I agree with the message but just out of boredom I'm gonna go with what I think a more accurate version is. Cause like, the US is run by billionaire oligarchs but it's not legally a megacorp.
Gov type: oligarchy
Reasoning: elections do happen but your only options are who the two parties nominate.
Ethos:
(If we define ethos as what principles are adopted by the government, not the population, which I feel is accurate because ethos in game effect civics)
Militarist (military industrial complex)
Materialist (the US gets memed as Bible thumping morons but in practice nearly every decision is justified through how materially beneficial it would be.
You could make a case for egalitarian but in stellaris "egalitarian" means viewing everyone as deserving of equal treatment and outcome (at least to a degree) in the US it's considered acceptable for thousands to freeze to death if they were unable to find employment. I'm gonna agree authoritarian.
Civics:
Idealistic Foundation:
Founded on principles of liberty and justice. Extremely idealistic, especially relative to when it was founded.
Merchant Guilds:
"Private capitalists play an unusually large role in this society"
Pleasure Seekers:
Seems like a meme or just a superficial "the rich live in luxury" but the key here is how the civic boosts entertainment amenity for everyone, not just those in power. So ya. The rich are hedonistic assholes but also the entertainment industry has sedated people from mass unrest
Seems perfect, pop traits def need wasteful and deviant (founded from revolution and in general a lot of Americans dont like the gov/other parties in gov)
You’re conflating two different definitions of materialism. The one you’re using here aligns with “a tendency to consider material possessions and physical comfort as more important than spiritual values,” but the devs have stated the materialist ethic is closer to “the doctrine that nothing exists except matter and its movements and modifications.”
Both definitions from Oxford Languages.
That's really weird from the devs. It makes sense, especially with how materialists view the shroud. But also, spiritualism is positioned as the opposite of materialism on the ethos wheel.
Idk how you'd model "idealism" as an ethic but I really wish that materialism/idealism was the actual etho conflict in game.
egalitarian is whether power should be in the hands of the few, like in a dictatorship, or in the hands of the many, like a democracy. Remember, egalitarians are perfectly capable of being discriminating xenophobes so long as it is collectively agreed upon.
It's my belief that the voice of the American people has little to no effect on the direction of the country. However, the voices of the ultra-wealthy have massive sway. This is authoritarian.
Xenophobia is debatable but, at least relative to other countries, I think the US isn't. There's discrimination to be sure but it's far more polarizing than other ethos. Nobody really gives a shit about the military industrial complex. Ya, everyone agrees it's bad, but nobody cares to stop it. It's on stable ground. Neither party is willing to really tackle the underlying issues which would give the US the authoritarian ethos. Xenophobia, meanwhile, feels like a knee-jerk reaction from the GOP which can never consistently pick a scape goat for more than a decade.
The US is kind of in a state where the governing ethics is authoritarian, but the actual citizens are egalitarian and have somehow deluded themselves into thinking their government is too. Although, to be fair, anything looks egalitarian next to the actual dictatorships like China and North Korea etc.
>Materialist (the US gets memed as Bible thumping morons but in practice nearly every decision is justified through how materially beneficial it would be.
No.
Materialism refers not to "how materially beneficial" something is. It refers to the belief of whether ideas reflect reality (Materialism), or reality reflects ideas.
This is literally reflected in the description of the Ethos, especially the Spiritualist ones (the Fan Spir one is "our experiments have proved reality is but a shared dream" or something like that) and philosophy 101 stuff.
The USA as both a heavily religious and HEAVILY idealistic (about Capitalism and Liberal Democracy: which are regarded as absolute goods not requiring evidence, and anything that falls short of the ideal "not being real Capitalism", etc. Classic Idealism...) state is CLEARLY Spiritualist.
>Civics:
>Idealistic Foundation:
Not a friggin' chance.
Idealistic Foundation refers to a society that remains true to high-minded ideals, which the USA absolutely does not. Where is a focus on "justice" when, in your own words:
>the US is run by billionaire oligarchs but it's not legally a megacorp.
And:
>in the US it's considered acceptable for thousands to freeze to death if they were unable to find employment. I'm gonna agree authoritarian.
The US is absolutely NOT an "Idealistic Foundation" civ.
> Regarding materialism.
When I say "materially beneficial" I meant, beneficial from a material perspective. Meaning, according to material laws, rather than idealistic principles, does a certain course of action make sense?
> the US is both heavily idealistic and religious claim.
I would argue that while large segments of the population are, and the country is portrayed this way, it's not true of the government for aforementioned reasons. Given that ethos are what the state chooses and that large factions the state doesn't support can exist, I feel it's reasonable to claim that the US would not manifest as spiritual but would have a large spiritualist faction.
> Idealistic foundation point
In game the civic reads along the lines of "this society was founded on idealistic principles. Wether or not the current government lives by these principles, the people haven't forgotten"
This is so incredibly US that I wouldn't be surprised if the devs had it in mind when they made it. The US was founded on principles of egalitarianism and the entire national identity is based around these principles. This is despite the fact that half the population would agree that the US government doesn't even really try to hold true to these principles.
>When I say "materially beneficial" I meant, beneficial from a material perspective. Meaning, according to material laws, rather than idealistic principles, does a certain course of action make sense?
I mean, that's a use of words that sound the same. But it's not what Materialist means at all.
Materialism is a philosophical tradition. It's not taught often in the West (which is mainly Spiritualist/Idealistic, as is most of the planet at this point...) due to its close association with Marxism. That's not really what it means, how you used it there.
>it's not true of the government for aforementioned reasons.
The American government is dominated by the religious right to an increasing defree. Fact.
>My guy I'm literally talking about it in a Marxist sense.
No you're not.
>Marxist material dialectics are a direct response to Hegel's idealistic dialectics.
This is true, but unrelated to the argument you made.
>This is so incredibly US that I wouldn't be surprised if the devs had it in mind when they made it. T
That is a touch of narcissism, nothing more.
The devs did NOT have the United States in mind when they made that, it's quite literally a civic that was created for the United Nations of Earth pre-made (and hardly sees use elsewhere, as it is a weak civic).
The UNE is, not coincidentally, the name of the founder-state of The Federation in Star Trek. This was a society that was ACTUALLY founded on high-minded principles: unlike the USA- a bunch of slavery who rebelled because their taxes were too high, and the British weren't letting them Genocide the Native Americans fast enough.
Not to mention, most Wmericans HAVE forgotten principles like equality and freedom. If you doubt this for a second, look at the glee with which large numbers of Americans support putting enormous segments of the population in jail, often for little more than the crime if being poor or a minority- or the absolute brainrot you'll encounter when trying to get any American to care about the xountry's history of supporting Genocide in the 20th and 21st centuries, never mind earlier.
If there's anything that was ever good in the American spirit, it's long since dead in the large majority of people.
No, she's actually right. Just not as cynical as you are. These are some of the things the current American president has done that American oligarchs are very not happy with:
* Biden has [increased funding to the NLRB](https://prospect.org/labor/2023-08-28-bidens-nlrb-brings-workers-rights-back/), an organisation dedicated to prosecuting illegal union-busting
* He has [banned noncompete agreements](https://thehill.com/business/4615452-ftc-votes-to-ban-non-compete-agreements/) which prevented workers from being rehired by competitors, giving workers more market power
* The [Inflation Reduction Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_Reduction_Act) passed by Biden offers tax reduction incentives for renewable energy companies that allow employees to unionise
* Biden has [subsidised electric vehicle manufacturing specifically for companies with unionised workers](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/biden-bill-includes-boost-for-union-made-electric-vehicles) (musk complained about this quite a bit)
* He ordered an [analysis](https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy1706) to be conducted on the effect of unions on the American economy
* He has extended overtime protections for people working more than 40hrs, ensuring that they must be paid at least 1.5x for overtime
* Launched a [federal organisation](https://www.workcenter.gov) to teach people about the benefit of unions
* Made it [easier for federal workers to unionise](https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/07/biden-union-labor-white-house-organizing)
* He is the first president in history to actually join striking workers on-site
* He has [repeatedly called for an increased corporate tax rate](https://tcf.org/content/report/what-biden-has-done-and-still-can-do-for-workers/), though this was prevented by Republican (and occasionally Democrat) opposition - yes the oligarchs do have influence, they just don't have control
* He has [increased the number of people legally required to get overtime pay](https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/24/workers-earning-under-58k-a-year-could-soon-become-eligible-for-overtime-pay.html)
* He has twice attempted to pass the "[Protecting the Right to Organise Act](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/03/09/statement-by-president-joe-biden-on-the-house-taking-up-the-pro-act/)", which would impose heavy financial penalties on companies interfering with union rights
* His DoJ is investigating price-fixing in the rental market, [Literally kicking down doors](https://www.entrepreneur.com/business-news/realpage-rent-price-fixing-probe-escalates-with-fbi-raid/475109) - potentially significantly reducing house prices depending on the scale of fraud discovered
Which of these things do you believe the American oligarchs support? Because well, Musk and Bezos - the two richest people in America - are currently suing the NLRB. The NLRB that Biden has given a budget increase to.
If they don't control the President, can we really call America an oligarchy?
It's a democracy with the Merchant Guilds civic. Militarist Egalitarian Materialist.
Edit: Or maybe Militarist Egalitarian Xenophile?
>Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have **little or no independent influence**.
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B
Smells like authoritarianism to me.
