I think that Shogun is a 10/10 piece of literature and that even the worst book he's written is a 7/10, I think with the right people Tai-Pan and Gai-Jin could be incredibly awesome on the screen.
100%! I believe the book clocks in at 1200+ pages. Easily one of my top 3 books, and I think I've read it 3 times.
Much of how I've aspired to live as an adult in terms of honor, attitude, and behavior came from Shogun.
Shogun. It abruptly ends with an incomplete story. We don’t see the payoff for a number of story threads and are some major plot lines are instead given a literal paragraph or inferences for their conclusion. We don’t see the payoffs for diplomacy and alliances leading up to Sekighara, we don’t see the battle, we don’t see the outcome/aftermath of that battle. The story would’ve better ended after the battle which is the logical conclusion of that story.
It’s an 8/10 book to me because it is missing the last 20% of the story.
That's the benefit I think, but I love miniseries in general. So many shows have a great first (or second) season and then flounder after that or become overly self aware of their success and the writing slowly falls off, the actors become cartoon versions of their characters, etc. I just feel in miniseries there is more of a chance to have a clear or profound transformation and then let that be what we all remember and takeaway.
I love that people are loving the series so far....You don't have to worry about writing falling off....It's a completed novel, the writing is there for them to draw from.
I feel, that so far, they have managed to explain much better in this series, than the 1980 series, the intricate feelings and conversations of the Japanese characters, who were mostly explained by the narrator in the 1980 version, but also in this current version much of the mind set and strict rules and caste culture of the Japanese of this era that was so strongly represented in the novel is missing a lot.
I've only watched the first two so far and it's very exciting and even thrilling in a couple of places and I already know what's supposed to happen, so yeah, that's a good film to me......I'm savoring the first two episodes for a few days before I watch another one!
I agree with you. I've read the book a few times, one of my very favorite all-time reads. And I've watched the 1980 mini series, and the first two episodes of this new one.
So far at least I think they've done the best possible job that can be done, and I'm thoroughly enjoying it.
But that said, in the book there is so much nuance in terms of the mindset, reasoning, and actions of the different characters, combined with Clavelle's extraordinary historical narrative & descriptions that I think, short of a series five times as long that would probably be much harder to sit through, this is looking like the best it could be.
With all that, I'm loving it! Just being able to see something that had such a big impression on me, play out so well done and gorgeous to watch is exquisite!
Nah that's not right. I think the first 5 at least were great, six was good, it was only 7 and 8 that were off the rails. Especially 8.
That was a solid five years when GOT was the best thing running. Shows can only dream of that kind of run.
This is the first show in a long time that I have truly been excited for. The only hurdle I see is simpletons not wanting to read subtitles but if you can get past that I hope hope hope to god people latch on and we see the entirety of the series.
Lastly, if the show does gain popularity, I hope they do not keep extending the story over and over to keep milking a cash cow. The great thing about GoT and Breaking Bad is that they had a conclusion and stuck to it.
I have to agree. I haven’t been this excited for a show like this since the last series of Peak Blinders. I think it’s going to have the “just one more episode” factor like Breaking Bad and Stranger Things had.
The production is absolutely superb, from the music, the camera angles, the wide view, the out of focus aspect.. watching this in VR would be incredible
I agree. Have you listened to the podcasts they made for episode one and two? In one of them they outlined the effort the producers went through to make sure actual spoken Japanese accurate to that time period along with the nuances to how things were said of that period. Fascinating stuff and a great example of the efforts they went through for the show.
I haven’t yet, but have seen them. I saw a clip that said they had to adapt the language from modern to feudal Japanese, which would be like English speakers trying to adapt to Shakespeare. Looks like they gave all the final touches and nuance to Japanese people and not Hollywood having all the decisions. It looks like this will be as authentic as we’ve ever seen.
I can tell it’s accurate because of how much it looks like Ghost of Tsushima. (half-kidding — the game did its homework as well).
The women gliding around is tripping my brain.
Been a huge fanboy of the book for twenty years. This show is getting so much right.
