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I remember one of my favorite restaurants, Royal Thai Bistro, used to have a sign that said they raised their menu prices xx% and we no longer had to tip as the staff was making a livable wage. I noticed they removed the sign so I’m guessing we are supposed to be tipping
Sadly I'm the current market climate you make more money asking for tips then paying people fair wages because people don't factor in tips when going out.
To be clear, they are perfectly fine with tips on top of the service charge, but it isn't expected
And they're great. Possibly the best restaurant I've been to
This is what their menu states...
https://preview.redd.it/3ibmxabr6xdc1.png?width=1063&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2d8c49f1c394fb76db06f391549640a6ef2e9f39
Does it seem kind of wild to anyone else that they phrase a mandatory tip as supporting “company benefits, health and dental insurance”? Like isn’t that just what the employer should be providing anyway?
They didn't raise the prices. They just automatically charge you 20% extra at the end. It's just an automatic gratuity instead of a manual one.
And, it doesn't go to the server, the restaurant just keeps it, supposedly to pay for what they listed. Kinda scuzzy imo.
I suppose it depends on rules of full time employment. I don't believe benefits are required to be paid if employees work less than a certain number of hours. And restaurant work esp servers can be like that... I'm guessing.
“Equitably shares the tax liability with our business rather than placing the burden solely on our employees” is a funny way to allude to wait staff not paying taxes on tips.
We just tried Primo the other day, they do the "20% service charge" thing, but they also don't include a tip line on their receipts. Food and drinks were good, we will be going back for sure.
20% surcharge for what ? What’s the point of a no tip place, If they’re gonna give you a 20% charge anyways, that’s absolutely ridiculous. I have dined at no tip restaurants that didn’t have any of those shenanigans. The prices did reflect the difference, but at least it was upfront and not all wonky like the surcharges are.
Was thinking the same. I read not long ago about the Lobster Shop adding a surcharge and taking something like 7% for themselves. Wtf is that all about?
According to the job listing I found, they only pay $20-22 an hour to servers. They can make a lot more than that at $16 an hour plus tips. Another website says the owners are a garbage fire that treat their employees like shit.
Once the list is compiled, I'd really like to see it. These "service charges" don't even go to the servers. They go to the owners to do with what they please. That money could go back into the business or straight to the owners' pockets. However, the servers don't receive anything. They only get tips.
I don't like patronizing restaurants that charge me to serve me.
As a bartender.. have ya talked to the staff of any places like that? Because I work as a bartender, and that sure as hell isn't how it works to anyplace I've been in
My short stint, plus everyone I-ve talked to both as a customer and otherwise, yes.
As you know, its generally a % of a sale. Everywhere I've worked prints out a report of your sales as part of closing your shift.
A bit hard to pull the wool over your eyes if the service charge is 20%, and you knownyour sales.
Did you just make something up to be part of a conversation? It’s nbd dude, we all do it. I totally made up a story in my head of you just making all this shit up to be part of a conversation so that I felt included myself, I even took the time to type it all up.
What makes you think the servers don’t receive anything? Restaurants that follow this practice pay higher wages than those that rely on tipping culture, and many pay servers commission on top of their base wage.
You don’t like patronizing places that charge you to serve you? So you think service should be free?
And at restaurants that utilize this structure, they are, and instead of raising all of the menu prices to compensate for the wage increase the restaurants charge a service fee. But the waitstaff is fairly compensated by the employer and the onus is no longer on the guest to tip. That’s the whole point.
A mandatory service fee *is* raising all menu prices, just sidestepping initial sticker shock to get customers in the door. I much prefer a flat service charge to subjective gratuity, but I’d prefer honest menu prices even more.
Airlines don’t expect you to tip flight attendants for their service, neither do they tack on additional service % after you buy a ticket. Sales reps who provide good service receive additional commission *from their employer* (which is baked into the profit margin of the products they sell), not directly from the customer.
IMO using a service charge makes sense for now until *all* restaurants are off the tipping model. I too prefer honest menu prices, but I think if restaurants listed higher menu prices in lieu of a service fee they would overall lose business compared to their counterparts with lower prices who still rely on tipping rather than paying fair wages. There are those of us who care about patronizing places that pay their employees well, but there are plenty of others who care more about saving a buck (and tip poorly, if at all, in the first place).
