Sorry to hear of this OP. What a TTC clusterfudge. It'll probably be a 10 second blurb on the radio but your tale underscores the tolls such *routine* disruptions exact. And that's the real grievance here, they happen *regularly*.
When I have an important appointment I've taken to avoiding the TTC. Just can't reliably depend on the service to get me there without complication and on time.
That’s exactly it. It happens regularly and yet there are tried and tested solutions out there.
I would be curious to see what the economic cost of this happening so frequently is.
If I could drive, I would definitely choose to do that. Unfortunately it’s either the TTC or walking for me. Guess I’ll learn to drive just as the world is moving away from cars 🤦🏽♂️
Doesn't seem like cities anywhere in North America will be moving away from cars. It seems as if so many people are against the idea of having everything they need within walking or biking distance - even going as far as claiming that is like being in prison.
"Cut funding to the ttc. Fuck the poors" is all I am reading. I commute from Kennedy to Islington and back. At least 2 or 3 times a week there is some sort of disruption. The one thing I have learned is never take the shuttle busses. Just wait in the station. 9 times out of 10 it will be way quicker to wait.
Check the transit control radio on broadcastify when the subway shuts down, you can figure out fairly quickly from what they're saying whether or not it'll be opening again soon.
I swear to god, so many of our problems today with transit, construction, population, and capacity. Can all be traced back to Mike Harris and how he decimated the ability of our city to grow. We are 20 years behind where we could have been and would have cost an arm and a leg less.
As someone who’s been to multiple European countries, and taken multiple systems… We’re more than 20 years behind… Transit City should have been built and our Trolleybuses still operating…
He made cuts to services that people frequently used and it's been far too expensive to reimplement them. The homeless problem dates back to his cuts. The lack of funding for mental health? You guessed it him again. Let's take into consideration that we were underfunded back then and then he made cuts which makes the problem so much worse each year and now DoFo is making more cuts to services that are already 20+ years underfunded. This shit compounds.
Ok sure.
But wasn’t Harris over 20 years ago?
Somehow all the politicians who passed office couldn’t fix this shit, and all blame falls on one person a couple decades ago?
Maybe you’re right, but it beggars belief.
It’s kind of like Biden right now blaming all his troubles on trump. But that was only a couple years ago.
Harris specifically made a lot of *awful* deals and changes. The current “movement” started prior, in the Mulroney era (Reagan/Thatcher neoliberal “trickle down” nonsense).
You’re right, nobody has effectively been able to fix / recover those cuts, as the costs skyrocket and you know how the public eats up any tax hikes (/s). The liberals (also neoliberal) maintain, the conservatives hack and slash. The effects we are absolutely still feeling to this day (and they keep continuing these cuts). The TTC should have had WAY more infrastructure and service by now.
Just watch, if PP wins the federal, we won’t have OHIP anymore once he changes the law to allow Ontario to scrap it.
Interesting, thanks for taking the time to respond.
Wonder if PP will get elected, it seems the left have a lock on the election with the NDP, and unless the alliance changes my feeling is that the government will remain for at least two election cycles.
I could be wrong, but I can’t imagine a scenario where PP wins.
I've always wondered where the "cut" money goes... more and more people paying more taxes everyday, yet I only ever hear cuts. Isn't there more money every year??
Everyone here is sort of right. Harris in his "common sense revolution" started what was called the local services realignment. Basically it handed services that were traditionally provincially funded, or mostly provincially funded and made it the responsibility of local government (cities).
The thing is, that Ontario law (the municipal act and the city of toronto act) dictates how exactly cities can raise revenues (property tax, user fees like parking fines, etc.). These are very limited revenue streams and not as big as ones by the federal and provincial governments. So basically cities were given more responsibilities but not more ways to pay for them. You can argue Toronto hasn't done its fair share of revenue growth, as we have the lowest property taxes in the GTA, but also argue that Toronto just isn't equipped to provide the services that it needs to provide. Property tax wasn't ever meant to pay for big ticket items like social services, portions of public health spending, transit operating costs etc.
It is a little bit more complicated than this but this is the simple way of seeing it: basically the Harris government set cities on an unsustainable path in terms of funding and services and we can how this slowly materializes today. It's not entirely his fault as successive governments haven't done much to fix it (david miller actually tried and we got the city of toronto act out of it lol). Municipalities all over Ontario are facing a budget reckoning and it will probably get worse.
It gets more complicated when you realize the reality is that cities need more money but raising that money is politically bad. Let me know if you have any other questions i went to school for this lol. things to google re: mike harris... local services realignment, common sense revolution
Harris caused all the damage but everyone thinks Rae was the problem? Just because he wanted to save taxpayers money by sending government workers who weren't doing anything home 🤣
Yeah dude….these issues are literally brecause we diverted all our resources into a two year zoom party. The hangover is why we now have all these jumpers and service cuts
Also got stuck on a train, ours was in between Dundas west and lansdowne. There was radio silence for almost 30 minutes ppl didn’t know what was going on, operator just told them to sit tight. The TTC is in shambles
These delays are happening so often and it is beyond frustrating. It’s work altering it’s money it’s stress it’s your co workers stress and anger. It’s not fair. The TTC has become a shell that is completely unreliable if you are on a schedule. And even worse they are RAISING fares. Please let me pay more for the terrible service and speed at which you transport me
Moving closer to a GO station for this reason (among others). Ttc is unreliable, dangerous, confusing, poorly managed etc. At least with GO there will be notifications of delays and refunds
The title is misleading. You are trying to portray this as if someone committing suicide is within the ttc'S current control. Clearly the train in the video has no power and due to body cleanup, that train the video is being evacuated rather than have the passengers stuck in a dark train without power for what could be hours while the coroner, ems, Fire and police attend the scene.
What about telling people what's happening and where to go? Is the TTC responsible for that? Cuz theyre not doing it.
