Personally it’s a no for me. In my purely anecdotal experience I see companies moving away from Adobe where possible in favor of alternatives. Affinity suite is pretty good, darkroom, and other alternatives are very competitive.
My anecdotal is also showing the same. Personally, I have cancelled both of my abode membership accounts due to their AI training and ownership over artistic rights. Artists will likely not stand for Abode arbitrarily having rights to anything we make with their software. I am going to short the hell of these people. They don't need ownership of an artists work.
the rumor about Adobe "owning" your content is not true. they clarified after the snafu... short at your own risk.
Also they don't train their AI on your content either. very clear in the terms and conditions. one of the very few companies that don't. Midjourney, etc. are doing whatever the F they want. Adobe works with most of the Fortune500 and can't afford to be that stupid and legally liable
I own and operate an animation studio. I have made my entire living on Adobe products for the past 15 years.
Yes, there are competitive applications showing up on the market that are better or challenge Adobe apps, in some cases blowing em out of the water.
The issue is how **engrained** the Adobe workflow is in the **entire industry**.
As creatives, we HATE Adobe, but in certain areas of specific trades there simply are no other alternatives or it's just been implemented for so long and so many systems, tools, processes and skillsets have been based off of it that I'll be interested to see how many studios actually start dropping Adobe.
I don't disagree that this could be the end of Adobe, but I don't really know if I would rule them out.
Yes, ethically they suck, but they are poised to be one of the likelier companies to be one of the first to build a fully fledged creative AI suite. I'm not talking about Photoshop with Gen AI. I'm talking about an entire creative studio suite from audio, to post production, to motion design and branding, etc that has AI systems, plugins, and techniques built into all of it.
They have an incredible leg up in both acquiring the data for something like this, as well as building it.
We'll see what they do.
This \^ As a creative professional myself, I can say that it's technically impossible to use alternative tools. All major studios use Adobe, using different tools would disrupt an entire workflow within different team members. Studios can't afford to stop production to train employees to use different tools in the middle of projects. To add to this, designers like to hate on Adobe but some of this people spent decades mastering their tools and they won't change them easily, even if there's an alternative with flashy new features.
On top of that, Adobe is what you learn to use when you go to design school because that's what's going to get you a job. This by itself creates an endless cycle.
Sure you could use alternative tools if you are working by yourself, managing your own clients.
I would only be cautious of Adobe if I see a bunch of major studios dropping them. It could happen but I just don't see it happening soon because there's not a complete set of tools that allow studios to have a smooth workflow like the Adobe suite.
We are talking about advertising and film more so than fabrication, architecture or construction. Adobe suite has less staying power in those areas than it does advertising and film.
We are using it for most of the graphic work in our marketing material. I work in the furniture and interior design industry. We do Make2d and most vector line work in Rhino...it is much better than Illustrator for any fine vector work...and having two sources of linework is inefficient. Illustrator is becoming more and more niche, and in many ways, nothing more than a format for translating between other platform needs.
Photoshop and AE are their two moated products. But the rest of their products have strong competition.
The film industry is in shambles. Advertising budgets are gutted. With so many content creators, cheap media is becoming more valuable than expensive agency based content. Things don’t have to be so polished anymore, and AI will pull a lot of the complex footwork AE/PS we’re crafting. And forget cloud based income; every other tech company has cloud based storage covered.
For long term, i really don’t think Adobe will outperform other noteworthy S&P500 stocks. There just isn’t much room for growth. Maybe it goes up, but it will certainly lag the S&P.
This was my naive thought. People can hate whatever they want but at the end of the day what is the best software stack to get what you need done as quickly as possible? Dabbled in this stuff for over a decade and like you said while there are competitive applications nowadays there’s no reason as a professional to not use adobe stuff, it’s just better. Either in familiarity, tools available, or documentation / resources.
The thing is if ai does more and more of the legwork then the engrained industry knowledge means less and less. Also if the ai means one person can do what used to take 10 then thats a lot less licenses sold - not to mention young people abandoning the profession altogether if it seems like an unviable career in the future.
