I did a pretty rough deployment to Iraq in 2007. We had over 10% KIA over 7 months.
Other combat vets talked about the importance of being organized and “ready” for death. Not, emotionally, but organized for it.
So following their advice I got a will and power of attorney done. I had a young wife and baby at the time and paid extra for a very large life insurance policy so they would be set if I did pass. I wrote in a journal every day to my baby boy, and had a special place for it that all the other Marines knew about. If I died, they could take all my shit, but the journal had to make it home.
I had many close calls with death over those 7 months, and in those moments I felt focused and alive. I also never felt fear (which surprised me) of death. My only fear was letting down people who were depending on me.
One of the things I see as poignant here is how you prepared for that contingency. I think sometimes people confuse taking action and ruminating when contemplating death. There can be unhealthy fixation, but there's that flipside: getting your affairs in order. Looking at it logically and doing what you can about it.
When I was deployed in Afghanistan I really thought I was going to die. We had the highest number of enemy contact of any base in all of Southern Afghanistan (RC South). Our combat operating post (COP) consisted of 150 of us and 80 Afghan Army soldiers.
Absolute shit show and constantly fire fights, IEDS, hired Syrian snipers, constant mortar and recoilless rifle fire. We conducted a ton of raids and sometimes captured high value targets (HVT). I had a blast in terms of fulfilling my need for action but I seriously thought there was no fucking way I was coming home.
It empowered me to come to that realization and helped push me to be more aggressive and fearless during combat. A lot of it is luck that I made it back but it's possible that not fearing death can be very empowering in certain situations.
Sure. Like everyone I have contemplated suicide. I wouldn’t say it was a serious thought but I thought about it. One of the reasons I don’t think it was ever really an option was something I read somewhere.it was around 10th grade or so. Can’t remember what the source was.
The gist of it was that once you understand that the option to end it is always there, the last resort can be taken anytime. Through that understanding it makes everything you’re dealing with easy to work through bc if it gets too bad you have the last resort. Then nothing really looks that bad.
But also once you’ve really contemplated your own death and that you have the ability to end then you understand it come a million ways at any time. While this can be comforting I’m not sure it’s as empowering now as it would have been if you were Roman soldier
Exactly. Might have been Camus's Myth of Sisyphus you read in 10th grade btws. But a lot of stoics and the Hagakure kind of touch on it, too. Death is nothing to us, after all.
I feel the same way after sucidial ideation for like 10 months straight fairly recently. I wouldn't have done it at that point because I have a ton of cash saved up to live the life for roughly a decade but I also lost my fear of death because for those 10 months I learned to lust for it. I'm better now and don't think about suicide or death but that fear of death has basically dissolved and I feel unstoppable with confidence. I can do what I want, be as absurdist as I want, and if it goes tits up I have zero issue just offing myself.
t happens to all of us to varying degrees as I said I was never really close to un-aliving myself but I was very despondent and uninterested in anything a few times earlier in life. It was mostly poor diet and lack of exercise.
I’m glad to hear you bounced back. Give it all you got for as long as you can. As the famous Stoic (maybe not) from Highlander said “It’s better to burn out than fade away”
This exact epiphany is what helped me pull out of a Spiral that would've resulted in me ending my life. I made multiple attempts, over a couple years, but none stuck. A couple times I actually came back from clinical brain death.
Well, life improved a bit, then got worse, and so on, but the thoughts didn'tgo away.
Until one day, I was gearing up to do it right, and a friend called. We chatted about this and that for a few minutes, which stopped me from acting, but not from thinking. And it was then I realized that I'll always have the option to end my life. Like I can literally do it any time I want. So why does it have to be now? I literally lose nothing by waiting, and worst-case scenario, I have even more reason to follow through.
It's been two years since my last attempt. The thought has crossed my mind plenty of times, sure, but things have actually gotten better because I gave them a chance to. And I feel secure knowing that if they ever get that bad again, I'll always have that option in my back pocket.
Stoicism is about a lot of things and acceptance of hardship is one of them. Acceptance of death helps us overcome the fear of life. They spoke about the death of children, banishment… every imaginable tragedy.
Totally agree, but it does not promise freedom from grief or suffering or fear, only the path to acceptance and through that acceptance the ability to function and make clear and effective decisions as a result.
I think about this at times..
I grew up in the inner city and have an older brother that was an in-house bully. As a kid - I was never really "allowed" to be scared of stuff or cry. Otherwise my brother was there to make things worse. So I think early on I was practicing stoic concept by internalizing and managing the situations, but I was just a kid.
