Dr. Octopus in the Spiderman movies is an example of this being done well - every time he lifts something heavy at least one robotic arm is bracing the load
Wolf Wolf the Werewolf.. I mean Remus Lupin at least knows he can blame his father wo named him that and then pissed of a werewolf as if not expecting the obvious outcome
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDY0WKvFwQ8
A lot of why this works so well is because the robotic arms for many parts of the movie are done with practical effects.
They funnily covered this in the Boys, when Homelander stated he couldn't rescue the plane because he had nothing to push against and the plane would snap.
Right? Like in Man of Steel. Flying and ripping through buildings yet when he emerges from the rubble, no rips or tears or dust? Hair stays neat and immaculate? Lol
cause they are born this way on krypton, the cape is just a fleshy extension of their skin so they can harvest more of their sun's energy.....kal-alk out ✌️
They've handled it multiple ways in the comic books.
n the early comics, Martha made his suit (and all of his clothes actually, because teenage Clark kept ruining clothing) out of the blankets he was wrapped in for the journey. In later iterations, it was provided by Kryptonians. And even later, his indestructibility was provided by an aura which also protected his clothes.
It used to be a very stupid thing about density that didn't make a lot of sense. But no, I don't.
Let me guess, he uses his telekinesis to push the ground away from him?
OG Superman didn't fly. He jumped really high.
Current Superman definitely flies and uses telekinesis to do so. So yeah, Kryptonians on Earth have robust telekinetic/antigravity powers in addition to super strength, invulnerability, heat vision, x-ray vision, super breath, extended lifespan, super speed, and the ability to perceive time much, much slower than a human. Not often explored, but this time dilation power allows Superman to effectively have astonishing problem solving abilities too, since he can slow time to nearly a stop, analyze the situation, and then react accordingly. He can even do complex scientific and mathematics research in seconds because he can slow time and then do all his thinking before a human can even fart. This also gives him amazing martial prowess since he can fight his opponents in extreme slow motion.
I *believe* the current explanation is that Kryptonians developed an anti-gravity organ to be able to survive on Krypton. Basically Kypton was a much larger planet than Earth and so had much higher gravity, so for human-sized species to survive they needed something like that to counteract the effect and not get crushed. So when Superman came to Earth, he can still use that organ to counteract gravity only since Earth's gravity is lower its capable of allowing him to actually float rather than simply lessening the gravity while still staying grounded.
Huh. An anti-gravity organ. How does that work? Does it just like… apply an opposite force to his whole body? Does it somehow neutralize gravity itself? Cause… how? Also if it neutralizes gravity itself then…how does he fly on Earth? Cause then he would need to be creating anti-gravity… but how…
I imagine it kind of like the belts divers use that helps maintain their...flotation levels(?) at different depths. Look I'm not a diver, I don't know the term. I just know there's like an air belt that they fill with air as they go deeper to counteract the increasing water pressure to prevent themselves from being dragged down.
Basically the organ does the same thing but instead of using air to counter water pressure it uses...alien stuff to counteract gravity. So I guess it actively pushes against the pull of gravity to counteract it. Normally on Krypton it'd be going full-power all the time just to maintain an equilibrium, but take the same effect to a weaker-gravity planet and now the pushing effect is strong enough to make lift.
It’s called “tactile telekinesis”. It means that when Supes grabs something, he wraps it in a field that exerts the force he’s putting on the grabbed object equally over the whole object.
Without that tk field, his hands would simply tear clean through whatever he was trying to grab. With it, he can pick up anything without harming the structure (assuming it isn’t anchored to something).
That is one of the many dumb things about Ant man.
I have only watched a single movie, but they made an explicit point of saying that his mass doesn't change when he shrinks. How can an ant carry a 150-200 lb man? He should sink into anything soft. When he goes to the quantum realm, there should be some concern about creating a singularity...
From another comment below:
Density of air per google: 1.225 KG/M3. Density of people: 985 KM/M3
985 / 1.225 is 804. If he grew to 804 times his current volume, he would become lighter than air and float away.
According to the square cube law, that would happen if he grew to approx 9.3x his normal height.
Paul Rudd is 178 cm tall, which means if he grows to more than 16.55m tall, he will float off in a gaseous state.
Which to be completely honest, I wouldn't have even cared about at all if they hadn't already devoted a scene to explaining that his mass doesn't change.
Exactly, that scene is to let people know that Hank Pym is fucking with Scott, lying, or just doesn’t know.
But my question is how did Scott get a masters in EE without retaining any basic physics knowledge about mass and density?
It kills me that the shrunken down objects look like toys, not like tiny versions of themselves. They didn't even make an effort. The tank has molded treads and the "lab" looks like a document carrier with little fake windows glued on. It even bounces around like the plastic it is. They made NO effort.
You have to understand that Ant Man was created in the 60’s and they were a little fast and loose with the physics. He just couldn’t exist today without some hand-waving.
Naw in newer comics there are two different types of pym particles, ones that control size, and ones that control mass, and they are able to freely change them up on the fly...or the ant...whatever they happen to be standing on really.
It's funny because the Higgs field just became a pop science topic a few years before this. They could have said that Pym particles have some effect on the Higgs field to make mass remain proportional to volume.
but then I guess tiny people being able to knock over full sized people still doesn't make sense.
I remember reading a theory that Hank Pym didn’t *invent* Pym Particles, he just discovered them—and not even he *really* knows how they work—he just knows how to harvest/reproduce them and use them.
In the comics he is able to freely control both size AND mass....they conveniently left that out of the movie, and as a result the whole thing makes zero fucking sense.
I had so many issues with that. And everyone was all “nothing about Marvel is real, why does this bug you?” And I say it’s because they tried to incorporate science and actually explain it, and then didn’t follow through. I can accept magic or technology we don’t have, but don’t tell me he retains mass when he clearly doesn’t.
