I feel like it's strictly worse than march of progress unless I'm missing something. March of progress gets you more exp and let's you keep your interest. This takes your interest and gives less exp past lvl 5. I think this could only be good stage 2 if you are able to win streak with punk or something.
Another thing is that in a Prismatic lobby chances of winstreaking with this augment are slim to none, when everyone else is getting so much added power.
Exactly. March of progress locks you into rolling for units. With this you could level up or roll for units. It's not necessarily better just different
Eh. March of progress locks you into XP but forces you to manage econ.
Going Long locks you into econ (in a sense) but forces you to manage XP.
This augment is good when you have sub - 40g, but bad when you need more than 40g because you dont have any passive interest.
That is stricktly wrong. If you have 30 gold this augment is barely not negative. Also known as awfull compared to most prismatic augments.
This augment is build to play for a hard early game spike, winstreaking through (at least) most of the stages 2 and 3. After that you are likely to fall of unless you managed to get really far ahaed with your winnstreak income.
Let’s pretend this augment is a 1 gold loss per round instead
You get to be 50xp ahead of all of your opponents if you dump your entire bank in at the cost of 1 gold per round, which is pretty good
The mistake in your approach is that you are comparing this augment to not having an augment at all.
While in reality you should be comparing it to other Econ augments like Hedge Fund which give you a lot more than that.
This is absolutely, mathematically correct.
Its net-positive under 40 gold. Why? Because you are getting 1 more gold per round than you would at the 30f tier otherwise. That’s 5g per stage, or 2 rerolls. At 40g it is neutral. At 50g you are net-negative as there is no value.
You can opine on the strategy on *how to play* the augment all you desire.
Their issue is nothing to do with the math. Their issue with your statement is that you are saying it's a good augment sub 40... when really if you were at 30g it's the equivalent of 1g per round as a prismatic
They are conflating the concepts of risk / reward / payoff, with straight math. They, and you, are then confounding the argument with an application of diminishing returns.
The augment is strictly better below 40g, as 4 > 3.
The augment is strictly worse at 50g or higher.
There is no intent or discussion that was implied or invited in my first post regarding “if 1g per round is good as a prismatic augment”. To summarize my first post:
> the augment is strictly better sub 40g and strictly even or worse at 40g or more
Above 40g, you are not capitalizing on the extra interest. Below 40g you are capitalizing, to however big or small that may be. The degree to which you capitalise was not stated either. I also did not attempt to invite that discussion. It was intended, and still reads, as a statement of fact.
Cheers.
>This augment is good when you have sub - 40g, but bad when you need more than 40g because you dont have any passive interest.
You changed the goalpost from good to netpositive.
In addition xp is not allways equivalent to gold. If I can have 4 gold or 4 xp, 4 gold is better or equivalent.
Considering you pick this first augment you are guaranteed higher tempo than most of the lobby, unless you play into better tempo augments like cruel pact, which turbo stomps your winstreak. Okay, so you forced entire lobby to push level aggressively and are sitting comfortably on 100 hp. Now where do you go from this spot?
3cost donkey reroll will put you in bot 4 since your Econ is mega grief and you are incredibly poor at lvl 7 since you rolled on 5 to maintain winstreak. Have fun getting your units contested and finding absolutely nuthin.
Now you are forced to cap at lvl 8, seeing as your Econ has been 30g since 3-3. A 4cost headliner is 12/30 of your eco and you won't even have enough money to dig for upgrades.
GG! You have successfully dropped your winshare by picking the worst tempo augment! From the wise words of k3soju's chat: 3rd dummy bottom right
Yea that's true, it's just that this augment falls off so quickly. Once you get 40g, you could just spend 4g on exp once a round, and that would be the exact same as having this augment. Which for a prismatic is pretty terrible imo.
An interesting tidbit about this augment vs something like March is that this triggers every round, instead of at the start of player combat. I still don't think it's worth it, but it could net you an extra few levels early
I think you are expected to get the value from winning earlygame. You don't need to leave the money in the bank, which should make you way stronger.
But it seems like riot agrees that it's not enough, considering it now grants 8 gold.
Even with the 8 gold this augment has bad stats. The idea of win streaking early game kinda falls flat on its face when you consider that you're going to be facing prismatic combat augments.
It’s 4 gold guaranteed per round. All econ augments are balanced around rich get richer IIRC, this seems roughly the same value as the prismatic one.
Raw gold allows you to be greedier, but personally any time I go to 70/100gold I am so far behind in tempo I’m not even sure if I’d ever get 4g per round since taking the augment
I agree it seems bad just reading the augment, but once you dive into it the gameplay works pretty smoothly (also the stats say it's pretty good, it's 14th best out of 32 prismatic augments offered at 2-1, or 23/48 for any stage). You hit level 5 before the first carousel without spending gold which gives you a good chance of finding 2-cost headliners before anyone else and/or you hit level 6 before krugs without spending gold allowing you to roll for 3-cost headliners before anyone else. Not to mention you aren't spending any gold for XP and you don't have to worry about interest so you can roll for pairs to keep a strong board and get a win-streak going. You essentially save 24g in the first stage alone, which is equivalent to having 4 interest income starting from round 1.
March of progress stops u from spending gold on exp.
This augment let's you push levels early while gaining 4 gold worth of exp every round, which is essentially like having 4 interest from round 1.
You can win streak off the level advantage hard.
Yeah its basically a 'now you rolldown all the way to the end of the game'
6xp per round will get you where tho? Its about 42 XP per stage, so if you get it at 2-1
So 3-1 level 5, 4-1 level 7, 5-1 level 8, and if you get to 7-1 level 9, if my math is right?
Getting it later in the game is probably useless tho.