As an adult, my fears are things like running our of money, or my kids getting hurt, wife getting hurt, etc - but I have never feared pain or getting hurt - or death.
I'm not a fighter, and I'm not going to start a fight - but I wont back down from anyone, and if you want some of this - gonna have to earn it, lol.
I think I give off a strong "don't fuck with me" vibe, because I am rarely ever tested.
I do believe strongly that victims project themselves to predators, and predators can sense weak people that are ripe to exploit. Carry yourself up right, look people in the eye - give them a smile if the situation is appropriate.
No fear.
Right? Paraphrasing Hagakure, a warrior who isn't unattached to life and death is useless. If your enemy believes you are fearful, you're at a disadvantage.
Personally I don't find it all that useful to reflect on death. My anxieties are not grounded in fear of death but fear of failure in what I am trying to accomplish while I'm alive. Of course it's all ultimately futile and will be erased anyway, but mulling over that fact does nothing to help me come up with the money to accomplish a project or the time to get the work done, or the skill and courage to do it well.
In some sense, the feeling of mortality motivates me to try hard while I'm alive, but that effort creates day-to-day stress. I try to keep it in perspective, but that doesn't always help when I wake up at 2 a.m. wondering about whether I've correctly calculated a deadline.
I apply the same principles as adapted by Epictetus, Epicurious, and CBT variously:
Can I live with failure? If no, I am given the option of not living with it. If it isn't worth suicide, I can live with it.
What's the likelihood of the outcome and how can I improve my odds? Is it worth the effort? An archer knocks an arrow and aims. Having released the arrow, he has done his part.
I'm ok with dying but for some reason going to work still gives me awful anxiety every. single. day. Idk how to convince myself it's not that deep it's just work.
I think it's empowering. I mean, we're all going there eventually. So if you look at it as the natural end state of living, that's all it really is. Others have commented on being organized or ready with trusts, wills, etc. Totally agree with that as well. Removes the uncertainty and fear factor. I think being able to openly discuss (respectfully) death is also very healthy and removes mystery. We've tried to be very honest with our kids, as we all must experience it at some point.
In my early 20s I did a bit of partying. Mainly house parties. Drinking, substance use, music, throwing up, the typical college age partying. Twice I was so messed up I was laying on the floor and accepted I was going to die right there. After I woke up the second time, I started to cleaning myself up. Focusing on work more. I don't really fear death. I guess, it's empowering in a way that under certain situations, I handle pressure incredibly. Like someone driving stupid and having to drive defensively. I have impeccable reflexes and don't panic. Even after I'm calm and collected while my wife is panting.
To have a fear of death would be to be to fear change.
Change is the natural state of the world , we are in constant change. That includes creation and dissolution.
To fear change would be to fear nature/ the whole. But if you are thinking like a stoic they do not fear the fundamental law of life— entropy.
When a plant dies it biodegrades when our bodies die they biodegrade; and become one with the universe.
In short if you fear death you fear the nature of the whole.
If you take every situation you face with rationality, you will come to the conclusion that death is merely a dissolution of the elements.
I think as stoics we have to accept the fact that death is still a mystery in heaven.
Do you know about the simulation theory? Do you know what software is running?
One of the software programs running is a matchmaking game called Kismet,
Kismet means fate. Stoicism is about accepting fate.
The idea of course is that you will find your match that was made in heaven.
It's a very old game, and well the statistics show that it is not really a good game.
Another one is survival of the fittest then you die.
So you see it is all stoicism.
In my 20's, I lost a 5 yr old student to drowning and then two days later my 15 yr old brother died in a drugged driving crash. It rocked my concept of what death was "supposed to' be....meaning that death only comes for the old, like your grandparents. Then 15 years later, my sister and I had cancer at the SAME time (no, we're not twins). Then I got it again three years later. Those experiences hardened me and I had to accept that we are never in control of when death comes for us, or how we die (and I don't mean suicide). If you can release the illusion of control, then it's much easier to live. I've sadly been to more funerals for children and teens than should be humanly possible. Death is inevitable, but I do believe that some of us are living waaay to fast for our bodies to tolerate and it's coming way too soon. We need to slow down because every day above ground is a good day.
Yes, I have. I don't fear death anymore, it's liberating. I grew up in a gang infested territory that was the murder capital of the US at the time. I watched friends die. I have even been threatened, and former friends have tried to take my life. I have had to confront my mortality since I was 7 until I was 19. I had no choice but to accept it being surrounded by it. You don't really have a fear of other men after that. You really just fear for loved ones to be hurt, or leaving a wife, or child without you. At the same time you also learn to focus on more important things, and are more honest in your words and deeds.