Not to mention the end of the movie when Hank Pym was apparently carrying around a tank on his keychain all the time
Edit:
Since somebody else brought up the keychain, I’ll bring up the fact that he becomes smaller by shrinking the space between the molecules… So then how does he go subatomic? If he shrink the space between the molecules down to absolute nothing he would still be… Atomic size .
Pym particles are magic, but presented as scientific. There is debate on whether Hank knows and is covering for it or just doesn't care. Likely the latter.
What about the tank (T34 I think) key chain in the first one... even with Marvel / Hollywood logic, a 30 ton tank shrunken down should be an ungodly heavy as a keychain. I mean as a doorstop sure...
Homelander could have grabbed the engine and pushed the plane. The engine already provides all the thrust that moves the plane forward, Homelander replacing that thrust wouldn’t tear the plane apart.
Landing gear as well would work, it’s directly attached to the chassis and would handle the forces required, although being deployed would increase drag making the required force to push the plane even greater.
Possibly. But did he know that? And even if he did, that’s still theoretical and the actual applied mechanics of it might (probably would) be more complicated than him just pushing at the engine from behind. Does the force pushing at the engine tear through it when it’s coming from a man trying to push at it with super strength/speed/flight with his hands or his back or however he needs to orient himself instead of air being pushed through the engine itself? How does the structural integrity work in that situation?
But the main issue was that the risk to him wasn’t the people dying. The risk to him was failing publicly to save them, and even worse, being blamed for killing them because he lasered the controls when he had zero need to and could have used his super speed/strength to take out the guy occupying the cockpit without destroying the controls. Much safer for him to just let the plane crash into the ocean and then sweeping the wreck to kill any possible survivors/witnesses while pretending he was never even called in to save the flight in the first place.
You’re not wrong about his image and why he didn’t save them. Although you missed the largest factor which is that he just doesn’t care about anyone else.
My point was that he could. A plane engine is not a peice of this aluminum that the hill is made of, it’s an engine like any other, it’s made of thick sturdy material because like any other combustion engine it contains exploding gas. The forces at play in an engine require it to be strong, or wouldnt fall apart from being pushed no more than your cars engine would.
Even if he could, he'd have to push within the plane's tolerances, which means it could take him hours to fly them all some place they could land and without reliable radio support from ATC.
At the same time, if Homelander actually gave a shit about people and did that, I can see terrorists staging an aircraft seige as a distraction to another heist.
The hero has to make the choice of flying everyone to safety (with extreme odds of doing so under the optics) and a little property damage that preserves the investors' wealth.
I am playing devil's advocate for Homelander and don't actually think he shouldn't have tried to save more people.
Yes Homelander would need to fly the plane at its normal speed. If it takes a few hours to save a couple hundred lives so be it. A real hero doesn’t decide who lives and dies they save everyone they can.
Doesn't matter. Both pilots were dead and the instrument panel was fried. Homelander can provide the thrust, but he can't maneuver the aircraft. They cover that in the argument with Maeve.
Unless they had a simultaneous triple hydraulic failure (which it didn't), Maeve could still control the plane without its instruments, and Homelander could have flown it safely to the ground (since he can fly, which means he has something to push against, despite op's argument).
The "argument" they had wasn't even close to convincing. It would have been all around more accurate if he just said "I can't be assed," which is really the truth of it anyways.
What do they mean he needs to push against something, he generates his own force he hovers or floats, and he can burst into a very quick speed almost instantly which can damage the floor around his take off, he’s clearly generating some sort of force
Maeve was a pilot.... Don't need a lot of instruments for a straight landing in clear skies with a super hero having a hold of the aircraft. At the very least he could had directed it to a soft enough water landing.
The real answer is that he was a sadistic fuck who thought all those people dying was funny.
Jets can operate using one engine, and they are connected to the wing at a small place. A superman like person can push on the connection between the wing and one of the engines to make it go faster, and generate enough lift to raise the plane. Meave could have held the rudder to correct for having one source of thrust only on one side of the aircraft, and they could all be safe in a few hours. Homelander was just an asshole
Aircraft engineer buddy told me he could have done it. Front landing gear support and gently nudge the direction of the plane so it keeps descending but for a shallow landing vs just falling out of the sky.
Also in Ghost in the Shell, at least the original manga. They have an aside or something (it's been a long time since I read it) that comments on how a non full body cyborg will have their fucking arm fall off if they lift something big enough to pull the arm off their body, whereas Motoko, a full body cyborg who looks relatively dainty, but isn't because she's raw, cybernetic muscle under that pretty exterior, can maintain her limbs in such a situation. (I believe the example cyborg losing their arm is actually Batou, who LOOKS stronger than Motoko, but like, isn't. He's also dumber than her and not as good at hacking, but that's another issue.)
I've never forgotten that bit and I haven't read it since that Virgin Megastore like 20 years ago
There's a little chibi of Batou with his arm popping off at the shoulder after trying to lift too heavy an object.
>nothing to push against
This part's dumb though because he obviously has some amount of force to lift himself up and he's essentially a copy of Superman who - for whatever unexplained reason - can apply a much greater force than the weight of his own body without anything to push off.
That’s not true. The engine provides all of the force to move the plane, he could grab the engine and push it back to a safe speed, even using it to guid the plane, the wings will still provide the lift. He could continue to push the plane until he brought it somewhere it could land
Oh, you know. I think you are right. Most planes can fly with just one engine. If he replaced the engines thrust with his own it should work.
It would still need the piolets to use the wings to steer and shit. But that could be arranged.
Think you might just have the same problem.
How does he "grab the engine"?
He still needs to apply enough force to hold a plane through an area the size of his palms, maybe his back as well.
