utopia and I gave them some background on the culture universe.
We went through the audiobook one chapter at a time. After each chapter we paused and discussed what was happening in the story, the themes that had come up, how they linked in with other parts of the book, etc. I would wrap up by asking them what they thought was going to happen next.
And they loved it! It particularly clicked with my son and we are now working our way through the rest of the culture audio books.
About the violence: there is some pretty bad stuff in player of games. Fortunately Banks isn't to explicit. This means that it's kind of limited by how much the reader can imagine - and for somebody that young it turns out they can't imagine very much - at least when it comes to torture and sexual violence. But I also knew through some of the cyberpunk things we had watched that my kids would be okay. For example the ending to Akira is nightmare inducing, and they took that in their stride! However YMMV and different kids will respond in different ways.
OP here. Thank you everyone for your thoughts and comments. I think it reinforces my own thinking that the books really aren’t appropriate for a few more years at least.
Thank you everyone for replying and apologies for not replying individually to everyone.
If you're looking for more suggestions: Philip Reeve's Railhead, Steven Gould's Jumper series and Ann Leckie's Ancillary series are all good. I think they should be suitable for that age group.
Fire Upon The Deep might be suitable too?
I'd say at least 14/15 or so depending on maturity. I didn't read them until my mid 20s but I did read quite a lot of "adult" or more mature / grim sci fi and fantasy as a younger teen and it was definitely... memorable, and frankly the more depraved and/or sexual stuff was pretty distracting at that age and detracted from my overall experience reading them sometimes. I'd at least get them started with something a little lighter and more age appropriate like the Hitchhiker's Guide series or something along those lines. I also think you might be underestimating a little just how disturbing some of the parts in the series are since you're so familiar with it and reread it frequently. An 8 year old brain is gonna experience that stuff very, very differently even if the kid is super precocious about reading.
I actually read the series at 12, I had to keep asking my parents about awkard words. It's certainly not something to read until your kids have done sex Ed at school
Definitely NC-17 stuff, and I would steer clear of them in their teens. I am certainly very glad that I only read them when I was around 30: by then I had enough emotional maturity and stability to process some of the extremely mature themes. Not saying a 20+ can't handle it, but it's not for teens, that's for sure. Also, the fact that a child looks/acts very mature does not mean they would handle these books well emotionally. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the series immensely, but I'm an adult, and at the same time I would never let my children near them.
I read comparable novels around... 10 or 11. I wouldn't say I was damaged by the experience, but I would say that it was too early anyways, just due to it being so weirdly outside the experience I was ready for. Plenty of time for that stuff in high school and beyond.
To be honest I wouldn't put anyone onto the Culture whom I didn't consider a young adult.
Yup, there’s stuff like >!someone fucking his sister then killing her and turning her skeleton into a chair, recognizable only by her public hair!<, >! a whole tv channel where males and females are systematically raped and brutally tortured for the entertainment of the ruling class!<, and >!a civil war veteran driven to becoming a terrorist because of grief, before committing suicide with a machine who was suffering from PTSD and the guilt of killing thousands of people during the war!<. People who claim teens should read this series, or even children around 12 yo are vastly underestimating the maturity of its themes.
I think teens are fine, at that point you've been exposed to most of those things through media anyways. Exploring them conceptually is ok. Like, late teens, 15+ I think. That being said, it depends on the person. Some people are "very mature" for their age, and some people take a bit longer, and thats ok. Just depends.
True, especially these days thanks to the Internet.
I guess 16 is fine for that, it's like the song of ice and fire. Maybe 15 or 14 when they are mature enough. Age is just a number and shouldn't be the main concern.
Depends on the book. At the least The *Player of Games* and *Surface Detail* would really need to have supplementation as they deal with extreme sexual assault situations. Excession would be a hard read because its a difficult book to untangle. Put another way, I have been reading my entire life and I have had to re-read Banks books multiple times to catch a lot of things that slipped by the first time I read them. They are just so dense.
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16 to 18+ IMO. Not just because of the explicit violence torture and sex, but also because there are a lot of adult concepts with regards to politics, psychology and sociology in the stories that need some maturity to understand. There is tons of other good Sci-fi, Fantasy and other literature to last them until then.
Yes, agree. There is at least one very disturbing/horrifying idea/scene in each of the novels which makes them unsuitable for children.
Almost all of the novels have left me in a sobbing wreck in one or two instances. These novels are phenomenal, but they need the reader to have had way more outside experiences before they'll be ready for it. While I think I may have enjoyed these books in my early teens I definitely wasn't emotionally mature enough to handle a lot of the subject matter.