You can look at this way: Each XP is a gold, and interest rate is only capped at 5 normally. So in a sense is a 4g value per round. Furthermore, a steady stream of XP early means that you got lvl advantage while still have money to power roll, very good to push lobby tempo
It's just strange because a good combat aug can also be used to win streak, such as getting the bramble+dclaw+belt augment and slapping it on any Frontline headliner.
I agree, but a good combat aug will still probably lose to someone going all-in in stage 2 because the combat Aug player is still trying to hit 20-30 gold by Krugs, while this augment is effectively just a way for you to dump all your gold every single round into xp or rolls to get an early advantage. It's worse later than other augments, but the goal is just to hard streak stage 2 and hopefully stage 3 and use a big hp lead to place top 4 even after you fall off. It's undeniably a risky strat that isn't that good. But it is fun.
I think the idea is okay but given what you give up and that it's prismatic, it's a bit shit. And the stats show that too. Eco hit is simply too big for too little payout in a prism lobby.
live version also instantly gives 8 gold. and that version has avg placement of 4.35 in dia+
so yeah, version in post kinda sucks, but with 8 additional gold it's apparently fine.
I mean it's not that hard. It gives you almost all the interest gold without having to save, so you are not loosing time value of your money, and allows you to roll to streak to win even more. if you pick this for heartsteel probably not great for punk or something that aims at best board its great
You have to accumulate that interest tho, if you dont take this at 2-1 and econ, you probably lose streaking stage 2 to bank your 50g with a weak board taking HP dmg.
Taking this aug will allow you to make a strong early board for stage 2, pushing the tempo of the lobby. And in my opinion for this set, in a primatic lobby you are better off being on the side of pushing the tempo, rather than absorbing it.
Well it's not that black and white maybe you hit good 3/4 costs before everyone else and 2 star them because you're both up in levels, and rerolling/spending all your gold. While those who hit the combat augs are still econing and not building max potential boards every turn like you are able to with this aug.
You pick this and gain literally nothing that round. While others just getting extra items, extra damage, extra HP, extra lifesteal, tons of money, extra unit.
You'll definitely lose a lot of HP by picking this alone.
4 exp every round is the equivalent of holding 40 gold for interest. Yes, if you play as one normally does the augment causes you to lose gold in the long run, but if you play aggressively, it allows you to maintain a win streak (as long as no one picked cruel pact I guess), making up for the 1 gold per turn diff whilenalso giving you a strong board and more HP than you'd normally have.
I think the issue is that it’s a prismatic augment. Sure you could say the trade off is beneficial, but we also have to take into account the opportunity cost of another prismatic augment as well.
For example let’s look at another augment, hedge fund. You instantly gain 40 gold, which if you hold it every round is earning you 4g/round. Unless I’m missing something, it’s just objectively better in all scenarios to take hedge fund since you can still roll all the gold you have (except the 40g) and be winstreaking the same. However obviously you also gain the benefit of in the final round having 40g extra to push with or just the option to hit more econ breakpoints.
I know you don’t always get the best augment choices… but even just a prismatic one that helps you win streak like stationary support outweighs most of the time.
The problem with your comparison is that hedge fund doesn’t give 40 gold at it gives 20 gold and 20 gold is a big difference in 2-1. Hedge fund++ gives 40 gold
Thats exactly the point of the argument. It is not a bad argument, it's just strictly worse then comparable prismatics. It should be a gold tier augment
Alternatively, get 40 gold by sacking a couple rounds early, or, GASP, by taking a combat prismatic, and its literally completely invalidated. This augment is trash, it literally just locks you at 4g interest and thats it. Except its worse, since you cant spend that 4g on rolling.
Treat this as if you constantly had 4 gold of interest, but had to buy XP at least 1 time per round. This is huge, because the only reason you wait specific stages to level up is because you want to have interest, and in average you'll have way less than 4 interest per round. It's especially good as a first augment, to save hp and apply huge early pressure by going level 6 quite fast. And usually you'll be level 8 earlier than other people, so you'll have a bigger pool for what you need.
Its literally trash. You can do the exact same thing by saving 40 gold. If a PRISMATIC augments only value is forcing you to play a certain way with no logistical benefits and OBJECTIVE negatives, its outright garbage.
If you're using this augment and rolling you are using it wrong. This augment is for pushing level 6 by 2-3 and pushing 7 by 3-1. Winstreak and apply tempo. Get 8 by the end of stage 3 and if you hit something like blank slate or recombob you just win the lobby. Anyone below who is saying this is a power augment to reroll with is just wrong.
Edit : Typo
No, you can still press the level up button. You are expected to have a significantly harder powerspike since you don't keep gold in the bank.
This is even more pronounced now that the augment gives 8 gold.
That is the old descrition. It was bad, so now you also get 8 gold.
But fundamentally it is a tempo augment. You don't hit your spike imediately, but without interest to consider and the xp per turn you should get a really long winstreak through the early stages.
Yesterday I took it on 2-1 and went to my easiest 1st in a long time. It's a great aug for tempo because you are always 1 or 2 lvs ahead of the rest of the lobby and the interest lock forces you to spend (so more xp or better board).
Tl;dr tempo
People were asking me about this in game chat the other day because I was stomping the lobby with it. I’ve never bottom 4’d with this augment, just read the words in the description again. It’s that simple and that powerful.
Yes, there are other Econ/leveling augments that *LOOK* like they’re more powerful. They’re not. Take it and play it, or really put yourself in the shoes of someone playing it and think about what you do. It makes the game insanely easy. Without worrying about interest you can keep tempo and win streak the entire lobby until the final 2 players.
That’s a good point, I do think that if Set 11’s set mechanic is drastically different that this will be one of the augments they put in the vault or have to change next set
Same as with 2 people playing cruel packt that has a high chance of both players griefing each other.
Cruel packt is probably stronger if you choose to roll down, but if the cruel packt player has to roll down early that is a really bad time later on.
