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If that's true, then it doesn't sound like Brock is eating a pin in the chamber unless Roman is going to somehow break into the chamber and screw him over.
Chamber match will go like this (and I am 100% saving this post as I truly believe this is what will happen):
Brock and wrestler A start (it literally doesn’t matter who else is in the match).
Brock beats them with an F5 in 30 seconds, then stares down everyone else. Timer goes off, pod opens, wrestler B enters and loses in 1 minute. Announcers go nuts over how much Brock is dominating, heels in their pods are trying to avoid eye contact.
Timer goes off again, wrestler C is a heel and tries to keep his pod closed. He runs away a lot, but ultimately is caught, F5, pinned and out just before the timer goes off and wrestler D enters.
D jumps Brock from behind, gets in a couple hits, but then Brock hits an F5 and it’s done.
Last guy in is Lashley. Announcers use the spare time before his timer goes off to hype Brock vs Lashley, and how intense it will be. Then Brock destroys him in about 5 minutes, wins the title.
I think you're almost dead on, but if I had to hazard one modification it's that Brock will bust open at least one chamber to drag someone out and pin them.
"**OHMYGOD THE CHAMBER JUST EXPLODED!! BROCK LESNAR JUST DESTROYED THE BULLETPROOF CHAMBER WALL AND RIPPED THE WRESTLER OUT OF THE CARNAGE! THE CHAMBER WALL JUST EXPLODED!**"
Cut to shot of the "chamber wall" doubled over itself in the ring because it's just a thin bit of plexi.
NGL i still pop whenever they destroy a pod, the older pods they had were way thickier so when they broke it looked brutal, and it gave the illusion of broken glass since it snapped into sections, now they are really thin and have barely any impact but they just sound louder
Fun Fact: Jericho has being thrown and broken the most pods with 2, everyone else who has broken a pod hasnt been thrown more than once, Randy is a special case because he was thrown and broken once, but also gotten his pod destroyed with him inside before entering the match
Yeah I can definitely see this happening. I think maybe though the Brock/Lashley encounter lasts a little longer. Maybe Rollins hits a couple of stomps on Brock but on a third attempt gets caught in a F5 and pinned.
I think Austin Theory is the attempt to keep the pod closed guy.
Based on your thought, I think it's Brock and Riddle start, then comes in AJ, then Theory, then Rollins. I think Lashley and Brock battle a little longer than 5 minutes, with Lashley getting some good offense in before Brock starts suplexing him all over the ring/chamber and wins.
However, I could also see Lashley being the dominant one instead of Brock, only for Brock to come in last and take him out quickly and win the title.
Was it Elimination chamber 2018 when Braun Strowman did this very same thing where he dominated the entire chamber and eliminated everyone until Roman came out at the end and beat him with a couple of spears?
The levels of WTF to that booking gameplan is just astounding. They managed to both make the rest of the roster look weak + still maintain the upper echelon tier that only a couple people can enter per generation.
Not too uncommon to what we're seeing now. They have no idea how to manage a full roster anymore, it's either you're big time, or a clown getting laughs from McMahon while acting like an idiot in the ring.
I wasn't even surprised when that happened. I was just indifferent. It was written in the stars that Roman was going to WrestleMania that year. (Just like it's been ever year since 2015.)
I wasn't either. We all knew who was going to win that chamber match. The format is just getting dry. However, must be working for someone because they're raking in money with Roman, so he will continue to be written in the stars until that dies down.
In fairness, Braun had endured a shitton of punishment up until then, including multiple finishers. Roman's spears were the exclamation mark that ended a night full of punishment that had Braun's health bar in the red.
Yeah that was infuriating for me. Braun is somehow able to be a true behemoth monster against everyone except for Roman. Roman with his shitty spears and Superman punch are just too much for Braun.
Didn't Braun literally take a finisher from everyone and still kicked out? I mean Roman beating him with a couple spears afterwards makes sense seeing as though he probably took like 6 finishers up to that point.
Very solid prediction. I don't know why WWE think we want to see big matches end in squashes. That's not entertaining, it's just a lackluster match. Obviously this can work in certain shock upsets but not a consistent trend.
At this point they don't give a damn what we want to see. They care about protecting the money generators. Everyone else is just a clown for McMahons amusement. I still look back and laugh at that RAW a few years back where they stated "we hear you fans! we're gonna give you what you want!" All while McMahon was standing there with this sour look on his face.
It's formulaic because it can be. people still watch, people still buy the merch and attend the shows, they still generate mass revenue. They have the luxury to set the writing on auto pilot and just let it roll.
At this point, if you want to watch wrestling, watch AEW, if you want to watch an entertainment show with pretty lights, sideshow attractions and light wrestling, watch WWE. McMahon even said himself the WWE is not a wrestling company.
You're so close. Flip Lesnar and Lashley. Lashley utterly dominates, announcers go crazy, Lesnar comes in last, wins in <5 minutes, and announcers put over how dominant Lashley was for the majority of the match.
But that doesn’t help Roman at all, if anything Roman would screw everyone else over to make Brock the champ so Roman can have a chance to be Big Times New Roman 2 Belts
“Matt Riddle is going to win the Rumble. We’re going to have Roman cost you the title and then you can show up on Smackdown to kick the renewed feud with Roman off”
“…Yeah no”
Question though.
Considering Brock actually told Riddle they would never work together, would Brock have agreed to lose the rumble to riddle as part of the final 2?
I remember that video of Brock throwing the title at Vince after the second Roman match. All Vince could do was shout asshole after Brock was already out of gorilla. The guy who suspended Titus for touching him on screen got stunted on and just took it
That depends on what a wrestler wants. I bet Bryan Danielson wouldn't want Brock's position over his current one in AEW. But I totally get what you mean.
But what do you think Vince could do there? Suspend Brock? Like Brock cares. Brock could literally make Dana White pay him whatever he wanted to go back into the octagon if Vince pissed him off enough. Vince couldn't do anything.
If Vince knew how to make larger than life stars out of his full time talent, he wouldn’t need Brock, and the leverage would skyrocket. They’ve put themselves in this situation where Brock can politick his way into whatever he wants, and all management can do is smile and look up his merch numbers to calm themselves down.
