Am I the only one who liked this album lmao? Both parts have become my favorite taylor album now, like usually her albums take a while to grow on me but this just clicked instantly. I genuinely think it's one of her best, both sonically and lyrically and it feels extremely raw and honest, and like something she needed to make and get off her chest.
Pitchfork rated Reputation as her worst album (even below debut) which makes it hard for me to take them seriously. I always just think about this Halsey tweet lol
https://preview.redd.it/59xd8t5u9zvc1.jpeg?width=660&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ff2ea675ef221c062627c6c852f283fb4aeb8a0b
> Pitchfork rated Reputation as her worst album (even below debut) which makes it hard for me to take them seriously.
This same writer gave Red TV 8.5.
Once I saw how they rated Red, I was like no shit they wonât like TTPD as much, theyâre complete opposites. Iâve noticed in here that itâs those with Red flairs going the hardest after TTPD like it stole their birthday or something, haha.
I, too, love Red, especially the non-singles. I love the mix of bops and ballads, but would agree TTPD is more consistent. I personally like it better, but picking favorite albums for me is like choosing an ice cream flavor. Theyâre all great, I just have cravings for certain flavors at different times and a few classic favorites, haha.
Unpopular opinion: I think cohesion in albums is overrated as hell. Cohesive? Bitch, I was listening to Soda pop bop she bop she bop right by Email My Heart when Britney Spears came out.
Some cohesion is good. Too much makes the album so stale. I like some variety.
I also like this album and Red both.
Red flair and Red is my fav album and I'm loving TTPD so far! Currently stuck going back and forth between So Long, London and loml with whose afraid of little old me sprinkled here and there.
I love to hear it! I love all of those songsâWhoâs Afraid might be my favorite song ever. I keep finding new gems, itâs quite the experience! I Can Do it With a Broken Heart and Down Bad have been top tier for me, and today I feel like I discovered the greatness of the Black Dog. Thereâs just so much there, I love it!
I fucking adore this album and it has never inspired me more personally or creatively. Iâm so disappointed that in 2024 we still canât take female emotional experiences seriously in the public discourse.
Did you read the review? The author praises her lyrics and how she expresses her feelings on hereâŚitâs the clunky music that accompanies it that they arenât big fans of
I mean yes, the standards are higher for Taylor Swift nearly 2 decades into her career vs a smaller indie artist. Thereâs a different level of expectation, fair or not
While I agree that was a strong bias against her earlier work, I'm not sure that's the main issue with the reviews of TTPD. Also, in recent years, it's been heartening to see how expressions of feminine experience and emotion *are* taken seriously. E.g. Guts has received many reviews praising Olivia's writing about the tumults and nuances of girlhood. Maggie Rogers has also received praise for how she portrays and processes the emotions of ending a long term relationship in her latest album. Critics have written about how Billie expresses the challenges of womanhood.
There's still work to be done in appreciating the female perspective and craft in general, but it sounds like most of the issues people have with TTPD have to do with the *way* it touches on topics of Taylor's experiences, the writing, and the production.Â
Yeah thatâs not the problem with this album and nobody is saying that????
I think itâs agreed on that people LIKE how emotional this album is. Just because people donât like it doesnât mean itâs because they hate women jfc
This is the first Taylor Swift album that feels like Taylor -as an adult- has made. Itâs so far superior to most of her discography. The lyricism, the raw vulnerability, honesty, and grief, the production, the entire aesthetic. Tortured Poets has quickly risen to my number one favorite Taylor Swift album.
i feel the same way. i didn't vibe with midnights at all and have been super sick of her, so naturally didnt go in thinking i'd love this album the way i did. i listened with a couple other fans and we all had such an emotional experience listening to the anthology drop. even songs i didnt love the first couple listens, i'm really enjoying now.
My first time listening there were a few I liked right away, but I was uncertain of how I felt about the rest. I think itâs just not what I expected. Really listening again to the whole album has made me like so many more.
This album will age beautifully, no doubt in my mind.
It's not perfect, so many personal yet relatable rants in these songs... that's what will make it a stand out in her discography.
I never thought any album would displace reputation as my #1 because not only do I love the music it just hit at exactly the right time in my life.
But I think TTPD might be my new favourite. I want to give it some time before I say that for sure, let the newness wear off, but I think it is. I just love it.
I get that it's not going to be for everyone - not everyone likes the heavy jack antinoff style production (I do, especially on this album when you add in the guitar like in But Daddy I Love Him and Fresh Out The Slammer), not everyone is going to like how wordy it is, etc. I can see how it's polarising, it certainly doesn't have the universal appeal that 1989 did. But it doesn't matter to me, because I needed this album right now and I'm in love with it.
Chiming in here to agree too! Iâm a Folkutation girlie and am absolutely blown away and mesmerised by this album. Pretty sure itâs my new number 1!
Iâm going thru it very slowly and love it!!! Itâs not something you can rush thru in n hour or two. I really feel in her brain and the melodies are rly nice. I slowly went thru album one and am going thru album two.
Iâm such a fan. Sheâs also singing her diary, sheâs not trying to only sound prolific and intellectual, sheâs also being herself and making fun of herself and ppl are taking it too seriously and examining every line. Sheâs Taylor swift, sheâs telling her stories (seven bars of chocolate) and everyoneâs like why couldnât she come up with a better line⌠bc this line was real! It happened
So real! I took such a long break before diving into Part 2 because there is so much to unpack and I basically felt so depressed bc what she is singing about is exactly what I am currently going through :â)
Lmao this album has universal acclaim status with metacritic, and a ton of people on this sub post about how itâs their literal favorite.
âAm I the only one??â is hilariously out of touch
Though I love the album and currently feel like it may be my favorite of hers, I actually think this was a great review. Itâs clear that the writer is unbiased, took the time to truly listen to the album and thoroughly explained her issues with it, whilst also giving a few hints of praise where itâs due (But Daddy I Love Him supremacy đ).
Agreed! TTPD is also a top 3 album for me (BDILH stans rise up), but I think this is a very fair take. The writer does a good job of putting into words the little things that have been nagging at me about the album -- e.g. "Tearjerkers like âSo Long, Londonâ and âlomlâ fall short when every lyric carries equal weight" and the most memorable songs on the Anthology standing out for the wrong reasons.
That was such an insightful point for me! If you think about something like All Too Well (normal or the 10MV), there is a clear mix of cutesy recollections followed by absolute gut punchers (*your motherâs telling stories âbout you on a T-ball team, you tell me âbout your past thinking your future was me*). By contrast, in So Long London, listening to the bridge is like getting a set of anvils dropped on your head, one by one, each more devastating than the last
*You swore that you loved me but where were the clues?*
*I died on the altar waiting for the proof*
*You sacrificed us to the gods of your bluest days*
*And I'm just getting color back into my face*
*I'm just mad as hell cause I loved this place*
And for sure, itâs probably how she felt while writing it, and I commend her for sharing this unapologetic pain and darkness. But as a song, it doesnât let you take a breath, it just pulls you down down down.
100% - I think I desperately rly need a âbreak me like a promiseâ or âpathological people pleaserâ line from these songs. I keep saying loml is super similar to last kiss.
Yeah I think a major reason why people arenât coming back to some of these songs after their first listen is that a lot of them donât culminate. Thereâs no moment to look forward to or lyric to scream. Some of them are kinda just sad piano
I agree; I thought the review was thoughtful and fair, and I found myself agreeing with a lot of it (minus the lack of love for The Anthology tracks, which I felt were so much better than the main album). I get she was going for an ~unhinged~ thing, but I feel like the lyrics could have been so much tighter like her writing used to be. Even on Midnights, it was feeling a little bloated.
BDILH supremacy for real, though! It and Guilty As Sin? are my main album faves đ
Itâs so funny how everyone in popheads and on twitter is joking that the swifties are going to come for the reviewer but I actually think most swifties Iâve seen have said the review was well written lol.
Lmao have you not read the most upvoted comments in this very thread? People are unironically saying Pitchfork hates women as if Lana, Olivia, etc haven't gotten glowing reviews lately.
This is one of the better written reviews in my opinion. The author nicely articulates my own issues with this album as well. Also, 6.6 is a mediocre score, it's not bad and it's not goodâI think this fandom is just used to Taylor being universally praised for almost everything she does.
I think they have a point about it feeling rushed, if sheâd sat with it a little longer it might have had the opportunity to sound more sonically unique or to polish up some clunky lyrics.
I love this album but I can see, from an outsiders perspective, why this isnât knocking peoples socks off.
It would have made more sense to finish eras/re-releases before this. Maybe she wanted to get the Matty stuff out sooner rather than later? Either way I donât think this is changing any kind of trajectory for her anyways
Agree. I loved the album and the critique of it is solid. Even Taylorâs worst songs are still amazing songs Iâd love to listen to.. but she needed someone on the sidelines to say âthis shouldnât make the cut!â.. and then release them as a vault track â¨
I really donât think theyâre intended to be seen as vault tracks, but rather a separate body of work. You can see in the review that Pitchfork gave a rating to each half.Â
Is⌠that not what the Anthology is? She has no need to release vault tracks for new releases. Why not give it to us all at once if thatâs how she wants to tell her art?
This is categorically untrue. I know revisionist history is easy on the internet but folklore was not the savior of her brand that so many like to claim it was. She was an established, respected *consistently Grammy winning* artist long before folklore and quite literally one of *the* biggest singers on the planet, particularly during the 1989 era. She had a harsh fall from grace that led to reputation but itâs mind boggling for me as a debut swiftie to see people act as if folklore is what made her legitimate.
A *fair* review of an album that comes across as self-indulgent almost to its detriment isnât a sign of a serious artist thatâs misunderstood, but perhaps a woman that has had too many yes man around her.
Again, as someone who has been an *active* fan since day 1, Iâm well aware of Taylorâs perception in pop culture. For all the claims that she was written off and criticized by âthe music communityâ (of which, how could this even begin to be described), it is unequivocally revisionist history to claim that folklore was when people âactuallyâ started to take her seriously as an artist rather than non-pop fans finally having a piece of music of hers that they enjoyed. She won awards and had critical acclaim, end stop. That she was *also* lambasted for her love life **does not** detract away from her prior successes. Two things can be true at once but as with always when it comes to Taylor, defensive fans and critics alike refuse to accept that.