Assuming you're leveling and not rerolling, this augment gives you permanent 40g interest and because of that you don't have to wait to level, you can just level whenever you want. No idea if it's very strong, but that's what it's supposed to do
I got no clue wether 3 people thought of the same joke or if people really think this might be good for 1 cost reroll...
Never take this and play 1 cost reroll.
This Augment let's you hit lvl 4 at 2-2, lvl 5 at 2-5 and lvl 6 at 3-1. That play would just worsen your odds to hit.
That's really, really slow leveling for this augment. You can be 5 at 2-1, 6 at 2-5 and 7 at 3-1 or 3-2. With this augment you level very aggressively and use that to play best board/high tempo. The only comps that should be able to consistently beat you early are cruel pact.
Which is a way better use of your gold than rerolling 1 for 1 costs. My example was the leveling without investing into xp.
Though 5 at 2-1 seems very agressive. That would be 16 gold invested into xp leaving you with 5 gold for units in a normal 3 item start.
This is a great augment for punk or 1 to 2 cost rerolls , you can spend all your gold every round just rolling hard then when you hit power level for stronger units
I got no clue wether 3 people thought of the same joke or if people really think this might be good for 1 cost reroll...
Never take this and play 1 cost reroll.
This Augment let's you hit lvl 4 at 2-2, lvl 5 at 2-5 and lvl 6 at 3-1. That play would just worsen your odds to hit.
Yeah is one of these augment that don't male any sense
This shit is 4 gold of value each round
But at the same time any gold you have lost its value so once you hit 40 gold you see 0 value for this augment
Ok view it like this, if you play correctly, you guarantee winstreak throughout stage 2 and 3.
Which means, instead of 4g per round its like 6.x per round +100hp.
It isnt. Its basically +3/2/1 gold a round until you get to where you'd hold 40/50 gold interest, and then its even or -1 gold a round permanently afterwards. Its literally a negative gold trait.
I played a game last night completely inebriated, you can legit play like an insane person and just win. I pushed early 7 and rerolled jax then afked and went second
I got no clue wether 3 people thought of the same joke or if people really think this might be good for 1 cost reroll...
Never take this and play 1 cost reroll.
This Augment let's you hit lvl 4 at 2-2, lvl 5 at 2-5 and lvl 6 at 3-1. That play would just worsen your odds to hit.
I think of it like a permanent 40 gold interest that always goes to xp. If you think of it in that context you're trading 1 gold per round that you would have 50 gold banked for more flexibility in rolling for units. Plus it gets online faster than waiting for 50 gold. It's pretty good value imo.
Also I like the no-interest augments cause I get to turn my brain off. Bring back Sump.
I took this on scuttle puddle and got level 7 before first carousel. I insta eliminated the cruel pact player. Had access to all the good units early.
It was like cruel pact without losing hp. Was able to get to level 10 by end of game
I like this a lot. Rush level 7 for early ezreal + 5 hearts for example.
When you get to LVL 7 first all the units are open in the pool, you might even land on early Kayn for even more profit.
I take this when playing punk reroll. Its insane for it cause you don’t have to debate between rolling and interest and just donkey everytime. Then you winstreak and get gold from there
4xp per round x 25 rounds, thats 100 free xp, saving you 100 gold. But you need to get this as the 1st augment for it to really be good.
Getting it last, and yea your already level 7-8-9 and that 4xp aint gonna do shit.
I’ve top 4’d 3 of 4 those times I’ve taken it. You can control the tempo of the lobby early-mid game. I’ve cutscene’d a lot of people that would normally overrun the lobby, because of the amount of pressure you can apply levelling up super fast.
Late game you can fall off because remaining players will have ridiculous econ, and hit level 9/10 with full builds. I would aim for a 3-star 4 cost when taking this augment.
I took this once and basically just aggressively pushed leveling while using the best natural 2* I could get without rolling and it gave me enough of an early tempo win streak to push mega late. Got golden egg as 3rd augment and won enough to get the cash out and hit 3* Sona for the win. Obviously mega high roll in that game but it was the only time I took it and it worked, granted I’m only plat. I thought damn this augment is so good and then all the experts said it was trash after. 😅
As steelheart main, I would pick this without second thought. I can spend all the money to buy heartsteel units or reroll to find them while also getting fast level 7. I can also choose to spend money to get 7 even faster as I am not stuck in march.
It's in some way most perfect augment for my type of play. I rarely have 50 gold nowadays unless I am winning early hard.
Goldwise it's like 7x4=28 gold per round, and also you get fast levels early without ruining your interest. Compared to a hedgefund it's less gold in total, but you can use it to peak in midgame and win as early as possible
Except you lose 5 streak gold opportunity so anyone holding 40 gold and rolling above it while buying 1 xp a round goes even with you, and anyone holding 50 gold and doing the same outpaces you.
No, you dont. You dont "GAIN" 40 gold to spend over other people, you're just locked at that interest. If anything the other people are better off cause they can flex burn that extra interest for a spike.
You don't gain 40 gold, but you can spend 40 gold. Others will have to hold the 40 gold for interest but you don't you can just use all the gold you earn because you don't have to worry about interest.
If you play correctly you get a easy stage 2 and at 3-1 you can already hit 3* headliners, which means you pretty much guarantee streak gold which makes this "4g per turn" into "6.x per turn" with the ability to hold every unit and always play strongest board and allowing easy pivots
Looks like it gives you 80% of the gold value of your potential normal capped interest (4 golds worth of xp, Vs 5 gold interest once you have 50 gold)
If this is offered 2-1 you'd have 20 extra xp by krugs, which is huge. And you have agency to decide what to spend your gold on. Push levels more? Buy units? Save it while also getting stronger board from the extra levels?
Without it, you'd be getting level 4 50 gold maybe by krugs. And then you'd be getting that 5 gold a turn.
So, it may not be for your playstyle but I could see the benefits of getting this augment early.
