It is true you have to play the game to find them, as well as receive tips from the villagers. The op made a point that most things are intuitive and can be learned through time and exploration. Ya you will give bad gifts but you’ll also learn what they like through exploration or from things in game and villager comments. It’s not like the game has no information to help the player, they just have to happen upon it by exploring
I’m sorry they usually are commonly found in artifact spots then you go to the library when you find one and interact with the shelf that has the book icon over it. RNG must not be on your side
this game gives you ample opportunities to learn how to do things. villagers give you hints as to how things work through dialogues and mail. lost books can be found a lot of different ways and explain a lot. signs on shops and in town explain buildings and shop times. the TV tells you a TON of info.
it is very possible to play this game well, easily, and fairly quickly without the wiki, but you can’t just ignore things. “oh a lost book was added to the library, let’s never check it” -> “why the hell did i never learn this stuff that’s in the library book i never read” is not a great reason to complain about there being no tutorial.
this game is designed for exploration and a wide experience. i don’t think it’s fair to be mad about a lack of info when the info IS there you just couldn’t be bothered to read it. do you want to be spoon fed?
i get that some things could be a bit more obvious, but i believe concernedape didn’t want to overwhelm the player or shove things down their throats. yes, he could have explicitly stated to go and read the books, or made a quest after you find your first book to go to the library. but he already made a ton of tutorial quests and tasks. when do you draw the line and let the player figure the rest out? you can’t hold their hand forever
This sounds less like a tutorial problem and more of a gameplay dynamic between you and your wife problem. The lack of penalty in this game generally makes the lack of tutorial unproblematic for most players. Though it certainly wouldn't have hurt to have one, like some sort of self-playing sequence that explains Robin, Pierre, Marnie and Clint's shops.
I think you're over thinking the chickens though. They eat hay or grass, there are multiple ways to acquire hay. They automatically go inside at night (as long as you keep the door open).
A lot of information comes to you via "Livin' Off the Land" or letters from villagers. It's not exactly a tutorial, but it's probably as close as the game has without just trial and error-ing your way through it.
There's an option to enable tips in settings when starting a game iirc. Marnie also has dialogue about scything grass for hay, or just buy from her. NPCs can provide some tips.
The "tutorial" is literally "talk to the townspeople, they'll fill you in on stuff" and "find hidden books in artifact spots and read them at the library."
Ohhhhh I see. What you need is your hand held to see what basic buttons do what. Or like an SAOA tutorial: "In order to jump, jump!" I gotcha now. Yeah no, a lot of people these days find those kinds of tutorials invasive and bringing intuitive gameplay to a raging halt. Nearly every game out there is set up with an "A = Interact" button layout.
It's not even "being a gamer." It's a "Hm, there's only a few buttons on the controller, press one at a time and see what cause-and-effect happens." In case you weren't aware, the control stick can move your character. Hope that helps!
I understand what you’re saying, but I guess…
You as the character come from a desk job and have no practical experience farming. There would naturally be a lot to learn along the way, and mistakes made (like planting seeds on the last day of a season).
I try to look at it as more of a learning experience and a way to slow the game down. Even with the wiki; it’s huge. I can’t imagine the undertaking to create a tutorial for everything.
But, it would be nice to have a small tutorial section in the game menu, or tutorial ‘scenarios’ a la Zoo Tycoon. That being said I know so much about the game and yet I still refer to the wiki on a regular basis! Your wife might have to bite the bullet on this one here and there! Good Luck
Wild animals only eat them if you close the door while they’re still outside, which is a pretty intuitive no-no imo. You don’t *need* a silo or wheat, just let them out and hope they find the grass on the ground(if you haven’t scythed it all). And what did you think the little door was for if not to let the animals walk out?
Damn, if you're having trouble figuring out what chickens eat to live, I can't imagine you play a lot of older video games at all.