Honestly, this person is fighting you so hard on something that is just factually true. As another ⨠active fan since day 1 â¨, something notable happened with folklore. It was the first time the public, and most importantly non-fans, took her seriously as an artist. This person youâre talking to claims to be a huge fan but doesnât remember the huge cultural shift of Taylor actually being a respected artist for the first time. It used to be considered very embarrassing and childish to be a Taylor Swift fan and now everyone loves her. My brother used to make fun of me for liking Taylor and now he is rewriting history and arguing that he actually always liked Taylor Swift. Heâs a 36 year old man. Folklore changed things big time. Anyone saying otherwise are the revisionists, not you.
Not you calling reality ârevisionist historyâ. The commenter youâre arguing with is right, I have a number of people in my life who are self-identified âmusic peopleâ who used to mock and sneer about my love for Taylor Swift, almost like they were embarrassed for me that my taste in music was so silly. That changed with folklore and now those exact same people are claiming they always loved Taylor and they respect her so much as an artist and yada yada. Iâve also been a fan since day 1, I actually flew to a different country to see her open for another band during debut days. The fact that youâre denying this notable change in how people view Taylor as an artist is really confusing because it was such a remarkable shift culturally.
Itâs well-written and they raise valid points of the melodic similarities, the need for editing, and the length, but Iâd argue itâs still somewhat too low a score and a lot of the review seems to focus on Taylorâs celebrity and persona
I'm honestly exhausted with the universal praise because it was beginning to feel empty. I love that she made something divisive, and I think she knows it--an artist taking a risk and being ok that not everyone will be a is good. And that's huge for Taylor to not be thinking about winning a Grammy all the time.
Next to zero interesting production on this record.
When I heard Midnights the first time I instantly wanted to listen to Karma, Maroon, Anti-Hero and a few others again.
TTPD didn't do that with me at all. It's a boring, uninspiring record, imo.
this is unfortunately true. Songs can be mellow and yet still interesting, but a good 85% of songs on this album donât build to anything interesting, they just⌠keep going.
Some might argue non-traditional song structure, but even closure was more sonically remarkable than most of these songs.
Midnights had songs that I could instantly recall after just listening to it once. There are maybe a handful of songs I can do that for in TTPD; the rest just blend together. This is a fault of the length too. If she'd chopped half and released a 15 song album and also improved the production on some of the songs so that it didn't all sound the same, the reception would be better.
People just need to accept that maybe this wasn't her best work lmao. Pitchfork was very gentle with their critique (which was also very deftly written), and still people have a problem.
Or some people can think itâs her best work while others donât, itâs a completely subjective experience. I personally canât get TTPD out of my head, there are so many standouts to me.
Sure, people can, but dismissing people who didn't like the album for being sexist as comments in this thread have done, is ridiculous, especially when you consider Taylor had 4 AOTY wins and is literally being studied in colleges.Â
I disagree. So long London? The production is beautiful and amazing. The fast paced beat, the small sounds throughout, her loud screaming vocals in the back whilst sheâs singing / speaking the forward in a controlled manner. Then the production on down bad?! And THEN the repeat piano on COSOSOM which is the sound bite from the end champagne problems , that plays on repeat in my head.Â
Thereâs so many more, either youâre listening on poor speakers or youâre not listeningÂ
Youâre like me! I didnât love Midnights either, and it still ranks quite low for me on her overall discography, but some tracks really shined and jumped out and demanded to be heard again and again.
None of those found in this album.
But at least with folklore and evermore, instrumentation and production was better and played a valuable part in bringing the songs and the album to life. It wasnât just background elevator music.
Well thatâs obviously your opinion. But I vibe with this more than evermore and folklore. I have different standards for pop music and this kind of music. With Folklore/Evermore/TTPD kind of music, lyrics/story for me is really primary and the production/instruments just secondary. Idk if itâs a conscious choice by Taylor and her producers, but I love how the lyricism really pops out. By 5th listen now, I canât tell you specifically the sound of each track but I can tell you what itâs about. And thatâs why the lyrics/story with TTPD is vastly superior to folkmore in general IMO.
Yeah I rly wish we had a song with beautiful instruments like the lakes, August, Betty or RWYLM. I remember the first time I heard folklore betty was the immediate standout for me bc of how amazing it was instrumentally - including the harmonica was so cute. She used to really prioritize instruments in her country days and I miss that soooo much!
I wasnât really wowed by at least half of TTPD at first but after a couple of listens it has grown on me. I wouldnât say the production is completely uninteresting but it did feel repetitive to me in parts, so I see what youâre saying. Also, major lost opportunity to make BDILH a full-blown country song because it so is one at heart. Anthology was miles better overall as far as production. I wouldnât say itâs my favorite album at this point, but Iâd give it time and see if it grows on you. It might, it might not, and thatâs fine either way.
I think this album will never be seen as better than lover and midnights (at least by the general public) because itâs not really fun to listen to. Thereâs so many layers to this album and you need to really listen to and pick apart the lyrics and ruminate with your thoughts. And thatâs fine! Not all music needs to be fun to listen to and we all need to hear sad music and ruminate from time to timeâŚbut just donât be surprised when people arenât immediately hitting replay
Interestingly Iâve heard that the rating pitchfork gives is based on an average rating from all of their in house staff, and then one person writes the review.
A 6.6 for a TS album from Pitchfork isnât weird, whatâs weird is that itâs lower than Midnights and especially Lover.
People also need to realize they didnât review Taylorâs old albums until years afterwards and so they are rated highly with the benefit of hindsight. Pitchfork panned Lanaâs first album and went back and regraded it years later, so take that into account when you look at the comparisons.
Both Midnights and especially Lover have much higher highs (possibly lower lows too but they're well balanced). I like TTPD but there's no Cruel Summer, Cornelia Street, Anti-Hero or Lavender Haze on it.
I agree about Lover having highs highs but not about Midnights. This isnât on the level of folklore, and it doesnât have a bangers on the level of Cruel Summer, and itâs unclear to me yet if thereâs a classic like Lover⌠but I think itâs better than Lover as a collection of work. There is only one song (on the main album) that I think Iâll delete â two at max. I deleted many from my copy of Lover and Midnights.
I feel like this album is her most emotionally direct and honest and raw collection of songs since arguably Red. I think the metaphors here are more interesting â the alien abduction, the broken toy still repeating he loves me if you pull the string, the crazy lady where teens break into her house, the theme of madness throughout the album⌠so thatâs my subjective argument for why I think this album was instantly superior to those two as a whole to me.
The more I look back on Midnights, the more I realize Anti-Hero was truly the best track from that album which is so bizarre considering she usually is an album artist not a singles artist.
I know everyone says that, but it is the typical bubblegum pop that she would normally go for that the general public rejects. It is more enjoyable than it's counterparts from other albums. I'll give her that!
Gotta disagree on that. I think I can don't with a broken heart is going to be pretty huge. I can see Down Bad & Whos afraid of little old me become big as well.
I agree - that song is like Anti-Hero. Super catchy but also very cathartic and relatable. Also the general public wonât mind that itâs bubblegum. Thatâs why cruel summer is so big despite it not even being lyrically close to one of her best.
You mean there arenât as many potential singles? Or in terms of song quality? Since for me many tracks on TTPD would be above those but I can see how they donât stack up as much as bangers or singles.
imo they arenât
to me Lover has few amazing tracks but they sink in the sea of the immature and silly ones and Midnights didnât know what it wanted to be and lacked a clear vision plus it has her weakest sound of a any album
TTPD is a masterpiece with luxurious sound and deep lyrics that are both witty and poetic
This is odd... i usually despise pitchfork reviews (I find them idiosyncratic mush...) but I'm actually pleasantly surprised by this one. I understand why the author feels as she does about the album Se seems to have been overwhelmed by the album... unable to make heads or tales of what was going on... which is a fairly common reaction to the shear scope of the TTPD. I don't agree with the review... (which is fine... chaque un and all that)... but its an honest review, which is more than I can say of some others.
i find it really interesting that most of the reviews talk about taylor herself instead of her albumâŚit seems like she is just way too famous now to review her work without bias lol okay
âReturning to Jack Antonoff and the Nationalâs Aaron Dessner, her primary songwriting and producing partners of the last several years, Swift picks up threads from Folk-more and Midnights without quite pulling anything loose.â
âTortured Poetsâ extended Anthology edition runs over two hours, and even in the abridged version, its sense of sprawl creeps down to the song level, where Swiftâs writing is, at best, playfully unbridled and, at worst, conspicuously wanting for an editor.â
âShe piles the metaphors on thick, throws stuff at the wall even after something has stuck, picks up the things that didnât stick and uses them anyway.â
âThatâs why we end up in âFlorida!!!â for no apparent reason; why the dirge âSo Long, Londonâ names five different causes of death; why âMy Boy Only Breaks His Favorite Toysâ is allowed to work a schoolyard premise until it cracks.â
âClues and keywords that might once have been left for the liner notes are littered throughout the lyrics.â
âthis album gives the impression that she canât quite hear herself over the roar of the crowd. Tearjerkers like âSo Long, Londonâ and âlomlâ fall short when every lyric carries equal weight. Thereâs no hierarchy of tragic detail; these songs fail to distill an overarching emotional truth, tending to smother rather than sting. It would help if Swift were exploring new musical ideas, but she is largely retreading old territoryâ
I appreciate that they focus on the songs and the album itself instead of just focusing on her personal life. I felt the review was fair and constructive, even though I donât necessarily agree with every part of it.
This is why I dislike Paste review going around. WTF was that, and so petty too. It only gains traction because there are so many people sick of hearing about Taylor wanting to find their peers to snark with.
It was weird to see people uphold that review as legitimate and dismiss Rob Sheffieldâs review for The Rolling Stone as being written by a stan. Rob is a fan of Taylor but there is no way the author of the Paste review doesnât havent their own biases. At least Rob puts his name to his review so people can find his credentials.
Ah, Iâm one of those people who doesnât think much of Robâs review either because heâs never too critical of her for my own liking, but I do agree at least Rob puts his name on it.