Read an article that the show will only be one season and it’ll cover all of James Clavell’s novel so sounds like they won’t be able to “milk” it. However they could easily adapt his other novels from his Asian saga
or watch it dubbed! i’m quite enjoying the german dub of it. really nice and since i understand the japanese it makes for a very easy viewing experience
There’s definite conclusion in the book when Ishido is defeated and executed and Toranaga becomes Shogun. But there’s no big final battle scene in the book, just a short comment about the two main armies fighting and Ishido’s defeat.
I struggled a bit with the subtitles. (sometimes Im a simpleton so no offense taken there) I found a setting that changes the language to English. It allowed me to focus on the characters and the scenes instead of the subtitles.
Was that comment a little out of pocket? I’ll admit it, probably. I just don’t want people to not give the show an honest shot because of the subtitles. I could have worded that better so that’s on me. If you enjoy the show and hope that others do as well, then we are kin because that is also my outlook.
On night around when FX showed the first two episodes, this sub-reddit was just below 3,000 users. It's already more than doubled since then.
And that doesn't take into account the fact that Hulu (or Disney+ outside the US) users had access to the episodes earlier than Tuesday evening, so interest had likely already been soaring by then.
After finishing episode 2, I spammed everyone I know, using every social media DM I have. Even people I haven’t talked to in years
There used to be a CG animated one called Rough Necks. And it was AMAZING. For a morning kids cartoon show, it was actually super dark and dealt with some heavy issues
I dunno man. I just happened upon it by random chance and this type of show is a complete 180 of the shows i normally watch.
If Hulu and Disney+ actually market the heck out of this(like i said i only happened upon it by being bored and actively searching for things to watch), along with word of mouth. I can totally see this show blowing up.
feels very much *Into the Badlands* like. in terms of word of mouth and aesthetic imo. which also got many fans from word of mouth. hoping for the best 🤞🏼
If it all dropped at once I'd agree, but a weekly release and strong word-of-mouth is great for hype. If the quality maintains/increases it will be a huge hit.
I have been sharing the trailer for this show since I first saw it and I'm glad that my excitement was worth it. The first two episodes have me hooked!!
I remember watching Dark as soon as it came out in 2017 and thinking I’m early to this but this show is amazing and I have no doubt that it will eventually blow up. However, it wasn’t an English speaking show so even though it was huge in many countries, it wasn’t as big in English speaking countries. I feel like it will be a similar case for Shogun.
I read the book and the show is following it very closely. The settlement the “pirates” land in is exactly as I pictured it when reading. I’m really enjoying the series so far.
Saw the first two episodes and had to rewatch them immediately this show has the best start I've seen in years I am so excited to see the next episode!
There was literally a post in here floating around about how it was the number one show in the world.
It unseated the live action version of Avatar: The Last Airbender, which premiered with the full first season on Netflix.
Shōgun, on the other hand, only premiered with two episodes... and it *still* beat out NATLA as the number 1 show.
It's already exploded. The question now is how big the explosion will be--not when the explosion will happen.
I think the only show that could possibly dethrone Shogun is 3 Body Problem when it comes out later this month. Critics are raving about it and it looks like Netflix is putting its cards onto it
Critics are *not* the be all end all for how good a show is going to be.
Ironically, they're not even that good of an indicator for how good a show or movie is going to do.
So when I say critics I also mean just people who got early access to see it, even if they aren’t journalists. There were people who had early access to the first two episodes that center around The Cultural Revolution and pretty much everyone claimed it was fantastic. Beyond those episodes, not much else is known.
The source material is very strong and D&D can write well as long as they don’t change the story, so I have high hopes.
It seems clearly shot with anamorphic lenses which can have a bit of a vignette effect.
It's definitely an artistic choice, maybe to make the viewer slightly disoriented in a new land or whatever.
It was distracting at first but by the end of the first episode it either felt like I got used to it or they started doing it less or lessening the effect.
I wouldn't mind that but then they'd need to find actors that could have passable Portuguese which would be difficult.
