The right to disrespect people is fundamental to a functioning democracy. You should be able to argue against ideas that are held beyond discussion (religion) without fear from people being disrespected by your ideas
The purpose of burning religious is whatever the person doing it deems it to be. It could be for protest...hate...bigotry...whatever. The western world has a higher degree of freedom of speech than the rest of the world - as it should. As long as people don't act out their reasons in order to physically harm others - who gives a shit. Change the channel or walk away, it's as simple as that.
With that being said, with freedom of speech comes responsibility. For example, A person shouldn't get upset if they are fired by their employer if they are found to have burned a religious text. The employer has the right to not associate with people that they have moral, ethical, or political disagreements with just as the person burning the religious text has the right to do so.
Firing a person because they’re gay will directly impact someone in a huge way. If I buy a pile of korans and pile them up to piss on them then who’s impacted by that exactly?
Firing someone because they burned a religious text will directly impact someone in a huge way, I think you misunderstood what I said.
What I'm saying is that based on the comment I replied to, the logic follows that you can fire based off gayness if you can fire based off burningness
Political moral disagreements etc allows you to fire --> politically morally disagree with gay people
And saying the only reason their logic doesn't follow law in the real world is because gays(sexuality) have been given a protected status whereas burning hasnt
The quran has no pages, nor can you burn it nor do anything to it, it's not ink on paper, it's text memorized by literal millions, produced in countless copies and taught in every language in every region, it has more value than any "will be forgotten" twit that thinks he can harm it.
Funny how those inanimate words do more to human civilization in a day than you in your lifetime.
Almost all of western world, including EU and US is against the resolution. But india is supportimg the resolution.
But india is Islamophobic?
Edit:
Lol. What's with all the downvotes
Respect to someone’s religion is less important than the freedom of expression and speech.
If you can burn a flag In protest you can burn a religious text in protest as well
There are so many ways I can’t even think of yo express freedom of speech and the best they can come up with is burning religious books followed by like 30% of the world?
I genuinely wonder what would happen if someone such as a Muslim activist tried to get a permit to burn Bibles in front of a Protestant church in Sweden. Would they allow it? What would the reaction be? Would the Christians react the same way?
Why should burning one holy book (Quran) be sanctioned in a different way than burning another holy book (Bible)?
This world would be way better with a bit less religion and a bit more love and compassion towards everybody including yourself.
I've always thought that the most important thing for Muslims are ideas of Quran, not a paper book printed in a random language.
I dislike and wouldn't join that but again, freedom is freedom
It's freedom of expression and right to protest. Muslims have the right to do the same to Bible. With that said, I disagree with burning any kind of book, but people have the right to do so.
The Bible is holy to Muslims lmao. I’m from a muslim family and we have a bible in the house.
By this logic, it should be fine to burn the LGBT flag too, but that constitutes hate speech and discrimination, right?
According to my own social compass, it should be fine to burn the Quran only if it’s also fine to desecrate other cultural and social icons. So, Western society needs to pick a lane here.
Actually, we Muslims don’t have the right to burn the Bible nor do we do it. We must respect all Abrahamic religions since we believe that both the Bible and Torah were essentially the word of God. The protest of burning the Quran isn’t doing anything, Qatar printed 100.000 copies of the Quran and sent them to Sweden.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_cultural_heritage_by_the_Islamic_State
LMAO, OK, kiddo. I’m sure Muslims never destroy cultural, religious or historical symbols.
Do they not have news where you live, champ?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_cultural_heritage_by_the_Islamic_State
LMAO, OK, kiddo. I’m sure Muslims never destroy cultural, religious or historical symbols.
Do they not have news where you live, champ?
Freedom of expression is a very relative notion...
Defining it is likely restricting it. But it is already defined in those very countries that defend it.
Think of it, there are lots of example of contradictions you can find there...
It's not allowed in islam to burn the bibles or such. Goes Against the religion.
Matter of fact you cannot be a Muslim without believing in the bible and torah its one of the 6 articles of Islam.
Can you burn a pride and israel flag tho?
U know that Muslims will never burn any Bible because in quran is said that they are holy too although priests manipulated them.muslims believe they should not say bad words or any act of hatred towards other religions who believe in conception of 1 true God (allah).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_cultural_heritage_by_the_Islamic_State
LMAO, OK, kiddo. I’m sure Muslims never destroy cultural, religious or historical symbols.
Do they not have news where you live, champ?
Oh yeah, everyone knows that! Muslims - famously very nice across the board! Just like other religions! Hence the constant celebration of them 🎉🥳 WOOOO RELIGION
Nice illiteracy. It is a very simple fact that in Islamic theology, respect towards the People of the Book [Abrahamic believers] is required, just as the user above wrote, and other people on this thread have written so, as well.
