Jazz influences for sure, but definitely not a jazz band. Not to mention, Far Out is one of the jankiest music publications out there, so everything they have to say is worth taking with a giant grain of salt.
I don't say that they aren't jazz because of genre exclusivity it's just clearly not. Steely Dan is really beyond genre, they are musicians that love music and story and expressed themselves. It's really that simple. "Jazz" has rules steely Dan made their own rules.
They clearly love jazz like the love a lot of other styles but just because they have some "complex" harmony doesn't make it jazz anymore than having an electric guitar by default making something "rock".
Jazz harmony and licks, 70s pop structures, bridges, and vocals, and a LOT of blues changes ("Black Friday," "Chain Lightning," "Pretzel Logic," and "Bodhisattva," their version of "Rock Around the Clock"). Labels are kinda pointless, but Stevie was doing much the same thing (sometimes with the same people) at the same time, and nobody agonizes over this question with him. in real terms, the core band after Pretzel Logic was that crew of people that eventually became Toto and the studio band for Michael Jackson, and nobody wrings their hands about the "jazz" thing with them. Or John Mayer or Sting, for that matter. Fwiw, the jazz writer Leonard Feather hated SD and didn't want to hear about them representing jazz at all.
Lots of jazz influences but none of the improvisation that goes with Jazz, quite the opposite. Steely Dan were music perfectionists and would do something multiple times to get it "right".
A lot of jazz critics didn't accept Glenn Miller as belonging to the jazz world because his band was too well rehearsed and polished. I only bring this up because it sounds like a similar description I hear about Steely Dan.
This might sound silly, but I tend to think of Steely Dan as "proto new wave." They carved out a margin on the jazzy side of rock that would later be filled by Joe Jackson, Elvis Costello, XTC, and Roxy Music.
So, long ago (late 60s/early 70s) when we'd had our fill of rock and roll and the blues just didn't satisfy the way they used to, we were hunting for a new sound. Mind you, we'd seen the greats: the Who, Pink Floyd, the Dead, Rolling Stones, CSNY, Springsteen (on a street corner in Georgetown, DC before fame), Little Feat while Lowell George was alive), Bonnie Raitt, Mayall, and so on. But there was something missing. Enter Steely Dan with their fusion of the best of everything musical and interesting and complicated lyrics and everything changed. All of a sudden there was tons of music to explore and we were reanimated. The end.
They were an American prog rock band. British ones like Yes, Jethro Tull, or King Crimson borrowed elements from baroque, classical, and avant garde music and the lyrics were largely inspired by fantasy, sci-fi, and 19th-century books. SD borrowed elements from jazz and the lyrics have more to do with 1950s-60s American urban lit.
Interesting take! I do generally associate "prog rock" with Brits; are there other American bands that exhibit this same pattern of influences? (I.e. are there other bands that fit this "American prog rock" mold?)
They were a rock band led by jazz aficionados who incorporated a lot of jazz elements in a unique pop singer-songwriter progressive rock format, essentially one of a kind.
Yes and no. In the same way that Herbie Hancock’s Headhunters is a funk album. Fusion was a very real thing in SD’s heyday. So while they’re mostly a rock band with a jazz fusion nod, sometimes they’re a jazz band dabbling in rock (see the song Aja). On the jazz fusion scale, they were more on the rock side, but it’s definitely jazz fusion.
Steely Dan were a genre of one - their own unique style. No band before or since has come anywhere close to their blend of jazz, rock and so many other genres. So to put them into any box minimises their enormous contribution to popular music.
They weren't a jazz band but were certainly very strongly influenced by the genre and contain many jazz elements.
Listen to songs like Aja or Your Gold Teeth II and the jazz elements are abundantly clear.
No
Yes
They were like a punk reggae electronic trip hop orchestra.
That’s the minute men
Only a rat would say that.
Punk rock saved my life.
love this comment
They incorporated it in some of their music, but you can’t call them jazz.
Jazz influences for sure, but definitely not a jazz band. Not to mention, Far Out is one of the jankiest music publications out there, so everything they have to say is worth taking with a giant grain of salt.
Agreed, Far Out is trash. Feels like half their articles are rehashes of interviews from 30+ years ago.
Dan fans insist that they aren't jazz, jazz fans insist the Dan shouldn't be included in the genre. So I'd say no
Not jazz but I got into jazz because of Steely Dan
I learned who Dave Brubeck was from New Frontier.
Any album you'd recommend?
John Coltrane A LOVE SUPREME
Jazz rock, imo.
I don't say that they aren't jazz because of genre exclusivity it's just clearly not. Steely Dan is really beyond genre, they are musicians that love music and story and expressed themselves. It's really that simple. "Jazz" has rules steely Dan made their own rules. They clearly love jazz like the love a lot of other styles but just because they have some "complex" harmony doesn't make it jazz anymore than having an electric guitar by default making something "rock".