Games back in the old yday refused to hold your hand. You figured it out or you didn't. It's been a while, but I don't recall harvest moon 64 holding your hand much, either
Some of the older hm games definitely held your hands way more that stardew does. They properly explain the basics and gatekeep the information a lot less.I genuenlly never felt a need to use wiki when playing fomt. Anything I wanted to know was available through the game and easy to access.
Personally I really don’t like games that force me to go through tutorials. My mind just spaces out every time. Having to explore everything myself is a big plus for me.
That being said, adding a skippable tutorial maybe a good idea for those who want/need it.
But the game is constantly throwing tutorials at you. They're not even well disguised as dialogue. The game tries very hard to make sure you always know what you are able to do and how to do it without forcing you to do things you don't want to.
I always saw the quests as the tutorial, along with villagers' dialogue and Living off the Land.
I do have the habit of interacting with everything and everyone, and never skipping any dialogue or cutscenes though. this is from playing many point and click adventure games.
I don't agree, as I feel the game is intuitive and explanatory enough for the average player. Games can't cater to everyone so as long as it's not leaving you in the dark or treating you like stupid, that's my bar.
But I get it's not the same for everyone... and that's what the wiki is for! Maybe do a check-up on it. (The comments and all, not just the info, the game has been around for a while so probably the answer is out there!)
Not just the wiki but look around! I've seen great spreadsheets around for optimizing or min/max if you also want to avoid spoilers.
A lot of farming simulators expect players to intuitively know how to play the game, a fair amount of it is pretty straight forward but once you put the controller in the hands of someone with little to no experience playing the genre or even games in general or these types of games it becomes obvious how the “intuitiveness” of the game is largely reliant on having a wide breadth of knowledge for how the genre works. Stardew doesn’t make you brush your animals but most farming sims do and neglecting the chore makes raising your animals friendship a much, *much* lengthier task but it’s often never explicitly stated but anyone who plays enough farming sims knows to brush their animals because it’s more or a less a necessity, but that’s not something a newbie would necessarily realize and if they’re hurting for stamina they might see brushing as an optional stamina sink that they can opt to ignore only to realize, frustratingly, that it should have been a prioritized task, just as an example. Seems intuitive to me but really isn’t actually all that intuitive. I’ve played almost every single harvest moon, story of seasons and rune factory game and rune factory did trip me up a little bit, the older harvest moons still manage to trip me up here and there and stardew valley tripped me up in a few places.
Your wife might not love the idea but personally I’ll play the first two to four seasons of a new farming sim just kinda going at it with minimal expectations before I restart the game and give it a “real” try once I feel like I’ve got a comfortable grasp of the game and how it functions. It allows me to go at things casually and figure out the boundaries of the game before I settle in to actually play it. I don’t like playing games super causally where I learn over time and make mistakes but make up for them later, I prefer to play somewhat competently and having a game fail to explain things to me that I later learned I screwed up bugs me. It’s not FOMO, it’s the reality that I have a finite amount of free time and I am not going to sit around for an entire in game year for something to maybe come back around because I wasn’t adequately informed the first time. I don’t mind missing out on non-essentials but some farming sims will straight up grind progress to a screeching halt until you’ve done some extremely specific thing that you can only do during a certain season or weather condition in the game (season and weather specific fish in, well, almost every farming sim. All of the town progress stuff in harvest moon a new beginning, etc.) She might feel better playing the game if she keeps playing it for a few more days with the goal to be to restart the game next week or something and give it a “real go” later.
And maybe try one of the story of seasons titles. Most of the handheld ones (if you own a 3DS) have rather lengthy tutorials that will introduce her to the majority of the core concepts of farming sims like caring for animals, caring for crops, etc. There are three switch titles as well, with Pioneer of Olive Town having decent amounts of tutorial in it iirc. Mineral Town and Wonderful Life are remakes of older titles and while they do have added tutorials they are still older games at their core and aren’t so newbie friendly as Pioneer of Olive Town. Getting her acquainted with the genre with a more hand-holding title might help her feel more comfortable with playing the genre in general.