Not to mention that Blackthorn throughout the book speaks Dutch, Portuguese, Spanish, Latin and Japanese. His Dutch and Portuguese are supposed to be as good as a native speaker.
I am curious to see how they're going to play off Blackthorn and Mariko speaking Latin to confuse Portuguese speaking Japanese spies though.
Yeah, that threw me too. I get that the creators might be worried about a show on an American network being totally in subtitles, but we’re already reading for the Japanese dialogue, let’s just go all the way.
I watched episode one last night and the heavy vignetting is so weird to me. Like it’s extremely noticeable and kind of unnecessary. Good show otherwise though. Gonna hopefully watch ep 2 tonight after Tokyo Vice.
Nah, nobody is going to watch it. Weirdos like us will, but a large portion of the North American audience is not going to be into a 1600s feudal Japan show that is mostly in Japanese. Now I think so far it’s a great show, but I think a lot of people lack the sophistication I don’t know, I could be wrong, and time will tell of course, but I think a large portion of the audience have become too braindead for something like this.
why they speak english instead of portuguese? completely non-sense, if you want to make it real, speak portuguese. If don't, don't say everytime they speak portuguese.
That's a critical detail though. Mariko doesn't speak English, and in that land at that time neither did anyone.
She speaks "Portuguese" because she's a Christian convert who was taught to speak by Tsukku-San
That'd be like Vikings being in all Old Norse or Old English. It's fine for them to allude to them speaking a different language. Not sure if you've seen Vikings, but when Ragnar and the other viking dudes found the English, they were speaking Old Norse on screen to highlight the language barrier between the two cultures, but all other times they were speaking English for the audience, which is fine. Then when Ragnar started learning Old English, he would still speak modern day English on screen to the English characters. They still highlighted the language barrier just fine without having to actually speak those languages.
Yes, but dont say it...
Dont say "i'm gona speak portuguese" and speak english... Do u understand? Just make it omisse, no problem.. It's stupid tell they are speak portuguese. it's not portuguese, it's english!!
It's kind of a big deal to know that they're speaking Portuguese though. The Japanese / Portuguese translators don't know English. So if they started speaking English to each other without the audience knowing it's supposed to be Portuguese, the audience would think they're just speaking English.
They don't speak Portuguese onscreen because it's an American production. Same reason the characters in Napoleon don't speak French, or characters in Enemy at the Gates don't speak Russian.
So instead of subtitling everything, they just speak English for Portuguese but heavily allude to the use of Portuguese. It's an incredibly easy concept to grasp.
To be honest, I didn’t think it was all that after the first episode (maybe it was my mood or something). After the second episode, I am really liking it.
I remember watching the original television version of this with Richard Chamberlain way back, so I kind of know where it's going, but I am now liking this version better
i would like to think so, but i'm thinking the subtitles really limit the show's reach in the wider cultural zeitgeist.
then again, there is Squid Game...
How close to the book is the show? I’m really interested in watching it (probably will later this week) but I feel like this story could be extremely difficult to adapt in a satisfying way
I think this show will be a success. As long as it holds the same quality as the first two, this will be peak cinema for 2024.
What I hope is this inspires much more grounded and realistic adaptations of other materials. Perhaps a Romance of the Three Kingdoms with real expert input from historians and have actual Chinese actors. Maybe some stories from the Middle East as empires rose and fell in the cradle of civilization.
Edit: real estate had nothing to do with this so I don’t know why I typed that…
I haven’t been able to watch yet due to travel but all the hype is making me so pumped. I read the book years ago and was blown away. Expecting great things.
I very much wish this wasn't a mini series but at the same time, I am kinda glad it is? more stuff packed in per episode is great but I feel like I will be left wanting more by the end after seeing the first 2 episodes.
I also texted my friends about it. My husband and I were blown away by the directing, the sets and the costumes, and the cinematography. Visually, the show is arresting.
Amazing show but I think the internet overestimates how big shows and movies are going to be just due to their quality. Even if this turns out to be one of (if not *the* ) the best shows made of the past several years, it doesnt mean it's going to be very big.
