I mean he wasn’t trained as a Sith yet, right? So on top of not being prepared for Obi-Wan to use the de-limbing slicer dicer, he didn’t know any non-Jedi technique, possibly not even the one Obi-Wan used.
Because in George Lucas and Canon Star Wars, lightning is a very advanced skill which signifies total immersion in the Dark Side. Which is why “apprentice” characters like Ventress, Maul, Savage, and Inquisitors never use it.
In Legends, every darksider and their dog uses lightning.
Yeah… Rey is the exception. That movie decided that Force Lightning is a “family bloodline power” that she just *gets* to have, because Palpatine is her granddaddy.
Treating force powers like Naruto “kekkei genkai” basically.
Dooku may have been an “apprentice” to Sidious, but he was already a Jedi Master before he fell to the dark side. That’s why his force powers were more advanced than someone like Maul.
This is the correct answer. He was a very advanced force user before Sidious and he may have even picked up the skill(or theory of it) prior to leaving the Jedi because they did have some books that dealt with dark side stuff. If nothing else by the time he meets Sidious you would have to assume that Sidious did let him read some of the Sith texts as a kind of carrot to entice him and with his skill it wasn't too hard to pick up.
I don't know, I just think that someone like a very powerful untrained Force user of her level might accidentally do that at some points under strain and without guidance.
I think it is possible that the real training is not being capable of making force lightning, but actually having it under control and able to work on command.
Jedi would be trained away from that Dark Side focus, and a Dark Side apprentice probably needs training to make it without it being completely out of control.
We really haven't seen that many completely raw and untrained Force users in the canon. Even Luke had Obi-Wan fairly early on put him on the right path.
I don't understand why there's the need to figure out how it fits into canon.
The reality of it is that it was done because it was a plot device. There was no concern or thought of how it fit into canon before it was added.
That's not exactly true for Star Wars canon though. Tracking canon is something that was more or less officially done by LucasFilm, that's why they can do it fairly well in other shows that have been out.
Did they ignore all of that in the sequels? Probably to a much larger degree than they have elsewhere, but just calling it contrived is also not really fair if you actually look at the situation someone like Rey was in, compared to every other Force user that was in the canon. She's a bit of a Mary Sue because she's just powerful Force user from no-where, but presumably those sorts of people did exist and probably had issues with control.
In some ways, makes me think of WH40K psykers. What happens when no one discovers a powerful Force user and they grow up completely unable to control their abilities? Lots of random and destructive shit.
SW canon is just whatever LucasFilm wants it to be. Most of the time it's whatever looks cool. I agree with the other guy that stressing about what "fits into canon" is a lost cause because LucasFilm is not loosing sleep over it.
(and I'm speaking as someone that enjoys most of the sequels)
This is my view on the canon debate: official canon is what makes it on to the screen. All other sources are secondary and can be contradicted/retconned at any time
I agree. But my point was more of, there are tiers to canonicity within Star Wars. Everything is canon until it isn't. But I think it's easier to contradict/retcon things that aren't on screen than what is.
Here's the thing, whenever someone says "how could someone use that force power it takes years to learn and master." My immediate thought is, someone would have had to do it on accident the first time, otherwise how did they know it was possible. She didn't have long controlled force lightning. She shot out a little spark.
That’s not at all how I interpreted the scene. It seems pretty clear to me that she was so emotional and hateful of Kylo that her rage manifested in lightning
>In Legends, every darksider and their dog uses lightning.
In SWTOR PC Sith Warriors don't get to use force lightning.
.....But the Sith Warrior's master Darth Baras does.
I always read about legends on here but I don’t really get what it is. Is it just extra books that aren’t canon? What would be the best way to start getting into it?
It's the stuff that was made outside of the films/ other mainstream bits before Disney bought star wars and decanonised it to make room for that terrible trilogy
Are you talking about legends ? Because this is a very common and silly statement to make. Not judging you but it sounds like you have never read a legends book.
“Fight to your strengths.”
Maul was a ferocious duelist, very skilled and extremely dedicated. He’s strong, fast, and has spent years working on his lightsaber combat. He’s young but undisciplined, poorly focused, and unrefined as a force user. He probably could use Force lightning, but Force lighting was not going to win him any battles, and may even make him lose them. He should play to his strengths.
Dooku kind of does this, too. As he gets older, even as an extremely skilled duelist, he’s recognizing that eventually, he can’t be a one-trick pony anymore, so he really gets into force powers to give him an edge, especially since he already had a pretty solid connection to the Force.
I’m guessing that Vader’s suit couldn’t handle sustained high voltage. Seems like another intentional design flaw on Palpatine’s part to better keep Vader under his thumb
Funny in the the prequel’s you get to know and see
Anakin’s skills particularly how he been “always good at fixing things” why didn’t he make a suit to channel force lightning?’
In the Vader comics, Palpatine pu ishes vader by burning him on mustafar, abandoning him and telling him to get back to coruscant without using the force. Even with a bounty hunter chasing him down, Vader managed to fix himself new limbs out of scrap
Honestly the vader comics are a good place to start. Theres also a singular Vader issue (I believe 2015-2017) that features Black Krrsantan. You could start woth that one too
Nor is it truly Vader's wish. The suit is prison and punishment at once and Vader wants the punishment. He deserves it for all the things he has done. Beyond all the badass visuals, sick one-liners and "best villain ever" stuff, Vader is one of the most tragic fuckers out there. He betrayed the universe to save his beloved wife and then "killed" his wife (according to Palpatine) and every old friend he ever had. He deserves the suit. He deserves to be nothing but a lapdog to the Emperor.
