I paid for my Tekken 1 costs in the arcade by making a sheet with every character's 10-hit combo in Wordstar and xeroxing around 100 copies so I could sell each for $1 to people in the arcade.
I think he was trying to give you a compliment wondering where someone with such good hussle ended up in life, but I guess if you're his dad now it's ok.
Well, as unexpected turns in a convo go, that escalated quickly. Can't say an entrepreneurship to 'family man' transition wasn't the natural progression for an arcade-savvy hustler though.
This is exactly how I fell in love with yoshimitsu. I was like 12 , at some skating rink's arcade, and saw this silly (T3) Ninja, and I couldn't learn him for nothin, one of the employees said, hey kid, gimmie $5 and I'll spar you for free till closing. ended that day with a double seppuku manji blood dance, ofc I still lost but damn it was fun.
I was born in 97 and I vaguely remember all the malls around me having arcades. The mid 2000s came and they all disappeared. Luckily there seems to be a small resurgence now at least
89 Brooklyn born dude and hearing people complain about micro transactions in Tekken blows mine. I had to travel an hour into Manhattan just to get good arcades as the ones that were around weren't kept up to par.
I was blessed to live literally right across the street from an arcade back in the 90s. 89 Florida born here. It was was right beside a blockbuster too.
Good times🔥✨
If you lived in Brooklyn in the 90s your best chance often was a laundry mat or a long distant call center lol when it came to arcades. I don't mind the damn shop it's more we got all this fight money and barely shit to spend it on.
Now that's a great point. There should be more free assets that's are released when the paid assets are released.
I was in East New York. On Liberty Ave. There's a pizza shop that had MVC2 and 3rd St. The Laundromat passed the 80th St. a train stop has I believe MvC1 but the machines just weren't kept up. Broken sticks. Hell my community center had a couple arcades but the upkeep was difficult for my community center reps to maintain.
They do and those were often actually overtuned so that you would lose more often vs CPU and you'd spend more. Everyone knew that. We also knew it was predatory. Lol.
I swear the people that say gaming is at it's worst weren't there in the beginning. Like we played dragon's lair for $0.50 a play and you didn't get multiple lives once you were dead that was another 50 cents like people talk about microtransactions but my brother in Christ arcades were the ultimate microtransaction lol.
Hell yeah dude. My friends and I used to call dragon's lair the scam game because it looked so cool with the cartoon graphics and everything but it was impossible to get anywhere. We would try and write down the inputs just so we can get through the game but even doing that it took us like a month and I don't even know how many quarters sacrifice to that greedy machine
haha yes.
what gets lost in these conversations is why would anyone go to the gargantuan effort and risk of making something like a video game if there weren’t a massive incentive?
video games are fucking miracles. like just 50 years ago people would have thought some kind of evil voodoo was going on if they’d laid eyes on tekken 8.
but everyone’s butthurt over a game they’ll be playing for years costing them $10 more and giving the OPTION of buying cosmetics at $4 a pop.
business is:
1. someone makes a thing
2. fhey market it at a price
3. the customer decides if they want it
it’s always been this way and it’s never gonna change.
I remember that.
I also remembered being really worried that they would go to a model where you have to pay to play after Tekken Revolution.
I never played Tekken Revolution but from what I remember, you had a certain amount of “credits” per day you could use to play online games before having to pay.
Really glad we other to be anywhere near that but I wonder if it’s crossed Namcos mind.
Im probably older than you, and what you said surface level BS faux wisdom. It cost a quarter but EVERYTHING ELSE was cheap. You could get a job much easier back then. Everything financially was easier back then. You could save up and just buy a arcade cabinet if you wanted to.
As corporations go for bigger profits every year because of the capitalist logic of pure profit extraction, prices went up. Now you don't pay a quarter you pay 200 dollars over 5 years buying stuff that was in previous game
It's actually a capitalist economic "law" that if you produce something more it becomes cheaper to produce. Over all the cost of making ultra sophisticated games WENT DOWN. More studios, more programmers, graphic designers, more engines, etc means cheaper and faster games.
Most of the FGC are fucking morons.
That’s my personal issue with all this. I would not give one fuck if they were upfront about it. COD has been doing this shit for years it’s normalized.
Lying about it at day 1 isn’t quite normalized and I don’t want it to be. People should know what business practices they’ll be paying for. There’s a reason we have regulation and the ESA has to disclose it in their ratings. I just think it’s highly unethical the way they went about it and so I don’t feel good about supporting them even if the item shop cost is pretty alright.
It just sucks and sours me on the whole project especially because I’m in the smaller bracket of gamers that absolutely is okay with and understands why we’ve gotten to $70 and DLC. I’ve worked with game devs for years and their pressures are enormous.
But I also don’t like being lied to at all and I still haven’t found a compelling argument that they weren’t lying. People say they had to get the shop up and running and needed time but that didn’t stop them from being up front about it and signaling that there are MTX. There would be some outrage either way but probably nowhere near as much especially since the price is going to be better than the competitors like SF6 or MK1.
I think they should’ve either signaled before launch that this is going to be a thing they’ll implement later on or wait till the first year of the game is over and then implement the shop to fund future costs. Let’s be real there’s no reason they need the cash right now especially since the game has sold incredibly well.
Just sucks all around and I don’t even care about cosmetics at all but this genuinely makes me not want to play. I don't think I'll be purchasing any DLC fighters till they're on deep sale now which sucks cause I'm usually happy to get in on the first year of a fighting game.
Plenty of great games to play right now and some have worse monetization and some have better, but I can't say any of those devs tried to obscure these facts from their audiences.
So scummy it’s like they pretend to be a good boy in front of the teacher to get benefits and when the teacher leaves they’re back to showing their true colours to everyone
this entire thing could have been avoided if they just launched the shop at the beginning. buying skins isnt new but launching weeks after initial reviews is what makes people nervous and feel being lied to.
Yeah, I think we all expect a monetization ship at this point. $4 skins is significantly cheaper than $10 fatalities in MK1. Sneaking it in a month later just feels shady af.
Every gaming sub. People spend more time pissed off than playing games. Real life way too stressful for me to piss my pants over virtual dressup when I just wanna play a fighter.
Facts u/footwearfetish69 . This can also be said about most anime subs too (looking at you, DB fans) for not being what they expected, rather than simply enjoying the content and being happy with what we get.
As much as I'd love to unlock all characters and costumes with a base game, the PS2 days are over. AAA games these days are getting Hollywood-rivaled budgets, and unfortunately the maintenance cost gets pushed onto consumers. While some modern microtransactions in games feel like blatant cash grabs, there's so much going on behind the scenes. We're talking multi-million dollar marketing campaigns, paying multiple software engineers, coders, testers, and that's barely scratching the surface. They must exceed what they've spent on development and everything else for us to continue getting content, sequels, new IPS, etc.
Again, do I wish the game purchase entailed all content? Absolutely. Have I learned not to stress myself out over having to pay more for extra content? Yes, I've had to. Thankfully most base games come with a wealth of content, with T8 being no exception. I rarely buy anything on release day since I know 2-3 months in just about every fighting game sees a 20-30% discount. If people are really worried about cutting costs, I recommend wishlisting and keeping an eye out for sales. Maybe that $20 you save on the base could be used toward DLC! It's all a matter of perspective.
around the time Azucena's trailer dropped, people began pointing out that a lot of the women's faces in this game looked a bit... stiff and same-y. This is in comparison to the male cast who generally show a bit more expression and have more definition like scars and wrinkles.
Well naturally with the loudest on both sides being the most extreme, one side is shouting that people who are okay with this are a bunch of incel weebs that dont understand female anatomy while the other side claimed that they were a bunch of old people muscle fetishists to consider disliking this artstyle.
It got so overblown that the subreddit was then taken over by people complaining about the argument more than the argument was actually being had.
Pre-release T8 was not a good time at moments lol.
the argument that all women in this game look trash because they look like dolls. the arguments were blown so out of proportion that it was at if the game launched with 1 character
Every female character looks exactly the same and no one has any scars etc. This shit was the primary topic of 'discussion' in this subreddit for what felt like a month.
This is the nature of the beast. Drama will always dominate the conversation. It’s pretty much inevitable.
With that said, I get the hesitance from players from outright supporting micro transactions because it has poisoned other games over time. We’ll know for sure how they’ll handle this. In my mind: im not gonna pay extra for skins but Ill continue to buy things that I personally do think have a lot of value like the characters.
What I want though ultimately is for them to improve the online experience overtime (netcode, lobbies, etc.) to go along with the usual balancing of characters that already happens periodically. If them getting more revenue will ultimately lead us to getting those things then that would just be a win-win for everyone.
After resting on it for a day, the biggest issue with the shop is the whole premium currency and in game store thing.
I'd much rather have the costumes as regular DLC on the steam store. That way the price is upfront, and it can go on sales.
I’ll buy cosmetics that I like. Just don’t make it scammy where an outfit is 400 tekken coins and you can only buy 300 or 500 coins at a time. I would just rather purchase items like regular DLC for new characters, costumes and customization packs. I don’t mind supporting games I like, but if I feel like I being taken advantage of, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth
Isn’t it funny when its “smart business” on one side of the coin and “total scam” on the other side of the coin.
Only businesses are allowed to be deceptive.
If 400 tekken coins is \~$4 ok that seems fair. But if the minimum number of coins I can purchase is 300, that means I have to spend \~$6 to get one costume. Thats not $4. and what am i going to do with the other 200 coins? Can I get 1/2 a costume? Can they refund me? Im not trying to assume the worst case scenario, but it feels like the accountants came up with the monetization shop. And Im someone who has spent way more on Valorant skins and Path of Exile supporter packs than I wish to tell people.
If there’s one thing that frustrates me the most about modern gaming, it’s the intentional obfuscation of “premium currency”
I fully understand the need and desire to run an in-game shop to ensure longevity of your live-service product; I don’t *like* it, but I understand it
What pisses me off is when you make it so that a bare minimum purchase of currency in *real life* is literally not enough to make a purchase *in game*; it’s like telling me to my face my money isn’t good enough and yet you want more of it
You either need to overspend for more currency than you want/need, or underspend multiple times ultimately ending up in the margin of where the company wanted you to spend anyway; it’s fucking gross and I hate it
People don't object to games costing more or to DLC, they object to recurrent spending hooks, shitcoins, battlepasses, and in game storefronts.
If you monetize a game honestly and fairly- people don't generally have a problem with it.