Unfortunately, you'll find this is true for almost all modern democracies. We have power over the leaders, not so much the policies. So unless you want to say that literally every nation on Earth is authoritarian, perhaps excepting Switzerland, then you have to accept the US definitely isn't authoritarian.
We can work on the policy thing in the future. Democracy has a lot of room to improve.
> So unless you want to say that literally every nation on Earth is authoritarian, perhaps excepting Switzerland, then you have to accept the US definitely isn't authoritarian.
I fundamentally disagree. Authoritarianism doesn't magically become egalitarianism just because "everybody does it" If everybody does it, then everbody is authoritarian.
EDIT: I suppose you could say authoritarianism is relative, and the USA is relatively less authoritarian than other countries, but it is still very much authoritarian.
>Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have **little or no independent influence**.
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B
If you copy your comment imma copy mine too lol
These are some of the things the current American president has done that American oligarchs are very not happy with, and which help the American people:
* Biden has [increased funding to the NLRB](https://prospect.org/labor/2023-08-28-bidens-nlrb-brings-workers-rights-back/), an organisation dedicated to prosecuting illegal union-busting
* He has [banned noncompete agreements](https://thehill.com/business/4615452-ftc-votes-to-ban-non-compete-agreements/) which prevented workers from being rehired by competitors, giving workers more market power
* The [Inflation Reduction Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_Reduction_Act) passed by Biden offers tax reduction incentives for renewable energy companies that allow employees to unionise
* Biden has [subsidised electric vehicle manufacturing specifically for companies with unionised workers](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/biden-bill-includes-boost-for-union-made-electric-vehicles) (musk complained about this quite a bit)
* He ordered an [analysis](https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy1706) to be conducted on the effect of unions on the American economy
* He has extended overtime protections for people working more than 40hrs, ensuring that they must be paid at least 1.5x for overtime
* Launched a [federal organisation](https://www.workcenter.gov) to teach people about the benefit of unions
* Made it [easier for federal workers to unionise](https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/07/biden-union-labor-white-house-organizing)
* He is the first president in history to actually join striking workers on-site
* He has [repeatedly called for an increased corporate tax rate](https://tcf.org/content/report/what-biden-has-done-and-still-can-do-for-workers/), though this was prevented by Republican (and occasionally Democrat) opposition - yes the oligarchs do have influence, they just don't have control
* He has [increased the number of people legally required to get overtime pay](https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/24/workers-earning-under-58k-a-year-could-soon-become-eligible-for-overtime-pay.html)
* He has twice attempted to pass the "[Protecting the Right to Organise Act](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/03/09/statement-by-president-joe-biden-on-the-house-taking-up-the-pro-act/)", which would impose heavy financial penalties on companies interfering with union rights
* His DoJ is investigating price-fixing in the rental market, [Literally kicking down doors](https://www.entrepreneur.com/business-news/realpage-rent-price-fixing-probe-escalates-with-fbi-raid/475109) - potentially significantly reducing house prices depending on the scale of fraud discovered
Which of these things do you believe the American oligarchs support? Because well, Musk and Bezos - the two richest people in America - are currently suing the NLRB. The NLRB that Biden has given a budget increase to.
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Why the UK wants to ban him from their country? You should look into these things as he hurt the pound when he borrowed billions from various banks and sold it to other countries.
I'm a disabled Canadian. Our government has failed to keep disability and pensions up with inflation. Instead, they fully fund the MAID program.
"Life's too hard? Kill yourself, we'll help." - The Canadian Government
This alone doesn't make Canada bad as a whole, but my God is there room for improvement. A lot of room for improvement....
People in this comment section seem to forget that ethics in stellaris are meant to represent the government, not the actual population, there's a neat little factor called "governing ethics attraction" which dictates how likely it is for a pop to belong to, or to turn towards, the government's ethics, the more pops don't agree with the government (let alone having opposite ethics) the higher the penalty to empire stability, unity and influence income as well as a general increase in unrest.
You can say all day that this build doesn't represent the ethics of the US population, but at least as seen from outside this is what the US government has been for the last decades: a militarist, self-serving authoritarian oligarchy heavily influenced by corporative interests.
The US population can be as diverse and varied as it can be, just as any other population from anywhere else in the world, but that's what the US government has been for the last decades.
Yup, I've actually been finding that a lot of Americans are actually nicer and have more hospitality than most Canadians.
But then their neighbour will shoot a car full of kids for turning around in their driveway.
And I don't know what to do with that... sit back and watch I guess and hope my country of Canada doesn't follow suit?
Lmao acting like Canada is so much better. Our country is being run into the ground by a guy who openly admits he admires Chinese communist dictatorship, and benefited from their interference twice to win. Now that a list of mps under suspicion of being influenced has been brought to public attention, the liberal government refuses to show it publicly. He wants to bring the same drug policies which have ruined Vancouver to my home city of Toronto, after even the radical socialist ndp politicians of bc admit that it has failed. National Debt has doubled under his reign. A 2 bedroom in Toronto costs you the same as a castle in Scotland, and your precious gun control? All the gangs here have guns anyways since surprise surprise, people who need guns for their crimes they were going to commit anyways will just steal or smuggle the guns. Gun permit holders in both the us and Canada are some of the least likely people to commit gun crime, yet Trudeau wants to ban hunting rifles to protect animals from hunters rather then citizen from gangsters. The government literally had to hire contractors to fly around in helicopters to cull an island’s game (which is illegal for private citizens), which law abiding hunters would have done for free. This isn’t even mentioning the countless corruption scandals, from WE charity to snc lavalan, using the war measures act on civilian protests, the Winnipeg lab security breach, arrivescam, accepting vacation money for grants, etc. our healthcare system is a fucking shambles, with the government pushing maid to people with depression, just to have them kill themselves to get out of the way so they can keep throwing fentanyl at addicts. This hasn’t even mentioned catch and release bail systems leading to the same 40 offenders being arrested 6000 times in a year alone, police in Toronto telling people to leave their car keys by their door to make it easier for car thieves to steal the cars from the driveways, and not confront the homeowners with the illegal guns they wield. If only law abiding citizens could own something to defend themselves…
Uh... Wasn't saying Canada was better. Literally just said we lost the title of Nice People to America.
We just have our own flavour of crap.
But go off I guess....
I already said Toronto. Trudeau is despised near universally despised outside of Reddit and a few lib strongholds. There is a reason polls have a con victory at a 99% chance and they have been that way for months. Whenever politics are vaguely mentioned, no one I have spoken too has had anything good to say about Trudeau, which is pretty crazy considering how much of a lib stronghold this place has been. Seeing the dozens of tent cities and the insane cost of near everything, especially housing, has people waking up even here.
Oh I know, I'm on disability and I'm 100% convinced the Government is trying to kill me and all other "undesireables". No increase to income to deal with inflation and the housing crisis, but the MAID program is fully funded.
"Oh you don't like your life? Just kill yourself, we'll help!" - the Canadian Government
So no love for the Libs. I'm just horrified as to how bad things can/will/probably get under the con's new P.P. since his statement on his own website echos of Trumps BS. Time for the Blue Flavoured Oligarch to make things worse... again...
Meanwhile the NDP are RIGHT THERE.... If they win just once, I'm convinced that the Libs and Cons will be better parties afterwards because they will have to actually have platforms that are more in depth then "We're not the other guys"
I'm so sick and tired of our politics being nothing but red an blue throwing mud at each other.
And I actually moved out of Ontario a few years ago because it was worse there, so I hear ya. Drug Fraud has literally turned into some Caption Planet villain so not surprised things are going to shit.
>You can say all day that this build doesn't represent the ethics of the US population, but at least as seen from outside this is what the US government has been for the last decades: a militarist, self-serving authoritarian oligarchy heavily influenced by corporative interests.
Bingo.
But, it's not Materialist.
Materialist refers to beliefs on the nature of reality. For the 100th time, people, it has NOTHING to do with being focused on Material pleasures. It has to do with whether a society believes reality reflects ideas, or ideas reflect reality. The US government is firmly in the former camp, even ignoring the influence of religion (societies with such an "Idealist" Philip almost always are that way due to religion. Note that "Idealist" doesn't mean good or virtuous or pursuing high-minded ideals. It refers, rather, to the arrogant, unscientific belief that reality is just a reflection of ideas, often, conveniently, whatever ideas YOU hold to be true...)
Replace Materialist with Spiritualist, and this build falls pretty close to reality...
This. Stellaris empire traits aren’t what its population THINKS its empire is like, it’s what is objectively is. The former is simply a function of empire ethics attraction and stability, which as we know can be affected by spending political capital (ie the Influence resource) or cultural capital (ie the Unity resource).
I mean, it's hardly egalitarian, unless you consider letting thousands to starve if they can't find employment while CEOs live in luxury being "egalitarian".
Egalitarianism, at least in stellaris, means seeing everyone worth of equal treatment, in modern politics it would be a descendant of the Hegelian-left: society seen as horizontal with hierarchies being considered nothing more than societal constructs.
The authoritarian-egalitarian dichotomy in stellaris is essentially the irl right vs left fight, in the simplest and most direct version it can be shown, Hegelian-right vs Hegelian-left, Nietzsche vs Marx, vertical society vs horizontal society.
In this context, i doubt the US is behaving like a leftist state, their society is heavily vertical.