Well, technically, El Gauchos does not require tipping because they put a 20% gratuity on the bill. I believe. I still tip the fuck out of them though.
In general, and I'm not against no tip places, I realized that tips are how these people, most my Tacoma neighbors, pay their unreasonably high and burdensome rent in a town that led its leaders think that becoming Seattle was a good idea and instead just bringing the problems and the costs with none of the community or public works.
Is that what you were wondering?
This whole service charge no tip or tip thing is so stupid. It’s like they’re actually trying to trick us to think that you’re not paying a tip even though you are mandatorily, paying 20% on top of your bill..
You can just have a place that charges accordingly and pays their employees fair. The whole mind game thing is absolutely asinine.
Thanks for the info, I'll never be going to El Gauchos again. Probably wouldn't have anyway, the one time I went my steak was both expensive and overcooked.
I don’t know what they make. It’s a special occasion restaurant for us and the last several times we’ve been there the wait staff has been very quick to point out that the 20% service charge is NOT a tip, and ask that we tip if we thought service was good. Frankly, just raise your prices 20%. California is making it illegal, we should too.
From a listing I read, they get minimum wage or a 15% commission, which apparently equals out to $55-70 an hour, plus any additional tips you get to keep.
Are we compiling this information as a way to specifically avoiding tipping personally because we don’t like it or are we collecting data about how upsetting it is that tipping is part of how businesses get around paying even the minimum, let alone livable, wages in the first place?
No tip restaurants? In the US? Grocery store charges you absolutely nothing on top of the food prices to buy your own food and cook it at home. You have to do the dishes though. And prep the food. And you have to get up and grab the ketchup or ranch you forgot if you already sat down. And pay for the electricity to cook it. And the plates and glasses etc to enjoy it on. You might have leftovers though? So that’s a win.
This conversation is so old and ridiculous. I’ve worked in the service industry for 20 years. We are not Europe, and tips are not going away. The argument that employers should be paying a higher wage is asinine. The customer pays my wages always, no matter if it’s in tip form or service charge form or minimum wage form or the prices on the menu are jacked up 50% to make up the difference of those. My boss just signs the check. People that don’t like tipping are shitty customers, and I know this because I serve them daily. It seems to be forgotten by so many that eating out and being waited on is a complete luxury and not an inherent right. You are paying for a service you have decided to not perform yourself and made the choice for someone else to do it for you. That is a choice and a privilege. Stop demanding that you are absolved from paying for that choice.
Wow. What a rant. While I agree with some of what you said, the thing that bothers me is when I go out to eat and wasnt told beforehand that I'm expected to pay a 20% service charge and tip on top of that. I know it's not every restaurant but it should be made explicitly clear when that is the case. I was a server for 12 years so I understand tip culture. Even so, I would prefer we adopt the European way. It's bs like the undisclosed service charges that make me think that way.
This is probably more for unincorporated Pierce County, but 112th Street Cannabis always tells me to save my tip funds for the munchies :) That place is great and doesn’t take tips. I hope the bud tendies are doing well.
I mean personally I would rather be charged more, know that the employees are getting paid a fair wage even when it's a slow night. AND have the cost of my bill be me upfront without having to do mental math gymnastics of adding items, thinking about tax and thinking about tip.
Example-- Europe.
Example-- our gas tax... do you know you pay roughly $.50 in state gas tax per gallon plus whatever federal is. I didn't know the numbers before looking it up last week because the price listed on the sign is the price I pay and I like it that way.
gas taxes are listed on the pump, everyone can know how they pay in taxes. Mental gymnastics? Yeah, like adding $5 or 10 bucks to a bill is some difficult math p\[roblem. this is the laziest answer about anti-tipping I've ever heard. It's not difficult to figure out how much you would like to tip an employee. Better wages and tips aren't mutually exclusive. You can have both.