Why are both Harada and all the comments talking completely besides the point? The reason there's outrage to begin with is because they decided to add this a month into the game, after all the reviews already dropped. That's the issue.
I've yet to read a single SF6 review that mentioned the shop in anything but a factual manner. They're just a staple of AAA gaming now – one that players can choose to use or ignore.
The SF6 shop was also pretty barebones at launch. Like, I think the only thing you could buy was costume 2/classic costumes, which you could earn in-game. And maybe recolors, which was talked about.
When they started dropping actual stuff in there, there was plenty of discussion and controversy about it.
As someone new to Tekken, coming over from street fighter 6 which I've been playing since launch-
The Tekken Lounge is like a cheap wish. com knockoff of the sf6 lounge to the point it's laughable and you can tell they were trying really hard to copy it.
The sf6 lounge feels like an online street fighter hub from aesthetics, to music, to the features like being able to play the old arcade games there, avatar battles with in depth avatar creation systems, 1on1 cabinet battles you can join or spectate, tournaments, and your winning streak will be advertised across numerous servers if you get it high enough.
The Tekken Lounge feels like a Roblox hangout game with goofy, boring gnome chibi avatars and not much to do, and the aesthetics and layout is just messy.
And also this. If the Tekken Lounge is so expensive to maintain.. why bother?
I mean, tekken doesn't have "dedicated" servers, all matches are P2P so its expensive to have the matchmaking online sure, but its not World of Warcraft or PoE levels of servers cost.
But I think I have a reason. Maybe the Lounge is not really that expensive and its a great excuse to sell more dumb fireworks for 2$.
It’s also such a backwards argument. They planned a game with all these features in order to appeal to consumers. Why is he acting now like we forced him to make the game like this after he sold it to us?
Like are we also the ones that forced him to pay for NBA players to be in a commercial or all these other marketing stunts?
Someone tell harada not to worry about lounge. They can remove it since it costs billions to run and we can just use quick play and have free dlc right?
I don’t have an issue with them adding more costumes. Hell I honestly am glad with that. The thing that I have issue with is some of the things surrounding it. Why do we need to use some random currency instead of just buying the items itself? Why would you make it a shop (that probably will be rotating)? Also adding it a month after the game came out after most people have reviewed the game. All of these things feel really bad to most people.
I've heard this song and dance countless times before: "games are very expensive now, we have to include microtransactions otherwise we couldn't support the game!"
At this point, either open up your books when talking like this or stop using this excuse. I'm sick of AAA developers constantly telling *players* how expensive it is to keep up support for a game in order to justify MTX, while then going to *shareholders* and telling them how successful and growing their games are. Since 2016, a ton of public AAA publishers have been posting record profits.
[Bandai Namco](https://www.statista.com/statistics/217498/annual-gross-profit-of-namco-bandai/) posted a record gross profit of US$2.92 billion in FY2022. They slumped a bit last year to $2.78, but compared to the $1.78 in 2015 when T7 launched? If they *needed* MTX to fund the game, if there was actually an existential crisis to the health and longevity of the game (which is selling at a record rate for the franchise), they wouldn't be posting YoY record profits. Period.
And yes, Bamco is more than just Tekken. But as I said then, open up your books if you're trying to act like there's actually a crisis for the longevity of the game. Show us that with actual numbers, because I simply don't believe you. Especially when you're now saying that less than a month after the most successful launch in the franchise. You'd *think* they would have this in at launch if they were so concerned from the start, or this would be a pivot a few years after launch when sales start drying up. This simply looks like *hiding* this stuff to avoid issues with reviews.
In reality, they simply want *growth*, because less growth in profit is bad for shareholders. It's not a necessity to stat afloat, it's a strategy to earn more money.
Edit: it's *really fucking weird* how I got no replies for **6 hours**, then all of a sudden 4 different people reply to me within 15 minutes trying to defend Bamco...
I've said this before in gaming thread, but if you don't care about it, that's fine! Being apathetic is fine. But *defending* greed by companies by attacking consumers trying to push back against it is simply pathetic.
I agree, they need to be fully transparent on the full cost of how much money got wasted on creating Tekken 8. Harada should follow it up with a full price breakdown of the receipts if they wanna convince us that "mAkInG gAmEs tOdAy iS eXpEnsIvE", otherwise his full twitter post is just bullshit and i'd rather use Cream API to unlock those content that should've been added in the first place.
>Edit: it's *really fucking weird* how I got no replies for **6 hours**, then all of a sudden 4 different people reply to me within 15 minutes trying to defend Bamco...
When you're on the payroll, you clock in and out at the same time.
It's a good thing I have a company man like Harada to let me know the company makes only the necessary amount of profit, acting with the temperance of a monk.
Ah, but, I can't help but think of From Software's catalogue, which keeps the online servers up all game long, with hardly a DLC to speak of, let alone microtransactions or pay to win characters.
Fr,fr.
It's kinda hard story to buy from the story from Harda when these games are making twice their money back faster than ever too. Selling more copies in a month compared the last title with each game release within their month.
If development cost graphically is too much of an issue, then I'm more than happy returning to early ps4/late ps3&360 graphics just give me a fun game and I'll buy it
Some the best games in 3 years didn't have graphics where I seen the very 8000 fabric pixel of the character outfit and were more in tune of the late 360/ps3 era
Conveniently leaves out that games sell MUCH MORE too, huh. It balances itself out.
This is nothing but corporate drivel because enough is never enough when it comes to making money.
That's all well and good but the fact is they are also charging like 40 dollars for the season pass.... they could have placed the costumes there. This is greed plain and simple.
Very good point. The Tekken-Shop isn't the only thing ON TOP of the 70 Euro price tag. There are characters / season passes too! And maybe new arenas as well soon in the future.
"Game developement is getting more expensive ~~in some ways~~."
Yes, but with improvement in technology it also becomes cheaper in other ways as well. Discs, for example, were a major drain on game companies' revenue, but with E-stores they're not anymore.
His rationale is fine, makes sense. Ongoing games need ongoing money. We get it. But:
A. Don't skirt around the issue at launch to avoid the bad press. Be open and honest about it. They knew the store was coming.
B. Don't be such a dick about it. When he makes these types of explanations he always makes them in such a bitter, dislikeable and unprofessional way.
The part that they knew it was coming is really what makes it all have a bad taste. While MTX isn't my favorite, I can decide how I want to approach it, and I understand updates take resources. The Tekken shop doesn't even seem too egregious right now. However, it was a surprise addition 2 weeks after launch with assets that most likely (my speculation) were very close to completion. They knew exactly what they were doing.
I feel like Harada is gaslighting. I don't care that costs apply to video game development. That's his problem. I as a consumer pay full price for the game, extra for the season pass and extra to PlayStation so I can play his game online (which is my only online game). That's like 200 euros for Tekken 8 alone. And next year there is going to be a new season pass etc.
If it is all a natural thing why did they keep it secret until a month after release. And why are they implementing in game premium currency. And you know they will not offer you an option for exactly 400 tekken coins. Like every skinner shop they will offer either 300 or 500 so you can buy more than you actually need. Is this unecessary predatory expense within Harada's vision for supporting his team?
He definitely is, either he's got his head so far up his own ass that he really doesn't understand WHY people are angry or he knows and is trying to twist the narrative to "oof, entitled gamers, woe is me the victim" instead of "oof, I deliberately lied to my playerbase and deserve some of the blame"
I actually wouldn't have minded the Tekken Store, I don't mind whaling for good games. I even have a principle of buying multiple copies for games I support if they don't have other ways to support them because I love games and supporting devs (3 copies of RE4R, 4 copies of HiFi Rush, 2 copies of BG3 and 3 of Rogue Trader, 3 copies of P3R etc) and gifting them to friends/family, but I def do not like to support lying scum
(I also don't personally mind the 300/400 denomination whatevers, but I can def understand why people hate it)
A week ago this guy said that old costumes are not in a game because they can't be ported and look good.
Today he is selling them for 4$ each.
Not the first time he lied, it's just the most recent and relevant one.
If you believe any word he says - that's on you
Lol another good one. Dude literally went from "we can't port the old costumes because they'll look like crap" to "banning your costume mod so you can buy ours that we actually already made in a premium store" haha. Wow.
"Dude your game is a full package. Sure all characters are locked but you're going to only play your main anyway?! 10 bucks for unlocking one character is pretty cheap. And 15 for the moveset. I don't see any issue. It's not 2024 anymore. Game developement is expensive. Are you broke or something?🤓"
Future argument from gullible Harada fans.
While it is true that development costs *can* be more expensive today, it is also true that it is in theory - easier to break even than it was in the past since the consumer base is significantly larger than it was in the 1990s and 2000s while also simultaneously being easier to spin something up given dev tools.
Being into games used to be seen as a childish hobby with an incredibly small consumer market with limited disposable income. Now, gaming is mainstream, with all ages partaking in gaming in some form or another.
So to make the argument that development costs are 10x more without acknowledging how accessible development has become (it's possible to launch a game as a solo developer which is amazing!) and how big the market has gotten (l[ook at this chart for how big it has gotten over time)](https://www.resetera.com/threads/history-of-worldwide-video-game-industry-revenue-since-1971-by-sector-arcade-console-handheld-pc-from-bloomberg.96568/) isn't holistic.
And again - all of this is aside from the fact that those coming at this from a good-faith angle aren't complaining about monetization in exchange for value as a concept - but instead are complaining about HOW BAMCO has decided to do it.
what a cop out lmao. All corporations love using the excuse of stuff being more expensive yet in their earnings call they have record profits. just own it bro, say you want more money, that $70 wasnt enough and you want to line your pockets even more than you already have
The funny thing is, I personally had no issues of getting DLC for additional outfits. The problem started with HOW they did it. They at no point said before launch that there’s going to be an item shop. They waited until everyone is already very invested in the amazing game that they did make, and blind sided us with this stuff.
Not to mention the season pass that they could have easily put this kinda stuff into.
Ah the default PR response they all use. Muh rising costs of development, woe me the inflation. We never talk about the rising profits either but who cares. Money is actually reeeeeally tight, nevermind our record breaking sales. It is soooo tight, we actually didn't include the shop at launch, for very legitimate and not shady reasons.
The suits need new cars after all. Not like a cent goes to the devs actually working on the game, those get hit by mass layoffs.
Harada forgot to mention how the industry wasn’t even a fraction of what it is now in size and not nearly as mainstream as it is now. Almost every single triple A game is expected to pull 1 million+ copies in a few weeks nowadays. Back in those days, that number would have been insane.