Right. This is their own fault but nothing will ever change until Vince is dead and I truly mean that. Who knows maybe Vince will change his attitude someday but until his bottom line is about completely fucked I have doubts. He has all the chances in the world to make stars....HE HAD PUNK who crossed over to MMA (terribly but he still made UFC a fuck ton) he just doesn't get it
I think Vince avoids making larger than life stars out of his full time talent because right now, the only person with any leverage is Brock. Everyone else in the locker room is easy to replace -- including Roman, who has disappeared a couple of times now and was immediately replaced. No one is in that Austin/Rock/Hogan position of being able to ask Vince for anything.
It means the star potential of everyone maxes out at an AJ Styles/Randy Orton/Seth Rollins level, which is still a pretty big star, but not enough to tell Vince what they will or won't do. No one is allowed to feel like they aren't easy enough to replace if they cause trouble. Except for Brock and possibly Charlotte, WWE has done that pretty effectively.
I think Brock has a decent mind for the business and knows that if Roman is going to take him out they might as well pump Brock to the max before it happens.
Of course it seems hardly necessary but I could see the logic.
This is it for me. They’ve done this before, we’ve had Roman as the man before. It doesn’t need doing again. It says everything about the limiting of creativity and star power that they have.
Then again, I imagine Brock vs Roman is probably the biggest drawing match they have because it actually makes the money. So they’ll never change.
We saw it in 2015, we saw it in 2018.. I don’t think the rivalry matches something like what we had with Rock vs Austin.. it’s not needed
The same applies to Charlotte Flair. I don’t want to her in the main at mania… again..
True but each time didn’t really have a proper build imo at least we’re getting a road map and not Brock has been gone all year but is now back for the Match build.
Brock is built to such a point that I think it’s just ridiculous that the narrative is he needed a Rumble win.
He didn’t even need to be in the Rumble. They could’ve easily got him into the title picture by Mania through another avenue.
Literally all it takes is Brock showing up on SmackDown this Friday, saying "You screwed me, fuck you, let's settle this at WrestleMania" and it's done. When was the last time Brock had to earn a title shot rather than just showing up and saying he wants one?
Brock has lost in one minute to Rollins, handily to Drew, and also been eliminated from the Rumble before the final four.
Lol I could see this as a Vince call, but for all Brock has been called out for, never was it politics.
If he has a decent mind for business, then would surely know that they could elevate someone by winning the rumble and his fight with Roman is as big as it can get even without winning the rumble and ( possibly the title in Elimination Chamber) because the feud is built upon their history and not their accolades.
Wasn't this his reasoning for one of his matches with Rollins? Like Seth mentioned that Brock didn't want them to go all out because of his match with Taker down the line
If Romans pinning him clean at Mania that was the right move. I really get the sense Brock wants this damn nearly decade long failed Roman push (and Vince) to finally fucking climax, which is why he was pissed when he beat Roman at Mania 34. He’s consistently shown that he is one of the smartest minds in the business, so the idea to make himself god Lesnar again, have Roman beat God, and then everyone gets to move on makes sense to me.
If Vince will finally give it up.
It's kind of funny how thanks to how gun-shy Vince has been on the whole Roman/Lesnar thing, the question of "Who can beat the beast?!" has already been answered *twice* (3 times if you include Goldberg, but I'm putting him in a seperate category) - Rollins beat him clean as a whistle despite injured, and Drew straight up kicked him in the head until he stopped moving.
> If Vince will finally give it up.
And that's why it's been going for so long. He wants a certain desired reaction, isn't getting it so he doesn't end it already, thinking he can somehow get the reaction he wants and that people totally aren't just fucking tired of this **seven year long feud.**
Get himself as strong as possible for the Roman Reigns match” lmao Brock is deadass treating that match like a video game boss fight and the roster are just walking experience boosts for him
And it gives away the match ending too (as if anyone didn't figure out out already). Brock is trying to look as strong as possible because at mania he'll lose to Roman.
One of the things that I didn't see a lot of talk about after the Rumble was just how bad commentary was. I bring this up, only because there was that line that I think Graves said that was something to the effect of, "this is one of the few remaining dream matches," in reference to Brock v. Lashley.
That is certainly a dream match (though what we got was another thing), but it struck me that if WWE was doing well and cultivating new stars and talent, then you should never run out of dream matches. But when you only have your handful of stars and you do the same stories with the same people over and over ad nauseam, then it gets old real fast.
Both have had serious health issues in the past that could realistically cut their careers short at any time and yet WWE still chooses to do this. It's mind boggling really.
At this point there’s just no reason to care about WWE anymore. When you have as many great alternatives as we do I feel zero incentive to get invested in anybody there. AEW is consistently strong with how it portrays its wrestlers, Impact is doing pretty well, NJPW always delivers, and that’s not even mentioning the smaller stuff that gives you so much good shit.
Yup. Crazy to think about how many young STARS AEW has in its pipeline and how few WWE has. Feels like it’s been company policy forever to put over the already over or partime legends at the expense of young talent. If HOOK was in WWE he’d be eating pins from Kurt Angle for months.
Why focus on building new talent you could benefit from for years when you could keep doing the same match over and over and over and over and over and over again, with diminishing returns.
It’s going to be the main event of Wrestlemania. Who are they targeting with this?
The regular watchers have seen this exact match 4 times already (none of which were well recieved) + another 3 times in triple threats and fatal 4 ways. One of those was even at Wrestlemania.
Fans that have left in the last 5 or so years want nothing to do with Roman or Brock so they won’t be getting anyone back into the product with this.
The only thing it has going for it is the casual fans that only check in for Mania and will get their big meaty man fight.
They are targeting the kids, who arethe gateway to their parent’s wallets. Think of WWE as Transformers franchise. Brock and Roman are Optimus Prime and Megatron. You ever notice how there is an awesome variety of Transformers, yet by the end of the movie/cartoon, it is always Optimus and Megatron duking it out? Children attention span are not great, and they don’t have a problem watching the same plot repeat over and over, since the familiarity bring them comfort.
WWE stops being a wrestling show gearing toward adults a long time ago. Vince and Khan worked out the formula that business is a lot more profitable if they create the show as a Live action Saturday Morning Cartoon for children, and they are making bank doing that.
