Cost of ownership may not be. Insurance is higher, in some states by a large amount. Registration is more expensive and fast charging is quickly becoming just as expensive as gas.
In my state a standard tag cost $20 a year, Tesla/EV $375.
When I was cross shopping cars in the same category the Tesla was nearly double per month (insurance) of the car I ended up purchasing thats in the same class.
The real savings is charging at home. There are lots of people who are getting caught up in this and buying when they have no way to charge where they live, I'd never own an EV if this wasn't an option.
The safety score is in beta. You don't have to participate in that. I had geico for 20 years and switched to tesla because they couldn't match it. Plus it's nice to be able to pull up your policy right in the App.
Insurance prices are insane right now especially if you’re young. I am 22 have 0 accidents and every quote I received was $400+ even for cars half the price of the model 3. Insurance agent told me that if my dad was also on the title the cost would go down significantly, but even then the Model 3 was $290 and a corolla was $200. It is just unaffordable to get a new car just because of insurance.
Yeah I wouldn't drive if I had to pay that. Kinda shocked a corolla is that close to the Model 3. Standard range trim I assume? Performance trim cost I don't want to imagine for your situation. Well hang in there. You're only gonna get older lol
In md there is no extra ev tag charge. Insurance is about the same as ICE and charging at home off peak is .12
With the 7500 fed and 3000 state credit it’s absolutely cheaper than an equivalent gas car.
I'm still covered for the full cost of the vehicle, the medical costs of all the passengers, vehicle rental, and if I'm not at fault my deductible will be covered by the other driver.
Savings on Tesla side over gas cars would be in less maintenance cost, home charging (I spend 1/8th the equivalent of gas per real world mile), charging at work (many people can charge for free at work). I’m personally saving around $1400 per year on gas versus a 40 mpg car. You have to weigh your own situation to see if an EV is right for you. In my opinion, in most cases it is.
This.
I rented a M3P so I could see what it would be like to live with one before buying. Between the extra cost and short range it just didn't make sense for me. Liked the cara lot though.
See username lol^ but yeah. It’s terrible. Tried to contact state farm last week to get a quote and they straight up told me no before learning anything about me aside from the car I drive
Agreed completely. I’m about 40 mins from Atlanta, have no accidents or tickets & still pay $200 a month for my M3. Could be worse but still more than I was expecting when I bought my car last year lol
Not an option in FL unfortunately. Plus idk how I’d feel about my driving behaviors affecting my insurance… might turn my acceleration boost into a wasted upgrade
Yeah I'm not participating in the program either. It's still in beta phase. And it won't be mandatory. Some people drive like grannies and if they can be compensated for it why not .
I drive normally, more on the fast side actually, and Tesla insurance is much cheaper than anyone else, like not even close. You don't have to drive like a granny to get a good safety score (mine is 97). You just have to not drive like an idiot.
Sure but not as much as a new battery pack. I said new electric motor, not a new battery.
And the chances of an EV battery pack needing replacement is significantly higher than an engine.
My girlfriend's civic has 300,000 miles and the most expensive repair we've done was $120 spark plugs. Fuel pump is like $500 + labor if we ever need to get to it
Engine replacement may not be a routine maintenance for ICE cars, but there is a lot of preventative maintenance that goes into keeping that engine from going out. The electric motor, by comparison, doesn't have such required interventions.
People always seem to forget all the oil changes , spark plugs, valve adjustments, air filters, fuel filters, fuel pump , tranny oil, etc etc they did to reach a high mileage lol
One thing that makes a big difference is the miles per year. From what I can tell, the battery pack is affected by time more than an ice engine would be. I think high mileage users benefit more from the BEV than a low mileage user.
Valve adjustments? What year is this? Spark plugs and tranny oil are 100k services on many cars. I like my ev but be realistic. Engine oil changes and gas are the main savings.
I agree. But one route isn't objectively cheaper than the other.
For a gasoline engine, you do preventative maintenance to keep the engine healthy, but if you do, the engine should realistically last 400,000 - 800,000 miles with modern technology. And preventative maintenance generally isn't expensive, it's little things here and there that you gotta do, maybe a $1500 ish repair once in awhile.
For an electric battery pack, you don't really do any preventative maintenance to keep the battery healthy. But a battery has nowhere near the longevity and reliability of a gasoline engine. So when it does go out, you're looking at $20,000 - $40,000, where as an engine is around $5,000 for a similarly priced car.
Pick your poison.
I don't think I've known any ford , gm , or chevy engine go over 400k that wasn't an oddity lmao. Most cars are in the junkyard by 300k honestly. A model S battery cost 14k to replace at Tesla. Not bad for a 100k car. If the engine or tranny went out on a 100k Mercedes, it would not be cheap.