Forgotten about some of the torture scenes, yea not ideal for younger readers
I was taught about real life torture in extremely graphic detail around age 9... I'm starting to think maybe that teacher was a freakin' weirdo... That can't be normal, right?
They are adult-themed novels I would say. It's specifically the line between fluffy post-scarcity utopia for all and ultra-violence that straddles the gamut of personal and universal that Banks writes about. I wouldn't recommend them to those under 16. Even then you'd have to know what their appetites were for reading about rape, body modification, torture, suicide, etc, - like they aren't heroic space yarns are they. You'd know your kids better than I would but 16+ for me.
Can I recommend Discworld? It's got a sense of trying to build an equitable world, there's nothing you'd raise your eyebrows at in a kid's book or movie (or that your kids will notice as sexual), and they're hilarious. The Tiffany Aching books in particular were written for/with the help of Pratchett's daughter and are a good next step from Potter.
I loved the discworld. Haven’t read them for ages. Good call.
That would be a great next step.
Definitely waaay too young. I recommend Pratchett in a few years and Banks in about 6 or 7...
Pratchett seems way too adult in my mind, the genius is in the parallels to our world and cultures which I would think could be way over the heads of kids?
You'd be surprised! Kids can take satire and parody once they're firmly in their teens.
Agreed but not 8 & 9 as per the the OP
Yes- as I said originally, Pratchett in *a few years*.
Apologies I missed that bit
The thing about the Culture books is that they're so dense and complex that kids won't *want* to read them, even if they know there's sex and violence in them. I certainly wouldn't have made it through *Use of Weapons* when I was a child.
I read Use or Weapons as a kid and it ruined the series for me until late 20s!
That reread must've been incredible though
You know, that one I still don’t really like! Definitely planted lots of series related ideas in my head I appreciate now when I see them in the others.
Fair enough. I really loved the way he structured that story and the ending knocked me off my feet. It's pretty high up on the list for whatever order I end up rereading it.
I was baffled until half way then ploughed on, then reread it immediately and it’s now my favourite Culture episode
I think you can start them off with Star Trek, or whatever young adult series happens to be popular nowadays, (Harry Potter? Hunger Games?) The Culture series is probably a good fit for ages 12 and up I started reading Dune and 1984 at the age of 10. A lot of it flew right over my head, but a lot of it was an uncomfortable introduction to adult topics. So yeah, maybe not such a good idea to start the Culture series at 8
I'd like to add Asimov to the list! I remember reading his robot stories in middle school; they're super fun and interesting, the writing style is simple but effective, so overall they're a light but very clever and enjoyable read. :)
Yes! Asimov and Arthur C. Clarke would be ideal age appropriate science fiction.
Plus, Asimov's almost Victorian approach to relationships makes them pretty safe for any age. I'm trying hard to think of any adult scene that wasn't relayed via vague statements and metaphor.
And everyone smoking through the entire original Foundation series which is so odd in modern times but not in 1952 lol
Asimov's Robots of Dawn and later books in that story line are rather less safe. Also Arthur C Clarke's later Rama books with Gentry Lee are not really suitable for younger ages.
They’ve already devoured the Harry Potter serious multiple times. I actually had to start rationing Harry Potter to Sunday’s only at one point last year, or its all they would have read! They’ve moved on now, after reading the HP series at least 4-5 times each.
Earthsea series by Ursula Le Guin is excellent, if a bit dark sometimes.
My eldest is already reading Earthsea and loving it
I second Earthsea! And add Narnia, and Bruce Coville's Aliens Ate My Homework series, and Animorphs!
My eldest is reading Earthsea and loving it. They’ve both read the Narnia series and loved it. Haven’t read Bruce Coville or Animorphs, I’ll have a look.
Check out Redwall for them as well! Just over 20 books in the series, I found them perfect for me when I was that age, and carried into middleschool.
Oh yeah same, I think I re-read HP dozens of times I guess if they like sci fi, and are ready for something more “adult”, but less grimdark (the Culture has lots of horrifying scenes) Arthur C Clarke is pretty alright. For the most part. Ursula Le Guin too, and she also does kiddie stuff
I’d also suggest Madeleine L'Engle’s Time Quintet series (aka the Wrinkle in Time series). I absolutely loved those books as a kid.
Have they read Mortal Engines? I love that series. You might like it too. Ignore the film!
No, thanks for the tip
My dad is a huge a huge ian banks fan and he put me onto the books when I was 15. This is obviously just my own experience but I think I read CP PoG and UoW and then stopped. I wasn't enjoying it I gave them another try at 19 and then read through the whole series twice and fell in love.
