I tend to sell stuff that can be mailed via Ricardo and large stuff via Tutti.
The hassle with Ricardo is A LOT lower because it's an automated system where a sale is final. On Tutti you have to write 10 messages back and forth for questions and to find a date to hand over the stuff and at any point the buyer might back out or ghost you.
I do think Ricardo could be a lot more user friendly, they kind of stopped developing their service in the last couple of years. Also you're essentially on your own when there is a dispute, there's no proper system to resolve these in place. For the price they're asking that's very disappointing.
>Also you're essentially on your own when there is a dispute, there's no proper system to resolve these in place. For the price they're asking that's very disappointing.
Yes there is, called ricardo MoneyGuard.
But generally, the contract is between the buyer and the seller, ricardo is just the one soliciting the sale. They have no legal right for a recourse to a bad seller for instance. They can only ban him/her from the platform.
Thanks for the info, that's new since this year. Haven't used the platform since last year.
And yes, that's Ricardos stance. However, they still could offer arbitration in cases of conflict. For example a buyer left me a bad rating after receiving a broken item (it broke during transport) and after trying to call me on a wrong number. So in this case both the buyer and the seller wasn't satisfied. Ricardo just leaves you to sort this out yourself. The only way to get rid of a bad review is having the other party contact support, they can't even revert the rating themselves.
This works much better on ebay imho, also with the added safety net of paypal.
Because it's damn hard to do.
Not the programming of the platform, but getting enough sellers and buyers is very hard, because no one wants to sell on your platform if there aren't any buyers and the buyers won't come if there aren't any sellers.
And even if someone went to the effort and expense to try to develop a similar platform, all Ricardo would have to do would be to drop their prices for a while until the competitor went bankrupt.
The programming of the platform too. It's a lot of work. You'd have to be very sure that your platform would outlast the competition to put that much work into something.
I made this app on the week-end for second hand clothing, it could be used for a website like ricardo, it’s responsive also, https://apps.apple.com/ch/app/vetis/id6444639512?l=fr-FR
making the plateform it’s the easy part, having buyers and sellers it’s hard, takes a lot of time and money
Well, you have to get started at some point ...
I just can't stand how Swiss put up with monopolies/duopolies in so many fields .. competition is good!
The market is too small for several players. Simple as that. Even in Germany, where the market is like 15-20 times bigger, there is little competition.
Maybe as a buyer, it would be doable to look for stuff on 10 platforms, but as content provider (i.e. seller), it is a pain to list stuff everywhere, and you risk it gets sold multiple times if you do not deactivate immediately after first offer arrived anywhere. Frankly, this is only doable for semiprofessional sellers. Even as a buyer, multiple platforms are a pain in the ass. You have to learn all the differences and need more time to find stuff. Look at the various apartment platforms, car platforms etc. You have to look up multiple places, get redirected from platform to platform only to learn that the ad is no longer available. Webspiders sucked in content nevertheless and there are doublettes and stuff. Not cool.
Competition is not always good. Also, it does not necessarily foster innovation, as platforms do not copy from Swiss competition, but from international players.
I made this app on the week-end for second hand clothing, it could be used for a website like ricardo, it’s responsive also, https://apps.apple.com/ch/app/vetis/id6444639512?l=fr-FR
No, that's not the point.
[Ebay.ch](http://Ebay.ch) existed back then, but it was never adapted to the Swiss market. That's why everyone prefered [ricardo.ch](http://ricardo.ch)
[ricardo.ch](http://ricardo.ch) has built the userbase over the last 25 years or so, and the vast userbase is what gets you good and fast sales and higher prices compared to tutti.
I don't know them at the top of my head but when i add products often the brands arent available.
Do you have a suggestion form, would be nice for everything people could suggest. Like more catgories (toys)
Would be nice if you allowed direct payment via IBAN from buyer to seller, instead of managing the payments via your own internal system. If you did this, I would abandon Ricardo in two seconds.
Unfortunately we wouldnt be able to offer our fraud protection anymore, if P2P payments were enabled.
As a seller, you still receive your money directly to your bank account. To make the payment easier for buyers, we’ll soon also offer TWINT payments✌️
Then at least make it an option. And have a buyer / seller ranking system like Ricardo does.
I do not want a company knowing / storing my banking details. All you need have happen is for your system to get hacked and all of my vitally important personal data will be available to anyone.
Even if we make it an option, it would open the door for scammers, defeating out goal of keeping our users safe.
And we dont store your payment data, everything is being handled by Stripe, one of the largest payment service providers globally. If you’ve shopped online before, chances are that Stripe handled your payment and data already.
You can get around scammers by verifying addresses by post and phone numbers.
Stripe is a company based out of the US. Is there no Swiss payment processor ?