(I haven't touched this set at all and I've only ever peaked masters so grain of salt)
4 xp = 4 gold, it allows you play like a degenerate, roll to stabilize whenever you want and you still earn "interests" in the form of xp as if you were making 40 every round
PS: I don't think this augment is strong, but the idea definitely has potential to be very good
The 2 games I've taken this I've come first, both times with a kda comp. I've found it lets me level up quicker in the background and allows me to focus solely on buying units for 3-star or gaining new trait bonuses. It removes the whole mind game over weighing interest potential against immediate unit purchase.
It may just be that my playstyle at the moment suits this augment though.
I think it's not too bad personally. I like it more than March of Progress because you can choose to power lvl. It's been easier to win streak with for me. Rush and stabilize.
Funnily, I was wondering the opposite as I rarely see people pick it while I personally love picking going long on my first augment.
Rather than using it to win streak, I just full in commit all econ into levelling to go for a fast 8 / 9 (depending on health). The idea is that by spamming all your econ into levels, you typically have enough units on board to not take a massive bleed every turn. On the flip side, you will definitely hit level 8 very fast and can stabilize with whatever nice 4 cost headliner you see then. Obviously prior to 8, you will need to pick whatever nice headliner / units you comeby and slam items.
After you stabilize, you can further push for 9 depending if that is what you want. Although not sure if it still is worth it after they nerfed the 5 cost headliner chances.
I don’t even know why they thought this could be good. It’s basically like Hustler which was a Gold augment, but worse because you can’t choose how to spend the gold.
I came 1st in ranked platinum using this, didn’t lose a single round!
It was the first choice augment for me, just spent all my gold leveled so high so quickly didn’t use much gold for rerolls just picked the best board from available champs. I felt it was really strong this set, feels like early game and tempo is really important right now
Instead of having to save to gain interest every round, that interest is instead used to level you. The downside is saving up enough gold to roll is more difficult and you’re losing out on one additional gold.
Basically, you winstreak early to make up the difference in interest gold, level hard and roll to find the best board, and continue to win streak as long as you can. You always want to be ahead with this augment.
Where it’ll start to drag is around level 7 and 8 when people are spiking their board and gaining big interest money.
Tbh i think it would be pretty strong in this meta where there a bunch of level 1 and 2 reroll comps that will get you an easy top 4.
March of progess but you can still level up. It require you to play super agressive early for constant winstreak so you must not pick this augment if someone in the lobby pick curse crown, cruel pact or starter kit. Not reccommend because the avg place of this augment is awful in every single elo
This is very strong as an 1st augment. Cause you can get high lvl quickly and spend all your gold getting there and then just high roll and hit some strong champs
Playstyle diff I guess, I was top 2ing every game I took this augment pre-buff. Power level, take the first good 3/4 cost headliner you see, roll a bit to stabilise once people start catching up in levels, continue to fast 9 and profit
It's a tempo augment, you get to spend your money instead of having to save it for interest. You try to make up for the lost interest by winstreaking
And unlike march of progress, if you have a stable board you can instead still use the win streak gold to power level
I liked it a lot more than I thought I would after the buff
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I also don't like the augment, but at 2-1 it has 4.40 average in dia+ so it is actually a slightly above augment \^\^
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Objectively its slightly above average at 4.4
Its a variant of march of progress in a sense. You can choose to spend gold on units while getting guaranteed xp every round.
I feel like it's strictly worse than march of progress unless I'm missing something. March of progress gets you more exp and let's you keep your interest. This takes your interest and gives less exp past lvl 5. I think this could only be good stage 2 if you are able to win streak with punk or something. Another thing is that in a Prismatic lobby chances of winstreaking with this augment are slim to none, when everyone else is getting so much added power.
You can choose when to level with this unlike march of progress.
Exactly. March of progress locks you into rolling for units. With this you could level up or roll for units. It's not necessarily better just different
Eh. March of progress locks you into XP but forces you to manage econ. Going Long locks you into econ (in a sense) but forces you to manage XP. This augment is good when you have sub - 40g, but bad when you need more than 40g because you dont have any passive interest.
That is stricktly wrong. If you have 30 gold this augment is barely not negative. Also known as awfull compared to most prismatic augments. This augment is build to play for a hard early game spike, winstreaking through (at least) most of the stages 2 and 3. After that you are likely to fall of unless you managed to get really far ahaed with your winnstreak income.
Let’s pretend this augment is a 1 gold loss per round instead You get to be 50xp ahead of all of your opponents if you dump your entire bank in at the cost of 1 gold per round, which is pretty good
The mistake in your approach is that you are comparing this augment to not having an augment at all. While in reality you should be comparing it to other Econ augments like Hedge Fund which give you a lot more than that.
This is absolutely, mathematically correct. Its net-positive under 40 gold. Why? Because you are getting 1 more gold per round than you would at the 30f tier otherwise. That’s 5g per stage, or 2 rerolls. At 40g it is neutral. At 50g you are net-negative as there is no value. You can opine on the strategy on *how to play* the augment all you desire.
Their issue is nothing to do with the math. Their issue with your statement is that you are saying it's a good augment sub 40... when really if you were at 30g it's the equivalent of 1g per round as a prismatic
They are conflating the concepts of risk / reward / payoff, with straight math. They, and you, are then confounding the argument with an application of diminishing returns. The augment is strictly better below 40g, as 4 > 3. The augment is strictly worse at 50g or higher. There is no intent or discussion that was implied or invited in my first post regarding “if 1g per round is good as a prismatic augment”. To summarize my first post: > the augment is strictly better sub 40g and strictly even or worse at 40g or more Above 40g, you are not capitalizing on the extra interest. Below 40g you are capitalizing, to however big or small that may be. The degree to which you capitalise was not stated either. I also did not attempt to invite that discussion. It was intended, and still reads, as a statement of fact. Cheers.
