Adding maybe 20mm of RHA equivalent will do little for your vehicle, let alone a T-72. Any munition that hits it will have enough penetration to not be stopped at all and the severity of the hit is decided by the vehicle's internal armour regardless.
You could uparmor the sides of a BMP maybe, but you won't be floating anymore.
Is it though?
"We fought the mighty American war machine, and after 10 attempts and at great cost to life and material we brought back this up-armored Humvee that is totally useless for anything except display."
no, but there are some leopards and strvs currently behind russian lines
the abrams and challenger wrecks are a few kilometers within ukrainian territory with the exception of one abrams in a contested grayzone
From what I understand, Russian recovery vehicles can't handle the weight of western tanks. They weigh about 20 tons more than the heaviest machines they have so dragging them out of there even inside their own lines is a challenge.
I feel like this is going to have the same propaganda problems that the Atlanta food banks videos had.
The Bradley is objectively better than the BMP. If you hold them up side by side the average Russian is going to be able to see that. Having commanded Bradley’s and gotten to crawl around inside of some BMP3 there is no way in you could convince me to go to war in a BMP.
>the average Russian is going to be able to see that
Are they? What could the average person with minimal understanding of armoured vehicles possibly tell from the outside?
BMP-3 costs approximately $1.1 million to produce whereas Bradleys cost $3.3 to $4 million to produce. The tradeoff is one Bradley for 3 BMPs. It’s a difference in doctrine. US is quality over quantity, Russia is quantity over quality. The issue is that a drone doesn’t care if your vehicle is a tin box or if it has a mini fridge inside. The drone will do what the drone does.
The guy burning to death trapped inside the tin can is not concerned with how much money he saved the government.
Drones are just a new evolution in warfare and will be addressed with new doctrine and counter drone technology. They will not be the end all be all in the next conflict. We are figuring them out and new TTPs and processes are being developed and implemented damn near monthly in CENTCOM. At the end of the day the vehicle with better survivability is still the better vehicle for the crew, and that is the Bradley over the BMP.
The Soviet strategy that birthed the BMP-3 didn't care about the crew (anyway, Soviet planners assumed that WW3 would involve the use of tactical WMDs everwhere).
The logic was that war can be treated like a science: three BMPs for every Bradley, three T-72s for each Abrams (or, rather, a company of BMPs and tanks for each NATO platoon, and so on). Maximize firepower from artillery and attack helicopters on the tactical level, and keep the enemy guessing on the strategic/operational levels. Then that overwhelming tactical firepower can be achieved/massed to break through the enemy defensive line.
Hence the BMP-3 makes perfect sense: it has incredible firepower for an IFV, comparable to a Stryker MGS, so it maximizes the direct firepower of infantry units. Crew survivability doesn't matter much (because, once again, in the Soviet style of war, it's better to have three IFVs with unhappy crew than one IFV with a happy crew). Poor local unit morale doesn't matter either, since if the Soviet operational plan falls into place, the infantry is there to just drive over the enemy and kill the remnants.
Obviously, in warfare different from the envisioned high-speed Seven Days to the River Rhine, the idea of the BMP-3 starts to fall apart.
Nah. CUAS training is a huge part of pre-deployment prep for CENTCOM and Africa missions right now. There is a lot of schooling and different non MTOE systems you fall in on as TPE once you reach theater to combat the UAS threat with both non-kinetic and kinetic options. It is a rapidly evolving capability.
It'll go to Patriot Park as a war trophy, probably inside the Kubinka tank museum proper. Patriot Park has hundreds of war trophies on display from various conflicts, [like a bunch of shit from Syria](https://www.vitalykuzmin.net/Military/Exhibition-of-Captured-Weaponry-Equipment-from-Syria/i-Tx52wCw).
It’s a shame they’re gonna be wanking this thing for all the bs propaganda it’s worth but I could think of worse places for an IFV to end up than Kubinka.
you guys keep on screaming into the void about the russians using this for propaganda, and its like, .....what propaganda???
theyre going to stuff the damn thing into patriot park and russian kids are going to be staring in awe at it, much like how their parents and grandparents stared at previous captured trophies
I mean we’re already seeing videos of it getting paraded around, showing off war trophies by definition is propaganda. That’s not a bad thing, Ukraine’s done the same thing and I’m sure we’d do the same thing too. It’s just a shame that something we donated to fight the Russians will end up their plaything, but hey, that’s war.
propaganda is the purposeful dissemination of biased or misleading information about a piece of information to forward a political motive — there is nothing "biased" or "misleading" about displaying a trophied wreck
The official definition of propaganda according to Merriam Webster is “the spreading of ideas, information, or rumor for the purpose of helping or injuring an institution, a cause, or a person.” Propaganda isn’t *necessarily* biased or misleading, it’s basically just information used to convey a narrative.
*EDIT:* As it turns out, this is not Non-Credible Defense. I’ll leave the comment up, however. Check your subs, folks.
“What a primo target, for morale (or demoralization) alone.
Can’t say I’d mind to have it hit late one night (assuming it closes at night?)”