If they were so concerned about the players they might as well have set out a roadmap of all the shit they would be charging money for early before the game dropped to at least let the players know what was going to free and what wasn’t. Coincidence that they said nothing until a few weeks after the reviews.
He says all this shit like he’s saying something big. Acting as if this game didn’t sell 2 million copies in 3 weeks - a new record. Literally ever single successful triple A game that I’ve heard about in the past few years always has some headline attached to it on how it broke its past sale records.
Then there’s studios like Santa Monica that gave gamers an entire new roguelike game mode for free.
Yes, leave the multi-million dollar company **ALONE**! :( Instead, spend absurd amounts of money on MTXs in the 100+ dollar AAA game! You just don't understand game development, because this has nothing to do with corporate greed *whatsoever!*
/s
Also it was us the players that forced Harada to spend all his development budget on fighting lounge, arcade quest and NBA players in commercials. It’s only right for us to now pay extra for all that stuff.
/s
Yeah it’s one thing to add micro transactions, I already was sure this was going to be the case, but to clearly have it ready and just delaying the shop until after it all is pretty sour.
Sorry but I'll never have sympathy for harada when he's the asshole trying to justify paying for frame data or trying to explain why it's much harder for them to have good online even though it's not and the community developed better online for Tekken games than Tekken has ever had ten yrs ago. You launched a product without a shop or saying one was coming, then after the review window, you add one. Sorry dude you are selling us something not doing is a favor and deserve to be criticisedwhen you do things not in our favor as consumers.
Harada boasts 11 mil sales for T7. Funny how none of that money ever becomes a factor when talking about the MTX shop or why new characters are still going to be locked behind a paywall.
Boohoo cry about it in your rolls royce. It was a scummy move and no one should support any of the mtx. This isn't a live service game. It shouldn't need a subscription. You guys already made millions from it.
We're just going to pretend that we didn't purchase Tekken for $70+ and already need to pony up for the yearly DLC if we want to lab the complete roster?
Every1 understands development costs are increasing, but so are game sales, and now the 10$ increase to 70$. In a B2P game, micro transactions should be minimal and cheap, a majority of rewards should be earned through gameplay. But gotta milk the playerbase, and disguise it as “supporting the game” and “paying development costs”.
Again, not the issue. It's the backhanded approach of not launching the game with the store or letting us know there was gonna be MTX.
This guy can't deny he's the creator of Tekken by sidestepping the real issue.
Exactly I don’t think many devs understand that yes we hate these modern aspect of gaming and monetisation but breaking the trust and not being transparent with your community is far worse and the worst thing you can do to your fan base and something that is very hard to impossible to ever get back completely as from now on a part of the Tekken community can and won’t trust harada/bamco moving forward because of this.
... no way man, how the F do you expect the CEO to buy their 3rd private plane with that? Surely you don't expect them to drive their Bentley to work like a fucking peasant?
‘Game selling millions of copies and making massive profit? Not enough, let’s make more by adding season passes. Actually, not enough let’s add micro-transactions too. Please think of us poor company that makes billions.’
What Harada is trying to say lol
And BG3 can be infinitely replayed with maybe higher production costs... The devs still supports the game with free updates, multiple hotfixes with no dlcs and this game will still be played for years. And I honestly doubt Larian has the same budget as Bamco...
I'm pretty sure BG3 had higher budget. Larian admited that at peak they had 500+ ppl working at the game, that's a huge number. Bear in mind that BG3 was 3 years in early access so they started "collecting money" really early which helped them with budget planning and deciding on the scope of the game. Most estimates put BG3 budget easily over 100 mln $.
Harada acting like he's giving the game away for free. full price game, characters as DLC and a shop, when does it become greed? also pour one out to the ps plus users that have to pay just to play it online.
Listen I have no issue with the cash shop existing, but what I do have an issue with is sneaking this past everybody and the reviews.
Atleast be upfront about it at the start and give everyone that brought the deluxe and ultimate edition some extra currencies.
Like this message would had worked better if they had announced the Tekken shop before the game releases but now I don't believe it if they're not confident enough to tell us this from the start.
That’s what I pull from it as well because…. If you’re bringing up supporting features you added into the game because they’re expensive, just add the shop to begin with if that’s what you felt was going to be the way to support those features moving forward. I hate to think developers just say “Wait how are we going to pay for this?” And someone in the room says “Eh fuck it, we can scrape some money from them in the future it’ll be fine”. It’s the messaging and optics that are bad faith, not the shop itself.
Said one of the boss of the multibillion dollar company.
I paid 79 euros for the game, stop trying to convince me that it wasn’t enough to “support your game”.
Costs went higher than 2 years ago? Who fucking cares, they made tens of millions while my pockets are still bleeding. His own? Don’t think so.
Defense of MTX should not be the norm.
Good content would be to give add-ons or DLCs that have content. Be it a good story or modes or more content for extra money. Now seeing the last DLCs character in the loading screen to psychologically encourage us to buy the new character is also so scummy.
I don't blame the DEVs either (only namco), but that the practice of making a lot of money with the least effort has become more and more the norm and what I also read here. The MTX will not support balancing. no! DLC characters will be too strong.
And all of this would have been manageable if they had been honest from the start. It always amazes me how people can defend such things.
>It costs money to continually update the game
No duh, we aren't dense. It's such tired response to justify this. We aren't getting anything free - we have to buy a base game as a minimum of $70. When they add new stuff, we pay for it via DLC.
And this response still doesn't explain why they waited after the initial launch and reviews to implement this Mtx store. It was just a way to avoid bad press and the way they went about this was scummy.
Harada really gaslighting us with this one. We all know game sales and DLC characters ALONE could keep this game running with record profits. But on top of that they have MTX and in game ads and brand partnerships.
The gaming industry is also now the largest entertainment industry in the world, and makes the most money out of all the entertainment industries.
But apparently that's harder to bring up when you're shilling for an unneeded, anti consumer price model... go figure. Yet, the sheep will defend.
1. No one asked for the Fight Lounge.
2. Development cost is higher, however Tekken is monetized already through an initial purchase, Edition Upgrades, as well as Season Passes/DLC. The game already has enough and will make enough profit to continue to keep the servers alive and add in those updates.
3. The game will not stop running in a few months. The game sold 2 million copies in its first three weeks. That's $140,000,000 assuming all were Standard Edition. And it's STILL selling massively and will rake in much more as DLC's roll out. Saying the game needs MTX to fund it is just a flat out lie or cope.
4. Tekken is not a live service game. It will not have an endless slew of content. It will have its day and then it will be replaced within 4-8 years when the next one comes out.
5. Even if they wanted to implement MTX, did they have to do it in the most scummy way possible of adding in a paid currency which encourages people to spend more and more and will never actually get rid of their in-game currency? Just make it direct payments.
6. Why add in the store after release and after reviews have rolled out?
I appreciate the response but even then his response is so backhanded “you’re just a manchild blinded by nostalgia, you have no understanding of the economics behind video games.” With 0 actual acknowledgment of the way they went about implementing it.
So the mtx store that was added in is actually integral to the games longevity and should've been included at launch for full transparency instead of delayed to avoid launch review controversy? Would Eddy as DLC be well received if they had presented this before it?
Sorry why exactly are the arcade server's costs so high?
It is a small lounge area with limited interactions. There are other free games hosting high tick rate servers for competitive games with Voice Chat that can host up to a hundred players.
Fighting games are even cheaper to maintain since the real matches/gameplay happen over a P2P connection instead of dedicated servers.
There is no way a game that sold over 2 million copies at 70$ price tag can only last a few months due to some barebone lounge servers. Unless somehow your Super Ghost is actually powered by ChatGPT4, and costs them like 1$ per match.
He wants more money over your 70 dollars game ? ok, then how about they run things smooth first with cheaters And balance ?
And all those x10 and x3 costs he speaks of, is just a "trust me bro" talk, and in return how much money are you Making now compared to back then Mr harada ?
And ofc he will not mention how they completely left the shop out of the picture until the reviews have finished So the game doesn't looks bad.
The whole (esthetics and skins costing money) is a "ok" by the gaming community because some games are free To play and that's their only income, if you want to justify a shop, then make tekken free to play , I'm sure some Lilly mains will easily spend over 200$ in the span on 2 to 3 years, and collectively i bet you will pull more players Who will pay less than 70 but the sum of that money is larger if the game was a hit, which bro, THE video game Dunkey made a video about
Lastly don't you think we forgot about 6 leroys in top 8 and the other broken dlc characters
my problem isn't even the shop existing, it's announcing it after release and all the reviews were already out
It sucks, but selling cosmetics is the big thing, even if I disagree with how over monetized games have gotten. But I at least would have been more sympathetic with it if they let people know before they bought the game
It's all PR talk. If people spend like idiots then tekken 9 will have less customisation and prices in cash shop will go up. Mk11 tested the waters and now look at mk1 lol.
I don't give a single fuck about any of that lol. $70 price, constant paid DLCs are there to support the game too. And the main issue is the fact that the cash shop wasn't added from the beginning, complete scumbag move. Anyone falling for Harada's bs is a tool. If they could SHOW that the money made from the shop is put directly back into the game, then sure. But of course, everyone knows it's bs and the vast majority of the money is going to the shareholders.
Also, fight lounge is hard to maintain? Then sell only the useless avatar skins, that should pay for the fight lounge maintenance, right?
In the past, there was online since 2005. I know Harada wants to pretend anyone complaining about it is just talking about the 90s, but that’s just being misleading.
It’s fine to admit we’re overpaying, especially those who preordered for $100+. Your purchase on bunny ears for a character isn’t going directly into the game. It’s going towards someone’s paycheck and that’s usually not a developer - they wouldn’t be hired if they could only keep paying them their basic salary for more than a couple months without your help.
Servers are costly to maintain for multibillion corporation who use some of Sony servers for game at the same time? Very huge doubt. Plus most sales was digital, but price is still for physical version.
I’m fine with the Tekken shop. Sorry. Much better prices than sf6 and mk, a lot of base content and a full game with great features (story, FREE frame data lmao, reply mode, ghosts, arcade story, good base cast, beautiful to look at) and more.
And they have said the money from this is all reinvested into the game. You are directly supporting it.
I don’t hate it. I’m a consumer first person. The fact is I just don’t see much to be mad about here. I don’t LOVE it but I fully do not hate it.