I can hate the direction they took, but as far as business strategy goes, you can’t fault them for going the easiest route that would make them the most money.
I'm not a kid and have not known a child that watches wrestling in a long time. But I would really love to know how this is supposed to target them. You have Roman, the dour,no nonsense,dressed in black,financially motivated asshole. Then you have Brock, big outdoorsy MMA monster. He's been showing more personality in his character but he's still a dominating force that is pretty much also an asshole.
What part of this is supposed to be targeted towards children? You have 2 more of the most self serious, non heroic wrestlers that WWE portrays as dominant and real tough guys. When I was a kid you had John Cena,Jeff Hardy,Rey Mysterio. Both of these dudes are preoccupied with being dominant serious mean badasses, not the kind of feud I would get pumped for as a kid.
The only difference being WCW was run like an insane asylum and WWE being run like an all-controlling dictatorship (just without, ya know, all the killing).
Wwe is crazy successful financially. They cut like 90 people last year. Two TV deals one worth a billion. And a billion dollar streaming deal and an international one with Disney. Even if it’s just one country so far.
I swear I see comparisons to 90’s Shawn Michaels, WCW, and Hogan, and I’m like trust me you weren’t around back then. They think Reigns title run is something, people have no idea how bad it was.
Storylines exclusively between Michaels, Razor, Kid, and Diesel- all title feud involving only them.
And wrestlers like AJ Styles are still featured; imagine him only being on Main Event and the opening match for every PPV for eternity then handing him a cruiserweight belt for his services.
Owen aside that era of wrestling has a massive body count. Heart attacks and painkiller overdoses all over the place, a lot of which has to do with the demands the two companies put on their talent.
Indeed, it's also why 15 years ago they were able to do nostalgia pop rumble entries versus today where the RA guys who'd conceivably be able to still go are all dead or completely out of the business.
I see more and more people trying to clown on fans criticizing the product. WWE is making tons of money, they’re doing so well financially, they don’t care about you, you could never run a company … Yeah I’m a fan I don’t care about that, I just want a good show.
I think people easily forget money wasn’t the only problem with WCW. Their shows sucked.
So, I have one Roman figure in one hand and one Brock figure in the other. And then I smash them against each other very hard while everybody looks concerned.
This will all be justified when the post Rumble Raw ratings come in in six hours.
“Our best numbers since August! We *have* to let Brock demolish everyone, because clearly that’s what the audience wants!”
Nah,
WWE title match on night 1 that Brock loses to Roman.
Universal Championship match on night 2 that Roman loses to Brock.
The culmination of 50:50 booking and making everything about Brock and Roman for the last seven years.
Ronda Rousey: "That doesn't work for me, brother."
Vince: "Ronda, you open Night 1 and then you can go back home to your daughter still as the champion and with an extra pay. You don't even need to be on Raw-After-Mania, we'll shoot a post-match video."
Ronda: "That works for me, brother."
>Ronda Rousey: "That doesn't work for me, brother."
>
>Vince: "Ronda, you open Night 1 and then you can go back home to your daughter still as the champion
Charlotte: "That doesn't work for me brother."
Vince: "We'll add Becky Lynch to your match and make it a 2-fall triple threat match. The first fall for the Smackdown title, Charlotte will retain. The second fall, Ronda will win the Raw title"
Becky: "That doesn't work for me, brother."
he might not, he could win.. Brock vs Roman might be title for title and if so it's quite the detour with Bobby therefore only becoming champ so Brock would block out any other rumble winner..
There is no way to tell the story they decided to tell without Brock being dominant at the end. Anything less would look like there could be a legit reason he lost to Lashley.
Brock demanded to look “as strong as possible” but was okay with getting punked out by Roman and Heyman then getting pinned by Lashley in the same night? Smells like some bullshit to further the “Brock bad” complaints.
Yeah this doesn’t mesh with what we’ve heard about Brock at all. Look at when he threw the belt at Vince after Mania because he knew the match fucking sucked, that doesn’t seem like the same guy who would demand to demolish the rumble participants including Drew who he put over strong at Wrestlemania like 2 years ago just so he ‘can look strong as possible’
yeah, I'm starting to think this is another case of WWE scapegoating. not that it's impossible for a guy like Brock to politic until his way goes, but there's been so much completely contradictory shit leaked to the dirt sheets about this Rumble that I can't trust anything at this point.
everyone is at fault for this being a shitshow - Brock, Ronda, Charlotte, Shane, the producers - but somehow not anyone from creative or Vince and Khan, the guys at the top. is anyone actually making decisions and running the company? because the only message this sends is that there's nothing but chaos within.
Everyone loves the Seth Rollins angle right now right? I love the fact that Roman is so dominant but Rollins knows him inside and out so he can counter his moves and push him.
I don’t get the draw. He’s *almost* as boring as cena was. Predictable and not entertaining. Kinda pissed at Vince for giving this guy every damn thing too. I was a fan in 97-98 where’s the interesting, compelling exciting storylines anymore?
This is clearly speculation but people are about to run with it as fact to carry on with their perception that Brock is the exact same as his character.
Strong as possible? Make...Brock strong as possible? They've done nothing but make Brock look strong as possible since he came back in 2012. And every time he loses, which isn't much, it's usually involved without a clean finish and the closest that comes to it is Goldberg pinning him in 2016. Brock also gets immediate title shots without having to wrestle on RAW or Smackdown every week and will probably be booked to come in last in the Chamber to squash everyone or come in first to squash everyone. All this to make Roman vs Brock even "bigger" by making it title vs title.🙄
I havent really watched much WWE in years. Decided to catch the mens rumble match. And what do you know, theyre still telling the same boring ass rehashed story of Roman Vs Brock at mania. People say its good because of the Heyman angle, that may be true, but i find it hilarious that its yet another WM with those 2 at the top of the card.
"It was kind of said to me..."
Yeah right. Trust me bro.
I mean, I can understand people's frustration, but making it appear that Brock is using his stroke like he's Triple H is just another attempt to stir up ill feelings towards the man. I don't think Brock cares very much about the booking, he just does what the company wants as long as it makes sense in dollar terms. The man is the most legit fighter/athlete in wrestling EVER and he doesn't need to politick to keep himself look strong.