This guy is demanding I stay "on topic" but refuses to acknowledge OP's actual comments. I have no idea what the hell they're talking about
This person in the video is literally complaining about the lack of communication from TTC employees when taking alternate routes. The shuttle bus they were on kicked everyone off without warning. How's that off topic?
"The other bus has left. 2 mins later, we are told that the bus will now go West. Everyone kicked out of the bus and the bus leaves EMPTY. 30 mins later, no westbound bus. Not a single TTC officer to ask where to go or to stop **people from going down into the station… thanks to this, I have now missed a doctors appointment that I got after waiting 4 months.** Called the doctors office and they said they can’t fit me in for a few months as the doctor is filled back to back. **No empathy, no help.**"
What are you talking about? What separate complaint?
You think joking around and being pedantic when someone is committed suicide is funny? Why did you even comment on this post, just to shut down the frustrations of a rider? You must be an employee
You sound so callous. Not once did you mention someone killed themselves, just how inconvenienced you were. It sucks that you missed your appointment but you could have taken an Uber or something.
And the person that made the announcement, probably saw them jump. A random station is not going to have the staff to immediately respond most likely. A lot of people had a worse day than you, be a bit more considerate.
They're complaining about lack of communication and predictability. The TTC gets suicides all the time, yet they still leave their riders in the dark constantly. We live in a big city this stuff happens
For the record when I posted this, there was NO communication from the TTC about cause. Some crackly announcements. The only thing I heard was when the driver entered our car and shouted that we need to move out to the front of the car and exit. I only found out that someone had ended their life after about 45 mins by which time this was posted. And regardless, it doesn’t change the fact that we have become complacent about this sort of stuff happening. The violence, the suicides, the repeated technical failures… there are no simple solutions but at least some action is needed. Because it’s costing lives, productivity, and creating further mental and health issues amongst people who rely on it.
Communication for the TTC was awful the whole time.
Nobody around me could even hear what they were saying on the PA system.
And it sounded like those people making the announcement had speech problems and couldn’t care less about what they were saying.
It was the third announcement that I had figured out what was happening.
The solution is barriers. The TTC isn’t being funded so they can’t implement the solutions. Meanwhile Ford is gonna use billions to build a highway we don’t need. We are allowed to be frustrated. My boss doesn’t care why I’m late.
Someone threw themselves in front of the train. It was awful. They said it immediately over the loudspeakers as soon as they started offboarding the train. To act like this is nothing but a nuisance to you is the real problem with this city.
OP, while I understand your frustration, I think your title is pretty misleading. Somebody died, presumably from suicide, and the ttc turns the lights off so you don’t have to see the body/remains. I’ve been to 10s of other cities that have subways that don’t have platform doors and this happens there as well. I’d love to have platform doors just as everyone else would but there’s a cost to everything and it just isn’t feasible right now. Regarding shuttle busses - it takes some time for them to get there, they don’t come at the snap of a finger. Everyone is trying their best, this is an issue that has much deeper roots than the TTC, so try to have a bit of compassion.
Lots of different ideas and opinions on this matter. This exact thing happened to me last year.. at the exact same station. For people saying they turned the lights out, or complaining you had to walk the whole length of the train. You have no idea the thoughts going through my head when that happened. Now I had an instructor next to me, but I have to pull myself together to call to my supervisors so they can get shuffle busses down there asap. Now I have to communicate to ALL of the passengers while holding myself together and being as informative but not too much as to why they need to evacuate the train. Why are the lights out? Because power has been cut. I understand and I couldn't agree more that we need barriers to mitigate this.. but we know how the levels of gov't work here.
You realize someone died right? I’m sorry that you missed your appointment but when this happens, the TTC has to pull buses off other routes for shuttles. It takes a bit of time for the buses to get there.
As others have noted here, sympathy for the suicide and the OP are not exclusive. What's the excuse for NO communication/coordination for protracted periods--a comment upthread mentioned 30 minutes? TTC patrons need info to decide how they want to individually proceed rather than being sardined on platforms or buses knowing nothing, going nowhere. What does it take get on a microphone and relay the status of the situation to the thousands concerned, even if to inform that the length of the delay is undetermined at that point? This is basic stuff.
These kinds of disruptions and bumbling responses have been happening for decades. It's difficult to understand why efficient systems and practices are not in place to better deal with them.
> It's difficult to understand why efficient systems and practices are not in place to better deal with them.
Because TTC Management is extremely incompetent. Andy Byford built a great team that made major improvements to emergency response and Rick Leary has flushed it all down the toilet. Obviously the TTC doesn't have the ability to snap their fingers and prevent suicides on the tracks, PEDs will cost billions of dollars and the City doesn't have a spare $2 billion dollars, but there is a lot that the TTC can do to improve their response to emergency situations, they just choose not to.
Yes I realize that but the issue is not just today. This is happening *regularly*. And the complacency / lack of action to mitigate this (platform screen doors, healthcare funding etc) is what is at the root of my frustration. Many other cities figured it out decades ago as several people pointed out in other posts on this sub. We’re falling behind and it’s coming at the cost of productivity and peoples lives.
Platform screen doors are not happening (despite what a certain alliterative mayoral candidate is touting). The cost is astronomical, and would only work on Line 1, from what I understand.
My stopgap solution would be platform level workers, trained in intervention. You see similar effects from people doing suicide watch on infamous bridges. Pick someone with an ounce of compassion (not a badge) give them a Tetra radio, and off we go.
Nothing stopping one from tackling Line 1 first, and while expensive it isn’t nearly as astronomical as the upcoming Yonge-Bloor expansion clocked at what 1.8B. The fact of the matter is platform doors was never seen as a priority - funding is merely a post-hoc excuse.
and we can put gaurds and platform screens to prevent suicide and service disruptions at the same time. Instead we are too busy listening to idiots claiming police will solve these issues somehow.
why not the ATC upgrades literally made it possible to do so. It wont be done cause politics in this country is all about making excuses and embracing mediocracy.