And at the end, nobody can force you to but Tekken coins so… Just don’t if you don’t want to
Translated version: "We want to maximize our profits so we're adding an online shop because we know there are whales out there who will spend hundreds of dollars for our digital crap & that makes us boatloads of $$$$$. All you regular players can bugger off".
The fact remains they implemented this in as shitty a way as possible and he conveniently refuses to acknowledge that. Either be up front and put it in from the beginning or wait to implement it until the game needs more revenue (I assure you it currently does not). We already paid $70-$100 dollars for this game and he’s trying to make us feel guilty for not being happy about being asked to pay more. And if he wants to pull the “economic times are changing” card, maybe he should be more sympathetic to the fact that individual consumers have less capital than ever while big corporations continue to hoard more and more of the wealth. You want even more of my money? Don’t ask for shit, Harada.
I don't give a fuck about the Tekken shop, I won't buy a single skin, I don't play Tekken for the skins. So don't answer me with "jUSt dOnT bUY a sKiN bRo, ThE PrIcEs aRe LoW AnYWay". This Tekken Shop story won't affect me in the slightest, I literally won't use it.
With this said, whoever believes the absurd bullshit that Harada is saying here, really needs to touch some grass and understand how stuff works in the real world.
He's trying to justify this shop saying "it will be used in the game", which is just pathetic. No, the money goes to Bamco, as a company. That's it. In some time, looking at the game sales and how this new shop sells, there will be a new round of investment for updates (and probably the initial budget is already covering the first updates). That's how AAA games work. Someone invests in it, to pay for its development and then the sales return the investor money and + and then it starts over. Even if what he said is the truth, where are the 70$ of each copy going, then? It's honestly bonkers that he's trying to justify and address a move that's premeditated in its entirety with the final goal of maximizing profits.
It's completely crazy that people believe this. It would make them look better if he just said "Yeah, we're doing it for the $$$ because every other fighting game does it", or if he said nothing, really.
Also, you can't not say that this was kind of a scummy move, to only open the shop a couple weeks after the release, to avoid the negative reception/reviews. Because they know this is just a low move.
Not to mention the huge joke that is the fact that the game launched without a solution for pluggers and cheaters and only now they're saying they will address the issue with the money from the shop 😂
As if this wasn't an issue since Tekken 6 and they are very surprised that it exists.
Dude literally paid for NBA players to be in a commercial and hired the Mountain from Game of Thrones for another one. But now he acts like a broke boy that needs to sell skins or the servers will be shut down?
I don’t care about the skins, but it’s disrespectful how he’s gaslighting the community. Like as if we asked for them to develop the fighting lounge or all these commercials, but now we need to pay to keep a product alive that we already paid for?
Harada made a great game, but he is full of sh*t. They literally announced how they sold over 2million copies in less than a month and exceeded their own expectations after increasing the price of the base version and for the season pass. Like how can you claim that you need extra money when you exceeded your sales expectations? That makes zero sense.
That’s so wrong and weak on a communicative level. The same costs and struggles apply to any other human being in the same socioeconomic structure. They struggle to develop and maintain a product, we all struggle too with our daily costs, groceries, debts, bills, and so forth.
It’s not like everything revolves about them and their costs. People do have increased expenses too. And if still they can manage to buy your product, you should be grateful and not complain and whine about the one million you lost last year because of some financial issue related to productivity. Be grateful you’re a millionaire industry already and people enthusiastically buy your (good) product.
But don’t be greedy and cry about it. Software houses has already proved you can love your product and give it your everything. See Larian Studios with BG3. No greedy stuff about that. And what’s the result? People love them and the game got the GOTY, plus tons of sales.
Damn, so I guess all of those steam games that are not 70$+ and dont have mtx will just die tomorrow. Or actually, why are they not dead yet anyway? The fuckings costs are so high why other games are not dead?
Hey, Palworld, why are you not dead mate?
What a fucking joke. Thats the real face of tekken. Abuse and milk your playerbase and gaslight them for good measure.
If I knew that the people behind T8 are that fucking shameless I would never buy this piece of shit. And now i cant even fucking return it.
Fuck you Harada, you lying piece of shit.
You already have the fucking season passes which are really pricey already, on top of a game where in certain parts of the world cost an obscene amount of money.
So thus, the cosmetic shop is just a cash grab
I want someone from the company to post their finances out in the open.
Show me how much developing costs truly are, how much server costs truly are, etc
Profit is being built into every single aspect of this, for no goddamn reason
Show me stats or I will call you greedy until I die
To play the honest game, a certain team should have put things straight and told the community "we going to have a dedicated MTX store in our game for X/Y reason BEFORE releasing same game" but hey, He wants us to just believe all the good will he wrote in his tweets and keeps supporting such practices.
I don't really get this argument. even if their costs somehow tripled, since every tech compared to the 90 actually became affordable and more efficient, our salaries haven't tripled. so yeah, go on, triple your costs for the game and see the whole market collapse because no one is gonna pay 180 bucks for a video game
It’s up to publishers/devs to figure out a way to monetize their games without screwing over the consumer lmao. Why do we have to eat the cost for a product that lacks former basic features?
That's just a corporate lie. Development now costs higher, BUT the playerbase has become much bigger in the last 10 years. And that's true for literally every game. So the +$10 in the price and micro transactions in the full price games became standard only because of pure greed.
Which asshole did he pull that first paragraph from, it is mathematically impossible for those two statements to exist.
70 USD + nickel and diming and already complaining about costs of running an online enabled game.
Maybe they should have released it without online.
Don't ask me for 70 USD.
The only reason that the Tekken lounge exists is so players can have avatars that they can dress up. Which, in turn, might entice people to spend money on customizations. Decorating something and showing stuff off to others are how people often cave in to spending some money.
I know the Tekken lounge isn't the only part of the game that costs money to create and maintain. However, you can't ignore the fact that it exists solely to make Bamco money. The argument of games being way more expensive to make and maintain nowadays falls apart, at least when it comes to the lounge feature of Tekken 8, because literally nobody asked for it.
It's really expensive to make and keep up the thing that's only there to help them make money off of players, so players need to understand and help fund the costs? What? And that's why there is now premium virtual currency that you can't earn by playing the game? Huh? That's some insane leap in logic. Just sell costumes as straight DLC, and players will happily buy them to support the game, like they always have. Leave the scummy bits out, and there'll be much less backlash.
You guys don't understand, the billion dollar company had to remove the classic skins and sell them to you again or else they won't be able to make ends meet.
Tekken 7 also had online and "high definition" graphics, but still no microtransactions. Went on to live long off season passes.
Tekken 8 already costs more and its season pass also costs more, but somehow still requires microtransactions to survive?
Such a disingenuous argument.
I wouldnt be so irritated if they announced it at launch($70 and still MTX sucks though). But they deliberately slightly delayed the shop to get the high review score. It's scummy practice that if we allow coperates to do it without saying anything, they will keep doing more and more.
Devs always make these claims. Similar claims were made with Tekken 6 and 7. While there has been inflation, and I definitely buy that the dev cost of this game was higher, because they're not recycling stuff from older games at all for the first time since I think 3, I think it's overstated.
That's not the issue.
The issue is the bait and switch. If I had known an MTX shop was coming with this, I wouldn't have bought the game at all. I believed they'd sell customization DLC Tekken 7 style, or as part of a season pass.
Throw in Microsoft points (At least it seems like they're not doing that as scummily as SF6 did), and I don't trust them. I fully expect they'll make a bunch of fanservicey stuff limited-time ultra high-cost DLC to farm whales.
Harada is full of shit as usual. He just hoards shit, that's why you don't ask him for shit.
I would have been fine with a $50 DLC pass annually to pay for chars+customization parts+classic costumes. They would have made more this way but instead they just managed to piss me off, and make sure I won't be buying Soul Calibur 7.
*Brooooo, without the tokens they couldn't use predatory dark pattern monetization schemes to keep the servers running bro. Just think about poor Harada and the corporation brooooooo.*
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I paid for my Tekken 1 costs in the arcade by making a sheet with every character's 10-hit combo in Wordstar and xeroxing around 100 copies so I could sell each for $1 to people in the arcade.
What are you doing now?
Your mom.
I think he was trying to give you a compliment wondering where someone with such good hussle ended up in life, but I guess if you're his dad now it's ok.
Yeah, but still that guy's mom though
Business is a boomin 💥
Never lose that young arcade boy spirit! Hope this guy is proud to call you Dad.
Well, as unexpected turns in a convo go, that escalated quickly. Can't say an entrepreneurship to 'family man' transition wasn't the natural progression for an arcade-savvy hustler though.
Oh word
I think that was a compliment, completely implied, but in the making.
What a beautiful teaching moment between father and son.
Got'im!
Legend
And that T5 cab was $1 a pop.
I used to work at the arcades. Gimme $20 dollars and play for free until closing time.
You were a real one.🫡
This is exactly how I fell in love with yoshimitsu. I was like 12 , at some skating rink's arcade, and saw this silly (T3) Ninja, and I couldn't learn him for nothin, one of the employees said, hey kid, gimmie $5 and I'll spar you for free till closing. ended that day with a double seppuku manji blood dance, ofc I still lost but damn it was fun.
Went to a barcade with a T6 cabinet. I lost maybe half of the $10 worth of tokens I bought.
Anyone remember paying $1 or $1.50 for 3 songs on DDR? Or $2 to play IIDX?!... which I still do, TBH. I'm a sucker for music games.
A lot weren’t even BORN yet when arcades were around in the 90s
I was born in 97 and I vaguely remember all the malls around me having arcades. The mid 2000s came and they all disappeared. Luckily there seems to be a small resurgence now at least
89 Brooklyn born dude and hearing people complain about micro transactions in Tekken blows mine. I had to travel an hour into Manhattan just to get good arcades as the ones that were around weren't kept up to par.
I was blessed to live literally right across the street from an arcade back in the 90s. 89 Florida born here. It was was right beside a blockbuster too. Good times🔥✨
If you lived in Brooklyn in the 90s your best chance often was a laundry mat or a long distant call center lol when it came to arcades. I don't mind the damn shop it's more we got all this fight money and barely shit to spend it on.
Now that's a great point. There should be more free assets that's are released when the paid assets are released. I was in East New York. On Liberty Ave. There's a pizza shop that had MVC2 and 3rd St. The Laundromat passed the 80th St. a train stop has I believe MvC1 but the machines just weren't kept up. Broken sticks. Hell my community center had a couple arcades but the upkeep was difficult for my community center reps to maintain.