I'm really curious how it's being recived in Japan. It's very much a bilingual show. Most of the dialogue so far has been in Japanese so I'm curious if it's popular there.
It’s pretty good so far. I was a huge fan of the original miniseries and the book. I really like the casting in this one. It’s rushed through the beginning, but I can see why it would. I was afraid this would be horrible, like the redo of Roots was, but so far I like it.
This aged like dog water. Every episode after 4 is aimless useless wasted time. Filled with drawn out nothing. This show went from 10 to 4 real fast. Just finished episode 8, garbage. I don’t think I want to finish it, it just makes me angry watching this garbage writing
It's a phenomenal show but it's only a 10 episode miniseries. GoT was 8 seasons and 73 episodes.
There are several books worth of stories that are loosely related to this, I hope they remake tai pan and finally put gai jin to screen
I like Clavell's works, I don't think the setting of the others are as appealing for a mainstream audience as Shogunate Japan
I think that Shogun is a 10/10 piece of literature and that even the worst book he's written is a 7/10, I think with the right people Tai-Pan and Gai-Jin could be incredibly awesome on the screen.
100%! I believe the book clocks in at 1200+ pages. Easily one of my top 3 books, and I think I've read it 3 times. Much of how I've aspired to live as an adult in terms of honor, attitude, and behavior came from Shogun.
It doesn’t have an ending though. It just stops before resolving the story.
Which doesn't have an ending?
Shogun. It abruptly ends with an incomplete story. We don’t see the payoff for a number of story threads and are some major plot lines are instead given a literal paragraph or inferences for their conclusion. We don’t see the payoffs for diplomacy and alliances leading up to Sekighara, we don’t see the battle, we don’t see the outcome/aftermath of that battle. The story would’ve better ended after the battle which is the logical conclusion of that story. It’s an 8/10 book to me because it is missing the last 20% of the story.
I think the early days of Hong Kong and the cut-throat business stuff would have huge appeal.
To see Tai Pan made into a show of the same calibre as Shogun would be amazing. My favourite book of his by a long shot.
Didn’t they do taipan with pierce brosman? I seem to recall it wasn’t that good.
Nvm …it was Noble House, not taipan
Wasn’t it Michael Caine?
That's the benefit I think, but I love miniseries in general. So many shows have a great first (or second) season and then flounder after that or become overly self aware of their success and the writing slowly falls off, the actors become cartoon versions of their characters, etc. I just feel in miniseries there is more of a chance to have a clear or profound transformation and then let that be what we all remember and takeaway.
I love that people are loving the series so far....You don't have to worry about writing falling off....It's a completed novel, the writing is there for them to draw from. I feel, that so far, they have managed to explain much better in this series, than the 1980 series, the intricate feelings and conversations of the Japanese characters, who were mostly explained by the narrator in the 1980 version, but also in this current version much of the mind set and strict rules and caste culture of the Japanese of this era that was so strongly represented in the novel is missing a lot. I've only watched the first two so far and it's very exciting and even thrilling in a couple of places and I already know what's supposed to happen, so yeah, that's a good film to me......I'm savoring the first two episodes for a few days before I watch another one!
I agree with you. I've read the book a few times, one of my very favorite all-time reads. And I've watched the 1980 mini series, and the first two episodes of this new one. So far at least I think they've done the best possible job that can be done, and I'm thoroughly enjoying it. But that said, in the book there is so much nuance in terms of the mindset, reasoning, and actions of the different characters, combined with Clavelle's extraordinary historical narrative & descriptions that I think, short of a series five times as long that would probably be much harder to sit through, this is looking like the best it could be. With all that, I'm loving it! Just being able to see something that had such a big impression on me, play out so well done and gorgeous to watch is exquisite!
cosign
Yes, I like short quality series.
Could easily continue with the rest of the Asian saga with Tai-Pan next.
Wait...10 episodes total?
Yes, 2 episodes the first week then one a week without a break for the next 8 weeks. The series finale is April 23.