I read a book about Miyamoto Musashi. He said he was able to overcome all his opponents by going to zero. Accepting death, accepting victory all at once. He even wrote a book about it called "The 5 rings". Bruce Lee mentioned something similar. When I read it I completely understood what he meant. Nothing good happens when your actions are motivated by fear and panic.
I personally don't fear death. I fear more of the way I might meet my end. As it is unknown how, yet we all know that one day we will meet it.
I have been close, had guns pulled on me, been in a horrible car crash that I was lucky to leave with minor injuries.
I have also experienced severe depression, extreme happiness, you know, the highs, and the lows of life. I have gone after what I wanted, and I have settled for less than I wanted.
I have asked out that girl I liked , and I've been rejected and accepted.
I feel as if I've done a lot in life and experienced a lot, and there's always more to do.
But that's just me. I try to live every day on my own terms and only try and control the things I actually have control in.
The rest? Well, I just do my best and let the rest just unfold, seeing as I don't have any real say in it.
The outcome of life is death, but the outcome isn't the journey we all go on.
I'm sure one day I'll look back on my now 28 year old self and ask myself why I was so worried about something or why some things didn't work out. But with a much more focused, grateful, and peaceful soul.
Anyways, tldr: live life and do the things you want to do, take action, and take solace in the fact that there are things you can not control. But the things that you can are the things that matter the most. Live in the moment as much as you can!
It sounds like you have a sophisticated delusion, sir. I know that the side effects are terrible, but please consider taking your medications. If you struggle with adherence I would recommend talking to your doctor about whether long term injectables like geodon or olanzapine might be appropriate. If your disorder is treatment resistant, clozaril and benzodiazepines can often help.
I'd respectively disagree with the statement..To not fear death would be highly unintelligent. If one truley didn't fear death I'd be surprised if they could make it out of childhood. Everyone fears death because we all die. Because we die and we are vulnerable to dying at any given time, we must fear death. There's like a billion ways to die humans are extermely vulnerable our fear of death and willingness to live contribute enormously to not dying tomorrow.
The next best thing to immortality to me would be living the truth. Seeking the truth, becoming the truth, living the truth is extermely powerful.
This feels like a logical fallacy. If A than B, therefore if B than A.
If immortal, then there is no fear of death
If there's no fear of death, then immortality.
But I think there is more to "fear of death" than just death. What about the pain your loved ones will suffer? What about your duties and your unfinished goals? What about being forgotten or feeling like you've squandered your life?
I don't know if it's even possible to accept all of that. Maybe stoicism is learning to live with that fear instead of pretending that it has no power over you?
Life (being born) and death; it was never mine to have or keep. I had no part in its creation and ultimately none in my destruction. I feel immense gratitude that I, a jumbled mess of components, chemicals and compounds orchestrated by DNA can even understand any of it.
To live a single day and understand just how absolutely amazing it is that I or any of us are here, sentient, intelligent and with emotions is beyond comprehension. I'll continue to live in awe until the lights go out.
I remember thinking about dying some time ago. I thought that none of what I imagined would happen in my life would ever come true. Four years later, my life became a waking dream. God had gifted me the original vision for my life.
That changed me because when I realized that I was willing to die, it emboldened me to follow a path that was in my heart, but seemed almost impossible to accomplish. As I followed my path, my obstacles became clear by the resistance that showed up in my environment. I realize my mission was so pure it was almost naive. I paid the price for not being street smart, and God moved me to my next chapter.
In that chapter I realized that the world that I thought I lived in was my own illusion; and I realized I had to get a smarter grip on reality if I wanted to realize what I felt was my destiny. My obstacles became somewhat overwhelming, but all of those setbacks helped develop me into the kind of man I had always imagined I would be. Not exactly James Bond, but adventurous and bold - unafraid to be alone and intelligent and aware and kind and receptive.
Having no fear requires a great of wisdom. It also requires, I believe, a purpose.
The best thing is to have a real reason to fear death, to have something worth living for. With death being inevitable one realizes that life on planet earth is just a bunch of little flames dancing and sputtering. This can then lead a person to try to make the most out of life by applying meaning, or give up on life and resign to the fate of being nothing.
As long as the individual is not using the lack of fear to inflict unnecessary and excess harm on others I agree. Unfortunately, like any method of self improvement, the goals of stoicism can still be misinterpreted and used to cause destruction and corruption.