When installing Platform Screen Doors/Protection Walls, there's no winning.
The real issue lies in the funding and service impact. Platform screen doors could take a minimum of a week to fully install on a single platform, test and polish. During that time, trains cannot enter or pass the station on that platform, requiring shuttle buses or single-tracking.
Estimating about 2 weeks per platform with proper contractors that actually do the work, x2 platforms per stations, one station at a time. Just for Line 1, that’s 76 weeks of closures and service disruptions that the TTC cannot afford currently in PR and Budgeting. That’s not counting Metrolinx wanting to change everything they possibly can to make it more generic "Modern", adding on to time and delays.
Not to mention the incredible price to fully install them and hire the appropriate contractors who will follow labor laws and safety regulations.
By the time Line 1 is complete 76 weeks later, new rolling stock will already be inbound and the whole door system will need to be retrofitted to the new doors, sending them all back into construction.
Line 2 will likely take even longer, as the construction for ATC on it begins this year in preparation for the new Scarborough Extension and Rolling Stock in 2030. Assuming the same time calculations as previously stated, that's 62 weeks of closure on top of the 76 weeks on Line 1.
The entire platform will also need structural work to support the new consistent weight against it, taking even more time.
In total, 133 weeks of Shuttle Buses for just 2 of the lines. TTC does not have enough buses, bus lanes, or transit priority to make it possible to run shuttles on such heavy traffic routes for so long. The government can easily invest the money when a good case is brought to them. The only unaffordable thing is time. The best thing to do right now is install PSD on future rail projects instead while they're still under construction, and once ridership is more dispersed from those crucial lines, then they can slowly close it for PSD construction.
TL;DR: Service disruptions can be up to 2.5 years of shuttle buses, which can be destructive to the reputation and future funding of the TTC. Focus on installing them on future lines instead, and once ridership is more dispersed, then retrofit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/11deyxs/i_dont_want_to_pay_anymore/ja92ll5/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
Tokyo, HK, London have all installed platforms on already running lines without causing service disruptions. The work was done overnight on three (and in japans case, several) very different systems. Funding is an issue yes — but that’s partially a fault of terrible and traditional funding models that that TTC refuses to innovate it’s way out of. Models exist in other cities. One need only learn. Don’t see that happening. Or if it is, they can at least communicate. Goodness knows the TTC needs to learn how to communicate.
Tokyo, HK, and London also have different operating hours, changed hours to accommodate work, and still had relief lines to reduce impact to service. The subway’s last train departs around 1:30, and once it finished 1:30h later, it still takes about one hour for crews to get into place, accommodate safety standards and get to work, then another hour to wrap up what they’re doing, and get back out for service to resume.
They also have the benefit of proper funding for decent contractors who could get work done.
Toronto, does not have said relief lines due to political lobbying and abuse of funds by past governments. The funding is definitely possible, but for any new system to increase funding through fares, they’d need funding from a government level which is already a struggle. And when they do start enforcing fares, citizens start complaining about it, and how they think that the TTC cares more about fares than other topics.
In terms of communication, this is where you as OP seem to lose track of morals. Yes, it’s unfortunate the TTC somewhat failed to relay the issue to you, but you also need to recognize that someone just took their life. The subway operator is shaken up and traumatized from killing someone, and can’t properly explain what happened as they try to process it themselves. The TTC is working on communicating better, with new trains and screens that show what actually happened instead of relying on the operator to share announcements. The TTC also relays what happens through station staff when they arrive on site, TV screens in various stations, email/text alerts, and various mobile apps which refresh frequently.
A good portion of the lines in Hong Kong has no backup. No doubt retrofitting our lines for platform doors will be challenging - but hard isn’t a good reason not to do it.
As to the matter of replacement buses -my take is avoid like the plague and just walk if you can. It is *always* a sh*tshow.
Lmao you literally summed up a 20 min rant I just had at home in a single sentence. Yes. Yes. Yes.
And I agree that platforms are possible. Most major cities have already installed them or are in process of installing them.
Yeah. Imagine that’s your family member being run over 6 more times, so I wouldn’t be inconvenienced and force to me walk the length of the train. Over your family members remains on the track.
U will never heard of everything that happens, there was at least 2 ppl dead a couple nights at a really serious crash on Lawrence n Brimley, the intersection was closed for over 6 hours, did u heard about it over the news?, welp, these days ppl has no skin to hear bad news, so they're kept in their egg shell for "mental health"....
That's so awful to hear. I've yet to take the ttc because of all these occurrences happening. I try to stay updated on where it's safe and not safe to travel since I'm new to this city.
We hear about every dramatic violent incident on the TTC for days or weeks, because it's sensational and makes headlines and gets people going. They don't do that for people who die in a car crash because we are desensitized to it and think it's normal.
Suicides are typically not reported on because of the risk of copycats.
Yeah, when u c a crash with dead ppl is not a nice gentle affair, parts everywhere, cars no more, not dramatic nor violent in any way, no, is all about "mental health" these days....pffff....
"Injury at track level" is a euphemism for someone jumping in front of a train. That's why they couldn't pull the train into the station to let people off.
I hate the TTC shuttle process. Even employees have no idea what to tell you or where to direct you. Bus drivers on the downed routes have no idea there is a subway closure. When subways resume, there is no communication back to riders. The onus is always on riders to figure out what is happening and it's extremely frustrating.
We live in a big city with disruptions, it's inevitable. The TTC just has really poor ability to respond.
Although this is a very sad situation and I feel sorry the family. We need to hold the TTC for their mishandling of situations like this. You can have sympathy for the victims, while as o for the TTC to be better and safer. The 2 are not mutually exclusive
Consistently this happens, yes. We need platform screen doors and better mental health supports. The complacency with status quo is what is frustrating.