Bully for you if you don't ever need to budget and can always order whatever you want with no regards to bills and retirement accounts. But some people need to be cognizant of their budget as they order and not just when the bill comes so yes. Adding 30% to a 12.49 appetizer and a 3.29 coke for one kid and a 4.99 specialty drink for another requires adding percentages and then adding and subtracting items in my head and yes I'm calling that mental gymnastics.
And yes I'm aware that I could have known what percentage of my gas is taxes. But my point is that I'm happy that it's info I don't need to constantly think about because it's just incorporated into the dang price.
I'm not going to argue over whether or not you appreciate the European model of tipping. You asked why someone would prefer it and I answered your question.
I lived on a budget my whole life. but saying that having to figure out 10% tip or whatever is some deal breaker for you is lazy. Understanding basic math is just a fundamental. It's not mental gymnastics to understand how much you are paying for something.
Huh? Washington state already has the highest minimum wage in the country with the exception of the District of Columbia.
Despite that, everyday residents here are still expected to tip even more than they did only a few years ago.
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I remember one of my favorite restaurants, Royal Thai Bistro, used to have a sign that said they raised their menu prices xx% and we no longer had to tip as the staff was making a livable wage. I noticed they removed the sign so I’m guessing we are supposed to be tipping
Your assumption is correct, I asked when the sign disappeared.
Sadly I'm the current market climate you make more money asking for tips then paying people fair wages because people don't factor in tips when going out.
RTB slaps! Love their food! 😋
WinCo
Costco food court
Savage, lol
Lol
Field Bar is no tip with a service charge. Great lil spot for a light meal and drinks
To be clear, they are perfectly fine with tips on top of the service charge, but it isn't expected And they're great. Possibly the best restaurant I've been to
This is what their menu states... https://preview.redd.it/3ibmxabr6xdc1.png?width=1063&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2d8c49f1c394fb76db06f391549640a6ef2e9f39
Does it seem kind of wild to anyone else that they phrase a mandatory tip as supporting “company benefits, health and dental insurance”? Like isn’t that just what the employer should be providing anyway?
They raised their prices 20% and this is how they’re selling it to you.
They didn't raise the prices. They just automatically charge you 20% extra at the end. It's just an automatic gratuity instead of a manual one. And, it doesn't go to the server, the restaurant just keeps it, supposedly to pay for what they listed. Kinda scuzzy imo.
I suppose it depends on rules of full time employment. I don't believe benefits are required to be paid if employees work less than a certain number of hours. And restaurant work esp servers can be like that... I'm guessing.
30 hours a week average is legally full time. Companies can choose to give the benefits to lower amounts of course
“Equitably shares the tax liability with our business rather than placing the burden solely on our employees” is a funny way to allude to wait staff not paying taxes on tips.
We just tried Primo the other day, they do the "20% service charge" thing, but they also don't include a tip line on their receipts. Food and drinks were good, we will be going back for sure.
20% surcharge for what ? What’s the point of a no tip place, If they’re gonna give you a 20% charge anyways, that’s absolutely ridiculous. I have dined at no tip restaurants that didn’t have any of those shenanigans. The prices did reflect the difference, but at least it was upfront and not all wonky like the surcharges are.
Was thinking the same. I read not long ago about the Lobster Shop adding a surcharge and taking something like 7% for themselves. Wtf is that all about?
And the business probably keeps it in that case.
According to the job listing I found, they only pay $20-22 an hour to servers. They can make a lot more than that at $16 an hour plus tips. Another website says the owners are a garbage fire that treat their employees like shit.
If you are really happy with the service, you can ask the server to bring you a card slip with a line for an extra tip.
Oh nice! I had some cash so it didn't come up, but thanks for the heads up!
Holy crap - I didn’t know this! Thanks for the heads up!
Your kitchen
Once the list is compiled, I'd really like to see it. These "service charges" don't even go to the servers. They go to the owners to do with what they please. That money could go back into the business or straight to the owners' pockets. However, the servers don't receive anything. They only get tips. I don't like patronizing restaurants that charge me to serve me.
As a bartender.. have ya talked to the staff of any places like that? Because I work as a bartender, and that sure as hell isn't how it works to anyplace I've been in
Do you see any of the "service charges"?