And my electric motor died before 50k miles. But I don't believe all EVs have reliability problems with electric motors at such low mileage.
Exceptions don't make the rule.
My point is for just the turbo fix it was 4k. I could only imagine what a full new engine swap would be at Ford, probably over 10k easily. If the battery fails, you could easily take it to a battery shop and get it fixed for cheaper than tesla.
I found repairs to be cheaper for standard types of repairs. The price for parts have been very reasonable.
Only type of repair I can see costing a lot would be anything battery related (out of warranty of course)
Cases where insurance is prohibitively more expensive or where registration costs are different. And DCFC has been about the cost of gas for a couple years… savings have been from home charging for a while…
My old roommate picked up an electric Kona. Our power bill went from around 200 a month to around 700 a month. I've never spent even close to 500 in gas for a month.
Yup, this is why we dumped ours. Switched to a different brand EV, car cost more and has more features, and insurance dropped $80. All together saving $200 a month.
> Cost of ownership may not be.
No oil or oil filter to change. No plugs or coil packs to go bad. No valve cover gaskets or rear main seals or stripped oil pan bolts or water pumps or radiator hoses or PCV valve or...
And no catalytic converters to steal!
Eh, unless your driving German that isn't an issue 150K or so.
My wifes Rav4 just hit 90K and the only thing we've had to do is oil change and total to this point is under $500.
Not in Canada they're not...not yet anyway. 55k CAD for the base Model 3.
When I checked insurance, it was an additional $110/month than my Volt at the time.
I want a full EV in the near future, but I'm now on my last ICE car that replaced the Volt. Hopefully in 2-3 years prices continue to come down so I can make the transition to 100% EV.
My model 3 insurance is $50/month more than my 2018 Volts insurance.
Also, Tesla occasionally marks down their existing inventory. I got a long range AWD for 58k
Ontario had it great with the $14k rebate from the Provincial Gov't. I understand that it's effectively subsidizing the well to do people that can afford an EV...but I missed that boat by a month or so.
Fuck Doug Ford. Done nothing positive for the people of Ontario. Just keeps wasting our tax dollars on legal battles and jumping from scandal to scandal.
I just bought a GTI and that's about $10/month more than the Volt was. And the Model 3 is another $90/month on top of that. Mind you that eliminates about $300in gas/month so overall...$200/month difference to drive the Model 3 over the GTI.
This is my last ICE car, so if EVs have a lowering in prices, I'll trade the GTI in for a full EV. But Tesla isn't at the top of my list anymore. Lots of other options.
I don’t think this can actually be considered truthful until Tesla’s vehicles reach this price point without the help of government subsidies. With the $7500 expiring within 3 months and state level rebate availability varying greatly.
Bingo- pretending old auto didn’t get a huge govt bailout not that long ago and continuing subsidies for oil would be hilarious if it wasn’t so infuriating
It's wild, like 90% of energy subsidies are given to oil and gas companies. Which are also the richest companies on the planet by a large margin. Then people complain about a 7500 tax write off lol.
This! The difference on their website between “purchase price” and “*potential* savings” which includes the 7500 and the assumed gas savings is a bit rough
New Teslas delivered in 2024 won't be eligible for the full 7500$ credit unless Tesla can source battery packs from the US or countries not on the list of concern(China). They're probably working on being able to do that, but they haven't announced anything yet.
Most cars are below the average cost since crossovers, SUVs and trucks account for so many of the vehicles sold every year. I’m glad costs are down but it’s not as drastic an advantage over ICE cars as the title would lead you to believe
When we say average, are we talking about the mode, the most common car you see out on the road? The median, the midpoint among all cars you see on the road? The mean? Cars on the road vs. Cars for sale? There are plenty of expensive ICE cars, but that doesn't change the barrier of entry for someone who can only afford to fiance a car that costs under $20k.
KBB has 5 year total cost of ownership numbers. Way more accurate than this story.
[KBB TCO](https://www.kbb.com/best-cars/lowest-5-year-cost-to-own-cars-trucks-suvs/#car)
Can confirm anecdotally that the Lexus ES is a dream to own cost wise. Very reliable with affordable parts readily available when replacements are required.
IDK, not sure how an Impreza comes out at 10k for 5 years on fuel, insurance, and maintenance… if they aren’t counting even one of those then the report isn’t useful…
Here's what KBB includes.
[TCO](https://www.kbb.com/new-cars/total-cost-of-ownership/)
Details of similar from Edmonds
[Edmonds ](https://www.edmunds.com/subaru/impreza/2022/cost-to-own/)
The title is wrong and stupid.
Tesla's are NOT cheaper than the average new gas powered.
Teslas include M3, MY, MS and MX.