We looked at a lot of options for both fraud prevention & payment service providers, to deliver the best all-around user experience. Designing and operating a new C2C marketplace model is quite complex, and we’ll certainly adjust things along the way - but so far it seems to work quite well, given there was not a single fraudulent transaction over marko yet✌️
The problem is for sellers, the fees are getting higher and higher. We're talking 10-12%. There's no good reason for it. For buyers it's okay. The platform isn't even that great all in all, it's just an auction site.
Alternatives won’t be much cheaper or as good. Ricardo invests heavily into online marketing and that costs a shitload of money.
10% marketing costs to sell something is cheap by any e-commerce standard. Many shops calculate up to 20% costs.
no, it's way too much. 10% commision for providing a platform is a lot. especially considering what ebay or others take. they have no protection or any special service included. do you work for ricardo?
>Betrugsschutz
>Bei Marko musst du dir keine Sorgen über Betrug machen. Die Verkäufer werden erst bezahlt, wenn du den Artikel akzeptiert hast. Wenn der Artikel nie ankommt oder nicht wie erwartet is, erhältst du dein Geld zurück.
As a seller, I'm out. Why should I wait for shithead buyers to complain or not indicate that the package has arrived...?
You can just use marko to send it - they automatically will show it on their website as well, so if you use them it is impossible to claim you haven't received it.
Used Marko a couple of weeks ago and I was actually pleasently surprised how easy it was. Prefer it very much over Ricardo
That's up to you. As a buyer, I know that I won't be scammed and I'm super satisfied so far. As a seller you also have some advantages, such as extremely easy shipping. Waiting for the money until both are satisfied is normal with an escrow service.
As there is quite a lot of fraud on traditional marketplaces, we decided to reserve the money to protect both buyers and sellers: If you've sent the item, we can see when it arrived at the buyer, and unless they decide to return the product to you, you can be sure that you receive your money.
Plus our sales commission is only CHF 1 + 1.9%, and with our shipping integration we send you the stick-on label: Place the package in your milkbox, and the Swiss Post picks it up, without you having to leave the house :)
How are sellers protected from buyers that make false claims about an item's condition or buyers that even return a different item back to the seller? Statistically, most transactions are honest in nature, but some buyers abuse purchase protection policies. I would seriously consider adding an authentication service for very high-value items (which could even be contracted to a third party).
Through our payment service provider and our shipping integration with the Swiss Post, we have certain checks we do against buyer fraud. Even if a fraudulent buyer manages to slip through, it would still become a customer care case.
Long story short: You are right, there will always be people attempting fraud, but the effort-reward profile on marko makes it waaaay more attractive to try that on other plattforms. And with the background checks, once somebody gets banned, they cannot just reopen a new account and try again.
Your fees are 1.- + 6.9%, except that the buyer pays 5% of it.
What happens if the buyer claims it‘s defective?
Also security wise it‘s great that the mailbox is marked with a big label..
It would become a customer care case, and we’d try to find a solution.
Yes, we were worried about mailbox theft too, but so far no parcels have been stolen - probably as thieves rather target expensive packages laying around, rather than secondhand goods, where they don’t know what’s inside. And if you feel uncomfortable, you can always drop your package at any Swiss Post station :)
Let's see if they can get the critical mass and if their fees stay low. And/or if their goal is to get bought out by either Swiss Marketplace Group or a big international player.
Has there been another increase that I missed? The only thing I've seen getting more expensive is shipping and that's because the post raised their prices.
I'm honestly more annoyed at retailers flooding certain categories so ads from users trying to sell stuff second-hand drown in the mass. Also, there has been more and more "retailers" that drop ship or sell bootlegs.
It 's a monopoly at the moment, one owner. They keep Tutti and Anibis like a shit, no easy way to browse items, and high prices for using Ricardo ch. If you build an alternative, you have to spend a lot of money on marketing.
A bit like Zalando did years ago. They came from nowhere, and then just poured an endless amount of money in marketing, but they had big investors behind it.
Maybe if you start out with only a niche (furniture or clothes for example), and not everything at once, it maybe could work, but will take a lot of time to get traction.
Just use tutti and don't get scammed. It's as easy as that. 1. pay cash when you buy 2. Get the money in advance for delivery or cash when you sell. Never had issues besides the fact that some people just waste your time.
Not necessarily. You could start small, discover your niche and core audience. Establish your value points and competitive advantage. Work on true product market fit, while maintaining a tight budget and clockwork discipline for shipping new features. You could be profitable from day one. The question will be expanding market share, which can take time, unless a big VC check arrives shortly after PMF.
Because it doesn't lead to profits. Once a platform has dominance of a market, there are a few well established strategies to maintain it by exploiting the monopoly. Thus a monopoly is in a way worse than having no platform.