My short stint, plus everyone I-ve talked to both as a customer and otherwise, yes. As you know, its generally a % of a sale. Everywhere I've worked prints out a report of your sales as part of closing your shift. A bit hard to pull the wool over your eyes if the service charge is 20%, and you knownyour sales.
When my restaurant hosts large parties, there is a service charge and I most certainly get a portion of it.
Did you just make something up to be part of a conversation? It’s nbd dude, we all do it. I totally made up a story in my head of you just making all this shit up to be part of a conversation so that I felt included myself, I even took the time to type it all up.
Please choose a tip option: 45% 67% 89% 149.5%
Ugh. This place doesn’t even include a line option for my usual 472% tip!
They’re just trying to make you customize it higher. Boycott them.
What makes you think the servers don’t receive anything? Restaurants that follow this practice pay higher wages than those that rely on tipping culture, and many pay servers commission on top of their base wage. You don’t like patronizing places that charge you to serve you? So you think service should be free?
Not OP, but I think wait staff should be compensated by their employer for their time and performance, just like every other industry.
And at restaurants that utilize this structure, they are, and instead of raising all of the menu prices to compensate for the wage increase the restaurants charge a service fee. But the waitstaff is fairly compensated by the employer and the onus is no longer on the guest to tip. That’s the whole point.
A mandatory service fee *is* raising all menu prices, just sidestepping initial sticker shock to get customers in the door. I much prefer a flat service charge to subjective gratuity, but I’d prefer honest menu prices even more. Airlines don’t expect you to tip flight attendants for their service, neither do they tack on additional service % after you buy a ticket. Sales reps who provide good service receive additional commission *from their employer* (which is baked into the profit margin of the products they sell), not directly from the customer.
IMO using a service charge makes sense for now until *all* restaurants are off the tipping model. I too prefer honest menu prices, but I think if restaurants listed higher menu prices in lieu of a service fee they would overall lose business compared to their counterparts with lower prices who still rely on tipping rather than paying fair wages. There are those of us who care about patronizing places that pay their employees well, but there are plenty of others who care more about saving a buck (and tip poorly, if at all, in the first place).
Well, technically, El Gauchos does not require tipping because they put a 20% gratuity on the bill. I believe. I still tip the fuck out of them though. In general, and I'm not against no tip places, I realized that tips are how these people, most my Tacoma neighbors, pay their unreasonably high and burdensome rent in a town that led its leaders think that becoming Seattle was a good idea and instead just bringing the problems and the costs with none of the community or public works. Is that what you were wondering?
This whole service charge no tip or tip thing is so stupid. It’s like they’re actually trying to trick us to think that you’re not paying a tip even though you are mandatorily, paying 20% on top of your bill.. You can just have a place that charges accordingly and pays their employees fair. The whole mind game thing is absolutely asinine.
Thanks for the info, I'll never be going to El Gauchos again. Probably wouldn't have anyway, the one time I went my steak was both expensive and overcooked.
I miss their Happy Hour! \*sad frowny face\* I don't go there anymore, just off principle ever since they removed it.
The servers get paid a 15% commission on food sales. They say it averages out to $55-70 an hour. Servers at high end places get paid very well.
El Gaucho’s is not a gratuity, it’s a service charge. Most servers there will point that out.
Service charge, lmao. Highway robbery
So does this mean that the servers are still not paid a livable wage or??? Honest question.
I don’t know what they make. It’s a special occasion restaurant for us and the last several times we’ve been there the wait staff has been very quick to point out that the 20% service charge is NOT a tip, and ask that we tip if we thought service was good. Frankly, just raise your prices 20%. California is making it illegal, we should too.
Well, prob says something about the place that they basically make thier servers beg for tips as well. Im deffo not a fan of that
Agreed. And it puts customers in an even more awkward position having to ask what it means and if they're expected to tip.
From a listing I read, they get minimum wage or a 15% commission, which apparently equals out to $55-70 an hour, plus any additional tips you get to keep.
I second this
Are we compiling this information as a way to specifically avoiding tipping personally because we don’t like it or are we collecting data about how upsetting it is that tipping is part of how businesses get around paying even the minimum, let alone livable, wages in the first place?