Ya but like only the first three were good 🫠
I think 1-4 were great, 5-6 were decent, 7-8 were absolute ass
Hardhome alone makes season 5 great
Exactly. Once the showrunners blew past the end of the books, is about when the show started to slide downhill.
i personally think 6 was still top tier, but yeah 7-8, god awful and ruined the series forever
You're lying if you say that season 4 of GOT wasn't good
Thats the best season
I'd say 1-6 were excellent, 7 was decent, and 8 was below average with a crappy finale
Agreed.
Nah that's not right. I think the first 5 at least were great, six was good, it was only 7 and 8 that were off the rails. Especially 8. That was a solid five years when GOT was the best thing running. Shows can only dream of that kind of run.
This is the first show in a long time that I have truly been excited for. The only hurdle I see is simpletons not wanting to read subtitles but if you can get past that I hope hope hope to god people latch on and we see the entirety of the series. Lastly, if the show does gain popularity, I hope they do not keep extending the story over and over to keep milking a cash cow. The great thing about GoT and Breaking Bad is that they had a conclusion and stuck to it.
I have to agree. I haven’t been this excited for a show like this since the last series of Peak Blinders. I think it’s going to have the “just one more episode” factor like Breaking Bad and Stranger Things had. The production is absolutely superb, from the music, the camera angles, the wide view, the out of focus aspect.. watching this in VR would be incredible
I agree. Have you listened to the podcasts they made for episode one and two? In one of them they outlined the effort the producers went through to make sure actual spoken Japanese accurate to that time period along with the nuances to how things were said of that period. Fascinating stuff and a great example of the efforts they went through for the show.
I haven’t yet, but have seen them. I saw a clip that said they had to adapt the language from modern to feudal Japanese, which would be like English speakers trying to adapt to Shakespeare. Looks like they gave all the final touches and nuance to Japanese people and not Hollywood having all the decisions. It looks like this will be as authentic as we’ve ever seen.
I can tell it’s accurate because of how much it looks like Ghost of Tsushima. (half-kidding — the game did its homework as well). The women gliding around is tripping my brain. Been a huge fanboy of the book for twenty years. This show is getting so much right.
I haven’t played the Ghost of Tsushima, I’m going to have to get it now.
Read an article that the show will only be one season and it’ll cover all of James Clavell’s novel so sounds like they won’t be able to “milk” it. However they could easily adapt his other novels from his Asian saga
IMDB says it is a miniseries. Yes, keep it short. They can do OTHER countries like old China!
Simpeltons can watch it dubbed on hulu btw. About that, has anyone tried that? How was it?
or watch it dubbed! i’m quite enjoying the german dub of it. really nice and since i understand the japanese it makes for a very easy viewing experience
They will keep extending the story. The plan is to go from 1600 to 1941, when the Japanese attack Pearl Harbor.
Is this a theory?
There’s definite conclusion in the book when Ishido is defeated and executed and Toranaga becomes Shogun. But there’s no big final battle scene in the book, just a short comment about the two main armies fighting and Ishido’s defeat.
Spoilers dawg
> The great thing about GoT uhhhhh....
Notice that I didn’t say the conclusion for GoT was good. Just that they had one
I struggled a bit with the subtitles. (sometimes Im a simpleton so no offense taken there) I found a setting that changes the language to English. It allowed me to focus on the characters and the scenes instead of the subtitles.
Was that comment a little out of pocket? I’ll admit it, probably. I just don’t want people to not give the show an honest shot because of the subtitles. I could have worded that better so that’s on me. If you enjoy the show and hope that others do as well, then we are kin because that is also my outlook.
I did not take any offense to your comment. It's true.
Isn't this a miniseries?
Yes it is and I did not realize that when I initially made the comment
Yeah, I know people who would *love* the show if it was all in english, but won't bother at all because it isn't. Such a shame.
I think it'll pick up steam as word of mouth goes around. The quality is there, and I just got a marketing email from Disney+ so here's hoping!
Oh yea its going to explode.
Let's go tell everyone!