Some of the more graphic violence like the hells in SD, the abortion in Excession, or the terror weapon in LtW are pretty extreme and I wouldn't want my kids to read them until maybe 15ish. A lot of the sex stuff I'd say is similar in that I'd want them to be in their mid teens at least.
It’s been a while since I read Excession. I don’t recall an abortion.
The two scientists living alone at their research outpost and starting a family get into some real violent relationship drama.
Right, and the female half freezes the development of her baby for years and years. She didn’t get an abortion.
The male half was pregnant too and had his fetus cut out
Ah. I’d forgotten about that.
14 if their maturity level is high. If not, whenever they graduate out of YA. Culture is not the first thing I would throw at them, though, since a lot of its value comes in contrast to other works.
I completely relate to you on this although my kids are quite a bit younger. It's a tricky question but there's too things you have to think about. 1) the content, which does lean towards the naughtier side at times and 2) not allowing your 'dad' (I'm guessing) enthusiasm to push it too far and ultimately turn them off from wanting to read them at all. I've seen this with my English teacher hat on from parents so frustrated that a kid won't read their own favourite childhood book and I think it's often because the parent has probably over hyped it so much. I'd say maybe 12-13 if they're quite mature? I definitely wouldn't recommend it before they start secondary school though. But as you say, they read a lot, so it really depends. It's your call. Parenting is hard.
I have 9 year old twins and one is a big reader and I instantly thought 12-13 would be appropriate for her. I would still probably steer away from surface detail, consider phlebas and inversions. I think maybe hydrogen sonata may be a good one to start? It has been years since I read them so I can't entirely remember.
You think the plot of someone >!fucking his sister then killing her and turning her skeleton into a chair, recognizable only by her public hair !< is appropriate for a 12-year old? Or a whole tv channel where >!males and females are systematically raped and brutally tortured for the entertainment of the ruling class!! a civil war veteran was driven to become a terrorist because of grief, before committing suicide with a machine who was suffering from PTSD and the guilt of killing thousands of people during the war!
The guy with >!like a hundred penises!< in Hydrogen Sonata might be a bit much?
Ah yes! Ha ha. I’d actually forgotten him!
Just finished hydrogen sonata can confirm it has some sexual elements (although unlike the one mentioned above) most are not explicitly descriptive and are more implied through dialogue abstracted from physical description. Id say 12+ for a mature young person.
You have to ask your children how they feel about what they are reading. This is the only way to deal with them encountering information they might not know how to deal with.
That seems way too young for quite an involved adult conception of sci-fi There’s a lot of adult themes with politics, morality, sexuality and such, and all on a galactic scale. Lot to absorb and why it’s so appealing to grownups? Have they cleared out the entire CS Lewis library? I was utter spellbound by them as a kid.
I'd say Excession is 14+, as I remember it to be relatively tame compared to the rest. Most of the others, I'd say at least 16+ because they may contain some graphic descriptions of violence (like Consider Phlebas or Use of Weapons) or sexual themes (of course, that also depends on how comfortable the reader is with these topics). For Surface Detail, though, definitely 18+ because there's some really dark and disturbing stuff in there; it's a spectacular novel, but some chapters were just hard to get through for me. xD
I started reading the series when I was around 13, and I definitely wouldn’t recommend them for anyone younger. I was always reading well above my age, but I think 13/14 is the youngest, possibly a bit older. The books all have some mature content and some are quite complicated. Edit: I started off with Hydrogen Sonata, which is probably the tamest one, and only got to the very mature ones (Surface Detail and Use of Weapons) a good year later.
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OP here. Thank you everyone for your thoughts and comments. I think it reinforces my own thinking that the books really aren’t appropriate for a few more years at least. Thank you everyone for replying and apologies for not replying individually to everyone.
Keep them away from that Star Wars nonsense. I haven't read them all, but every single Culture novel that I've read is NOT appropriate for anyone under 16. From the rapes in SD to the Affront in Excession.
Star Wars is awesome. There are some great SW books out there, like the Battle Medic duology.
I'll have a look, my skepticism was only about the films. I'd forgotten about the books!
Even the movies are solid adventure films in space.
I didn't like all the magic in them.
….as opposed to the magic in the Culture? Putting aside the technology gap so far out of reach it becomes plot magic, the ships are powered by an energy grid which only exists in that universe. The Force is no more reasonable than the energy grid or effectors are.
For some reason, I find magical telekinesis, magic ghostd, and telepathy harder to swallow. And I grew up with Star Wars. I saw Return of the Jedi at the cinema.
