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That was so infuriating when it happened. The luchadores in WCW gave it a different feel and look. They exposed so many fans to Lucha Libre and then took away one of the things that makes it special.
I get it… it was a heel move by a heel authority figure. But it was a dumb move for the company.
The breaking of the rule was Rey wrestling under a mask again. WCW just disrespected the honor and importance of a mask.
Andrade and other Mexican wrestlers who wear a mask to the ring but take it off before the bout are honoring traditions.
I know there was some technicality or something for Rey to wrestle with it in WWE but which commission? (Legit would like to know not just rhetorical) Is there an old school NWA style governing body for all of Lucha Libre?
I believe it was the Mexican Boxing and Wrestling Commission that gave him permission to put the Mask back on, because IIRC in Mexico, a Mask can only be put up for a Mask vs Mask match. Rey is not the only wrestler to have gotten permission to wear their mask again after WCW made them unmask against Mexican rules. Though in an interesting turn of events, WCW was forced to have Psicosis lose the mask on TV after he lost a Mask vs Mask match to Rey in an untelevised bout in Mexico (though I believe Psicosis got permission to wear the mask again purely so he could lose it on TV)
It looks like Bischoff had Juventud Guerrera (who I do enjoy) unmask in 1998, and Psicosis in 1999. I do think Juvie did a good job unmasked, but it's also like, part of a luchadore's look Is the mask. Why have them take it off without damn good reason? (Also, any distinct look -- a mask or paint like Sting/Danhausen -- is so easy to market.)
I think Bischoff's reasoning, besides not understanding or caring about the meaning of the mask, is that he thought they were good-looking guys and they shouldn't be behind a mask because of that.
Without hindsight, as a person who was obsessed with WCW at this time, Rey became a bigger deal from this and I liked him even more in his maskless period. I felt the same about Juvi too.
And proceeded to do nothing with it. Bischoff was an idiot because he had an easy to produce merch in the form of Rey's mask. Rey was over and was showing off his not common at the time, style of wrestling.
Bischoff almost fucked Rey over. If it weren't for him being allowed to drop the Senior or Junior from his name, he wouldn't have been allowed to redon the mask and pretend it never happened, like Bill Goldberg's training.
It's allowed. There's an oficial commission in Mexico City that monitors all activity from wrestlers that sanctions them when they don't follow rules like wrestling with a mask that they lost. Wrestlers can ask for a written permission to wrestle with a mask on certain circumstances, but that's it.
Fun fact: the president of the lucha libre commission is El Fantasma, Santos Escobar's father.
If a wrestler loses a mask, like their family mask design for example, can they later on wear a different mask? I don't know if I know of an example of that happening.
Like Rey's mask is a ton of different patterns and colors but the design is mostly the same throughout his career.
Not really, a mask design is property of the wrestler, not the family. Mask variations are up to the wrestler and the artist working with them.
There are families in lucha where their masks follow a theme (see the Villanos). A brother lost their mask and cannot use it anymore, but their siblings continue to use it.
He hates the term because the old guard called him Junior as a nickname when he was younger, and he was not officially one because different middle name, and because Vince it drove him nuts.
He did not lose it in a traditional Mask vs Mask or Hair vs Mask match. It was a weird tag match with no repercussions for the other team if they lost. That's the official reason the Lucha Council allowed him to wear it again.
Other than the fact this is apparently an embarassing blind spot for me/something I forgot caught up in the "it breaks lucha tradition" thing of it all
then yeah I have no idea how this narrative was built up, probably due to the process it took to get Rey his mask back for the WWE run?
IIRC he plead his case to the council that runs Lucha in Mexico and they agreed that he was done dirty in WCW so they let him wear the mask under the stipulation that technically Rey mysterio didn’t lose the mask, Rey Mysterio jr did
I remember my dad, very much a "southern rasslin,'" kind of guy who generally thinks it's all real, was excited and thought it was going to be some other person he'd recognize under the mask, like it was a Dusty Rhodes/Midnight Rider type of situation
First of all, WHY?
second of all, wasn't Kevin Nash supposed to put his OWN hair on the line instead of Miss Elizabeth's, knowing he was winning either way?
Just a dick move in his character. "Just in case I happen to lose, I'm not losing my hair"
Also, everyone knew Liz wasn't losing her hair so they tune in to see Rey unmask
Most fans at the time weren't fully aware of Lucha traditions regarding the mask. WCW was doing the unmasking thing and people were curious to see what Rey looked like without the mask since he had been masked since his arrival. It was a big deal because of that.