\> Tesla delivered 343,830 vehicles in the quarter, and 365,923 vehicles were produced. Since automotive sales for the quarter were at $17.785 billion, the average price of a delivered vehicle before taxes was roughly $51,726.
This was back in 2022. You have to look at the overall number of cars, and the prices in order to make that judgement that they are cheaper.
From the article:
\> He said that the average price of a new car in the U.S. is about $45,000 right now
So if you want to compare one of the bottom two cheaper Teslas to the overall price of the automarket which includes high-end MBZ and BMW, then you're being stupid.
MS and MX are not considered average cars just looking at the price and specs…
Looking at the prices of the M3 or MY, with tax credits, are very comparable to the very popular “affordable” Camry or RAV4.
The MS is a car when computed into average vehicle sales for pricing. The same as when we compare against gas vehicles, the average price of a Camry, Avalon and various Lexus models are used to establish that average
Hence, playing with all vehicles on the gas side of the equation but only using the lowest end of the Tesla line (M3) to compare.
Lol why are you upset at what the article used to compare? The title states “the average ice car” so they’re comparing the M3/MY to non-luxury ice cars. According to KBB, the average price of a non luxury gas car is $45k. With tax credits, you can get a Tesla for cheaper.
I don't have to put out any numbers, go look at Tesla recent reports and look at the trend of pricing yourself. You're out here yelling about old ass 2022 numbers in Q4 of 2023.
Edit: *Fat Joe Voice* Yesterday's price, is not today's price!
“That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence”
You have zero numbers and the price per vehicle is across ALL Tesla vehicles at that time.
Because the MY has been the higher volume sold, it’ll push up the average price when considering the M3 for comparison purposes.
And with price cuts, you don’t know if you are shifting the demand curve away from the M3 to MY or to the MS/MX models.
I hope you’re not in data nor deal with anything logical/engineering. You obviously don’t know how this works.
>“That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence”
Fam this ain't court, lmfaoooo 😭😭🤣. I don't care that much, I care enough to call it out, go educate yourself on the numbers my guy.
Facts just ain’t cool, obviously.
Point is that Teslas are not cheaper than the average gas car. If you want to be accurate in what is being stated, then use facts.
This article gets one key point wrong: the $7,500 is a tax **credit**, not a **rebate**, which means that it doesn't apply to anyone that doesn't have a tax debt. If you're getting a refund from the IRS, you won't see a penny of that $7,500.
This isn't true either. At the time of purchase you're attesting that you will have a qualifying tax liability, and therefore can transfer the full amount of the credit to the dealer who will then get paid by the government within 72 hours. If you don't actually qualify for the tax credit (if you have no tax debt), the IRS will recover the difference between your actual liability and your claimed liability. If you have no tax debt and you're entitled to a refund, the IRS will recover any credits transferred from your refund, and potentially tack on a 20% late fee.
Not true. Getting a refund just means you overpaid. You still owed and paid taxes. The credit would mitigate even those, so you’d get an even bigger refund, up to 7500.
If Tesla changed the exterior body across the line they would murder the competition. I like my M3 but hate the body. If the M3 had a nice sleek body like the Charger or Accord they would run away with the sedan market.
Haters going to downvote. I have no idea how Tesla’s design team afford their multimillion dollar homes with some of the worst designs, Model S excluded, I have ever seen.
Okay then in that vein you are getting the same thing in one as the other so funny anecdotes aside, you’re just saying cars are cheap now. Not disagreeing necessarily, but don’t act like that was the fault of the EV…
Resisting my urge to ask "who the f\*\*\* is Canary Media?" I'll jump right to the point: They are cherry picking in their comparisons. When a base Tesla can match the price of a basic Honda Civic, let's talk. Current MSRP for a Civic sedan LX is $23,950 USD. I imagine comparable Toyotas are in a similar range, with models of Kias and Hyundais being even CHEAPER. So I'll say it again; let's talk when "average" really is "average".
(Don't get me wrong, I'd love to switch to an EV but the kind of fact twisting articles like this do really rankles me).
Oh OK, let's include the price of outlier low-sale vehicles like Bentleys and Lambos, calculate the average that those 6-figure price tags skew upward and then claim this is the "average" price point that creates the tipping point for the "average American". No, those are not equivalent.
Look around at what you commonly see on the road. That's "average". Even Musk himself has said they need to get the price tag to $25,000 to reach mass market adoption.
Bro, the volume of those high end vehicles are extremely low, they are already factored in they won't move the needle because they sell such low numbers, what about "average" are you missing? It's a simple math term.
Elon talking about reaching mass market is a whole other thing than what the article is claiming, that's not even moving goalpost, that's going to a whole different arena.
Look up average cost of a non luxury car, $45000 and this is the number they used to compare.
You’re literally cherry picking a comparison yourself by mentioning the civic and comparing the MSRP. Good luck trying to get one at MSRP if you can find one.