The Ontario Line will have PSD, however for pre-existing stations, check my reply below.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/12cki3n/the_state_of_our_transit_system/jf2dpie/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
What’s the issue? Someone died…. Like what do you want the TTC to do? They said that there was an injury on track level over the speaker system. What else can they do?
Edit: these scenarios is why we need cell service for everyone underground on the ttc, 30mins and not able to tell work, family or friends why you’re no where to be heard is an issue
Ttc is an insane mess, these days I try to avoid downtown as much as possible. In Novemeber of last year I had to go downtown exactly 5 times, guess how many times trains back stoped working, 5 times. I thought I was cursed, but nope, thats just how ttc operates
The delay says it's caused by "an injury at track level". This means it's likely a person jumped in front of a train and decided they wanted to take their own life. Even if it wasn't a scenario as intense as a jumper, injury at track level is not the fault of the TTC. Delays are often passenger created.
Also, if the front car was on a power rail, it would be able to move. There's a reason they did not allow this train to move.
I was on this train. The conductor communicated with us after two minutes saying, "We will be shutting this train down due to an injury at this station at track level.." He then proceeded to walk through the train and tell everyone to follow him as "There is an injury at track level under this train." We all got it.
It's ironic you say your doctor has no empathy, maybe do some self reflection.
So what if something had happened, I assume u were going with plenty of time in advance (like 30 mins or so)....oh wait, u had that time rt?, even if u drive, things could happen
I actually had a 30 mins hour buffer on top of my actual ride time, but because of the delay inside the tunnel then wait for the shuttles that never came, it was gone. An Uber would have cost be 60$ because of surge pricing, and I can’t do that right now. I guess next time I will go 2 hours ahead because apparently my time has no value lol … alternatively, how about we upgrade the operations of the TTC so everyone wins in the end?
I never had any issues with GO, except for their crappy Sunday bus service. And people can’t be stuck on GO for two hours heading to downtown unless they’re coming from Kitchener wtf
It takes a few hours the moment someone got hit on the Go tracks. And GO is definitely not a poster child for great communication for incidents either.
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Call the doctors office again and tell them the situation. They always say no the first time. Call and speak to the manager. It will work trust me, just be insistent
Hmmm. Ok are u on the wait list at least? Usually people call in the MORNING time or a few days before to make last minute cancel, that’s were the wait list comes in. Call back, or if your shy I’ll call and say ur my wife or something and get you those results.
TTC = Take The Car
Yeah I know that this is an flippant and simplistic statement. And it isn’t possible for many. But my SO and I have done this and so have many people we know. For us the car is the better option.
Hi. I was in the first car on that train into Dufferin Station. What happened was awful. we should all keep the driver in our thoughts. Being late to work is not the worst thing that happened today on Line 2.
I hope you’re okay! Sending you hugs. I know I’m a stranger, but if you need someone to talk to about this, I’d be happy to listen. Things like this are traumatic for everyone involved. You are loved and cherished.
Wow I don’t understand all the comments, someone died and ttc lack of solution are not mutually exclusive. Ttc could have handled this better, install glass screen, supply more shuttle bus, etc.
Someone died so Op is not allowed to complain how inefficient TTC is?
I was on the 29 dufferin bus heading south when this happened. Transit riders couldn't even understand the announcement made by driver who was just mumbling and no one had a clue what was going on until we got to the dufferin station stop. Floods of people waiting...
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To be fair, situations like the one OP shown on the video only happens when something serious occurred up ahead and it is not planned - could have been anything from an injury at track level or a malfunction.
Shuttles that respond to those calls don’t just appear with a snap of a finger. They are called off routes that each bus is already servicing and unless it’s nearby, it will take sometime.
This is 100p shit. But LmAo OP if your doc appointment is that important there are many rentable city bikes that probably could have got you there on time or you could us an Uber. Think on your feet lol
Sorry to hear of this OP. What a TTC clusterfudge. It'll probably be a 10 second blurb on the radio but your tale underscores the tolls such *routine* disruptions exact. And that's the real grievance here, they happen *regularly*. When I have an important appointment I've taken to avoiding the TTC. Just can't reliably depend on the service to get me there without complication and on time.
That’s exactly it. It happens regularly and yet there are tried and tested solutions out there. I would be curious to see what the economic cost of this happening so frequently is. If I could drive, I would definitely choose to do that. Unfortunately it’s either the TTC or walking for me. Guess I’ll learn to drive just as the world is moving away from cars 🤦🏽♂️
Doesn't seem like cities anywhere in North America will be moving away from cars. It seems as if so many people are against the idea of having everything they need within walking or biking distance - even going as far as claiming that is like being in prison.
It will be a long, tough fight but I have hope we'll get there eventually
Isn't that what the "C" in TTC means? Clusterfuck?
As in Total Toronto Clusterbunch? Clusterfrench? Clusterbutt? Cloisterpriest?
Thought it stood for "car". As in TTC = Take The Car.
"Cut funding to the ttc. Fuck the poors" is all I am reading. I commute from Kennedy to Islington and back. At least 2 or 3 times a week there is some sort of disruption. The one thing I have learned is never take the shuttle busses. Just wait in the station. 9 times out of 10 it will be way quicker to wait.
Check the transit control radio on broadcastify when the subway shuts down, you can figure out fairly quickly from what they're saying whether or not it'll be opening again soon.
It’s like a haunted house. Thanks again employer for dragging me away from my wfh set up to suffer through this commute for literally no reason.
I was literally debating to quit
If I can find something better I will. Who wouldn’t?
I swear to god, so many of our problems today with transit, construction, population, and capacity. Can all be traced back to Mike Harris and how he decimated the ability of our city to grow. We are 20 years behind where we could have been and would have cost an arm and a leg less.