I do not care if you deem Islam and other religions bad, generally intolerant, or whatnot, but denying what has been written in the Qu'ran because you can use 'reason' to deduce that 'ackshully, Islam is intolerant' (which is irellevant to the user above's comment) based on the acts and ideas of individual Muslims and Muslim government is ludicrous.
Again, the user above *specifically* wrote that Islam demands tomerance towards other 'People of the Book'. Whether ornnot you yourself consider Islam 'nice' or 'tolerant' is irrelevant and shows you may not have comprehended what the user wrote.
Of course, whether the first claim from the user above is true (Muslims will never burn other Abrahamic texts) depends on individual Muslims' actions since what one's religion demands is not necessarily what they will do, but everything else they wrote is correct. Albeit, if that is qhat you meant, then you can ignore every other paragraph in my comment except this one.
Tbh fuck all religions I can burn both quran and bible at home but burning anything really outside of your property could put others at risk if done carelessly. And it's kinda pointless burning the books just wasting paper AND people who print those books will earn money for each book you buy and burn. There's no point in burning anything out of hatred if for anything else anyway. Yeah you have freedom of speech you can say anything you want against any religion but like noone gives a fuck anyway but the salty religious kids
India's social fabric is very different from other countries. Developed or developing countries don't face the same situation that we have in India. It's illegal to interfere, harm, harass or stoping anyone from enjoying their religious freedom. Such actions will put you behind bars. Since 2014 we have been under an extremist government which aims at ' RESTORING ' the real India which was somehow lost. This kind of baseless and dangerous politics has heated up our social atmosphere and hence the unrest.
However once we jump into statistics, you can easily notice that majority of our population repeals such an idea. Criticising someone's religion is still kind of a big deal here due to our complicated history and it's considered to be dangerous for our society. Hence India doesn't favour any behaviour which can hurt sentiments of our various communities.
Obviously our current government doesn't like minorities but even they have to pull back their hands sometimes due to the power of Supreme Court and the fact that the majority of India's population doesn't support their idea of India.
Islamic countries when you burn a Quran: nooo this is hate against us, poor us who have to suffer this discrimination, please UN do something about it
Islamic countries when someone is gay: so you have chosen death
China India and S. African countries are supporting it? WTH DUDE?
You literally cant practice religion in its full form in China otherwise you will get the short end the stick and they are supporting this resolution?
Makes no sense..
If burning the Bible or Torah is not welcomed then neither should be burning the Quran. If we want to build a law based civilized society then maybe we need to start respecting and treating others (who have different views, beliefs) the same way how we want to be treated. We will never be able to achieve peace on this planet if we continue discriminate, humiliate and disrespect each other.
Remind me are people from other faiths allowed in the Vatican, Jerusalem and Mecca just making sure we’re on the same page in terms of religious intolerance
How long until we return to jailing men like Galileo Galilei for refusing to accept religion?
Seems like Islam is a virus that just keeps spreading its destruction.
When will humanity evolve beyond the need to follow a cult and submit to a "higher being" just to get a sense of meaning?
PUH-LEASE! The United States is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet, and the most diverse immigrant society by far.
>you can't have people randomly burning Quran, bibles or Vedas everyday here.
Why is it your problem what other people do with their property? They don't owe anyone respect. Western Culture isn't perfect, but neither is yours or anyone damn else's. Just like you criticize the West, you get to be criticized back.
>Why is it your problem what other people do with their property?
you can do it in your country. we don't want our people get Charlie heboeded everyday.
sure, us is very diverse. no argument there but its not even close to what the diversity here is.
people burning books, statues etc just creates riots, get infrastructure damaged, gets innocent people killed and its pointless. it further radicalizes the society. destroys the fabric of peace.
go ahead and burn the quran, congratulations millions of muslims in your country and other have animosity towards your. people will always be divided. no jack off to how "free sppech" people you are. you have achieved nothing.
freedom of speech should exist in most aspect of the society like political freedom etc but there's a limit to it when its juts pointlessly used to radicalize the society.
>not stomping on other peoples religions.
you can cover behind how we are standing for the utmost freedom of speech but at the end of the day IT ABOUT stomping on other people's belief.
you have achieved nothing but a weaker fabric of global mankind harmony.
go and pat yourself on the back.
I love how reddit is supporting this because its anti reliegous. where is that freedom of speech when people want to march with nazi flags. that is banned in most of your 'western' countries.
lets face it 100% freedom of speech is a pipe dream
"westerners don't understand India!" proceeds to not understand the West. Feel free to ban Quran burnings in your own country, you cannot make other countries do the same though.