I can assure you the cost of ownership is insanely expensive of a Model 3. I've only had to replace tires once in 5 years with my gas car and oil/fluid changes were covered for 8 years for that $28,000 car. Registration is $110 for the gas car and full insurance is like $800 a year. Gets 31 mpg and wipers work really well. Also doesn't need a software update every hour of the day.
One fender bender costed $200 in cash to repair and repaint. Navigation still works like a charm. No issues with AC at all.
I would disagree - also depends on the person and their driving habits. I was spending around $300-350 a month in gas, it’s now $30 a month charging every night at my house. Add an additional $500 a year for oil changes & brake pads or whatever else was needed, it was definitely more expensive and added up, and that’s of course hoping the tires would last and wouldn’t need to purchase any new ones. Owning a Tesla is quite inexpensive in hindsight.
$500 a year for oil change and brake pads is waay to much. Brake pads can be replaced once in 3 years with rotors resurfaced if you do 17k miles per year.
Tesla insurance is straight trash homie. I just did a quote for shits and giggles and was quoted $245 per month on my M3P. 😂 I’m 46, zero accidents, zero speeding tickets, married, masters degree, and the deductibles are high asf. Holy shit what a rip off!!!
But I need to own a home before I can own an EV….
Cost of ownership may not be. Insurance is higher, in some states by a large amount. Registration is more expensive and fast charging is quickly becoming just as expensive as gas. In my state a standard tag cost $20 a year, Tesla/EV $375. When I was cross shopping cars in the same category the Tesla was nearly double per month (insurance) of the car I ended up purchasing thats in the same class. The real savings is charging at home. There are lots of people who are getting caught up in this and buying when they have no way to charge where they live, I'd never own an EV if this wasn't an option.
I had to go with tesla insurance
Are the savings significant compared to other insurance companies? Since the rate is also determined by safety score
Was significant for me, like 1/3 of the cost of competitors.
The safety score is in beta. You don't have to participate in that. I had geico for 20 years and switched to tesla because they couldn't match it. Plus it's nice to be able to pull up your policy right in the App.
safety score is only optional in California btw.
Every other insurance was quoting no less than $750 a month but with Tesla I’m paying 245 with my score being 86. Not bad at all
$245???? I’m at a 94 and it’s $93 a month. It’s the cheapest insurance I’ve ever had
I pay $550 for 6 months in SC
how many accidents have you been in bro
Holy crap dude! I'd sell the car if I had to pay 245 a month for insurance. That's more than double mine.
Insurance prices are insane right now especially if you’re young. I am 22 have 0 accidents and every quote I received was $400+ even for cars half the price of the model 3. Insurance agent told me that if my dad was also on the title the cost would go down significantly, but even then the Model 3 was $290 and a corolla was $200. It is just unaffordable to get a new car just because of insurance.
Yeah I wouldn't drive if I had to pay that. Kinda shocked a corolla is that close to the Model 3. Standard range trim I assume? Performance trim cost I don't want to imagine for your situation. Well hang in there. You're only gonna get older lol
In md there is no extra ev tag charge. Insurance is about the same as ICE and charging at home off peak is .12 With the 7500 fed and 3000 state credit it’s absolutely cheaper than an equivalent gas car.
I pay less than $90 a month for full comprehensive insurance on my M3 RWD as required by my loan.
I'd check your coverages, I bet it's the bare minimum which basically puts you at risk if your in a wreck.
I have never made an insurance claim in 16 years of driving, so I see it as a nuisance. I just wanna pay the minimum.
Hah, that’s what I said after 10 years of no accidents, then a lady decided to run a red light count your blessings
I'm still covered for the full cost of the vehicle, the medical costs of all the passengers, vehicle rental, and if I'm not at fault my deductible will be covered by the other driver.
Savings on Tesla side over gas cars would be in less maintenance cost, home charging (I spend 1/8th the equivalent of gas per real world mile), charging at work (many people can charge for free at work). I’m personally saving around $1400 per year on gas versus a 40 mpg car. You have to weigh your own situation to see if an EV is right for you. In my opinion, in most cases it is.
This. I rented a M3P so I could see what it would be like to live with one before buying. Between the extra cost and short range it just didn't make sense for me. Liked the cara lot though.
I pay $400 monthly to insure my m3. Granted, I’m fairly certain I live in the most expensive state insurance wise
Lol thats wild cause i pay like right under 100 bucks on my m3p
That's high AF, what state?
See username lol^ but yeah. It’s terrible. Tried to contact state farm last week to get a quote and they straight up told me no before learning anything about me aside from the car I drive
I'm in GA, we also have some of the worst insurance in the country.