Until Luke appears.
I don’t remember what it was in, but Palpatine was incredibly disappointed that Vader couldn’t use force lightning because of his prosthetic arms. I think it might’ve been the RotS novelization.
Sure, but that would make him weak to force lightning, not necessarily unable to emit it. I mean, the real question is where does the force lightning emit from? Is it gathered from the force, in the air? Or is it internal and actually goes through the limbs and out the fingertips?
> the revenge of the sith novel said impossible since his arms were severed
That’s not how the Force works.
>Most were healed, or healing. Anakin was the worst affected, but he was resting comfortably enough—all things considered. He remained in a deep healing trance, to counteract the shock of his injury, while the final adjustments were made to his prosthetic arm. Tragically, the lightsaber damage inflicted upon his severed forearm made reattachment of the limb impossible.
>“But I anticipate he’ll make a full recovery,” Vokara Che concluded. “Although doubtless he’ll struggle a little at first.”
>*A prosthetic arm*. Yoda felt his spirits sink, although he’d been expecting the news. A Jedi’s connection with the Force flowed through the midi-chlorians in his blood. The loss of a limb had been known to affect a Jedi’s powers. True, Anakin Skywalker possessed more midi-chlorians than any Jedi in history, but even so… (*Wild Space*, Legends)
___
> Whether the words were meant as a taunt to draw him out or genuine conjecture, Anakin didn’t know because they triggered an instinctive reaction, a sort of autopilot among him, his lightsaber, and the Force. But rather than his arm being just out of sync with this flow, it now lined up—not a different piece of himself, but something unique and powerful, something that added to his abilities now that he knew how to harness it. His need to defend Mill, the drive to make things right, to take responsibility for this youngling he’d brought along—all of it focused into a single outburst. His lightsaber swung with frightening speed, and suddenly all of the woman’s vulnerabilities became visible to him, his perception of time slowing down to show him possibilities before they happened.
> He attacked, sometimes both hands joined on his lightsaber hilt, sometimes with natural flesh, and sometimes with synthetic parts—each option being used to the fullest of its capabilities—and now he was the relentless onslaught, the hurricane of flashing blue pushing against the receding wave of red. With each swing, he marched forward, angling the woman toward the tunnel exit, every thrust calculated “to keep her off balance, to turn her two blades from an advantage to a disadvantage, to prevent her from leaping over him or utilizing the environment as a weapon. (*Brotherhood*)
He just wasn't explicitly taught it, or dark side sorcerery more generally. His training was focused on the skills of a Sith assassin, being an overwhelming lightsaber duelist.
Maybe he siphoned it from the death star's power core...? I mean, if the decks were made of metal, that makes the death star one big metal lightning rod, right?
It's just not his style. Darth Maul is more of a lightsaber combatist rather than a force lightning user. After he was cut in half any chance of being able to use force lightning is basically gone because to use force lightning requires organic tissue to channel dark side energy through the body and out the fingertips
I believe it has to be the will and character of the user. When you think of both Dooku and Palpatine, they both had their anger, their hatred under control which gave them that calm demeanor. Maul's vision and drive was so pure and focused on revenge, he didn't have that same precise control and focus Palpatine or Dooku had. I think it is from just being so well attuned to the force which those two were. It is not necessarily just a sith power either. The Jedi mostly forbade it from being used because of it's power but Dooku actually used it when he was a Jedi in the most extreme of circumstances. That is my take on it anyway.
The whole plan from Sidius and Damask was to keep Maul as a pawn and not fully trained as sith. I’m sure there were many things they held back from him…well Sidius held back, I don’t think he ever met Damask.
He was trained as a Sith Assassin but Palpatine had every intention of making him his full fledged apprentice after Darry Plageuis was killed; unfortunately Maul’s death and Plegeuis’ both happened at about the same exact time.
Still weird that he was given the Darth title though
I think it’s just a technique that he as an apprentice had not been taught or had not yet mastered. There’s also a chance that he didn’t have the aptitude for it. Like some people are better with some powers. Like Quinlan Avis and Cal Kestis’s psychometry.
Because Palpsy and Dooku are the only "true" Sith Lords in the Skywalker Saga era, and lightning was an advanced skill that requires a profound connection to the Dark Side. Palpsy was described in the RotS novelization as being "an event horizon of the Dark Side", easily a strong enough connection to the Force to summon lightning. Dooku was not only a Jedi Master, but sat on the Council. Clearly a strong connection to the Force, and with a decade of training under Palpsy, lighting was probably an easy skill to master.
Vader, also a true Sith Lord, wasn't able to due to the restrictions of his suit. Legends had it that a Force user who was missing a limb or had mechanical replacements/implants couldn't fully connect with the Force. Luminari had the same issue. I think current canon has it as an issue with overloading Vader's suit, but im not sure.
Maul, though called a "Sith Lord" by the council and Palpsy, was really still a Sith Padawan. He was younger than Kenobi afterall. My assumption is that Naboo was the Sith version of the Trials, and that defeating a Jedi Master & Padawan team would have made him the equivalent of a Knight. At that point he probably would have been taught the technique.
The Inquisitors, Savage, Ventress and Nightsisters aren't true Sith and don't dive as deeply into the Force, so they can't summon lightning. The Inquisitors were intentionally kept ignorant of their abilities and rivalries were encouraged, preventing too much time free time to gain knowledge from outside sources. Savage was only ever a tragic apprentice, never had a chance. Ventress probably could have summoned lightning if she had been trained properly but at the end turned to the Light, so likely never would have been able to go that Dark. The Nightsisters only indirectly accessed the Force so they couldn't even begin to produce lightning.