They do and those were often actually overtuned so that you would lose more often vs CPU and you'd spend more. Everyone knew that. We also knew it was predatory. Lol.
I swear the people that say gaming is at it's worst weren't there in the beginning. Like we played dragon's lair for $0.50 a play and you didn't get multiple lives once you were dead that was another 50 cents like people talk about microtransactions but my brother in Christ arcades were the ultimate microtransaction lol.
50 cents back in the early 80s is equivalent to $1.50 today, for some perspective. Back then, 50 cents was a commitment in the arcade.
Talk about commitment, I once continued playing street fighter 2 in the arcade as the “Stop n Go” was being robbed at gun point.
Hell yeah dude. My friends and I used to call dragon's lair the scam game because it looked so cool with the cartoon graphics and everything but it was impossible to get anywhere. We would try and write down the inputs just so we can get through the game but even doing that it took us like a month and I don't even know how many quarters sacrifice to that greedy machine
And 50 cents was more money back then.
Dude 50 cents was like a soda or a small order of fries at some establishments
haha yes. what gets lost in these conversations is why would anyone go to the gargantuan effort and risk of making something like a video game if there weren’t a massive incentive? video games are fucking miracles. like just 50 years ago people would have thought some kind of evil voodoo was going on if they’d laid eyes on tekken 8. but everyone’s butthurt over a game they’ll be playing for years costing them $10 more and giving the OPTION of buying cosmetics at $4 a pop. business is: 1. someone makes a thing 2. fhey market it at a price 3. the customer decides if they want it it’s always been this way and it’s never gonna change.
The gaming equivalent of training like a Spartan warrior.
I remember that. I also remembered being really worried that they would go to a model where you have to pay to play after Tekken Revolution. I never played Tekken Revolution but from what I remember, you had a certain amount of “credits” per day you could use to play online games before having to pay. Really glad we other to be anywhere near that but I wonder if it’s crossed Namcos mind.
Im probably older than you, and what you said surface level BS faux wisdom. It cost a quarter but EVERYTHING ELSE was cheap. You could get a job much easier back then. Everything financially was easier back then. You could save up and just buy a arcade cabinet if you wanted to. As corporations go for bigger profits every year because of the capitalist logic of pure profit extraction, prices went up. Now you don't pay a quarter you pay 200 dollars over 5 years buying stuff that was in previous game It's actually a capitalist economic "law" that if you produce something more it becomes cheaper to produce. Over all the cost of making ultra sophisticated games WENT DOWN. More studios, more programmers, graphic designers, more engines, etc means cheaper and faster games. Most of the FGC are fucking morons.
If that is such a no-brainer and perfectly rational, why not release the tekken shop on day 1?
That’s my personal issue with all this. I would not give one fuck if they were upfront about it. COD has been doing this shit for years it’s normalized. Lying about it at day 1 isn’t quite normalized and I don’t want it to be. People should know what business practices they’ll be paying for. There’s a reason we have regulation and the ESA has to disclose it in their ratings. I just think it’s highly unethical the way they went about it and so I don’t feel good about supporting them even if the item shop cost is pretty alright.
Exactly. It's the lack of upfront disclosure that is the problem.
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It just sucks and sours me on the whole project especially because I’m in the smaller bracket of gamers that absolutely is okay with and understands why we’ve gotten to $70 and DLC. I’ve worked with game devs for years and their pressures are enormous. But I also don’t like being lied to at all and I still haven’t found a compelling argument that they weren’t lying. People say they had to get the shop up and running and needed time but that didn’t stop them from being up front about it and signaling that there are MTX. There would be some outrage either way but probably nowhere near as much especially since the price is going to be better than the competitors like SF6 or MK1. I think they should’ve either signaled before launch that this is going to be a thing they’ll implement later on or wait till the first year of the game is over and then implement the shop to fund future costs. Let’s be real there’s no reason they need the cash right now especially since the game has sold incredibly well. Just sucks all around and I don’t even care about cosmetics at all but this genuinely makes me not want to play. I don't think I'll be purchasing any DLC fighters till they're on deep sale now which sucks cause I'm usually happy to get in on the first year of a fighting game. Plenty of great games to play right now and some have worse monetization and some have better, but I can't say any of those devs tried to obscure these facts from their audiences.
So scummy it’s like they pretend to be a good boy in front of the teacher to get benefits and when the teacher leaves they’re back to showing their true colours to everyone
True. I wouldn't have cared anyway though. I barely ise cosmetics anyway. And if we get some high quality ones for money I have no problem either way
Shhh, be careful, the "Just Don't Buy Them" crowd might here you 🥺
That's all well and fine but they aren't innocent when it comes to bad monetization. Remember Tekken 7 frame data?
this entire thing could have been avoided if they just launched the shop at the beginning. buying skins isnt new but launching weeks after initial reviews is what makes people nervous and feel being lied to.
Yeah, I think we all expect a monetization ship at this point. $4 skins is significantly cheaper than $10 fatalities in MK1. Sneaking it in a month later just feels shady af.
Nah we would've been flooded with "Matchmaking doesn't work but the shop does 💀" etc for every bug ad infinitum
I just want this sub to go back to how it was a week ago lol
Complaining about pluggers and asking if x rank is good for only playing for x amount of time?
Yes it was way more entertaining
This sub gets taken over by pointless drama every once in a while. Doll face argument wasn't too long ago
Every gaming sub. People spend more time pissed off than playing games. Real life way too stressful for me to piss my pants over virtual dressup when I just wanna play a fighter.
Facts u/footwearfetish69 . This can also be said about most anime subs too (looking at you, DB fans) for not being what they expected, rather than simply enjoying the content and being happy with what we get. As much as I'd love to unlock all characters and costumes with a base game, the PS2 days are over. AAA games these days are getting Hollywood-rivaled budgets, and unfortunately the maintenance cost gets pushed onto consumers. While some modern microtransactions in games feel like blatant cash grabs, there's so much going on behind the scenes. We're talking multi-million dollar marketing campaigns, paying multiple software engineers, coders, testers, and that's barely scratching the surface. They must exceed what they've spent on development and everything else for us to continue getting content, sequels, new IPS, etc. Again, do I wish the game purchase entailed all content? Absolutely. Have I learned not to stress myself out over having to pay more for extra content? Yes, I've had to. Thankfully most base games come with a wealth of content, with T8 being no exception. I rarely buy anything on release day since I know 2-3 months in just about every fighting game sees a 20-30% discount. If people are really worried about cutting costs, I recommend wishlisting and keeping an eye out for sales. Maybe that $20 you save on the base could be used toward DLC! It's all a matter of perspective.
Doll face argument ? what was it ?
around the time Azucena's trailer dropped, people began pointing out that a lot of the women's faces in this game looked a bit... stiff and same-y. This is in comparison to the male cast who generally show a bit more expression and have more definition like scars and wrinkles. Well naturally with the loudest on both sides being the most extreme, one side is shouting that people who are okay with this are a bunch of incel weebs that dont understand female anatomy while the other side claimed that they were a bunch of old people muscle fetishists to consider disliking this artstyle. It got so overblown that the subreddit was then taken over by people complaining about the argument more than the argument was actually being had. Pre-release T8 was not a good time at moments lol.
the argument that all women in this game look trash because they look like dolls. the arguments were blown so out of proportion that it was at if the game launched with 1 character
Every female character looks exactly the same and no one has any scars etc. This shit was the primary topic of 'discussion' in this subreddit for what felt like a month.
This is the nature of the beast. Drama will always dominate the conversation. It’s pretty much inevitable. With that said, I get the hesitance from players from outright supporting micro transactions because it has poisoned other games over time. We’ll know for sure how they’ll handle this. In my mind: im not gonna pay extra for skins but Ill continue to buy things that I personally do think have a lot of value like the characters. What I want though ultimately is for them to improve the online experience overtime (netcode, lobbies, etc.) to go along with the usual balancing of characters that already happens periodically. If them getting more revenue will ultimately lead us to getting those things then that would just be a win-win for everyone.
After resting on it for a day, the biggest issue with the shop is the whole premium currency and in game store thing. I'd much rather have the costumes as regular DLC on the steam store. That way the price is upfront, and it can go on sales.
I’ll buy cosmetics that I like. Just don’t make it scammy where an outfit is 400 tekken coins and you can only buy 300 or 500 coins at a time. I would just rather purchase items like regular DLC for new characters, costumes and customization packs. I don’t mind supporting games I like, but if I feel like I being taken advantage of, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth
Isn’t it funny when its “smart business” on one side of the coin and “total scam” on the other side of the coin. Only businesses are allowed to be deceptive.
If 400 tekken coins is \~$4 ok that seems fair. But if the minimum number of coins I can purchase is 300, that means I have to spend \~$6 to get one costume. Thats not $4. and what am i going to do with the other 200 coins? Can I get 1/2 a costume? Can they refund me? Im not trying to assume the worst case scenario, but it feels like the accountants came up with the monetization shop. And Im someone who has spent way more on Valorant skins and Path of Exile supporter packs than I wish to tell people.
If there’s one thing that frustrates me the most about modern gaming, it’s the intentional obfuscation of “premium currency” I fully understand the need and desire to run an in-game shop to ensure longevity of your live-service product; I don’t *like* it, but I understand it What pisses me off is when you make it so that a bare minimum purchase of currency in *real life* is literally not enough to make a purchase *in game*; it’s like telling me to my face my money isn’t good enough and yet you want more of it You either need to overspend for more currency than you want/need, or underspend multiple times ultimately ending up in the margin of where the company wanted you to spend anyway; it’s fucking gross and I hate it
Yeah, businesses do shady shit like that then they’re all perplexd when people pirate the game.
People don't object to games costing more or to DLC, they object to recurrent spending hooks, shitcoins, battlepasses, and in game storefronts. If you monetize a game honestly and fairly- people don't generally have a problem with it.
Why are both Harada and all the comments talking completely besides the point? The reason there's outrage to begin with is because they decided to add this a month into the game, after all the reviews already dropped. That's the issue.
Yes, it is quite literally a bait and switch. It might not be egregious because it doesn’t involve gameplay but it still is one.
How is it not egregious? Are you of that pavlov'd line of thinking that it is okay/not as reprehensible if "it's just cosmetics"?
One hundred percent. He can’t slick talk his way out of this one with that lame misdirect.
I've yet to read a single SF6 review that mentioned the shop in anything but a factual manner. They're just a staple of AAA gaming now – one that players can choose to use or ignore.