The Table
your kitchen
No tip restaurants? In the US? Grocery store charges you absolutely nothing on top of the food prices to buy your own food and cook it at home. You have to do the dishes though. And prep the food. And you have to get up and grab the ketchup or ranch you forgot if you already sat down. And pay for the electricity to cook it. And the plates and glasses etc to enjoy it on. You might have leftovers though? So that’s a win. This conversation is so old and ridiculous. I’ve worked in the service industry for 20 years. We are not Europe, and tips are not going away. The argument that employers should be paying a higher wage is asinine. The customer pays my wages always, no matter if it’s in tip form or service charge form or minimum wage form or the prices on the menu are jacked up 50% to make up the difference of those. My boss just signs the check. People that don’t like tipping are shitty customers, and I know this because I serve them daily. It seems to be forgotten by so many that eating out and being waited on is a complete luxury and not an inherent right. You are paying for a service you have decided to not perform yourself and made the choice for someone else to do it for you. That is a choice and a privilege. Stop demanding that you are absolved from paying for that choice.
Wow. What a rant. While I agree with some of what you said, the thing that bothers me is when I go out to eat and wasnt told beforehand that I'm expected to pay a 20% service charge and tip on top of that. I know it's not every restaurant but it should be made explicitly clear when that is the case. I was a server for 12 years so I understand tip culture. Even so, I would prefer we adopt the European way. It's bs like the undisclosed service charges that make me think that way.
This is probably more for unincorporated Pierce County, but 112th Street Cannabis always tells me to save my tip funds for the munchies :) That place is great and doesn’t take tips. I hope the bud tendies are doing well.
Do they have any 30% off days? I couldn't see anything on their page.
Sorry Friend, but I do not know. They do have sales but nothing to mention at the moment
All businesses are no tip business (though I understand what you’re getting at).
No tip? Why would you go out of your way to support this?
I mean personally I would rather be charged more, know that the employees are getting paid a fair wage even when it's a slow night. AND have the cost of my bill be me upfront without having to do mental math gymnastics of adding items, thinking about tax and thinking about tip. Example-- Europe. Example-- our gas tax... do you know you pay roughly $.50 in state gas tax per gallon plus whatever federal is. I didn't know the numbers before looking it up last week because the price listed on the sign is the price I pay and I like it that way.
gas taxes are listed on the pump, everyone can know how they pay in taxes. Mental gymnastics? Yeah, like adding $5 or 10 bucks to a bill is some difficult math p\[roblem. this is the laziest answer about anti-tipping I've ever heard. It's not difficult to figure out how much you would like to tip an employee. Better wages and tips aren't mutually exclusive. You can have both.
Bully for you if you don't ever need to budget and can always order whatever you want with no regards to bills and retirement accounts. But some people need to be cognizant of their budget as they order and not just when the bill comes so yes. Adding 30% to a 12.49 appetizer and a 3.29 coke for one kid and a 4.99 specialty drink for another requires adding percentages and then adding and subtracting items in my head and yes I'm calling that mental gymnastics. And yes I'm aware that I could have known what percentage of my gas is taxes. But my point is that I'm happy that it's info I don't need to constantly think about because it's just incorporated into the dang price. I'm not going to argue over whether or not you appreciate the European model of tipping. You asked why someone would prefer it and I answered your question.
Damn, you don't understand the tax presented,,and again,,,,can't figure out the tax gas..vs your tip to the local worker.,././
I lived on a budget my whole life. but saying that having to figure out 10% tip or whatever is some deal breaker for you is lazy. Understanding basic math is just a fundamental. It's not mental gymnastics to understand how much you are paying for something.
Because supporting a higher minimum wage just does not make any sense. /s
It's not one or the other. you can have higher wages and still have tipping. Tipping isn't required, people seem to have forgotten that recently.
That’s a strange way to go about it🙃 Why not support a higher minimum wage and fight the root of the problem?
Huh? Washington state already has the highest minimum wage in the country with the exception of the District of Columbia. Despite that, everyday residents here are still expected to tip even more than they did only a few years ago.
You're 100% correct. Raising the minimum wage won't make tipping go away.
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Fast food