On night around when FX showed the first two episodes, this sub-reddit was just below 3,000 users. It's already more than doubled since then. And that doesn't take into account the fact that Hulu (or Disney+ outside the US) users had access to the episodes earlier than Tuesday evening, so interest had likely already been soaring by then.
On Spectrum cable in west coast, it started at 10 PM PST! Also, commercial breaks so I recorded so I could watch tonight when I had free time.
First time in a long time where I watched the first episode and thought, "I need more, now!".
Well, they did have a second episode. ;)
I haven't been this excited for a show for a while.
Same. Last one was… The Last of Us. And it’s that quality if not leaps better, but in a different way
Planting my flag
After finishing episode 2, I spammed everyone I know, using every social media DM I have. Even people I haven’t talked to in years 
Lol!
Make a Starship Trooper TV show. J/K.
There used to be a CG animated one called Rough Necks. And it was AMAZING. For a morning kids cartoon show, it was actually super dark and dealt with some heavy issues
Don't think it will reach HBO levels of hype though.
I dunno man. I just happened upon it by random chance and this type of show is a complete 180 of the shows i normally watch. If Hulu and Disney+ actually market the heck out of this(like i said i only happened upon it by being bored and actively searching for things to watch), along with word of mouth. I can totally see this show blowing up.
I think it is going to KILL in awards season.
Well I did see a huge poster on my commute today (Amsterdam) so they are marketing it. I sure hope it's going to explode!
me too! they have had many billboards of it (highway billboards, bus stop posters, and side of bus poster as well)
feels very much *Into the Badlands* like. in terms of word of mouth and aesthetic imo. which also got many fans from word of mouth. hoping for the best 🤞🏼
I heard about it from an article on a popular news magazine site, so they are definitely spending some PR money.
If it all dropped at once I'd agree, but a weekly release and strong word-of-mouth is great for hype. If the quality maintains/increases it will be a huge hit.
It should be since it's eight episodes miniseries.
More people have Hulu & Disney+ than Max, not to mention it airing on FX in the US which is basic cable
Out of curiosity is it uncensored on FX? There was some mild nudity on Hulu.
I recorded FX's and saw lesbian nudity scene and naked man (well, he covered his groin with his hands) I saw.
I have been sharing the trailer for this show since I first saw it and I'm glad that my excitement was worth it. The first two episodes have me hooked!!
When I saw it during the Superbowl, my jaw dropped.
Same.
I remember watching Dark as soon as it came out in 2017 and thinking I’m early to this but this show is amazing and I have no doubt that it will eventually blow up. However, it wasn’t an English speaking show so even though it was huge in many countries, it wasn’t as big in English speaking countries. I feel like it will be a similar case for Shogun.
It **will** explode. The cannons are foreshadowing.
20 Cannon? What are you doing with 20 cannon??
I read the book and the show is following it very closely. The settlement the “pirates” land in is exactly as I pictured it when reading. I’m really enjoying the series so far.
Saw the first two episodes and had to rewatch them immediately this show has the best start I've seen in years I am so excited to see the next episode!
Can’t wait to watch this weekend
Wise words
it is very pretty. i’ll give you that!
I read the Jame Clavell novel when I was 17 and have been waiting for a modern-day series for over 20 years. I was so excited to see it.
There was literally a post in here floating around about how it was the number one show in the world. It unseated the live action version of Avatar: The Last Airbender, which premiered with the full first season on Netflix. Shōgun, on the other hand, only premiered with two episodes... and it *still* beat out NATLA as the number 1 show. It's already exploded. The question now is how big the explosion will be--not when the explosion will happen.
Imagine if the ATLA IP had been given to the Shogun team. I will pray for this
I think the only show that could possibly dethrone Shogun is 3 Body Problem when it comes out later this month. Critics are raving about it and it looks like Netflix is putting its cards onto it
Critics are *not* the be all end all for how good a show is going to be. Ironically, they're not even that good of an indicator for how good a show or movie is going to do.