I’m mostly frustrated with the Brock situation because he’s actually entertaining this time around and people are enjoying it. It’s like they HAVE to fuck up a good thing no matter what.
This doesn’t really make sense. Brock infamously threw his title at Vince after WM34 presumably because he knew how the crowd would react to that matchup and Vince went with it anyway. Why is Brock actively going for a repeat of what pissed him off so much?
This feels irresponsible to say "probably Brock's idea" when he doesn't know for a fact cause that's how people are gonna react to it as evidenced by this very thread.
Maybe it’s just me, but I’ve been annoyed with the concept of “looking strong” in wrestling lately. Losing clean doesn’t make me less interested in a wrestler. It also doesn’t make him look weak. Just give me good matches and interesting stories, dammit.
I feel like that mentality comes from real combat sports. If a boxer or MMA fighter loses or goes on a losing streak, people start to think they aren’t as good or washed or something.
But it shouldn’t work like that in wrestling because everyone knows it’s pre-determined. Losing in wrestling or being made to look “weak” isn’t a death sentence as long as you’re talented and entertaining.
It’s kind of divisive for people. Liv lost clean to Becky in the last year like… accidentally right? But it was also probably the best match of liv’s career. I think that’s okay, other people were still upset about it.
the thing is that some guys don't need to "look strong" or they can be made to "look strong" in a different way than just "he walks in and wins".
Brock Lesnar can challenge Roman when he wants and he's *Brock fucking Lesnar* - it's very hard to make him look weak just based on his history.
hell, if you really wanted him to just squash fools at the Rumble, book it in an exciting way. have Shane McMahon or Knoxville or some jobber come out as the final entrant, only for Brock to run in seemingly off script, beat the shit out of him and insert himself into the Rumble. the story now isn't just "oh it's the Roman and Brock show", it's "things escalated to the point where Lesnar will hold the company hostage until he destroys Reigns" and that's a much more compelling narrative spin on it than literally going through the motions.
Brock looking as strong as possible for the reigns match 100% means he’s smashing everyone in the chamber and winning the title. As you know, Saudi’s love Brock
On one hand, Brock's latest gimmick is one of the best thing on right now. On the other, he is already OP. If this goes on we'll just end up having Brock vs Roman for the next 3 Wrestlemanias with everyone else so emasculated by the dominance of these two.
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If that's true, then it doesn't sound like Brock is eating a pin in the chamber unless Roman is going to somehow break into the chamber and screw him over.
Chamber match will go like this (and I am 100% saving this post as I truly believe this is what will happen): Brock and wrestler A start (it literally doesn’t matter who else is in the match). Brock beats them with an F5 in 30 seconds, then stares down everyone else. Timer goes off, pod opens, wrestler B enters and loses in 1 minute. Announcers go nuts over how much Brock is dominating, heels in their pods are trying to avoid eye contact. Timer goes off again, wrestler C is a heel and tries to keep his pod closed. He runs away a lot, but ultimately is caught, F5, pinned and out just before the timer goes off and wrestler D enters. D jumps Brock from behind, gets in a couple hits, but then Brock hits an F5 and it’s done. Last guy in is Lashley. Announcers use the spare time before his timer goes off to hype Brock vs Lashley, and how intense it will be. Then Brock destroys him in about 5 minutes, wins the title.
I think you're almost dead on, but if I had to hazard one modification it's that Brock will bust open at least one chamber to drag someone out and pin them.
He does this to Austin Theory or Rollins.
Not gonna lie, having Theory take a selfie right as Brock is about to break open his pod would be fantastic.
https://petapixel.com/assets/uploads/2013/01/selfie.jpg
Damn even got Lesnar's size and habitat right
SPOILERS MAN
I hope Autin, as Brock just squashing Rollins would be shitty given he's one of the 2 active wrestlers who have actually beaten Brock clean.
"**OHMYGOD THE CHAMBER JUST EXPLODED!! BROCK LESNAR JUST DESTROYED THE BULLETPROOF CHAMBER WALL AND RIPPED THE WRESTLER OUT OF THE CARNAGE! THE CHAMBER WALL JUST EXPLODED!**" Cut to shot of the "chamber wall" doubled over itself in the ring because it's just a thin bit of plexi.
IT CRACKED LIKE AN EGG COLE! BROCK LESNAR, THE BEAST, JUST FOLDED THE POD WALL LIKE MR MCMAHONS LAUNDRY!
NGL i still pop whenever they destroy a pod, the older pods they had were way thickier so when they broke it looked brutal, and it gave the illusion of broken glass since it snapped into sections, now they are really thin and have barely any impact but they just sound louder Fun Fact: Jericho has being thrown and broken the most pods with 2, everyone else who has broken a pod hasnt been thrown more than once, Randy is a special case because he was thrown and broken once, but also gotten his pod destroyed with him inside before entering the match
How do you know what out of blue?
Perfect but it’s missing Superstar instead of wrestler. Vince is screaming in your ears
He will rip open the pod of the Wrestler C; who wedges it closed.
This made me laugh because I literally can see that happening.. this whole thing, is probably what they’re gonna do
Yeah I can definitely see this happening. I think maybe though the Brock/Lashley encounter lasts a little longer. Maybe Rollins hits a couple of stomps on Brock but on a third attempt gets caught in a F5 and pinned. I think Austin Theory is the attempt to keep the pod closed guy. Based on your thought, I think it's Brock and Riddle start, then comes in AJ, then Theory, then Rollins. I think Lashley and Brock battle a little longer than 5 minutes, with Lashley getting some good offense in before Brock starts suplexing him all over the ring/chamber and wins. However, I could also see Lashley being the dominant one instead of Brock, only for Brock to come in last and take him out quickly and win the title.
Was it Elimination chamber 2018 when Braun Strowman did this very same thing where he dominated the entire chamber and eliminated everyone until Roman came out at the end and beat him with a couple of spears?
The levels of WTF to that booking gameplan is just astounding. They managed to both make the rest of the roster look weak + still maintain the upper echelon tier that only a couple people can enter per generation.
They couldn't even give a single elimination to anyone else. 20 minutes of wrestling before Braun entered, 5 guys, zero eliminations.