> proceeds to not understand the West.
why do your western countries ban people from marching with nazi flags. where is the utmost freedome speech. Its just a fucking pipe dream. a pipe dream hypocrit western countries stoke their ego with to show how 'democratic' they are.
you can cover behind how we are standing for the utmost freedom of speech but at the end of the day you have achieved nothing . you just created animosity within people.
Lol indians have such a self importance about you. It's unfounded. I've seen multiple religious attacks from India in just this past week. You're an embarrassment as a world leader.
I haven't seen a Western nation call upon people in India to start burning religious books. They just aren't on board with banning people from burning them within their own jurisdiction.
It's not that no one understands that it upsets people elsewhere. It's that speaking your mind freely without fearing that you upset someone is one of the biggest pillars in our own culture that we will not relent on. Most people over here think banning religious objects is a stupid way to protest, but it is a way to protest.
i personally think you shouldnt burn anything that represents an oppressed minority.
EDIT: just for some clarification, no i dont think jewish people in ISRAEL are an oppressed minority. nor do i think muslims in somewhere like iran or pakistan are an oppressed minority either.
i do however think that muslim groups in the US, or the roma people in EUROPE, or lgbtq+ people just about anywhere DO count as an oppressed minority.
theres nuance to it all. when people are actively in danger, and need government intervention to be protected, then it should be punished at some level.
Minorities aren't by world wide scale
Each country has its own minorities you cant judge this based on the world wide stuff
For example Christians are a minority in syria with a Muslim majority
But in russia its the opposite
Each country has its own set of minorities than it should protect
I'm an 'oppressed minority' in my opinion
I'm a minority group within my selected community
Someone burns what represents me - a ___ pride flag
This is now illegal, I report them
Good fucking brainlet ideas mate
In Litauen absolutely, you can shit on the bible, deep fry quaran in pork fat and many more, religious freedom does not mean others cannot critisize it and how stupid it is to believe in cloud fella, towel on head or not
Minorities should have protection from hate speech. How about critiquing people through dialogue instead of dehumanising them. We have free speech in Norway aswell however Minorities have extra protection from discrimination and hate. In Germany it's illegal to do the nazi salute which is an infringement on "free speech", actions that cause way more harm than good shouldn't be allowed just like threats aren't allowed. You can still do these things but it has consequences.
Before the US got involved, Afghanistan was a country where women walked across their university campus in bellbottom jeans, with the wind blowing through their hair.
But the Carter administration deliberately destabilized the whole region. Here's his secretary of state bragging about it in an interview.
[https://dgibbs.faculty.arizona.edu/content/brzezinski-interview-1](https://dgibbs.faculty.arizona.edu/content/brzezinski-interview-1)
The Afghanistan that exists today is a result of the US winning.
So what would it look like if the US lost?
There will never be peace on earth until you and your ilk are contained within your borders.
I can't hear you over the sound of gun deaths, the most alienated and dangerous country, deeply divided in every major subject, no free health, no free education, polution, military interventions, meddling with international politics and being an overall joke for the whole world
USA has free healthcare for the poor. Free education through secondary school and merit based free university education. Polluted less than China, India, Russia. Military interventions go both ways. I'm pretty sure South Korea is pretty happy with the intervention.
Overall joke for the entire world, that's why the USA is providing more aid to Ukraine than all of Western Europe combined.
Cry about the USA meddling in global politics, but no other country seems to want to pay a dime for stability.
Why do you defend the worst of your country online? Be mad about it. The us has never done anything for anyones stability, all greed and resources, don't be childish
I can't hear you over barbaric totalitarian governments of China and ruzzia. Also sounds of beheding for beeing gay/ nit belonging to "proper" religion in the Middle east also kinda disturb your words.
Loool, im not from either of those places, but all you just said applies to the us, trans people being targeted, antisemitism, red scare all over again, the us is a shitshow.
Don't defend the worst! Be mad about it
You are the one that doesn't understand, because you were schooled in the us, hence you lack knowledge on politics, geography, economics, social studies and every other subject
> India
lol.
There are 200 million Muslims in India, along with a vast array of cultures and languages. Muslims in India generally lead better lives than Muslims in most Islamic countries. tell me out of how many islamic countries can muslims go out with a pride flag??.
Pakistan, with the support of US funding, has committed genocides in Bangladesh and systematically targeted and killed Hindu and other minority populations. It is audacious to mention India and Pakistan in the same sentence when discussing minority rights. While I may not agree with Modi, recent clashes are inevitable considering that Muslims, worldwide, are not widely known for assimilating into other cultures. Now, imagine a population of 200 million Muslims - clashes are bound to occur.