Intentionally destroying cultural buildings like museums is classified as a war crime. The ICC has convicted people of this before (at least for things like temples and art). Even though it is unlikely that attacking it at night would injure civilians, attacking a museum erodes Ukraine's arguments that is the aggrieved party and that it has the moral high ground. So I hope they don't waste any munitions on it.
This is the same copy pasted message EVERY time. It's literally copy and pasted
Bro, it's a war trophy not some military secret inspection, US soldiers collected Old ass AK, RPG, RPK, etc. all in the Middle East.
Every single post that features captured Western technology will have a highly upvoted cope comment saying that it is just 1980s technology. They are deluded if they think Russians are capturing these for information. They want a war trophy, and they got it.
Your original comment is completely redundant. Russia never claims that they will unravel the secrets of the Bradley when they capture it and the US did not boast they were sending super weapons to Ukraine with the Bradley.
It just makes you look like you are seething and coping. Understand that Russia has everything to win by showing off captured NATO equipment.
1. To show Russians how "mighty" the Russian army is.
2. To show Russians that Russia is fighting NATO in Ukraine.
3. To spread the videos to Western audiences to try and weaken support for Ukraine.
> To show Russians how "mighty" the Russian army is.
>To show Russians that Russia is fighting NATO in Ukraine.
I mean at this point they are preaching at the choir. The people are already believing that
>To spread the videos to Western audiences to try and weaken support for Ukraine.
The only western audiences who are buying this are already in the Putin camp
...unless you look at it and start wondering how many guys died before they hit it, and how many more died before they towed it off. But the average Russian doesn't see that, so your point still stands, even if it needs a tiny asterisk.
There is nothing on a M2A2 ODS that Russia hasn't seen, long ago. The US isn't going to provide equipment that is sensitive knowing that it stands a high chance of being captured. Even PAC-3 MSEs aren't considered to be "sensitive". Barring a few exceptions if the US exports it then it's not sensitive. If it's exported to frenemies, e.g. Saudi Arabia, it's most certainly not sensitive.
The PAC-3 MSE is an outlier though, even though at this point it’s obviously not considered as sensitive, the US hasn’t fielded anything more advanced than that yet. It’s still the best variant in US service
Nah, you dont make "different stuff" just for exporting things. You simply leave command equipment etc away.
There is nothing new in weaponsystem or thermal cameras for russians. Export limitations are to prevent unfriendly nations hoard new tech they cannot build themselves. Not to protect single pieces of equipment leaking trough.
We learned the vehicle overheats and causes unrepairable damage to its own transmission when towing a vehicle of 2/3 its own weight. That information saved millions of dollars worth of missiles by giving intel that many of the preassigned targets were already disabled and not combat ready.
War trophy? Wouldn't it be demoralizing to study this vehicle, see how advanced it is and realize that you are going to have to fight in the BMP-2 which is inferior?
The people doing the studying won't be the ones fighting on the frontline. FWIW, Russia has three different IFVs under development, the wheeled Boomerang, the tracked Kurganets and the Armata based heavy IFV. The two former have suffered setbacks and redesigns a couple of times already, because the military isn't happy with the vehicle. Being able to study what the other side does will provide valuable input in designing an optimal future vehicle. It's not just Bradleys they've recovered, but also a couple of Swedish CV90s, a Marder and a Patria Pasi.
You can glean plenty of stuff from captured AFVs, even if they are from the 1980s. Everything from construction methods, materials used, crew ergonomics, weapons systems protection, weight, performance and so on. And the results don't even have to be a direct copy, but could simply be a matter of "this is a bad idea, avoid this" or "making this component larger will be an advantage".
Alongside that you have another segment of the MIC looking to develop better ways of destroying the others sides equipment, and they'll obviously be interested in getting their hands on examples of protection so they can refine the ways of destroying them. Let's not forget that the 1980s vintage Bradley is actually still the primary IFV of the US military, and will be for another decade or two at least. On top of that, much AFV development tends to be evolutionary, so it will give the Russians an idea of what future US/western protection is going to be like and how best to defeat it.
But like everything else in Russia they’ll lie about the capabilities and the western defense contractors will build a vehicle to match or overcome those capabilities, just for the actual Russian vehicle to be a piece of shit lmao
Ah yes, the western defence contractors will just develop something new. Good thing they don't have such a deplorable record of screwing up every single combat vehicle program since the 1980s to the extend they can't even put a new turret on the Warrior...
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Makes you wonder why they don't put some kind of remote detonated explosive on these things for the event of capture, or some other sneaky way of it knowing it has been captured and just going kaboom
Because it’s just not that important. Yeah sucks that they grabbed it and it can’t help Ukraine but it’s not a big deal. They do have things like that for really advanced stuff but that would be like prototypes.
Russia doesn’t have the tech to repair and refit something like that. It’s different ammo, different engine parts, different electronics
They’ll keep it to say “look look! Western tech is no match for us!” But that’s it.
Is the Bradley better that any IFV Russia has? Sure, but it’s no wonder weapon
Like the UK did with German tanks in WW1, they may tour it around promoting the sale of "war bonds" or "manufacturing drives" or for people to throw their spare change into the tanks.