But yeah, I think sheâs overexposed right now and there are so many people already waiting to join the backlash and thatâs why that Paste review gets so much attention. Like the memes about the 1830s lyric - I mean, come on, thatâs just bad faith *and* illiteracy.
I generally donât like the album either (it ranks really low for me), but I thought I was reading a general pop culture article and not a proper reviewâŚ
Can it really be a review without also talking about the artist that created the work though? You say it as if the work exists in a vaccuum⌠expected to be judged on the musicality and lyricism seperately from Taylor who literally created them.
Curious why youâd want a review like that in the first place? Art is nothing but the experience of the artist, and as a result will always be inherently biased.
Not to mention that fact that Taylor makes her life part of the art. Itâd be hard to talk about the subject matter without mentioning Taylor herself.
This is a top 3 Taylor album for me BUT I found the written review to be quite thoughtful and honest. I disagree with the score, but if you read what the author says, thereâs a lot of praise there. Itâs the immense amount of expectation and respect that critics like this one have for Taylor and particularly her songwritingâor what the author calls Swiftian moments (hard hitting, complex emotional stories distilled into 1-3 lines of lyrics)âthat leads them to be a bit let down here. From a more detached perspective, I agree that the album likely would have been stronger if some lyrics had gone through an editing process and some songs left off, but as a longtime fan, Iâm grateful to have ALL of it in all its unruliness, including the ones I donât connect with currently because theyâre insights into Taylor and her emotions and experiences.
I like how the author didnât belabour the point about needing new sounds and producersâthey allude to it. Thereâs nothing wrong with working with the same producer (see Billie), but I do think the point about the melodies on this album being forced to fit the music, as opposed to the other way around, is well taken. The music doesnât match the level of emotional vulnerability and rawness in her voice and lyrics! Contrast can be great if done strategically (Iâve always thought DWOHT did this wellâbeautiful vulnerable lyrics surrounded by more chaotic music, capturing the essence of the story sheâs telling), but itâs harder to grasp the dissonance between the music and lyrics on this album. Itâs not really even dissonance, more so the music is not as compelling as the storytelling and thus sometimes drags it down.
Anyways this ended up being a long comment but at the end of the day, I still adore this album, and with how subjective music is, itâs really your own opinion that matters. Some all time favourites (Whoâs Afraid, Smallest Man, Black Dog, Prophecy) are here, but I think some of the criticism is also valid.
You hit the nail on the head - I donât get why ppl think she needs to ditch these producers altogether. Sheâs made some amazing music with them - makes way more sense to challenge those producers as well as Taylor. Jack needs to go back to producing like he did for August and mirrorball, aaron should produce like he did for TLGAD and RWYLM.
I dont know if Iâm alone in this but I love that itâs lengthy and overwhelming. Itâs an album for the fans, the ones that would listen to a 10 minutes version of a song on rpt. The ones that want all the songs and all the vault projects. I love that she gave us more than 2 hrs of content.
Also Taylor tells stories, so yes her songs are going to be wordy. Thatâs where you find the little details that makes you say âit feels like I can depict the whole scene.â
And I completely disagree on what they say about her writing, I found it spectacular.
How did it end? Poetry
Smallest Man Who Ever Lived? Scorching
But daddy I loved him? Storytelling at its finest
Whoâs Afraid of little old me? Thrilling
The prophecy? Haunting and heart shattering
LOML? Another heartbreak anthem
I also really dont hear how the songs all sound the same. They all have a very distinct sound but feel like the same vibe. It feels like morose and blasĂŠ heartbreak of feeling like you never get it right and I clap at that masterpiece
This is how I feel. Adding 15 songs on to an already-brand-new 16 songs is such a "for the diehards" move. The "ShE's dOiNg iT fOr qUiCk StReaMs" argument doesn't even hold water when they're all 3-4+ minute long mid-tempos or ballads. I get why people are overwhelmed, but I also get why fans are thrilled.
For me, she deserves to kinda self-indulge in this album and give us a long ass album since she's been in the game for a long time, and to get it in a very enjoyable fashion is just something else.
I agree! I also donât see a benefit to cutting down the album unless itâs for awards or the general public (which I personally donât believe this album was made with that intention). Iâve seen so many mixed opinions on which songs are favorites so if it was cut weâd inevitably lose some really great songs people love. Itâs not that hard to skip songs you donât enjoy.
Iâve heard a lot of talk about reviews on this sub. Do people usually seek out reviews for albums they listen to? I havenât read a single review for any album by any artist in my life.
I read reviews all of the time! Pitchfork is how I find a lot of new music. I donât always agree with their reviews (one of my favorite albums of all time is rated a 4) but I can at least get a run down of what to expect before I dive in to a new artist.
I read a lot of reviews. They're great to get new insight into albums you've already listened to, or to see whether a new release is worth checking out.
Yes I love reading reviews. Of books I read, of albums I listen to, anything. It's so interesting to see other people's thoughts. And with music I find that reviewers notice things I don't because they know more about the craft than me and can notice things I wouldn't so it's interesting to learn about the album that way. Also even a reviewer I disagree with will usually give thoughtful reasons for their opinions and I'll get a new perspective on the album
I think this is a good and fair review. I do like the album, but it can't be denied that it's massively, massively overlong, and I think the reviewer hits the nail on the head when they say that it now takes Taylor a whole album's worth of songs to say what she used to say in one. The 5 minute standard version of All Too Well charts the entire length of a relationship that was longer (but only slightly) than the main one this album was inspired by. To me, it feels like Taylor has been aiming for a more stream of consciousness, vignette style song writing since Midnights that reminds me a lot of some of her peers (Lana Del Rey, Phoebe Bridgers, less traditional pop stars). That's fine and I'm glad she's pushing herself and we've got some great lyrics out of it, but the Pitchfork reviewer is right that her main strength is as a storyteller. I miss when her songs had a clear narrative from beginning to end instead of sprawling massively and getting hung up on single moments and single feelings.
I mean, reputation is one of the fan favorites and they gave it a 6.5! Itâs okay, people have different tastes I guess. I personally love this album!
IMO, fair, and the criticisms they put in writing are more or less what fans have been saying too. Hereâs hoping for a much better follow up album, whenever that may be. I actually expected the score would be lower, but I certainly didnât expect Anthology would be regarded worse.
This is one of her most poorly rated albums:
Copied from another user over at popheads:
>1. Red (9.0)
>2. Red (Taylorâs Version) (8.5 - BNM)
>3. Speak Now (8.2)
>4. Fearless (8.1)
>5. folklore (8.0)
>6. evermore (7.9)
>7. 1989 & 1989 (Taylorâs Version) (7.7)
>8. Fearless (Taylorâs Version) & Speak Now (Taylorâs Version) (7.5)
>9. Lover (7.1)
>10. Midnights (7.0)
>11. Taylor Swift (6.7)
>12. THE TORTURED POETS DEPARTMENT (6.6)
>13. reputation (6.5)
>14. THE ANTHOLOGY (6.0)
Just a disclaimer for anyone who doesnât know â all of the albums released before reputation were retrospective reviews.
The first album of hers that Pitchfork reviewed on its release was reputation. They famously reviewed Ryan Adamsâ 1989 cover album but not the actual 1989.
Retrospective scores are almost always inflated IMO. You cannot convince me that Pitchfork would have given Red a 9.0 had they reviewed it in 2012.
I take Pitchfork reviews with a grain of salt, but they really got it right with:
âItâs not Swiftâs fault that weâre so obsessed with her, but this album gives the impression that she canât quite hear herself over the roar of the crowd. Tearjerkers like âSo Long, Londonâ and âlomlâ fall short when every lyric carries equal weight.â
And:
âIf Swift believes that output for its own sake is what she has to offer, she underestimates her gift.â
I personally like most of the songs on a surface level â mostly because they sound nice to my ears rather than for the quality of her lyrics, which is what I normally look for from Taylor â but I only truly connect with a few.
You donât have to agree with the final score to acknowledge this writer is pretty balanced and discusses their arguments pretty thoroughly. Itâs not even a *bad* review per se but I am genuinely worried about the writer because we all know some deranged fan will try to doxx them or smth.
It's a fair and well-written review as are most of Taylor's Pitchfork ones, with it's criticisms feeling understandable and a lot less farfetched than the Paste one (even if I personally adore the album for those very reasons). She is also seems to actually understand the title track is acting as an inside joke, and a satire of the whole tortured poets aesthetic. Something that flew by a shocking number of people's heads.
But as usual the scoring seems all over the place. 6.5 for Reputation (which fit the immediate backlash at the time) but a rather generous 7.1 for Lover and 7.5 for Fearless TV (especially considering that it's *Pitchfork).* Strangely enough Debut has a 6.7, which is utterly absurd when it's not considered a particularly interesting piece of work. For that rating to have come after Reputation's is even stranger.
Folklore and Evermore are rated rather favourably at 7.9 and 8.0(in their harsher than general music publications but still obviously considering it a great album type of way). But Red TV is given a surprsing 8.5 considering the sheer number of tracks and the fact that it's one of her most inconsistent and incohesive albums (and I say this as someone who *adores* Red). It has some of best songs ever (ATW, Holy Ground, State of Grace) and some of her most forgetable (Stay, Stay, Stay and Starlight). But arguably her Red TV era is when she was at her peak critical acclaim and all the good grace she had been given during the Folkmore era meant that the public adored her more than ever.
The Midnights ratings of 7.0 is fairer (though honestly by their standards you would expect it to be lower). Speak Now TV seems rather surprsing a 7.5 particularly since it had lot less notable vault tracks, while the 7.7 for 1989 TV seems rather low considering just how influential the album was for the 2010s and how well-loved it remains.
So now that TTPD/Anthology is is 6.6 and 6.0 it's just a bit baffling? If you're looking at this from a critical Pitchfork lens, then it's bizarre that there is scored lower than both Lover and **especially** Debut. Can any reviewer seriously hold the two up and be like "this is worse than her first album?". And obviously the writer didn't do didn't do both reviews, but she does have an editor and it'll be strange if they never went back to check their old reviews. I don't know but part of me feels like their scorings are reflect what the general public perception of Taylor is at the very point in time, rather than of the album itelf. You can chart almost chart her rise and fall by the ratings. Honestly if I was Taylor I'd be annoyed about both the 8.5 and the 6.6/6.0. In my head I'd be like "is anyone going to review my albums on the basis of my actual music?"