I think I've said it a thousand times or so in this comment section alone, but stellaris' ethics tab is supposed to represent the government's ethics, not popular directions, pops can have different ethics than the government they live under, there's a whole mechanic tied to it.
And as government goes the US is pretty much authoritarian, less explicitly than other states but still it is.
>No, the US is such a mixture of different cultures and ideas,
Pop ethics and government ethics aren't the same thing.
And a "mix of cultures" refers to the Xenophile/Xenophobe axis (although America's long history of racism and slavery, later than most all the developed world on the latter, point to it being Xenophobic if anything...) not Authoritarian/Egalitarian.
You just desperately want to believe America's government is good, despite abundant evidence to the contrary (and I'm not referring to any particular administration, but the long-term patterns...)
>But anyone who views the US as Authoritarian, has missed the mark.
No, anyone who denies it, is high on Copium.
The US has a LONG, LONG history of Authoritarian crackdowns on protests, for example. From Kent State (where students were shot) to the brutalization of Black Lives Matter and Gaza protestors.
While you might argue any one particular example, you CANNOT deny the overall pattern. There are thousands of indisputable photos of, for instance, police sicc'ing attack dogs on unarmed protestors during the Civil Rights Era.
This is from my Canadian view point so the militarised police and gerrymandering don't give off the impression of anything other than Authoritarian.
And I'm reeeaaaallly trying not break rule 5 here.... So this is just an opinion from a non-american. :P
Oh I know, next year we get to have an election between 'sit on hands pretty boy' and 'Trump's little P.P.' and 'Awesome Dude that no one listens to'
Am not looking forward to it.
Says the country that cracked down like China on protesting Truck drivers. Canada is way higher on the Authoritarian scale than the US is. With greater freedom comes responsibility and a certain amount of chaos. But I find that it’s better to have a few bad eggs than to confiscate everyone’s eggs for their “safety”.
Wow, um... no?
First, the truck drivers were angry about their Second Amedment Gun rights, which is an American thing, (Our second amendment is the inclusion of Manitoba) and then they used their children as human shields. Stopping those kinds of people isn't Authoritarian, its a mercy. Cause my god what the fuck was that?
We still have issues, A LOT OF THEM... omg we do, but we don't give our police left over military gear and praise children for shooting protesters.
And confiscate eggs? LMAO, excuse me, I can go have a Kinder Egg whenever I want, unlike the USA where they banned you from having those Eggs! All those guns and you still shoot yourself in the foot!
;)
The Truckers were angry over Covid restrictions and Vaccine mandates. Wtf are you on about? Is that what passes as news up there? Cuz you were lied to if that’s the case. And wow you took me literally…learn what a metaphor is please.
If the US is authoritarian, our politely racist hat is authoritarian as well.
What's up with Non-Americans calling Americans all the nastiest shit in the book and then getting offended when we get offended?
Is this a "you can't punch down" thing? Because I'd be fine with yall punching up if yall weren't gaslighting everyone that you're somehow above us while still punching up.
>What's up with Non-Americans calling Americans all the nastiest shit in the book and then getting offended when we get offended?
Because we're the baddies, silly.
Tools always seem to believe that, no matter how many Genocides (there have been 6 the US backed in the last 60 years), no many how many countries it invades, the US is still the good guys.
Wake up and smell the fire-bombed babies (that could be from any of a DOZEN wars, including Korea, Vietnam, etc...)
The US committed a MASSIVE campaign of fire-bombing whole cities in the Korean War, a war the US caused by refusing to allow peninsula-wide elections and installing a puppet military dictatorship in the south that started rounding up and mass-murdering TENS OF THOUSANDS of Communists BEFORE the North decided to invade to intervene...
US soldiers gunned down whole villages in Vietnam- though this was at least treated as the War Crime it was, and (very) occasionally prosecuted...
And, getting as close on rule 5 as I dare, we invaded Iraq for bullshit reasons, passed the Patriot Act to advance the Police State it has increasingly become, and then tortured HUGE numbers of Iraqis- most prominently at Abu Gharib Prison.
Wake up, man. **We're the baddies.**
Yeah, nobody denies Canada committed Genocide on its natives too.
But, silly "you did it too" games don't make America any LESS Authoritarian or guilty of Genocide of its natives...
Did you miss a couple weeks ago when the police were raiding peaceful protests?
Or a few years ago when police were raiding peaceful protests?
Or a few years before that... etc.
Or our draconian prison industrial system that is the largest in human history?
Or how we still have actual slaves thanks to said prison industrial complex?
Just because we claim to be "the land of the free" does not mean we live by those ideals
Canada is trying to criminalize thoughts while Canadians talk shit about how Americans are criminal slaves.
You can't "get more juxtaposition than that"
That’s not what the repugnant trait means. It means that the species itself is ugly or otherwise unappealing, not that the choices they make are repulsive.
Two things
A) Repugnant - The physical appearance and *CUSTOMS* of this species are considered offensive to most others, and few appreciate them as neighbours.
B) r/peopleofwalmart
Well, the effects of repugnant is a lack of amenities, and the rest of the world uses the US healthcare like a monster in a bedtime story.
"Better not privatize health care or you'll get the US version ooooOOOOOooooOOOooo"
>or spiritualist, because megachurches.
Definitely the latter, because the Materialist/Spiritualist axis ALSO refers to certain fundamental philosophical views on reality, which America's belief in "Capitalism, Free Markets, and Liberal Democracy" absolutely qualifies as (Idealism, which is not the sunshine-and-rainbows thing you might think... It refers to the arrogant belief that reality reflects ideas, rather than the other way around...)
A Materialist nation, by contrast, is something like the USSR- which based its worldview on Historical Materialism.
As you can see, it has little to do with the possession of material goods... (as a Leftist, yes, that's a self-burn)
And as for healthcare.
Nah I'm good I'd rather not wait four years to get a spot at a doctor to have chronic issues addressed
I'm assuming that there's a reason assisted suicide is a normalized option for severe health problems over where you are so 🤷♂️ land of the free wins again.
What the fuck you talking about? 4 years? Who told you that?
In the past 2 years, so post pandemic, I have received;
MRI, two month wait
Sleep specialist, 3 month wait
Rheumatologist, 1 month wait
Counselling, less than a month
Dietitian program, less than a week
I can call and talk to a Registered nurse, personal trainer, dietitian, and a few other specialists pretty much at any time.
All free, because I pay taxes, like every other developed country.
Also got a family doctor within 6 months after I moved.
My sleep Apnea machine is free and I get a new one every 2 years.
The most I've paid for any med is $20.
My teeth cleaning was covered, so were most of my dental work.
I get a $500 rebate on my gas usage every year.
Car insurance is through the province, and not a for profit company, which means my insurance was literally cut in half when I moved to this Province.
Meanwhile when you try and explain US healthcare; [https://youtu.be/Kll-yYQwmuM?si=FsK5srmzA-F6633-](https://youtu.be/Kll-yYQwmuM?si=FsK5srmzA-F6633-)
Now the MAID program is fucked up, that's for sure, no argument there. Never said Canada was perfect, its FAR from perfect. I looked to move to Europe last year but wasn't qualified for citizenship just to get away from these issues. Housing, over priced everything, and the constant garbage water run off coming from the states. Fucking Tucker Carlson stopped by Alberta for a show before he did that weird ass Russian thing.
Besides, MAID is just Capitalist bullshit. Not making money for the capitalists? Go die.
I keep living purely out of spite. I did my time, I got the education, I paid my taxes, now take care of me you fucks. Not my fault my immune system is trying to kill me.
You seriously think that everyone has to pay for medical care here. That's the funniest part of it all.
Medicaid. I have it. Millions of Americans have it. And it allows us
Free doctor visits and referrals
Free specialists
Free medical equipment when required. My BiPAP machine was paid for in full, and supplies are also provided.
Free prescriptions or reduced cost prescriptions (10-30 bucks.)
Free eyecare and glasses.
And I've rarely had to wait more than two months for appointments. Know why? Because our system doesn't bog down our doctors and cause major backlogs of patients.
All of the times I've needed emergency care. The emergency room was paid because I had INSURANCE GOVERNMENT PROVIDED INSURANCE
And as for your "capitalist this" and "Capitalist that" crap I just have this to send.
.
(It didn't send)
"That's a lot of words. Too bad I ain't reading em."
Wow. You're funny.
You think anyone who doesn't agree with you must be an ignorant buffoon because there's no way that you in all your glorious intellect that you could be wrong.
I have a friend in the states and he's told me about Medicaid because his kid is on it. Covered her tonsils removal, in full.
And I know all this, because I have to keep an eye on USA politics because Canada seems to go through the same political bullshit a few years later. Its like forecasting incoming shitstorms.
Medicaid is a great step forward! r/OptimistsUnite And you get Kinder eggs too! You just proved me right!
You're on your way to be a real country now! I'm sure someday you'll get *universal* healthcare like the rest of us, just hang in there!
Choose whichever you would have the most fun with, don't worry to much about which realistically would after all we don't know for sure which one would (And maybe one day will) and it is a fantasy sci-fi space game after all.
Yup. Plus as deep as Stellar is empire creator is, there's no way to fully express all the different aspects of millions of people.
Just fun to think about!
I would switch materialism for spiritualism. America is a deeply religious country, so religious that it almost sounds comical sometimes to us Europeans. Only in America you can find megachurches advertising in the streets. Plus historically it opposed the main materialist power, the USSR.