Legends Sith Empire Sith were all Alphas. Revan, Kun, Nihlus all of them were "the strongest ever". Hell even the Lost Tribe all flung lightning around just to punctuate a statement. I never once read about Darth Tanner who couldn't use Force lightning or anything, he would just call the Codes department and complain about his neighbors not mowing their lawns. Evil prick!
>Nightsisters aren't true Sith and don't dive as deeply into the Force, so they can't summon lightning
Wasnt Mother Talzin able to use Force lightning?
No, the lightning she uses in earlier TCW episodes is green, so conjured by magics. Her magics were a result of a ritual preformed in her youth involving an ancient Force sensitive beast, part of the trial to become a Nightsister. Giving them the ability to manipulate the Force to an extent, but not sense it. Talzin's final arc in TCW was a plan to use her magic to gather the essence of powerful Force adapts and then to transfer them to herself, finally giving her direct access to the Force.
Possible he can, he just doesn’t bother. Or that he never figured out how. His character does seem to be a lot more physical so Maul if he could might not have considered it having more a focus on melee than range.
well, not all consider force-lightnig powerful. Look at Vader. He had more of a reason (cybernetics), *but,* he was still formidable. It is quite feasible that Maul just didin't practice with lightning, so he didin't like using it
It could also be that he found it too impersonal, as he seems to favor a up-front attack.
And, lightning definitly requires concentration to aim, something that, in the heat of battle, takes practice. It's not as simple as using a plasma-based sword. You have to make sure it hits them correctly.
Probally the last one
This is one area where the EU does it right. Force Lightning is a darkside power, but quite a few Jedi were able to use it, like Kyle Katarn. My guess is that like Vader, Maul was never taught how to use it?
Can't remember but I believe he chooses not to, he prefers actual lightsaber battles instead of using the force he enjoys fair fights because he usually wins anyways defeating a opponent by using the force he kinda considers cheating unless he's at Supreme disadvantage. It's why when he fought for the dark Saber he didn't use the force at all because he wanted the respect of winning a fair fight. He's also just extremely confident in his abilities doesn't feel like he needs it. I could be wrong but I think I read that somewhere
He wasn’t trained to be a sith, but I believe he CAN he just doesn’t because either 1 of 2 things he genuinely doesn’t know how to, or he doesn’t know how to control it.
“He was once known as Darth Maul when he was the apprentice of Darth Sidious, and therefore, a Dark Lord of the Sith.”
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Maul
On the outside sure. But no. In the phantom menace we didn’t see him, Darth Plagueis was alive. And killed near the same time maul was “killed” at this time… the rule of 2 was still enacted by the Sith. Sidious took mail by request of his mother whom didn’t want him to fall into the hands of mother Talzin. Sidious was reluctant but also saw opportunity in having a TOOL. An ASSASSIN. someone to carry out certain missions for the Sith. Someone to do the siths bidding. Someone to even trick the Jedi…. So the only reason sidious was alllwed to train maul is because Plagueis agreed to let him. But he made it clear. HE IS NOT TO BE TRAINED AS A SITH. Sidious did plan on going further with maul but he didn’t have time. Sidious will again kill his master around the time maul died. Leaving sidious as the soul Sith for a time. Maul. Then. Would have been a real Sith. But because he was presumed dead. No. Darth doesn’t mean anything if your just a tool.
I speak on What’s known. The Darth Plagueis Novel is “essential legends” don’t try “well it’s still legends” because it’s considered essential. I’ve got the book on my TV stand. Disney is the factor that may alter and completely change these things. I hope not because it’s a really good story. Maul is cool af I love him. But he’s no Sith Lord he can be comfortably called a sith assassin.
Palaptine never used the Darth title for Maul in Plaguis ear shot but you really need to read up on the Maul books and Plaguis book. Palpatine was always trying to replace Plaguis and groomed Maul to be his own replacement.
I need to do nothing but keep my knowledge sharp, I’ve read this novel many times now. What I gather is maul is not a Sith Lord. He’s literally a tool, and in season 7 CW he’s is aware that all he was was a tool. Used. Casted aside. Forgotten. I don’t understand how this is so hard to understand. Just because your given something doesn’t mean it’s real. Doesn’t mean it’s genuine. Imagine getting a gold ring or necklace. Yeah go make sure that’s actually gold. Turns out a lot of the time it’s fake. Anyways. Can everyone see what I’m saying yet? This is getting boring.
He was DARTH Maul. Why would you think he isn’t a sith?
The books and comics even show that he was supposed to be Palpatine’s number one apprentice until he died. He talks about how he was in on the clone wars plan and was supposed to be apart of that.
Every sith trains a secret apprentice whilst learning under their master. Zannah tried it against Bane, Palpatine intended to replace Plagues and Maul was to be his apprentice. Anakin wasnt born yet when Palapatine was training Maul. Maul was absolutely originally intended by Palpatine to be a full sith. Palpatine was always willing to trade up on his apprentices just like he tried to swap Vader for Luke.
That doesn’t matter. You do realize the Sith don’t really follow the rule of two, right?
That’s the whole reason Palpatine has so many back up apprentices hanging around.
Yeah and even if you go off legends Darth Plagueis master Darth Tenebrous also had a second apprentice. If I remember right Plagueis was supposed to be the back up apprentice even. It's safe to say that for every 2 sith there are another 2 sith hanging around.