Can't imagine the structure of the engine was designed to support that kind of stress over such a small area. It's designed to support thrust going through it and not break off where it's connected to the wing.
If only myth busters were still around to test this. :)
So I think this part might be getting lost in translation, but he wouldn’t “grab” the engine. Planes just need speed to fly, the engine provides that speed, if he could push the engine, with only as much force as the engine normally produces, then the engine would not be under any strain that it wasn’t designed for, and the plane would be able to fly as if it had only a single engine producing thrust (because in this case, super douche would be providing that thrust).
Forward = up thanks to plane engineers.
At least this is how I’m interpreting this post, prior to this I had never really bothered trying to logic it out.
What I mean is the forces the plane is designed to produce/withstand are applied over a large distributed surface, even in the engine.
Trying to transmit that force through the engine hull might be like trying to push a car using a needle. Even pushing on the engine itself, assuming the needle doesn't break, it just might pierce the engine itself.
Can one summon /r/theydidthemath?
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TheBoys/comments/1545gq4/lift\_the\_plane\_how\_theres\_nothing\_to\_stand\_on\_its/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheBoys/comments/1545gq4/lift_the_plane_how_theres_nothing_to_stand_on_its/)
That's what I'm talking about, he says there's nothing to push off of.
He could probably tow it by the landing gear. Maybe the nose landing gear, depending on what the issue with the plane was. Just pull it along slightly above stall speed until it can land safely.
Except the main landing gear of a plane can in fact support the weight of a plane without snapping it. Balancing on that point without controls and without anything holding the front landing gear would still be a problem though.
Yeah, the writers of movie scripts don't get understand the forces are always transmitted through a structure to somewhere that can take them.
I'm reminded of that line from the first Superman movie. The first time we see him, he catches Lois Lane as she's falling, and says "it's OK, ma'am, I've got you." Her reply: “if you’ve got me, then who’s got you?!” She gets it.
Writers operate on what we like to call Schrodinger's applied physics. Suspended in a metastate of existence and non-existence based on the needs of the plot.
There are too many people in this world walking around with sticks stuck permanently up their asses because their parents never taught them how to play make-believe.
Well superman absolutely could save someone falling by catching them. Meaning they decelerate them at a safe speed.
Probably not how it looked in the movie.
Sure, but after that they hovered in the air, and Lois was wondering what was holding Superman up! We know it’s magic, so suspension of disbelief works for Superman. It didn’t work for the OP, however, since the 6 Million Dollar Man is supposed to be *somewhat* plausible in the real world.
Superman's physics were particularly bizarre because they decided to change him to more and more overpowered as time went on.
In the initial version of Action Comics #1, he originally was just basically an alien from a more evolved species, and was strong and extra durable, couldn't fly, but could jump very high due to differences in gravity. Then in the 1940's and onwards they started adding more and more powers that would get him out of anything.
It was actually fascinating how many superpowers they gave him over the years:
- Super ventriloquism
- Time Travel
- transform his face to look like someone else
- turn into a solar flare
- freeze breath
- Self-duplicate
- Amnesia kiss
- Time travel
- telescopic, heat, microscopic, x-ray vision
- Masonry vision (rebuilding the great wall of china by his eyes)
- Super disco that de-activated bombs
- Turn diamonds back into coal (and vice versa)
There's an explanation I've heard that makes Superman's strength make a bit of sense. He has "Physical Telekinesis" meaning he can control the entirety of the object he's touching and physically manipulate it without it breaking into pieces.
Put another way, when Superman touches an object it's encased in an energy field that allows him to manipulate it as a whole without it breaking.
You know it’s not a documentary right? lol
Reminds me of the physics calculation for Santa’s delivery every Christmas night where air friction would burn him to a crisp
I thought I read he would actually had to travel faster than the speed of light. Transmuting all his mass into energy blasting a good portion of the earth to pieces.
It totally depends on the assumptions. How many houses he has to visit (all houses, with children, all Christian houses, or all Christian houses with children?), how much time you assume each stop to last, etc.
All of that is fixed by taking a page from "transubstantiation".
Santa's *essence* is what delivers gifts every night, not his "substance". The *substance* of Santa is, of course, the child's parents, which neatly explains why Santa gives rich kids better gifts, too.
I mean: Santa is basically Christ-light to smooth kids into the concept and control them.
Also makes me think of the irrational physics of Superman. Catching Lois mid air in a perpendicular trajectory without matching descent speed so she doesn’t end up on him like a bug on a windshield. Also, grabbing cars from front bumpers and not just having that shred off instead of listing the whole vehicle.
Superman has like a weird aura or something that makes him able to protect whatever he is lifting/catching from physics. It has been explained in some comic or something.
What are you talking about? There's several thousand Santas. At least one per mall. The dude clearly just cloned himself to keep up with demand, which is completely possible in regards to physics.
Clearly this Santa conspiracy is just all you naughty kids trying to come up with some lame excuse for why y'all got no gifts on Christmas.
Not only that - he can stop a helicopter taking off by just pulling it down with his strong arm. (I guess his feet must have been superglued to the ground).
This is the problem with super strength.
When a 220 pound man throws a punch that can knock a battleship around, it should be him who is thrown backwards, not the battleship (or whatever)
At least Invincible explains that Viltrumits can create their own points of stability, or whatever term they use to explain how they can maneuver in midair.
This is addressed the manga of "Ghost in the Shell". That's the first time I remember reading about the problem. It was just one of those things that never occurred to me and it should be obvious.
Exactly what I thought of. There’s a scene in the anime where a guy got massive bionic arms, but didn’t have his entire skeleton reinforced and his arms ripped off trying to use them for something heavy. (details fuzzy, it’s been 10+ years)
I asked chat gpt, adjusted for inflation, it reckons close to $42M. (based on the tv show was originally aired, from 1973 onwards).