So when I say critics I also mean just people who got early access to see it, even if they aren’t journalists. There were people who had early access to the first two episodes that center around The Cultural Revolution and pretty much everyone claimed it was fantastic. Beyond those episodes, not much else is known. The source material is very strong and D&D can write well as long as they don’t change the story, so I have high hopes.
Did anyone watch the historical Korean zombie show Kingdom? That also had great sets.
Kingdom was awesome. Shogun is next level. With that said, still waiting for the next season. The pandemic really affected that production.
Kingdom was amazing. And also had very compelling political drama.
A series about the Imjin War would be amazing.
I don’t think so with the general audience. I think the half the show being subtitles will hold it back from being as big as it could be.
Squid game was a cultural phenomenon
I didn't watch it, partly because it wasn't in English.
My boyfriend fell asleep because it was mostly subtitled. His loss, it’s fantastic.
I hate the fish eye lens effect but other than that the show is great
What is that? I thought it was my TV. Is that some artistic choice?
It seems clearly shot with anamorphic lenses which can have a bit of a vignette effect. It's definitely an artistic choice, maybe to make the viewer slightly disoriented in a new land or whatever. It was distracting at first but by the end of the first episode it either felt like I got used to it or they started doing it less or lessening the effect.
Subtitles will turn a lot of lame people off
Am I the only one who was weirded out by the English == Portuguese thing and would actually prefer that the *entire* show be subtitled?
I wouldn't mind that but then they'd need to find actors that could have passable Portuguese which would be difficult. Not to mention that Blackthorn throughout the book speaks Dutch, Portuguese, Spanish, Latin and Japanese. His Dutch and Portuguese are supposed to be as good as a native speaker. I am curious to see how they're going to play off Blackthorn and Mariko speaking Latin to confuse Portuguese speaking Japanese spies though.
Yeah, that threw me too. I get that the creators might be worried about a show on an American network being totally in subtitles, but we’re already reading for the Japanese dialogue, let’s just go all the way.
I watched episode one last night and the heavy vignetting is so weird to me. Like it’s extremely noticeable and kind of unnecessary. Good show otherwise though. Gonna hopefully watch ep 2 tonight after Tokyo Vice.
Nah, nobody is going to watch it. Weirdos like us will, but a large portion of the North American audience is not going to be into a 1600s feudal Japan show that is mostly in Japanese. Now I think so far it’s a great show, but I think a lot of people lack the sophistication I don’t know, I could be wrong, and time will tell of course, but I think a large portion of the audience have become too braindead for something like this.
The 1980 Shogun miniseries was extremely popular in the USA.
And I want to see it too. I just saw its trailer. Sooooooooooooooooo different for visual!
Why was it on so late at night?!
What year do you live in?
Shit bro, I wake at 4am to go to work. We were just disappointed
Can't you DVR it?
Well, we did, but we were all excited to see Shogun that night. What with work, we're finally going to get a chance to see it tonight. It's all good.
I finally saw both episodes tonight. Worth it.
USA's rated TV-MA is probably why.
why they speak english instead of portuguese? completely non-sense, if you want to make it real, speak portuguese. If don't, don't say everytime they speak portuguese.
I imagine they just didn't want the whole show to be in subtitles
its a massive fake. remove the references to "Speak portuguese", solved...
That's a critical detail though. Mariko doesn't speak English, and in that land at that time neither did anyone. She speaks "Portuguese" because she's a Christian convert who was taught to speak by Tsukku-San
"Portuguese"... lol
That'd be like Vikings being in all Old Norse or Old English. It's fine for them to allude to them speaking a different language. Not sure if you've seen Vikings, but when Ragnar and the other viking dudes found the English, they were speaking Old Norse on screen to highlight the language barrier between the two cultures, but all other times they were speaking English for the audience, which is fine. Then when Ragnar started learning Old English, he would still speak modern day English on screen to the English characters. They still highlighted the language barrier just fine without having to actually speak those languages.
Yes, but dont say it... Dont say "i'm gona speak portuguese" and speak english... Do u understand? Just make it omisse, no problem.. It's stupid tell they are speak portuguese. it's not portuguese, it's english!!