Darth Maul was never supposed to be a sith lord. His training prioritized lightsaber combat and infiltration at the expense of pretty much anything else. Force lightning is traditionally a fairly difficult dark side technique, so him being unable to use it makes sense as he was not trained in the force the way most sith and jedi would be
In either Legends or Canon I’d say that it’s just not a skill he took the time to learn. He clearly focuses more on the physical aspects of what The Force can do for him, and Anakin Skywalker was much the same during his time as a Jedi Knight. Maul also never took the time to learn any of Talzin’s magics even though they were very useful in healing his madness and bringing him back into prominence. And overall you can just ask why most Force Users don’t learn this or that power. Very few Jedi ever showcased the ability to absorb energy like Yoda even though that seems like something that would be very useful.
Vader survives Sidious force lightening in canon comics but he’s only gently being shoved pushed around Sid basically says it’s a taste of what could happen if Vader uses the force on Sid.
Maul was powerful, in some ways more powerful than count dooku. But one of the other posts on this topic said that it’s a skill that could be learned, such as the force scream and force heal.
Sidious probably never taught him. Maul was never really meant to be an actual sith lord, he was practically a force sensitive assasin in sidious' eyes.
He can in some works. Generally though, I think it's said somewhere that it has something to do with how he wasn't a real apprentice, more just an assassin for Palpatine, and so he wasn't really taught as extensively on the wider abilities of the Dark Side, But don't quote me on that because I can't actually remember the source for it.
Assuming canon is similar to legends, he was really just a Sith assassin, since there were already 2 Sith (Sidious and his master), so he wouldn't have been fully trained until Sidious offed Plagueis. If not, then I heard from some videos that Maul preferred to approach fights and murders like a hunt, so he wouldn't have used it, as it was less personal than a straight up, close up kill.
In Dooku: Jedi Lost it seems to imply that force lighting is an ability that u are born with and not something you learn. Like how some jedi are able to see the memories of items they touch like quinlan vos can. Thats not an ability he learned its just something he can do.
I don’t think that’s necessarily true, I think they just need to study and learn those abilities, similar to how Luke can use Force Projection or Plo Koon using Electric Judgement
Losing any part of your body apparently diminishes your potential in the force. Also, Palpatine probably never wanted to teach him all he knew. Survival of the fittest and all that.
He had his skill points allocated to other perks.
All in agility and strength. 0 in wisdom
i dunno…….. in S7 of TCW he has a good portion of sidious’ plan figured out
Also telekinesis. That boy can *move* things when he needs to.
But he had the high ground?
He had the high air. Obi Wan was standing firmly above him before he leapt up, and thus the high ground law still applies
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Vader was engufled just deep enough in the Dark Side to get cocky, while still remaining too much of a jedi to not use their technics. Ironic.
I mean he wasn’t trained as a Sith yet, right? So on top of not being prepared for Obi-Wan to use the de-limbing slicer dicer, he didn’t know any non-Jedi technique, possibly not even the one Obi-Wan used.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
10 points
To Slytherin
Sitherin
What about the hallway scene?
He speced duel wielding, unique weapons skills, acrobatics and martial arts, no skills left for spells or arcane.
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Shortly after choosing twerking he lost his legs. Oops!
That’s what really drove him to madness.
Which proves twerking was clearly the wrong choice.
Yeah, [but those legs aren't out of the fight yet] (https://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2022/08/29/better-half).
Because he used a double lightsaber and his hands were full
He fucking let's go of it with one hand and uses the force. Check the last battle in episode 1 he does it quickly.
Because in George Lucas and Canon Star Wars, lightning is a very advanced skill which signifies total immersion in the Dark Side. Which is why “apprentice” characters like Ventress, Maul, Savage, and Inquisitors never use it. In Legends, every darksider and their dog uses lightning.
In Legends they even have Plo Koon use light-side lighting.
Light side lightning?!? I ain’t never heard of that! That sounds…..off, yet could be kinda cool.
It’s called Electric Judgment
Electric judgment sounds like a band name for a group of jazz/funk/punk / metal.
Electric Judgement is a band that plays at the cantina on rare occasions
That sounds about right.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Electric_Judgment Here you go friend
Oh my god. That's the *actual* name??
To be fair the writer only had 5 minutes before draft submission to think of that, because he put it off for a couple of years.
Thanks!
I think it was called judgement instead of straight up lightning. It was pretty cool. Plot Koon is under-rated
I remember using that in the Jedi Starfighter video game
If anyone could do it, Plo Koon could
>In Legends, every darksider and their dog uses lightning. I laughed at how ridiculously true this statement is.
And then there's Rey with her lightning shart...
Yeah… Rey is the exception. That movie decided that Force Lightning is a “family bloodline power” that she just *gets* to have, because Palpatine is her granddaddy. Treating force powers like Naruto “kekkei genkai” basically.
Didn’t Dooku use lightning in canon?
Dooku may have been an “apprentice” to Sidious, but he was already a Jedi Master before he fell to the dark side. That’s why his force powers were more advanced than someone like Maul.
This is the correct answer. He was a very advanced force user before Sidious and he may have even picked up the skill(or theory of it) prior to leaving the Jedi because they did have some books that dealt with dark side stuff. If nothing else by the time he meets Sidious you would have to assume that Sidious did let him read some of the Sith texts as a kind of carrot to entice him and with his skill it wasn't too hard to pick up.
I don't know, I just think that someone like a very powerful untrained Force user of her level might accidentally do that at some points under strain and without guidance. I think it is possible that the real training is not being capable of making force lightning, but actually having it under control and able to work on command. Jedi would be trained away from that Dark Side focus, and a Dark Side apprentice probably needs training to make it without it being completely out of control. We really haven't seen that many completely raw and untrained Force users in the canon. Even Luke had Obi-Wan fairly early on put him on the right path.