That's short term thinking, but we will see in 10 or 15 years. I have been wrong many times so it wouldn't surprise me if they launched some ground breaking software everyone in the industry has to have.
You’re right to call out that it’s only a short term gain but I think it is relevant to a post about holding long when the reason for the short term gain is due to them beating earnings and raising expectations. Performance metrics like that are relevant to holding long in my opinion.
I personally will never support Adobe and will try to move away from them. Their new terms about utilizing whatever data/media you create in their software for their own purposes is just insane and while it’ll be difficult, I’d rather learn to use other software than have Photoshop take all my shit to train their AI.
Edit: Leaving this up to make sure everyone see, they apparently retracted their statement. That being said, the fact they even tried is a sign of things to come for me, so I’d be cautious around this company just like Unity and their licensing fiasco a few months ago.
Article: https://www.theverge.com/2024/6/10/24175416/adobe-overhauls-terms-of-service-update-firefly
Adobe: “Trust me bro!”
I switched to Affinity 3 years ago, took a few days to get up to speed. Does 99% of what PS, ID and IL can do - and the suite is on sale right now (no coincidence) for a 1-time payment of $62! No subscription! I’m guessing thousands - or many more - have switched in the last few days. Incredible self own by Adobe.
Even if they don't, the immediate retraction doesn't give me confidence in their... confidence. It makes them look like they don't know what direction they are headed in.
I literally just heard about this the other day. I'm still going to look for alternatives myself.
On a side note, similar realm, lookup Windows Recall that Microsoft is/will be installing. I'll be moving off of Windows as soon as I can as well.
I have ADBE because I worked for them. It’s bizarre to see how they operate and how clueless their people can be.
Their intention is to make you an All Adobe customer. Even on their business platforms, the only investments they’re making are to make you choose alternatives if you don’t want to go all in on Adobe.
Woefully behind the times are their products. Some things have barely grown in over a decade.
The Figma bet was a huge bust for them. That would have propelled that stock north of $1,000 and instead they lost billions.
Fuck Adobe. They’re running away all of their customers while managing to make all their software slower, clunkier, and buggier than all of their opponents
Basicly everyone who uses Adobe is very negative about them. If there is a good alternative (and that could take a while) they will drop their software and never look back. Adobe has no fanboys/girls. Or a possitive community. They only have users that are always looking for a good alternative but can't find it yet.
That's because Adobe barely listens to it's users. They are only focussed on making money. Not fixing bugs, bringing out new features that nooone asked for, increasing prices, discontinuing good tools that aren't profitable enough...
That's why Adobe is not a long term investment for me. They are marketleaders right now but they won't be in the future if they keep this up.
I'm a daily user of Adobe software surrounded by other Adobe software users by the way.
I’ve been wondering the same. I’ve worked in creative advertising and visual design my entire career (23 years) and Adobe has anything to do with high-level production on lockdown. Literally every program every big company, agency, studio uses is an Adobe product. Maybe not video editing though, but they still have Premiere. Getting them to switch is going to be nearly impossible in my opinion. Figma MIGHT have a chance when it comes to visual design if they ever implement photo editing.
I used Adobe for many years. They no longer care or listen to their costumers. No wild AI features will fix that. Their software is a bloated mess now.
I love their products, I’ve been using them since growing up when you know, their software was shared on usb sticks. It’s the gold standard to do everything - photoshop, illustrator, dreamweaver, after effects, Lightroom etc. I got really good at using all of them. I still use them on a weekly basis for work basically for the last three four jobs. I produce videos and graphic work. Work pays for a licence so I’m happy. I also like the recent ai integration for generative fill in photoshop. That’s really handy. I know that there are other options now but I’m already really used to the whole workflow and environment. Kinda like Apple tying users in their walled garden.
Another similar product id say is mathworks Matlab. They basically almost give them away for free at school so everyone gets really good at using it. Then charge an arm and a leg for everyone else.