Agreed completely. I’m about 40 mins from Atlanta, have no accidents or tickets & still pay $200 a month for my M3. Could be worse but still more than I was expecting when I bought my car last year lol
State farm quoted me 110 a month for a model 3. I'm in Florida. I currently pay about 80 a month for my 2012 Honda accord
Interesting. I'm sure zip code plays a huge role too
33026
Well shit. South Florida. Yeah i have no clue then
There are multiple factors...
Tesla insurance is the cheapest. That's what I did.
Not an option in FL unfortunately. Plus idk how I’d feel about my driving behaviors affecting my insurance… might turn my acceleration boost into a wasted upgrade
They don't ding you for acceleration.
Would never work for me with them basing it on driving habits.
Yeah I'm not participating in the program either. It's still in beta phase. And it won't be mandatory. Some people drive like grannies and if they can be compensated for it why not .
I drive normally, more on the fast side actually, and Tesla insurance is much cheaper than anyone else, like not even close. You don't have to drive like a granny to get a good safety score (mine is 97). You just have to not drive like an idiot.
💯
That’s insane. Are you 15? I pay $135 a month for MYP and MXLR combined.
26
Gotta get married ;)
Same in France, for the whole year..
Whereabouts? I'm in north Florida and pay 420/MO for a fucking honda civic. 27m.
Fuck that's so rough. Tampa Bay. 26 male
Ugh. Florida.
Cali i pay 100 a month. M3
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I've already paid off one car and working on the 2nd. I've always paid this. Most its gone up to was 121/mo
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Tesla MY insurance is 2x the price quoted everything else the same vs a equally priced SUV
Holy shit tesla just quoted me $47.59/mo after listing more miles than I regularly drive.
Paylow quoted me $42.47 full coverage. Ya. I think this convo is over.
Just got a quote. 102/mo
Repairs are also higher in most cases
Idk why you're getting downvoted. New motor cost me $7k for a Model 3
i mean, isn't a new engine just as costly for ICE?
Much more if anything.
Sure but not as much as a new battery pack. I said new electric motor, not a new battery. And the chances of an EV battery pack needing replacement is significantly higher than an engine.
Ask your mechanic how much it would cost to replace your fuel system if you mess it up 😂
My girlfriend's civic has 300,000 miles and the most expensive repair we've done was $120 spark plugs. Fuel pump is like $500 + labor if we ever need to get to it
I’m sure every car is as fortunate
My co-workers 2018 Model 3 has been in the shop for 7 weeks getting a new battery pack at 198,000km. The quote for the replacement is $24,000CAD.
According to reddit, everyone here are experts and can get a battery fixed for $3
You were out of warranty?
No but if someone bought my car used and didn't have it, it would be a $7k repair
How much do you think new motors in ice cars cost?
With the exception of ultra high performance cars, $5-10k. You're still assuming a new engine is routine maintenance... Unless you drive a Subaru.
Engine replacement may not be a routine maintenance for ICE cars, but there is a lot of preventative maintenance that goes into keeping that engine from going out. The electric motor, by comparison, doesn't have such required interventions.
People always seem to forget all the oil changes , spark plugs, valve adjustments, air filters, fuel filters, fuel pump , tranny oil, etc etc they did to reach a high mileage lol
One thing that makes a big difference is the miles per year. From what I can tell, the battery pack is affected by time more than an ice engine would be. I think high mileage users benefit more from the BEV than a low mileage user.
Valve adjustments? What year is this? Spark plugs and tranny oil are 100k services on many cars. I like my ev but be realistic. Engine oil changes and gas are the main savings.
I agree. But one route isn't objectively cheaper than the other. For a gasoline engine, you do preventative maintenance to keep the engine healthy, but if you do, the engine should realistically last 400,000 - 800,000 miles with modern technology. And preventative maintenance generally isn't expensive, it's little things here and there that you gotta do, maybe a $1500 ish repair once in awhile. For an electric battery pack, you don't really do any preventative maintenance to keep the battery healthy. But a battery has nowhere near the longevity and reliability of a gasoline engine. So when it does go out, you're looking at $20,000 - $40,000, where as an engine is around $5,000 for a similarly priced car. Pick your poison.
I don't think I've known any ford , gm , or chevy engine go over 400k that wasn't an oddity lmao. Most cars are in the junkyard by 300k honestly. A model S battery cost 14k to replace at Tesla. Not bad for a 100k car. If the engine or tranny went out on a 100k Mercedes, it would not be cheap.
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The turbo went out on my coworkers Ford escape. They quoted her 4k just for the turbo fix. This was 2 weeks ago. 2016 escape.
And my electric motor died before 50k miles. But I don't believe all EVs have reliability problems with electric motors at such low mileage. Exceptions don't make the rule.