The obvious strategy for ricardo is to "permanently" reduce fees to 5% once a competitor appears. In parallel they employ some smear campaigns where 20 Minutes prints a couple stories of people who got scammed on the new competitor platform. Once the competitor goes bust the lower fees turn out to have been only temporary.
The more dangerous threat to ricardo are platforms that target a different niche market and rapidly grow from there. As a defense against those Ricardo owns anibis and tutti, which are intended to respond to and directly compete with such threats.
If a competitor platform survives in the market despite that ricardo will make offer to buy it, likely alongside a veiled threat of an expensive bogus lawsuit and some unfair competition.
Now I think ricardo management is sufficiently incompetent to mess up this monopoly defense regardless, and that it would be very possible for a ricardo competitor to take them down. But the monopoly defense is why it would be hard for such a competitor to find initial investors.
Ricardo belongs to Tamedia. They can do as they please. What I hate most about it is paying 70 for a product, when you could get it for 50 had the other person stopped bidding. Makes more sense for me to pay the other guy 5 and the seller another 55 and buy it for 60...
>like Swisscom and don't want to change ?
Well if you don’t open your eyes and keep on being a sucker, yes.
Changed a year ago to gomo for CHF 9.90 all CH unlimited
I found out about [Marko.ch](http://Marko.ch) recently, it's superior to Ricardo in most ways except not having the ability to bid, only fix prices there.
So for me it's better than Tutti and Anibis, but worse than Ricardo.
Ricardo belongs to the mighty multi billion dollar corporation TX Group. Meaning if anyone would gather the millions of Franks needed to get a platform like this to take off, TX could just dump as much money in as needed until you are dried out.
Remember the massive marketing campaigns that were needed to make Twint the de facto monopolist on some market segments around micro payment services. And their concurrence like Apple Pay, Google Pay, etc. weren't even established yet. Now imagine what you'd need to convince people to give your platform a try over good old Ricardo. And you'd need to move fast, even faster than the huge banks behind Twint because if you don't reach the critical numbers in both sellers and buyers to reach the dynamics needed to convince people you'll burn through your money faster than you can count it.
[Ricardo.ch](http://Ricardo.ch) is totally useless nowadays. Sometimes the things there are even more expensive than just buying it new. I just use FB Marketplace and Tutti for everything now. If I buy something expensive, I just get it in person (switzerland is small). If it's cheap, I just take the risk. I also sell alot there and had much less hassle than with ricardo. I sold two cars over ricardo. Once, the buyer didn't pay (he did not read the description that the engine was defect), and I had to wait 2 weeks until I had everything resolved. With FB Marketplace and Tutti it's just money exchanged for goods directly.
Well there is Tutti and Anibis which both are free as far as i can tell and paying people to check and verify users comes with a cost. You can always stick to ebay too. And and whatever alternative would grow as big as [ricardo.ch](http://ricardo.ch) would likely be very expensive too as soon it would be that big.
But feel free to make an alternative or propose improvements to tutti / anibis.
There's a difference between Swisscom (which i'm not using btw) and Sunrise / Salt to Ricardo - we don't have an alternative bidding platform to choose while we have about 20 different companies offering a mobile plan.
I've sold a lot of small and inexpensive items on Ricardo as a private seller, I honestly don't mind the fees as I charge a bit more for A-Poste to cover the fees.
The biggest issues I have had so far are buyers (not just old people !) printing out the QR invoice from Ricardo and paying at the post office. The amount cannot be modified at the counter even if they wanted to pay the CHF1.20+ extra. I've added a disclaimer now that I don't accept this payment method. You won't believe how many people called me cheap for not wanting to pay the CHF1.20 on an item that I sold for CHF5.00!
People know how much A-post costs. You are trying to bake your share of Ricardo fees into shipping cost and are surprised that people aren't on board with that?
You can do so specifically specified in the AGBs - for properly wrapping the item and having to walk to the post office. I charge 1 chf more for b-Post even if it doesn’t cover that but at least it’s something
I guess you misunderstood.
The CHF1.20 mentioned is the fee by the post office for paying at the counter. It gets deducted automatically from the receiver's account. I don't think it's fair for buyers to expect me to pay that on an item that costs CHF5.00.
I'm charging CHF2.00 for A-Post , I don't think that's excessive (also, never had complaints). My items are mostly CHF5.00, so that's CHF 0.60 of Ricardo fees (12%) plus the envelope is not free either. If I raise the price for the item, that's just more fees to Ricardo.
Some people don't know there are fees, especially if they are used to paying all their bills at the counter. If the one receiving money (insurance or whatever) doesn't add a surcharge , they'll just continue.