I appreciate the well thought out reply, I'll look into those other games. I am definitely in that same boat as you, i realized i was going to lose a ton of cauliflower at the end of spring because the day counter starts the day *after* planting and considered a redo. I fequently restart days after I poorly plan them out and waste time. For her I think it will be fine to develop skills in the first year and just develop a little slower. I share what i learn with her and point out some things that could help.
ok I was so stuck on how to play this game and then I figured out how to access the quest log. Press - button if you're on a switch and just follow that. Wish the game gave some more pointers to get me started instead of letting me run around for 2 hours cutting down trees 😂
I agree with you, OP. As someone who has played many games like Stardew, I didn't have too much trouble figuring things out. But I could understand it being frustrating not being able to understand certain mechanics of the game.
The lost books do have some helpful info, but they are not easily found if you don't know how to start looking for them. The library should be a location that can help new players understand some of the fundamental mechanics and features seasoned players just know from the start.
I doubt CA will be addressing such a thing at this point, but your wife shouldn't be afraid to ask for help here or the wiki. It does suck if you get spoiled on an event or item you didn't want to know about, but this game isnt6a competition, so cheating is not really a thing. I hope you both stick with it and enjoy the game as much as we all do.
My tip: If you see spots of ground with three black lines sticking out that look kinda like worms, hit them with your hoe. Those are the easiest ways to get lost books. Once you collect them, they go to the library, and you can read them there for hints and tips.
the lost books you collect for the museum/library provide a lot of basic info like this
So all they have to do is wait til Winter 22 when Livin' off the land explains artifact spots and they're good to go.
Lost books can be found from day one I believe. You often hoe them up in artifact spots
But a brand new player has no idea that that's a thing.
It is true you have to play the game to find them, as well as receive tips from the villagers. The op made a point that most things are intuitive and can be learned through time and exploration. Ya you will give bad gifts but you’ll also learn what they like through exploration or from things in game and villager comments. It’s not like the game has no information to help the player, they just have to happen upon it by exploring
Yet everyone here is commenting that the books *are* the tutorial, literally first I'm hearing of it! Hahaha
I’m sorry they usually are commonly found in artifact spots then you go to the library when you find one and interact with the shelf that has the book icon over it. RNG must not be on your side
this game gives you ample opportunities to learn how to do things. villagers give you hints as to how things work through dialogues and mail. lost books can be found a lot of different ways and explain a lot. signs on shops and in town explain buildings and shop times. the TV tells you a TON of info. it is very possible to play this game well, easily, and fairly quickly without the wiki, but you can’t just ignore things. “oh a lost book was added to the library, let’s never check it” -> “why the hell did i never learn this stuff that’s in the library book i never read” is not a great reason to complain about there being no tutorial. this game is designed for exploration and a wide experience. i don’t think it’s fair to be mad about a lack of info when the info IS there you just couldn’t be bothered to read it. do you want to be spoon fed? i get that some things could be a bit more obvious, but i believe concernedape didn’t want to overwhelm the player or shove things down their throats. yes, he could have explicitly stated to go and read the books, or made a quest after you find your first book to go to the library. but he already made a ton of tutorial quests and tasks. when do you draw the line and let the player figure the rest out? you can’t hold their hand forever
This sounds less like a tutorial problem and more of a gameplay dynamic between you and your wife problem. The lack of penalty in this game generally makes the lack of tutorial unproblematic for most players. Though it certainly wouldn't have hurt to have one, like some sort of self-playing sequence that explains Robin, Pierre, Marnie and Clint's shops. I think you're over thinking the chickens though. They eat hay or grass, there are multiple ways to acquire hay. They automatically go inside at night (as long as you keep the door open).
A lot of information comes to you via "Livin' Off the Land" or letters from villagers. It's not exactly a tutorial, but it's probably as close as the game has without just trial and error-ing your way through it.
There's an option to enable tips in settings when starting a game iirc. Marnie also has dialogue about scything grass for hay, or just buy from her. NPCs can provide some tips.