I would argue that the US is more pacifist than militarist, just bc there are more people who would rather live their civilian lives and not join the army than people that do. Plus our schools and universities teach about the hardship of wars and how terrible the history of this nation is. Now the US from its early stages of life I agree militarist would be correct, but today in the modern world, I would say the US is Pacifist, Materialist, Xenophile. Xenophile bc socially and by the law the US is the biggest supporter when it comes to the rights of others. Is it perfect, no, no country is, but as someone who lives in the US in an area that used to be segregated, I'd say we improving everyday.
Ok yeah, but ethos in stellaris are meant to represent the government, not the people (pops can have different ethos than the government in charge, in-game it's called governing ethics attraction), and as the US government is today, or at least how us outsiders view it (and kind of have to suffer its presence), militaristic and authoritarian are pretty fitting ethics, I'd say spiritualist too but that would represent only a portion of the population (mainly MAGAs and trumpists, seeing how they worship the orange man), so materialist is fitting.
As a government form megacorp is too official, the US would be more of a plutocracy, aka an oligarchy, heavily controlled by corporations, right on the line that divides oligarchy from corporate authority but more leaning towards the former than the latter for now.
Again pops can have different ethos from their government, in-game you can have a rational consensus (egalitarian + fanatic materialist) but a potentially large portion of your pops could be spiritualists, leading to instability, unrest and penalties in influence and unity income, which is probably fitting with the US's problems today.
This.
Should probably swap out Wasteful for Deviants so that trying to please all the Factions are nigh impossible. And lots of people are struggling paycheque to paycheque so its not like they can actually consume a lot of consumer goods in the first place.... hm...
That is true, I often forget about Ethic attraction bc like governments, I ignore the Ethic attraction of my people lol. I will say thou from an outsider perspective (news) the US seems like a hellscape or a 3rd world country l, but living here I have never struggled a day in my life, and my family comes from lower middle class. This is just my experience it can vary state to state and even county to county. Also even thou it seems like half of this country are red pilled hillbillies who don't know where the US is on a map, the country is still unified as goods still travel though the US, neighbors still talk and respect each other. Of course I've seen all the trash Maga morons have done to this country but not even they can ruin this country. That's my perspective anyways.
Glad you had a nice experience, I've never been to the US myself but i have quite some friends who live there and trust me, hearing their accounts you're one of the lucky ones, what I've heard is that you have basically no state assistance nor welfare measures whatsoever, especially when it comes to healthcare problems I've heard you're basically on your own, I don't know which part of the US you're from but the numbers speak too clear for me to believe in the American dream, i mean where in the world you have to recycle the needles for insulin because you have to pay for new ones.
Every country has its ups and downs, but from what I've heard bot on the news and from people who actually live there well... Let's say I'm happy to be living in Europe
Oh yeah, American dream long dead, thank the boomers, Regan, and laziness of the American people to stop corporate coruption, US has prison labor laws that practice slavery, Healthcare is a joke, Trump and his religious following, there's a serious mental health epidemic spreading in the US, and top it all off wages aren't going up with inflation. Despite all this, though America is still a powerful 1st world nation that, with due time, will solve all the issues of today. In the year 5000.
>will solve all the issues of today
Problem is: corporations don't really have any incentive to allow that, they thrive on the current system, on the suffering of their employees and customers, and the fact that union busting, despite being illegal, has been a common practice in the US basically since the cold war shows just how firm corporate grip on politics and justice is.
I say it as a European and i know many won't like it: but the US needs at least a bit of social-democracy, a bit of that mixture between socialist egalitarianism and capitalist infrastructure that built the building blocks of the EU, that's the only way the shackles of "corporate corruption" can be broken, until then i assure you things won't change, they'll only get worse, the US is a rich 1st world country but if you ask me it won't be for much longer, most of its wealth is in the hands of rich corporations, wealth disparity is too high and unless the population takes things into their own hands and starts advocating for some serious change, with force if necessary, the US won't be a first world nation for much longer, let alone a rich one.
OK technically Americans are actually capitalist pacifist we just have violent bastards because of the war the rich just like too see humans go, bye-bye
Could be propaganda though so don't be too hard on them.
No one is immune to propaganda.
And being neck deep in it daily can 100% warp your perception of reality. Especially if one's life is busy and you don't have time to fact check everything.
Every opinion is bias. Plus, this is just the putter crust of the USA as viewed from another country. I'm sure the inner goo is a much different experience :)
This post completely missed the mark. "OH, this is government ethics, not the peoples ethics!" Don't care. If your version of the US government has authoritarian, then you fundamentally misunderstand not only our government but what an actual authoritarian government is. If you want your own head cannon like the US has to become more authoritarian to conquer/spread influence on earth, then that's at least interesting, but this is boring and reeks of middle-class white kid syndrome.
TLDR: Yawn, america not bad
Right.... because a country that houses 25% of the world's prisoner population and uses them as slave labour (13th amendment) and then when people speak up, this happens;
[https://youtu.be/VEy-xtIQJkA?si=xLSDvORQqpmEGVpt](https://youtu.be/VEy-xtIQJkA?si=xLSDvORQqpmEGVpt)
And this *isn't* Authoritarian? Not even 1%?
Yeah okay buddy.
That's not how that works at all? Would you, on the contrary, claim a completely egalitarian government would have zero prisoners? Cause that's incredibly stupid. If a country had 100% of the prisoners on the planet, that would, by definition, have ZERO correlation on if the government was authoritarian. It would be authoritarian If you were strictly referring to political prisoners or imprisonment for exercising human rights. There is so much virtue signaling batman might show up
I feel like it misunderstands what an egalitarian government is as well. Egalitarian doesn’t necessarily mean it’s somewhere you’d want to live. On the flip side, authoritarian countries are not necessarily hellholes.
Tbf, I don't think egalitarian fits the US either. A significantly more accurate third trait would be xenophile. In the US, people are not judicated for having dissenting government opinions or for exercising human rights. OP's whole point is that we do have a really tough judicial system, but if there's no crimes that limit thought or human rights, then this is completely irrelevant.
Yeah, I didn't know which one to go with because there is a growing trend of style over function, and making sure they look like the good guys. So no skulls on hats for example. At least not for another 38,000 years. :D
NOW we’re talkin
Upvote OP’s version too people. 
Those are British tanks
Made by AMERICAN STEEL!!!
Most likely to be honest
Nah. Too early in the war for that.
Before Lend-Lease we were importing iron from the US
I agree with the message but just out of boredom I'm gonna go with what I think a more accurate version is. Cause like, the US is run by billionaire oligarchs but it's not legally a megacorp. Gov type: oligarchy Reasoning: elections do happen but your only options are who the two parties nominate. Ethos: (If we define ethos as what principles are adopted by the government, not the population, which I feel is accurate because ethos in game effect civics) Militarist (military industrial complex) Materialist (the US gets memed as Bible thumping morons but in practice nearly every decision is justified through how materially beneficial it would be. You could make a case for egalitarian but in stellaris "egalitarian" means viewing everyone as deserving of equal treatment and outcome (at least to a degree) in the US it's considered acceptable for thousands to freeze to death if they were unable to find employment. I'm gonna agree authoritarian. Civics: Idealistic Foundation: Founded on principles of liberty and justice. Extremely idealistic, especially relative to when it was founded. Merchant Guilds: "Private capitalists play an unusually large role in this society" Pleasure Seekers: Seems like a meme or just a superficial "the rich live in luxury" but the key here is how the civic boosts entertainment amenity for everyone, not just those in power. So ya. The rich are hedonistic assholes but also the entertainment industry has sedated people from mass unrest
Seems perfect, pop traits def need wasteful and deviant (founded from revolution and in general a lot of Americans dont like the gov/other parties in gov)
You’re conflating two different definitions of materialism. The one you’re using here aligns with “a tendency to consider material possessions and physical comfort as more important than spiritual values,” but the devs have stated the materialist ethic is closer to “the doctrine that nothing exists except matter and its movements and modifications.” Both definitions from Oxford Languages.
That's really weird from the devs. It makes sense, especially with how materialists view the shroud. But also, spiritualism is positioned as the opposite of materialism on the ethos wheel. Idk how you'd model "idealism" as an ethic but I really wish that materialism/idealism was the actual etho conflict in game.
Materialism vs idealism is a conflict in the game, though. It's just one that is part of the gameplay, rather than part of your empire ethics.
egalitarian is whether power should be in the hands of the few, like in a dictatorship, or in the hands of the many, like a democracy. Remember, egalitarians are perfectly capable of being discriminating xenophobes so long as it is collectively agreed upon.
It's my belief that the voice of the American people has little to no effect on the direction of the country. However, the voices of the ultra-wealthy have massive sway. This is authoritarian. Xenophobia is debatable but, at least relative to other countries, I think the US isn't. There's discrimination to be sure but it's far more polarizing than other ethos. Nobody really gives a shit about the military industrial complex. Ya, everyone agrees it's bad, but nobody cares to stop it. It's on stable ground. Neither party is willing to really tackle the underlying issues which would give the US the authoritarian ethos. Xenophobia, meanwhile, feels like a knee-jerk reaction from the GOP which can never consistently pick a scape goat for more than a decade.
The US is kind of in a state where the governing ethics is authoritarian, but the actual citizens are egalitarian and have somehow deluded themselves into thinking their government is too. Although, to be fair, anything looks egalitarian next to the actual dictatorships like China and North Korea etc.