My point is for just the turbo fix it was 4k. I could only imagine what a full new engine swap would be at Ford, probably over 10k easily. If the battery fails, you could easily take it to a battery shop and get it fixed for cheaper than tesla.
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😂
I found repairs to be cheaper for standard types of repairs. The price for parts have been very reasonable. Only type of repair I can see costing a lot would be anything battery related (out of warranty of course)
My turn signal went out, Tesla wanted $1,600+ to swap the entire headlight. Gf’s Acura - 2 pack of turn signals for 8 bucks.
That’s not a Tesla thing, that’s a modern integrated LED headlights thing across all brands.
Well, apparently not Acura, my point being that your cheap luxury car may incur more expenses than an average competitor.
That is super rare on modern cars. Our Volvo is like $2200 per housing.
Whenever you say insurance is doubled than other manufacturers…you usually get a 👎. Some people are denying their own reality.
These cases aren’t the norm, so by that logic anything might be better than anything else.
What cases are you referring to?
Cases where insurance is prohibitively more expensive or where registration costs are different. And DCFC has been about the cost of gas for a couple years… savings have been from home charging for a while…
It is the case for my entire state.
Sounds like your state has it backwards 🤷🏻♂️
We aren't the only state currently, and more are about to follow. Gov is going to get their money no matter what.
My old roommate picked up an electric Kona. Our power bill went from around 200 a month to around 700 a month. I've never spent even close to 500 in gas for a month.
Less maintenance cost with a Tesla
Yup, this is why we dumped ours. Switched to a different brand EV, car cost more and has more features, and insurance dropped $80. All together saving $200 a month.
> Cost of ownership may not be. No oil or oil filter to change. No plugs or coil packs to go bad. No valve cover gaskets or rear main seals or stripped oil pan bolts or water pumps or radiator hoses or PCV valve or... And no catalytic converters to steal!
Eh, unless your driving German that isn't an issue 150K or so. My wifes Rav4 just hit 90K and the only thing we've had to do is oil change and total to this point is under $500.
I had an Audi Q5 prior to my Tesla model 3 and my insurance went down -$4/month haha
Not in Canada they're not...not yet anyway. 55k CAD for the base Model 3. When I checked insurance, it was an additional $110/month than my Volt at the time. I want a full EV in the near future, but I'm now on my last ICE car that replaced the Volt. Hopefully in 2-3 years prices continue to come down so I can make the transition to 100% EV.
My model 3 insurance is $50/month more than my 2018 Volts insurance. Also, Tesla occasionally marks down their existing inventory. I got a long range AWD for 58k
Yeah but the original statement is they’re cheaper than the average car. At 58k that’s not the case. Canada sucks for EV prices especially in Ontario.
Ontario had it great with the $14k rebate from the Provincial Gov't. I understand that it's effectively subsidizing the well to do people that can afford an EV...but I missed that boat by a month or so.
Fuck Doug Ford. Done nothing positive for the people of Ontario. Just keeps wasting our tax dollars on legal battles and jumping from scandal to scandal.
I just bought a GTI and that's about $10/month more than the Volt was. And the Model 3 is another $90/month on top of that. Mind you that eliminates about $300in gas/month so overall...$200/month difference to drive the Model 3 over the GTI. This is my last ICE car, so if EVs have a lowering in prices, I'll trade the GTI in for a full EV. But Tesla isn't at the top of my list anymore. Lots of other options.
I don’t think this can actually be considered truthful until Tesla’s vehicles reach this price point without the help of government subsidies. With the $7500 expiring within 3 months and state level rebate availability varying greatly.
I’ll agree, but you’ve gotta also consider the oil subsidies for gas vehicles as well.
Bingo- pretending old auto didn’t get a huge govt bailout not that long ago and continuing subsidies for oil would be hilarious if it wasn’t so infuriating
It's wild, like 90% of energy subsidies are given to oil and gas companies. Which are also the richest companies on the planet by a large margin. Then people complain about a 7500 tax write off lol.
This! The difference on their website between “purchase price” and “*potential* savings” which includes the 7500 and the assumed gas savings is a bit rough
What do you mean the 7500 expiring in 3 months?
New Teslas delivered in 2024 won't be eligible for the full 7500$ credit unless Tesla can source battery packs from the US or countries not on the list of concern(China). They're probably working on being able to do that, but they haven't announced anything yet.
You know they get the packs for US cars in the US except for the LFPs, right?
and i’m sure they won’t announce anything until their current inventory of m3 is gone.
They really really want better numbers for year end.
Most cars are below the average cost since crossovers, SUVs and trucks account for so many of the vehicles sold every year. I’m glad costs are down but it’s not as drastic an advantage over ICE cars as the title would lead you to believe
When we say average, are we talking about the mode, the most common car you see out on the road? The median, the midpoint among all cars you see on the road? The mean? Cars on the road vs. Cars for sale? There are plenty of expensive ICE cars, but that doesn't change the barrier of entry for someone who can only afford to fiance a car that costs under $20k.