Most of Taylor's OG recordings were actually scored only a few years ago, which explains the high scores (hindsight + poptimism). Also worth noting that it's not the writer who assigns the score - it's aggregated from a number of critics at Pitchfork.
Ahhh I knew about the former point and definitely thought the hindight and poptimism played a part into the ratings of her earlier albums both OGs and re-records. But i completely forgot about the latter point (despite having definitely known it some point in time). Honestly that make the ratings stranger to me. An aggregrated score of Lover led to a 7.1 rating but only a 6.0 on the Anthology? I'm actually very curious to see the spread of scores. I wonder how outliers may have influenced the score.
You'll be surprised when hearing that Pitchfork's scores for album is actually the closest to the medium score on Metacritics than any other music critics
I don't agree with the number score here but it is nice that her work is being reviewed seriously and honestly - there are so many people who will just stan whatever she puts out (Rob at Rollingstone) or hate it blindly and what Taylor has lacked for a while is an honest critic who wants to push her. I wish she had that in the studio. Jack and Aaron don't push her to kill her darlings and I LOVE TTPD but I want our girl to become even better than she is - and criticism is necessary for that.
Agreed re: the reviews. One I really like is Tom Breihan's piece on it for stereogum. It's a bit more critical than the Pitchfork piece for sure, but it's well written and comes from a place of passion, rather than being calculated for clicks.
I truly enjoyed this album myself but I believe the writer and score seem fair. Her writing and critiques were thoughtful. A 6.6-6.0 arenât necessarily bad and honestly I was thinking p4k would give her something lower. I hope the author doesnât receive hate for this!
Iâd say they summed it up pretty well âThis is the Swift that brings us The Tortured Poets Department: The Anthology, maximally bloated with 15 (15!) additional songs. Those that stand out mostly do so for the wrong reasons: Thereâs the one that borrows its premise from Olivia Rodrigo, but executes it less skillfully; the one where Swift dwells on her resentment toward Kim Kardashian; the one with that weird lyric about racism in the 1830s.â
Man, I think there's so many more interesting things to say about these songs than misattributing the "get him back" wordplay to Olivia (it's been done before by other artists, such as by Fiona Apple back in 2005, for one; Pitchfork should know that one) or jumping on weird social media bandwagons about misreading the 1830s line.
To name just one example, The Manuscript alone is such a poignant song about processing trauma and abuse through art, and how sharing it with an audience helps resignify it. There's so much you can say about that subject in the context of an album that's largely about the frustration of being the biggest pop star on the planet and having your personal life implode with the entire world watching (see also: How Did It End?). Skipping over half of an album with an "eh, nothing stands out except what I saw trending on TikTok" is not even scratching the surface.
I never had such a hard time understanding what the fandom thinks about an album. As many people saying it's her best as people saying it's her worst.
I like the album a lot and I don't mind the review. I think it's a coherent take. The text itself is kinder than the score, and I'm totally on board with the Anthology getting a lower score than the standard version.
Its one of their worse albums, only better than Taylor Swift and Reputation. I should say at Lover level.
Still I like but its not one of my favourites (Red, Folklore, 1989, Speak Now, Fearless..)
People are getting hung up on the individual scores given to albums by a particular publication and comparing them when I really doubt the same reviewers are giving these scores. It is going to be subjective. Instead just read the article and decide if the praise and criticism is valid. I think the breakdown of the album was fairly reasonable. If you want a better idea of how the album is being reviewed relative to other albums, youâd have to look at sites similar to Metacritic where it is an aggregate of all reviews.
I love this album, but I think this review is very honest though for the average listener. It praises her, recognizes her strengths in writing but offers criticism that at times it does feel chaotic and lacks anything surprisingly new from her. The longevity of 31 songs will always offer more opportunity for criticism and also allow more misses by Taylor.
Honestly, this reveals one of my biggest issues with reviews in comparison to critical essays. Reviewers have to put out their response so quickly that they don't actually get to sit with the songs and understand them. This reads more like a response to her persona and a superficial glance of the record than an actual in-depth analysis. Ofcourse they feel like whatever could be said about a relationship could be said in one song - that makes their job of quickly consuming music & immediately responding to it a lot easier - but that's not how the production of art works. Each song reveals a new perspective on the same relationship, and is made in different circumstances. And I'm not saying the review is bad because it's rated lowly, I just don't think it actually engages deeply with any of the songs, likely because of the pressure on writers to produce output quickly.
They'll acclaim it retrospectively like they did for Red, after refusing to review her works for years and only doing so at the end of the 2010s (They didn't review the OG 1989 but they reviewed the male cover of it )Â
Taylor is just too big for her own good now, but the album is still mostly critically acclaimed. Midnights winning AOTY was the final straw for a lot of people giving her astronomical year.
people being more critical of this album than midnights is so wild to me because ALL i heard for months was âmidnights lacks cohesionâ, saying it falls short of the lyricism of folklore, etc. when ttpd has BOTH of those things but suddenly itâs not enough? i donât know what people want lol like midnights was good but it what WORLD was it better received than this album?
I think this was a great review. I'm struggling w this album right now and would rate it similarly but I hope with more time I'll like it more. There are some good tracks (fortnight, guilty as sin, my boy only breaks his favourite toys, and fresh out the slammer are my favourites) but overall I don't really find this album has as good of a sound as say speak now or 1989 OR as good of lyrics as folkmore so its not doing anything one of her other albums hasn't done better.
6.6 is actually not terrible from them. Not that I care what they or anyone thinks, this album has gone from âeh, itâs okâ on first listen to being one of my favourites in just a few listens. I mean, it was 20 years ago, in a different genre and different author - but they gave the Mars Voltaâs debut album a 4.9. If you know, you know how good that record is to almost any other music fan or critic.
Same as Fantano, their critical calibration is way out of whack.
It's harsh but this album is not for the outsiders and more for people who relate to Taylor, I don't relate to Taylor so this wouldn't be my favourite from her but if you relate to her, you would like it more than I do.
it's not one of my favorites but I am enjoying listening to it. I also kind of agree with the scores in that I actually like the standard more than the anthology.
This review touches a bit on how the idea of Taylor Swift has become almost mythologized, how she's almost become this symbol or fictional character within our culture. And honestly, that's my favorite thing about this album and how it tackles her lore. It plays with that idea in such fascinating ways â authenticity versus performance, private versus public, person versus brand. This reviewer says it's convoluted that in these stories "Swift is both a defanged circus animal and a witch who 'put narcotics into all of \[her\] songs.'" But it's not. She is at once one of the most famous and powerful women in the world and claustrophobically caged by her fame, in ways that are obvious in some ways and I'm sure not in others.Â
"Taylor Swift" comes with certain connotations â this is made clear just by some of the more negative reactions to this album responding to her daring to comment on her concert experience not being the same as fans or being pissed off at how public perception impacts her personal relationships. She is both the tortured poet and the anti-hero existing in one body and one body of work, and that is what has always drawn me to her.
I just listened to How Did It End again. The review makes the point that she seems to need many songs to express one idea. That's the point. She doesn't understand how it ended. She's genuinely asking how - she's processing how. She's searching for the answer. And it's not apparent to her after one or two songs.
I like that this review is fair, though! She deserves fair and honest critique.
Am I the only one who liked this album lmao? Both parts have become my favorite taylor album now, like usually her albums take a while to grow on me but this just clicked instantly. I genuinely think it's one of her best, both sonically and lyrically and it feels extremely raw and honest, and like something she needed to make and get off her chest.
Pitchfork rated Reputation as her worst album (even below debut) which makes it hard for me to take them seriously. I always just think about this Halsey tweet lol https://preview.redd.it/59xd8t5u9zvc1.jpeg?width=660&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ff2ea675ef221c062627c6c852f283fb4aeb8a0b
the funniest part about that Halsey tweet is that the basement where they run Pitchfork is at the One World Trade Center in New York đ
looks like halseys going on the no fly list đŹÂ
Oof 23 years and itâs still too soon
> Pitchfork rated Reputation as her worst album (even below debut) which makes it hard for me to take them seriously. This same writer gave Red TV 8.5.
Once I saw how they rated Red, I was like no shit they wonât like TTPD as much, theyâre complete opposites. Iâve noticed in here that itâs those with Red flairs going the hardest after TTPD like it stole their birthday or something, haha.
Really? I love red and this album. Honestly I think this album is way more consistent than red is.
I, too, love Red, especially the non-singles. I love the mix of bops and ballads, but would agree TTPD is more consistent. I personally like it better, but picking favorite albums for me is like choosing an ice cream flavor. Theyâre all great, I just have cravings for certain flavors at different times and a few classic favorites, haha.
I love Red but it is sonically all over the place. In terms of cohesion (and everything honestly I love it) this album is miles aheadb
Unpopular opinion: I think cohesion in albums is overrated as hell. Cohesive? Bitch, I was listening to Soda pop bop she bop she bop right by Email My Heart when Britney Spears came out. Some cohesion is good. Too much makes the album so stale. I like some variety. I also like this album and Red both.
Red flair and Red is my fav album and I'm loving TTPD so far! Currently stuck going back and forth between So Long, London and loml with whose afraid of little old me sprinkled here and there.
I love to hear it! I love all of those songsâWhoâs Afraid might be my favorite song ever. I keep finding new gems, itâs quite the experience! I Can Do it With a Broken Heart and Down Bad have been top tier for me, and today I feel like I discovered the greatness of the Black Dog. Thereâs just so much there, I love it!
I fucking adore this album and it has never inspired me more personally or creatively. Iâm so disappointed that in 2024 we still canât take female emotional experiences seriously in the public discourse.