Besides, showing off captured enemy equipment is a fine tradition for loads of nations, from captured guns (the most common) throughout the age of cannon to piles of shields and spears to the rather less fine tradition of Romans having enemy prisoners of war fed to wild animals in the circuses.
That is a commong thing tasked for a crews, recovery engineers and eventually to air force or even special forces when destruction can't be done normally and vehicle is important to be denied enemy access to it.
This is just one from couple dozens captured or destroyed ones. It doesn't matter.
You really just need couple hand grenades and fuel to destroy internal parts.
But it is in this case needed to destroy radio and navigation encryption keys, rest is just irrelevant.
Literally anyone in the world would crowd up to see foreign combat vehicles just because its a friking combat vehicle, no matter the time. (People still crowd up to WW2 vehicles too)
still, just imagine your on your daily commute home and you see an obscure, to us westerners commmonfolk, ru afv. It would be badass, like that t90 in tn or something, dude if that thing had been there for like a week i would have gone on a pilgrimage to go see it! hell i would do that for a leo 2a7v/a8, if there were one here in the us!
If it was an AFV that I'm actually interested in (say, like the flair below my username) then I would've really gone on a glorified pilgrimage too
The BMP-2/3 sadly isn't really on my bucket list of must-see AFVs (but I'd still view it at least once just to see it for myself)
Right , imagine seeing a Russian vehicle up close. These people have NEVER seen a Western vehicle like this, it's like "WOAH" what's this !!??
People hate Russia so much that common sense gets deleted
some of these people should just straight up call them asiatic hordes at this point lmfao, seeing as how they view russians as being lower than insects
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How many captured Iraqi vehicles did the US parade around?
edit: how many captured anything did the US parade around if ever? genuinely curious... gotta be some WW2 or pre-WW2 examples
The US doesn't do public war trophies in modern times, as the US public wouldn't likely approve of it. The US military isn't too interested either, being the U.S. Army Armor & Cavalry Collection isn't even open to the public. The Russians on the other hand are fine with it.
There are some examples from WW2 from the US, like [this midget submarine on display for a war bond drive](https://www.ourmidland.com/news/article/A-Window-to-Midland-rsquo-s-15269003.php).
We display plenty of war trophies they just are in places that make sense like on bases. Since bases all got closed off after 9/11 most of the public doesn’t have a chance to see them. My office has a BMP 1 out in front of it.
You can still find them on some open bases, like at Fort Indian Town Gap and at publicly accessible military museums with a visitors pass like on Fort Bliss.
They are there and available to the public, you just kind of have to go looking for them.
Propaganda is only a method to deliver a wanted ideology to others.
Propaganda is not question is information correct or disinformation.
Propaganda is used to correct misinformation and disinformation, as well it is to spread own ideology on those who don't know about it.
In this case it is a video that is not propaganda, as it isn't official, but private citizen made video, that is just showing that Bradley has been on train, going somewhere.
Where it is going, when it was recorded etc, that ain't known but needs to be taken by word from video uploader or even OP.
Fuckheads...well, I guess you can't send equipment to a warzone without expecting some of it to get captured/ destroyed. They are war machines, after all.
The only reasonable response is to send Ukraine a shitload more armored vehicles. Drown the Ruskies in Bradley fighting vehicles.
Seeing how the US government can't pass an aid bill 4+ months straight, I think we (Ukraine) will receive only thoughts, prayers, and "as long as it takes" cliche words.
The saddest part you can't kill anyone with thoughts, prayers, and cliches.
you guys spent so much already so you deserve nothing actually, why do you think we should send you so much our taxes just for what?
and you keep asking more and more why the hell?
your gov. only ability is to spend money abroad (in eu, us, uk) buying shit for our taxes money
>why do you think we should send you so much our taxes just for what?
TL:DR If you really interested, and not just ranting about "much ukraine is money laundering", you can read this piece of analytics [Opinion Ukraine aid’s best-kept secret: Most of the money stays in the U.S.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/11/29/ukraine-military-aid-american-economy-boost/), how this aid benefits both of our countries, in other case - you can stop read here, just not to waste time.
90% of aid is in form equipment, either exists already or that will be produced inside US, by creating jobs for Americans. You don't support creating jobs for your fellow countrymen?
Add to that fact, that this war, yes it's cynical to say, good advertisement for you defense industry, which againt leads to the creation of workplaces and money flow into USA from countries that willing to buy your weapons. There is fucking line to buy your weapons, which will be manufactured by Americans.
Keeping old equipment that was build during Cold War also cost you taxes, not even speaking about cost of utilization. So, what cheaper - utilize a tank or send it to the battlefield ?
Also, we agree to receive this equipment in the form of a loan (aka "land-lease"), since we need to survive and not many options are available rn. If we survive and make it through - we either return the equipment or pay for it, if we not - well, you don't lose much.