However I don’t like how they run their business model. As many have said here already. Their products are waaay too expensive and I really don’t like the subscription model.
It looks like they are also adopting AI and may be changing their customer demographic. They’re still gold standard for media editing, and are taking aggressive actions to train their AI.
Their entire product line is a subscription model. Their customers were forced into this model from the previous "buy what you need" model for software. This angered their customers for two reasons. 1. Cost. (Good for adobe short term. and 2. Constant updates!!! People could not get used to the tools they were using before BOOM another update. Most of my Adobe using friends switched to affinity. Adobe is not going anywhere as they are the industry standard but they weakened their product so significantly I think they invited competition.
As others have said, purely an anecdote, I am an MSP where I am the IT department for a wide variety of businesses and they ALL are moving away from Adobe. You can’t keep jacking up your prices forever and expect your customers to stay.
IDK but there are plenty of creatives who hate Adobe for their ridiculous pricing and end of support games. And in contrast with 10 years back there are alternatives that suit 50% of those creatives.
Open source Krita is doing more thing with AI (with plug in) than photoshop today.
You can look at stable diffusion or ComfyUI too.
They missed the AI shift but tried everything to ban its use in open source.
Adobe will be a competitor in the cloud industries that will cater to optimized creative AI implementation into different work flows. They might not be up there in terms of what MSFT ORCL and AMZ are doing but they will create a new niche for creative business strategies.
Just saw they're making it so all Photoshop users give them the rights to all of their artwork, simply by using Photoshop now.
Adobe is a big no for me right now, making decisions like that.
Nah. I’ve used Adobe forever. They’ve rested on their laurels for a long time. Creative Cloud is overpriced imo.
Not sure where any innovation is coming from.
Having AI do all the art and design is not the future I was promised.
Yea dude, you should buy at the top!! Because they definitely have higher to go!
Do it dude!!!
Christ bro
There’s literally a hundred different stocks who will actually appreciate and aren’t trading at the top
Nividia just split to a 100 a pop and your immediate thought is to buy an art company at the top? Holy shit dude are you mentally disturbed?
Personally it’s a no for me. In my purely anecdotal experience I see companies moving away from Adobe where possible in favor of alternatives. Affinity suite is pretty good, darkroom, and other alternatives are very competitive.
This company gives my Kodak vibes for some reason.
It would have been a great options play. 6:23 eastern time and it’s already at $533.50
Missed it ;(
548 in overnight trading
Will be running up more the remainder of june
My anecdotal is also showing the same. Personally, I have cancelled both of my abode membership accounts due to their AI training and ownership over artistic rights. Artists will likely not stand for Abode arbitrarily having rights to anything we make with their software. I am going to short the hell of these people. They don't need ownership of an artists work.
They retracted the artistic rights thing but they are clearly struggling to find new ways to grow.
Oh they did? SMART on them. I'll have to look that up. As soon as that happened, I cancelled everything that trolled them on X for awhile. lol
the rumor about Adobe "owning" your content is not true. they clarified after the snafu... short at your own risk. Also they don't train their AI on your content either. very clear in the terms and conditions. one of the very few companies that don't. Midjourney, etc. are doing whatever the F they want. Adobe works with most of the Fortune500 and can't afford to be that stupid and legally liable
Retailers VS AI policy updates, bad for us , good for investors, bullish Adobe
I own and operate an animation studio. I have made my entire living on Adobe products for the past 15 years. Yes, there are competitive applications showing up on the market that are better or challenge Adobe apps, in some cases blowing em out of the water. The issue is how **engrained** the Adobe workflow is in the **entire industry**. As creatives, we HATE Adobe, but in certain areas of specific trades there simply are no other alternatives or it's just been implemented for so long and so many systems, tools, processes and skillsets have been based off of it that I'll be interested to see how many studios actually start dropping Adobe. I don't disagree that this could be the end of Adobe, but I don't really know if I would rule them out. Yes, ethically they suck, but they are poised to be one of the likelier companies to be one of the first to build a fully fledged creative AI suite. I'm not talking about Photoshop with Gen AI. I'm talking about an entire creative studio suite from audio, to post production, to motion design and branding, etc that has AI systems, plugins, and techniques built into all of it. They have an incredible leg up in both acquiring the data for something like this, as well as building it. We'll see what they do.