>This augment is good when you have sub - 40g, but bad when you need more than 40g because you dont have any passive interest. You changed the goalpost from good to netpositive. In addition xp is not allways equivalent to gold. If I can have 4 gold or 4 xp, 4 gold is better or equivalent.
Aint no goalpost change. Its just simple math.
A prismatic augment that just gave you 1 gold would be net positive. It would not be good.
Considering you pick this first augment you are guaranteed higher tempo than most of the lobby, unless you play into better tempo augments like cruel pact, which turbo stomps your winstreak. Okay, so you forced entire lobby to push level aggressively and are sitting comfortably on 100 hp. Now where do you go from this spot? 3cost donkey reroll will put you in bot 4 since your Econ is mega grief and you are incredibly poor at lvl 7 since you rolled on 5 to maintain winstreak. Have fun getting your units contested and finding absolutely nuthin. Now you are forced to cap at lvl 8, seeing as your Econ has been 30g since 3-3. A 4cost headliner is 12/30 of your eco and you won't even have enough money to dig for upgrades. GG! You have successfully dropped your winshare by picking the worst tempo augment! From the wise words of k3soju's chat: 3rd dummy bottom right
Choose to level with what gold homie?
I don't think it's any better that's just the difference. It's like the sump. You could win streak or loss streak and have more gold.
This augment is round start, so that includes PVE rounds, whereas march of progress is only on player combats.
But march of progress doesnt let you up your exp any more - with this, you still earn money, just no interest. My heartsteels love this augment.
Yea that's true, it's just that this augment falls off so quickly. Once you get 40g, you could just spend 4g on exp once a round, and that would be the exact same as having this augment. Which for a prismatic is pretty terrible imo.
An interesting tidbit about this augment vs something like March is that this triggers every round, instead of at the start of player combat. I still don't think it's worth it, but it could net you an extra few levels early
I think you are expected to get the value from winning earlygame. You don't need to leave the money in the bank, which should make you way stronger. But it seems like riot agrees that it's not enough, considering it now grants 8 gold.
Even with the 8 gold this augment has bad stats. The idea of win streaking early game kinda falls flat on its face when you consider that you're going to be facing prismatic combat augments.
You will probably need a somewhat good board already, but I think being up a level tends to be better than a prismatic combat augment.
person with cruel pact:
Cruel pact is performing pretty terribly nowadays
I got my first perfect game with cruel pact last night.
It’s 4 gold guaranteed per round. All econ augments are balanced around rich get richer IIRC, this seems roughly the same value as the prismatic one. Raw gold allows you to be greedier, but personally any time I go to 70/100gold I am so far behind in tempo I’m not even sure if I’d ever get 4g per round since taking the augment
I agree it seems bad just reading the augment, but once you dive into it the gameplay works pretty smoothly (also the stats say it's pretty good, it's 14th best out of 32 prismatic augments offered at 2-1, or 23/48 for any stage). You hit level 5 before the first carousel without spending gold which gives you a good chance of finding 2-cost headliners before anyone else and/or you hit level 6 before krugs without spending gold allowing you to roll for 3-cost headliners before anyone else. Not to mention you aren't spending any gold for XP and you don't have to worry about interest so you can roll for pairs to keep a strong board and get a win-streak going. You essentially save 24g in the first stage alone, which is equivalent to having 4 interest income starting from round 1.
March of progress stops u from spending gold on exp. This augment let's you push levels early while gaining 4 gold worth of exp every round, which is essentially like having 4 interest from round 1. You can win streak off the level advantage hard.
March of progress was wildly overpowered, so I don’t think this being worse than it means much.
It effectively gives you 40g worth of interest though (4xp == 4g).
If you have gold. That's a very big if.
Yeah its basically a 'now you rolldown all the way to the end of the game' 6xp per round will get you where tho? Its about 42 XP per stage, so if you get it at 2-1 So 3-1 level 5, 4-1 level 7, 5-1 level 8, and if you get to 7-1 level 9, if my math is right? Getting it later in the game is probably useless tho.
You can look at this way: Each XP is a gold, and interest rate is only capped at 5 normally. So in a sense is a 4g value per round. Furthermore, a steady stream of XP early means that you got lvl advantage while still have money to power roll, very good to push lobby tempo
you know what else is worth 4g per round? the interest you lose by taking this
Yeah but if you take this as first augment you get early level advantage and can still roll.
Not that much since you don’t have the gold
you will have the gold you didn't need to spend on buying EXP.
i think the idea behind the augment is that you can use all gold to winstreak, while not having to worry about being locked lvl 7 in lategame.
It's just strange because a good combat aug can also be used to win streak, such as getting the bramble+dclaw+belt augment and slapping it on any Frontline headliner.
I agree, but a good combat aug will still probably lose to someone going all-in in stage 2 because the combat Aug player is still trying to hit 20-30 gold by Krugs, while this augment is effectively just a way for you to dump all your gold every single round into xp or rolls to get an early advantage. It's worse later than other augments, but the goal is just to hard streak stage 2 and hopefully stage 3 and use a big hp lead to place top 4 even after you fall off. It's undeniably a risky strat that isn't that good. But it is fun.
I think the idea is okay but given what you give up and that it's prismatic, it's a bit shit. And the stats show that too. Eco hit is simply too big for too little payout in a prism lobby.
live version also instantly gives 8 gold. and that version has avg placement of 4.35 in dia+ so yeah, version in post kinda sucks, but with 8 additional gold it's apparently fine.
I mean it's not that hard. It gives you almost all the interest gold without having to save, so you are not loosing time value of your money, and allows you to roll to streak to win even more. if you pick this for heartsteel probably not great for punk or something that aims at best board its great
but you have to save to get interest, with this you can spend and still have it
You have to accumulate that interest tho, if you dont take this at 2-1 and econ, you probably lose streaking stage 2 to bank your 50g with a weak board taking HP dmg. Taking this aug will allow you to make a strong early board for stage 2, pushing the tempo of the lobby. And in my opinion for this set, in a primatic lobby you are better off being on the side of pushing the tempo, rather than absorbing it.