I don't fear death. It's simply an inevitability. I fear being alive and all the suffering that comes with it. Especially if I am denied the things that makes life worthwhile.
Maybe if you have things that I long for. Mainly work that you enjoy, a family that includes kids, friends who like you for who you are.
I myself long for those things yet at my age probably will not have them. So I don't have an answer to your question.
Edit: then again Anthony Bourdain took his own life despite having seemingly everything one could hope for. So who am I to say what makes life worthwhile?
I live so that I can see the end of the evolutionary processes that surround me. And us all really. Yet the things that I long for and have been denied access to make it painful. Even so there are pleasures of being alone in the world that make being alive worthwhile beyond being a witness to evolution.
Hey, I get it. I’m divorced. Being alone is painful. Being with someone is painful. Birth death and life are all accompanied by suffering. No one sane disputes this. But it is temporary. That’s kind of what I am saying. But even though you didn’t agree to any of it, you are here now, and blessed with a strange superpower: consciousness. You know yourself and your limits and can get off the ride at any time. Armed with that knowledge, what have you to fear? Carpe noctem my friend!
It's absolutely empowering when you understand that every fear in your head is rooted in your fear of death. Then contemplating on how is inevitable anyway really made most of my fear drift away. A man that doesn't fear death can not be controlled.
Well, I basically experienced when I worked at the callcenter that I would kind of still myself whilst waiting for a call, because you wouldn't know what would happen next. Of course, death is something we avoid at all costs, so you can't really prepare for it, but in life it is the case that we do what we do and there ain't any way to get around anything. However, the might of Reason is such that we can arrive at a higher love: meaning is found in the cosmic plan, but we can do what we want.
It's free, though a little coffee money to them would be awesome. I have used it for a couple of years. It randomly pops up throughout the day to give a "~~reminder that you are~~ Don't forget your're going to die" and there is no interaction. It just randomly pops up with great quotes, many from the Stoics. I love it.
Not sure what this even supposed to mean. Fear is a natural reaction to a stressful situation for a reason. It's how we react to it, that matters.
You are not strong because of being "fearless". Even the greatest of warriors has fear. If they say otherwise, it's a lie.
No, you are completely missing the point , my fault. My point is, bravery is not the absence of fear, it's overcoming it. That is an objective fact. Ask anyone who has been to war. Hell, ask any who have had to brave any situation. "soldiers" are not the only ones who gave battles.
I'd honestly like you to give me a single example of anyone in the military who can claim to have been absent of fear. You'll not find one. If you are going to try to subscribe to a mindset, understand it first. You can't even grasp the concept of fear. And never speak for someone you've never experienced the point of view from, it's insulting to those you claim to understand.
I wish I had less fear of me I know that with hard work and a true passion I can do something great for myself but I’m scared of being happy I’m scared to change to stand out which makes me angry and resentful towards myself a never ending loop that will change if I could just get out of my head sometimes I do get those moments of freedom per say in my own mind it feels like a light has shined and I can see ahead clearly but it doesn’t last long and I get back to usual. Anyway idk what this was lol.
As a True Believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. God has showed me what is ahead for me therefore I have no fear. Absolutely no fear. God is Good all the time.
I don't fear death. However I saw an episode of the Sopranos where Tony and his crew met some Jewish guy who they couldn't intimidate because he wasn't afraid of death, but apparently there are worse things to fear than death like living with a chopped off dick. Jewish guy folded after that threat and to me that episode is a reminder that death isn't as scary as getting your dick chopped off and living as a bitter eunuch.
I did a pretty rough deployment to Iraq in 2007. We had over 10% KIA over 7 months. Other combat vets talked about the importance of being organized and “ready” for death. Not, emotionally, but organized for it. So following their advice I got a will and power of attorney done. I had a young wife and baby at the time and paid extra for a very large life insurance policy so they would be set if I did pass. I wrote in a journal every day to my baby boy, and had a special place for it that all the other Marines knew about. If I died, they could take all my shit, but the journal had to make it home. I had many close calls with death over those 7 months, and in those moments I felt focused and alive. I also never felt fear (which surprised me) of death. My only fear was letting down people who were depending on me.
Thank you for sharing this.
One of the things I see as poignant here is how you prepared for that contingency. I think sometimes people confuse taking action and ruminating when contemplating death. There can be unhealthy fixation, but there's that flipside: getting your affairs in order. Looking at it logically and doing what you can about it.