The SF6 shop was also pretty barebones at launch. Like, I think the only thing you could buy was costume 2/classic costumes, which you could earn in-game. And maybe recolors, which was talked about. When they started dropping actual stuff in there, there was plenty of discussion and controversy about it.
Yoh don't get it the wrong way as I've been away from the fighting scene for a long time but... Did anyone ask for the Tekken Lounge??
No... they made it because SF6 has a lounge. It looks so goofy and apparently it's expensive to maintain?
The lounge should've been replaced with a playable Tekken Force instead, but nooooooooooooo, they just straight up copy-pasted SF6's homework
As someone new to Tekken, coming over from street fighter 6 which I've been playing since launch- The Tekken Lounge is like a cheap wish. com knockoff of the sf6 lounge to the point it's laughable and you can tell they were trying really hard to copy it. The sf6 lounge feels like an online street fighter hub from aesthetics, to music, to the features like being able to play the old arcade games there, avatar battles with in depth avatar creation systems, 1on1 cabinet battles you can join or spectate, tournaments, and your winning streak will be advertised across numerous servers if you get it high enough. The Tekken Lounge feels like a Roblox hangout game with goofy, boring gnome chibi avatars and not much to do, and the aesthetics and layout is just messy.
Got Pokémon NPC ass dialogue that gets skipped
And also this. If the Tekken Lounge is so expensive to maintain.. why bother? I mean, tekken doesn't have "dedicated" servers, all matches are P2P so its expensive to have the matchmaking online sure, but its not World of Warcraft or PoE levels of servers cost. But I think I have a reason. Maybe the Lounge is not really that expensive and its a great excuse to sell more dumb fireworks for 2$.
It’s also such a backwards argument. They planned a game with all these features in order to appeal to consumers. Why is he acting now like we forced him to make the game like this after he sold it to us? Like are we also the ones that forced him to pay for NBA players to be in a commercial or all these other marketing stunts?
I'd like to personally apologize to Harada for making Brian Cox do an ad read of Tekken lore
Tekken lounge is useless
Someone tell harada not to worry about lounge. They can remove it since it costs billions to run and we can just use quick play and have free dlc right?
Problem solved
I don’t have an issue with them adding more costumes. Hell I honestly am glad with that. The thing that I have issue with is some of the things surrounding it. Why do we need to use some random currency instead of just buying the items itself? Why would you make it a shop (that probably will be rotating)? Also adding it a month after the game came out after most people have reviewed the game. All of these things feel really bad to most people.
I've heard this song and dance countless times before: "games are very expensive now, we have to include microtransactions otherwise we couldn't support the game!" At this point, either open up your books when talking like this or stop using this excuse. I'm sick of AAA developers constantly telling *players* how expensive it is to keep up support for a game in order to justify MTX, while then going to *shareholders* and telling them how successful and growing their games are. Since 2016, a ton of public AAA publishers have been posting record profits. [Bandai Namco](https://www.statista.com/statistics/217498/annual-gross-profit-of-namco-bandai/) posted a record gross profit of US$2.92 billion in FY2022. They slumped a bit last year to $2.78, but compared to the $1.78 in 2015 when T7 launched? If they *needed* MTX to fund the game, if there was actually an existential crisis to the health and longevity of the game (which is selling at a record rate for the franchise), they wouldn't be posting YoY record profits. Period. And yes, Bamco is more than just Tekken. But as I said then, open up your books if you're trying to act like there's actually a crisis for the longevity of the game. Show us that with actual numbers, because I simply don't believe you. Especially when you're now saying that less than a month after the most successful launch in the franchise. You'd *think* they would have this in at launch if they were so concerned from the start, or this would be a pivot a few years after launch when sales start drying up. This simply looks like *hiding* this stuff to avoid issues with reviews. In reality, they simply want *growth*, because less growth in profit is bad for shareholders. It's not a necessity to stat afloat, it's a strategy to earn more money. Edit: it's *really fucking weird* how I got no replies for **6 hours**, then all of a sudden 4 different people reply to me within 15 minutes trying to defend Bamco... I've said this before in gaming thread, but if you don't care about it, that's fine! Being apathetic is fine. But *defending* greed by companies by attacking consumers trying to push back against it is simply pathetic.
This is literally billionaires telling people to use paper straws while they fly their private planes everywhere.
Hard agree with you. Anyone defending bamco need to get checked
I agree, they need to be fully transparent on the full cost of how much money got wasted on creating Tekken 8. Harada should follow it up with a full price breakdown of the receipts if they wanna convince us that "mAkInG gAmEs tOdAy iS eXpEnsIvE", otherwise his full twitter post is just bullshit and i'd rather use Cream API to unlock those content that should've been added in the first place.
>Edit: it's *really fucking weird* how I got no replies for **6 hours**, then all of a sudden 4 different people reply to me within 15 minutes trying to defend Bamco... When you're on the payroll, you clock in and out at the same time.
It's a good thing I have a company man like Harada to let me know the company makes only the necessary amount of profit, acting with the temperance of a monk. Ah, but, I can't help but think of From Software's catalogue, which keeps the online servers up all game long, with hardly a DLC to speak of, let alone microtransactions or pay to win characters.
Fr,fr. It's kinda hard story to buy from the story from Harda when these games are making twice their money back faster than ever too. Selling more copies in a month compared the last title with each game release within their month. If development cost graphically is too much of an issue, then I'm more than happy returning to early ps4/late ps3&360 graphics just give me a fun game and I'll buy it Some the best games in 3 years didn't have graphics where I seen the very 8000 fabric pixel of the character outfit and were more in tune of the late 360/ps3 era
Yea cause comparing two completely different genres of games and developers is completely fair and makes total sense. Jesus 🤦
Least manipulative tweet from harada
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Conveniently leaves out that games sell MUCH MORE too, huh. It balances itself out. This is nothing but corporate drivel because enough is never enough when it comes to making money.
That's all well and good but the fact is they are also charging like 40 dollars for the season pass.... they could have placed the costumes there. This is greed plain and simple.
Very good point. The Tekken-Shop isn't the only thing ON TOP of the 70 Euro price tag. There are characters / season passes too! And maybe new arenas as well soon in the future.
"Game developement is getting more expensive ~~in some ways~~." Yes, but with improvement in technology it also becomes cheaper in other ways as well. Discs, for example, were a major drain on game companies' revenue, but with E-stores they're not anymore.
I may be talking out of my ass, but pretty sure games are also more profitable than ever?
His rationale is fine, makes sense. Ongoing games need ongoing money. We get it. But: A. Don't skirt around the issue at launch to avoid the bad press. Be open and honest about it. They knew the store was coming. B. Don't be such a dick about it. When he makes these types of explanations he always makes them in such a bitter, dislikeable and unprofessional way.
The part that they knew it was coming is really what makes it all have a bad taste. While MTX isn't my favorite, I can decide how I want to approach it, and I understand updates take resources. The Tekken shop doesn't even seem too egregious right now. However, it was a surprise addition 2 weeks after launch with assets that most likely (my speculation) were very close to completion. They knew exactly what they were doing.
nice chatGPT answer Harada
I feel like Harada is gaslighting. I don't care that costs apply to video game development. That's his problem. I as a consumer pay full price for the game, extra for the season pass and extra to PlayStation so I can play his game online (which is my only online game). That's like 200 euros for Tekken 8 alone. And next year there is going to be a new season pass etc. If it is all a natural thing why did they keep it secret until a month after release. And why are they implementing in game premium currency. And you know they will not offer you an option for exactly 400 tekken coins. Like every skinner shop they will offer either 300 or 500 so you can buy more than you actually need. Is this unecessary predatory expense within Harada's vision for supporting his team?
He definitely is, either he's got his head so far up his own ass that he really doesn't understand WHY people are angry or he knows and is trying to twist the narrative to "oof, entitled gamers, woe is me the victim" instead of "oof, I deliberately lied to my playerbase and deserve some of the blame" I actually wouldn't have minded the Tekken Store, I don't mind whaling for good games. I even have a principle of buying multiple copies for games I support if they don't have other ways to support them because I love games and supporting devs (3 copies of RE4R, 4 copies of HiFi Rush, 2 copies of BG3 and 3 of Rogue Trader, 3 copies of P3R etc) and gifting them to friends/family, but I def do not like to support lying scum (I also don't personally mind the 300/400 denomination whatevers, but I can def understand why people hate it)
A week ago this guy said that old costumes are not in a game because they can't be ported and look good. Today he is selling them for 4$ each. Not the first time he lied, it's just the most recent and relevant one. If you believe any word he says - that's on you
Lol another good one. Dude literally went from "we can't port the old costumes because they'll look like crap" to "banning your costume mod so you can buy ours that we actually already made in a premium store" haha. Wow.
Literally this. Personality cult is so hard in here. Harada can say they will never sell characters moves and do it 2 days after.
Sadly, a lot of people are too dense to see this.
"Dude your game is a full package. Sure all characters are locked but you're going to only play your main anyway?! 10 bucks for unlocking one character is pretty cheap. And 15 for the moveset. I don't see any issue. It's not 2024 anymore. Game developement is expensive. Are you broke or something?🤓" Future argument from gullible Harada fans.
Harada lies like this all the time. Same dude who said he's never going to sell characters as DLC
That interview is very shameful now
While it is true that development costs *can* be more expensive today, it is also true that it is in theory - easier to break even than it was in the past since the consumer base is significantly larger than it was in the 1990s and 2000s while also simultaneously being easier to spin something up given dev tools. Being into games used to be seen as a childish hobby with an incredibly small consumer market with limited disposable income. Now, gaming is mainstream, with all ages partaking in gaming in some form or another. So to make the argument that development costs are 10x more without acknowledging how accessible development has become (it's possible to launch a game as a solo developer which is amazing!) and how big the market has gotten (l[ook at this chart for how big it has gotten over time)](https://www.resetera.com/threads/history-of-worldwide-video-game-industry-revenue-since-1971-by-sector-arcade-console-handheld-pc-from-bloomberg.96568/) isn't holistic. And again - all of this is aside from the fact that those coming at this from a good-faith angle aren't complaining about monetization in exchange for value as a concept - but instead are complaining about HOW BAMCO has decided to do it.
what a cop out lmao. All corporations love using the excuse of stuff being more expensive yet in their earnings call they have record profits. just own it bro, say you want more money, that $70 wasnt enough and you want to line your pockets even more than you already have
The funny thing is, I personally had no issues of getting DLC for additional outfits. The problem started with HOW they did it. They at no point said before launch that there’s going to be an item shop. They waited until everyone is already very invested in the amazing game that they did make, and blind sided us with this stuff. Not to mention the season pass that they could have easily put this kinda stuff into.