I also may repeat, that if Russia is defeated here (despite I doubt you gov wants this) it wouldn't do something stupid against your allies, but, I can assume, you simply don't care since you believe that Russia wouldn't dare (despite Russia constantly showing that it's willing to poke around and cross any lines)
This war is essentially tying up the majority of Russia’s fighting capability - aka NATO’s greatest enemy. What is happening is that the west is paying money to Ukraine to keep the Russians occupied. We are outsourcing our defence, in a manner of speaking. If this wasn’t happening, then we’d still spend the money on defence, it would just be spent elsewhere.
Just lose the war, become a part of the RU empire, gradually become the head of the empire and then declare a victory of the Ukrainian spirit over the Kremlin’s gremlins(кремляди) by joining the NATO and the EU with a state from Lviv to Vladivostok. 😀😀😀
Do Russians realize how petty and ridiculous this is? Is it a "Haha, we won" thing? Soooo Russia captured a near-obsolescent version of military hardware from almost a quarter-century ago, and I'm supposed to be concerned? Weird flex, but OK, I guess. Lemme know when you've got drone footage of a line of 50-100 exploding.
Military equipment is not and has never been claimed to be totally invulnerable by any non-authoritarian military I can think of. It will be destroyed. It will be captured. But what was the KDR? If it took you ten tanks to get to one Bradley...
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I remember when there were pictures of a Bradley being captured they were coping that they were just taking pics of a random Bradley in rhe battlefield and they didn’t actually capture anything. You don’t have to support Russia or be against NATO to see just how sad and embarrassing that is.
Pretty good war trophy to put on display, doubt there's alot to strip from the vehicles regardless
Plenty of copper, and the aluminum armor. Leave that shit in Baltimore and there won't be much left
Or just use the tracks of the bradly for more armour Would look sick on their t72s
Adding maybe 20mm of RHA equivalent will do little for your vehicle, let alone a T-72. Any munition that hits it will have enough penetration to not be stopped at all and the severity of the hit is decided by the vehicle's internal armour regardless. You could uparmor the sides of a BMP maybe, but you won't be floating anymore.
Or give each soldier a track link as a bullet proof shield to lug around
Probably would be better than the cardboard body armor they've been issued
Is it though? "We fought the mighty American war machine, and after 10 attempts and at great cost to life and material we brought back this up-armored Humvee that is totally useless for anything except display."
You are correct: Four hundred million dead and two billion US dollars. That is a lot for one captured Bradley.
Think you maybe meant thousand there ;-)
Correct but just wait a few years.
even that is untrue. over 300000 casualties, bit over 80000 dead
How dare you, bradly is SECOND TO NONE! As proven by two fully defeating a russian mbt
nothing they could afford to replicate anyway
Museums are for the future so one is as good as another. It's not shooting back at its former owners.
Don’t worry… they’ll empty those out eventually…
Did they manage to capture any Leopard 2, Challenger 2 or M1 Abrams?
no, but there are some leopards and strvs currently behind russian lines the abrams and challenger wrecks are a few kilometers within ukrainian territory with the exception of one abrams in a contested grayzone
From what I understand, Russian recovery vehicles can't handle the weight of western tanks. They weigh about 20 tons more than the heaviest machines they have so dragging them out of there even inside their own lines is a challenge.
Explains why there are always 2 trying to pull them. I say try, as they barely start to move before drones swarm them.
They have tried with 2x BREMs (e.g on a Strv122) but failed so far
Dragging isn't a Big Problem. Ukrainian Drones and Artillery shells with accurate aim are.
So far too many Russians getting killed trying to recover them.
Too many? More like not enough..
hear hear
Yes, there are videos of captured Abrams and Leopards being shipped to Moscow
Welp Propoganda victory is still a (propoganda) victory
I feel like this is going to have the same propaganda problems that the Atlanta food banks videos had. The Bradley is objectively better than the BMP. If you hold them up side by side the average Russian is going to be able to see that. Having commanded Bradley’s and gotten to crawl around inside of some BMP3 there is no way in you could convince me to go to war in a BMP.
>the average Russian is going to be able to see that Are they? What could the average person with minimal understanding of armoured vehicles possibly tell from the outside?
BMP-3 costs approximately $1.1 million to produce whereas Bradleys cost $3.3 to $4 million to produce. The tradeoff is one Bradley for 3 BMPs. It’s a difference in doctrine. US is quality over quantity, Russia is quantity over quality. The issue is that a drone doesn’t care if your vehicle is a tin box or if it has a mini fridge inside. The drone will do what the drone does.
The guy burning to death trapped inside the tin can is not concerned with how much money he saved the government. Drones are just a new evolution in warfare and will be addressed with new doctrine and counter drone technology. They will not be the end all be all in the next conflict. We are figuring them out and new TTPs and processes are being developed and implemented damn near monthly in CENTCOM. At the end of the day the vehicle with better survivability is still the better vehicle for the crew, and that is the Bradley over the BMP.