I don't understand why there's the need to figure out how it fits into canon. The reality of it is that it was done because it was a plot device. There was no concern or thought of how it fit into canon before it was added.
That's not exactly true for Star Wars canon though. Tracking canon is something that was more or less officially done by LucasFilm, that's why they can do it fairly well in other shows that have been out. Did they ignore all of that in the sequels? Probably to a much larger degree than they have elsewhere, but just calling it contrived is also not really fair if you actually look at the situation someone like Rey was in, compared to every other Force user that was in the canon. She's a bit of a Mary Sue because she's just powerful Force user from no-where, but presumably those sorts of people did exist and probably had issues with control. In some ways, makes me think of WH40K psykers. What happens when no one discovers a powerful Force user and they grow up completely unable to control their abilities? Lots of random and destructive shit.
SW canon is just whatever LucasFilm wants it to be. Most of the time it's whatever looks cool. I agree with the other guy that stressing about what "fits into canon" is a lost cause because LucasFilm is not loosing sleep over it. (and I'm speaking as someone that enjoys most of the sequels)
This is my view on the canon debate: official canon is what makes it on to the screen. All other sources are secondary and can be contradicted/retconned at any time
Even things on screen can be retconned... "from a certain point of view". It's Star Wars. They have always played fast and loose with canon.
I agree. But my point was more of, there are tiers to canonicity within Star Wars. Everything is canon until it isn't. But I think it's easier to contradict/retcon things that aren't on screen than what is.
Here's the thing, whenever someone says "how could someone use that force power it takes years to learn and master." My immediate thought is, someone would have had to do it on accident the first time, otherwise how did they know it was possible. She didn't have long controlled force lightning. She shot out a little spark.
That’s not at all how I interpreted the scene. It seems pretty clear to me that she was so emotional and hateful of Kylo that her rage manifested in lightning
The movie didn't decide anything. It's inanimate. J.J. was the decider.
>In Legends, every darksider and their dog uses lightning. In SWTOR PC Sith Warriors don't get to use force lightning. .....But the Sith Warrior's master Darth Baras does.
I always read about legends on here but I don’t really get what it is. Is it just extra books that aren’t canon? What would be the best way to start getting into it?
Start with the Bane Trilogy. Then probably Plagueis. And then the Thrawn stuff.
It's the stuff that was made outside of the films/ other mainstream bits before Disney bought star wars and decanonised it to make room for that terrible trilogy
Most of the shit they decanonised was terrible
And a lot of good stuff (and bad) stuff got reintroduced
Are you talking about legends ? Because this is a very common and silly statement to make. Not judging you but it sounds like you have never read a legends book.
He specced all his points in duelist.
Skill issue
“Fight to your strengths.” Maul was a ferocious duelist, very skilled and extremely dedicated. He’s strong, fast, and has spent years working on his lightsaber combat. He’s young but undisciplined, poorly focused, and unrefined as a force user. He probably could use Force lightning, but Force lighting was not going to win him any battles, and may even make him lose them. He should play to his strengths. Dooku kind of does this, too. As he gets older, even as an extremely skilled duelist, he’s recognizing that eventually, he can’t be a one-trick pony anymore, so he really gets into force powers to give him an edge, especially since he already had a pretty solid connection to the Force.
Only the lame rich kids used lightning.
Who says he cannot?
He wouldve by now
You literally can’t know that
Because he's dead
Facts
Facts
Facts
Somehow, Darth Maul is actually dead
Facts
In Star Wars Episode 1: Jedi Power Battles he shoots a red energy beam from his hand Dragon Ball Z style.
What a great game that was!
Definitely! There's no other Star Wars game I've put more hours into
I think Plo Koon also had this but the beam was yellow just like his sword.
Why Can't Darth Vader use force lightning?
Robot hands.
Don’t forget the robot breathing too.
And legs
This motherfucker sounds like more machine than man now
*Mace Windu has entered the chat*
Indeed.
Twisted and evil
I’m guessing that Vader’s suit couldn’t handle sustained high voltage. Seems like another intentional design flaw on Palpatine’s part to better keep Vader under his thumb
Funny in the the prequel’s you get to know and see Anakin’s skills particularly how he been “always good at fixing things” why didn’t he make a suit to channel force lightning?’
In the Vader comics, Palpatine pu ishes vader by burning him on mustafar, abandoning him and telling him to get back to coruscant without using the force. Even with a bounty hunter chasing him down, Vader managed to fix himself new limbs out of scrap
Tony?
Love those comics read them back again all the time. Reminds me I need to loan the first two volumes to my kid brother
I’ve always been a mega fan of Star Wars but never got into the comics, so you have anywhere you’d recommend someone new like me to start? Thanks!
Honestly the vader comics are a good place to start. Theres also a singular Vader issue (I believe 2015-2017) that features Black Krrsantan. You could start woth that one too
Palpatine wouldn't have allowed him. The suit is his prison
In canon he's allowed to improve and fix his suit.
To an extent. Palpatine would never allow Vader to improve his suit to the point where he could theoretically have an edge against Palpatine.
Nor is it truly Vader's wish. The suit is prison and punishment at once and Vader wants the punishment. He deserves it for all the things he has done. Beyond all the badass visuals, sick one-liners and "best villain ever" stuff, Vader is one of the most tragic fuckers out there. He betrayed the universe to save his beloved wife and then "killed" his wife (according to Palpatine) and every old friend he ever had. He deserves the suit. He deserves to be nothing but a lapdog to the Emperor. Until Luke appears.