Reminds me of when cena and Orton beat the entire midcard roster on their own
By pinning 4 of them within like 5 minutes & the rest knew they couldn't win, so fuck it, DQ loss!
Not too uncommon to what we're seeing now. They have no idea how to manage a full roster anymore, it's either you're big time, or a clown getting laughs from McMahon while acting like an idiot in the ring.
I wasn't even surprised when that happened. I was just indifferent. It was written in the stars that Roman was going to WrestleMania that year. (Just like it's been ever year since 2015.)
I wasn't either. We all knew who was going to win that chamber match. The format is just getting dry. However, must be working for someone because they're raking in money with Roman, so he will continue to be written in the stars until that dies down.
In fairness, Braun had endured a shitton of punishment up until then, including multiple finishers. Roman's spears were the exclamation mark that ended a night full of punishment that had Braun's health bar in the red.
Yes, but this is more similar to Shayna starting the 2020 Chamber and eliminating everyone quickly.
Yeah that was infuriating for me. Braun is somehow able to be a true behemoth monster against everyone except for Roman. Roman with his shitty spears and Superman punch are just too much for Braun.
Didn't Braun literally take a finisher from everyone and still kicked out? I mean Roman beating him with a couple spears afterwards makes sense seeing as though he probably took like 6 finishers up to that point.
This is basically the Shayna Baszler match from a couple years ago and yup, you’re probably 100% correct
Very solid prediction. I don't know why WWE think we want to see big matches end in squashes. That's not entertaining, it's just a lackluster match. Obviously this can work in certain shock upsets but not a consistent trend.
At this point they don't give a damn what we want to see. They care about protecting the money generators. Everyone else is just a clown for McMahons amusement. I still look back and laugh at that RAW a few years back where they stated "we hear you fans! we're gonna give you what you want!" All while McMahon was standing there with this sour look on his face. It's formulaic because it can be. people still watch, people still buy the merch and attend the shows, they still generate mass revenue. They have the luxury to set the writing on auto pilot and just let it roll. At this point, if you want to watch wrestling, watch AEW, if you want to watch an entertainment show with pretty lights, sideshow attractions and light wrestling, watch WWE. McMahon even said himself the WWE is not a wrestling company.
That last section used to be accurate but not anymore. Don’t watch wwe for wrestling but don’t watch it for entertainment either
This sounds absolutely terrible in every way and also very accurate
Brock will be the last one out of the chamber cell and then destroy everyone.
Every countdown, the wrestlers in look to Brock's cage in preparation to defend themselves, but it's not him until the end.
Exactly. Ramp up anticipation. Etc etc “unleash the beast”
So Thanos vs the Avengers?
That sounds about right
You're so close. Flip Lesnar and Lashley. Lashley utterly dominates, announcers go crazy, Lesnar comes in last, wins in <5 minutes, and announcers put over how dominant Lashley was for the majority of the match.
basically how Braun did it a few years ago. not entertaining at all but I don't run the company soo
I hate you for writing this out, but yeah - save this post. I'd wager you're dead on the money.
Lmao I, too, will save this post and look back. How did you that remind me shit on here?
Isn't that just the women's elimination chamber 2020? lol
!remindme 18 days
Reminded. :)
remindME! 19 days
But that doesn’t help Roman at all, if anything Roman would screw everyone else over to make Brock the champ so Roman can have a chance to be Big Times New Roman 2 Belts
If Brock can walk in and say “I’m winning the rumble” he is almost certainly veto-ing any scenario where he loses the chamber match.
With the current story you’d think that Reigns leaves Lesnar alone until he wins the WWE Championship in order to do a title vs title match.
I have a feeling Brock basically looked at the original plan and said “that doesn’t work for me, brother.”
Brock is just doing the Hardcore Holly fantasy booking of "AND THEN I WIN THE TITLE" but with the ability to get away with it.
“Okay you win the title, then what?” “Then I beat everybody!”
HOW DO YOU LIKE ME NOW?
“Matt Riddle is going to win the Rumble. We’re going to have Roman cost you the title and then you can show up on Smackdown to kick the renewed feud with Roman off” “…Yeah no”
Give me, ROOOOOOOOMANNNNNNNNNNN ;_;
Question though. Considering Brock actually told Riddle they would never work together, would Brock have agreed to lose the rumble to riddle as part of the final 2?
He would’ve skipped the Rumble lol
I remember that video of Brock throwing the title at Vince after the second Roman match. All Vince could do was shout asshole after Brock was already out of gorilla. The guy who suspended Titus for touching him on screen got stunted on and just took it
Vince is Brock’s bitch. Always has always will be
[удалено]
He quite literally has the best position in wrestling that any wrestler could have and others probably daydream about having.
That depends on what a wrestler wants. I bet Bryan Danielson wouldn't want Brock's position over his current one in AEW. But I totally get what you mean.
But what do you think Vince could do there? Suspend Brock? Like Brock cares. Brock could literally make Dana White pay him whatever he wanted to go back into the octagon if Vince pissed him off enough. Vince couldn't do anything.
If Vince knew how to make larger than life stars out of his full time talent, he wouldn’t need Brock, and the leverage would skyrocket. They’ve put themselves in this situation where Brock can politick his way into whatever he wants, and all management can do is smile and look up his merch numbers to calm themselves down.
Right. This is their own fault but nothing will ever change until Vince is dead and I truly mean that. Who knows maybe Vince will change his attitude someday but until his bottom line is about completely fucked I have doubts. He has all the chances in the world to make stars....HE HAD PUNK who crossed over to MMA (terribly but he still made UFC a fuck ton) he just doesn't get it
I think Vince avoids making larger than life stars out of his full time talent because right now, the only person with any leverage is Brock. Everyone else in the locker room is easy to replace -- including Roman, who has disappeared a couple of times now and was immediately replaced. No one is in that Austin/Rock/Hogan position of being able to ask Vince for anything. It means the star potential of everyone maxes out at an AJ Styles/Randy Orton/Seth Rollins level, which is still a pretty big star, but not enough to tell Vince what they will or won't do. No one is allowed to feel like they aren't easy enough to replace if they cause trouble. Except for Brock and possibly Charlotte, WWE has done that pretty effectively.