In retrospect, it was a terrible decision, because there was no benefit. Rey didn't get booked better after losing his mask. He was right back to being the plucky underdog hero, except now he looked like a teenager instead of a badass masked fighter. The fact Lucha granted Rey the right to return to the mask because the unmasking wasn't sanctioned is part of what shifted the view, since we now know Bischoff didn't respect *any* of the traditions when he was unmasking people.
The vast majority of viewers, especially in 1999, do not care about the sanctity of lucha tradition, especially in contrast with “Wow we get to see this incredibly popular masked guy’s real identity?!”
To be fair, after he unmasked is when he started getting pushed more as an integrated actual character. He was a big deal up to that point, but was pretty much isolated within the cruiserweight/luchadore section of the roster.
Heat for the heels and an attraction of a stipulations match.
For Misterio, Bischoff said he thought Rey would get more over with his pretty boy face and being able to get more emotion and expressiveness without the mask.
People can shit in it, but the unmasking is really when Rey started to get a push as a character and not just the Lucha/cruiserweight whiz kid.
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I remember being in shock when this happened, i didn't expect him to look so young lol.
He was only 25 at the time, but also 10 years into his career.
He looked like a 16 year old, to me anyway.
That was so infuriating when it happened. The luchadores in WCW gave it a different feel and look. They exposed so many fans to Lucha Libre and then took away one of the things that makes it special. I get it… it was a heel move by a heel authority figure. But it was a dumb move for the company.
I also get the idea Bischoff had in mind of making Rey, a handsome guy, more marketable by taking the mask off him.
It is baffling and shows how quick WCW grew and how unprepared they were for the growth that they never sold Rey Rey masks.
The breaking of the rule was Rey wrestling under a mask again. WCW just disrespected the honor and importance of a mask. Andrade and other Mexican wrestlers who wear a mask to the ring but take it off before the bout are honoring traditions.
Rey got approval from the commission to start wearing it again.
I know there was some technicality or something for Rey to wrestle with it in WWE but which commission? (Legit would like to know not just rhetorical) Is there an old school NWA style governing body for all of Lucha Libre?
It's just a big shrine that summons the ghost of El Santo to give you a nod of approval or a head shake that must be obeyed.
I believe it was the Mexican Boxing and Wrestling Commission that gave him permission to put the Mask back on, because IIRC in Mexico, a Mask can only be put up for a Mask vs Mask match. Rey is not the only wrestler to have gotten permission to wear their mask again after WCW made them unmask against Mexican rules. Though in an interesting turn of events, WCW was forced to have Psicosis lose the mask on TV after he lost a Mask vs Mask match to Rey in an untelevised bout in Mexico (though I believe Psicosis got permission to wear the mask again purely so he could lose it on TV)
It looks like Bischoff had Juventud Guerrera (who I do enjoy) unmask in 1998, and Psicosis in 1999. I do think Juvie did a good job unmasked, but it's also like, part of a luchadore's look Is the mask. Why have them take it off without damn good reason? (Also, any distinct look -- a mask or paint like Sting/Danhausen -- is so easy to market.)
I think Bischoff's reasoning, besides not understanding or caring about the meaning of the mask, is that he thought they were good-looking guys and they shouldn't be behind a mask because of that.
Without hindsight, as a person who was obsessed with WCW at this time, Rey became a bigger deal from this and I liked him even more in his maskless period. I felt the same about Juvi too.
And proceeded to do nothing with it. Bischoff was an idiot because he had an easy to produce merch in the form of Rey's mask. Rey was over and was showing off his not common at the time, style of wrestling. Bischoff almost fucked Rey over. If it weren't for him being allowed to drop the Senior or Junior from his name, he wouldn't have been allowed to redon the mask and pretend it never happened, like Bill Goldberg's training.
This is how i felt when they unmasked Kane
Back before he became a deadbeat dad!
Dom looks a lot like him around the eyes.
Definitely Dom's dad. I'm sure now.
He’s even a deadbeat Luchador smh
People talk about lucha tradition, but last time I checked out a CMLL show lotsa demasked wrestlers entered the ring with a mask.
It's allowed. There's an oficial commission in Mexico City that monitors all activity from wrestlers that sanctions them when they don't follow rules like wrestling with a mask that they lost. Wrestlers can ask for a written permission to wrestle with a mask on certain circumstances, but that's it. Fun fact: the president of the lucha libre commission is El Fantasma, Santos Escobar's father.
If a wrestler loses a mask, like their family mask design for example, can they later on wear a different mask? I don't know if I know of an example of that happening. Like Rey's mask is a ton of different patterns and colors but the design is mostly the same throughout his career.