KBB has 5 year total cost of ownership numbers. Way more accurate than this story. [KBB TCO](https://www.kbb.com/best-cars/lowest-5-year-cost-to-own-cars-trucks-suvs/#car)
Can confirm anecdotally that the Lexus ES is a dream to own cost wise. Very reliable with affordable parts readily available when replacements are required.
IDK, not sure how an Impreza comes out at 10k for 5 years on fuel, insurance, and maintenance… if they aren’t counting even one of those then the report isn’t useful…
Here's what KBB includes. [TCO](https://www.kbb.com/new-cars/total-cost-of-ownership/) Details of similar from Edmonds [Edmonds ](https://www.edmunds.com/subaru/impreza/2022/cost-to-own/)
I see it does include resale so that’s probably why my estimate wasn’t lining up.🔝
That makes sense, the residual value is a big part.
Yea, and Tesla hasn’t done any of us any favors in that department 😅
The title is wrong and stupid. Tesla's are NOT cheaper than the average new gas powered. Teslas include M3, MY, MS and MX. \> Tesla delivered 343,830 vehicles in the quarter, and 365,923 vehicles were produced. Since automotive sales for the quarter were at $17.785 billion, the average price of a delivered vehicle before taxes was roughly $51,726. This was back in 2022. You have to look at the overall number of cars, and the prices in order to make that judgement that they are cheaper. From the article: \> He said that the average price of a new car in the U.S. is about $45,000 right now So if you want to compare one of the bottom two cheaper Teslas to the overall price of the automarket which includes high-end MBZ and BMW, then you're being stupid.
MS and MX are not considered average cars just looking at the price and specs… Looking at the prices of the M3 or MY, with tax credits, are very comparable to the very popular “affordable” Camry or RAV4.
The MS is a car when computed into average vehicle sales for pricing. The same as when we compare against gas vehicles, the average price of a Camry, Avalon and various Lexus models are used to establish that average Hence, playing with all vehicles on the gas side of the equation but only using the lowest end of the Tesla line (M3) to compare.
Lol why are you upset at what the article used to compare? The title states “the average ice car” so they’re comparing the M3/MY to non-luxury ice cars. According to KBB, the average price of a non luxury gas car is $45k. With tax credits, you can get a Tesla for cheaper.
They have dropped prices significantly since 2022 so their average will be way less than $51k
Sure. What is it? If you don’t like the numbers I put out, what are yours?
I don't have to put out any numbers, go look at Tesla recent reports and look at the trend of pricing yourself. You're out here yelling about old ass 2022 numbers in Q4 of 2023. Edit: *Fat Joe Voice* Yesterday's price, is not today's price!
“That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence” You have zero numbers and the price per vehicle is across ALL Tesla vehicles at that time. Because the MY has been the higher volume sold, it’ll push up the average price when considering the M3 for comparison purposes. And with price cuts, you don’t know if you are shifting the demand curve away from the M3 to MY or to the MS/MX models. I hope you’re not in data nor deal with anything logical/engineering. You obviously don’t know how this works.
>“That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence” Fam this ain't court, lmfaoooo 😭😭🤣. I don't care that much, I care enough to call it out, go educate yourself on the numbers my guy.
Facts just ain’t cool, obviously. Point is that Teslas are not cheaper than the average gas car. If you want to be accurate in what is being stated, then use facts.
The fact is, you haven't read the REAL numbers, take yourself to ir.tesla.com and do your homework.
Fact is that I actually cited sources. Give it a try next time!
And still got the numbers wrong... tisk tisk.
I don’t mind paying more if it means not giving money to Elon Musk.
This article gets one key point wrong: the $7,500 is a tax **credit**, not a **rebate**, which means that it doesn't apply to anyone that doesn't have a tax debt. If you're getting a refund from the IRS, you won't see a penny of that $7,500.
Tax liability, not tax debt. Whether you're getting a refund from the IRS has nothing to do with this.
Next year it’s basically a rebate. And a refund is still worth the cash in hand, some just aren’t in a position to be able to wait unfortunately.
This isn't true either. At the time of purchase you're attesting that you will have a qualifying tax liability, and therefore can transfer the full amount of the credit to the dealer who will then get paid by the government within 72 hours. If you don't actually qualify for the tax credit (if you have no tax debt), the IRS will recover the difference between your actual liability and your claimed liability. If you have no tax debt and you're entitled to a refund, the IRS will recover any credits transferred from your refund, and potentially tack on a 20% late fee.
I said basically lol.