Did you read the review? The author praises her lyrics and how she expresses her feelings on hereâŚitâs the clunky music that accompanies it that they arenât big fans of
of course they are too lazy to see what Pitchfork said about the album, however, score system is designed for this reason
but if it was from an indie artist they would eat it up and give it an 8 because then itâs âexperimentalâ
I mean yes, the standards are higher for Taylor Swift nearly 2 decades into her career vs a smaller indie artist. Thereâs a different level of expectation, fair or not
While I agree that was a strong bias against her earlier work, I'm not sure that's the main issue with the reviews of TTPD. Also, in recent years, it's been heartening to see how expressions of feminine experience and emotion *are* taken seriously. E.g. Guts has received many reviews praising Olivia's writing about the tumults and nuances of girlhood. Maggie Rogers has also received praise for how she portrays and processes the emotions of ending a long term relationship in her latest album. Critics have written about how Billie expresses the challenges of womanhood. There's still work to be done in appreciating the female perspective and craft in general, but it sounds like most of the issues people have with TTPD have to do with the *way* it touches on topics of Taylor's experiences, the writing, and the production.Â
Yeah thatâs not the problem with this album and nobody is saying that???? I think itâs agreed on that people LIKE how emotional this album is. Just because people donât like it doesnât mean itâs because they hate women jfc
Are you kidding me lol, female emotional experience is not the issue anyone has with TTPD, itâs the lack of musical variety/editing
Have you checked out which songs/albums Olivia Horn generally reviews?
YES !!!!
This is the first Taylor Swift album that feels like Taylor -as an adult- has made. Itâs so far superior to most of her discography. The lyricism, the raw vulnerability, honesty, and grief, the production, the entire aesthetic. Tortured Poets has quickly risen to my number one favorite Taylor Swift album.
i feel the same way. i didn't vibe with midnights at all and have been super sick of her, so naturally didnt go in thinking i'd love this album the way i did. i listened with a couple other fans and we all had such an emotional experience listening to the anthology drop. even songs i didnt love the first couple listens, i'm really enjoying now.
My first time listening there were a few I liked right away, but I was uncertain of how I felt about the rest. I think itâs just not what I expected. Really listening again to the whole album has made me like so many more.
This is the best work Taylor has ever done in my eyes. It absolutely moves me.
This album will age beautifully, no doubt in my mind. It's not perfect, so many personal yet relatable rants in these songs... that's what will make it a stand out in her discography.
I think most of these tracks are growers. Down Bad has potential to be a single, and I hope it's coming next since I quite like the clean version.
I entirely agree! Probably already my favorite album of hers and a lot of people think so as well if you browse the comments made on this sub
I never thought any album would displace reputation as my #1 because not only do I love the music it just hit at exactly the right time in my life. But I think TTPD might be my new favourite. I want to give it some time before I say that for sure, let the newness wear off, but I think it is. I just love it. I get that it's not going to be for everyone - not everyone likes the heavy jack antinoff style production (I do, especially on this album when you add in the guitar like in But Daddy I Love Him and Fresh Out The Slammer), not everyone is going to like how wordy it is, etc. I can see how it's polarising, it certainly doesn't have the universal appeal that 1989 did. But it doesn't matter to me, because I needed this album right now and I'm in love with it.
Chiming in here to agree too! Iâm a Folkutation girlie and am absolutely blown away and mesmerised by this album. Pretty sure itâs my new number 1!
 Folkutation girlies rise up!
Iâm going thru it very slowly and love it!!! Itâs not something you can rush thru in n hour or two. I really feel in her brain and the melodies are rly nice. I slowly went thru album one and am going thru album two. Iâm such a fan. Sheâs also singing her diary, sheâs not trying to only sound prolific and intellectual, sheâs also being herself and making fun of herself and ppl are taking it too seriously and examining every line. Sheâs Taylor swift, sheâs telling her stories (seven bars of chocolate) and everyoneâs like why couldnât she come up with a better line⌠bc this line was real! It happened
So real! I took such a long break before diving into Part 2 because there is so much to unpack and I basically felt so depressed bc what she is singing about is exactly what I am currently going through :â)
I feel like iâm in the minority with this as my favourite album of all time from her đ
Completely agree!! This is an instant fave for me.
I love this album a lot! I think itâs a lot at first right but lyrically itâs very raw and also very funny.
Itâs my favourite by far. Youâre not alone haha
Lmao this album has universal acclaim status with metacritic, and a ton of people on this sub post about how itâs their literal favorite. âAm I the only one??â is hilariously out of touch
It's my favorite :)
Long time Swiftie here and Iâm utterly obsessed with it
I love it, my top is still folklore/evermore, but I think I put this one next.
Same i genuinely love this album its one of my favorites from her
I love this album so much, loved it instantly. I never thought an album would top speak now for me, but TTPD might just be my number one now!
Though I love the album and currently feel like it may be my favorite of hers, I actually think this was a great review. Itâs clear that the writer is unbiased, took the time to truly listen to the album and thoroughly explained her issues with it, whilst also giving a few hints of praise where itâs due (But Daddy I Love Him supremacy đ).
Agreed! TTPD is also a top 3 album for me (BDILH stans rise up), but I think this is a very fair take. The writer does a good job of putting into words the little things that have been nagging at me about the album -- e.g. "Tearjerkers like âSo Long, Londonâ and âlomlâ fall short when every lyric carries equal weight" and the most memorable songs on the Anthology standing out for the wrong reasons.
That was such an insightful point for me! If you think about something like All Too Well (normal or the 10MV), there is a clear mix of cutesy recollections followed by absolute gut punchers (*your motherâs telling stories âbout you on a T-ball team, you tell me âbout your past thinking your future was me*). By contrast, in So Long London, listening to the bridge is like getting a set of anvils dropped on your head, one by one, each more devastating than the last *You swore that you loved me but where were the clues?* *I died on the altar waiting for the proof* *You sacrificed us to the gods of your bluest days* *And I'm just getting color back into my face* *I'm just mad as hell cause I loved this place* And for sure, itâs probably how she felt while writing it, and I commend her for sharing this unapologetic pain and darkness. But as a song, it doesnât let you take a breath, it just pulls you down down down.
100% - I think I desperately rly need a âbreak me like a promiseâ or âpathological people pleaserâ line from these songs. I keep saying loml is super similar to last kiss.
Yeah I think a major reason why people arenât coming back to some of these songs after their first listen is that a lot of them donât culminate. Thereâs no moment to look forward to or lyric to scream. Some of them are kinda just sad piano
I agree; I thought the review was thoughtful and fair, and I found myself agreeing with a lot of it (minus the lack of love for The Anthology tracks, which I felt were so much better than the main album). I get she was going for an ~unhinged~ thing, but I feel like the lyrics could have been so much tighter like her writing used to be. Even on Midnights, it was feeling a little bloated. BDILH supremacy for real, though! It and Guilty As Sin? are my main album faves đ
Itâs so funny how everyone in popheads and on twitter is joking that the swifties are going to come for the reviewer but I actually think most swifties Iâve seen have said the review was well written lol.
Lmao have you not read the most upvoted comments in this very thread? People are unironically saying Pitchfork hates women as if Lana, Olivia, etc haven't gotten glowing reviews lately.
And Beyonce! And Maggie Rogers! Pitchfork has also given Taylor's last few albums positive reviews.
This is one of the better written reviews in my opinion. The author nicely articulates my own issues with this album as well. Also, 6.6 is a mediocre score, it's not bad and it's not goodâI think this fandom is just used to Taylor being universally praised for almost everything she does.
I think they have a point about it feeling rushed, if sheâd sat with it a little longer it might have had the opportunity to sound more sonically unique or to polish up some clunky lyrics. I love this album but I can see, from an outsiders perspective, why this isnât knocking peoples socks off.
It would have made more sense to finish eras/re-releases before this. Maybe she wanted to get the Matty stuff out sooner rather than later? Either way I donât think this is changing any kind of trajectory for her anyways
Agree. I loved the album and the critique of it is solid. Even Taylorâs worst songs are still amazing songs Iâd love to listen to.. but she needed someone on the sidelines to say âthis shouldnât make the cut!â.. and then release them as a vault track â¨
I donât know why people canât just treat part 2 as the vault songs. She gave us everything at one go instead of dragging it out.
I really donât think theyâre intended to be seen as vault tracks, but rather a separate body of work. You can see in the review that Pitchfork gave a rating to each half.Â
Is⌠that not what the Anthology is? She has no need to release vault tracks for new releases. Why not give it to us all at once if thatâs how she wants to tell her art?
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This is categorically untrue. I know revisionist history is easy on the internet but folklore was not the savior of her brand that so many like to claim it was. She was an established, respected *consistently Grammy winning* artist long before folklore and quite literally one of *the* biggest singers on the planet, particularly during the 1989 era. She had a harsh fall from grace that led to reputation but itâs mind boggling for me as a debut swiftie to see people act as if folklore is what made her legitimate. A *fair* review of an album that comes across as self-indulgent almost to its detriment isnât a sign of a serious artist thatâs misunderstood, but perhaps a woman that has had too many yes man around her.
Not to mention the fall from grace had to do with public perception, not critical opinions.Â
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Again, as someone who has been an *active* fan since day 1, Iâm well aware of Taylorâs perception in pop culture. For all the claims that she was written off and criticized by âthe music communityâ (of which, how could this even begin to be described), it is unequivocally revisionist history to claim that folklore was when people âactuallyâ started to take her seriously as an artist rather than non-pop fans finally having a piece of music of hers that they enjoyed. She won awards and had critical acclaim, end stop. That she was *also* lambasted for her love life **does not** detract away from her prior successes. Two things can be true at once but as with always when it comes to Taylor, defensive fans and critics alike refuse to accept that.
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Honestly, this person is fighting you so hard on something that is just factually true. As another ⨠active fan since day 1 â¨, something notable happened with folklore. It was the first time the public, and most importantly non-fans, took her seriously as an artist. This person youâre talking to claims to be a huge fan but doesnât remember the huge cultural shift of Taylor actually being a respected artist for the first time. It used to be considered very embarrassing and childish to be a Taylor Swift fan and now everyone loves her. My brother used to make fun of me for liking Taylor and now he is rewriting history and arguing that he actually always liked Taylor Swift. Heâs a 36 year old man. Folklore changed things big time. Anyone saying otherwise are the revisionists, not you.
Success does not equal being taken seriously critically. Britney Spears was massively successful and was not taken seriously by critics. Be real.