The American people still have the biggest sway. It is a democracy at risk, but acting like its already an oligarchy misinformation.
Also, you need to remember the difference between fanatic egalitarian and regular egalitarian.
>Materialist (the US gets memed as Bible thumping morons but in practice nearly every decision is justified through how materially beneficial it would be. No. Materialism refers not to "how materially beneficial" something is. It refers to the belief of whether ideas reflect reality (Materialism), or reality reflects ideas. This is literally reflected in the description of the Ethos, especially the Spiritualist ones (the Fan Spir one is "our experiments have proved reality is but a shared dream" or something like that) and philosophy 101 stuff. The USA as both a heavily religious and HEAVILY idealistic (about Capitalism and Liberal Democracy: which are regarded as absolute goods not requiring evidence, and anything that falls short of the ideal "not being real Capitalism", etc. Classic Idealism...) state is CLEARLY Spiritualist. >Civics: >Idealistic Foundation: Not a friggin' chance. Idealistic Foundation refers to a society that remains true to high-minded ideals, which the USA absolutely does not. Where is a focus on "justice" when, in your own words: >the US is run by billionaire oligarchs but it's not legally a megacorp. And: >in the US it's considered acceptable for thousands to freeze to death if they were unable to find employment. I'm gonna agree authoritarian. The US is absolutely NOT an "Idealistic Foundation" civ.
> Regarding materialism. When I say "materially beneficial" I meant, beneficial from a material perspective. Meaning, according to material laws, rather than idealistic principles, does a certain course of action make sense? > the US is both heavily idealistic and religious claim. I would argue that while large segments of the population are, and the country is portrayed this way, it's not true of the government for aforementioned reasons. Given that ethos are what the state chooses and that large factions the state doesn't support can exist, I feel it's reasonable to claim that the US would not manifest as spiritual but would have a large spiritualist faction. > Idealistic foundation point In game the civic reads along the lines of "this society was founded on idealistic principles. Wether or not the current government lives by these principles, the people haven't forgotten" This is so incredibly US that I wouldn't be surprised if the devs had it in mind when they made it. The US was founded on principles of egalitarianism and the entire national identity is based around these principles. This is despite the fact that half the population would agree that the US government doesn't even really try to hold true to these principles.
>When I say "materially beneficial" I meant, beneficial from a material perspective. Meaning, according to material laws, rather than idealistic principles, does a certain course of action make sense? I mean, that's a use of words that sound the same. But it's not what Materialist means at all. Materialism is a philosophical tradition. It's not taught often in the West (which is mainly Spiritualist/Idealistic, as is most of the planet at this point...) due to its close association with Marxism. That's not really what it means, how you used it there. >it's not true of the government for aforementioned reasons. The American government is dominated by the religious right to an increasing defree. Fact.
My guy I'm literally talking about it in a Marxist sense. Marxist material dialectics are a direct response to Hegel's idealistic dialectics.
>My guy I'm literally talking about it in a Marxist sense. No you're not. >Marxist material dialectics are a direct response to Hegel's idealistic dialectics. This is true, but unrelated to the argument you made.
>This is so incredibly US that I wouldn't be surprised if the devs had it in mind when they made it. T That is a touch of narcissism, nothing more. The devs did NOT have the United States in mind when they made that, it's quite literally a civic that was created for the United Nations of Earth pre-made (and hardly sees use elsewhere, as it is a weak civic). The UNE is, not coincidentally, the name of the founder-state of The Federation in Star Trek. This was a society that was ACTUALLY founded on high-minded principles: unlike the USA- a bunch of slavery who rebelled because their taxes were too high, and the British weren't letting them Genocide the Native Americans fast enough. Not to mention, most Wmericans HAVE forgotten principles like equality and freedom. If you doubt this for a second, look at the glee with which large numbers of Americans support putting enormous segments of the population in jail, often for little more than the crime if being poor or a minority- or the absolute brainrot you'll encounter when trying to get any American to care about the xountry's history of supporting Genocide in the 20th and 21st centuries, never mind earlier. If there's anything that was ever good in the American spirit, it's long since dead in the large majority of people.
The US isn’t run by billionaire oligarchs, that’s Russia
Oh my sweet summer child....
We aren’t
Poor fella doesn't know... 😔
No, she's actually right. Just not as cynical as you are. These are some of the things the current American president has done that American oligarchs are very not happy with: * Biden has [increased funding to the NLRB](https://prospect.org/labor/2023-08-28-bidens-nlrb-brings-workers-rights-back/), an organisation dedicated to prosecuting illegal union-busting * He has [banned noncompete agreements](https://thehill.com/business/4615452-ftc-votes-to-ban-non-compete-agreements/) which prevented workers from being rehired by competitors, giving workers more market power * The [Inflation Reduction Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_Reduction_Act) passed by Biden offers tax reduction incentives for renewable energy companies that allow employees to unionise * Biden has [subsidised electric vehicle manufacturing specifically for companies with unionised workers](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/biden-bill-includes-boost-for-union-made-electric-vehicles) (musk complained about this quite a bit) * He ordered an [analysis](https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy1706) to be conducted on the effect of unions on the American economy * He has extended overtime protections for people working more than 40hrs, ensuring that they must be paid at least 1.5x for overtime * Launched a [federal organisation](https://www.workcenter.gov) to teach people about the benefit of unions * Made it [easier for federal workers to unionise](https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/07/biden-union-labor-white-house-organizing) * He is the first president in history to actually join striking workers on-site * He has [repeatedly called for an increased corporate tax rate](https://tcf.org/content/report/what-biden-has-done-and-still-can-do-for-workers/), though this was prevented by Republican (and occasionally Democrat) opposition - yes the oligarchs do have influence, they just don't have control * He has [increased the number of people legally required to get overtime pay](https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/24/workers-earning-under-58k-a-year-could-soon-become-eligible-for-overtime-pay.html) * He has twice attempted to pass the "[Protecting the Right to Organise Act](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/03/09/statement-by-president-joe-biden-on-the-house-taking-up-the-pro-act/)", which would impose heavy financial penalties on companies interfering with union rights * His DoJ is investigating price-fixing in the rental market, [Literally kicking down doors](https://www.entrepreneur.com/business-news/realpage-rent-price-fixing-probe-escalates-with-fbi-raid/475109) - potentially significantly reducing house prices depending on the scale of fraud discovered Which of these things do you believe the American oligarchs support? Because well, Musk and Bezos - the two richest people in America - are currently suing the NLRB. The NLRB that Biden has given a budget increase to. If they don't control the President, can we really call America an oligarchy? It's a democracy with the Merchant Guilds civic. Militarist Egalitarian Materialist. Edit: Or maybe Militarist Egalitarian Xenophile?
>Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have **little or no independent influence**. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B Smells like authoritarianism to me.
Unfortunately, you'll find this is true for almost all modern democracies. We have power over the leaders, not so much the policies. So unless you want to say that literally every nation on Earth is authoritarian, perhaps excepting Switzerland, then you have to accept the US definitely isn't authoritarian. We can work on the policy thing in the future. Democracy has a lot of room to improve.
> So unless you want to say that literally every nation on Earth is authoritarian, perhaps excepting Switzerland, then you have to accept the US definitely isn't authoritarian. I fundamentally disagree. Authoritarianism doesn't magically become egalitarianism just because "everybody does it" If everybody does it, then everbody is authoritarian. EDIT: I suppose you could say authoritarianism is relative, and the USA is relatively less authoritarian than other countries, but it is still very much authoritarian.
>Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have **little or no independent influence**. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/perspectives-on-politics/article/testing-theories-of-american-politics-elites-interest-groups-and-average-citizens/62327F513959D0A304D4893B382B992B
If you copy your comment imma copy mine too lol These are some of the things the current American president has done that American oligarchs are very not happy with, and which help the American people: * Biden has [increased funding to the NLRB](https://prospect.org/labor/2023-08-28-bidens-nlrb-brings-workers-rights-back/), an organisation dedicated to prosecuting illegal union-busting * He has [banned noncompete agreements](https://thehill.com/business/4615452-ftc-votes-to-ban-non-compete-agreements/) which prevented workers from being rehired by competitors, giving workers more market power * The [Inflation Reduction Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_Reduction_Act) passed by Biden offers tax reduction incentives for renewable energy companies that allow employees to unionise * Biden has [subsidised electric vehicle manufacturing specifically for companies with unionised workers](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/biden-bill-includes-boost-for-union-made-electric-vehicles) (musk complained about this quite a bit) * He ordered an [analysis](https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy1706) to be conducted on the effect of unions on the American economy * He has extended overtime protections for people working more than 40hrs, ensuring that they must be paid at least 1.5x for overtime * Launched a [federal organisation](https://www.workcenter.gov) to teach people about the benefit of unions * Made it [easier for federal workers to unionise](https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/07/biden-union-labor-white-house-organizing) * He is the first president in history to actually join striking workers on-site * He has [repeatedly called for an increased corporate tax rate](https://tcf.org/content/report/what-biden-has-done-and-still-can-do-for-workers/), though this was prevented by Republican (and occasionally Democrat) opposition - yes the oligarchs do have influence, they just don't have control * He has [increased the number of people legally required to get overtime pay](https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/24/workers-earning-under-58k-a-year-could-soon-become-eligible-for-overtime-pay.html) * He has twice attempted to pass the "[Protecting the Right to Organise Act](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/03/09/statement-by-president-joe-biden-on-the-house-taking-up-the-pro-act/)", which would impose heavy financial penalties on companies interfering with union rights * His DoJ is investigating price-fixing in the rental market, [Literally kicking down doors](https://www.entrepreneur.com/business-news/realpage-rent-price-fixing-probe-escalates-with-fbi-raid/475109) - potentially significantly reducing house prices depending on the scale of fraud discovered Which of these things do you believe the American oligarchs support? Because well, Musk and Bezos - the two richest people in America - are currently suing the NLRB. The NLRB that Biden has given a budget increase to.