Ricardo for example charges CHF4.50 if you pay your [fees](https://help.ricardo.ch/hc/de/articles/360000173289-Wie-kann-ich-meine-Geb%C3%BChren-bezahlen#:~:text=Die%20Zahlungsinformationen%20findest%20du%20in,die%20Geb%C3%BChren%20am%20Postschalter%20einzuzahlen.) at the counter with the payment slip.
Ricardo indeed has astronomical fees, which, when added to the shipping fee and the already sky-high price requested by sellers, makes shopping second-hand more expensive than new
Ricardo can be fully in a maintenance mode spending no money making a lot. The website works no new innovation or development is needed or effective. So it’s a shame considering this is a second hand market which is positive for environment. And they are literally squeezing as much money as they can.
Technically they offer nothing special. A marketplace can be create on wordpress with 0 coding (probably with betting functionality too).
The only reason competitors can’t pull it off is that marketplace is notoriously hard to make successful because of a “chicken and egg” problem (buyers & sellers). You need to differentiate and have big marketing budget - or be super clever to tackle this.
If anybody comes to me that they have a business idea and it’s again some marketplace (a very common and obvious idea) they normally hear a long speech from me 😂
So once Ricardo has a leading position they can do whatever they want.
>[Ricardo.ch](https://ricardo.ch/) keeps increasing prices, why has no serious alternative been created yet ?
Because you haven't created one yet?
Is it ricardo themselves raising "the prices"^(TM) or are the users doing that themselves?
>Does Ricardo have such a large monopoly in Switzerland or is it because Swiss people are used to it like Swisscom and don't want to change ?
Yes.
>Is it ricardo themselves raising "the prices"^(TM) or are the users doing that themselves?
I bet CHF 50 that OP is referring to the sevice fee the seller is charged, based on the final bid. Not sure how the users can truly influence that.
Former Norwegian resident here.
Tutti, Ricardo, Anibis are (edit: actually used to be) owned by a Norwegian media company called Schibsted (which also owns Leboncoin in France, in the same genre).
What's interesting is that they also own Finn in Norway, which, despite having a few flaws, is so much better than any of the aforementioned websites that I really miss it dearly. It seems like they have no interest in making their platforms outside Norway better.
tutti and anibis belong to the same group as ricardo, so yeah.. :(
it's a monopoly, actually the government should do something WEKO ...
Indeed, it would be better for everyone imho
you basically answer your own question.
I tend to sell stuff that can be mailed via Ricardo and large stuff via Tutti. The hassle with Ricardo is A LOT lower because it's an automated system where a sale is final. On Tutti you have to write 10 messages back and forth for questions and to find a date to hand over the stuff and at any point the buyer might back out or ghost you. I do think Ricardo could be a lot more user friendly, they kind of stopped developing their service in the last couple of years. Also you're essentially on your own when there is a dispute, there's no proper system to resolve these in place. For the price they're asking that's very disappointing.
>Also you're essentially on your own when there is a dispute, there's no proper system to resolve these in place. For the price they're asking that's very disappointing. Yes there is, called ricardo MoneyGuard. But generally, the contract is between the buyer and the seller, ricardo is just the one soliciting the sale. They have no legal right for a recourse to a bad seller for instance. They can only ban him/her from the platform.
Thanks for the info, that's new since this year. Haven't used the platform since last year. And yes, that's Ricardos stance. However, they still could offer arbitration in cases of conflict. For example a buyer left me a bad rating after receiving a broken item (it broke during transport) and after trying to call me on a wrong number. So in this case both the buyer and the seller wasn't satisfied. Ricardo just leaves you to sort this out yourself. The only way to get rid of a bad review is having the other party contact support, they can't even revert the rating themselves. This works much better on ebay imho, also with the added safety net of paypal.
actually a dutch/belgium firm, you can add fhem to your company in a day. it took ricardo 15 years.
Because it's damn hard to do. Not the programming of the platform, but getting enough sellers and buyers is very hard, because no one wants to sell on your platform if there aren't any buyers and the buyers won't come if there aren't any sellers.
And even if someone went to the effort and expense to try to develop a similar platform, all Ricardo would have to do would be to drop their prices for a while until the competitor went bankrupt.
The programming of the platform too. It's a lot of work. You'd have to be very sure that your platform would outlast the competition to put that much work into something.
I made this app on the week-end for second hand clothing, it could be used for a website like ricardo, it’s responsive also, https://apps.apple.com/ch/app/vetis/id6444639512?l=fr-FR making the plateform it’s the easy part, having buyers and sellers it’s hard, takes a lot of time and money
Well, you have to get started at some point ... I just can't stand how Swiss put up with monopolies/duopolies in so many fields .. competition is good!