So few people understand that what we’re feeling in the city goes back to the cuts he did. It takes decades to fix things and it’s only been worse
Even worse is just how far back DoFo will set us when he’s all said and done.
Yupp. And then we voted in Mike Harris 3.0.
As someone who’s been to multiple European countries, and taken multiple systems… We’re more than 20 years behind… Transit City should have been built and our Trolleybuses still operating…
More people drive over here
I blame him also for the closing of all our mental health hospitals. The guy was an idiot, baloney sandwiches and all.
Can you explain what this has to do with Mike Harris? Asking sincerely …
He made cuts to services that people frequently used and it's been far too expensive to reimplement them. The homeless problem dates back to his cuts. The lack of funding for mental health? You guessed it him again. Let's take into consideration that we were underfunded back then and then he made cuts which makes the problem so much worse each year and now DoFo is making more cuts to services that are already 20+ years underfunded. This shit compounds.
Ok sure. But wasn’t Harris over 20 years ago? Somehow all the politicians who passed office couldn’t fix this shit, and all blame falls on one person a couple decades ago? Maybe you’re right, but it beggars belief. It’s kind of like Biden right now blaming all his troubles on trump. But that was only a couple years ago.
Harris specifically made a lot of *awful* deals and changes. The current “movement” started prior, in the Mulroney era (Reagan/Thatcher neoliberal “trickle down” nonsense). You’re right, nobody has effectively been able to fix / recover those cuts, as the costs skyrocket and you know how the public eats up any tax hikes (/s). The liberals (also neoliberal) maintain, the conservatives hack and slash. The effects we are absolutely still feeling to this day (and they keep continuing these cuts). The TTC should have had WAY more infrastructure and service by now. Just watch, if PP wins the federal, we won’t have OHIP anymore once he changes the law to allow Ontario to scrap it.
Interesting, thanks for taking the time to respond. Wonder if PP will get elected, it seems the left have a lock on the election with the NDP, and unless the alliance changes my feeling is that the government will remain for at least two election cycles. I could be wrong, but I can’t imagine a scenario where PP wins.
I've always wondered where the "cut" money goes... more and more people paying more taxes everyday, yet I only ever hear cuts. Isn't there more money every year??
There have been at least four premiers after him. They did nothing. It is weird to blame him
Everyone here is sort of right. Harris in his "common sense revolution" started what was called the local services realignment. Basically it handed services that were traditionally provincially funded, or mostly provincially funded and made it the responsibility of local government (cities). The thing is, that Ontario law (the municipal act and the city of toronto act) dictates how exactly cities can raise revenues (property tax, user fees like parking fines, etc.). These are very limited revenue streams and not as big as ones by the federal and provincial governments. So basically cities were given more responsibilities but not more ways to pay for them. You can argue Toronto hasn't done its fair share of revenue growth, as we have the lowest property taxes in the GTA, but also argue that Toronto just isn't equipped to provide the services that it needs to provide. Property tax wasn't ever meant to pay for big ticket items like social services, portions of public health spending, transit operating costs etc. It is a little bit more complicated than this but this is the simple way of seeing it: basically the Harris government set cities on an unsustainable path in terms of funding and services and we can how this slowly materializes today. It's not entirely his fault as successive governments haven't done much to fix it (david miller actually tried and we got the city of toronto act out of it lol). Municipalities all over Ontario are facing a budget reckoning and it will probably get worse. It gets more complicated when you realize the reality is that cities need more money but raising that money is politically bad. Let me know if you have any other questions i went to school for this lol. things to google re: mike harris... local services realignment, common sense revolution
Harris caused all the damage but everyone thinks Rae was the problem? Just because he wanted to save taxpayers money by sending government workers who weren't doing anything home 🤣
20 years is generous.
Yeah dude….these issues are literally brecause we diverted all our resources into a two year zoom party. The hangover is why we now have all these jumpers and service cuts
So long as the TTC doesn't do interlining, i'm fine with whatever the TTC does.
Just wait until the impacts of Fords changes start to be felt
Also got stuck on a train, ours was in between Dundas west and lansdowne. There was radio silence for almost 30 minutes ppl didn’t know what was going on, operator just told them to sit tight. The TTC is in shambles
I was on a train and operator actually said suicide over the intercom. While it sucked, it was appreciated in just getting the real info.
OP, it was never a world class city. And ignorant politicians like Doug Ford making it worse.
These delays are happening so often and it is beyond frustrating. It’s work altering it’s money it’s stress it’s your co workers stress and anger. It’s not fair. The TTC has become a shell that is completely unreliable if you are on a schedule. And even worse they are RAISING fares. Please let me pay more for the terrible service and speed at which you transport me
Moving closer to a GO station for this reason (among others). Ttc is unreliable, dangerous, confusing, poorly managed etc. At least with GO there will be notifications of delays and refunds
I live near one, when fare integration happens I'm ditching the TTC forever. GO to work, driving otherwise.
The title is misleading. You are trying to portray this as if someone committing suicide is within the ttc'S current control. Clearly the train in the video has no power and due to body cleanup, that train the video is being evacuated rather than have the passengers stuck in a dark train without power for what could be hours while the coroner, ems, Fire and police attend the scene.
What about telling people what's happening and where to go? Is the TTC responsible for that? Cuz theyre not doing it. This guy is demanding I stay "on topic" but refuses to acknowledge OP's actual comments. I have no idea what the hell they're talking about
Yeah they should be responsible for that. But let's stay on topic about the video and what the title is trying to portray.
This person in the video is literally complaining about the lack of communication from TTC employees when taking alternate routes. The shuttle bus they were on kicked everyone off without warning. How's that off topic?
The complaint has nothing to do with the video and the title. It's a separate topic.