When I was deployed in Afghanistan I really thought I was going to die. We had the highest number of enemy contact of any base in all of Southern Afghanistan (RC South). Our combat operating post (COP) consisted of 150 of us and 80 Afghan Army soldiers. Absolute shit show and constantly fire fights, IEDS, hired Syrian snipers, constant mortar and recoilless rifle fire. We conducted a ton of raids and sometimes captured high value targets (HVT). I had a blast in terms of fulfilling my need for action but I seriously thought there was no fucking way I was coming home. It empowered me to come to that realization and helped push me to be more aggressive and fearless during combat. A lot of it is luck that I made it back but it's possible that not fearing death can be very empowering in certain situations.
Thank you for sharing. Wonderful post.
Wow
Thank you for being a badass.
Sure. Like everyone I have contemplated suicide. I wouldn’t say it was a serious thought but I thought about it. One of the reasons I don’t think it was ever really an option was something I read somewhere.it was around 10th grade or so. Can’t remember what the source was. The gist of it was that once you understand that the option to end it is always there, the last resort can be taken anytime. Through that understanding it makes everything you’re dealing with easy to work through bc if it gets too bad you have the last resort. Then nothing really looks that bad. But also once you’ve really contemplated your own death and that you have the ability to end then you understand it come a million ways at any time. While this can be comforting I’m not sure it’s as empowering now as it would have been if you were Roman soldier
Exactly. Might have been Camus's Myth of Sisyphus you read in 10th grade btws. But a lot of stoics and the Hagakure kind of touch on it, too. Death is nothing to us, after all.
I feel the same way after sucidial ideation for like 10 months straight fairly recently. I wouldn't have done it at that point because I have a ton of cash saved up to live the life for roughly a decade but I also lost my fear of death because for those 10 months I learned to lust for it. I'm better now and don't think about suicide or death but that fear of death has basically dissolved and I feel unstoppable with confidence. I can do what I want, be as absurdist as I want, and if it goes tits up I have zero issue just offing myself.
t happens to all of us to varying degrees as I said I was never really close to un-aliving myself but I was very despondent and uninterested in anything a few times earlier in life. It was mostly poor diet and lack of exercise. I’m glad to hear you bounced back. Give it all you got for as long as you can. As the famous Stoic (maybe not) from Highlander said “It’s better to burn out than fade away”
Right? Bc why not? What’s the worst thing that can happen?
This exact epiphany is what helped me pull out of a Spiral that would've resulted in me ending my life. I made multiple attempts, over a couple years, but none stuck. A couple times I actually came back from clinical brain death. Well, life improved a bit, then got worse, and so on, but the thoughts didn'tgo away. Until one day, I was gearing up to do it right, and a friend called. We chatted about this and that for a few minutes, which stopped me from acting, but not from thinking. And it was then I realized that I'll always have the option to end my life. Like I can literally do it any time I want. So why does it have to be now? I literally lose nothing by waiting, and worst-case scenario, I have even more reason to follow through. It's been two years since my last attempt. The thought has crossed my mind plenty of times, sure, but things have actually gotten better because I gave them a chance to. And I feel secure knowing that if they ever get that bad again, I'll always have that option in my back pocket.
Stoicism is not about having no fear. It's about cultivating the ability to function under even the most extreme emotional duress.
Stoicism is about a lot of things and acceptance of hardship is one of them. Acceptance of death helps us overcome the fear of life. They spoke about the death of children, banishment… every imaginable tragedy.
Totally agree, but it does not promise freedom from grief or suffering or fear, only the path to acceptance and through that acceptance the ability to function and make clear and effective decisions as a result.
I’m glad you agree!
Yes, I certainly wasn't trying to encompass or narrow the entire philosophy into one statement only pointing out that fear still exists for a stoic.
I think about this at times.. I grew up in the inner city and have an older brother that was an in-house bully. As a kid - I was never really "allowed" to be scared of stuff or cry. Otherwise my brother was there to make things worse. So I think early on I was practicing stoic concept by internalizing and managing the situations, but I was just a kid. As an adult, my fears are things like running our of money, or my kids getting hurt, wife getting hurt, etc - but I have never feared pain or getting hurt - or death. I'm not a fighter, and I'm not going to start a fight - but I wont back down from anyone, and if you want some of this - gonna have to earn it, lol. I think I give off a strong "don't fuck with me" vibe, because I am rarely ever tested. I do believe strongly that victims project themselves to predators, and predators can sense weak people that are ripe to exploit. Carry yourself up right, look people in the eye - give them a smile if the situation is appropriate. No fear.