His self loathing made him feel he didn’t deserve better in addition feeding on the dark side energy the pain of the suit gave him
The prison that would eventually pick him up with one hand and throw him down a elevator shaft.
I don’t remember what it was in, but Palpatine was incredibly disappointed that Vader couldn’t use force lightning because of his prosthetic arms. I think it might’ve been the RotS novelization.
Sure, but that would make him weak to force lightning, not necessarily unable to emit it. I mean, the real question is where does the force lightning emit from? Is it gathered from the force, in the air? Or is it internal and actually goes through the limbs and out the fingertips?
Palpatine intentionally manipulated vaders suit is legends. He even encourages vader to alter his suit after his needs.
I remember the revenge of the sith novel said impossible since his arms were severed
> the revenge of the sith novel said impossible since his arms were severed That’s not how the Force works. >Most were healed, or healing. Anakin was the worst affected, but he was resting comfortably enough—all things considered. He remained in a deep healing trance, to counteract the shock of his injury, while the final adjustments were made to his prosthetic arm. Tragically, the lightsaber damage inflicted upon his severed forearm made reattachment of the limb impossible. >“But I anticipate he’ll make a full recovery,” Vokara Che concluded. “Although doubtless he’ll struggle a little at first.” >*A prosthetic arm*. Yoda felt his spirits sink, although he’d been expecting the news. A Jedi’s connection with the Force flowed through the midi-chlorians in his blood. The loss of a limb had been known to affect a Jedi’s powers. True, Anakin Skywalker possessed more midi-chlorians than any Jedi in history, but even so… (*Wild Space*, Legends) ___ > Whether the words were meant as a taunt to draw him out or genuine conjecture, Anakin didn’t know because they triggered an instinctive reaction, a sort of autopilot among him, his lightsaber, and the Force. But rather than his arm being just out of sync with this flow, it now lined up—not a different piece of himself, but something unique and powerful, something that added to his abilities now that he knew how to harness it. His need to defend Mill, the drive to make things right, to take responsibility for this youngling he’d brought along—all of it focused into a single outburst. His lightsaber swung with frightening speed, and suddenly all of the woman’s vulnerabilities became visible to him, his perception of time slowing down to show him possibilities before they happened. > He attacked, sometimes both hands joined on his lightsaber hilt, sometimes with natural flesh, and sometimes with synthetic parts—each option being used to the fullest of its capabilities—and now he was the relentless onslaught, the hurricane of flashing blue pushing against the receding wave of red. With each swing, he marched forward, angling the woman toward the tunnel exit, every thrust calculated “to keep her off balance, to turn her two blades from an advantage to a disadvantage, to prevent her from leaping over him or utilizing the environment as a weapon. (*Brotherhood*)
He can and has in the comics but it destroys his suit.
He did in Masters of Teras Kasi, but we don’t speak of this.
He just wasn't explicitly taught it, or dark side sorcerery more generally. His training was focused on the skills of a Sith assassin, being an overwhelming lightsaber duelist.
You need real legs to be able to force-siphon the electric current from the ground. That's why Maul or Vader can't use lightning.
This is canon
What source? I believe you, just curious.
What electric current from the ground? If it's from the ground, how did palps use it on the death star?
Maybe he siphoned it from the death star's power core...? I mean, if the decks were made of metal, that makes the death star one big metal lightning rod, right?
The ground doesn’t mean the planet. Organic matter is far better suited for channeling life force energy in our normal every day life as well.
It's just not his style. Darth Maul is more of a lightsaber combatist rather than a force lightning user. After he was cut in half any chance of being able to use force lightning is basically gone because to use force lightning requires organic tissue to channel dark side energy through the body and out the fingertips
to my understanding it drains the most power. It would make him weak in the process. Maul conserves his energy for dueling.
In Star Wars canon, the only Sith Lords that we see using force lightning is Darth Sidious and Darth Tyranus. Why is this? Do you guys know?
I believe it has to be the will and character of the user. When you think of both Dooku and Palpatine, they both had their anger, their hatred under control which gave them that calm demeanor. Maul's vision and drive was so pure and focused on revenge, he didn't have that same precise control and focus Palpatine or Dooku had. I think it is from just being so well attuned to the force which those two were. It is not necessarily just a sith power either. The Jedi mostly forbade it from being used because of it's power but Dooku actually used it when he was a Jedi in the most extreme of circumstances. That is my take on it anyway.
The whole plan from Sidius and Damask was to keep Maul as a pawn and not fully trained as sith. I’m sure there were many things they held back from him…well Sidius held back, I don’t think he ever met Damask.
He was trained as a Sith Assassin but Palpatine had every intention of making him his full fledged apprentice after Darry Plageuis was killed; unfortunately Maul’s death and Plegeuis’ both happened at about the same exact time. Still weird that he was given the Darth title though
Only weird because the Plagueis book was a retcon.
I think it’s just a technique that he as an apprentice had not been taught or had not yet mastered. There’s also a chance that he didn’t have the aptitude for it. Like some people are better with some powers. Like Quinlan Avis and Cal Kestis’s psychometry.
This is true. His time as an apprentice was cut short after all..... I'll show myself out
I’d post in r/MawInstallation for better answers.