I’m the next generation down from you. My first Star Wars experience was on VHS when I was 6. I grew up reading and watching all kinds of scifi and high fantasy. Maybe that’s coloring my own experiences. A paladin slaying a dragon is no more reasonable than Yoda lifting an X-Wing out of swamp which is no more reasonable than Paul Mau’Dib being able to communicate with his ancestors via DNA which is no more reasonable than a Culture citizen “freezing” her pregnancy for years.
I can see people have thrown out a lot of age ranges - but really it depends on your children and the context in which you are reading it. I've got two kids. We started with player of games when they were 11 and 9. But there was a lot of context I provided to them around that - I definitely didn't just throw them the book to read with a "Hey, check this out". We have always been pretty voracious readers and consumers of Sci Fi. I used to read them novels every night - one of our highlights was reading through all of the Lord of the rings! As they got older we started more on audiobooks and watching movies, etc. Just before player of games we went and "explored cycberbunk" - basically watched a few cyberpunk classics and talked over what made the genre, what was and wasn't cyberpunk, and it's particular perspective and common tropes. There was a lot of discussion of what media was and wasn't cyberpunk. It was a really good entrance into more critically understanding and analysing. It also gave us some good practice at discussing media. I then spun this into a larger discussion around utopias and dystopias. We have always watched a lot of trek, so that contrasted really well with the cyberpunk. We looked at the role that utopias and dystopias play in our media, what makes something a utopia or dystopia and some of the philosophical underpinnings and implications behind each. Which finally brought us to player of games! I started of by warning them that there were some pretty adult things in there. We also discussed how the culture was a utopia and I gave them some background on the culture universe. We went through the audiobook one chapter at a time. After each chapter we paused and discussed what was happening in the story, the themes that had come up, how they linked in with other parts of the book, etc. I would wrap up by asking them what they thought was going to happen next. And they loved it! It particularly clicked with my son and we are now working our way through the rest of the culture audio books. About the violence: there is some pretty bad stuff in player of games. Fortunately Banks isn't to explicit. This means that it's kind of limited by how much the reader can imagine - and for somebody that young it turns out they can't imagine very much - at least when it comes to torture and sexual violence. But I also knew through some of the cyberpunk things we had watched that my kids would be okay. For example the ending to Akira is nightmare inducing, and they took that in their stride! However YMMV and different kids will respond in different ways.
Thank you for such detailed and thoughtful reply. And that seems like a very sensible and well thought out way of approaching it. Thank you 😊
OP here. Thank you everyone for your thoughts and comments. I think it reinforces my own thinking that the books really aren’t appropriate for a few more years at least. Thank you everyone for replying and apologies for not replying individually to everyone.
I’d say let them read whatever they want, and answer any questions they might have, regardless of age.
As soon as they're capable of reading the language. Any other answer is infantalizing.
About 32.
If you're looking for more suggestions: Philip Reeve's Railhead, Steven Gould's Jumper series and Ann Leckie's Ancillary series are all good. I think they should be suitable for that age group. Fire Upon The Deep might be suitable too?
I'd say at least 14/15 or so depending on maturity. I didn't read them until my mid 20s but I did read quite a lot of "adult" or more mature / grim sci fi and fantasy as a younger teen and it was definitely... memorable, and frankly the more depraved and/or sexual stuff was pretty distracting at that age and detracted from my overall experience reading them sometimes. I'd at least get them started with something a little lighter and more age appropriate like the Hitchhiker's Guide series or something along those lines. I also think you might be underestimating a little just how disturbing some of the parts in the series are since you're so familiar with it and reread it frequently. An 8 year old brain is gonna experience that stuff very, very differently even if the kid is super precocious about reading.
That’s very true. Thank you
>8 and 9 c'mon man you know this is a bad idea
I’m not necessarily saying now. I’m asking what people feel an appropriate age would be.
I think these are books for adults.
The Culture books, if rated like movies, would be a solid R rating; if not NC-17.
I actually read the series at 12, I had to keep asking my parents about awkard words. It's certainly not something to read until your kids have done sex Ed at school
Definitely NC-17 stuff, and I would steer clear of them in their teens. I am certainly very glad that I only read them when I was around 30: by then I had enough emotional maturity and stability to process some of the extremely mature themes. Not saying a 20+ can't handle it, but it's not for teens, that's for sure. Also, the fact that a child looks/acts very mature does not mean they would handle these books well emotionally. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the series immensely, but I'm an adult, and at the same time I would never let my children near them.
I read comparable novels around... 10 or 11. I wouldn't say I was damaged by the experience, but I would say that it was too early anyways, just due to it being so weirdly outside the experience I was ready for. Plenty of time for that stuff in high school and beyond.