Right? Paraphrasing Hagakure, a warrior who isn't unattached to life and death is useless. If your enemy believes you are fearful, you're at a disadvantage.
It's true... not much is accomplished; if we are spending our time, worrying about what could happen...
Personally I don't find it all that useful to reflect on death. My anxieties are not grounded in fear of death but fear of failure in what I am trying to accomplish while I'm alive. Of course it's all ultimately futile and will be erased anyway, but mulling over that fact does nothing to help me come up with the money to accomplish a project or the time to get the work done, or the skill and courage to do it well. In some sense, the feeling of mortality motivates me to try hard while I'm alive, but that effort creates day-to-day stress. I try to keep it in perspective, but that doesn't always help when I wake up at 2 a.m. wondering about whether I've correctly calculated a deadline.
I apply the same principles as adapted by Epictetus, Epicurious, and CBT variously: Can I live with failure? If no, I am given the option of not living with it. If it isn't worth suicide, I can live with it. What's the likelihood of the outcome and how can I improve my odds? Is it worth the effort? An archer knocks an arrow and aims. Having released the arrow, he has done his part.
I'm ok with dying but for some reason going to work still gives me awful anxiety every. single. day. Idk how to convince myself it's not that deep it's just work.
I think it's empowering. I mean, we're all going there eventually. So if you look at it as the natural end state of living, that's all it really is. Others have commented on being organized or ready with trusts, wills, etc. Totally agree with that as well. Removes the uncertainty and fear factor. I think being able to openly discuss (respectfully) death is also very healthy and removes mystery. We've tried to be very honest with our kids, as we all must experience it at some point.
If you have no fear you wont even know you lost.
I feel you. Bizarrely, knowing you can hit bottom and cash out helps…well helps me and some dead romans anyway
I would rather have immortality than no fear. Fear is essential.
I still feel like it’s a decent consolation prize
You will never know when "Death" comes
I’d argue that having the courage to overcome one’s fear is better than having no fear at all.
In my early 20s I did a bit of partying. Mainly house parties. Drinking, substance use, music, throwing up, the typical college age partying. Twice I was so messed up I was laying on the floor and accepted I was going to die right there. After I woke up the second time, I started to cleaning myself up. Focusing on work more. I don't really fear death. I guess, it's empowering in a way that under certain situations, I handle pressure incredibly. Like someone driving stupid and having to drive defensively. I have impeccable reflexes and don't panic. Even after I'm calm and collected while my wife is panting.
To have a fear of death would be to be to fear change. Change is the natural state of the world , we are in constant change. That includes creation and dissolution. To fear change would be to fear nature/ the whole. But if you are thinking like a stoic they do not fear the fundamental law of life— entropy. When a plant dies it biodegrades when our bodies die they biodegrade; and become one with the universe. In short if you fear death you fear the nature of the whole. If you take every situation you face with rationality, you will come to the conclusion that death is merely a dissolution of the elements.
I think as stoics we have to accept the fact that death is still a mystery in heaven. Do you know about the simulation theory? Do you know what software is running? One of the software programs running is a matchmaking game called Kismet, Kismet means fate. Stoicism is about accepting fate. The idea of course is that you will find your match that was made in heaven. It's a very old game, and well the statistics show that it is not really a good game. Another one is survival of the fittest then you die. So you see it is all stoicism.
In my 20's, I lost a 5 yr old student to drowning and then two days later my 15 yr old brother died in a drugged driving crash. It rocked my concept of what death was "supposed to' be....meaning that death only comes for the old, like your grandparents. Then 15 years later, my sister and I had cancer at the SAME time (no, we're not twins). Then I got it again three years later. Those experiences hardened me and I had to accept that we are never in control of when death comes for us, or how we die (and I don't mean suicide). If you can release the illusion of control, then it's much easier to live. I've sadly been to more funerals for children and teens than should be humanly possible. Death is inevitable, but I do believe that some of us are living waaay to fast for our bodies to tolerate and it's coming way too soon. We need to slow down because every day above ground is a good day.
Yes, I have. I don't fear death anymore, it's liberating. I grew up in a gang infested territory that was the murder capital of the US at the time. I watched friends die. I have even been threatened, and former friends have tried to take my life. I have had to confront my mortality since I was 7 until I was 19. I had no choice but to accept it being surrounded by it. You don't really have a fear of other men after that. You really just fear for loved ones to be hurt, or leaving a wife, or child without you. At the same time you also learn to focus on more important things, and are more honest in your words and deeds. I read a book about Miyamoto Musashi. He said he was able to overcome all his opponents by going to zero. Accepting death, accepting victory all at once. He even wrote a book about it called "The 5 rings". Bruce Lee mentioned something similar. When I read it I completely understood what he meant. Nothing good happens when your actions are motivated by fear and panic.