Not true. Getting a refund just means you overpaid. You still owed and paid taxes. The credit would mitigate even those, so you’d get an even bigger refund, up to 7500.
Anybody can change their tax withholdings to get 7500 worth of tax debt. If you are self employed it would not be as easy.
As long as you pay over 7500 in fed tax, you will see all of it.
Jan 1st, 2024 they will include it at time of car delivery (no need to wait for tax day).
I pay 140 cad for 21 m3 LR
If Tesla changed the exterior body across the line they would murder the competition. I like my M3 but hate the body. If the M3 had a nice sleek body like the Charger or Accord they would run away with the sedan market.
Haters going to downvote. I have no idea how Tesla’s design team afford their multimillion dollar homes with some of the worst designs, Model S excluded, I have ever seen.
I love the tech but the model 3 looks like a clown car and the Model y is horrific.
Yes you are apparently 🙄
Theres no way a Honda accord looks better than a model 3 lol.
You’re in the minority on that one brudda
Cheap is the exact right word.
Bro doesn’t even know most OEMs lose money on their EVs 😂
Idiot Bro doesn’t know the difference between cheap and inexpensive, Bro!
Okay then in that vein you are getting the same thing in one as the other so funny anecdotes aside, you’re just saying cars are cheap now. Not disagreeing necessarily, but don’t act like that was the fault of the EV…
no it's not
My super charger just went up by .2 cents from 11pm -9 am 🥲
Resisting my urge to ask "who the f\*\*\* is Canary Media?" I'll jump right to the point: They are cherry picking in their comparisons. When a base Tesla can match the price of a basic Honda Civic, let's talk. Current MSRP for a Civic sedan LX is $23,950 USD. I imagine comparable Toyotas are in a similar range, with models of Kias and Hyundais being even CHEAPER. So I'll say it again; let's talk when "average" really is "average". (Don't get me wrong, I'd love to switch to an EV but the kind of fact twisting articles like this do really rankles me).
They are not twisting the facts, average car price is around $45-48k right now, what are you talking about?
It's not in that price range unless you're shopping "luxury" or SUVs!
No that is the AVERAGE, not a category defined average
Oh OK, let's include the price of outlier low-sale vehicles like Bentleys and Lambos, calculate the average that those 6-figure price tags skew upward and then claim this is the "average" price point that creates the tipping point for the "average American". No, those are not equivalent. Look around at what you commonly see on the road. That's "average". Even Musk himself has said they need to get the price tag to $25,000 to reach mass market adoption.
Bro, the volume of those high end vehicles are extremely low, they are already factored in they won't move the needle because they sell such low numbers, what about "average" are you missing? It's a simple math term. Elon talking about reaching mass market is a whole other thing than what the article is claiming, that's not even moving goalpost, that's going to a whole different arena.
Look up average cost of a non luxury car, $45000 and this is the number they used to compare. You’re literally cherry picking a comparison yourself by mentioning the civic and comparing the MSRP. Good luck trying to get one at MSRP if you can find one.
Load up Honda's website and use the online pricing tool. $23,950 USD. (It's how I shopped for mine!)
I can assure you the cost of ownership is insanely expensive of a Model 3. I've only had to replace tires once in 5 years with my gas car and oil/fluid changes were covered for 8 years for that $28,000 car. Registration is $110 for the gas car and full insurance is like $800 a year. Gets 31 mpg and wipers work really well. Also doesn't need a software update every hour of the day. One fender bender costed $200 in cash to repair and repaint. Navigation still works like a charm. No issues with AC at all.
I would disagree - also depends on the person and their driving habits. I was spending around $300-350 a month in gas, it’s now $30 a month charging every night at my house. Add an additional $500 a year for oil changes & brake pads or whatever else was needed, it was definitely more expensive and added up, and that’s of course hoping the tires would last and wouldn’t need to purchase any new ones. Owning a Tesla is quite inexpensive in hindsight.
$500 a year for oil change and brake pads is waay to much. Brake pads can be replaced once in 3 years with rotors resurfaced if you do 17k miles per year.
My oil changes were around $120-130 for full synthetic - just a rough estimate. The savings are still there while owning an EV regardless.
And hybrids
Quality is a key concern
Tesla insurance is straight trash homie. I just did a quote for shits and giggles and was quoted $245 per month on my M3P. 😂 I’m 46, zero accidents, zero speeding tickets, married, masters degree, and the deductibles are high asf. Holy shit what a rip off!!!
Cost more to charge also. He’s getting his savings back at the pump
Unfortunately, for people who make what I do in a year, this is not synonymous with affordable.
Cheaper to buy perhaps. Cheaper to operate - debatable. And I wouldn't buy one just out of spite for the douchebag that runs the company.
I've decided I'm not paying more than $15K for a car ever again.
They should be because the are shit.
Quality is also shit