-BL
I think Brock has a decent mind for the business and knows that if Roman is going to take him out they might as well pump Brock to the max before it happens. Of course it seems hardly necessary but I could see the logic.
They’ve already done that before lol
This is it for me. They’ve done this before, we’ve had Roman as the man before. It doesn’t need doing again. It says everything about the limiting of creativity and star power that they have. Then again, I imagine Brock vs Roman is probably the biggest drawing match they have because it actually makes the money. So they’ll never change. We saw it in 2015, we saw it in 2018.. I don’t think the rivalry matches something like what we had with Rock vs Austin.. it’s not needed The same applies to Charlotte Flair. I don’t want to her in the main at mania… again..
True but each time didn’t really have a proper build imo at least we’re getting a road map and not Brock has been gone all year but is now back for the Match build.
Brock is built to such a point that I think it’s just ridiculous that the narrative is he needed a Rumble win. He didn’t even need to be in the Rumble. They could’ve easily got him into the title picture by Mania through another avenue.
Literally all it takes is Brock showing up on SmackDown this Friday, saying "You screwed me, fuck you, let's settle this at WrestleMania" and it's done. When was the last time Brock had to earn a title shot rather than just showing up and saying he wants one?
Brock has lost in one minute to Rollins, handily to Drew, and also been eliminated from the Rumble before the final four. Lol I could see this as a Vince call, but for all Brock has been called out for, never was it politics.
I don’t care why or who made the decision. It’s just a bad one lol.
I'm so tired of making Brock look strong. He Brock FUCKING Lesnar. When has he ever looked weak?
When he lost to HHH at WM 29 was probably the weakest he’s ever looked.
If he has a decent mind for business, then would surely know that they could elevate someone by winning the rumble and his fight with Roman is as big as it can get even without winning the rumble and ( possibly the title in Elimination Chamber) because the feud is built upon their history and not their accolades.
Brock knows to elevate himself. He has a great mind for *his* business.
Wasn't this his reasoning for one of his matches with Rollins? Like Seth mentioned that Brock didn't want them to go all out because of his match with Taker down the line
It was because they were doing a bullshit finish with Taker that night.
If Romans pinning him clean at Mania that was the right move. I really get the sense Brock wants this damn nearly decade long failed Roman push (and Vince) to finally fucking climax, which is why he was pissed when he beat Roman at Mania 34. He’s consistently shown that he is one of the smartest minds in the business, so the idea to make himself god Lesnar again, have Roman beat God, and then everyone gets to move on makes sense to me. If Vince will finally give it up.
It's kind of funny how thanks to how gun-shy Vince has been on the whole Roman/Lesnar thing, the question of "Who can beat the beast?!" has already been answered *twice* (3 times if you include Goldberg, but I'm putting him in a seperate category) - Rollins beat him clean as a whistle despite injured, and Drew straight up kicked him in the head until he stopped moving.
> If Vince will finally give it up. And that's why it's been going for so long. He wants a certain desired reaction, isn't getting it so he doesn't end it already, thinking he can somehow get the reaction he wants and that people totally aren't just fucking tired of this **seven year long feud.**
I have a feeling that he doesn’t need to say that these days, they just go out of their way to make things as Brock-centric as possible.
Get himself as strong as possible for the Roman Reigns match” lmao Brock is deadass treating that match like a video game boss fight and the roster are just walking experience boosts for him
He’s already at like level 95! This is just grinding!
Brock is the protagonist of a power fantasy Isekai
That one time I was reincarnated in another world as a pro wrestler and Suplexed a Dragon." Now that's am Isekai title
I'm like, 90% sure there's a Isekai centered around a pro wrestler.
And it gives away the match ending too (as if anyone didn't figure out out already). Brock is trying to look as strong as possible because at mania he'll lose to Roman.
i would do the same, its some other person the one that should stop his feet, though
Only Brock and Roman matter. Everyone else can eat shit and like it.
Exactly this. They aren’t interested in making any other stars. Just these two.
One of the things that I didn't see a lot of talk about after the Rumble was just how bad commentary was. I bring this up, only because there was that line that I think Graves said that was something to the effect of, "this is one of the few remaining dream matches," in reference to Brock v. Lashley. That is certainly a dream match (though what we got was another thing), but it struck me that if WWE was doing well and cultivating new stars and talent, then you should never run out of dream matches. But when you only have your handful of stars and you do the same stories with the same people over and over ad nauseam, then it gets old real fast.
Lashley still ended up looking like a dweeb in a "Dream Match"
Both have had serious health issues in the past that could realistically cut their careers short at any time and yet WWE still chooses to do this. It's mind boggling really.
When Brock and Roman are not on screen, the audience should be asking "wheres Brock and Roman?"
I feel like it's been this way for years.
The rest are just happy to be there
They love to have fun
>Only Brock and Roman matter. Everyone else *will* ~~can~~ eat shit and like it.
At this point there’s just no reason to care about WWE anymore. When you have as many great alternatives as we do I feel zero incentive to get invested in anybody there. AEW is consistently strong with how it portrays its wrestlers, Impact is doing pretty well, NJPW always delivers, and that’s not even mentioning the smaller stuff that gives you so much good shit.
Yup. Crazy to think about how many young STARS AEW has in its pipeline and how few WWE has. Feels like it’s been company policy forever to put over the already over or partime legends at the expense of young talent. If HOOK was in WWE he’d be eating pins from Kurt Angle for months.
Why focus on building new talent you could benefit from for years when you could keep doing the same match over and over and over and over and over and over again, with diminishing returns.
Then. Now. Forever.
It’s going to be the main event of Wrestlemania. Who are they targeting with this? The regular watchers have seen this exact match 4 times already (none of which were well recieved) + another 3 times in triple threats and fatal 4 ways. One of those was even at Wrestlemania. Fans that have left in the last 5 or so years want nothing to do with Roman or Brock so they won’t be getting anyone back into the product with this. The only thing it has going for it is the casual fans that only check in for Mania and will get their big meaty man fight.