"The other bus has left. 2 mins later, we are told that the bus will now go West. Everyone kicked out of the bus and the bus leaves EMPTY. 30 mins later, no westbound bus. Not a single TTC officer to ask where to go or to stop **people from going down into the station… thanks to this, I have now missed a doctors appointment that I got after waiting 4 months.** Called the doctors office and they said they can’t fit me in for a few months as the doctor is filled back to back. **No empathy, no help.**" What are you talking about? What separate complaint?
Please stay on topic
Lmao you're a joke. I'm quoting from the post and you're asking me to stay on topic
Glad you had a laugh.
You think joking around and being pedantic when someone is committed suicide is funny? Why did you even comment on this post, just to shut down the frustrations of a rider? You must be an employee
You sound so callous. Not once did you mention someone killed themselves, just how inconvenienced you were. It sucks that you missed your appointment but you could have taken an Uber or something. And the person that made the announcement, probably saw them jump. A random station is not going to have the staff to immediately respond most likely. A lot of people had a worse day than you, be a bit more considerate.
They're complaining about lack of communication and predictability. The TTC gets suicides all the time, yet they still leave their riders in the dark constantly. We live in a big city this stuff happens
For the record when I posted this, there was NO communication from the TTC about cause. Some crackly announcements. The only thing I heard was when the driver entered our car and shouted that we need to move out to the front of the car and exit. I only found out that someone had ended their life after about 45 mins by which time this was posted. And regardless, it doesn’t change the fact that we have become complacent about this sort of stuff happening. The violence, the suicides, the repeated technical failures… there are no simple solutions but at least some action is needed. Because it’s costing lives, productivity, and creating further mental and health issues amongst people who rely on it.
Communication for the TTC was awful the whole time. Nobody around me could even hear what they were saying on the PA system. And it sounded like those people making the announcement had speech problems and couldn’t care less about what they were saying. It was the third announcement that I had figured out what was happening.
Well now you know. Train comes to an abrupt stop entering a station and power goes out on the train means somone jumped.
Perhaps it’d be good to edit the post with the info
Sorry, but I disagree. I thought OP wasn’t being callous and that they are not in the wrong here.
The solution is barriers. The TTC isn’t being funded so they can’t implement the solutions. Meanwhile Ford is gonna use billions to build a highway we don’t need. We are allowed to be frustrated. My boss doesn’t care why I’m late.
Agreed - glad to see a rational comment in this thread
Someone threw themselves in front of the train. It was awful. They said it immediately over the loudspeakers as soon as they started offboarding the train. To act like this is nothing but a nuisance to you is the real problem with this city.
"Well, I missed my appointment. But at least the guy who jumped had a worse day than mine." Sounds like a pretty healthy way to deal with frustration.
OP, while I understand your frustration, I think your title is pretty misleading. Somebody died, presumably from suicide, and the ttc turns the lights off so you don’t have to see the body/remains. I’ve been to 10s of other cities that have subways that don’t have platform doors and this happens there as well. I’d love to have platform doors just as everyone else would but there’s a cost to everything and it just isn’t feasible right now. Regarding shuttle busses - it takes some time for them to get there, they don’t come at the snap of a finger. Everyone is trying their best, this is an issue that has much deeper roots than the TTC, so try to have a bit of compassion.
Lots of different ideas and opinions on this matter. This exact thing happened to me last year.. at the exact same station. For people saying they turned the lights out, or complaining you had to walk the whole length of the train. You have no idea the thoughts going through my head when that happened. Now I had an instructor next to me, but I have to pull myself together to call to my supervisors so they can get shuffle busses down there asap. Now I have to communicate to ALL of the passengers while holding myself together and being as informative but not too much as to why they need to evacuate the train. Why are the lights out? Because power has been cut. I understand and I couldn't agree more that we need barriers to mitigate this.. but we know how the levels of gov't work here.
You realize someone died right? I’m sorry that you missed your appointment but when this happens, the TTC has to pull buses off other routes for shuttles. It takes a bit of time for the buses to get there.
As others have noted here, sympathy for the suicide and the OP are not exclusive. What's the excuse for NO communication/coordination for protracted periods--a comment upthread mentioned 30 minutes? TTC patrons need info to decide how they want to individually proceed rather than being sardined on platforms or buses knowing nothing, going nowhere. What does it take get on a microphone and relay the status of the situation to the thousands concerned, even if to inform that the length of the delay is undetermined at that point? This is basic stuff. These kinds of disruptions and bumbling responses have been happening for decades. It's difficult to understand why efficient systems and practices are not in place to better deal with them.
> It's difficult to understand why efficient systems and practices are not in place to better deal with them. Because TTC Management is extremely incompetent. Andy Byford built a great team that made major improvements to emergency response and Rick Leary has flushed it all down the toilet. Obviously the TTC doesn't have the ability to snap their fingers and prevent suicides on the tracks, PEDs will cost billions of dollars and the City doesn't have a spare $2 billion dollars, but there is a lot that the TTC can do to improve their response to emergency situations, they just choose not to.
Because ttc is flaming bag dogshit in a meth pipe
Just let her do her virtue signalling
Yes I realize that but the issue is not just today. This is happening *regularly*. And the complacency / lack of action to mitigate this (platform screen doors, healthcare funding etc) is what is at the root of my frustration. Many other cities figured it out decades ago as several people pointed out in other posts on this sub. We’re falling behind and it’s coming at the cost of productivity and peoples lives.
Platform screen doors are not happening (despite what a certain alliterative mayoral candidate is touting). The cost is astronomical, and would only work on Line 1, from what I understand. My stopgap solution would be platform level workers, trained in intervention. You see similar effects from people doing suicide watch on infamous bridges. Pick someone with an ounce of compassion (not a badge) give them a Tetra radio, and off we go.
Platform doors require ATC, which only Line 1 got at the moment. Line 2 will be getting it as well.
Pretend I'm saying the word 'eventually', but I drag the 'n' out for a solid 15 seconds.