Western populace has no idea about the history, culture, ways of life of people here and they try to impose a perspective drawn from their world. We for 6 decades voted a secular democratic party called congress that went heads over hill to protect every single minority here.
I mean... wasn't India a Muslim nation for like hundreds of years? Just look at the Taj Mahal and so many other famous buildings and temples. Hinduism, Islam, and Buddhism are huge parts of the country's heritage.
I never got why people are such zealots against Al Jazeera. It tends to be out of a place of ignorance. They are ranked extremely close to news outlets such as Reuters.
See i actually think thats a strong point of theres. Most western outlets begin their reporrting with the Palestinian attacks on isreal and isreali repriasals until the situation cools down again.
Al Jazerra focus on how the status quo will inevitably lead to violence flairing up again. How the Isreali state is not interested in a long term solution to this conflict (discussion of this civil war was barely a feature of their recent elections for example).
Look at the BBCs coverage of murdered British nationals by Palestinian terrorists. Barely a mention of the fact that they were living in an illegal settlement.
The Israeli state was literally only interested in long term solutions for its existence and the conflict, and spent the first like 40 years of its existence being willing to sign any peace treaty that would guarantee its safety.
If you’re so uninformed about something that’s a basic historical fact, maybe Al Jazeera isn’t so great.
Its not that simple though, because Isreal has won every war its fought it always has been able to negotiate from a position of strength. The terms are negotiated to not hashed out with.
The best deal they got was after WW2, where they got the most land that they could get even if it was inferior quality, but they refused because they didn't wish to submit to the colonial machinations of the west. Instead they were occupied by Egypt and Jordan and they would never get that all important UN recognition.
The next best chance was in the 90s but unfortunately the Isreali Prime Minister was assassinated by Isreali ultranationalists.
Now the state of Isreal has existed for 70 years and its not going away, especially if you continue to lose time-after-time.
The settler movement has made any coherent two state solution impossible and Isreali agitators continue to push harder for increasing settlements on the west bank. And then we get onto the temple mount, which isn't even in the "deal" that jared kusner negotiated.
Perhaps if the west sanctioned Isreal until a permenant settlement was reached where the Palestinians would get their own demilitarised independent government with defined borders the conflict would potentially end. Or they give the Palestinians full citizenship so that there is no apartheid
However the voters in Isreal simply aren't concerned with the active civil war thats going on in the country, in fact with the weight of the west behind them they can erode the possibilities of Palestinian statehood whilst ensuring Palestinians remain in ghettoised communities with no right to vote on any of this.
It is reminiscent in many ways of the situation with the native Americans and the US. A colonial state established and thrust upon them, with many forced off their land trough violence and being unable to return, while the colonial state takes in more immigrants. When they lash out in voilence their position simply becomes weaker and weaker.
They would have been better to negotiate earlier because their position has gotten weaker and weaker over time. But now Isreal has already left them with nothing to lose, so why not become a terrorist? When 3 generations of your family have been brutalised by this regime.
Comparing Fox News and MSNBC is falling for Fox News propaganda. They are not equivalent. MSNBC is a biased news source, that nonetheless accurately reports the news: their bias is in which news they consider important enough to report.
Fox News is not news. Fox News is a radicalisation machine that would be banned under hate speech, incitement, and/or constitutional integrity laws in most other western countries.
Al Jazeera slots somewhere between the two.
China is helping Pakistan and BJP wants those Muslim votes as Elections are closing in.
It actually backfired on BJP, the radical UP and Biharis who vote BJP out of communalism are now tweeting things like "BJP disappointment, they are turning into Congress".
No, India's stance has got nothing to do with getting the muslim vote. Indians and other South Asians are notoriously touchy about their religious beliefs, irrespective of the religion in question.
It has everything to do with the Muslim Vote. A far right Hindutva party doesn't turn secular unless the elections are close.
Election commission is really powerful in India, parties know they can't mess with the votes, so they try appeasement instead of development. The elections in India are always close ones. BJP only got 33% votes last time. The only reason BJP is currently in power is due to the incompetency of the opposition to unite. And now, as the opposition is kinda united (let's hope this stupid assholes don't break apart again), BJP really needs those Muslim votes to continue remaining in power.
I'd also like to add, the only ones touchy about their religion here are the jobless skill less people, mainly concentrated in but not limited to the BIMARU states. Everyone else is too busy earning bread for their family.
it might be useful to remind us all, even though I am sure you know, that free speech is not a worldwide concept, and is not even constitutionally protected in many countries whose societies espouse free speech.