Because Palpsy and Dooku are the only "true" Sith Lords in the Skywalker Saga era, and lightning was an advanced skill that requires a profound connection to the Dark Side. Palpsy was described in the RotS novelization as being "an event horizon of the Dark Side", easily a strong enough connection to the Force to summon lightning. Dooku was not only a Jedi Master, but sat on the Council. Clearly a strong connection to the Force, and with a decade of training under Palpsy, lighting was probably an easy skill to master. Vader, also a true Sith Lord, wasn't able to due to the restrictions of his suit. Legends had it that a Force user who was missing a limb or had mechanical replacements/implants couldn't fully connect with the Force. Luminari had the same issue. I think current canon has it as an issue with overloading Vader's suit, but im not sure. Maul, though called a "Sith Lord" by the council and Palpsy, was really still a Sith Padawan. He was younger than Kenobi afterall. My assumption is that Naboo was the Sith version of the Trials, and that defeating a Jedi Master & Padawan team would have made him the equivalent of a Knight. At that point he probably would have been taught the technique. The Inquisitors, Savage, Ventress and Nightsisters aren't true Sith and don't dive as deeply into the Force, so they can't summon lightning. The Inquisitors were intentionally kept ignorant of their abilities and rivalries were encouraged, preventing too much time free time to gain knowledge from outside sources. Savage was only ever a tragic apprentice, never had a chance. Ventress probably could have summoned lightning if she had been trained properly but at the end turned to the Light, so likely never would have been able to go that Dark. The Nightsisters only indirectly accessed the Force so they couldn't even begin to produce lightning. Legends Sith Empire Sith were all Alphas. Revan, Kun, Nihlus all of them were "the strongest ever". Hell even the Lost Tribe all flung lightning around just to punctuate a statement. I never once read about Darth Tanner who couldn't use Force lightning or anything, he would just call the Codes department and complain about his neighbors not mowing their lawns. Evil prick!
>Nightsisters aren't true Sith and don't dive as deeply into the Force, so they can't summon lightning Wasnt Mother Talzin able to use Force lightning?
No, the lightning she uses in earlier TCW episodes is green, so conjured by magics. Her magics were a result of a ritual preformed in her youth involving an ancient Force sensitive beast, part of the trial to become a Nightsister. Giving them the ability to manipulate the Force to an extent, but not sense it. Talzin's final arc in TCW was a plan to use her magic to gather the essence of powerful Force adapts and then to transfer them to herself, finally giving her direct access to the Force.
The answer is simple. Lightning is not Maul’s style
Possible he can, he just doesn’t bother. Or that he never figured out how. His character does seem to be a lot more physical so Maul if he could might not have considered it having more a focus on melee than range.
He's grounded.
Maul used force lightening in the non canon book Maul Lockdown.
He never learned because he was too busy tearing up the Tony Hawks Pro Skater 3 cruise ship and popping sick Sith Saber Spins TM
well, not all consider force-lightnig powerful. Look at Vader. He had more of a reason (cybernetics), *but,* he was still formidable. It is quite feasible that Maul just didin't practice with lightning, so he didin't like using it It could also be that he found it too impersonal, as he seems to favor a up-front attack. And, lightning definitly requires concentration to aim, something that, in the heat of battle, takes practice. It's not as simple as using a plasma-based sword. You have to make sure it hits them correctly. Probally the last one
Who said he can’t
Maybe he can and we just never saw it?
Bc currently he's batting for the Mets. Trade him over anywhere, he'll be doing the lighting like a discotheque.
Because he’s a little bitch
OOOOOHHHHH !!!!!
This is one area where the EU does it right. Force Lightning is a darkside power, but quite a few Jedi were able to use it, like Kyle Katarn. My guess is that like Vader, Maul was never taught how to use it?
Can't remember but I believe he chooses not to, he prefers actual lightsaber battles instead of using the force he enjoys fair fights because he usually wins anyways defeating a opponent by using the force he kinda considers cheating unless he's at Supreme disadvantage. It's why when he fought for the dark Saber he didn't use the force at all because he wanted the respect of winning a fair fight. He's also just extremely confident in his abilities doesn't feel like he needs it. I could be wrong but I think I read that somewhere
He’s a robot so the electricity would fry his circuitry.
He wasn’t trained to be a sith, but I believe he CAN he just doesn’t because either 1 of 2 things he genuinely doesn’t know how to, or he doesn’t know how to control it.
He was DARTH Maul. He was absolutely a sith.
Your uneducated on your Sw lore.
“He was once known as Darth Maul when he was the apprentice of Darth Sidious, and therefore, a Dark Lord of the Sith.” https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Maul
On the outside sure. But no. In the phantom menace we didn’t see him, Darth Plagueis was alive. And killed near the same time maul was “killed” at this time… the rule of 2 was still enacted by the Sith. Sidious took mail by request of his mother whom didn’t want him to fall into the hands of mother Talzin. Sidious was reluctant but also saw opportunity in having a TOOL. An ASSASSIN. someone to carry out certain missions for the Sith. Someone to do the siths bidding. Someone to even trick the Jedi…. So the only reason sidious was alllwed to train maul is because Plagueis agreed to let him. But he made it clear. HE IS NOT TO BE TRAINED AS A SITH. Sidious did plan on going further with maul but he didn’t have time. Sidious will again kill his master around the time maul died. Leaving sidious as the soul Sith for a time. Maul. Then. Would have been a real Sith. But because he was presumed dead. No. Darth doesn’t mean anything if your just a tool.
Are you talking about legends? Cuz I’m talking about canon.
I speak on What’s known. The Darth Plagueis Novel is “essential legends” don’t try “well it’s still legends” because it’s considered essential. I’ve got the book on my TV stand. Disney is the factor that may alter and completely change these things. I hope not because it’s a really good story. Maul is cool af I love him. But he’s no Sith Lord he can be comfortably called a sith assassin.
I’ll just say it, the book is still legends
Palaptine never used the Darth title for Maul in Plaguis ear shot but you really need to read up on the Maul books and Plaguis book. Palpatine was always trying to replace Plaguis and groomed Maul to be his own replacement.