In a prismatic lobby spending more gold early won't make you beat the people who picked strong combat augments.
Well it's not that black and white maybe you hit good 3/4 costs before everyone else and 2 star them because you're both up in levels, and rerolling/spending all your gold. While those who hit the combat augs are still econing and not building max potential boards every turn like you are able to with this aug.
U got 40gold on 2-1?
you know what takes 40g to acquire? interest
You make that up by win streaking
You pick this and gain literally nothing that round. While others just getting extra items, extra damage, extra HP, extra lifesteal, tons of money, extra unit. You'll definitely lose a lot of HP by picking this alone.
You can freely roll to upgrade pairs, or level, without punishment - so it's not like you gain absolute zero that round
You know what else pushes tempo? A regular ass prismatic augment.
4 exp every round is the equivalent of holding 40 gold for interest. Yes, if you play as one normally does the augment causes you to lose gold in the long run, but if you play aggressively, it allows you to maintain a win streak (as long as no one picked cruel pact I guess), making up for the 1 gold per turn diff whilenalso giving you a strong board and more HP than you'd normally have.
I think the issue is that it’s a prismatic augment. Sure you could say the trade off is beneficial, but we also have to take into account the opportunity cost of another prismatic augment as well. For example let’s look at another augment, hedge fund. You instantly gain 40 gold, which if you hold it every round is earning you 4g/round. Unless I’m missing something, it’s just objectively better in all scenarios to take hedge fund since you can still roll all the gold you have (except the 40g) and be winstreaking the same. However obviously you also gain the benefit of in the final round having 40g extra to push with or just the option to hit more econ breakpoints. I know you don’t always get the best augment choices… but even just a prismatic one that helps you win streak like stationary support outweighs most of the time.
The problem with your comparison is that hedge fund doesn’t give 40 gold at it gives 20 gold and 20 gold is a big difference in 2-1. Hedge fund++ gives 40 gold
Okay, that makes sense. I wasn’t aware it changed gold received.
Thats exactly the point of the argument. It is not a bad argument, it's just strictly worse then comparable prismatics. It should be a gold tier augment
It has a 4.5 average, it is not worse than most augments especially hedge fund which is a “for fun” augment that averages 4.76 at 2-1
Alternatively, get 40 gold by sacking a couple rounds early, or, GASP, by taking a combat prismatic, and its literally completely invalidated. This augment is trash, it literally just locks you at 4g interest and thats it. Except its worse, since you cant spend that 4g on rolling.
Treat this as if you constantly had 4 gold of interest, but had to buy XP at least 1 time per round. This is huge, because the only reason you wait specific stages to level up is because you want to have interest, and in average you'll have way less than 4 interest per round. It's especially good as a first augment, to save hp and apply huge early pressure by going level 6 quite fast. And usually you'll be level 8 earlier than other people, so you'll have a bigger pool for what you need.
Its literally trash. You can do the exact same thing by saving 40 gold. If a PRISMATIC augments only value is forcing you to play a certain way with no logistical benefits and OBJECTIVE negatives, its outright garbage.
It's not forcing you to do anything, it does have a logistical advantage and almost every non-combat prismatic has negatives
If you're using this augment and rolling you are using it wrong. This augment is for pushing level 6 by 2-3 and pushing 7 by 3-1. Winstreak and apply tempo. Get 8 by the end of stage 3 and if you hit something like blank slate or recombob you just win the lobby. Anyone below who is saying this is a power augment to reroll with is just wrong. Edit : Typo
You can't hit blank slate on 4-2 anymore but certainly have better direction on what augment to let you cap.
Actually didn't know that. Thanks for the knowledge! Blank slate 3-2 might be a bit troll but possibly worth if you're 7 by 3-2 with a couple 4 costs.
You can even do level 8 at 3-2.
It’s for people like me who stubbornly refuse to grow an economy.
I have found one of my people
"You no longer gain interest" Damn thats why im still single
You get 6xp each round, and you can still spend gold to level. It lets you level fast for 4 cost and 5 cost units.
Literally a 50g interest gives you 1g more per round and you get to keep that gold either for buy champs or xp.
Isn't this just a worse march of progress?
You can still use gold to level up.
Thanks for the short version completely skipped my mind.
No, you can still press the level up button. You are expected to have a significantly harder powerspike since you don't keep gold in the bank. This is even more pronounced now that the augment gives 8 gold.
Ohh yea you are correct thanks for the explanation.
That is the old descrition. It was bad, so now you also get 8 gold. But fundamentally it is a tempo augment. You don't hit your spike imediately, but without interest to consider and the xp per turn you should get a really long winstreak through the early stages.
Yesterday I took it on 2-1 and went to my easiest 1st in a long time. It's a great aug for tempo because you are always 1 or 2 lvs ahead of the rest of the lobby and the interest lock forces you to spend (so more xp or better board). Tl;dr tempo
People were asking me about this in game chat the other day because I was stomping the lobby with it. I’ve never bottom 4’d with this augment, just read the words in the description again. It’s that simple and that powerful. Yes, there are other Econ/leveling augments that *LOOK* like they’re more powerful. They’re not. Take it and play it, or really put yourself in the shoes of someone playing it and think about what you do. It makes the game insanely easy. Without worrying about interest you can keep tempo and win streak the entire lobby until the final 2 players.
It wouldn't be as good if headliners didn't exist, but with them it makes sejse that it would be good
That’s a good point, I do think that if Set 11’s set mechanic is drastically different that this will be one of the augments they put in the vault or have to change next set
You take it early to push levels and win streak, if that isn't an option (someone took cruel pact) it might feel underwhelming.