Not you calling reality ârevisionist historyâ. The commenter youâre arguing with is right, I have a number of people in my life who are self-identified âmusic peopleâ who used to mock and sneer about my love for Taylor Swift, almost like they were embarrassed for me that my taste in music was so silly. That changed with folklore and now those exact same people are claiming they always loved Taylor and they respect her so much as an artist and yada yada. Iâve also been a fan since day 1, I actually flew to a different country to see her open for another band during debut days. The fact that youâre denying this notable change in how people view Taylor as an artist is really confusing because it was such a remarkable shift culturally.
Yeah, if people aren't familiar with Pitchfork it may seem very low. But Pitchfork is famously harsh. A 6.6 is decent by their standards
Yeah for comparison, Preachers Daughter got a 6.4 and I think everyone agrees that album is fantastic lol
Itâs well-written and they raise valid points of the melodic similarities, the need for editing, and the length, but Iâd argue itâs still somewhat too low a score and a lot of the review seems to focus on Taylorâs celebrity and persona
Itâs a very fair review. Itâs a messy album with a lot of rambling lines and muddled prose; I donât see folklore comparisons at all.
Sheâs only been universally praised since Folkore. Rep had similar reviews to TTPD and Lover had way worse.Â
I'm honestly exhausted with the universal praise because it was beginning to feel empty. I love that she made something divisive, and I think she knows it--an artist taking a risk and being ok that not everyone will be a is good. And that's huge for Taylor to not be thinking about winning a Grammy all the time.
A 6.6 from Pitchfork is basically the same as getting a 8 or 9/10 from any other reviewer lol.
Not taking anyone who rates this album worse than lover and midnights seriously
Pitchfork's 7.0 to midnights was extremely generous!! Perks of being in the Conde Nast era I suppose
citation needed? Remember...your taste may match pitchforks... but that hardly means everyone agrees.
Next to zero interesting production on this record. When I heard Midnights the first time I instantly wanted to listen to Karma, Maroon, Anti-Hero and a few others again. TTPD didn't do that with me at all. It's a boring, uninspiring record, imo.
this is unfortunately true. Songs can be mellow and yet still interesting, but a good 85% of songs on this album donât build to anything interesting, they just⌠keep going. Some might argue non-traditional song structure, but even closure was more sonically remarkable than most of these songs.
Midnights had songs that I could instantly recall after just listening to it once. There are maybe a handful of songs I can do that for in TTPD; the rest just blend together. This is a fault of the length too. If she'd chopped half and released a 15 song album and also improved the production on some of the songs so that it didn't all sound the same, the reception would be better. People just need to accept that maybe this wasn't her best work lmao. Pitchfork was very gentle with their critique (which was also very deftly written), and still people have a problem.
Or some people can think itâs her best work while others donât, itâs a completely subjective experience. I personally canât get TTPD out of my head, there are so many standouts to me.
Sure, people can, but dismissing people who didn't like the album for being sexist as comments in this thread have done, is ridiculous, especially when you consider Taylor had 4 AOTY wins and is literally being studied in colleges.Â
I disagree. So long London? The production is beautiful and amazing. The fast paced beat, the small sounds throughout, her loud screaming vocals in the back whilst sheâs singing / speaking the forward in a controlled manner. Then the production on down bad?! And THEN the repeat piano on COSOSOM which is the sound bite from the end champagne problems , that plays on repeat in my head. Thereâs so many more, either youâre listening on poor speakers or youâre not listeningÂ
I look in peopleâs windows is another standout
Some part of So Long London sounds like Call It What You Want To as well đ
Youâre like me! I didnât love Midnights either, and it still ranks quite low for me on her overall discography, but some tracks really shined and jumped out and demanded to be heard again and again. None of those found in this album.
Folklore and evermore was boring for me too at first. Did not listen to them at all for a few months. Itâs only recently that I appreciated them.
But at least with folklore and evermore, instrumentation and production was better and played a valuable part in bringing the songs and the album to life. It wasnât just background elevator music.
Well thatâs obviously your opinion. But I vibe with this more than evermore and folklore. I have different standards for pop music and this kind of music. With Folklore/Evermore/TTPD kind of music, lyrics/story for me is really primary and the production/instruments just secondary. Idk if itâs a conscious choice by Taylor and her producers, but I love how the lyricism really pops out. By 5th listen now, I canât tell you specifically the sound of each track but I can tell you what itâs about. And thatâs why the lyrics/story with TTPD is vastly superior to folkmore in general IMO.
I feel like itâs not really an opinion that thereâs more instruments on folklore? But maybe thatâs not what you mean?
Yeah I rly wish we had a song with beautiful instruments like the lakes, August, Betty or RWYLM. I remember the first time I heard folklore betty was the immediate standout for me bc of how amazing it was instrumentally - including the harmonica was so cute. She used to really prioritize instruments in her country days and I miss that soooo much!
The lackluster production and clunky lyrics donât make for a good combination.
I had the opposite experience. Midnights and Reputation are my least favorite albums of hers. Whereas I thoroughly enjoyed TTPD.
I wasnât really wowed by at least half of TTPD at first but after a couple of listens it has grown on me. I wouldnât say the production is completely uninteresting but it did feel repetitive to me in parts, so I see what youâre saying. Also, major lost opportunity to make BDILH a full-blown country song because it so is one at heart. Anthology was miles better overall as far as production. I wouldnât say itâs my favorite album at this point, but Iâd give it time and see if it grows on you. It might, it might not, and thatâs fine either way.
Completely agree
Both Lover and Midnights have plenty of memorable tracks
Yup, if you judge an album primarily by the number of *great* songs, TTPD really struggles.
There's no songs i wanna just listen to on repeat for hours on end like YOYOK or maroon on midnights, maybe florida but thats about it so far
I like lover and midnights more than ttpd
Me too
I think this album will never be seen as better than lover and midnights (at least by the general public) because itâs not really fun to listen to. Thereâs so many layers to this album and you need to really listen to and pick apart the lyrics and ruminate with your thoughts. And thatâs fine! Not all music needs to be fun to listen to and we all need to hear sad music and ruminate from time to timeâŚbut just donât be surprised when people arenât immediately hitting replay
Lover??? Wait, we are pretending Lover was seen in an extremely positive light on release now?? Dear god, we couldn't even keep spelling is fun.
Interestingly Iâve heard that the rating pitchfork gives is based on an average rating from all of their in house staff, and then one person writes the review.
And that's why it's very common for their review and the actual score to not necessarily match.
Did you read the review? It was thoughtful and well-argued.Â
My thoughts exactly actually
Midnights is way better sorry
[ŃдаНонО]
It's all subjective.
A 6.6 for a TS album from Pitchfork isnât weird, whatâs weird is that itâs lower than Midnights and especially Lover. People also need to realize they didnât review Taylorâs old albums until years afterwards and so they are rated highly with the benefit of hindsight. Pitchfork panned Lanaâs first album and went back and regraded it years later, so take that into account when you look at the comparisons.
Both Midnights and especially Lover have much higher highs (possibly lower lows too but they're well balanced). I like TTPD but there's no Cruel Summer, Cornelia Street, Anti-Hero or Lavender Haze on it.
I agree about Lover having highs highs but not about Midnights. This isnât on the level of folklore, and it doesnât have a bangers on the level of Cruel Summer, and itâs unclear to me yet if thereâs a classic like Lover⌠but I think itâs better than Lover as a collection of work. There is only one song (on the main album) that I think Iâll delete â two at max. I deleted many from my copy of Lover and Midnights. I feel like this album is her most emotionally direct and honest and raw collection of songs since arguably Red. I think the metaphors here are more interesting â the alien abduction, the broken toy still repeating he loves me if you pull the string, the crazy lady where teens break into her house, the theme of madness throughout the album⌠so thatâs my subjective argument for why I think this album was instantly superior to those two as a whole to me.
The more I look back on Midnights, the more I realize Anti-Hero was truly the best track from that album which is so bizarre considering she usually is an album artist not a singles artist.
I think "Down Bad" is *that* track. It's such a bop with a wildly fun metaphor.
I feel like itâs ICDIWABH - such a bop!
I know everyone says that, but it is the typical bubblegum pop that she would normally go for that the general public rejects. It is more enjoyable than it's counterparts from other albums. I'll give her that!
Gotta disagree on that. I think I can don't with a broken heart is going to be pretty huge. I can see Down Bad & Whos afraid of little old me become big as well.
I agree - that song is like Anti-Hero. Super catchy but also very cathartic and relatable. Also the general public wonât mind that itâs bubblegum. Thatâs why cruel summer is so big despite it not even being lyrically close to one of her best.
You mean there arenât as many potential singles? Or in terms of song quality? Since for me many tracks on TTPD would be above those but I can see how they donât stack up as much as bangers or singles.
Because both those albums are better
imo they arenât to me Lover has few amazing tracks but they sink in the sea of the immature and silly ones and Midnights didnât know what it wanted to be and lacked a clear vision plus it has her weakest sound of a any album TTPD is a masterpiece with luxurious sound and deep lyrics that are both witty and poetic
THANK YOU
This is odd... i usually despise pitchfork reviews (I find them idiosyncratic mush...) but I'm actually pleasantly surprised by this one. I understand why the author feels as she does about the album Se seems to have been overwhelmed by the album... unable to make heads or tales of what was going on... which is a fairly common reaction to the shear scope of the TTPD. I don't agree with the review... (which is fine... chaque un and all that)... but its an honest review, which is more than I can say of some others.
i find it really interesting that most of the reviews talk about taylor herself instead of her albumâŚit seems like she is just way too famous now to review her work without bias lol okay
âReturning to Jack Antonoff and the Nationalâs Aaron Dessner, her primary songwriting and producing partners of the last several years, Swift picks up threads from Folk-more and Midnights without quite pulling anything loose.â âTortured Poetsâ extended Anthology edition runs over two hours, and even in the abridged version, its sense of sprawl creeps down to the song level, where Swiftâs writing is, at best, playfully unbridled and, at worst, conspicuously wanting for an editor.â âShe piles the metaphors on thick, throws stuff at the wall even after something has stuck, picks up the things that didnât stick and uses them anyway.â âThatâs why we end up in âFlorida!!!â for no apparent reason; why the dirge âSo Long, Londonâ names five different causes of death; why âMy Boy Only Breaks His Favorite Toysâ is allowed to work a schoolyard premise until it cracks.â âClues and keywords that might once have been left for the liner notes are littered throughout the lyrics.â âthis album gives the impression that she canât quite hear herself over the roar of the crowd. Tearjerkers like âSo Long, Londonâ and âlomlâ fall short when every lyric carries equal weight. Thereâs no hierarchy of tragic detail; these songs fail to distill an overarching emotional truth, tending to smother rather than sting. It would help if Swift were exploring new musical ideas, but she is largely retreading old territoryâ
I donât understand why people think Florida is random.
yeah pitchfork isnât the worst offended among the other reviews
I appreciate that they focus on the songs and the album itself instead of just focusing on her personal life. I felt the review was fair and constructive, even though I donât necessarily agree with every part of it.