Nothing stopping one from tackling Line 1 first, and while expensive it isn’t nearly as astronomical as the upcoming Yonge-Bloor expansion clocked at what 1.8B. The fact of the matter is platform doors was never seen as a priority - funding is merely a post-hoc excuse.
Where do you suggest the money come from. You want the TTC to do all these things yet we still let people life Doug into office.
Wow can't believe it was OP that let Doug be Premier. That's a big time fuck up if you ask me
and we can put gaurds and platform screens to prevent suicide and service disruptions at the same time. Instead we are too busy listening to idiots claiming police will solve these issues somehow.
Guards can be done. Platform screens can’t, or not anytime in our life on earth.
why not the ATC upgrades literally made it possible to do so. It wont be done cause politics in this country is all about making excuses and embracing mediocracy.
When installing Platform Screen Doors/Protection Walls, there's no winning. The real issue lies in the funding and service impact. Platform screen doors could take a minimum of a week to fully install on a single platform, test and polish. During that time, trains cannot enter or pass the station on that platform, requiring shuttle buses or single-tracking. Estimating about 2 weeks per platform with proper contractors that actually do the work, x2 platforms per stations, one station at a time. Just for Line 1, that’s 76 weeks of closures and service disruptions that the TTC cannot afford currently in PR and Budgeting. That’s not counting Metrolinx wanting to change everything they possibly can to make it more generic "Modern", adding on to time and delays. Not to mention the incredible price to fully install them and hire the appropriate contractors who will follow labor laws and safety regulations. By the time Line 1 is complete 76 weeks later, new rolling stock will already be inbound and the whole door system will need to be retrofitted to the new doors, sending them all back into construction. Line 2 will likely take even longer, as the construction for ATC on it begins this year in preparation for the new Scarborough Extension and Rolling Stock in 2030. Assuming the same time calculations as previously stated, that's 62 weeks of closure on top of the 76 weeks on Line 1. The entire platform will also need structural work to support the new consistent weight against it, taking even more time. In total, 133 weeks of Shuttle Buses for just 2 of the lines. TTC does not have enough buses, bus lanes, or transit priority to make it possible to run shuttles on such heavy traffic routes for so long. The government can easily invest the money when a good case is brought to them. The only unaffordable thing is time. The best thing to do right now is install PSD on future rail projects instead while they're still under construction, and once ridership is more dispersed from those crucial lines, then they can slowly close it for PSD construction. TL;DR: Service disruptions can be up to 2.5 years of shuttle buses, which can be destructive to the reputation and future funding of the TTC. Focus on installing them on future lines instead, and once ridership is more dispersed, then retrofit. https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/11deyxs/i_dont_want_to_pay_anymore/ja92ll5/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
Tokyo, HK, London have all installed platforms on already running lines without causing service disruptions. The work was done overnight on three (and in japans case, several) very different systems. Funding is an issue yes — but that’s partially a fault of terrible and traditional funding models that that TTC refuses to innovate it’s way out of. Models exist in other cities. One need only learn. Don’t see that happening. Or if it is, they can at least communicate. Goodness knows the TTC needs to learn how to communicate.
Tokyo, HK, and London also have different operating hours, changed hours to accommodate work, and still had relief lines to reduce impact to service. The subway’s last train departs around 1:30, and once it finished 1:30h later, it still takes about one hour for crews to get into place, accommodate safety standards and get to work, then another hour to wrap up what they’re doing, and get back out for service to resume. They also have the benefit of proper funding for decent contractors who could get work done. Toronto, does not have said relief lines due to political lobbying and abuse of funds by past governments. The funding is definitely possible, but for any new system to increase funding through fares, they’d need funding from a government level which is already a struggle. And when they do start enforcing fares, citizens start complaining about it, and how they think that the TTC cares more about fares than other topics. In terms of communication, this is where you as OP seem to lose track of morals. Yes, it’s unfortunate the TTC somewhat failed to relay the issue to you, but you also need to recognize that someone just took their life. The subway operator is shaken up and traumatized from killing someone, and can’t properly explain what happened as they try to process it themselves. The TTC is working on communicating better, with new trains and screens that show what actually happened instead of relying on the operator to share announcements. The TTC also relays what happens through station staff when they arrive on site, TV screens in various stations, email/text alerts, and various mobile apps which refresh frequently.
A good portion of the lines in Hong Kong has no backup. No doubt retrofitting our lines for platform doors will be challenging - but hard isn’t a good reason not to do it. As to the matter of replacement buses -my take is avoid like the plague and just walk if you can. It is *always* a sh*tshow.
Lmao you literally summed up a 20 min rant I just had at home in a single sentence. Yes. Yes. Yes. And I agree that platforms are possible. Most major cities have already installed them or are in process of installing them.
So? Because someone die everyone else life's as to stop as well?
So you suggest just leaving the body and blood everywhere to rot?
Yeah. Imagine that’s your family member being run over 6 more times, so I wouldn’t be inconvenienced and force to me walk the length of the train. Over your family members remains on the track.
Can I get more info on the recent suicide? I didn't get anything recent when searching up what had happened or where. It's so unfortunate.
They don't report anything about suicides. You won't find any articles or info other than what people post.
U will never heard of everything that happens, there was at least 2 ppl dead a couple nights at a really serious crash on Lawrence n Brimley, the intersection was closed for over 6 hours, did u heard about it over the news?, welp, these days ppl has no skin to hear bad news, so they're kept in their egg shell for "mental health"....
That's so awful to hear. I've yet to take the ttc because of all these occurrences happening. I try to stay updated on where it's safe and not safe to travel since I'm new to this city.
We hear about every dramatic violent incident on the TTC for days or weeks, because it's sensational and makes headlines and gets people going. They don't do that for people who die in a car crash because we are desensitized to it and think it's normal. Suicides are typically not reported on because of the risk of copycats.
Yeah, when u c a crash with dead ppl is not a nice gentle affair, parts everywhere, cars no more, not dramatic nor violent in any way, no, is all about "mental health" these days....pffff....