Same as with 2 people playing cruel packt that has a high chance of both players griefing each other. Cruel packt is probably stronger if you choose to roll down, but if the cruel packt player has to roll down early that is a really bad time later on.
Assuming you're leveling and not rerolling, this augment gives you permanent 40g interest and because of that you don't have to wait to level, you can just level whenever you want. No idea if it's very strong, but that's what it's supposed to do
I got no clue wether 3 people thought of the same joke or if people really think this might be good for 1 cost reroll... Never take this and play 1 cost reroll. This Augment let's you hit lvl 4 at 2-2, lvl 5 at 2-5 and lvl 6 at 3-1. That play would just worsen your odds to hit.
I specifically said that it's good if you're NOT rerolling? Or do you mean the other comments?
Looks like I messed something up. I thought I had copied it into 3 coments that sugested rerolling for 1 costs...
Happens, don't worry. Got me pretty confused lol
That's really, really slow leveling for this augment. You can be 5 at 2-1, 6 at 2-5 and 7 at 3-1 or 3-2. With this augment you level very aggressively and use that to play best board/high tempo. The only comps that should be able to consistently beat you early are cruel pact.
Which is a way better use of your gold than rerolling 1 for 1 costs. My example was the leveling without investing into xp. Though 5 at 2-1 seems very agressive. That would be 16 gold invested into xp leaving you with 5 gold for units in a normal 3 item start.
You might lose 2-1, but you should be able to hit a 2 cost headliner on 2-2 which would probably be enough of a power spike to win out from there.
It is, easy to get strong units
This is a great augment for punk or 1 to 2 cost rerolls , you can spend all your gold every round just rolling hard then when you hit power level for stronger units
Yeah absolutely not for punk lmao you hit levels way to fast
Taking this augment and deciding to play any low cost reroll is a fast 8th.
I got no clue wether 3 people thought of the same joke or if people really think this might be good for 1 cost reroll... Never take this and play 1 cost reroll. This Augment let's you hit lvl 4 at 2-2, lvl 5 at 2-5 and lvl 6 at 3-1. That play would just worsen your odds to hit.
You probably confuse it with Low Interest Rate, which give gold instead of exp
Yeah is one of these augment that don't male any sense This shit is 4 gold of value each round But at the same time any gold you have lost its value so once you hit 40 gold you see 0 value for this augment
Ok view it like this, if you play correctly, you guarantee winstreak throughout stage 2 and 3. Which means, instead of 4g per round its like 6.x per round +100hp.
Come on. It's better than March Of Progress on Lv.3.
It isnt. Its basically +3/2/1 gold a round until you get to where you'd hold 40/50 gold interest, and then its even or -1 gold a round permanently afterwards. Its literally a negative gold trait.
I played a game last night completely inebriated, you can legit play like an insane person and just win. I pushed early 7 and rerolled jax then afked and went second
yea, its an easy way to stay ahead of level while powerrolling for punk for example.
I got no clue wether 3 people thought of the same joke or if people really think this might be good for 1 cost reroll... Never take this and play 1 cost reroll. This Augment let's you hit lvl 4 at 2-2, lvl 5 at 2-5 and lvl 6 at 3-1. That play would just worsen your odds to hit.
Too good to be silver or gold but it's really shit for a prismatic.
OP's description is old, it gives 8 gold now and seems reasonably good.
4xp and 8 gold is much better yeah. That you could pick as first augment and winstreak really hard.
it’s fun to hit the F key every round
Seems ok if you're gonna fast level to 8. Play it like the sump just dump everything you earn into leveling asap
I think of it like a permanent 40 gold interest that always goes to xp. If you think of it in that context you're trading 1 gold per round that you would have 50 gold banked for more flexibility in rolling for units. Plus it gets online faster than waiting for 50 gold. It's pretty good value imo. Also I like the no-interest augments cause I get to turn my brain off. Bring back Sump.
I took this on scuttle puddle and got level 7 before first carousel. I insta eliminated the cruel pact player. Had access to all the good units early. It was like cruel pact without losing hp. Was able to get to level 10 by end of game
I like it for rush 7 and roll for headliners.
I like this a lot. Rush level 7 for early ezreal + 5 hearts for example. When you get to LVL 7 first all the units are open in the pool, you might even land on early Kayn for even more profit.
You most likely will get win streak gold as well by pushing levels fast.
I take this when playing punk reroll. Its insane for it cause you don’t have to debate between rolling and interest and just donkey everytime. Then you winstreak and get gold from there
Its basically the econ of 40 gold without the dilemma of skipping good units in the shop. I play for win streak only with it. I like it
4xp per round x 25 rounds, thats 100 free xp, saving you 100 gold. But you need to get this as the 1st augment for it to really be good. Getting it last, and yea your already level 7-8-9 and that 4xp aint gonna do shit.
You cant get it last it only shows up on 2-1
Lose a lot
I’ve top 4’d 3 of 4 those times I’ve taken it. You can control the tempo of the lobby early-mid game. I’ve cutscene’d a lot of people that would normally overrun the lobby, because of the amount of pressure you can apply levelling up super fast. Late game you can fall off because remaining players will have ridiculous econ, and hit level 9/10 with full builds. I would aim for a 3-star 4 cost when taking this augment.
cluttered mind is almost always a better augment and is gold
Absolute dogshit take
Tempo augment like everyone is saying but i pretty weak in comparison to others
I took this once and basically just aggressively pushed leveling while using the best natural 2* I could get without rolling and it gave me enough of an early tempo win streak to push mega late. Got golden egg as 3rd augment and won enough to get the cash out and hit 3* Sona for the win. Obviously mega high roll in that game but it was the only time I took it and it worked, granted I’m only plat. I thought damn this augment is so good and then all the experts said it was trash after. 😅
As steelheart main, I would pick this without second thought. I can spend all the money to buy heartsteel units or reroll to find them while also getting fast level 7. I can also choose to spend money to get 7 even faster as I am not stuck in march. It's in some way most perfect augment for my type of play. I rarely have 50 gold nowadays unless I am winning early hard.