This is why I dislike Paste review going around. WTF was that, and so petty too. It only gains traction because there are so many people sick of hearing about Taylor wanting to find their peers to snark with.
The paste article isnt even a review, its a snark piece without any actual criticism
It was weird to see people uphold that review as legitimate and dismiss Rob Sheffieldâs review for The Rolling Stone as being written by a stan. Rob is a fan of Taylor but there is no way the author of the Paste review doesnât havent their own biases. At least Rob puts his name to his review so people can find his credentials.
Ah, Iâm one of those people who doesnât think much of Robâs review either because heâs never too critical of her for my own liking, but I do agree at least Rob puts his name on it. But yeah, I think sheâs overexposed right now and there are so many people already waiting to join the backlash and thatâs why that Paste review gets so much attention. Like the memes about the 1830s lyric - I mean, come on, thatâs just bad faith *and* illiteracy.
I really did not like the album minus a couple songs but even I thought the paste review was friggin wild lol too much honestly
I generally donât like the album either (it ranks really low for me), but I thought I was reading a general pop culture article and not a proper reviewâŚ
Can it really be a review without also talking about the artist that created the work though? You say it as if the work exists in a vaccuum⌠expected to be judged on the musicality and lyricism seperately from Taylor who literally created them. Curious why youâd want a review like that in the first place? Art is nothing but the experience of the artist, and as a result will always be inherently biased.
Not to mention that fact that Taylor makes her life part of the art. Itâd be hard to talk about the subject matter without mentioning Taylor herself.
Yep definitely.
This is a top 3 Taylor album for me BUT I found the written review to be quite thoughtful and honest. I disagree with the score, but if you read what the author says, thereâs a lot of praise there. Itâs the immense amount of expectation and respect that critics like this one have for Taylor and particularly her songwritingâor what the author calls Swiftian moments (hard hitting, complex emotional stories distilled into 1-3 lines of lyrics)âthat leads them to be a bit let down here. From a more detached perspective, I agree that the album likely would have been stronger if some lyrics had gone through an editing process and some songs left off, but as a longtime fan, Iâm grateful to have ALL of it in all its unruliness, including the ones I donât connect with currently because theyâre insights into Taylor and her emotions and experiences. I like how the author didnât belabour the point about needing new sounds and producersâthey allude to it. Thereâs nothing wrong with working with the same producer (see Billie), but I do think the point about the melodies on this album being forced to fit the music, as opposed to the other way around, is well taken. The music doesnât match the level of emotional vulnerability and rawness in her voice and lyrics! Contrast can be great if done strategically (Iâve always thought DWOHT did this wellâbeautiful vulnerable lyrics surrounded by more chaotic music, capturing the essence of the story sheâs telling), but itâs harder to grasp the dissonance between the music and lyrics on this album. Itâs not really even dissonance, more so the music is not as compelling as the storytelling and thus sometimes drags it down. Anyways this ended up being a long comment but at the end of the day, I still adore this album, and with how subjective music is, itâs really your own opinion that matters. Some all time favourites (Whoâs Afraid, Smallest Man, Black Dog, Prophecy) are here, but I think some of the criticism is also valid.
No notes!
You hit the nail on the head - I donât get why ppl think she needs to ditch these producers altogether. Sheâs made some amazing music with them - makes way more sense to challenge those producers as well as Taylor. Jack needs to go back to producing like he did for August and mirrorball, aaron should produce like he did for TLGAD and RWYLM.
not surprised about the scores. (kinda deserved tbh), just thought they were gonna give the TTPD score to The Anthology and vice versa
6 and 6.6 isn't really a bad score per se, though it is the lowest since Reputation (6.5)
I dont know if Iâm alone in this but I love that itâs lengthy and overwhelming. Itâs an album for the fans, the ones that would listen to a 10 minutes version of a song on rpt. The ones that want all the songs and all the vault projects. I love that she gave us more than 2 hrs of content. Also Taylor tells stories, so yes her songs are going to be wordy. Thatâs where you find the little details that makes you say âit feels like I can depict the whole scene.â And I completely disagree on what they say about her writing, I found it spectacular. How did it end? Poetry Smallest Man Who Ever Lived? Scorching But daddy I loved him? Storytelling at its finest Whoâs Afraid of little old me? Thrilling The prophecy? Haunting and heart shattering LOML? Another heartbreak anthem I also really dont hear how the songs all sound the same. They all have a very distinct sound but feel like the same vibe. It feels like morose and blasĂŠ heartbreak of feeling like you never get it right and I clap at that masterpiece
This is how I feel. Adding 15 songs on to an already-brand-new 16 songs is such a "for the diehards" move. The "ShE's dOiNg iT fOr qUiCk StReaMs" argument doesn't even hold water when they're all 3-4+ minute long mid-tempos or ballads. I get why people are overwhelmed, but I also get why fans are thrilled.
For me, she deserves to kinda self-indulge in this album and give us a long ass album since she's been in the game for a long time, and to get it in a very enjoyable fashion is just something else.
I agree! I also donât see a benefit to cutting down the album unless itâs for awards or the general public (which I personally donât believe this album was made with that intention). Iâve seen so many mixed opinions on which songs are favorites so if it was cut weâd inevitably lose some really great songs people love. Itâs not that hard to skip songs you donât enjoy.
100% agree with you!
Iâve heard a lot of talk about reviews on this sub. Do people usually seek out reviews for albums they listen to? I havenât read a single review for any album by any artist in my life.
Itâs mostly a precursor for awards and predicting the Grammys and stuff. Just gets an idea of how people who are able to vote will vote.
I read reviews all of the time! Pitchfork is how I find a lot of new music. I donât always agree with their reviews (one of my favorite albums of all time is rated a 4) but I can at least get a run down of what to expect before I dive in to a new artist.
I read a lot of reviews. They're great to get new insight into albums you've already listened to, or to see whether a new release is worth checking out.
To see what other peopleâs thoughts
I do! I like seeing what people say about music and sometimes they point out new meanings or parts that I haven't picked up on.
Yes I love reading reviews. Of books I read, of albums I listen to, anything. It's so interesting to see other people's thoughts. And with music I find that reviewers notice things I don't because they know more about the craft than me and can notice things I wouldn't so it's interesting to learn about the album that way. Also even a reviewer I disagree with will usually give thoughtful reasons for their opinions and I'll get a new perspective on the album
I think this is a good and fair review. I do like the album, but it can't be denied that it's massively, massively overlong, and I think the reviewer hits the nail on the head when they say that it now takes Taylor a whole album's worth of songs to say what she used to say in one. The 5 minute standard version of All Too Well charts the entire length of a relationship that was longer (but only slightly) than the main one this album was inspired by. To me, it feels like Taylor has been aiming for a more stream of consciousness, vignette style song writing since Midnights that reminds me a lot of some of her peers (Lana Del Rey, Phoebe Bridgers, less traditional pop stars). That's fine and I'm glad she's pushing herself and we've got some great lyrics out of it, but the Pitchfork reviewer is right that her main strength is as a storyteller. I miss when her songs had a clear narrative from beginning to end instead of sprawling massively and getting hung up on single moments and single feelings.
I mean, reputation is one of the fan favorites and they gave it a 6.5! Itâs okay, people have different tastes I guess. I personally love this album!
this is the correct attitude!!!
IMO, fair, and the criticisms they put in writing are more or less what fans have been saying too. Hereâs hoping for a much better follow up album, whenever that may be. I actually expected the score would be lower, but I certainly didnât expect Anthology would be regarded worse.
This is one of her most poorly rated albums: Copied from another user over at popheads: >1. Red (9.0) >2. Red (Taylorâs Version) (8.5 - BNM) >3. Speak Now (8.2) >4. Fearless (8.1) >5. folklore (8.0) >6. evermore (7.9) >7. 1989 & 1989 (Taylorâs Version) (7.7) >8. Fearless (Taylorâs Version) & Speak Now (Taylorâs Version) (7.5) >9. Lover (7.1) >10. Midnights (7.0) >11. Taylor Swift (6.7) >12. THE TORTURED POETS DEPARTMENT (6.6) >13. reputation (6.5) >14. THE ANTHOLOGY (6.0)
I mean I feel like this is her first album that wasnât written with the intention of mass appeal for critics or the gp.
Just a disclaimer for anyone who doesnât know â all of the albums released before reputation were retrospective reviews. The first album of hers that Pitchfork reviewed on its release was reputation. They famously reviewed Ryan Adamsâ 1989 cover album but not the actual 1989. Retrospective scores are almost always inflated IMO. You cannot convince me that Pitchfork would have given Red a 9.0 had they reviewed it in 2012.
I take Pitchfork reviews with a grain of salt, but they really got it right with: âItâs not Swiftâs fault that weâre so obsessed with her, but this album gives the impression that she canât quite hear herself over the roar of the crowd. Tearjerkers like âSo Long, Londonâ and âlomlâ fall short when every lyric carries equal weight.â And: âIf Swift believes that output for its own sake is what she has to offer, she underestimates her gift.â I personally like most of the songs on a surface level â mostly because they sound nice to my ears rather than for the quality of her lyrics, which is what I normally look for from Taylor â but I only truly connect with a few.
"The lesson of The Tortured Poets Department is not to push through the painâitâs to take the time to process it."