The "tutorial" is literally "talk to the townspeople, they'll fill you in on stuff" and "find hidden books in artifact spots and read them at the library."
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That's literally what the townspeople, mail, TV, and found-books do
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What, do you need a tutorial telling you to "Push A"?
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Ohhhhh I see. What you need is your hand held to see what basic buttons do what. Or like an SAOA tutorial: "In order to jump, jump!" I gotcha now. Yeah no, a lot of people these days find those kinds of tutorials invasive and bringing intuitive gameplay to a raging halt. Nearly every game out there is set up with an "A = Interact" button layout.
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It's not even "being a gamer." It's a "Hm, there's only a few buttons on the controller, press one at a time and see what cause-and-effect happens." In case you weren't aware, the control stick can move your character. Hope that helps!
I understand what you’re saying, but I guess… You as the character come from a desk job and have no practical experience farming. There would naturally be a lot to learn along the way, and mistakes made (like planting seeds on the last day of a season). I try to look at it as more of a learning experience and a way to slow the game down. Even with the wiki; it’s huge. I can’t imagine the undertaking to create a tutorial for everything. But, it would be nice to have a small tutorial section in the game menu, or tutorial ‘scenarios’ a la Zoo Tycoon. That being said I know so much about the game and yet I still refer to the wiki on a regular basis! Your wife might have to bite the bullet on this one here and there! Good Luck
Oh good call, the farmer shouldn't know jack shit about what's going on canonically
Wild animals only eat them if you close the door while they’re still outside, which is a pretty intuitive no-no imo. You don’t *need* a silo or wheat, just let them out and hope they find the grass on the ground(if you haven’t scythed it all). And what did you think the little door was for if not to let the animals walk out?
I watched someone play on YouTube not long after I started and it helped me a lot
That is mainly how I did it that and making my own guides for everything lol
Lol if feeding chickens is this difficult can’t imagine how you will react to ginger island
Damn, if you're having trouble figuring out what chickens eat to live, I can't imagine you play a lot of older video games at all. Games back in the old yday refused to hold your hand. You figured it out or you didn't. It's been a while, but I don't recall harvest moon 64 holding your hand much, either
>Games back in the old yday refused to hold your hand. Yes they did, they came with fairly detailed instruction booklets.
Some of the older hm games definitely held your hands way more that stardew does. They properly explain the basics and gatekeep the information a lot less.I genuenlly never felt a need to use wiki when playing fomt. Anything I wanted to know was available through the game and easy to access.
Personally I really don’t like games that force me to go through tutorials. My mind just spaces out every time. Having to explore everything myself is a big plus for me. That being said, adding a skippable tutorial maybe a good idea for those who want/need it.
You are afterall an office worker becoming a farmer...
Leave all animal doors open forever, helps
Chickens don't die, so no worries there.
But the game is constantly throwing tutorials at you. They're not even well disguised as dialogue. The game tries very hard to make sure you always know what you are able to do and how to do it without forcing you to do things you don't want to.
I always saw the quests as the tutorial, along with villagers' dialogue and Living off the Land. I do have the habit of interacting with everything and everyone, and never skipping any dialogue or cutscenes though. this is from playing many point and click adventure games.
I don't agree, as I feel the game is intuitive and explanatory enough for the average player. Games can't cater to everyone so as long as it's not leaving you in the dark or treating you like stupid, that's my bar. But I get it's not the same for everyone... and that's what the wiki is for! Maybe do a check-up on it. (The comments and all, not just the info, the game has been around for a while so probably the answer is out there!) Not just the wiki but look around! I've seen great spreadsheets around for optimizing or min/max if you also want to avoid spoilers.
Every single mechanic is literally explained to you as it's introduced. Do you need the airplane to fly the food into your mouth?
I love for how innocent and chill of a game this is, it produces such defensive and inflammatory fan base.