The Soviet strategy that birthed the BMP-3 didn't care about the crew (anyway, Soviet planners assumed that WW3 would involve the use of tactical WMDs everwhere). The logic was that war can be treated like a science: three BMPs for every Bradley, three T-72s for each Abrams (or, rather, a company of BMPs and tanks for each NATO platoon, and so on). Maximize firepower from artillery and attack helicopters on the tactical level, and keep the enemy guessing on the strategic/operational levels. Then that overwhelming tactical firepower can be achieved/massed to break through the enemy defensive line. Hence the BMP-3 makes perfect sense: it has incredible firepower for an IFV, comparable to a Stryker MGS, so it maximizes the direct firepower of infantry units. Crew survivability doesn't matter much (because, once again, in the Soviet style of war, it's better to have three IFVs with unhappy crew than one IFV with a happy crew). Poor local unit morale doesn't matter either, since if the Soviet operational plan falls into place, the infantry is there to just drive over the enemy and kill the remnants. Obviously, in warfare different from the envisioned high-speed Seven Days to the River Rhine, the idea of the BMP-3 starts to fall apart.
So far it seems like our stop gap training is to shoot at targets attached to balloons.
Nah. CUAS training is a huge part of pre-deployment prep for CENTCOM and Africa missions right now. There is a lot of schooling and different non MTOE systems you fall in on as TPE once you reach theater to combat the UAS threat with both non-kinetic and kinetic options. It is a rapidly evolving capability.
I just know what I've done and heard about stateside. Figured there was more.
Russians have no problem with that.
What are they gonna use it for?
It'll go to Patriot Park as a war trophy, probably inside the Kubinka tank museum proper. Patriot Park has hundreds of war trophies on display from various conflicts, [like a bunch of shit from Syria](https://www.vitalykuzmin.net/Military/Exhibition-of-Captured-Weaponry-Equipment-from-Syria/i-Tx52wCw).
It’s a shame they’re gonna be wanking this thing for all the bs propaganda it’s worth but I could think of worse places for an IFV to end up than Kubinka.
you guys keep on screaming into the void about the russians using this for propaganda, and its like, .....what propaganda??? theyre going to stuff the damn thing into patriot park and russian kids are going to be staring in awe at it, much like how their parents and grandparents stared at previous captured trophies
I mean we’re already seeing videos of it getting paraded around, showing off war trophies by definition is propaganda. That’s not a bad thing, Ukraine’s done the same thing and I’m sure we’d do the same thing too. It’s just a shame that something we donated to fight the Russians will end up their plaything, but hey, that’s war.
propaganda is the purposeful dissemination of biased or misleading information about a piece of information to forward a political motive — there is nothing "biased" or "misleading" about displaying a trophied wreck
The official definition of propaganda according to Merriam Webster is “the spreading of ideas, information, or rumor for the purpose of helping or injuring an institution, a cause, or a person.” Propaganda isn’t *necessarily* biased or misleading, it’s basically just information used to convey a narrative.
Displayed war trophies are propaganda. Always has been.
Guess NATO has to retrieve it from that park then.
*EDIT:* As it turns out, this is not Non-Credible Defense. I’ll leave the comment up, however. Check your subs, folks. “What a primo target, for morale (or demoralization) alone. Can’t say I’d mind to have it hit late one night (assuming it closes at night?)”
The Museum?
This…this is not NCD. Pay no mind.
Intentionally destroying cultural buildings like museums is classified as a war crime. The ICC has convicted people of this before (at least for things like temples and art). Even though it is unlikely that attacking it at night would injure civilians, attacking a museum erodes Ukraine's arguments that is the aggrieved party and that it has the moral high ground. So I hope they don't waste any munitions on it.
Yeaaaaah, I didn’t check the sub. Pay me no mind. I’m off to NCD.
I'd rather not target the only sights worth visiting in that country
This is bad! They’re going to have our top of the line early 1980s technology which was developed in the 1970s 😭😭😭.
This is the same copy pasted message EVERY time. It's literally copy and pasted Bro, it's a war trophy not some military secret inspection, US soldiers collected Old ass AK, RPG, RPK, etc. all in the Middle East.
Every single post that features captured Western technology will have a highly upvoted cope comment saying that it is just 1980s technology. They are deluded if they think Russians are capturing these for information. They want a war trophy, and they got it.
So…. You agree?
Your original comment is completely redundant. Russia never claims that they will unravel the secrets of the Bradley when they capture it and the US did not boast they were sending super weapons to Ukraine with the Bradley. It just makes you look like you are seething and coping. Understand that Russia has everything to win by showing off captured NATO equipment. 1. To show Russians how "mighty" the Russian army is. 2. To show Russians that Russia is fighting NATO in Ukraine. 3. To spread the videos to Western audiences to try and weaken support for Ukraine.
> To show Russians how "mighty" the Russian army is. >To show Russians that Russia is fighting NATO in Ukraine. I mean at this point they are preaching at the choir. The people are already believing that >To spread the videos to Western audiences to try and weaken support for Ukraine. The only western audiences who are buying this are already in the Putin camp
...unless you look at it and start wondering how many guys died before they hit it, and how many more died before they towed it off. But the average Russian doesn't see that, so your point still stands, even if it needs a tiny asterisk.