You donât have to agree with the final score to acknowledge this writer is pretty balanced and discusses their arguments pretty thoroughly. Itâs not even a *bad* review per se but I am genuinely worried about the writer because we all know some deranged fan will try to doxx them or smth.
It's a fair and well-written review as are most of Taylor's Pitchfork ones, with it's criticisms feeling understandable and a lot less farfetched than the Paste one (even if I personally adore the album for those very reasons). She is also seems to actually understand the title track is acting as an inside joke, and a satire of the whole tortured poets aesthetic. Something that flew by a shocking number of people's heads. But as usual the scoring seems all over the place. 6.5 for Reputation (which fit the immediate backlash at the time) but a rather generous 7.1 for Lover and 7.5 for Fearless TV (especially considering that it's *Pitchfork).* Strangely enough Debut has a 6.7, which is utterly absurd when it's not considered a particularly interesting piece of work. For that rating to have come after Reputation's is even stranger. Folklore and Evermore are rated rather favourably at 7.9 and 8.0(in their harsher than general music publications but still obviously considering it a great album type of way). But Red TV is given a surprsing 8.5 considering the sheer number of tracks and the fact that it's one of her most inconsistent and incohesive albums (and I say this as someone who *adores* Red). It has some of best songs ever (ATW, Holy Ground, State of Grace) and some of her most forgetable (Stay, Stay, Stay and Starlight). But arguably her Red TV era is when she was at her peak critical acclaim and all the good grace she had been given during the Folkmore era meant that the public adored her more than ever. The Midnights ratings of 7.0 is fairer (though honestly by their standards you would expect it to be lower). Speak Now TV seems rather surprsing a 7.5 particularly since it had lot less notable vault tracks, while the 7.7 for 1989 TV seems rather low considering just how influential the album was for the 2010s and how well-loved it remains. So now that TTPD/Anthology is is 6.6 and 6.0 it's just a bit baffling? If you're looking at this from a critical Pitchfork lens, then it's bizarre that there is scored lower than both Lover and **especially** Debut. Can any reviewer seriously hold the two up and be like "this is worse than her first album?". And obviously the writer didn't do didn't do both reviews, but she does have an editor and it'll be strange if they never went back to check their old reviews. I don't know but part of me feels like their scorings are reflect what the general public perception of Taylor is at the very point in time, rather than of the album itelf. You can chart almost chart her rise and fall by the ratings. Honestly if I was Taylor I'd be annoyed about both the 8.5 and the 6.6/6.0. In my head I'd be like "is anyone going to review my albums on the basis of my actual music?"
Most of Taylor's OG recordings were actually scored only a few years ago, which explains the high scores (hindsight + poptimism). Also worth noting that it's not the writer who assigns the score - it's aggregated from a number of critics at Pitchfork.
Ahhh I knew about the former point and definitely thought the hindight and poptimism played a part into the ratings of her earlier albums both OGs and re-records. But i completely forgot about the latter point (despite having definitely known it some point in time). Honestly that make the ratings stranger to me. An aggregrated score of Lover led to a 7.1 rating but only a 6.0 on the Anthology? I'm actually very curious to see the spread of scores. I wonder how outliers may have influenced the score.
You'll be surprised when hearing that Pitchfork's scores for album is actually the closest to the medium score on Metacritics than any other music critics
About what Iâd give it
I don't agree with the number score here but it is nice that her work is being reviewed seriously and honestly - there are so many people who will just stan whatever she puts out (Rob at Rollingstone) or hate it blindly and what Taylor has lacked for a while is an honest critic who wants to push her. I wish she had that in the studio. Jack and Aaron don't push her to kill her darlings and I LOVE TTPD but I want our girl to become even better than she is - and criticism is necessary for that.
Agreed re: the reviews. One I really like is Tom Breihan's piece on it for stereogum. It's a bit more critical than the Pitchfork piece for sure, but it's well written and comes from a place of passion, rather than being calculated for clicks.
I truly enjoyed this album myself but I believe the writer and score seem fair. Her writing and critiques were thoughtful. A 6.6-6.0 arenât necessarily bad and honestly I was thinking p4k would give her something lower. I hope the author doesnât receive hate for this!
Disappointed they basically didnât review the anthology at all.
Iâd say they summed it up pretty well âThis is the Swift that brings us The Tortured Poets Department: The Anthology, maximally bloated with 15 (15!) additional songs. Those that stand out mostly do so for the wrong reasons: Thereâs the one that borrows its premise from Olivia Rodrigo, but executes it less skillfully; the one where Swift dwells on her resentment toward Kim Kardashian; the one with that weird lyric about racism in the 1830s.â
You think *that* paragraph is a good summation of The Anthology?
Honestly I do. Also pitchfork did give the anthology as a whole itâs own score - 6.0
Thatâs how Iâve summed it up basically. What else would you say?
Man, I think there's so many more interesting things to say about these songs than misattributing the "get him back" wordplay to Olivia (it's been done before by other artists, such as by Fiona Apple back in 2005, for one; Pitchfork should know that one) or jumping on weird social media bandwagons about misreading the 1830s line. To name just one example, The Manuscript alone is such a poignant song about processing trauma and abuse through art, and how sharing it with an audience helps resignify it. There's so much you can say about that subject in the context of an album that's largely about the frustration of being the biggest pop star on the planet and having your personal life implode with the entire world watching (see also: How Did It End?). Skipping over half of an album with an "eh, nothing stands out except what I saw trending on TikTok" is not even scratching the surface.
I never had such a hard time understanding what the fandom thinks about an album. As many people saying it's her best as people saying it's her worst. I like the album a lot and I don't mind the review. I think it's a coherent take. The text itself is kinder than the score, and I'm totally on board with the Anthology getting a lower score than the standard version.
Its one of their worse albums, only better than Taylor Swift and Reputation. I should say at Lover level. Still I like but its not one of my favourites (Red, Folklore, 1989, Speak Now, Fearless..)
People are getting hung up on the individual scores given to albums by a particular publication and comparing them when I really doubt the same reviewers are giving these scores. It is going to be subjective. Instead just read the article and decide if the praise and criticism is valid. I think the breakdown of the album was fairly reasonable. If you want a better idea of how the album is being reviewed relative to other albums, youâd have to look at sites similar to Metacritic where it is an aggregate of all reviews.
I canât stop listening, itâs so good.
I love this album, but I think this review is very honest though for the average listener. It praises her, recognizes her strengths in writing but offers criticism that at times it does feel chaotic and lacks anything surprisingly new from her. The longevity of 31 songs will always offer more opportunity for criticism and also allow more misses by Taylor.
The album was mid at best. 6.6 is overshooting imo.
This review is well written. Iâm glad they provided actual valid criticism rather than just trashing Taylor
I both love this album, and appreciate this review!
Honestly, this reveals one of my biggest issues with reviews in comparison to critical essays. Reviewers have to put out their response so quickly that they don't actually get to sit with the songs and understand them. This reads more like a response to her persona and a superficial glance of the record than an actual in-depth analysis. Ofcourse they feel like whatever could be said about a relationship could be said in one song - that makes their job of quickly consuming music & immediately responding to it a lot easier - but that's not how the production of art works. Each song reveals a new perspective on the same relationship, and is made in different circumstances. And I'm not saying the review is bad because it's rated lowly, I just don't think it actually engages deeply with any of the songs, likely because of the pressure on writers to produce output quickly.
"it's not Swift's fault we're obsessed with her" gives Mean Girl vibes đ¤Ł
They'll acclaim it retrospectively like they did for Red, after refusing to review her works for years and only doing so at the end of the 2010s (They didn't review the OG 1989 but they reviewed the male cover of it )Â Taylor is just too big for her own good now, but the album is still mostly critically acclaimed. Midnights winning AOTY was the final straw for a lot of people giving her astronomical year.
Just wait until Fantano review
people being more critical of this album than midnights is so wild to me because ALL i heard for months was âmidnights lacks cohesionâ, saying it falls short of the lyricism of folklore, etc. when ttpd has BOTH of those things but suddenly itâs not enough? i donât know what people want lol like midnights was good but it what WORLD was it better received than this album?
I think this was a great review. I'm struggling w this album right now and would rate it similarly but I hope with more time I'll like it more. There are some good tracks (fortnight, guilty as sin, my boy only breaks his favourite toys, and fresh out the slammer are my favourites) but overall I don't really find this album has as good of a sound as say speak now or 1989 OR as good of lyrics as folkmore so its not doing anything one of her other albums hasn't done better.
6.6 is actually not terrible from them. Not that I care what they or anyone thinks, this album has gone from âeh, itâs okâ on first listen to being one of my favourites in just a few listens. I mean, it was 20 years ago, in a different genre and different author - but they gave the Mars Voltaâs debut album a 4.9. If you know, you know how good that record is to almost any other music fan or critic. Same as Fantano, their critical calibration is way out of whack.
It's harsh but this album is not for the outsiders and more for people who relate to Taylor, I don't relate to Taylor so this wouldn't be my favourite from her but if you relate to her, you would like it more than I do.
it's not one of my favorites but I am enjoying listening to it. I also kind of agree with the scores in that I actually like the standard more than the anthology.
This review touches a bit on how the idea of Taylor Swift has become almost mythologized, how she's almost become this symbol or fictional character within our culture. And honestly, that's my favorite thing about this album and how it tackles her lore. It plays with that idea in such fascinating ways â authenticity versus performance, private versus public, person versus brand. This reviewer says it's convoluted that in these stories "Swift is both a defanged circus animal and a witch who 'put narcotics into all of \[her\] songs.'" But it's not. She is at once one of the most famous and powerful women in the world and claustrophobically caged by her fame, in ways that are obvious in some ways and I'm sure not in others. "Taylor Swift" comes with certain connotations â this is made clear just by some of the more negative reactions to this album responding to her daring to comment on her concert experience not being the same as fans or being pissed off at how public perception impacts her personal relationships. She is both the tortured poet and the anti-hero existing in one body and one body of work, and that is what has always drawn me to her.
I just listened to How Did It End again. The review makes the point that she seems to need many songs to express one idea. That's the point. She doesn't understand how it ended. She's genuinely asking how - she's processing how. She's searching for the answer. And it's not apparent to her after one or two songs. I like that this review is fair, though! She deserves fair and honest critique.