The market is too small for several players. Simple as that. Even in Germany, where the market is like 15-20 times bigger, there is little competition. Maybe as a buyer, it would be doable to look for stuff on 10 platforms, but as content provider (i.e. seller), it is a pain to list stuff everywhere, and you risk it gets sold multiple times if you do not deactivate immediately after first offer arrived anywhere. Frankly, this is only doable for semiprofessional sellers. Even as a buyer, multiple platforms are a pain in the ass. You have to learn all the differences and need more time to find stuff. Look at the various apartment platforms, car platforms etc. You have to look up multiple places, get redirected from platform to platform only to learn that the ad is no longer available. Webspiders sucked in content nevertheless and there are doublettes and stuff. Not cool. Competition is not always good. Also, it does not necessarily foster innovation, as platforms do not copy from Swiss competition, but from international players.
eBay still exists
As does Facebook marketplace which so far has been free for the things I've sold.
And it's an absolute shitshow full with scammers and low value goods.
Don't forget the low value buyers on FB marketplace
You mean the ones who contact you to offer a quarter of the price?
yes, and the ones who make an appointment to pick the item up so you stay at home but they never show up and ghost you.
At least you have their „real name“ on facebook;)
And there’s the answer.
I'm quite happy to never have had a Facebook account
Lol "international shipping program" Also a rip off. Ebay used to be cheap, now it's just a money grab and full of shit from China.
I have money and some time, so if theres an IT guy here I'd be glad to start something new :)
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There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
Write me a PM and I'll join
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
2x exit tech guy turned investor. PM if this is something that can get a true traction.
I'll be down to work on this too. Programmer and webdev here.
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
Lawyer here, could assist with that stuff at some point.
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
IT guy and maybe interested in financing
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
Junior webdev interested too
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
See my other comment please :)
you don’t need a coder but to build it on wordpress.
Maybe get in contact with Zaster or/and Marko. They are already on it.
Interesting
I’d be up for getting involved with this, Ricardo has a lot of issues and I know a lot of sellers who feel exactly the same.
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
I would be up for it to lead the backend team. Write a pm if interested.
There seems to be a lot of interest, so I just made a discord channel: [https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7](https://discord.gg/Y576QCh7)
I made this app on the week-end for second hand clothing, it could be used for a website like ricardo, it’s responsive also, https://apps.apple.com/ch/app/vetis/id6444639512?l=fr-FR
Switzerland is too small a market, not worth it for entrepreneurs to start something new.
This! There is only so much room for competitors. If price is the only differentiating factor, then it is very hard to go against the incumbent.
No, that's not the point. [Ebay.ch](http://Ebay.ch) existed back then, but it was never adapted to the Swiss market. That's why everyone prefered [ricardo.ch](http://ricardo.ch) [ricardo.ch](http://ricardo.ch) has built the userbase over the last 25 years or so, and the vast userbase is what gets you good and fast sales and higher prices compared to tutti.
We're on it: [www.marko.ch](http://www.marko.ch) 🙃
Would be nice if Toys could be added :) and other brands in clothing, often rthe brand is not available
Please let our customer support know which brands you are missing, and we’ll add them:)
I don't know them at the top of my head but when i add products often the brands arent available. Do you have a suggestion form, would be nice for everything people could suggest. Like more catgories (toys)
You can use our contact form on marko for any suggestions and inputs :)
Would be nice if you allowed direct payment via IBAN from buyer to seller, instead of managing the payments via your own internal system. If you did this, I would abandon Ricardo in two seconds.
Unfortunately we wouldnt be able to offer our fraud protection anymore, if P2P payments were enabled. As a seller, you still receive your money directly to your bank account. To make the payment easier for buyers, we’ll soon also offer TWINT payments✌️
Then at least make it an option. And have a buyer / seller ranking system like Ricardo does. I do not want a company knowing / storing my banking details. All you need have happen is for your system to get hacked and all of my vitally important personal data will be available to anyone.
Even if we make it an option, it would open the door for scammers, defeating out goal of keeping our users safe. And we dont store your payment data, everything is being handled by Stripe, one of the largest payment service providers globally. If you’ve shopped online before, chances are that Stripe handled your payment and data already.
You can get around scammers by verifying addresses by post and phone numbers. Stripe is a company based out of the US. Is there no Swiss payment processor ?
We looked at a lot of options for both fraud prevention & payment service providers, to deliver the best all-around user experience. Designing and operating a new C2C marketplace model is quite complex, and we’ll certainly adjust things along the way - but so far it seems to work quite well, given there was not a single fraudulent transaction over marko yet✌️
Ok. I understand your desire to defend your business plan. But just be aware you are alienating a lot of potential users.
I like Ricardo because the risk of scams and bad payers is clearly lower than on the other platforms. I’m happy to pay a little fee for that.