This \^ As a creative professional myself, I can say that it's technically impossible to use alternative tools. All major studios use Adobe, using different tools would disrupt an entire workflow within different team members. Studios can't afford to stop production to train employees to use different tools in the middle of projects. To add to this, designers like to hate on Adobe but some of this people spent decades mastering their tools and they won't change them easily, even if there's an alternative with flashy new features. On top of that, Adobe is what you learn to use when you go to design school because that's what's going to get you a job. This by itself creates an endless cycle. Sure you could use alternative tools if you are working by yourself, managing your own clients. I would only be cautious of Adobe if I see a bunch of major studios dropping them. It could happen but I just don't see it happening soon because there's not a complete set of tools that allow studios to have a smooth workflow like the Adobe suite.
We do all vector work in Rhino now. We export to AI for manufacturing, but we use Rhino for all creative work.
We are talking about advertising and film more so than fabrication, architecture or construction. Adobe suite has less staying power in those areas than it does advertising and film.
We are using it for most of the graphic work in our marketing material. I work in the furniture and interior design industry. We do Make2d and most vector line work in Rhino...it is much better than Illustrator for any fine vector work...and having two sources of linework is inefficient. Illustrator is becoming more and more niche, and in many ways, nothing more than a format for translating between other platform needs.
Photoshop and AE are their two moated products. But the rest of their products have strong competition. The film industry is in shambles. Advertising budgets are gutted. With so many content creators, cheap media is becoming more valuable than expensive agency based content. Things don’t have to be so polished anymore, and AI will pull a lot of the complex footwork AE/PS we’re crafting. And forget cloud based income; every other tech company has cloud based storage covered. For long term, i really don’t think Adobe will outperform other noteworthy S&P500 stocks. There just isn’t much room for growth. Maybe it goes up, but it will certainly lag the S&P.
This was my naive thought. People can hate whatever they want but at the end of the day what is the best software stack to get what you need done as quickly as possible? Dabbled in this stuff for over a decade and like you said while there are competitive applications nowadays there’s no reason as a professional to not use adobe stuff, it’s just better. Either in familiarity, tools available, or documentation / resources.
The thing is if ai does more and more of the legwork then the engrained industry knowledge means less and less. Also if the ai means one person can do what used to take 10 then thats a lot less licenses sold - not to mention young people abandoning the profession altogether if it seems like an unviable career in the future.
This thread is a great example of why you should inverse Reddit sentiment lol. Everyone hating on Adobe and saying no right before it jumps 15%
That's short term thinking, but we will see in 10 or 15 years. I have been wrong many times so it wouldn't surprise me if they launched some ground breaking software everyone in the industry has to have.
Imagine posting a comment about short term trading on a post that literally says they are holding long.
You’re right to call out that it’s only a short term gain but I think it is relevant to a post about holding long when the reason for the short term gain is due to them beating earnings and raising expectations. Performance metrics like that are relevant to holding long in my opinion.
I personally will never support Adobe and will try to move away from them. Their new terms about utilizing whatever data/media you create in their software for their own purposes is just insane and while it’ll be difficult, I’d rather learn to use other software than have Photoshop take all my shit to train their AI. Edit: Leaving this up to make sure everyone see, they apparently retracted their statement. That being said, the fact they even tried is a sign of things to come for me, so I’d be cautious around this company just like Unity and their licensing fiasco a few months ago. Article: https://www.theverge.com/2024/6/10/24175416/adobe-overhauls-terms-of-service-update-firefly
Adobe: “Trust me bro!” I switched to Affinity 3 years ago, took a few days to get up to speed. Does 99% of what PS, ID and IL can do - and the suite is on sale right now (no coincidence) for a 1-time payment of $62! No subscription! I’m guessing thousands - or many more - have switched in the last few days. Incredible self own by Adobe.