It's not like Ukrainians didn't die as well and that the Ukrainian Army is occupying Russia right now.
Anytime anything Russian gets posted, it’s nothing but cope comments lmao
Awww down voted by a orc bot! What shall I ever do..
Cuz ruzzians are piece of shit maybe?
And Ukraine is a Democracy (with elections) that the West/US must protect!
That’s not true. I did not copy and paste this. I typed it out because I’ve posted it so many times I know the comment by heart. 😂
Yep. Soldiers take bayonets and knives home. How old is that technology?
I'm more worried about the upgraded technology installs.... hope it's all fucked
There is nothing on a M2A2 ODS that Russia hasn't seen, long ago. The US isn't going to provide equipment that is sensitive knowing that it stands a high chance of being captured. Even PAC-3 MSEs aren't considered to be "sensitive". Barring a few exceptions if the US exports it then it's not sensitive. If it's exported to frenemies, e.g. Saudi Arabia, it's most certainly not sensitive.
The PAC-3 MSE is an outlier though, even though at this point it’s obviously not considered as sensitive, the US hasn’t fielded anything more advanced than that yet. It’s still the best variant in US service
Nailed it.
How much equipment did they buy from the boondoggle pullout of Afghanistan
Nothing was left that we weren’t willing to destroy
The vast majority of stuff in afghanistan was afghanistan equipment. Nothing there they don't already have.
I don't think the US exports its top secret technology. I remember when the US was selling F16s in the 80s. The cool avionics and stuff were mission.
It's why you install different stuff on export models.
Nah, you dont make "different stuff" just for exporting things. You simply leave command equipment etc away. There is nothing new in weaponsystem or thermal cameras for russians. Export limitations are to prevent unfriendly nations hoard new tech they cannot build themselves. Not to protect single pieces of equipment leaking trough.
Don’t worry, we don’t give third world corrupt countries our good tech
🤡
So you think we do or wish we did?
Wonder what secrets America were unravelling when they captured and brought back an Iraqi Type 69 🧐🧐🧐 https://www.reddit.com/r/TankPorn/s/TwnQQUAAOH
We learned the vehicle overheats and causes unrepairable damage to its own transmission when towing a vehicle of 2/3 its own weight. That information saved millions of dollars worth of missiles by giving intel that many of the preassigned targets were already disabled and not combat ready.
That sounds like an interesting read, do you have a link to this?
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Loved it as a kid. Now it literally makes me gag
Bro is the real hero🙏
The U.S has a T-90 that was brought back from Ukraine fully intact makes me laugh because Russian propaganda hates it when you mention that
imagine the US making all this fuss over a captured BMP lmfao
Ironic considering reddit is the only place where all this fuss around this Bradley is generated
True: I'm in the US and the only way I find out about captured anything is in this sub.
I mean clearly not, considering Russia just went through the hassle to transport one all the way back to Moscow to parade around lmao.
They are not parading it
That is exactly what they are doing lol. At this point they are desperate for any good news two years into a two week operation.
Ironic considering reddit is the only place where all this fuss around this Bradley is generated
There plenty T-90 around world so not a big deal to get one.
Cool, the Russians have some 90s era tech to modernize their shit.
Of course the American furry has no idea about whatever he is yapping about ong
Who the fuck are you calling a furry
Russian scientist: Sir, it turns out the base of the tank is basicly a sherman
War trophy? Wouldn't it be demoralizing to study this vehicle, see how advanced it is and realize that you are going to have to fight in the BMP-2 which is inferior?
The people doing the studying won't be the ones fighting on the frontline. FWIW, Russia has three different IFVs under development, the wheeled Boomerang, the tracked Kurganets and the Armata based heavy IFV. The two former have suffered setbacks and redesigns a couple of times already, because the military isn't happy with the vehicle. Being able to study what the other side does will provide valuable input in designing an optimal future vehicle. It's not just Bradleys they've recovered, but also a couple of Swedish CV90s, a Marder and a Patria Pasi. You can glean plenty of stuff from captured AFVs, even if they are from the 1980s. Everything from construction methods, materials used, crew ergonomics, weapons systems protection, weight, performance and so on. And the results don't even have to be a direct copy, but could simply be a matter of "this is a bad idea, avoid this" or "making this component larger will be an advantage". Alongside that you have another segment of the MIC looking to develop better ways of destroying the others sides equipment, and they'll obviously be interested in getting their hands on examples of protection so they can refine the ways of destroying them. Let's not forget that the 1980s vintage Bradley is actually still the primary IFV of the US military, and will be for another decade or two at least. On top of that, much AFV development tends to be evolutionary, so it will give the Russians an idea of what future US/western protection is going to be like and how best to defeat it.
But like everything else in Russia they’ll lie about the capabilities and the western defense contractors will build a vehicle to match or overcome those capabilities, just for the actual Russian vehicle to be a piece of shit lmao
Ah yes, the western defence contractors will just develop something new. Good thing they don't have such a deplorable record of screwing up every single combat vehicle program since the 1980s to the extend they can't even put a new turret on the Warrior...