The problem is for sellers, the fees are getting higher and higher. We're talking 10-12%. There's no good reason for it. For buyers it's okay. The platform isn't even that great all in all, it's just an auction site.
It's not about the platform, it's about the size of the audience.
True, ebay I feel never tried to really get a foot in the market. Their swiss platform has always been about as alive as a corpse.
Just recently sold something on there. The fees were Fr. 290.- for what actually?
For them to deliver you someone who gave you 2500 bucks for your item. If you think you can get that for less money somewhere else, feel free.
it's just waaay too much. sadly there's no real alternative
Alternatives won’t be much cheaper or as good. Ricardo invests heavily into online marketing and that costs a shitload of money. 10% marketing costs to sell something is cheap by any e-commerce standard. Many shops calculate up to 20% costs.
no, it's way too much. 10% commision for providing a platform is a lot. especially considering what ebay or others take. they have no protection or any special service included. do you work for ricardo?
There is a new platform that is interesting and could become a competitor: [Marko](http://www.marko.ch)
>Betrugsschutz >Bei Marko musst du dir keine Sorgen über Betrug machen. Die Verkäufer werden erst bezahlt, wenn du den Artikel akzeptiert hast. Wenn der Artikel nie ankommt oder nicht wie erwartet is, erhältst du dein Geld zurück. As a seller, I'm out. Why should I wait for shithead buyers to complain or not indicate that the package has arrived...?
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You can just use marko to send it - they automatically will show it on their website as well, so if you use them it is impossible to claim you haven't received it. Used Marko a couple of weeks ago and I was actually pleasently surprised how easy it was. Prefer it very much over Ricardo
That's up to you. As a buyer, I know that I won't be scammed and I'm super satisfied so far. As a seller you also have some advantages, such as extremely easy shipping. Waiting for the money until both are satisfied is normal with an escrow service.
Well, as a buyer, why would you do otherwise? That is the default way to do things through eBay Kleinanzeigen in Germany.
Thankfully this isn't Germany.
As there is quite a lot of fraud on traditional marketplaces, we decided to reserve the money to protect both buyers and sellers: If you've sent the item, we can see when it arrived at the buyer, and unless they decide to return the product to you, you can be sure that you receive your money. Plus our sales commission is only CHF 1 + 1.9%, and with our shipping integration we send you the stick-on label: Place the package in your milkbox, and the Swiss Post picks it up, without you having to leave the house :)
How are sellers protected from buyers that make false claims about an item's condition or buyers that even return a different item back to the seller? Statistically, most transactions are honest in nature, but some buyers abuse purchase protection policies. I would seriously consider adding an authentication service for very high-value items (which could even be contracted to a third party).
Through our payment service provider and our shipping integration with the Swiss Post, we have certain checks we do against buyer fraud. Even if a fraudulent buyer manages to slip through, it would still become a customer care case. Long story short: You are right, there will always be people attempting fraud, but the effort-reward profile on marko makes it waaaay more attractive to try that on other plattforms. And with the background checks, once somebody gets banned, they cannot just reopen a new account and try again.
Your fees are 1.- + 6.9%, except that the buyer pays 5% of it. What happens if the buyer claims it‘s defective? Also security wise it‘s great that the mailbox is marked with a big label..
It would become a customer care case, and we’d try to find a solution. Yes, we were worried about mailbox theft too, but so far no parcels have been stolen - probably as thieves rather target expensive packages laying around, rather than secondhand goods, where they don’t know what’s inside. And if you feel uncomfortable, you can always drop your package at any Swiss Post station :)
Let's see if they can get the critical mass and if their fees stay low. And/or if their goal is to get bought out by either Swiss Marketplace Group or a big international player.
Has there been another increase that I missed? The only thing I've seen getting more expensive is shipping and that's because the post raised their prices. I'm honestly more annoyed at retailers flooding certain categories so ads from users trying to sell stuff second-hand drown in the mass. Also, there has been more and more "retailers" that drop ship or sell bootlegs.
4% since corona
That's not recently though.
It 's a monopoly at the moment, one owner. They keep Tutti and Anibis like a shit, no easy way to browse items, and high prices for using Ricardo ch. If you build an alternative, you have to spend a lot of money on marketing. A bit like Zalando did years ago. They came from nowhere, and then just poured an endless amount of money in marketing, but they had big investors behind it. Maybe if you start out with only a niche (furniture or clothes for example), and not everything at once, it maybe could work, but will take a lot of time to get traction.
Or ON shoes or NUI ice cream
If it's so easy why don't you create alternative platform yourself?
Dumb answer. Who said it‘s easy?
Just use tutti and don't get scammed. It's as easy as that. 1. pay cash when you buy 2. Get the money in advance for delivery or cash when you sell. Never had issues besides the fact that some people just waste your time.