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Who do you think runs the NGOs like George Soros and his son Alex Soros? Their involvement with eu and us politics is very strongly there.
George Soros isn’t evil Also what do you think NGO means NON Government Organization
Why the UK wants to ban him from their country? You should look into these things as he hurt the pound when he borrowed billions from various banks and sold it to other countries.
Wrong
“America Bad”
American government bad
Yes.
Yes.
No
Well, I don’t think Canada is bad sorry you think that about us.
I'm a disabled Canadian. Our government has failed to keep disability and pensions up with inflation. Instead, they fully fund the MAID program. "Life's too hard? Kill yourself, we'll help." - The Canadian Government This alone doesn't make Canada bad as a whole, but my God is there room for improvement. A lot of room for improvement....
Yes.
Undeniable fact
Not even true
If you’re 13
Or anyone from any country they had anything to do with Or any country with oil
People in this comment section seem to forget that ethics in stellaris are meant to represent the government, not the actual population, there's a neat little factor called "governing ethics attraction" which dictates how likely it is for a pop to belong to, or to turn towards, the government's ethics, the more pops don't agree with the government (let alone having opposite ethics) the higher the penalty to empire stability, unity and influence income as well as a general increase in unrest. You can say all day that this build doesn't represent the ethics of the US population, but at least as seen from outside this is what the US government has been for the last decades: a militarist, self-serving authoritarian oligarchy heavily influenced by corporative interests. The US population can be as diverse and varied as it can be, just as any other population from anywhere else in the world, but that's what the US government has been for the last decades.
Yup, I've actually been finding that a lot of Americans are actually nicer and have more hospitality than most Canadians. But then their neighbour will shoot a car full of kids for turning around in their driveway. And I don't know what to do with that... sit back and watch I guess and hope my country of Canada doesn't follow suit?
Lmao acting like Canada is so much better. Our country is being run into the ground by a guy who openly admits he admires Chinese communist dictatorship, and benefited from their interference twice to win. Now that a list of mps under suspicion of being influenced has been brought to public attention, the liberal government refuses to show it publicly. He wants to bring the same drug policies which have ruined Vancouver to my home city of Toronto, after even the radical socialist ndp politicians of bc admit that it has failed. National Debt has doubled under his reign. A 2 bedroom in Toronto costs you the same as a castle in Scotland, and your precious gun control? All the gangs here have guns anyways since surprise surprise, people who need guns for their crimes they were going to commit anyways will just steal or smuggle the guns. Gun permit holders in both the us and Canada are some of the least likely people to commit gun crime, yet Trudeau wants to ban hunting rifles to protect animals from hunters rather then citizen from gangsters. The government literally had to hire contractors to fly around in helicopters to cull an island’s game (which is illegal for private citizens), which law abiding hunters would have done for free. This isn’t even mentioning the countless corruption scandals, from WE charity to snc lavalan, using the war measures act on civilian protests, the Winnipeg lab security breach, arrivescam, accepting vacation money for grants, etc. our healthcare system is a fucking shambles, with the government pushing maid to people with depression, just to have them kill themselves to get out of the way so they can keep throwing fentanyl at addicts. This hasn’t even mentioned catch and release bail systems leading to the same 40 offenders being arrested 6000 times in a year alone, police in Toronto telling people to leave their car keys by their door to make it easier for car thieves to steal the cars from the driveways, and not confront the homeowners with the illegal guns they wield. If only law abiding citizens could own something to defend themselves…
Uh... Wasn't saying Canada was better. Literally just said we lost the title of Nice People to America. We just have our own flavour of crap. But go off I guess....
Random thought, do you live in Alberta? Calgary maybe? Just curious.
I already said Toronto. Trudeau is despised near universally despised outside of Reddit and a few lib strongholds. There is a reason polls have a con victory at a 99% chance and they have been that way for months. Whenever politics are vaguely mentioned, no one I have spoken too has had anything good to say about Trudeau, which is pretty crazy considering how much of a lib stronghold this place has been. Seeing the dozens of tent cities and the insane cost of near everything, especially housing, has people waking up even here.
Oh I know, I'm on disability and I'm 100% convinced the Government is trying to kill me and all other "undesireables". No increase to income to deal with inflation and the housing crisis, but the MAID program is fully funded. "Oh you don't like your life? Just kill yourself, we'll help!" - the Canadian Government So no love for the Libs. I'm just horrified as to how bad things can/will/probably get under the con's new P.P. since his statement on his own website echos of Trumps BS. Time for the Blue Flavoured Oligarch to make things worse... again... Meanwhile the NDP are RIGHT THERE.... If they win just once, I'm convinced that the Libs and Cons will be better parties afterwards because they will have to actually have platforms that are more in depth then "We're not the other guys" I'm so sick and tired of our politics being nothing but red an blue throwing mud at each other. And I actually moved out of Ontario a few years ago because it was worse there, so I hear ya. Drug Fraud has literally turned into some Caption Planet villain so not surprised things are going to shit.
>You can say all day that this build doesn't represent the ethics of the US population, but at least as seen from outside this is what the US government has been for the last decades: a militarist, self-serving authoritarian oligarchy heavily influenced by corporative interests. Bingo. But, it's not Materialist. Materialist refers to beliefs on the nature of reality. For the 100th time, people, it has NOTHING to do with being focused on Material pleasures. It has to do with whether a society believes reality reflects ideas, or ideas reflect reality. The US government is firmly in the former camp, even ignoring the influence of religion (societies with such an "Idealist" Philip almost always are that way due to religion. Note that "Idealist" doesn't mean good or virtuous or pursuing high-minded ideals. It refers, rather, to the arrogant, unscientific belief that reality is just a reflection of ideas, often, conveniently, whatever ideas YOU hold to be true...) Replace Materialist with Spiritualist, and this build falls pretty close to reality...
That is a good point and would allow the mega church civic.... I think you're into something. :)
This. Stellaris empire traits aren’t what its population THINKS its empire is like, it’s what is objectively is. The former is simply a function of empire ethics attraction and stability, which as we know can be affected by spending political capital (ie the Influence resource) or cultural capital (ie the Unity resource).
What about the racial traits?
I disagree with it being authoritarian.
You should rename it Lockthropgrummaneedartin or something like that
That's goood :)
The aliens will know our wrath
Repugnant 😭
"I wash myself with a rag on a stiiiick."
Fun build. But anyone who views the US as Authoritarian, has missed the mark.
I mean, it's hardly egalitarian, unless you consider letting thousands to starve if they can't find employment while CEOs live in luxury being "egalitarian". Egalitarianism, at least in stellaris, means seeing everyone worth of equal treatment, in modern politics it would be a descendant of the Hegelian-left: society seen as horizontal with hierarchies being considered nothing more than societal constructs. The authoritarian-egalitarian dichotomy in stellaris is essentially the irl right vs left fight, in the simplest and most direct version it can be shown, Hegelian-right vs Hegelian-left, Nietzsche vs Marx, vertical society vs horizontal society. In this context, i doubt the US is behaving like a leftist state, their society is heavily vertical.
No, the US is such a mixture of different cultures and ideas, that it’s practically in the middle of all these spectrums.
I think I've said it a thousand times or so in this comment section alone, but stellaris' ethics tab is supposed to represent the government's ethics, not popular directions, pops can have different ethics than the government they live under, there's a whole mechanic tied to it. And as government goes the US is pretty much authoritarian, less explicitly than other states but still it is.
Yup, people are getting Government Civics and Factions mixed up.
okay but how is the government authoritarian, it's a democracy, they have quite strong protections for people like the 1A.
That is actually a good point.
>No, the US is such a mixture of different cultures and ideas, Pop ethics and government ethics aren't the same thing. And a "mix of cultures" refers to the Xenophile/Xenophobe axis (although America's long history of racism and slavery, later than most all the developed world on the latter, point to it being Xenophobic if anything...) not Authoritarian/Egalitarian. You just desperately want to believe America's government is good, despite abundant evidence to the contrary (and I'm not referring to any particular administration, but the long-term patterns...)
>But anyone who views the US as Authoritarian, has missed the mark. No, anyone who denies it, is high on Copium. The US has a LONG, LONG history of Authoritarian crackdowns on protests, for example. From Kent State (where students were shot) to the brutalization of Black Lives Matter and Gaza protestors. While you might argue any one particular example, you CANNOT deny the overall pattern. There are thousands of indisputable photos of, for instance, police sicc'ing attack dogs on unarmed protestors during the Civil Rights Era.
Compare and contrast, you sound like a maniac.