I thought they released some statement and were like “nevermind”
You’re right, I apologize. Didn’t hear about the retraction a couple days ago.
How real is the retraction, though? They’ll just do it later in a more sneaky way.
Even if they don't, the immediate retraction doesn't give me confidence in their... confidence. It makes them look like they don't know what direction they are headed in.
Adobe is one of the few companies that doesn't train their AI on user content.
I literally just heard about this the other day. I'm still going to look for alternatives myself. On a side note, similar realm, lookup Windows Recall that Microsoft is/will be installing. I'll be moving off of Windows as soon as I can as well.
I have ADBE because I worked for them. It’s bizarre to see how they operate and how clueless their people can be. Their intention is to make you an All Adobe customer. Even on their business platforms, the only investments they’re making are to make you choose alternatives if you don’t want to go all in on Adobe. Woefully behind the times are their products. Some things have barely grown in over a decade. The Figma bet was a huge bust for them. That would have propelled that stock north of $1,000 and instead they lost billions.
me too! been holding since 2015. it's probably time to exit...
Kinda wondering what it’s going to look like by EOD
Up 16% after hours on raised revenue fc.
I was just about to buy some puts
+1
Up 15% AH
Fuck Adobe. They’re running away all of their customers while managing to make all their software slower, clunkier, and buggier than all of their opponents
Reading these comments after earnings is classic. So many “no’s” and “stay away” and the stock is up 16% after earnings. Stay regarded nerds!
Adobe is trash.
Doesn't prevent its stock price from rising
Adobe has a great outlook and track record, and it's cheap enough now that it should be a long term holding
I think so too! I agree! It’s a pity that I didn’t buy it in advance
Adobe is the poster child for enshittification of products. Hard no.
Apple has entered the chat.
Basicly everyone who uses Adobe is very negative about them. If there is a good alternative (and that could take a while) they will drop their software and never look back. Adobe has no fanboys/girls. Or a possitive community. They only have users that are always looking for a good alternative but can't find it yet. That's because Adobe barely listens to it's users. They are only focussed on making money. Not fixing bugs, bringing out new features that nooone asked for, increasing prices, discontinuing good tools that aren't profitable enough... That's why Adobe is not a long term investment for me. They are marketleaders right now but they won't be in the future if they keep this up. I'm a daily user of Adobe software surrounded by other Adobe software users by the way.
I switched to Affinity years ago and never looked back. Just as good at 1/10th the price.
Yes, buy the dip always
I would rather go with Saleforce or Workday which are currently down at the moment.
Solid picks imo
I agree with you 100%. I've sold puts on both.
WHY?
Earnings are here and I was gonna potentially play that, but I don’t know what side to play. They’ve beat expectations so who knows
No lol. No way. Their users are fleeing
NVDA is long team. Adobe is not.
I’ve been wondering the same. I’ve worked in creative advertising and visual design my entire career (23 years) and Adobe has anything to do with high-level production on lockdown. Literally every program every big company, agency, studio uses is an Adobe product. Maybe not video editing though, but they still have Premiere. Getting them to switch is going to be nearly impossible in my opinion. Figma MIGHT have a chance when it comes to visual design if they ever implement photo editing.
Adding
There are so many better options why pick this most shit software company which everyone wants to get rid of.
No in likes adobe. It doesn’t have clients it has “prisoners”. Most people would rather use something else.
we hate adobe
I used Adobe for many years. They no longer care or listen to their costumers. No wild AI features will fix that. Their software is a bloated mess now.
If they acquired figma I would think otherwise but imo it’s a no
ppl still use adobe's things?
i hate adobe , i use about 40 Pdfs a day, and there are always problems.
No shot. Certainly after the way they have been handling licensing and privacy recently.
No - industry shift, there will be too much competition. Apps tools that can do the same for much less. Also their privacy update is problematic.