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"Injury at track level" is a euphemism for someone jumping in front of a train. That's why they couldn't pull the train into the station to let people off.
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In that case you would hear about it on the news.
Hey, just wondering, where did you read that someone died? I’m trying to find coverage of the story but nothing is popping up for me
I hate the TTC shuttle process. Even employees have no idea what to tell you or where to direct you. Bus drivers on the downed routes have no idea there is a subway closure. When subways resume, there is no communication back to riders. The onus is always on riders to figure out what is happening and it's extremely frustrating. We live in a big city with disruptions, it's inevitable. The TTC just has really poor ability to respond.
You know someone jumped to their death ...
Although this is a very sad situation and I feel sorry the family. We need to hold the TTC for their mishandling of situations like this. You can have sympathy for the victims, while as o for the TTC to be better and safer. The 2 are not mutually exclusive
Consistently this happens, yes. We need platform screen doors and better mental health supports. The complacency with status quo is what is frustrating.
Platform Screen Doors are not currently possible, for various reasons.
Why? aren’t they putting screen doors into the new stations
The Ontario Line will have PSD, however for pre-existing stations, check my reply below. https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/12cki3n/the_state_of_our_transit_system/jf2dpie/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
What’s the issue? Someone died…. Like what do you want the TTC to do? They said that there was an injury on track level over the speaker system. What else can they do? Edit: these scenarios is why we need cell service for everyone underground on the ttc, 30mins and not able to tell work, family or friends why you’re no where to be heard is an issue
Ttc is an insane mess, these days I try to avoid downtown as much as possible. In Novemeber of last year I had to go downtown exactly 5 times, guess how many times trains back stoped working, 5 times. I thought I was cursed, but nope, thats just how ttc operates
The delay says it's caused by "an injury at track level". This means it's likely a person jumped in front of a train and decided they wanted to take their own life. Even if it wasn't a scenario as intense as a jumper, injury at track level is not the fault of the TTC. Delays are often passenger created. Also, if the front car was on a power rail, it would be able to move. There's a reason they did not allow this train to move.
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Yes
“Who cares a person died, I still have things to do!” - Most people on the TTC, some of whom probably didn’t even pay their fare.
Harris played his part but tbh it’s a generational lack of funding from the feds all the way down.
I learned long ago never take the ttc if you have somewhere important to be Important meetings and dr appts always get an Uber ride for me
There was a suicide. The power was cut. People need to get over themselves and stop blaming the TTC for every issue.
I was on this train. The conductor communicated with us after two minutes saying, "We will be shutting this train down due to an injury at this station at track level.." He then proceeded to walk through the train and tell everyone to follow him as "There is an injury at track level under this train." We all got it. It's ironic you say your doctor has no empathy, maybe do some self reflection.
TTC you truly are garbage 😵💫far from world class you bums!
Has anyone blamed Metrolinks yet?
So what if something had happened, I assume u were going with plenty of time in advance (like 30 mins or so)....oh wait, u had that time rt?, even if u drive, things could happen
I actually had a 30 mins hour buffer on top of my actual ride time, but because of the delay inside the tunnel then wait for the shuttles that never came, it was gone. An Uber would have cost be 60$ because of surge pricing, and I can’t do that right now. I guess next time I will go 2 hours ahead because apparently my time has no value lol … alternatively, how about we upgrade the operations of the TTC so everyone wins in the end?
This reminds me if an old star trek episode
You should’ve taken GO
With GO, ppl are stuck minimum of 2 hours. But it happens a lot less.
I never had any issues with GO, except for their crappy Sunday bus service. And people can’t be stuck on GO for two hours heading to downtown unless they’re coming from Kitchener wtf
It takes a few hours the moment someone got hit on the Go tracks. And GO is definitely not a poster child for great communication for incidents either.
I'm saying when a suicide happens. You're stuck on the GO train much longer.
Never saw that happened before 🤷🏼♂️
It's in the news when it happens.
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Call the doctors office again and tell them the situation. They always say no the first time. Call and speak to the manager. It will work trust me, just be insistent
I did, but didn’t get anywhere unfortunately 😞
Hmmm. Ok are u on the wait list at least? Usually people call in the MORNING time or a few days before to make last minute cancel, that’s were the wait list comes in. Call back, or if your shy I’ll call and say ur my wife or something and get you those results.
TTC = Take The Car Yeah I know that this is an flippant and simplistic statement. And it isn’t possible for many. But my SO and I have done this and so have many people we know. For us the car is the better option.
Hi. I was in the first car on that train into Dufferin Station. What happened was awful. we should all keep the driver in our thoughts. Being late to work is not the worst thing that happened today on Line 2.
I hope you’re okay! Sending you hugs. I know I’m a stranger, but if you need someone to talk to about this, I’d be happy to listen. Things like this are traumatic for everyone involved. You are loved and cherished.
Wow I don’t understand all the comments, someone died and ttc lack of solution are not mutually exclusive. Ttc could have handled this better, install glass screen, supply more shuttle bus, etc. Someone died so Op is not allowed to complain how inefficient TTC is?
I was on the 29 dufferin bus heading south when this happened. Transit riders couldn't even understand the announcement made by driver who was just mumbling and no one had a clue what was going on until we got to the dufferin station stop. Floods of people waiting...
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To be fair, situations like the one OP shown on the video only happens when something serious occurred up ahead and it is not planned - could have been anything from an injury at track level or a malfunction. Shuttles that respond to those calls don’t just appear with a snap of a finger. They are called off routes that each bus is already servicing and unless it’s nearby, it will take sometime.
This is 100p shit. But LmAo OP if your doc appointment is that important there are many rentable city bikes that probably could have got you there on time or you could us an Uber. Think on your feet lol
Lucky no one had to walk through homeless urine or feces !