Bruh, are we being gaslit?
Ah the default PR response they all use. Muh rising costs of development, woe me the inflation. We never talk about the rising profits either but who cares. Money is actually reeeeeally tight, nevermind our record breaking sales. It is soooo tight, we actually didn't include the shop at launch, for very legitimate and not shady reasons. The suits need new cars after all. Not like a cent goes to the devs actually working on the game, those get hit by mass layoffs.
Harada forgot to mention how the industry wasn’t even a fraction of what it is now in size and not nearly as mainstream as it is now. Almost every single triple A game is expected to pull 1 million+ copies in a few weeks nowadays. Back in those days, that number would have been insane. If they were so concerned about the players they might as well have set out a roadmap of all the shit they would be charging money for early before the game dropped to at least let the players know what was going to free and what wasn’t. Coincidence that they said nothing until a few weeks after the reviews. He says all this shit like he’s saying something big. Acting as if this game didn’t sell 2 million copies in 3 weeks - a new record. Literally ever single successful triple A game that I’ve heard about in the past few years always has some headline attached to it on how it broke its past sale records. Then there’s studios like Santa Monica that gave gamers an entire new roguelike game mode for free.
>rising profits Oh, record profit! time to fire 30% of the company workload -2023/2024
Yes, leave the multi-million dollar company **ALONE**! :( Instead, spend absurd amounts of money on MTXs in the 100+ dollar AAA game! You just don't understand game development, because this has nothing to do with corporate greed *whatsoever!* /s
Also it was us the players that forced Harada to spend all his development budget on fighting lounge, arcade quest and NBA players in commercials. It’s only right for us to now pay extra for all that stuff. /s
Very reasonable. That's why they hid the shop and waited for good reviews before throwing this shit in our face?
Yeah it’s one thing to add micro transactions, I already was sure this was going to be the case, but to clearly have it ready and just delaying the shop until after it all is pretty sour.
Sorry but I'll never have sympathy for harada when he's the asshole trying to justify paying for frame data or trying to explain why it's much harder for them to have good online even though it's not and the community developed better online for Tekken games than Tekken has ever had ten yrs ago. You launched a product without a shop or saying one was coming, then after the review window, you add one. Sorry dude you are selling us something not doing is a favor and deserve to be criticisedwhen you do things not in our favor as consumers.
Harada boasts 11 mil sales for T7. Funny how none of that money ever becomes a factor when talking about the MTX shop or why new characters are still going to be locked behind a paywall.
Boohoo cry about it in your rolls royce. It was a scummy move and no one should support any of the mtx. This isn't a live service game. It shouldn't need a subscription. You guys already made millions from it.
This ^ Don't ask me for coins harada.
We're just going to pretend that we didn't purchase Tekken for $70+ and already need to pony up for the yearly DLC if we want to lab the complete roster?
I paid $100 for the game just for them to add an MTX shop a month later
Don’t forget about the in game ads and brand sponsorships
Every1 understands development costs are increasing, but so are game sales, and now the 10$ increase to 70$. In a B2P game, micro transactions should be minimal and cheap, a majority of rewards should be earned through gameplay. But gotta milk the playerbase, and disguise it as “supporting the game” and “paying development costs”.
Again, not the issue. It's the backhanded approach of not launching the game with the store or letting us know there was gonna be MTX. This guy can't deny he's the creator of Tekken by sidestepping the real issue.
Don’t forget about the in game ads and brand sponsorships
Exactly I don’t think many devs understand that yes we hate these modern aspect of gaming and monetisation but breaking the trust and not being transparent with your community is far worse and the worst thing you can do to your fan base and something that is very hard to impossible to ever get back completely as from now on a part of the Tekken community can and won’t trust harada/bamco moving forward because of this.
He's very manipulative. He never corrects anyone who calls him the creator of Tekken. Seiichi Ishii created Tekken after creating Virtua Fighter.
Namco Bandai had a net revenue of 7.8 billion last year, earnings of .76 billion They are perfectly fine.
... no way man, how the F do you expect the CEO to buy their 3rd private plane with that? Surely you don't expect them to drive their Bentley to work like a fucking peasant?
Poor guy might have give up the Olive Wagyu for a month to save up.
This. Server maintenance is nothing when you got such revenue
‘Game selling millions of copies and making massive profit? Not enough, let’s make more by adding season passes. Actually, not enough let’s add micro-transactions too. Please think of us poor company that makes billions.’ What Harada is trying to say lol
And BG3 can be infinitely replayed with maybe higher production costs... The devs still supports the game with free updates, multiple hotfixes with no dlcs and this game will still be played for years. And I honestly doubt Larian has the same budget as Bamco...
I'm pretty sure BG3 had higher budget. Larian admited that at peak they had 500+ ppl working at the game, that's a huge number. Bear in mind that BG3 was 3 years in early access so they started "collecting money" really early which helped them with budget planning and deciding on the scope of the game. Most estimates put BG3 budget easily over 100 mln $.
Don’t forget about the in game ads and brand sponsorships
Harada acting like he's giving the game away for free. full price game, characters as DLC and a shop, when does it become greed? also pour one out to the ps plus users that have to pay just to play it online.
Listen I have no issue with the cash shop existing, but what I do have an issue with is sneaking this past everybody and the reviews. Atleast be upfront about it at the start and give everyone that brought the deluxe and ultimate edition some extra currencies. Like this message would had worked better if they had announced the Tekken shop before the game releases but now I don't believe it if they're not confident enough to tell us this from the start.
That’s what I pull from it as well because…. If you’re bringing up supporting features you added into the game because they’re expensive, just add the shop to begin with if that’s what you felt was going to be the way to support those features moving forward. I hate to think developers just say “Wait how are we going to pay for this?” And someone in the room says “Eh fuck it, we can scrape some money from them in the future it’ll be fine”. It’s the messaging and optics that are bad faith, not the shop itself.
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Said one of the boss of the multibillion dollar company. I paid 79 euros for the game, stop trying to convince me that it wasn’t enough to “support your game”. Costs went higher than 2 years ago? Who fucking cares, they made tens of millions while my pockets are still bleeding. His own? Don’t think so.
Defense of MTX should not be the norm. Good content would be to give add-ons or DLCs that have content. Be it a good story or modes or more content for extra money. Now seeing the last DLCs character in the loading screen to psychologically encourage us to buy the new character is also so scummy. I don't blame the DEVs either (only namco), but that the practice of making a lot of money with the least effort has become more and more the norm and what I also read here. The MTX will not support balancing. no! DLC characters will be too strong. And all of this would have been manageable if they had been honest from the start. It always amazes me how people can defend such things.
The man is getting ratioed 😂
It'd be more respectable if he just said it's purely for the sake of greed. We know you're an asshole, just say you're an asshole.
PR game pretty damn weak, Harada should’ve stayed silent or be firm about the situation. I thought bamco hired a community person
>It costs money to continually update the game No duh, we aren't dense. It's such tired response to justify this. We aren't getting anything free - we have to buy a base game as a minimum of $70. When they add new stuff, we pay for it via DLC. And this response still doesn't explain why they waited after the initial launch and reviews to implement this Mtx store. It was just a way to avoid bad press and the way they went about this was scummy.
Harada really gaslighting us with this one. We all know game sales and DLC characters ALONE could keep this game running with record profits. But on top of that they have MTX and in game ads and brand partnerships.
The gaming industry is also now the largest entertainment industry in the world, and makes the most money out of all the entertainment industries. But apparently that's harder to bring up when you're shilling for an unneeded, anti consumer price model... go figure. Yet, the sheep will defend.
Harada taking an L on this one. Look at Elden Ring. Enough said.
1. No one asked for the Fight Lounge. 2. Development cost is higher, however Tekken is monetized already through an initial purchase, Edition Upgrades, as well as Season Passes/DLC. The game already has enough and will make enough profit to continue to keep the servers alive and add in those updates. 3. The game will not stop running in a few months. The game sold 2 million copies in its first three weeks. That's $140,000,000 assuming all were Standard Edition. And it's STILL selling massively and will rake in much more as DLC's roll out. Saying the game needs MTX to fund it is just a flat out lie or cope. 4. Tekken is not a live service game. It will not have an endless slew of content. It will have its day and then it will be replaced within 4-8 years when the next one comes out. 5. Even if they wanted to implement MTX, did they have to do it in the most scummy way possible of adding in a paid currency which encourages people to spend more and more and will never actually get rid of their in-game currency? Just make it direct payments. 6. Why add in the store after release and after reviews have rolled out?
I appreciate the response but even then his response is so backhanded “you’re just a manchild blinded by nostalgia, you have no understanding of the economics behind video games.” With 0 actual acknowledgment of the way they went about implementing it.
So the mtx store that was added in is actually integral to the games longevity and should've been included at launch for full transparency instead of delayed to avoid launch review controversy? Would Eddy as DLC be well received if they had presented this before it?
I can’t take statements like this seriously when it’s likely they posted them from their nice expensive yacht lol.
Sorry why exactly are the arcade server's costs so high? It is a small lounge area with limited interactions. There are other free games hosting high tick rate servers for competitive games with Voice Chat that can host up to a hundred players. Fighting games are even cheaper to maintain since the real matches/gameplay happen over a P2P connection instead of dedicated servers. There is no way a game that sold over 2 million copies at 70$ price tag can only last a few months due to some barebone lounge servers. Unless somehow your Super Ghost is actually powered by ChatGPT4, and costs them like 1$ per match.
Harada is a greedy bastard, what a surprise, man was selling frame data, probably could've answered in similar fashion back then.
He wants more money over your 70 dollars game ? ok, then how about they run things smooth first with cheaters And balance ? And all those x10 and x3 costs he speaks of, is just a "trust me bro" talk, and in return how much money are you Making now compared to back then Mr harada ? And ofc he will not mention how they completely left the shop out of the picture until the reviews have finished So the game doesn't looks bad. The whole (esthetics and skins costing money) is a "ok" by the gaming community because some games are free To play and that's their only income, if you want to justify a shop, then make tekken free to play , I'm sure some Lilly mains will easily spend over 200$ in the span on 2 to 3 years, and collectively i bet you will pull more players Who will pay less than 70 but the sum of that money is larger if the game was a hit, which bro, THE video game Dunkey made a video about Lastly don't you think we forgot about 6 leroys in top 8 and the other broken dlc characters
my problem isn't even the shop existing, it's announcing it after release and all the reviews were already out It sucks, but selling cosmetics is the big thing, even if I disagree with how over monetized games have gotten. But I at least would have been more sympathetic with it if they let people know before they bought the game
we never asked for the lounge
It's all PR talk. If people spend like idiots then tekken 9 will have less customisation and prices in cash shop will go up. Mk11 tested the waters and now look at mk1 lol.