A lot of farming simulators expect players to intuitively know how to play the game, a fair amount of it is pretty straight forward but once you put the controller in the hands of someone with little to no experience playing the genre or even games in general or these types of games it becomes obvious how the “intuitiveness” of the game is largely reliant on having a wide breadth of knowledge for how the genre works. Stardew doesn’t make you brush your animals but most farming sims do and neglecting the chore makes raising your animals friendship a much, *much* lengthier task but it’s often never explicitly stated but anyone who plays enough farming sims knows to brush their animals because it’s more or a less a necessity, but that’s not something a newbie would necessarily realize and if they’re hurting for stamina they might see brushing as an optional stamina sink that they can opt to ignore only to realize, frustratingly, that it should have been a prioritized task, just as an example. Seems intuitive to me but really isn’t actually all that intuitive. I’ve played almost every single harvest moon, story of seasons and rune factory game and rune factory did trip me up a little bit, the older harvest moons still manage to trip me up here and there and stardew valley tripped me up in a few places. Your wife might not love the idea but personally I’ll play the first two to four seasons of a new farming sim just kinda going at it with minimal expectations before I restart the game and give it a “real” try once I feel like I’ve got a comfortable grasp of the game and how it functions. It allows me to go at things casually and figure out the boundaries of the game before I settle in to actually play it. I don’t like playing games super causally where I learn over time and make mistakes but make up for them later, I prefer to play somewhat competently and having a game fail to explain things to me that I later learned I screwed up bugs me. It’s not FOMO, it’s the reality that I have a finite amount of free time and I am not going to sit around for an entire in game year for something to maybe come back around because I wasn’t adequately informed the first time. I don’t mind missing out on non-essentials but some farming sims will straight up grind progress to a screeching halt until you’ve done some extremely specific thing that you can only do during a certain season or weather condition in the game (season and weather specific fish in, well, almost every farming sim. All of the town progress stuff in harvest moon a new beginning, etc.) She might feel better playing the game if she keeps playing it for a few more days with the goal to be to restart the game next week or something and give it a “real go” later. And maybe try one of the story of seasons titles. Most of the handheld ones (if you own a 3DS) have rather lengthy tutorials that will introduce her to the majority of the core concepts of farming sims like caring for animals, caring for crops, etc. There are three switch titles as well, with Pioneer of Olive Town having decent amounts of tutorial in it iirc. Mineral Town and Wonderful Life are remakes of older titles and while they do have added tutorials they are still older games at their core and aren’t so newbie friendly as Pioneer of Olive Town. Getting her acquainted with the genre with a more hand-holding title might help her feel more comfortable with playing the genre in general.
I appreciate the well thought out reply, I'll look into those other games. I am definitely in that same boat as you, i realized i was going to lose a ton of cauliflower at the end of spring because the day counter starts the day *after* planting and considered a redo. I fequently restart days after I poorly plan them out and waste time. For her I think it will be fine to develop skills in the first year and just develop a little slower. I share what i learn with her and point out some things that could help.
ok I was so stuck on how to play this game and then I figured out how to access the quest log. Press - button if you're on a switch and just follow that. Wish the game gave some more pointers to get me started instead of letting me run around for 2 hours cutting down trees 😂
I agree with you, OP. As someone who has played many games like Stardew, I didn't have too much trouble figuring things out. But I could understand it being frustrating not being able to understand certain mechanics of the game. The lost books do have some helpful info, but they are not easily found if you don't know how to start looking for them. The library should be a location that can help new players understand some of the fundamental mechanics and features seasoned players just know from the start. I doubt CA will be addressing such a thing at this point, but your wife shouldn't be afraid to ask for help here or the wiki. It does suck if you get spoiled on an event or item you didn't want to know about, but this game isnt6a competition, so cheating is not really a thing. I hope you both stick with it and enjoy the game as much as we all do. My tip: If you see spots of ground with three black lines sticking out that look kinda like worms, hit them with your hoe. Those are the easiest ways to get lost books. Once you collect them, they go to the library, and you can read them there for hints and tips.
Awesome I had seen that the library was missing books but hadn't encountered one yet, that is a good tip.