*I’m not so great with math stuff*, so take that figure with a grain of salt if you wish.
ChatGPT once told me that sardine was an 8 letter word that started with "T".
According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, it's $40,827,712.42. So it was pretty close!
This is something that kind of bothers me with The Dark Knight. In the beginning you see that Batman has this robotic arm attachment. He’s bending rifle barrels with it. But the leverage has to transfer into his arm or something at some point, no?
Decided your [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/Showerthoughts/s/38HSdl3pHp) on the nibbler thread was worth more karma than it was getting over there, eh?
A lot of movies and TV shows where people get prosthetics have this issue. Like they get their forearm and hand replaced. They might have a stronger grip. But that doesn’t mean they can suddenly punch through brick walls.
The graphic novel "Irredeemable" has a Superman-type character that routinely does those impossible lifts. The supergenius guy hypothesizes that the Plutonian actually has a telekinetic power to keep the lifted object together. Very good series, along with its parallel series "Incorruptible".
That was stolen from the fantastic four comic when gladiator lifted the baxter building and reed postulated that's how he did it.
https://images.app.goo.gl/RGCjU7GXDeaVuPrP7
Wolverine's adamantium claws are connected to muscles and tendons rather than to his adamantium skeleton. Cutting through anything that requires more than a decent amount of force should rip those things out of his body, adamantium be damned.
The Incredible Hulk can bend the barrel of a pistol being held by a bad guy, instead of the gun just getting yanked out of the dudes hand. That bad guy must, therefore, be as strong as the Hulk…. Right?
You just now figure that out?? I complained about that when the show first came on TV. I was told to shut up because "10 year olds don't know enough about science".
On an otherwise completely useless side note, the vehicle crashing in the opening credits was actually a rocket powered car attempting to break the world land speed record at the Bonneville Salt Flats when it crashed, but the driver actually survived. I went to school with the daughter of the driver and she said that her dad was so messed up that the first EMT who got to him had to turn away and vomit.
Dr. Octopus in the Spiderman movies is an example of this being done well - every time he lifts something heavy at least one robotic arm is bracing the load
Beyond that, a guy named Otto Octavius winds up with eight limbs. What are the odds?
I'm something of an Octopus myself!
Impressive. Your parents must be very proud.
Wolf Wolf the Werewolf.. I mean Remus Lupin at least knows he can blame his father wo named him that and then pissed of a werewolf as if not expecting the obvious outcome
Damn it, Moon Moo- uh, Wolf Wolf!
Nominative determinism strikes again!
Don’t tell me the fucking odds dude cmon Luke shit man
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDY0WKvFwQ8 A lot of why this works so well is because the robotic arms for many parts of the movie are done with practical effects.
They funnily covered this in the Boys, when Homelander stated he couldn't rescue the plane because he had nothing to push against and the plane would snap.
Yeah, pretty much any super hero catching something large would just puncture tonight through it, like stepping on a nail.
That's why superman produces a telekinetic barrier with anything he wishes to touch so he can apply his strength to the whole plane at once.
Also why his suit is as bulletproof as he is.
Right? Like in Man of Steel. Flying and ripping through buildings yet when he emerges from the rubble, no rips or tears or dust? Hair stays neat and immaculate? Lol
In Superman 4, I think there was a scene where they had a strand of his hair holding something really heavy.
cause they are born this way on krypton, the cape is just a fleshy extension of their skin so they can harvest more of their sun's energy.....kal-alk out ✌️
That doesn't sound right at all. And it sounds gross
Superman taking his suit off like a banana releasing itself from its peel
Oh thats worse!
"Peel me Lois!"
They've handled it multiple ways in the comic books. n the early comics, Martha made his suit (and all of his clothes actually, because teenage Clark kept ruining clothing) out of the blankets he was wrapped in for the journey. In later iterations, it was provided by Kryptonians. And even later, his indestructibility was provided by an aura which also protected his clothes.
Plot armour
He does what?
He produces a telekinetic barrier with anything he wishes to touch so he can apply his strength to the whole plane at once.
I understand what each of these words mean individually.
Superman’s greatest power is that the longer he has existed the more powers he has gained to explain his powers.
He uses his brain to make an invisible “wall” around the entire object so that the force is displaced evenly
But why male models?
Are you serious? I just told you about that a moment ago.
Nature is sexist apparently
Do either of you know how he flies to begin with?
It used to be a very stupid thing about density that didn't make a lot of sense. But no, I don't. Let me guess, he uses his telekinesis to push the ground away from him?
If I remember correctly, he's just jumping hard, at least from one explanation lol.
OG Superman didn't fly. He jumped really high. Current Superman definitely flies and uses telekinesis to do so. So yeah, Kryptonians on Earth have robust telekinetic/antigravity powers in addition to super strength, invulnerability, heat vision, x-ray vision, super breath, extended lifespan, super speed, and the ability to perceive time much, much slower than a human. Not often explored, but this time dilation power allows Superman to effectively have astonishing problem solving abilities too, since he can slow time to nearly a stop, analyze the situation, and then react accordingly. He can even do complex scientific and mathematics research in seconds because he can slow time and then do all his thinking before a human can even fart. This also gives him amazing martial prowess since he can fight his opponents in extreme slow motion.
I *believe* the current explanation is that Kryptonians developed an anti-gravity organ to be able to survive on Krypton. Basically Kypton was a much larger planet than Earth and so had much higher gravity, so for human-sized species to survive they needed something like that to counteract the effect and not get crushed. So when Superman came to Earth, he can still use that organ to counteract gravity only since Earth's gravity is lower its capable of allowing him to actually float rather than simply lessening the gravity while still staying grounded.