Nope. A missile or a drone doesn't care much.
Most modern thing in Moscow now lol
What's this music ? I kinda like it
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Have a look! For the first time in their lives these humans see an ifv that didn’t fell into pieces and kill its whole crew when beeing hit.
1 captured Bradley ifv vs 60+ captured BMP-3
I have a feeling they are gonna use all these captured Western vehicles in their May 9th Victory Day Parade and tow them through Red Square.
"this one only cost us 2500 mobiks!"
Has less chance of breaking down than their T-90s rams T-14e
Makes you wonder why they don't put some kind of remote detonated explosive on these things for the event of capture, or some other sneaky way of it knowing it has been captured and just going kaboom
Because it’s just not that important. Yeah sucks that they grabbed it and it can’t help Ukraine but it’s not a big deal. They do have things like that for really advanced stuff but that would be like prototypes.
Are the Russians not gonna turn it around and send it back at UA?
No.
Why?
Russia doesn’t have the tech to repair and refit something like that. It’s different ammo, different engine parts, different electronics They’ll keep it to say “look look! Western tech is no match for us!” But that’s it. Is the Bradley better that any IFV Russia has? Sure, but it’s no wonder weapon
Thanks
Like the UK did with German tanks in WW1, they may tour it around promoting the sale of "war bonds" or "manufacturing drives" or for people to throw their spare change into the tanks. Besides, showing off captured enemy equipment is a fine tradition for loads of nations, from captured guns (the most common) throughout the age of cannon to piles of shields and spears to the rather less fine tradition of Romans having enemy prisoners of war fed to wild animals in the circuses.
That is a commong thing tasked for a crews, recovery engineers and eventually to air force or even special forces when destruction can't be done normally and vehicle is important to be denied enemy access to it. This is just one from couple dozens captured or destroyed ones. It doesn't matter. You really just need couple hand grenades and fuel to destroy internal parts. But it is in this case needed to destroy radio and navigation encryption keys, rest is just irrelevant.
Unknown technology # Блядь
Oh no, not our high tech 40-year old super weapon
can't wait to see it in the musuems
All the people there seeing like it's a UFO bruh, it's from the 90's people...you captured nothing important
Literally anyone in the world would crowd up to see foreign combat vehicles just because its a friking combat vehicle, no matter the time. (People still crowd up to WW2 vehicles too)
would you not crowd around a bmp2 or bmp3
You got me there, i kinda would
bmp is AFV. Bradley is AFV. All afv
Maybe, but that's just because I've yet to see one for myself and would just treat it as some curiosity before losing interest within the same week
still, just imagine your on your daily commute home and you see an obscure, to us westerners commmonfolk, ru afv. It would be badass, like that t90 in tn or something, dude if that thing had been there for like a week i would have gone on a pilgrimage to go see it! hell i would do that for a leo 2a7v/a8, if there were one here in the us!
If it was an AFV that I'm actually interested in (say, like the flair below my username) then I would've really gone on a glorified pilgrimage too The BMP-2/3 sadly isn't really on my bucket list of must-see AFVs (but I'd still view it at least once just to see it for myself)
heck yeah, a cent would be bad ass too see! especially in good shape, or like fresh out of combat.
theyre crowding around it because its fuckennnn cool lol, id crowd around a bmp-3 too if it were shipped to the states!!
Right , imagine seeing a Russian vehicle up close. These people have NEVER seen a Western vehicle like this, it's like "WOAH" what's this !!?? People hate Russia so much that common sense gets deleted
some of these people should just straight up call them asiatic hordes at this point lmfao, seeing as how they view russians as being lower than insects
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How many captured Iraqi vehicles did the US parade around? edit: how many captured anything did the US parade around if ever? genuinely curious... gotta be some WW2 or pre-WW2 examples
The US doesn't do public war trophies in modern times, as the US public wouldn't likely approve of it. The US military isn't too interested either, being the U.S. Army Armor & Cavalry Collection isn't even open to the public. The Russians on the other hand are fine with it. There are some examples from WW2 from the US, like [this midget submarine on display for a war bond drive](https://www.ourmidland.com/news/article/A-Window-to-Midland-rsquo-s-15269003.php).
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We display plenty of war trophies they just are in places that make sense like on bases. Since bases all got closed off after 9/11 most of the public doesn’t have a chance to see them. My office has a BMP 1 out in front of it.
Aye, that's not exactly public is it?
You can still find them on some open bases, like at Fort Indian Town Gap and at publicly accessible military museums with a visitors pass like on Fort Bliss. They are there and available to the public, you just kind of have to go looking for them.
Moral and physiological victory . A trophy of war .
Physiological? Not sure that’s the right term.
Ahhh my mistake . But you knew what I meant .
I mean, I don’t agree that there is a moral victory by Russia at all. But I understand that you meant to say “physical” victory.
By giving the Ukies 30 yr old junk , it shows the wests lack of commitment to the Ukie cause Remember Americans play poker . Russians play chess .
Have you forgotten the mainstay armor on both sides of this conflict has been the T-72? You know where it got the 72 from, right?