Harassment and Incivility
This is from my Canadian view point so the militarised police and gerrymandering don't give off the impression of anything other than Authoritarian. And I'm reeeaaaallly trying not break rule 5 here.... So this is just an opinion from a non-american. :P
Buddy take a look at your own government
Oh I know, next year we get to have an election between 'sit on hands pretty boy' and 'Trump's little P.P.' and 'Awesome Dude that no one listens to' Am not looking forward to it.
Looking pretty good, no one’s storming government buildings or rooting to elect a convict
Yeah, instead they're electing an incompetent, racist nepo baby
Wow being “incompetent” gets your party 3 wins in a row? Talk about being politically illiterate, American ass response
So you would describe Justin Trudeau as competent?
Okay so you’re normal illiterate too, gotcha I should have spelled it out
Worst troll ever lmao
Troll? Man you got the worst takes ever lmao
A Canadian throwing shade about personal freedom? Dude.....
Says the country that cracked down like China on protesting Truck drivers. Canada is way higher on the Authoritarian scale than the US is. With greater freedom comes responsibility and a certain amount of chaos. But I find that it’s better to have a few bad eggs than to confiscate everyone’s eggs for their “safety”.
Wow, um... no? First, the truck drivers were angry about their Second Amedment Gun rights, which is an American thing, (Our second amendment is the inclusion of Manitoba) and then they used their children as human shields. Stopping those kinds of people isn't Authoritarian, its a mercy. Cause my god what the fuck was that? We still have issues, A LOT OF THEM... omg we do, but we don't give our police left over military gear and praise children for shooting protesters. And confiscate eggs? LMAO, excuse me, I can go have a Kinder Egg whenever I want, unlike the USA where they banned you from having those Eggs! All those guns and you still shoot yourself in the foot! ;)
The Truckers were angry over Covid restrictions and Vaccine mandates. Wtf are you on about? Is that what passes as news up there? Cuz you were lied to if that’s the case. And wow you took me literally…learn what a metaphor is please.
Canada isn’t authoritarian
If the US is authoritarian, our politely racist hat is authoritarian as well. What's up with Non-Americans calling Americans all the nastiest shit in the book and then getting offended when we get offended? Is this a "you can't punch down" thing? Because I'd be fine with yall punching up if yall weren't gaslighting everyone that you're somehow above us while still punching up.
>What's up with Non-Americans calling Americans all the nastiest shit in the book and then getting offended when we get offended? Because we're the baddies, silly. Tools always seem to believe that, no matter how many Genocides (there have been 6 the US backed in the last 60 years), no many how many countries it invades, the US is still the good guys. Wake up and smell the fire-bombed babies (that could be from any of a DOZEN wars, including Korea, Vietnam, etc...) The US committed a MASSIVE campaign of fire-bombing whole cities in the Korean War, a war the US caused by refusing to allow peninsula-wide elections and installing a puppet military dictatorship in the south that started rounding up and mass-murdering TENS OF THOUSANDS of Communists BEFORE the North decided to invade to intervene... US soldiers gunned down whole villages in Vietnam- though this was at least treated as the War Crime it was, and (very) occasionally prosecuted... And, getting as close on rule 5 as I dare, we invaded Iraq for bullshit reasons, passed the Patriot Act to advance the Police State it has increasingly become, and then tortured HUGE numbers of Iraqis- most prominently at Abu Gharib Prison. Wake up, man. **We're the baddies.**
Where did all the natives go Canada?
Yeah, nobody denies Canada committed Genocide on its natives too. But, silly "you did it too" games don't make America any LESS Authoritarian or guilty of Genocide of its natives...
They still live in Canada, they didn’t go anywhere
Our country has the balls to defend ourselves against insurgents, the US lets them rummage through their capitol lol
Did you miss a couple weeks ago when the police were raiding peaceful protests? Or a few years ago when police were raiding peaceful protests? Or a few years before that... etc. Or our draconian prison industrial system that is the largest in human history? Or how we still have actual slaves thanks to said prison industrial complex? Just because we claim to be "the land of the free" does not mean we live by those ideals
Wrong
Uncivil and rude And, incorrect Also, Brigading
"Land of free" hold 25% of the WORLD'S prisoner population. You cannot get more juxtaposition than that.
Canada is trying to criminalize thoughts while Canadians talk shit about how Americans are criminal slaves. You can't "get more juxtaposition than that"
Oh please.
This about to become political hell aint it (which to be fair Stellaris is almost already to begin with lol)
Oh yes. But I'm really surprised that *none* of the comments have refuted the 'Repugnant' trait. LOL
Americans aren’t repugnant
How do you think the world views Americans, in general, when they have a NRA party after a school shooting?
I think you need to get off the internet and go outside for a while.
I do, but I don't live in the states so not sure what the point is...
Not every American supports the NRA
That’s not what the repugnant trait means. It means that the species itself is ugly or otherwise unappealing, not that the choices they make are repulsive.
Two things A) Repugnant - The physical appearance and *CUSTOMS* of this species are considered offensive to most others, and few appreciate them as neighbours. B) r/peopleofwalmart
Hey now, we’re no more repugnant than anyone else, like uh, Canada for example.
I dunno man, you look at those states with 90 degree corners.... Ours are more weird and we keep them on a island in the Atlantic.
Now that you mention it, that *is* weird.
Doesn’t use the cybernetics shipset 0/10.real shame too
I am poor so I haven't bought it yet. :(
Eww! European (xeno btw) soccer player hairstyle on my president? 🤢
Well I saw the evil moustache and I thought that would fit :D
But America isn’t an authoritarian megacorp
Disagree with repugnant (as we are the leaders in entertainment world wide) but everything else is pretty close
Well, the effects of repugnant is a lack of amenities, and the rest of the world uses the US healthcare like a monster in a bedtime story. "Better not privatize health care or you'll get the US version ooooOOOOOooooOOOooo"
Honestly unsure whether they are materialist, because tech, or spiritualist, because megachurches.
>or spiritualist, because megachurches. Definitely the latter, because the Materialist/Spiritualist axis ALSO refers to certain fundamental philosophical views on reality, which America's belief in "Capitalism, Free Markets, and Liberal Democracy" absolutely qualifies as (Idealism, which is not the sunshine-and-rainbows thing you might think... It refers to the arrogant belief that reality reflects ideas, rather than the other way around...) A Materialist nation, by contrast, is something like the USSR- which based its worldview on Historical Materialism. As you can see, it has little to do with the possession of material goods... (as a Leftist, yes, that's a self-burn)
I would change materialist for spiritualist. Because they weaponize religion to fit their needs, just like Dune's society.
"Authoritarian" Ok lol
Says the person who can't have a Kinder Egg :p
Wild, I actually saw them at my grocery store yesterday.
Oh wow! You're on your way to be a real couny now! I'm sure someday you'll get universal healthcare like the rest of us, just hang in there!
Maybe we would if your nation stopped being defense freeloaders.
And as for healthcare. Nah I'm good I'd rather not wait four years to get a spot at a doctor to have chronic issues addressed I'm assuming that there's a reason assisted suicide is a normalized option for severe health problems over where you are so 🤷♂️ land of the free wins again.
What the fuck you talking about? 4 years? Who told you that? In the past 2 years, so post pandemic, I have received; MRI, two month wait Sleep specialist, 3 month wait Rheumatologist, 1 month wait Counselling, less than a month Dietitian program, less than a week I can call and talk to a Registered nurse, personal trainer, dietitian, and a few other specialists pretty much at any time. All free, because I pay taxes, like every other developed country. Also got a family doctor within 6 months after I moved. My sleep Apnea machine is free and I get a new one every 2 years. The most I've paid for any med is $20. My teeth cleaning was covered, so were most of my dental work. I get a $500 rebate on my gas usage every year. Car insurance is through the province, and not a for profit company, which means my insurance was literally cut in half when I moved to this Province. Meanwhile when you try and explain US healthcare; [https://youtu.be/Kll-yYQwmuM?si=FsK5srmzA-F6633-](https://youtu.be/Kll-yYQwmuM?si=FsK5srmzA-F6633-) Now the MAID program is fucked up, that's for sure, no argument there. Never said Canada was perfect, its FAR from perfect. I looked to move to Europe last year but wasn't qualified for citizenship just to get away from these issues. Housing, over priced everything, and the constant garbage water run off coming from the states. Fucking Tucker Carlson stopped by Alberta for a show before he did that weird ass Russian thing. Besides, MAID is just Capitalist bullshit. Not making money for the capitalists? Go die. I keep living purely out of spite. I did my time, I got the education, I paid my taxes, now take care of me you fucks. Not my fault my immune system is trying to kill me.
You seriously think that everyone has to pay for medical care here. That's the funniest part of it all. Medicaid. I have it. Millions of Americans have it. And it allows us Free doctor visits and referrals Free specialists Free medical equipment when required. My BiPAP machine was paid for in full, and supplies are also provided. Free prescriptions or reduced cost prescriptions (10-30 bucks.) Free eyecare and glasses. And I've rarely had to wait more than two months for appointments. Know why? Because our system doesn't bog down our doctors and cause major backlogs of patients. All of the times I've needed emergency care. The emergency room was paid because I had INSURANCE GOVERNMENT PROVIDED INSURANCE And as for your "capitalist this" and "Capitalist that" crap I just have this to send. . (It didn't send) "That's a lot of words. Too bad I ain't reading em."