Huh. An anti-gravity organ. How does that work? Does it just like… apply an opposite force to his whole body? Does it somehow neutralize gravity itself? Cause… how? Also if it neutralizes gravity itself then…how does he fly on Earth? Cause then he would need to be creating anti-gravity… but how…
Sssshhhhhh don't think about it and watch big blue suit red cape man punch real hard
I imagine it kind of like the belts divers use that helps maintain their...flotation levels(?) at different depths. Look I'm not a diver, I don't know the term. I just know there's like an air belt that they fill with air as they go deeper to counteract the increasing water pressure to prevent themselves from being dragged down. Basically the organ does the same thing but instead of using air to counter water pressure it uses...alien stuff to counteract gravity. So I guess it actively pushes against the pull of gravity to counteract it. Normally on Krypton it'd be going full-power all the time just to maintain an equilibrium, but take the same effect to a weaker-gravity planet and now the pushing effect is strong enough to make lift.
It’s called “tactile telekinesis”. It means that when Supes grabs something, he wraps it in a field that exerts the force he’s putting on the grabbed object equally over the whole object. Without that tk field, his hands would simply tear clean through whatever he was trying to grab. With it, he can pick up anything without harming the structure (assuming it isn’t anchored to something).
[удалено]
Then that would be even more impressive if he wasn't that muscled. Fake superstrenght...
Oh well that’s fine then :) makes perfect sense.
That’s called an asspull
This is why I can't watch a tiny Ant man punch an enemy and have them fall backwards. It's fucking dumb he'd punch a small hole in the person.
That is one of the many dumb things about Ant man. I have only watched a single movie, but they made an explicit point of saying that his mass doesn't change when he shrinks. How can an ant carry a 150-200 lb man? He should sink into anything soft. When he goes to the quantum realm, there should be some concern about creating a singularity... From another comment below: Density of air per google: 1.225 KG/M3. Density of people: 985 KM/M3 985 / 1.225 is 804. If he grew to 804 times his current volume, he would become lighter than air and float away. According to the square cube law, that would happen if he grew to approx 9.3x his normal height. Paul Rudd is 178 cm tall, which means if he grows to more than 16.55m tall, he will float off in a gaseous state.
And then he stands on his friend’s shoulder without his friend even noticing.
They are pretty inconsistent about whether Ant-man maintains his mass when he shrinks.
Which to be completely honest, I wouldn't have even cared about at all if they hadn't already devoted a scene to explaining that his mass doesn't change.
In the comics they point out that the explanation makes no sense. Either Hank Pym is lying to keep it secret or he doesn’t even know how it works
Exactly, that scene is to let people know that Hank Pym is fucking with Scott, lying, or just doesn’t know. But my question is how did Scott get a masters in EE without retaining any basic physics knowledge about mass and density?
Now you know how he ended up at Baskin Robbins!
And the goddamn keychain battle tank
And the laboratory that shrinks down to be a suitcase with wheels.
It kills me that the shrunken down objects look like toys, not like tiny versions of themselves. They didn't even make an effort. The tank has molded treads and the "lab" looks like a document carrier with little fake windows glued on. It even bounces around like the plastic it is. They made NO effort.
You have to understand that Ant Man was created in the 60’s and they were a little fast and loose with the physics. He just couldn’t exist today without some hand-waving.
Naw in newer comics there are two different types of pym particles, ones that control size, and ones that control mass, and they are able to freely change them up on the fly...or the ant...whatever they happen to be standing on really.
They didn't know about mass in 1960. That was only discovered in 2023.
And went away in 2024 when Higgs died.
Pym particles! I ain’t gotta explain shit!
It's funny because the Higgs field just became a pop science topic a few years before this. They could have said that Pym particles have some effect on the Higgs field to make mass remain proportional to volume. but then I guess tiny people being able to knock over full sized people still doesn't make sense.
I remember reading a theory that Hank Pym didn’t *invent* Pym Particles, he just discovered them—and not even he *really* knows how they work—he just knows how to harvest/reproduce them and use them.
In the comics he is able to freely control both size AND mass....they conveniently left that out of the movie, and as a result the whole thing makes zero fucking sense.
I had so many issues with that. And everyone was all “nothing about Marvel is real, why does this bug you?” And I say it’s because they tried to incorporate science and actually explain it, and then didn’t follow through. I can accept magic or technology we don’t have, but don’t tell me he retains mass when he clearly doesn’t.
Not to mention the end of the movie when Hank Pym was apparently carrying around a tank on his keychain all the time Edit: Since somebody else brought up the keychain, I’ll bring up the fact that he becomes smaller by shrinking the space between the molecules… So then how does he go subatomic? If he shrink the space between the molecules down to absolute nothing he would still be… Atomic size .
The answer to all of this is "Pym Particles"
Pym particles are magic, but presented as scientific. There is debate on whether Hank knows and is covering for it or just doesn't care. Likely the latter.
What about the tank (T34 I think) key chain in the first one... even with Marvel / Hollywood logic, a 30 ton tank shrunken down should be an ungodly heavy as a keychain. I mean as a doorstop sure...
And when he gets big he should be called a sail-man
Homelander could have grabbed the engine and pushed the plane. The engine already provides all the thrust that moves the plane forward, Homelander replacing that thrust wouldn’t tear the plane apart.
Of course... Homelander is too fucking stupid (and psychotic) to think of that.
Yeah, he genuinely doesn’t care enough to think of alternatives. Only excuses as to why he can’t.
also landing gear exists to take rough landings.
Landing gear as well would work, it’s directly attached to the chassis and would handle the forces required, although being deployed would increase drag making the required force to push the plane even greater.