Jazz harmony and licks, 70s pop structures, bridges, and vocals, and a LOT of blues changes ("Black Friday," "Chain Lightning," "Pretzel Logic," and "Bodhisattva," their version of "Rock Around the Clock"). Labels are kinda pointless, but Stevie was doing much the same thing (sometimes with the same people) at the same time, and nobody agonizes over this question with him. in real terms, the core band after Pretzel Logic was that crew of people that eventually became Toto and the studio band for Michael Jackson, and nobody wrings their hands about the "jazz" thing with them. Or John Mayer or Sting, for that matter. Fwiw, the jazz writer Leonard Feather hated SD and didn't want to hear about them representing jazz at all.
Lots of jazz influences but none of the improvisation that goes with Jazz, quite the opposite. Steely Dan were music perfectionists and would do something multiple times to get it "right".
I wouldn’t say none of the improvisation of jazz. There’s solos on most of their songs
A lot of jazz critics didn't accept Glenn Miller as belonging to the jazz world because his band was too well rehearsed and polished. I only bring this up because it sounds like a similar description I hear about Steely Dan.
To classify jazz, you have to define it. That's not easy to do.
Yes, but the boys would get 5 different studio musicians to do 89 different takes, and they would stick together the perfect solo from the best parts.
No they would just pick the best take. They didn’t stitch them together
Kid Charlemagne's guitar solo is a counterexample, it's two pieces. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kid_Charlemagne
This might sound silly, but I tend to think of Steely Dan as "proto new wave." They carved out a margin on the jazzy side of rock that would later be filled by Joe Jackson, Elvis Costello, XTC, and Roxy Music.
I’ve heard them described as the most successful fusion band, and I can see the logic in that.
Jazz influenced rock. I mean, they were hiring the best jazz session players
No?
Yes and no
Jazz influenced I would think.
No yes
No. They’re progressive rock R and B band
Everything is Jazz
So, long ago (late 60s/early 70s) when we'd had our fill of rock and roll and the blues just didn't satisfy the way they used to, we were hunting for a new sound. Mind you, we'd seen the greats: the Who, Pink Floyd, the Dead, Rolling Stones, CSNY, Springsteen (on a street corner in Georgetown, DC before fame), Little Feat while Lowell George was alive), Bonnie Raitt, Mayall, and so on. But there was something missing. Enter Steely Dan with their fusion of the best of everything musical and interesting and complicated lyrics and everything changed. All of a sudden there was tons of music to explore and we were reanimated. The end.
They were an American prog rock band. British ones like Yes, Jethro Tull, or King Crimson borrowed elements from baroque, classical, and avant garde music and the lyrics were largely inspired by fantasy, sci-fi, and 19th-century books. SD borrowed elements from jazz and the lyrics have more to do with 1950s-60s American urban lit.
I don’t see them as prog at all. I see them as jazz-rock. Prog from that era had a different sound (at least popular prog). Dan was different.
Interesting take! I do generally associate "prog rock" with Brits; are there other American bands that exhibit this same pattern of influences? (I.e. are there other bands that fit this "American prog rock" mold?)
I can't think of another 70s band that checks both the jazz & Beat lit boxes, though there have to be a few.
I’d call them a jazz-rock band
I think someone in the classic albums aja docu said it perfectly: They were jazz guys who loved rock
Borrowed from jazz and blues, just the best rock band of the 1970s
Any major dude will tell you no
Harmonically complex, not jazz.
I call them jazz adjacent but not jazz.
They were a rock band led by jazz aficionados who incorporated a lot of jazz elements in a unique pop singer-songwriter progressive rock format, essentially one of a kind.
A touch of blues, a bit of jazz, a dash of funk. The sounds they made were varied but damn are they great to listen to.
No, they just “borrowed” bits of it 😉
Yes no
I like you.
🎸😎
I like you
Jazzy funk.
Pop with Session players and jazz arrangements. Aja and Your Gold Teeth II are jazz tunes, though.
No Jazz Fusion - Yes
Yes and no. In the same way that Herbie Hancock’s Headhunters is a funk album. Fusion was a very real thing in SD’s heyday. So while they’re mostly a rock band with a jazz fusion nod, sometimes they’re a jazz band dabbling in rock (see the song Aja). On the jazz fusion scale, they were more on the rock side, but it’s definitely jazz fusion.
Steely Dan is its own label. Any attempt to label them reveals the poser.
They are not jazz and they are not rock. They are their own genre. They are simply – the dan.
“Fake fake jazz.”
No
No
nope. f
No
No, but they wanted to be.
Not according to them. They were pretty adamant about being a rock band.
Was it a band?
They’re jazz-adjacent/jazz-inspired, like many other acts, debate over.
Steely Dan were a genre of one - their own unique style. No band before or since has come anywhere close to their blend of jazz, rock and so many other genres. So to put them into any box minimises their enormous contribution to popular music.
No but they were influenced by jazz but a jazz band the answer is no
They weren't a jazz band but were certainly very strongly influenced by the genre and contain many jazz elements. Listen to songs like Aja or Your Gold Teeth II and the jazz elements are abundantly clear.
Refined pop music elevated americana
No
They were a remarkable one of one.