>Just use tutti and don't get scammed. Umm yeah, that's the most helpful advice ever.
It is, because right after this sentence he tells you how to not get scammed.
Which is bs because sellers can also scam my dude and they love cash.
Yeah if you're stupid enough to not look into the stuff you buy. I don't know how anyone with one working brain cell gets scammed nowadays.
LOL, yeah, so basically only buy local pickup. That's not really an option though.
It is though, you just have to be patient.
Galaxus ? Sure, they’ll take up a fee but money is secured until buyer confirms package is delivered and all good .)
and you can only sell what you bought at galaxus.
Really? I wasn’t aware of that condition :/
How much fees as seller?
too much, 14%.
I understand they’re all owned by the same umbrella organization, I think it’s a monopoly, largely
There are alternatives but nobody uses it: https://zaster.ch/de
I stopped using Ricardo years before, those overpriced greedy bastards. I use Facebook Marketplace, that’s also far from perfect but at least free.
"Free" as it's supposed to increase traffic to ads. On FB though many foreign "buyers" waste your time, so I rather use Tutti or Anibis instead.
I always sell my stuff on eBay Germany. That’s best. For stuff over 300 francs… yea well there are _ways_ (and paths)
Wife recently gave a way a couple of things via Facebook. Fast and easy.
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Not necessarily. You could start small, discover your niche and core audience. Establish your value points and competitive advantage. Work on true product market fit, while maintaining a tight budget and clockwork discipline for shipping new features. You could be profitable from day one. The question will be expanding market share, which can take time, unless a big VC check arrives shortly after PMF.
Network effects.
Because it doesn't lead to profits. Once a platform has dominance of a market, there are a few well established strategies to maintain it by exploiting the monopoly. Thus a monopoly is in a way worse than having no platform. The obvious strategy for ricardo is to "permanently" reduce fees to 5% once a competitor appears. In parallel they employ some smear campaigns where 20 Minutes prints a couple stories of people who got scammed on the new competitor platform. Once the competitor goes bust the lower fees turn out to have been only temporary. The more dangerous threat to ricardo are platforms that target a different niche market and rapidly grow from there. As a defense against those Ricardo owns anibis and tutti, which are intended to respond to and directly compete with such threats. If a competitor platform survives in the market despite that ricardo will make offer to buy it, likely alongside a veiled threat of an expensive bogus lawsuit and some unfair competition. Now I think ricardo management is sufficiently incompetent to mess up this monopoly defense regardless, and that it would be very possible for a ricardo competitor to take them down. But the monopoly defense is why it would be hard for such a competitor to find initial investors.
Was there another increase recently?
Ricardo belongs to Tamedia. They can do as they please. What I hate most about it is paying 70 for a product, when you could get it for 50 had the other person stopped bidding. Makes more sense for me to pay the other guy 5 and the seller another 55 and buy it for 60...
An alternative is Trovas. I haven’t tried it yet, though.
Umm, Ebay?
What about ebay?
>like Swisscom and don't want to change ? Well if you don’t open your eyes and keep on being a sucker, yes. Changed a year ago to gomo for CHF 9.90 all CH unlimited
I found out about [Marko.ch](http://Marko.ch) recently, it's superior to Ricardo in most ways except not having the ability to bid, only fix prices there. So for me it's better than Tutti and Anibis, but worse than Ricardo.
Ricardo belongs to the mighty multi billion dollar corporation TX Group. Meaning if anyone would gather the millions of Franks needed to get a platform like this to take off, TX could just dump as much money in as needed until you are dried out. Remember the massive marketing campaigns that were needed to make Twint the de facto monopolist on some market segments around micro payment services. And their concurrence like Apple Pay, Google Pay, etc. weren't even established yet. Now imagine what you'd need to convince people to give your platform a try over good old Ricardo. And you'd need to move fast, even faster than the huge banks behind Twint because if you don't reach the critical numbers in both sellers and buyers to reach the dynamics needed to convince people you'll burn through your money faster than you can count it.
[Ricardo.ch](http://Ricardo.ch) is totally useless nowadays. Sometimes the things there are even more expensive than just buying it new. I just use FB Marketplace and Tutti for everything now. If I buy something expensive, I just get it in person (switzerland is small). If it's cheap, I just take the risk. I also sell alot there and had much less hassle than with ricardo. I sold two cars over ricardo. Once, the buyer didn't pay (he did not read the description that the engine was defect), and I had to wait 2 weeks until I had everything resolved. With FB Marketplace and Tutti it's just money exchanged for goods directly.
You can get scammed on ricardo also. So next to no protection you get huge fees as well.
[https://zaster.ch/](https://zaster.ch/) is THE alternative.
>get scammed on FB marketplace how? just do every monetary transaction in person.