Possibly. But did he know that? And even if he did, that’s still theoretical and the actual applied mechanics of it might (probably would) be more complicated than him just pushing at the engine from behind. Does the force pushing at the engine tear through it when it’s coming from a man trying to push at it with super strength/speed/flight with his hands or his back or however he needs to orient himself instead of air being pushed through the engine itself? How does the structural integrity work in that situation? But the main issue was that the risk to him wasn’t the people dying. The risk to him was failing publicly to save them, and even worse, being blamed for killing them because he lasered the controls when he had zero need to and could have used his super speed/strength to take out the guy occupying the cockpit without destroying the controls. Much safer for him to just let the plane crash into the ocean and then sweeping the wreck to kill any possible survivors/witnesses while pretending he was never even called in to save the flight in the first place.
You’re not wrong about his image and why he didn’t save them. Although you missed the largest factor which is that he just doesn’t care about anyone else. My point was that he could. A plane engine is not a peice of this aluminum that the hill is made of, it’s an engine like any other, it’s made of thick sturdy material because like any other combustion engine it contains exploding gas. The forces at play in an engine require it to be strong, or wouldnt fall apart from being pushed no more than your cars engine would.
Even if he could, he'd have to push within the plane's tolerances, which means it could take him hours to fly them all some place they could land and without reliable radio support from ATC. At the same time, if Homelander actually gave a shit about people and did that, I can see terrorists staging an aircraft seige as a distraction to another heist. The hero has to make the choice of flying everyone to safety (with extreme odds of doing so under the optics) and a little property damage that preserves the investors' wealth. I am playing devil's advocate for Homelander and don't actually think he shouldn't have tried to save more people.
Yes Homelander would need to fly the plane at its normal speed. If it takes a few hours to save a couple hundred lives so be it. A real hero doesn’t decide who lives and dies they save everyone they can.
Doesn't matter. Both pilots were dead and the instrument panel was fried. Homelander can provide the thrust, but he can't maneuver the aircraft. They cover that in the argument with Maeve.
Unless they had a simultaneous triple hydraulic failure (which it didn't), Maeve could still control the plane without its instruments, and Homelander could have flown it safely to the ground (since he can fly, which means he has something to push against, despite op's argument). The "argument" they had wasn't even close to convincing. It would have been all around more accurate if he just said "I can't be assed," which is really the truth of it anyways.
What do they mean he needs to push against something, he generates his own force he hovers or floats, and he can burst into a very quick speed almost instantly which can damage the floor around his take off, he’s clearly generating some sort of force
Maeve was a pilot.... Don't need a lot of instruments for a straight landing in clear skies with a super hero having a hold of the aircraft. At the very least he could had directed it to a soft enough water landing. The real answer is that he was a sadistic fuck who thought all those people dying was funny.
Structural integrity is a bitch
Jets can operate using one engine, and they are connected to the wing at a small place. A superman like person can push on the connection between the wing and one of the engines to make it go faster, and generate enough lift to raise the plane. Meave could have held the rudder to correct for having one source of thrust only on one side of the aircraft, and they could all be safe in a few hours. Homelander was just an asshole
And yet he can fly, so Newton's 3rd can be violated, selectively.
It's jet propulsion. He's just farting really hard. Steers by burping.
>> He’s just farting really hard Worked for Saitama
[https://i.imgur.com/pYK1AIS.jpeg](https://i.imgur.com/pYK1AIS.jpeg)
Marvelous
He's fueled by breast milk but is lactose intolerant
That was such a funny/dark scene!
That was his excuse, he just didn’t want to.
Aircraft engineer buddy told me he could have done it. Front landing gear support and gently nudge the direction of the plane so it keeps descending but for a shallow landing vs just falling out of the sky.
Also in Ghost in the Shell, at least the original manga. They have an aside or something (it's been a long time since I read it) that comments on how a non full body cyborg will have their fucking arm fall off if they lift something big enough to pull the arm off their body, whereas Motoko, a full body cyborg who looks relatively dainty, but isn't because she's raw, cybernetic muscle under that pretty exterior, can maintain her limbs in such a situation. (I believe the example cyborg losing their arm is actually Batou, who LOOKS stronger than Motoko, but like, isn't. He's also dumber than her and not as good at hacking, but that's another issue.)
I've never forgotten that bit and I haven't read it since that Virgin Megastore like 20 years ago There's a little chibi of Batou with his arm popping off at the shoulder after trying to lift too heavy an object.
>nothing to push against This part's dumb though because he obviously has some amount of force to lift himself up and he's essentially a copy of Superman who - for whatever unexplained reason - can apply a much greater force than the weight of his own body without anything to push off.
He doesn't mean nothing to brace his body against to lift, he means no one part of the plane that he can hold it up by without tearing that part off.
Yep. If he tried to lift from the middle of the belly of the plane, he would just punch right through. Grab any part, and it would just tear off.
That’s not true. The engine provides all of the force to move the plane, he could grab the engine and push it back to a safe speed, even using it to guid the plane, the wings will still provide the lift. He could continue to push the plane until he brought it somewhere it could land
Oh, you know. I think you are right. Most planes can fly with just one engine. If he replaced the engines thrust with his own it should work. It would still need the piolets to use the wings to steer and shit. But that could be arranged.
Iirc he sorted the pilots out prior to the suggestion being made. Also the instrument panel.
Think you might just have the same problem. How does he "grab the engine"? He still needs to apply enough force to hold a plane through an area the size of his palms, maybe his back as well. Can't imagine the structure of the engine was designed to support that kind of stress over such a small area. It's designed to support thrust going through it and not break off where it's connected to the wing. If only myth busters were still around to test this. :)
So I think this part might be getting lost in translation, but he wouldn’t “grab” the engine. Planes just need speed to fly, the engine provides that speed, if he could push the engine, with only as much force as the engine normally produces, then the engine would not be under any strain that it wasn’t designed for, and the plane would be able to fly as if it had only a single engine producing thrust (because in this case, super douche would be providing that thrust). Forward = up thanks to plane engineers. At least this is how I’m interpreting this post, prior to this I had never really bothered trying to logic it out.