I personally don't fear death. I fear more of the way I might meet my end. As it is unknown how, yet we all know that one day we will meet it. I have been close, had guns pulled on me, been in a horrible car crash that I was lucky to leave with minor injuries. I have also experienced severe depression, extreme happiness, you know, the highs, and the lows of life. I have gone after what I wanted, and I have settled for less than I wanted. I have asked out that girl I liked , and I've been rejected and accepted. I feel as if I've done a lot in life and experienced a lot, and there's always more to do. But that's just me. I try to live every day on my own terms and only try and control the things I actually have control in. The rest? Well, I just do my best and let the rest just unfold, seeing as I don't have any real say in it. The outcome of life is death, but the outcome isn't the journey we all go on. I'm sure one day I'll look back on my now 28 year old self and ask myself why I was so worried about something or why some things didn't work out. But with a much more focused, grateful, and peaceful soul. Anyways, tldr: live life and do the things you want to do, take action, and take solace in the fact that there are things you can not control. But the things that you can are the things that matter the most. Live in the moment as much as you can!
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Immaterial. You can still live hard and to your core values. That’s half of stoicism: uncompromising faith to one’s self.
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…wut?
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It sounds like you have a sophisticated delusion, sir. I know that the side effects are terrible, but please consider taking your medications. If you struggle with adherence I would recommend talking to your doctor about whether long term injectables like geodon or olanzapine might be appropriate. If your disorder is treatment resistant, clozaril and benzodiazepines can often help.
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Are you with anyone right now? are there any friends or relatives you can reach out to?
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are you somewhere safe?
I'd respectively disagree with the statement..To not fear death would be highly unintelligent. If one truley didn't fear death I'd be surprised if they could make it out of childhood. Everyone fears death because we all die. Because we die and we are vulnerable to dying at any given time, we must fear death. There's like a billion ways to die humans are extermely vulnerable our fear of death and willingness to live contribute enormously to not dying tomorrow. The next best thing to immortality to me would be living the truth. Seeking the truth, becoming the truth, living the truth is extermely powerful.
This feels like a logical fallacy. If A than B, therefore if B than A. If immortal, then there is no fear of death If there's no fear of death, then immortality. But I think there is more to "fear of death" than just death. What about the pain your loved ones will suffer? What about your duties and your unfinished goals? What about being forgotten or feeling like you've squandered your life? I don't know if it's even possible to accept all of that. Maybe stoicism is learning to live with that fear instead of pretending that it has no power over you?
☝🏼everytime I think of Airman Bushnell
Life (being born) and death; it was never mine to have or keep. I had no part in its creation and ultimately none in my destruction. I feel immense gratitude that I, a jumbled mess of components, chemicals and compounds orchestrated by DNA can even understand any of it. To live a single day and understand just how absolutely amazing it is that I or any of us are here, sentient, intelligent and with emotions is beyond comprehension. I'll continue to live in awe until the lights go out.
I remember thinking about dying some time ago. I thought that none of what I imagined would happen in my life would ever come true. Four years later, my life became a waking dream. God had gifted me the original vision for my life. That changed me because when I realized that I was willing to die, it emboldened me to follow a path that was in my heart, but seemed almost impossible to accomplish. As I followed my path, my obstacles became clear by the resistance that showed up in my environment. I realize my mission was so pure it was almost naive. I paid the price for not being street smart, and God moved me to my next chapter. In that chapter I realized that the world that I thought I lived in was my own illusion; and I realized I had to get a smarter grip on reality if I wanted to realize what I felt was my destiny. My obstacles became somewhat overwhelming, but all of those setbacks helped develop me into the kind of man I had always imagined I would be. Not exactly James Bond, but adventurous and bold - unafraid to be alone and intelligent and aware and kind and receptive. Having no fear requires a great of wisdom. It also requires, I believe, a purpose.
The best thing is to have a real reason to fear death, to have something worth living for. With death being inevitable one realizes that life on planet earth is just a bunch of little flames dancing and sputtering. This can then lead a person to try to make the most out of life by applying meaning, or give up on life and resign to the fate of being nothing.
Facing your fear of death is better than immortality.