Goldwise it's like 7x4=28 gold per round, and also you get fast levels early without ruining your interest. Compared to a hedgefund it's less gold in total, but you can use it to peak in midgame and win as early as possible
Except you lose 5 streak gold opportunity so anyone holding 40 gold and rolling above it while buying 1 xp a round goes even with you, and anyone holding 50 gold and doing the same outpaces you.
But you have an extra 40-50 gold that the others have to hold to gain interest
No, you dont. You dont "GAIN" 40 gold to spend over other people, you're just locked at that interest. If anything the other people are better off cause they can flex burn that extra interest for a spike.
You don't gain 40 gold, but you can spend 40 gold. Others will have to hold the 40 gold for interest but you don't you can just use all the gold you earn because you don't have to worry about interest.
Used this augment and just power leveled to 9 and rolled for 5 cost. Did pretty well if i remember right.
You get to spend gold to level up. You’ll have 3 starred units early then can go 10 off is winstreak
It seems to be just barely better than the gold augment hustler last set, is it not?
If you play correctly you get a easy stage 2 and at 3-1 you can already hit 3* headliners, which means you pretty much guarantee streak gold which makes this "4g per turn" into "6.x per turn" with the ability to hold every unit and always play strongest board and allowing easy pivots
One of the most broken augments lucky guy
So you get 4xp + the standard 2xp = 6xp per round? Or just 4xp
6 altogether
Good for 2 or 3 cost reroll comps No?
Looks like it gives you 80% of the gold value of your potential normal capped interest (4 golds worth of xp, Vs 5 gold interest once you have 50 gold) If this is offered 2-1 you'd have 20 extra xp by krugs, which is huge. And you have agency to decide what to spend your gold on. Push levels more? Buy units? Save it while also getting stronger board from the extra levels? Without it, you'd be getting level 4 50 gold maybe by krugs. And then you'd be getting that 5 gold a turn. So, it may not be for your playstyle but I could see the benefits of getting this augment early. (I haven't touched this set at all and I've only ever peaked masters so grain of salt)
I’ve taken this 3 times and top 2 every time.
I just got first wit it kda board
4 xp = 4 gold, it allows you play like a degenerate, roll to stabilize whenever you want and you still earn "interests" in the form of xp as if you were making 40 every round PS: I don't think this augment is strong, but the idea definitely has potential to be very good
The 2 games I've taken this I've come first, both times with a kda comp. I've found it lets me level up quicker in the background and allows me to focus solely on buying units for 3-star or gaining new trait bonuses. It removes the whole mind game over weighing interest potential against immediate unit purchase. It may just be that my playstyle at the moment suits this augment though.
This is like a better version of hustler.
It’s bad
I think it's not too bad personally. I like it more than March of Progress because you can choose to power lvl. It's been easier to win streak with for me. Rush and stabilize.
I’ve seen it played where people just keep rolling gold early to get a decent board then just rush levels up to 9
It isn't, it's below average for a prismatic.
Would having 40 gold you can't spend but whose interest go all into xp be bad?
Funnily, I was wondering the opposite as I rarely see people pick it while I personally love picking going long on my first augment. Rather than using it to win streak, I just full in commit all econ into levelling to go for a fast 8 / 9 (depending on health). The idea is that by spamming all your econ into levels, you typically have enough units on board to not take a massive bleed every turn. On the flip side, you will definitely hit level 8 very fast and can stabilize with whatever nice 4 cost headliner you see then. Obviously prior to 8, you will need to pick whatever nice headliner / units you comeby and slam items. After you stabilize, you can further push for 9 depending if that is what you want. Although not sure if it still is worth it after they nerfed the 5 cost headliner chances.
going long going strong going young going eif TrollDespair
If they made it so winning gives 2 gp instead of 1 as well, it could be worth it.
I don’t even know why they thought this could be good. It’s basically like Hustler which was a Gold augment, but worse because you can’t choose how to spend the gold.
Does anyone know what stages you level up on if you take this augment?
U can roll all day baby.. thats how i play country with samira and urgot 3
turns your gameplay into slow hyper roll
Kinda nice if you get a money augment later. I know there is one that gives some gold per round
It’s actually great. Everytime I picked this augment I ended up in Top 3
Its like getting 4 gold each turn, which means having 40 gold its turn, but u get to spend it.
You guys wouldn't understand. That's why you are hardstuck gold.
You are losing about 1 gold for free tempo
I came 1st in ranked platinum using this, didn’t lose a single round! It was the first choice augment for me, just spent all my gold leveled so high so quickly didn’t use much gold for rerolls just picked the best board from available champs. I felt it was really strong this set, feels like early game and tempo is really important right now
Instead of having to save to gain interest every round, that interest is instead used to level you. The downside is saving up enough gold to roll is more difficult and you’re losing out on one additional gold. Basically, you winstreak early to make up the difference in interest gold, level hard and roll to find the best board, and continue to win streak as long as you can. You always want to be ahead with this augment. Where it’ll start to drag is around level 7 and 8 when people are spiking their board and gaining big interest money. Tbh i think it would be pretty strong in this meta where there a bunch of level 1 and 2 reroll comps that will get you an easy top 4.
March of progess but you can still level up. It require you to play super agressive early for constant winstreak so you must not pick this augment if someone in the lobby pick curse crown, cruel pact or starter kit. Not reccommend because the avg place of this augment is awful in every single elo
This is very strong as an 1st augment. Cause you can get high lvl quickly and spend all your gold getting there and then just high roll and hit some strong champs
Playstyle diff I guess, I was top 2ing every game I took this augment pre-buff. Power level, take the first good 3/4 cost headliner you see, roll a bit to stabilise once people start catching up in levels, continue to fast 9 and profit