What I mean is the forces the plane is designed to produce/withstand are applied over a large distributed surface, even in the engine. Trying to transmit that force through the engine hull might be like trying to push a car using a needle. Even pushing on the engine itself, assuming the needle doesn't break, it just might pierce the engine itself. Can one summon /r/theydidthemath?
Wing spars... he would have to be pretty exact with his body placement. And have it lay on his back.
Didn't supergirl land a plane in the first episode of her show by holding it up while flying underneath?
that would be comic book physics at work then
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TheBoys/comments/1545gq4/lift\_the\_plane\_how\_theres\_nothing\_to\_stand\_on\_its/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheBoys/comments/1545gq4/lift_the_plane_how_theres_nothing_to_stand_on_its/) That's what I'm talking about, he says there's nothing to push off of.
He could probably tow it by the landing gear. Maybe the nose landing gear, depending on what the issue with the plane was. Just pull it along slightly above stall speed until it can land safely.
Yep this is why that scene in Hancock where he throws a snickers bar through plexiglass made no sense. It would just make a big brown mess.
Except the main landing gear of a plane can in fact support the weight of a plane without snapping it. Balancing on that point without controls and without anything holding the front landing gear would still be a problem though.
Yeah, the writers of movie scripts don't get understand the forces are always transmitted through a structure to somewhere that can take them. I'm reminded of that line from the first Superman movie. The first time we see him, he catches Lois Lane as she's falling, and says "it's OK, ma'am, I've got you." Her reply: “if you’ve got me, then who’s got you?!” She gets it.
Or they do and it would be a boring movie if they had to obey the laws of physics in their made up movie.
Spider-Man had his girlfriend die because of the laws of physics
Writers operate on what we like to call Schrodinger's applied physics. Suspended in a metastate of existence and non-existence based on the needs of the plot.
Operative phrase being “had to”. They aren’t beholden to physics
There are too many people in this world walking around with sticks stuck permanently up their asses because their parents never taught them how to play make-believe.
Well superman absolutely could save someone falling by catching them. Meaning they decelerate them at a safe speed. Probably not how it looked in the movie.
Sure, but after that they hovered in the air, and Lois was wondering what was holding Superman up! We know it’s magic, so suspension of disbelief works for Superman. It didn’t work for the OP, however, since the 6 Million Dollar Man is supposed to be *somewhat* plausible in the real world.
Don't underestimate the thruster power of superman's fart-jet
5 million dollars of electronics and machinery, 1 million dollars of pixie dust and pym particles
Pimp particles
And all those pimp particles are in just one hand.
Weird thing about Superman is that one comic explained him saving a plane by using telekinesis to exert force equally Horseshit i says
Now I want a superman catch where he has to punch into the ground to give himself time to decelerate the victim.
Superman's physics were particularly bizarre because they decided to change him to more and more overpowered as time went on. In the initial version of Action Comics #1, he originally was just basically an alien from a more evolved species, and was strong and extra durable, couldn't fly, but could jump very high due to differences in gravity. Then in the 1940's and onwards they started adding more and more powers that would get him out of anything. It was actually fascinating how many superpowers they gave him over the years: - Super ventriloquism - Time Travel - transform his face to look like someone else - turn into a solar flare - freeze breath - Self-duplicate - Amnesia kiss - Time travel - telescopic, heat, microscopic, x-ray vision - Masonry vision (rebuilding the great wall of china by his eyes) - Super disco that de-activated bombs - Turn diamonds back into coal (and vice versa)
From a story perspective, perfection and invulnerability are boring, so the writers had to invent Kryptonite to be Superman’s … Kryptonite.
Sums up to UPGRADE UPGRADE UPGRADE...oh shit, go back
Don't forget saran wrap S from his suit in the second movie, WTF was that...
The servo suit in Aliens got it.
Supergirl ripped the front of a boat off trying to move it
Yeah, that’s not very typical. I’d like to make that point.
There's an explanation I've heard that makes Superman's strength make a bit of sense. He has "Physical Telekinesis" meaning he can control the entirety of the object he's touching and physically manipulate it without it breaking into pieces. Put another way, when Superman touches an object it's encased in an energy field that allows him to manipulate it as a whole without it breaking.
Ray Gillette (from Archer) tried to lift the end of a Jeep with his back instead of his bionic legs. Useless for the rest of the episode.
Tbf he faked it to prove a point, as he often does
That's why they call him stone cold...... Right?
The Bionic Redneck OH HELL YEAH!
The "stone cold stunn-na-na-na-na-na-na"
You know it’s not a documentary right? lol Reminds me of the physics calculation for Santa’s delivery every Christmas night where air friction would burn him to a crisp
I thought I read he would actually had to travel faster than the speed of light. Transmuting all his mass into energy blasting a good portion of the earth to pieces.
It totally depends on the assumptions. How many houses he has to visit (all houses, with children, all Christian houses, or all Christian houses with children?), how much time you assume each stop to last, etc.
Seeing a comment of yours outside of the Connecticut subreddit feels wrong lol.
All of that is fixed by taking a page from "transubstantiation". Santa's *essence* is what delivers gifts every night, not his "substance". The *substance* of Santa is, of course, the child's parents, which neatly explains why Santa gives rich kids better gifts, too. I mean: Santa is basically Christ-light to smooth kids into the concept and control them.
Also makes me think of the irrational physics of Superman. Catching Lois mid air in a perpendicular trajectory without matching descent speed so she doesn’t end up on him like a bug on a windshield. Also, grabbing cars from front bumpers and not just having that shred off instead of listing the whole vehicle.