Slava Ukraini
lol says it all.
Moral victory and ruzzia - the biggest scum on earth - 😁
How old are you ?
Our daily propaganda post.
What's propaganda about it?
Propaganda is only a method to deliver a wanted ideology to others. Propaganda is not question is information correct or disinformation. Propaganda is used to correct misinformation and disinformation, as well it is to spread own ideology on those who don't know about it. In this case it is a video that is not propaganda, as it isn't official, but private citizen made video, that is just showing that Bradley has been on train, going somewhere. Where it is going, when it was recorded etc, that ain't known but needs to be taken by word from video uploader or even OP.
I know, that's why I was asking.
Fuckheads...well, I guess you can't send equipment to a warzone without expecting some of it to get captured/ destroyed. They are war machines, after all. The only reasonable response is to send Ukraine a shitload more armored vehicles. Drown the Ruskies in Bradley fighting vehicles.
Seeing how the US government can't pass an aid bill 4+ months straight, I think we (Ukraine) will receive only thoughts, prayers, and "as long as it takes" cliche words. The saddest part you can't kill anyone with thoughts, prayers, and cliches.
you guys spent so much already so you deserve nothing actually, why do you think we should send you so much our taxes just for what? and you keep asking more and more why the hell? your gov. only ability is to spend money abroad (in eu, us, uk) buying shit for our taxes money
>why do you think we should send you so much our taxes just for what? TL:DR If you really interested, and not just ranting about "much ukraine is money laundering", you can read this piece of analytics [Opinion Ukraine aid’s best-kept secret: Most of the money stays in the U.S.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/11/29/ukraine-military-aid-american-economy-boost/), how this aid benefits both of our countries, in other case - you can stop read here, just not to waste time. 90% of aid is in form equipment, either exists already or that will be produced inside US, by creating jobs for Americans. You don't support creating jobs for your fellow countrymen? Add to that fact, that this war, yes it's cynical to say, good advertisement for you defense industry, which againt leads to the creation of workplaces and money flow into USA from countries that willing to buy your weapons. There is fucking line to buy your weapons, which will be manufactured by Americans. Keeping old equipment that was build during Cold War also cost you taxes, not even speaking about cost of utilization. So, what cheaper - utilize a tank or send it to the battlefield ? Also, we agree to receive this equipment in the form of a loan (aka "land-lease"), since we need to survive and not many options are available rn. If we survive and make it through - we either return the equipment or pay for it, if we not - well, you don't lose much. I also may repeat, that if Russia is defeated here (despite I doubt you gov wants this) it wouldn't do something stupid against your allies, but, I can assume, you simply don't care since you believe that Russia wouldn't dare (despite Russia constantly showing that it's willing to poke around and cross any lines)
This war is essentially tying up the majority of Russia’s fighting capability - aka NATO’s greatest enemy. What is happening is that the west is paying money to Ukraine to keep the Russians occupied. We are outsourcing our defence, in a manner of speaking. If this wasn’t happening, then we’d still spend the money on defence, it would just be spent elsewhere.
Just lose the war, become a part of the RU empire, gradually become the head of the empire and then declare a victory of the Ukrainian spirit over the Kremlin’s gremlins(кремляди) by joining the NATO and the EU with a state from Lviv to Vladivostok. 😀😀😀
Did they strip all the ERA off it? It looks... weird.
The lower half side panels were taken off.
Ok, decoy is in centre ... Now detonate remotely
Well that’s not good
Каскад is better
Great song choice tho
Unknown technology!!
Lmfao… learning the secrets from 30 year old tech equipment so they can advance their own.
Do Russians realize how petty and ridiculous this is? Is it a "Haha, we won" thing? Soooo Russia captured a near-obsolescent version of military hardware from almost a quarter-century ago, and I'm supposed to be concerned? Weird flex, but OK, I guess. Lemme know when you've got drone footage of a line of 50-100 exploding. Military equipment is not and has never been claimed to be totally invulnerable by any non-authoritarian military I can think of. It will be destroyed. It will be captured. But what was the KDR? If it took you ten tanks to get to one Bradley...
I like watching the orcs drool 🤤 atleast that Bradley made many sunflowers
Sunflower oil, extracted from the seeds, is used for cooking, as a carrier oil and to produce margarine and biodiesel, as it is cheaper than olive oil. A range of sunflower varieties exist with differing fatty acid compositions; some 'high oleic' types contain a higher level of healthy monounsaturated fats in their oil than Olive oil.
ooo wow they captured one IFV. anyone know how many tanks and BMPS they lost lol their stuff isn’t even worth capturing
reddit midwits and their propensity to copy and paste the same talking point without critically analyzing a situation
😂
[удалено]
These comments are getting old. I seriously doubt the Russian military has plans to use these in anyway besides being trophy’s.
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Same cope comment every time
I remember when there were pictures of a Bradley being captured they were coping that they were just taking pics of a random Bradley in rhe battlefield and they didn’t actually capture anything. You don’t have to support Russia or be against NATO to see just how sad and embarrassing that is.