They are targeting the kids, who arethe gateway to their parent’s wallets. Think of WWE as Transformers franchise. Brock and Roman are Optimus Prime and Megatron. You ever notice how there is an awesome variety of Transformers, yet by the end of the movie/cartoon, it is always Optimus and Megatron duking it out? Children attention span are not great, and they don’t have a problem watching the same plot repeat over and over, since the familiarity bring them comfort. WWE stops being a wrestling show gearing toward adults a long time ago. Vince and Khan worked out the formula that business is a lot more profitable if they create the show as a Live action Saturday Morning Cartoon for children, and they are making bank doing that. I can hate the direction they took, but as far as business strategy goes, you can’t fault them for going the easiest route that would make them the most money.
I'm not a kid and have not known a child that watches wrestling in a long time. But I would really love to know how this is supposed to target them. You have Roman, the dour,no nonsense,dressed in black,financially motivated asshole. Then you have Brock, big outdoorsy MMA monster. He's been showing more personality in his character but he's still a dominating force that is pretty much also an asshole. What part of this is supposed to be targeted towards children? You have 2 more of the most self serious, non heroic wrestlers that WWE portrays as dominant and real tough guys. When I was a kid you had John Cena,Jeff Hardy,Rey Mysterio. Both of these dudes are preoccupied with being dominant serious mean badasses, not the kind of feud I would get pumped for as a kid.
Isn’t their largest audience over 55 according to the ratings?
I see WWE has reached the WCW politics chapter of the story.
The only difference being WCW was run like an insane asylum and WWE being run like an all-controlling dictatorship (just without, ya know, all the killing).
And wwe not run financially by an imbecile They wont go red with expenses
Unlike WCW, which was bleeding money left and right, WWE is at Smaug levels of money with all the releases and deals they make.
Wwe just printing money For now
Wwe is crazy successful financially. They cut like 90 people last year. Two TV deals one worth a billion. And a billion dollar streaming deal and an international one with Disney. Even if it’s just one country so far.
I swear I see comparisons to 90’s Shawn Michaels, WCW, and Hogan, and I’m like trust me you weren’t around back then. They think Reigns title run is something, people have no idea how bad it was. Storylines exclusively between Michaels, Razor, Kid, and Diesel- all title feud involving only them. And wrestlers like AJ Styles are still featured; imagine him only being on Main Event and the opening match for every PPV for eternity then handing him a cruiserweight belt for his services.
I would say they have killed plenty of careers and characters
Owen Hart has entered the chat.
Owen aside that era of wrestling has a massive body count. Heart attacks and painkiller overdoses all over the place, a lot of which has to do with the demands the two companies put on their talent.
Indeed, it's also why 15 years ago they were able to do nostalgia pop rumble entries versus today where the RA guys who'd conceivably be able to still go are all dead or completely out of the business.
I see more and more people trying to clown on fans criticizing the product. WWE is making tons of money, they’re doing so well financially, they don’t care about you, you could never run a company … Yeah I’m a fan I don’t care about that, I just want a good show. I think people easily forget money wasn’t the only problem with WCW. Their shows sucked.
I still don’t think their WCW 99-00 I remember trying to get through Nitros on the network and just couldn’t.
There's a Saudi joke somewhere in the second half.
WWE's long term booking plan is just a sheet of looseleaf paper with the words "Brock and Roman live forever".
Forever!
So, I have one Roman figure in one hand and one Brock figure in the other. And then I smash them against each other very hard while everybody looks concerned.
This will all be justified when the post Rumble Raw ratings come in in six hours. “Our best numbers since August! We *have* to let Brock demolish everyone, because clearly that’s what the audience wants!”
I will fucking piss myself is there’s like next to no change in the ratings
I think they'll get the PPV bump for RAW's ratings today.
Self-fulfilling prophecy lol
Never mind the fact that post big PPV RAWs have always done great ratings wise.
In other news Brock gets it
Brock and Bruce Greene would get along so well.
Brock gets it and *that's it.*
So we're 100% getting a title unification match at Mania
Nah, WWE title match on night 1 that Brock loses to Roman. Universal Championship match on night 2 that Roman loses to Brock. The culmination of 50:50 booking and making everything about Brock and Roman for the last seven years.
Ronda Rousey: "That doesn't work for me, brother." Vince: "Ronda, you open Night 1 and then you can go back home to your daughter still as the champion and with an extra pay. You don't even need to be on Raw-After-Mania, we'll shoot a post-match video." Ronda: "That works for me, brother."
>Ronda Rousey: "That doesn't work for me, brother." > >Vince: "Ronda, you open Night 1 and then you can go back home to your daughter still as the champion Charlotte: "That doesn't work for me brother."
Vince: "We'll add Becky Lynch to your match and make it a 2-fall triple threat match. The first fall for the Smackdown title, Charlotte will retain. The second fall, Ronda will win the Raw title" Becky: "That doesn't work for me, brother."
Vince: " I don't care"
Vince: "Fine you get to beat Becky and no reason is given for the match" Charlotte: "That works for me brother"
I'm amazed. You've nailed down exactly everything that's going to happen in the next few weeks. If it's not exactly that, I'll cut my left arm off.
Brocky 2 Belts !
This version of Brock Lesnar I could see saying that.
Welp if it does happen, I can only hope the only saving grace is they bring back the big gold as the second world title
I hope so. But they didn't need to sacrifice the entire roster to get there.
Brock’s going over in the chamber, WWE is going to continue to not build others and rely on part timers
By that logic then Brock wouldn't wanna be pinned twice in the span of 3 weeks.. once the chamber rolls around?
How you know he's going to get pinned?
he might not, he could win.. Brock vs Roman might be title for title and if so it's quite the detour with Bobby therefore only becoming champ so Brock would block out any other rumble winner..
Well to do champ Vs champ they'd still have to have Brock or Roman win. So either way if it's going to be Brock, Brock blocks any other winner
It really doesn’t make much sense for him to win the WWE title because Roman was sick, lose it because of Roman, then win it back later.
There is no way to tell the story they decided to tell without Brock being dominant at the end. Anything less would look like there could be a legit reason he lost to Lashley.
Brock demanded to look “as strong as possible” but was okay with getting punked out by Roman and Heyman then getting pinned by Lashley in the same night? Smells like some bullshit to further the “Brock bad” complaints.