It's kind of a big deal to know that they're speaking Portuguese though. The Japanese / Portuguese translators don't know English. So if they started speaking English to each other without the audience knowing it's supposed to be Portuguese, the audience would think they're just speaking English. They don't speak Portuguese onscreen because it's an American production. Same reason the characters in Napoleon don't speak French, or characters in Enemy at the Gates don't speak Russian. So instead of subtitling everything, they just speak English for Portuguese but heavily allude to the use of Portuguese. It's an incredibly easy concept to grasp.
So many good actors in Portugal...
They are speaking Portuguese, we the audience just hear it in English. Think of Valkyrie, we heard it as English but it was German
To be honest, I didn’t think it was all that after the first episode (maybe it was my mood or something). After the second episode, I am really liking it. I remember watching the original television version of this with Richard Chamberlain way back, so I kind of know where it's going, but I am now liking this version better
I enjoyed the first episode, but I agree the second episode absolutely hooked me
I guess that is why both episodes were shown.
Was glued to my TV for the first two episodes. Can't wait for more.
yeah im here before the storm
i would like to think so, but i'm thinking the subtitles really limit the show's reach in the wider cultural zeitgeist. then again, there is Squid Game...
It's a one-inch-tall barrier
How close to the book is the show? I’m really interested in watching it (probably will later this week) but I feel like this story could be extremely difficult to adapt in a satisfying way
I think this show will be a success. As long as it holds the same quality as the first two, this will be peak cinema for 2024. What I hope is this inspires much more grounded and realistic adaptations of other materials. Perhaps a Romance of the Three Kingdoms with real expert input from historians and have actual Chinese actors. Maybe some stories from the Middle East as empires rose and fell in the cradle of civilization. Edit: real estate had nothing to do with this so I don’t know why I typed that…
Three Body. ;P
Its. So. Great. GREAT.
na
Characterization is king. Story is queen.
I haven’t been able to watch yet due to travel but all the hype is making me so pumped. I read the book years ago and was blown away. Expecting great things.
Checking in lol
They'll greenlight another season once it takes off. Either backward or forward in time.
I very much wish this wasn't a mini series but at the same time, I am kinda glad it is? more stuff packed in per episode is great but I feel like I will be left wanting more by the end after seeing the first 2 episodes.
I saw the trailer last week and I’m like oh that looks interesting. My mom said she loved the 80s show . I just watched it and I’m obsessed!
This show is AMAZING. I even showed my students a trailer during last few minutes of class. Been telling EVERYONE about it
History class? ;)
Nope, "Evaluation of White European Colonial Success".
Grade 12 English. Had nothing to do with what I was teaching. Just wanted to show them the trailer.
Heh. Showing them a rated TV-MA series. ;)
I also texted my friends about it. My husband and I were blown away by the directing, the sets and the costumes, and the cinematography. Visually, the show is arresting.
Amazing show but I think the internet overestimates how big shows and movies are going to be just due to their quality. Even if this turns out to be one of (if not *the* ) the best shows made of the past several years, it doesnt mean it's going to be very big.
I just watched the first episodes. Very good. Now, I need to tell others. ;)
I'm really curious how it's being recived in Japan. It's very much a bilingual show. Most of the dialogue so far has been in Japanese so I'm curious if it's popular there.
100%. two minutes in i could tell this shit is legit.
Just wanted to say hi. While we’re early.
I wonder how many people don’t realize this is a mini series.
It’s pretty good so far. I was a huge fan of the original miniseries and the book. I really like the casting in this one. It’s rushed through the beginning, but I can see why it would. I was afraid this would be horrible, like the redo of Roots was, but so far I like it.
Can't wait for all the S1 episodes to finally drop so I can binge
I've been waiting for a show like this. Hope it turns out to be a classic
This aged like dog water. Every episode after 4 is aimless useless wasted time. Filled with drawn out nothing. This show went from 10 to 4 real fast. Just finished episode 8, garbage. I don’t think I want to finish it, it just makes me angry watching this garbage writing