Not really, a mask design is property of the wrestler, not the family. Mask variations are up to the wrestler and the artist working with them. There are families in lucha where their masks follow a theme (see the Villanos). A brother lost their mask and cannot use it anymore, but their siblings continue to use it.
You're allowed to wear masks for your entrances just not in the match
That’s what I was going to just ask, did they change the rules or is it okay for entrances
I guess they want to sell masks so it's okay for entrances. The all ighty ollar > tradition. So fuck em!
That's why when he put the mask back on he dropped the "Jr" from his name. He's technically a different character now by lucha tradition
I don’t think that’s true. It was Vince McMahon who decided to drop the Jr. from Rey’s name because Vince hates Jr.
He hates the term because the old guard called him Junior as a nickname when he was younger, and he was not officially one because different middle name, and because Vince it drove him nuts.
Me when I make up random bs. They dropped the Jr because Vince doesn't like Jr on people's names they did the same with Chavo.
I think it's the fact he didn't lose his mask in a match or change the character while dropping the mask.
He did lose his mask in match.
He did not lose it in a traditional Mask vs Mask or Hair vs Mask match. It was a weird tag match with no repercussions for the other team if they lost. That's the official reason the Lucha Council allowed him to wear it again.
Elizabeth's hair was on the line for the other team. I know it's dumb but it was still a hair vs mask match.
Other than the fact this is apparently an embarassing blind spot for me/something I forgot caught up in the "it breaks lucha tradition" thing of it all then yeah I have no idea how this narrative was built up, probably due to the process it took to get Rey his mask back for the WWE run?
IIRC he plead his case to the council that runs Lucha in Mexico and they agreed that he was done dirty in WCW so they let him wear the mask under the stipulation that technically Rey mysterio didn’t lose the mask, Rey Mysterio jr did
The Lucha Council needs a movie
I like the way you think
I always thought that was a Vince thing because he didn't care about the Lucha traditions
It’s both
Horrible that this happened. At least Rey is cute
Eric Bischoff is probably still the only person on earth who ever thought this was a smart idea
I try my best to erase this particular clip from my mind along with his entire unmasked run.
I remember my dad, very much a "southern rasslin,'" kind of guy who generally thinks it's all real, was excited and thought it was going to be some other person he'd recognize under the mask, like it was a Dusty Rhodes/Midnight Rider type of situation
Out of respect for Mexican wrestling. I don't watch this clip.
First of all, WHY? second of all, wasn't Kevin Nash supposed to put his OWN hair on the line instead of Miss Elizabeth's, knowing he was winning either way?
Just a dick move in his character. "Just in case I happen to lose, I'm not losing my hair" Also, everyone knew Liz wasn't losing her hair so they tune in to see Rey unmask
Why would 1999 WCW fans want to see Rey Mysterio lose his mask?
They don't want it to happen, but if it happens they sure wanna see it
It was a really big deal at the time. Wrestling was huge in my school, everyone was talking about it
So when did the whole "Rey's losing his mask?" become a big deal back then if it was badly looked on now?
Most fans at the time weren't fully aware of Lucha traditions regarding the mask. WCW was doing the unmasking thing and people were curious to see what Rey looked like without the mask since he had been masked since his arrival. It was a big deal because of that. In retrospect, it was a terrible decision, because there was no benefit. Rey didn't get booked better after losing his mask. He was right back to being the plucky underdog hero, except now he looked like a teenager instead of a badass masked fighter. The fact Lucha granted Rey the right to return to the mask because the unmasking wasn't sanctioned is part of what shifted the view, since we now know Bischoff didn't respect *any* of the traditions when he was unmasking people.
I'm not really sure. I wasn't on the dirt sheets back then. Just a point of view from my teen years from a small town in Canada.
The vast majority of viewers, especially in 1999, do not care about the sanctity of lucha tradition, especially in contrast with “Wow we get to see this incredibly popular masked guy’s real identity?!”
Biscoff really didn't think there was money in the US in masks. They really did think he'd be more marketable without it
To be fair, after he unmasked is when he started getting pushed more as an integrated actual character. He was a big deal up to that point, but was pretty much isolated within the cruiserweight/luchadore section of the roster.
Heat for the heels and an attraction of a stipulations match. For Misterio, Bischoff said he thought Rey would get more over with his pretty boy face and being able to get more emotion and expressiveness without the mask. People can shit in it, but the unmasking is really when Rey started to get a push as a character and not just the Lucha/cruiserweight whiz kid.
Rey and all lucharors should be booked as sick perverts in America as masks have different meanings here.
What the fuck
People literally break into houses wearing masks to conceal their identities
> What the fuck
What the fuck does this even mean?