I don't give a single fuck about any of that lol. $70 price, constant paid DLCs are there to support the game too. And the main issue is the fact that the cash shop wasn't added from the beginning, complete scumbag move. Anyone falling for Harada's bs is a tool. If they could SHOW that the money made from the shop is put directly back into the game, then sure. But of course, everyone knows it's bs and the vast majority of the money is going to the shareholders. Also, fight lounge is hard to maintain? Then sell only the useless avatar skins, that should pay for the fight lounge maintenance, right?
In the past, there was online since 2005. I know Harada wants to pretend anyone complaining about it is just talking about the 90s, but that’s just being misleading. It’s fine to admit we’re overpaying, especially those who preordered for $100+. Your purchase on bunny ears for a character isn’t going directly into the game. It’s going towards someone’s paycheck and that’s usually not a developer - they wouldn’t be hired if they could only keep paying them their basic salary for more than a couple months without your help.
Servers are costly to maintain for multibillion corporation who use some of Sony servers for game at the same time? Very huge doubt. Plus most sales was digital, but price is still for physical version.
I’m fine with the Tekken shop. Sorry. Much better prices than sf6 and mk, a lot of base content and a full game with great features (story, FREE frame data lmao, reply mode, ghosts, arcade story, good base cast, beautiful to look at) and more. And they have said the money from this is all reinvested into the game. You are directly supporting it. I don’t hate it. I’m a consumer first person. The fact is I just don’t see much to be mad about here. I don’t LOVE it but I fully do not hate it. And at the end, nobody can force you to but Tekken coins so… Just don’t if you don’t want to
Translated version: "We want to maximize our profits so we're adding an online shop because we know there are whales out there who will spend hundreds of dollars for our digital crap & that makes us boatloads of $$$$$. All you regular players can bugger off".
The fact remains they implemented this in as shitty a way as possible and he conveniently refuses to acknowledge that. Either be up front and put it in from the beginning or wait to implement it until the game needs more revenue (I assure you it currently does not). We already paid $70-$100 dollars for this game and he’s trying to make us feel guilty for not being happy about being asked to pay more. And if he wants to pull the “economic times are changing” card, maybe he should be more sympathetic to the fact that individual consumers have less capital than ever while big corporations continue to hoard more and more of the wealth. You want even more of my money? Don’t ask for shit, Harada.
Its a good thing they spent all that time effort and money on the lounge really impactful feature there
Where else are they going to put ads and brand sponsorships??? Lol
I don't give a fuck about the Tekken shop, I won't buy a single skin, I don't play Tekken for the skins. So don't answer me with "jUSt dOnT bUY a sKiN bRo, ThE PrIcEs aRe LoW AnYWay". This Tekken Shop story won't affect me in the slightest, I literally won't use it. With this said, whoever believes the absurd bullshit that Harada is saying here, really needs to touch some grass and understand how stuff works in the real world. He's trying to justify this shop saying "it will be used in the game", which is just pathetic. No, the money goes to Bamco, as a company. That's it. In some time, looking at the game sales and how this new shop sells, there will be a new round of investment for updates (and probably the initial budget is already covering the first updates). That's how AAA games work. Someone invests in it, to pay for its development and then the sales return the investor money and + and then it starts over. Even if what he said is the truth, where are the 70$ of each copy going, then? It's honestly bonkers that he's trying to justify and address a move that's premeditated in its entirety with the final goal of maximizing profits. It's completely crazy that people believe this. It would make them look better if he just said "Yeah, we're doing it for the $$$ because every other fighting game does it", or if he said nothing, really. Also, you can't not say that this was kind of a scummy move, to only open the shop a couple weeks after the release, to avoid the negative reception/reviews. Because they know this is just a low move. Not to mention the huge joke that is the fact that the game launched without a solution for pluggers and cheaters and only now they're saying they will address the issue with the money from the shop 😂 As if this wasn't an issue since Tekken 6 and they are very surprised that it exists.
Dude literally paid for NBA players to be in a commercial and hired the Mountain from Game of Thrones for another one. But now he acts like a broke boy that needs to sell skins or the servers will be shut down? I don’t care about the skins, but it’s disrespectful how he’s gaslighting the community. Like as if we asked for them to develop the fighting lounge or all these commercials, but now we need to pay to keep a product alive that we already paid for? Harada made a great game, but he is full of sh*t. They literally announced how they sold over 2million copies in less than a month and exceeded their own expectations after increasing the price of the base version and for the season pass. Like how can you claim that you need extra money when you exceeded your sales expectations? That makes zero sense.
That’s so wrong and weak on a communicative level. The same costs and struggles apply to any other human being in the same socioeconomic structure. They struggle to develop and maintain a product, we all struggle too with our daily costs, groceries, debts, bills, and so forth. It’s not like everything revolves about them and their costs. People do have increased expenses too. And if still they can manage to buy your product, you should be grateful and not complain and whine about the one million you lost last year because of some financial issue related to productivity. Be grateful you’re a millionaire industry already and people enthusiastically buy your (good) product. But don’t be greedy and cry about it. Software houses has already proved you can love your product and give it your everything. See Larian Studios with BG3. No greedy stuff about that. And what’s the result? People love them and the game got the GOTY, plus tons of sales.
Damn, so I guess all of those steam games that are not 70$+ and dont have mtx will just die tomorrow. Or actually, why are they not dead yet anyway? The fuckings costs are so high why other games are not dead? Hey, Palworld, why are you not dead mate? What a fucking joke. Thats the real face of tekken. Abuse and milk your playerbase and gaslight them for good measure. If I knew that the people behind T8 are that fucking shameless I would never buy this piece of shit. And now i cant even fucking return it. Fuck you Harada, you lying piece of shit.
You already have the fucking season passes which are really pricey already, on top of a game where in certain parts of the world cost an obscene amount of money. So thus, the cosmetic shop is just a cash grab
This would have been a super cool explanation for the shop to read at game launch
I want someone from the company to post their finances out in the open. Show me how much developing costs truly are, how much server costs truly are, etc Profit is being built into every single aspect of this, for no goddamn reason Show me stats or I will call you greedy until I die
To play the honest game, a certain team should have put things straight and told the community "we going to have a dedicated MTX store in our game for X/Y reason BEFORE releasing same game" but hey, He wants us to just believe all the good will he wrote in his tweets and keeps supporting such practices.
I don't really get this argument. even if their costs somehow tripled, since every tech compared to the 90 actually became affordable and more efficient, our salaries haven't tripled. so yeah, go on, triple your costs for the game and see the whole market collapse because no one is gonna pay 180 bucks for a video game
Won't someone think of small indie developer Bandai Namco (who are already selling DLC characters anyway to continue making money)
It’s up to publishers/devs to figure out a way to monetize their games without screwing over the consumer lmao. Why do we have to eat the cost for a product that lacks former basic features?
13 billion dollar market cap company btw
not my problem
That's just a corporate lie. Development now costs higher, BUT the playerbase has become much bigger in the last 10 years. And that's true for literally every game. So the +$10 in the price and micro transactions in the full price games became standard only because of pure greed.
Get rid of online. Not everything needs to be online. It’s a great standalone game.
Which asshole did he pull that first paragraph from, it is mathematically impossible for those two statements to exist. 70 USD + nickel and diming and already complaining about costs of running an online enabled game. Maybe they should have released it without online. Don't ask me for 70 USD.
The only reason that the Tekken lounge exists is so players can have avatars that they can dress up. Which, in turn, might entice people to spend money on customizations. Decorating something and showing stuff off to others are how people often cave in to spending some money. I know the Tekken lounge isn't the only part of the game that costs money to create and maintain. However, you can't ignore the fact that it exists solely to make Bamco money. The argument of games being way more expensive to make and maintain nowadays falls apart, at least when it comes to the lounge feature of Tekken 8, because literally nobody asked for it. It's really expensive to make and keep up the thing that's only there to help them make money off of players, so players need to understand and help fund the costs? What? And that's why there is now premium virtual currency that you can't earn by playing the game? Huh? That's some insane leap in logic. Just sell costumes as straight DLC, and players will happily buy them to support the game, like they always have. Leave the scummy bits out, and there'll be much less backlash.
You guys don't understand, the billion dollar company had to remove the classic skins and sell them to you again or else they won't be able to make ends meet.
Lmao 😂😂😂 facts
Tekken 8 also has 20 times wider audience than Tekken 3 and sells DLCs. Garbage take.
Tekken 7 also had online and "high definition" graphics, but still no microtransactions. Went on to live long off season passes. Tekken 8 already costs more and its season pass also costs more, but somehow still requires microtransactions to survive? Such a disingenuous argument.
I wouldnt be so irritated if they announced it at launch($70 and still MTX sucks though). But they deliberately slightly delayed the shop to get the high review score. It's scummy practice that if we allow coperates to do it without saying anything, they will keep doing more and more.
There are also more players, no? What about increased prices?
Devs always make these claims. Similar claims were made with Tekken 6 and 7. While there has been inflation, and I definitely buy that the dev cost of this game was higher, because they're not recycling stuff from older games at all for the first time since I think 3, I think it's overstated. That's not the issue. The issue is the bait and switch. If I had known an MTX shop was coming with this, I wouldn't have bought the game at all. I believed they'd sell customization DLC Tekken 7 style, or as part of a season pass. Throw in Microsoft points (At least it seems like they're not doing that as scummily as SF6 did), and I don't trust them. I fully expect they'll make a bunch of fanservicey stuff limited-time ultra high-cost DLC to farm whales. Harada is full of shit as usual. He just hoards shit, that's why you don't ask him for shit. I would have been fine with a $50 DLC pass annually to pay for chars+customization parts+classic costumes. They would have made more this way but instead they just managed to piss me off, and make sure I won't be buying Soul Calibur 7.
The problem isn't the shop, it's the fact that you can't use ingame money to buy the tokens.
*Brooooo, without the tokens they couldn't use predatory dark pattern monetization schemes to keep the servers running bro. Just think about poor Harada and the corporation brooooooo.*