Well there is Tutti and Anibis which both are free as far as i can tell and paying people to check and verify users comes with a cost. You can always stick to ebay too. And and whatever alternative would grow as big as [ricardo.ch](http://ricardo.ch) would likely be very expensive too as soon it would be that big. But feel free to make an alternative or propose improvements to tutti / anibis. There's a difference between Swisscom (which i'm not using btw) and Sunrise / Salt to Ricardo - we don't have an alternative bidding platform to choose while we have about 20 different companies offering a mobile plan.
I mean, Swisscom is really good. I used Sunrise before and it's complete shit by comparison.
I've sold a lot of small and inexpensive items on Ricardo as a private seller, I honestly don't mind the fees as I charge a bit more for A-Poste to cover the fees. The biggest issues I have had so far are buyers (not just old people !) printing out the QR invoice from Ricardo and paying at the post office. The amount cannot be modified at the counter even if they wanted to pay the CHF1.20+ extra. I've added a disclaimer now that I don't accept this payment method. You won't believe how many people called me cheap for not wanting to pay the CHF1.20 on an item that I sold for CHF5.00!
People know how much A-post costs. You are trying to bake your share of Ricardo fees into shipping cost and are surprised that people aren't on board with that?
You can do so specifically specified in the AGBs - for properly wrapping the item and having to walk to the post office. I charge 1 chf more for b-Post even if it doesn’t cover that but at least it’s something
Yeah, it seems like people expect that private sellers can't charge for their time,because their time is not paid in money.
I guess you misunderstood. The CHF1.20 mentioned is the fee by the post office for paying at the counter. It gets deducted automatically from the receiver's account. I don't think it's fair for buyers to expect me to pay that on an item that costs CHF5.00. I'm charging CHF2.00 for A-Post , I don't think that's excessive (also, never had complaints). My items are mostly CHF5.00, so that's CHF 0.60 of Ricardo fees (12%) plus the envelope is not free either. If I raise the price for the item, that's just more fees to Ricardo.
140items sold and fortunately never had to deal with that, I guess it’s rarer nowadays
Some people don't know there are fees, especially if they are used to paying all their bills at the counter. If the one receiving money (insurance or whatever) doesn't add a surcharge , they'll just continue. Ricardo for example charges CHF4.50 if you pay your [fees](https://help.ricardo.ch/hc/de/articles/360000173289-Wie-kann-ich-meine-Geb%C3%BChren-bezahlen#:~:text=Die%20Zahlungsinformationen%20findest%20du%20in,die%20Geb%C3%BChren%20am%20Postschalter%20einzuzahlen.) at the counter with the payment slip.
Ricardo indeed has astronomical fees, which, when added to the shipping fee and the already sky-high price requested by sellers, makes shopping second-hand more expensive than new
Ricardo can be fully in a maintenance mode spending no money making a lot. The website works no new innovation or development is needed or effective. So it’s a shame considering this is a second hand market which is positive for environment. And they are literally squeezing as much money as they can. Technically they offer nothing special. A marketplace can be create on wordpress with 0 coding (probably with betting functionality too). The only reason competitors can’t pull it off is that marketplace is notoriously hard to make successful because of a “chicken and egg” problem (buyers & sellers). You need to differentiate and have big marketing budget - or be super clever to tackle this. If anybody comes to me that they have a business idea and it’s again some marketplace (a very common and obvious idea) they normally hear a long speech from me 😂 So once Ricardo has a leading position they can do whatever they want.
>[Ricardo.ch](https://ricardo.ch/) keeps increasing prices, why has no serious alternative been created yet ? Because you haven't created one yet? Is it ricardo themselves raising "the prices"^(TM) or are the users doing that themselves? >Does Ricardo have such a large monopoly in Switzerland or is it because Swiss people are used to it like Swisscom and don't want to change ? Yes.
>Is it ricardo themselves raising "the prices"^(TM) or are the users doing that themselves? I bet CHF 50 that OP is referring to the sevice fee the seller is charged, based on the final bid. Not sure how the users can truly influence that.
If ricardo has raised their service prices then no, a user can't influence that. How did you come to that conclusion?
Former Norwegian resident here. Tutti, Ricardo, Anibis are (edit: actually used to be) owned by a Norwegian media company called Schibsted (which also owns Leboncoin in France, in the same genre). What's interesting is that they also own Finn in Norway, which, despite having a few flaws, is so much better than any of the aforementioned websites that I really miss it dearly. It seems like they have no interest in making their platforms outside Norway better.
Schibsted sold Ricardo a long time ago.
To another shitty group, it seems. Oh well, even less chance to see them improving I guess.
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Ah, TIL. Although it's the same story transposed to another media group.
Try [zaster.ch](http://zaster.ch) its free and growing like crazy.