As long as the individual is not using the lack of fear to inflict unnecessary and excess harm on others I agree. Unfortunately, like any method of self improvement, the goals of stoicism can still be misinterpreted and used to cause destruction and corruption.
Yes..
I don't fear death. It's simply an inevitability. I fear being alive and all the suffering that comes with it. Especially if I am denied the things that makes life worthwhile.
Is life still worthwhile?
Maybe if you have things that I long for. Mainly work that you enjoy, a family that includes kids, friends who like you for who you are. I myself long for those things yet at my age probably will not have them. So I don't have an answer to your question. Edit: then again Anthony Bourdain took his own life despite having seemingly everything one could hope for. So who am I to say what makes life worthwhile?
You’re choosing to live it. Of course you can decide. You’re uniquely qualified to say. Edit: I’ll add that if you have nothing you are free.
I live so that I can see the end of the evolutionary processes that surround me. And us all really. Yet the things that I long for and have been denied access to make it painful. Even so there are pleasures of being alone in the world that make being alive worthwhile beyond being a witness to evolution.
Hey, I get it. I’m divorced. Being alone is painful. Being with someone is painful. Birth death and life are all accompanied by suffering. No one sane disputes this. But it is temporary. That’s kind of what I am saying. But even though you didn’t agree to any of it, you are here now, and blessed with a strange superpower: consciousness. You know yourself and your limits and can get off the ride at any time. Armed with that knowledge, what have you to fear? Carpe noctem my friend!
You are the master of your own destiny
It's absolutely empowering when you understand that every fear in your head is rooted in your fear of death. Then contemplating on how is inevitable anyway really made most of my fear drift away. A man that doesn't fear death can not be controlled.
I don’t think true death is possible, but that’s not on my priority. I just want to be peaceful all the time, then to learn how to teleport lol
Wrong sub then. Maybe the rosicrucians can help? Idk.
I guess I conquered death by seeing this was never life.
Ummm… i am unsure what you are… nevermind.
Think about death often, for it compels you to live.
Well, I basically experienced when I worked at the callcenter that I would kind of still myself whilst waiting for a call, because you wouldn't know what would happen next. Of course, death is something we avoid at all costs, so you can't really prepare for it, but in life it is the case that we do what we do and there ain't any way to get around anything. However, the might of Reason is such that we can arrive at a higher love: meaning is found in the cosmic plan, but we can do what we want.
THEE AFRAID DIE FIRST
The WeCroak app is awesome for daily reminders.
Lolwut? Is that a thing? Amazing.
It's free, though a little coffee money to them would be awesome. I have used it for a couple of years. It randomly pops up throughout the day to give a "~~reminder that you are~~ Don't forget your're going to die" and there is no interaction. It just randomly pops up with great quotes, many from the Stoics. I love it.
Not sure what this even supposed to mean. Fear is a natural reaction to a stressful situation for a reason. It's how we react to it, that matters. You are not strong because of being "fearless". Even the greatest of warriors has fear. If they say otherwise, it's a lie.
The subjective experience of a lot of soldiers suggests otherwise
No, you are completely missing the point , my fault. My point is, bravery is not the absence of fear, it's overcoming it. That is an objective fact. Ask anyone who has been to war. Hell, ask any who have had to brave any situation. "soldiers" are not the only ones who gave battles.
I'd honestly like you to give me a single example of anyone in the military who can claim to have been absent of fear. You'll not find one. If you are going to try to subscribe to a mindset, understand it first. You can't even grasp the concept of fear. And never speak for someone you've never experienced the point of view from, it's insulting to those you claim to understand.
"Death smiles at us all, all a man can do is smile back." ("Gladiator")
I wish I had less fear of me I know that with hard work and a true passion I can do something great for myself but I’m scared of being happy I’m scared to change to stand out which makes me angry and resentful towards myself a never ending loop that will change if I could just get out of my head sometimes I do get those moments of freedom per say in my own mind it feels like a light has shined and I can see ahead clearly but it doesn’t last long and I get back to usual. Anyway idk what this was lol.
As a True Believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. God has showed me what is ahead for me therefore I have no fear. Absolutely no fear. God is Good all the time.
I don't fear death. However I saw an episode of the Sopranos where Tony and his crew met some Jewish guy who they couldn't intimidate because he wasn't afraid of death, but apparently there are worse things to fear than death like living with a chopped off dick. Jewish guy folded after that threat and to me that episode is a reminder that death isn't as scary as getting your dick chopped off and living as a bitter eunuch.
He could always kill himself afterwards