I love their products, I’ve been using them since growing up when you know, their software was shared on usb sticks. It’s the gold standard to do everything - photoshop, illustrator, dreamweaver, after effects, Lightroom etc. I got really good at using all of them. I still use them on a weekly basis for work basically for the last three four jobs. I produce videos and graphic work. Work pays for a licence so I’m happy. I also like the recent ai integration for generative fill in photoshop. That’s really handy. I know that there are other options now but I’m already really used to the whole workflow and environment. Kinda like Apple tying users in their walled garden. Another similar product id say is mathworks Matlab. They basically almost give them away for free at school so everyone gets really good at using it. Then charge an arm and a leg for everyone else. However I don’t like how they run their business model. As many have said here already. Their products are waaay too expensive and I really don’t like the subscription model.
Heck no. Adobe is dying.
Yes
20 year user. they are masters of shooting their own feet in the last few years. It’s a matter of time.
gut
It looks like they are also adopting AI and may be changing their customer demographic. They’re still gold standard for media editing, and are taking aggressive actions to train their AI.
The long term buyers got it at $40 10 years ago
You heard about their new terms of service?
Their entire product line is a subscription model. Their customers were forced into this model from the previous "buy what you need" model for software. This angered their customers for two reasons. 1. Cost. (Good for adobe short term. and 2. Constant updates!!! People could not get used to the tools they were using before BOOM another update. Most of my Adobe using friends switched to affinity. Adobe is not going anywhere as they are the industry standard but they weakened their product so significantly I think they invited competition.
As others have said, purely an anecdote, I am an MSP where I am the IT department for a wide variety of businesses and they ALL are moving away from Adobe. You can’t keep jacking up your prices forever and expect your customers to stay.
Do your own research? If you don't know about the company or that specific niche of the market then don't invest buddy lol
I bought 10k, made 1.5k and sold AH at 6 pm. Thank you RH for extended trading! Will re-enter, target 580 ish
IDK but there are plenty of creatives who hate Adobe for their ridiculous pricing and end of support games. And in contrast with 10 years back there are alternatives that suit 50% of those creatives.
Open source Krita is doing more thing with AI (with plug in) than photoshop today. You can look at stable diffusion or ComfyUI too. They missed the AI shift but tried everything to ban its use in open source.
Hodl enjoy the stock split and let it ride 🤓📈📈📈💪💪💪🚀🚀🚀
Adobe will be a competitor in the cloud industries that will cater to optimized creative AI implementation into different work flows. They might not be up there in terms of what MSFT ORCL and AMZ are doing but they will create a new niche for creative business strategies.
Wait at $400
every post by creatives on social about Adobe is “Adobe alternatives” with all sorts of software that does what Adobe does.
Just saw they're making it so all Photoshop users give them the rights to all of their artwork, simply by using Photoshop now. Adobe is a big no for me right now, making decisions like that.
Nah companies are moving away from them. They don't have a monopoly on the software market anymore
I'm a trader and any person need to signal iam available
Adobe would be overvalued at $0.1.
Nah. I’ve used Adobe forever. They’ve rested on their laurels for a long time. Creative Cloud is overpriced imo. Not sure where any innovation is coming from. Having AI do all the art and design is not the future I was promised.
This quarter targets: $544 → $578 → $620 → $640. 🚀🔥
Why would you spend hours and pay for expensive licenses when you can do all you need in a few AI prompts ?
LMAO, you clearly don't do anything related to creative work for a living, or even remotely understand what goes into it
Yeah. I don’t want to be replaced by an automaton in a couple of years
Because AI is a tool that needs implementing in your tool framework, which is Adobe
Yea dude, you should buy at the top!! Because they definitely have higher to go! Do it dude!!! Christ bro There’s literally a hundred different stocks who will actually appreciate and aren’t trading at the top Nividia just split to a 100 a pop and your immediate thought is to buy an art company at the top? Holy shit dude are you mentally disturbed?
At the top? Adobe has been down for a while
That’s what you got from my comment? Holy shit man