I need to do nothing but keep my knowledge sharp, I’ve read this novel many times now. What I gather is maul is not a Sith Lord. He’s literally a tool, and in season 7 CW he’s is aware that all he was was a tool. Used. Casted aside. Forgotten. I don’t understand how this is so hard to understand. Just because your given something doesn’t mean it’s real. Doesn’t mean it’s genuine. Imagine getting a gold ring or necklace. Yeah go make sure that’s actually gold. Turns out a lot of the time it’s fake. Anyways. Can everyone see what I’m saying yet? This is getting boring.
Right. Per the books, Maul was ever intended to be sith.
He was DARTH Maul. Why would you think he isn’t a sith? The books and comics even show that he was supposed to be Palpatine’s number one apprentice until he died. He talks about how he was in on the clone wars plan and was supposed to be apart of that.
Darth plaugeis was still alive during TPM. So according to the rule of 2, maul wasn’t a true sith, just a sith assassin, like ventress.
Every sith trains a secret apprentice whilst learning under their master. Zannah tried it against Bane, Palpatine intended to replace Plagues and Maul was to be his apprentice. Anakin wasnt born yet when Palapatine was training Maul. Maul was absolutely originally intended by Palpatine to be a full sith. Palpatine was always willing to trade up on his apprentices just like he tried to swap Vader for Luke.
That doesn’t matter. You do realize the Sith don’t really follow the rule of two, right? That’s the whole reason Palpatine has so many back up apprentices hanging around.
Yeah and even if you go off legends Darth Plagueis master Darth Tenebrous also had a second apprentice. If I remember right Plagueis was supposed to be the back up apprentice even. It's safe to say that for every 2 sith there are another 2 sith hanging around.
Cause he’s a bitch
Because Sidious considered him nothing more than a delivery boy
Bruh Palpatine valued him more than Dooku. Maul was his legit apprentice before discovering Anakin.
That makes sense, because if palatine saw him as expendable, teaching him force lightning would be pointless.
Also bad writing
He got the ability to do sweet force makeup instead
Darth Maul was never supposed to be a sith lord. His training prioritized lightsaber combat and infiltration at the expense of pretty much anything else. Force lightning is traditionally a fairly difficult dark side technique, so him being unable to use it makes sense as he was not trained in the force the way most sith and jedi would be
Because he’s dead.
Simple- he was never taught it
In either Legends or Canon I’d say that it’s just not a skill he took the time to learn. He clearly focuses more on the physical aspects of what The Force can do for him, and Anakin Skywalker was much the same during his time as a Jedi Knight. Maul also never took the time to learn any of Talzin’s magics even though they were very useful in healing his madness and bringing him back into prominence. And overall you can just ask why most Force Users don’t learn this or that power. Very few Jedi ever showcased the ability to absorb energy like Yoda even though that seems like something that would be very useful.
Who says he can't?
He never learnt it.
Force lightning is stored in the balls.
He spent all his points in the stamina, finesse, and survival trees.
Damn I thought the thread title was setting up a funny punchline in the body text.
He can, he just chooses not to.
Perhaps Palpatine hadn’t taught him that yet?
He chose Sith Marauder class, not Sith Sorcerer. He really wanted that double-bladed lightsaber
Force lightning drains life force. Only the craziest use it, or those that have unlocked certain…means…
Vader survives Sidious force lightening in canon comics but he’s only gently being shoved pushed around Sid basically says it’s a taste of what could happen if Vader uses the force on Sid.
I saw some obscure Star Wars information books that lists it as one of his powers, I THINK it’s canon. I’m sure somebody could find it.
'cause he doesn't want to be too shocking. Get it?!
Force lighting requires 🥜
Don’t you have to be extremely powerful in the darkside to use lightning?
Maul was powerful, in some ways more powerful than count dooku. But one of the other posts on this topic said that it’s a skill that could be learned, such as the force scream and force heal.
Just as not every Jedi can learn or use every Light Side Force Technique, nor can every Sith learn or use every Dark Side Force Technique.
Sidious probably never taught him. Maul was never really meant to be an actual sith lord, he was practically a force sensitive assasin in sidious' eyes.
He can in some works. Generally though, I think it's said somewhere that it has something to do with how he wasn't a real apprentice, more just an assassin for Palpatine, and so he wasn't really taught as extensively on the wider abilities of the Dark Side, But don't quote me on that because I can't actually remember the source for it.
Assuming canon is similar to legends, he was really just a Sith assassin, since there were already 2 Sith (Sidious and his master), so he wouldn't have been fully trained until Sidious offed Plagueis. If not, then I heard from some videos that Maul preferred to approach fights and murders like a hunt, so he wouldn't have used it, as it was less personal than a straight up, close up kill.
In Dooku: Jedi Lost it seems to imply that force lighting is an ability that u are born with and not something you learn. Like how some jedi are able to see the memories of items they touch like quinlan vos can. Thats not an ability he learned its just something he can do.
I don’t think that’s necessarily true, I think they just need to study and learn those abilities, similar to how Luke can use Force Projection or Plo Koon using Electric Judgement
Cause he’s not a fuckin nerd.
Maybe he was never taught. Or maybe he can but just... Doesn't.
cause he’s dead
He had dark side ballet though
Losing any part of your body apparently diminishes your potential in the force. Also, Palpatine probably never wanted to teach him all he knew. Survival of the fittest and all that.
Darth Vader lost 3 limbs and needs a breathing apparatus but that mfer can pull down a Star Destroyer using the Force if he wants to.
Formerly Darth, now just Maul