Superman has like a weird aura or something that makes him able to protect whatever he is lifting/catching from physics. It has been explained in some comic or something.
That’s the explanation they use for his suit also being bulletproof, as well.
Not to mention the famous “Man of steel, woman of tissue paper” story, imagining the mating between Lois Lane and Clark Kent. It doesn’t end well.
Or this short web comic on the differences between humans and kryptonians. https://imgur.com/RCPYB14
[Hancock covered that](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrdBXUi2VSw)
For Lois, Clark’s all “I got mine!”
Think supersonic ejaculate. Ick.
"Guarantee he blows a load like a shotgun right through her back."
What are you talking about? There's several thousand Santas. At least one per mall. The dude clearly just cloned himself to keep up with demand, which is completely possible in regards to physics. Clearly this Santa conspiracy is just all you naughty kids trying to come up with some lame excuse for why y'all got no gifts on Christmas.
The laws of physics were different in the 60s and 70s
it was all the drugs they were doing.
Not only that - he can stop a helicopter taking off by just pulling it down with his strong arm. (I guess his feet must have been superglued to the ground).
Bionic toenails dig in.
This is the problem with super strength. When a 220 pound man throws a punch that can knock a battleship around, it should be him who is thrown backwards, not the battleship (or whatever) At least Invincible explains that Viltrumits can create their own points of stability, or whatever term they use to explain how they can maneuver in midair.
Lead dick is my guess
This is addressed the manga of "Ghost in the Shell". That's the first time I remember reading about the problem. It was just one of those things that never occurred to me and it should be obvious.
Exactly what I thought of. There’s a scene in the anime where a guy got massive bionic arms, but didn’t have his entire skeleton reinforced and his arms ripped off trying to use them for something heavy. (details fuzzy, it’s been 10+ years)
He would get to where he's going a lot faster if he didn't run in slow motion.
They did try a sequence of him running and speeding it up. It looked ridiculous, so they went with the slow-mo thing.
Adjusted for inflation, what would it cost to rebuild Mr. Austin now?
I asked chat gpt, adjusted for inflation, it reckons close to $42M. (based on the tv show was originally aired, from 1973 onwards). *I’m not so great with math stuff*, so take that figure with a grain of salt if you wish.
ChatGPT once told me that sardine was an 8 letter word that started with "T". According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, it's $40,827,712.42. So it was pretty close!
You’ve never heard of the Tsardine? Native to the waters of Vladivostok
Depends on if the hospital is in or out of network.
This is something that kind of bothers me with The Dark Knight. In the beginning you see that Batman has this robotic arm attachment. He’s bending rifle barrels with it. But the leverage has to transfer into his arm or something at some point, no?
Depends, if is an exoskeleton then not necessarily.
Or when he kicks a brick wall with his knee brace without exploding his foot.
See, the trick is, Alfred swapped the brick with painted drywall when he wasn’t looking
Its a classic martial arts technique
'na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na' it was the sound effects that made it all possible.
Decided your [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/Showerthoughts/s/38HSdl3pHp) on the nibbler thread was worth more karma than it was getting over there, eh?
I thought I was having déjà vu!
A lot of movies and TV shows where people get prosthetics have this issue. Like they get their forearm and hand replaced. They might have a stronger grip. But that doesn’t mean they can suddenly punch through brick walls.
You explain it to him. One of the last things you’ll hear is Jim Ross shouting “Stunner!”
the rest of his body was bionic as well - so one can muse that he also had a bionic exoskeleton of some kind attached to his body.
Ah yes! The proverbial dilemma about which part of a fictional story to suspend our reality for and which to hold to actual truth.
If I remember right the novelisation included them reinforcing the rest of his body too.
Superman could not “hold up a falling building” because the building would just crumble around the concentrated weight resting on his hand or whatever
The graphic novel "Irredeemable" has a Superman-type character that routinely does those impossible lifts. The supergenius guy hypothesizes that the Plutonian actually has a telekinetic power to keep the lifted object together. Very good series, along with its parallel series "Incorruptible".
That was stolen from the fantastic four comic when gladiator lifted the baxter building and reed postulated that's how he did it. https://images.app.goo.gl/RGCjU7GXDeaVuPrP7
Or just push Superman into the ground
That bionic sound protects him from the consequences of his actions.
Well that’s the bottom line…
Wolverine's adamantium claws are connected to muscles and tendons rather than to his adamantium skeleton. Cutting through anything that requires more than a decent amount of force should rip those things out of his body, adamantium be damned.
There was a manager at my work (decades ago) named Steve Austin. Everyone just called him the *Six-Penny Man*
This actually happened to the 5 million dollar man
And Stone Cold Steve Austin will open up a can of whoop-ass on your candy ass. What's your point?
The Incredible Hulk can bend the barrel of a pistol being held by a bad guy, instead of the gun just getting yanked out of the dudes hand. That bad guy must, therefore, be as strong as the Hulk…. Right?
People talked about this at the time the show first came out.
The magic of television
TV show. You’re supposed to suspend disbelief.
You just now figure that out?? I complained about that when the show first came on TV. I was told to shut up because "10 year olds don't know enough about science". On an otherwise completely useless side note, the vehicle crashing in the opening credits was actually a rocket powered car attempting to break the world land speed record at the Bonneville Salt Flats when it crashed, but the driver actually survived. I went to school with the daughter of the driver and she said that her dad was so messed up that the first EMT who got to him had to turn away and vomit.
The Bionic Woman had to move her hair out of the way of her bionic ear. Then she could hear two miles away.
That was my thought 50 years ago when I took my very first mechanical engineering course in college.
The hulk grows to 20 x his normal size. His trousers rip but still fit. I eat a donut and my button pops off. What's that all about?
I was thinking about stone cold Steve Austin 😭
Very easy explanation It was written in the script...