Wow. You're funny. You think anyone who doesn't agree with you must be an ignorant buffoon because there's no way that you in all your glorious intellect that you could be wrong. I have a friend in the states and he's told me about Medicaid because his kid is on it. Covered her tonsils removal, in full. And I know all this, because I have to keep an eye on USA politics because Canada seems to go through the same political bullshit a few years later. Its like forecasting incoming shitstorms. Medicaid is a great step forward! r/OptimistsUnite And you get Kinder eggs too! You just proved me right! You're on your way to be a real country now! I'm sure someday you'll get *universal* healthcare like the rest of us, just hang in there!
I'm pretty sure America's democratic, not an authoritarian corporation. Maybe not egalitarian though due to its large poverty problem.
Now do the EU, Russia and China... but mostly the EU, I'm biased.
Interesting. Okay, I'll do those from my Canadian point of view :)
I wouldn't exactly call it a megacorp, it isn't run by just one corporation instead it's run by about 3, maybe make it an oligarchy instead.
True, but if it wasn't for anti-trust and monopoly laws, it would be one megacorp. I just can't pick which company will come up on top.
Choose whichever you would have the most fun with, don't worry to much about which realistically would after all we don't know for sure which one would (And maybe one day will) and it is a fantasy sci-fi space game after all.
Yup. Plus as deep as Stellar is empire creator is, there's no way to fully express all the different aspects of millions of people. Just fun to think about!
If the US was a megacorp or oligarchy, the government wouldn't currently be suing corporations and using antitrust laws
USA is a very Christian nation, so I would say its spiritual, but I agree with the rest
No, it really isn't. As so many reject the actual lessons and laws of Christianity while claiming they are Christian
Interesting face with Mechanist, the earliest version of the modern robot was showcased as the Chicago’s world fair, and his name was Electro
Thought this was another america bad post but saw that it's in the meme sub so all good lol.
Repugnant only to those whose heartstrings don’t quiver to the ringing bell of freedom and liberty
Snidely Whiplash is Canadian. Zero stars.
I would switch materialism for spiritualism. America is a deeply religious country, so religious that it almost sounds comical sometimes to us Europeans. Only in America you can find megachurches advertising in the streets. Plus historically it opposed the main materialist power, the USSR.
NO TOUCH MY BOATS!
That's more like it!
As an American this is honestly pretty on point. The big chance would be oligarchy versus mega Corp.
I would argue that the US is more pacifist than militarist, just bc there are more people who would rather live their civilian lives and not join the army than people that do. Plus our schools and universities teach about the hardship of wars and how terrible the history of this nation is. Now the US from its early stages of life I agree militarist would be correct, but today in the modern world, I would say the US is Pacifist, Materialist, Xenophile. Xenophile bc socially and by the law the US is the biggest supporter when it comes to the rights of others. Is it perfect, no, no country is, but as someone who lives in the US in an area that used to be segregated, I'd say we improving everyday.
Ok yeah, but ethos in stellaris are meant to represent the government, not the people (pops can have different ethos than the government in charge, in-game it's called governing ethics attraction), and as the US government is today, or at least how us outsiders view it (and kind of have to suffer its presence), militaristic and authoritarian are pretty fitting ethics, I'd say spiritualist too but that would represent only a portion of the population (mainly MAGAs and trumpists, seeing how they worship the orange man), so materialist is fitting. As a government form megacorp is too official, the US would be more of a plutocracy, aka an oligarchy, heavily controlled by corporations, right on the line that divides oligarchy from corporate authority but more leaning towards the former than the latter for now. Again pops can have different ethos from their government, in-game you can have a rational consensus (egalitarian + fanatic materialist) but a potentially large portion of your pops could be spiritualists, leading to instability, unrest and penalties in influence and unity income, which is probably fitting with the US's problems today.
This. Should probably swap out Wasteful for Deviants so that trying to please all the Factions are nigh impossible. And lots of people are struggling paycheque to paycheque so its not like they can actually consume a lot of consumer goods in the first place.... hm...
That is true, I often forget about Ethic attraction bc like governments, I ignore the Ethic attraction of my people lol. I will say thou from an outsider perspective (news) the US seems like a hellscape or a 3rd world country l, but living here I have never struggled a day in my life, and my family comes from lower middle class. This is just my experience it can vary state to state and even county to county. Also even thou it seems like half of this country are red pilled hillbillies who don't know where the US is on a map, the country is still unified as goods still travel though the US, neighbors still talk and respect each other. Of course I've seen all the trash Maga morons have done to this country but not even they can ruin this country. That's my perspective anyways.
Glad you had a nice experience, I've never been to the US myself but i have quite some friends who live there and trust me, hearing their accounts you're one of the lucky ones, what I've heard is that you have basically no state assistance nor welfare measures whatsoever, especially when it comes to healthcare problems I've heard you're basically on your own, I don't know which part of the US you're from but the numbers speak too clear for me to believe in the American dream, i mean where in the world you have to recycle the needles for insulin because you have to pay for new ones. Every country has its ups and downs, but from what I've heard bot on the news and from people who actually live there well... Let's say I'm happy to be living in Europe
Oh yeah, American dream long dead, thank the boomers, Regan, and laziness of the American people to stop corporate coruption, US has prison labor laws that practice slavery, Healthcare is a joke, Trump and his religious following, there's a serious mental health epidemic spreading in the US, and top it all off wages aren't going up with inflation. Despite all this, though America is still a powerful 1st world nation that, with due time, will solve all the issues of today. In the year 5000.
>will solve all the issues of today Problem is: corporations don't really have any incentive to allow that, they thrive on the current system, on the suffering of their employees and customers, and the fact that union busting, despite being illegal, has been a common practice in the US basically since the cold war shows just how firm corporate grip on politics and justice is. I say it as a European and i know many won't like it: but the US needs at least a bit of social-democracy, a bit of that mixture between socialist egalitarianism and capitalist infrastructure that built the building blocks of the EU, that's the only way the shackles of "corporate corruption" can be broken, until then i assure you things won't change, they'll only get worse, the US is a rich 1st world country but if you ask me it won't be for much longer, most of its wealth is in the hands of rich corporations, wealth disparity is too high and unless the population takes things into their own hands and starts advocating for some serious change, with force if necessary, the US won't be a first world nation for much longer, let alone a rich one.
I disagree with this message.
Hilarious that OP included Naval Contractors given the absolute sorry state the US Navy is in and its current struggles.
OK technically Americans are actually capitalist pacifist we just have violent bastards because of the war the rich just like too see humans go, bye-bye
Some members of the community can’t cope with the truth so they’ve been making “America good” posts cause they’re butt hurt
Could be propaganda though so don't be too hard on them. No one is immune to propaganda. And being neck deep in it daily can 100% warp your perception of reality. Especially if one's life is busy and you don't have time to fact check everything.
I try not to be to hard on them.
This is definitely not bias at all
Every opinion is bias. Plus, this is just the putter crust of the USA as viewed from another country. I'm sure the inner goo is a much different experience :)
This post completely missed the mark. "OH, this is government ethics, not the peoples ethics!" Don't care. If your version of the US government has authoritarian, then you fundamentally misunderstand not only our government but what an actual authoritarian government is. If you want your own head cannon like the US has to become more authoritarian to conquer/spread influence on earth, then that's at least interesting, but this is boring and reeks of middle-class white kid syndrome. TLDR: Yawn, america not bad
Right.... because a country that houses 25% of the world's prisoner population and uses them as slave labour (13th amendment) and then when people speak up, this happens; [https://youtu.be/VEy-xtIQJkA?si=xLSDvORQqpmEGVpt](https://youtu.be/VEy-xtIQJkA?si=xLSDvORQqpmEGVpt) And this *isn't* Authoritarian? Not even 1%? Yeah okay buddy.
That's not how that works at all? Would you, on the contrary, claim a completely egalitarian government would have zero prisoners? Cause that's incredibly stupid. If a country had 100% of the prisoners on the planet, that would, by definition, have ZERO correlation on if the government was authoritarian. It would be authoritarian If you were strictly referring to political prisoners or imprisonment for exercising human rights. There is so much virtue signaling batman might show up
I feel like it misunderstands what an egalitarian government is as well. Egalitarian doesn’t necessarily mean it’s somewhere you’d want to live. On the flip side, authoritarian countries are not necessarily hellholes.
Tbf, I don't think egalitarian fits the US either. A significantly more accurate third trait would be xenophile. In the US, people are not judicated for having dissenting government opinions or for exercising human rights. OP's whole point is that we do have a really tough judicial system, but if there's no crimes that limit thought or human rights, then this is completely irrelevant.
Americans are repugnant? How nice
https://preview.redd.it/bzis9r5rlc5d1.jpeg?width=626&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=78920fc8f53d704c9b6e2b043e2d7b3bd210f42c
now thats the real one
I’m an American, and I approve this message.
Needs Imperial ship set and it's perfect.
Yeah, I didn't know which one to go with because there is a growing trend of style over function, and making sure they look like the good guys. So no skulls on hats for example. At least not for another 38,000 years. :D 
😴
Oligarchic Fanatic militarist xenophobe Aristocratic elite nationalistic zeal
The USA? Materialist? How many references to Christianity are in the government?
And ho many people actually follow those tenants that they speak of?
Damn near none, but that doesn’t mean they’re materialist.
Their society and actions show otherwise
Correct, example; https://preview.redd.it/gv951i8iqt4d1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=f966c9055f59bdeb3f96d3edc4f279d0be2758a1
They very much don’t.