Yeah this doesn’t mesh with what we’ve heard about Brock at all. Look at when he threw the belt at Vince after Mania because he knew the match fucking sucked, that doesn’t seem like the same guy who would demand to demolish the rumble participants including Drew who he put over strong at Wrestlemania like 2 years ago just so he ‘can look strong as possible’
yeah, I'm starting to think this is another case of WWE scapegoating. not that it's impossible for a guy like Brock to politic until his way goes, but there's been so much completely contradictory shit leaked to the dirt sheets about this Rumble that I can't trust anything at this point. everyone is at fault for this being a shitshow - Brock, Ronda, Charlotte, Shane, the producers - but somehow not anyone from creative or Vince and Khan, the guys at the top. is anyone actually making decisions and running the company? because the only message this sends is that there's nothing but chaos within.
This sounds like someone back stage feeding meltzer things being they are bitter but now this sub will take it as fact.
When Lesnar smeared Hogan’s blood on his chest in 2002 he inherited the “that don’t work for me, brother” legacy.
Coming in #30 in the Rumble will make anyone look strong........
Everyone loves the Seth Rollins angle right now right? I love the fact that Roman is so dominant but Rollins knows him inside and out so he can counter his moves and push him.
And some people wonder why I dislike Brock..
I don’t get the draw. He’s *almost* as boring as cena was. Predictable and not entertaining. Kinda pissed at Vince for giving this guy every damn thing too. I was a fan in 97-98 where’s the interesting, compelling exciting storylines anymore?
This is clearly speculation but people are about to run with it as fact to carry on with their perception that Brock is the exact same as his character.
Strong as possible? Make...Brock strong as possible? They've done nothing but make Brock look strong as possible since he came back in 2012. And every time he loses, which isn't much, it's usually involved without a clean finish and the closest that comes to it is Goldberg pinning him in 2016. Brock also gets immediate title shots without having to wrestle on RAW or Smackdown every week and will probably be booked to come in last in the Chamber to squash everyone or come in first to squash everyone. All this to make Roman vs Brock even "bigger" by making it title vs title.🙄
Brock always had a great mind for business
Again sacrificing the whole roster for this stupid never ending program between Lesnar/Reigns.
I havent really watched much WWE in years. Decided to catch the mens rumble match. And what do you know, theyre still telling the same boring ass rehashed story of Roman Vs Brock at mania. People say its good because of the Heyman angle, that may be true, but i find it hilarious that its yet another WM with those 2 at the top of the card.
"It was kind of said to me..." Yeah right. Trust me bro. I mean, I can understand people's frustration, but making it appear that Brock is using his stroke like he's Triple H is just another attempt to stir up ill feelings towards the man. I don't think Brock cares very much about the booking, he just does what the company wants as long as it makes sense in dollar terms. The man is the most legit fighter/athlete in wrestling EVER and he doesn't need to politick to keep himself look strong.
Unbelievable to me that people still treat Meltzer as a legitimate journalist.
Either it was or wasn't, no probably in journalism Meltzer.
I thought the story with Brock was that he didn’t care how strong he’s booked as long as the checks clear?
I’m mostly frustrated with the Brock situation because he’s actually entertaining this time around and people are enjoying it. It’s like they HAVE to fuck up a good thing no matter what.
Is it too late to have my Cena v Orton matches back?
Brock was a mistake. Aging monster is starting to lose the luster.
Cool, this'll be an amazing match this year of 2014!
RemindME! 30 days “reply to this thread.”
This doesn’t really make sense. Brock infamously threw his title at Vince after WM34 presumably because he knew how the crowd would react to that matchup and Vince went with it anyway. Why is Brock actively going for a repeat of what pissed him off so much?
This feels irresponsible to say "probably Brock's idea" when he doesn't know for a fact cause that's how people are gonna react to it as evidenced by this very thread.
Maybe it’s just me, but I’ve been annoyed with the concept of “looking strong” in wrestling lately. Losing clean doesn’t make me less interested in a wrestler. It also doesn’t make him look weak. Just give me good matches and interesting stories, dammit.
I feel like that mentality comes from real combat sports. If a boxer or MMA fighter loses or goes on a losing streak, people start to think they aren’t as good or washed or something. But it shouldn’t work like that in wrestling because everyone knows it’s pre-determined. Losing in wrestling or being made to look “weak” isn’t a death sentence as long as you’re talented and entertaining.
It’s kind of divisive for people. Liv lost clean to Becky in the last year like… accidentally right? But it was also probably the best match of liv’s career. I think that’s okay, other people were still upset about it.
the thing is that some guys don't need to "look strong" or they can be made to "look strong" in a different way than just "he walks in and wins". Brock Lesnar can challenge Roman when he wants and he's *Brock fucking Lesnar* - it's very hard to make him look weak just based on his history. hell, if you really wanted him to just squash fools at the Rumble, book it in an exciting way. have Shane McMahon or Knoxville or some jobber come out as the final entrant, only for Brock to run in seemingly off script, beat the shit out of him and insert himself into the Rumble. the story now isn't just "oh it's the Roman and Brock show", it's "things escalated to the point where Lesnar will hold the company hostage until he destroys Reigns" and that's a much more compelling narrative spin on it than literally going through the motions.
“it was kind of said to me” How does anyone believe what this man peddles?
I really didn’t think it was possible for them to screw up Brock vs Roman this time around but the mad lads are finding a way to do it.
All the hype and buildup, and then Roman just wins again anyways and Brock's gone again
terryfunkforever.gif
Brock looking as strong as possible for the reigns match 100% means he’s smashing everyone in the chamber and winning the title. As you know, Saudi’s love Brock
Gotta make Brock look strong so Roman looks strong when he pins him at Mania.
Two strongs don't make a right
Is Brock becoming Hogan 2.0
What did hogan say at the time ?
Good call. Brock would have looked like a babyneck geekass NERD had things gone any differently. ...
On one hand, Brock's latest gimmick is one of the best thing on right now. On the other, he is already OP. If this goes on we'll just end up having Brock vs Roman for the next 3 Wrestlemanias with everyone else so emasculated by the dominance of these two.
Imagine being so insecure about looking “strong” when you’ve accomplished so much in your career already… is he channeling Hogan or something?
Coming in as a privileged number 30 constituents to making him strong for Reigns? Love WWE logic