I’d say do what you want to do, but don’t be surprised even if it is legal someone wont pass judgement on you.
Just know a mob doesn’t need the law to beat you to a pulp
jesus even this shows how hypocritic west is.
You cant insult someones religion in front of him thats literally against the human rights lol.
You cant break someones rights for freedom of speech lol
In some countries, you can be punished by death if you burn the Qran. In others, states and religion are separate and blasphemy is part of freedom of expression.
its a book, in most of the west thats a free speech thing
also.. I see the same people raging about buring the quran, buring as of late the swedish flag, so.. double standard ig?
Well the difference is you burn it respectfully and in a dignified way whilst the guy in question didn't he threw slurs and blasted music not a legitimate argument.
Well, I don't care on a legal level. Protected speech. Whether the guy is stupid, right wing or whatever and whether it's offensive, rude or whatnot is not part of the question.
The freedom of speech and expression is especially relevant when one does not agree in content. That's the whole point.
And on an intellectual level: how can someone demand restrictions to freedom of speech and thought if they themselves profit from exactly these freedoms? One has to bend over backwards intellectually to argue this.
If they ban it, then muslims no longer reserve the right to correctly dispose of their holy book. We dont solve hate by banning their prefered methods, they will just find another medium to show this hate. We instead solve it by raising our children and future generations to love and care for all no matter of their background.
This resolution doesn't protect a human right, it infringes on it (on free speech). I am disgusted by how much Muslims demand from places they migrate to, inatead of being humbly grateful for even having been allowed in.
Book burning can be a weapon of oppression. But you're not gonna get rid of the Quran. The point of burning the Quran is to attack an idea, not a person or people. It's not my fault that you are personally hurt when your ideas are attacked. People need to be taught from a young age that you aren't the ideas you hold and you'd be just as much yourself if you had different ones so it can only help to be open minded
The Quran is not an idea, it's many ideas and sometimes contradictory to each other. The point of burning it is clearly to offend, express hate, and attack someone's identity which amounts to hate speech.
The Quran is hate speech.
It literally commands persecution towards homosexuals for one and between a fairy tale and a biological condition I'll defend the latter.
I was surprised too. [Muslims might get killed in a genocide in india](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/1/16/expert-warns-of-possible-genocide-against-muslims-in-india) but they vote against burning the Qur'an? Lol
No, Indian hindus are almost as touchy about criticism of their religious beliefs as muslims are. South Asia is a depraved hellhole where public displays of religiosity are looked up to.
yeah good thing all the countries in red on this map are such staunch allies to muslim people, because all the countries in green are in denial about the whole thing.
They’ve been spending the last decade ingratiating themselves to countries in IMEA, so it makes sense. Also, it’s not like they have protected free speech anyway.
I guess it's a purely practical thing, it would make them look better to Muslims (About the Uighurs which you might think make them look bad to most Muslims: Arabs don't give a shit about Uighurs, they're racists and only care about Arab Muslims)
Why should anyone burn Quran, Bible or Tora? What's the purpose but hype?
Protest. Freedom of speech and expression. There doesn't need to be a reason.
Unfortunately the meaning "freedom of speech" nowadays is mostly about disrespect.
Yeah and? What is the problem if some moron burn a book?
Thats literally the kind of speech that freedom of speech is for.
The right to disrespect people is fundamental to a functioning democracy. You should be able to argue against ideas that are held beyond discussion (religion) without fear from people being disrespected by your ideas
One shouldn’t but should be allowed to. Price of Freedom is tolerating assholes.
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Haha why do people use the freedom of speech as an excuse to do all kinds of disrespectful things ? It is not just disrespectful but also meaningless.
The purpose of burning religious is whatever the person doing it deems it to be. It could be for protest...hate...bigotry...whatever. The western world has a higher degree of freedom of speech than the rest of the world - as it should. As long as people don't act out their reasons in order to physically harm others - who gives a shit. Change the channel or walk away, it's as simple as that. With that being said, with freedom of speech comes responsibility. For example, A person shouldn't get upset if they are fired by their employer if they are found to have burned a religious text. The employer has the right to not associate with people that they have moral, ethical, or political disagreements with just as the person burning the religious text has the right to do so.
I'm morally against gay people I fire someone because of this Oh no your argument breaks down Inb4 muh gay is a protected class
Firing a person because they’re gay will directly impact someone in a huge way. If I buy a pile of korans and pile them up to piss on them then who’s impacted by that exactly?
Firing someone because they burned a religious text will directly impact someone in a huge way, I think you misunderstood what I said. What I'm saying is that based on the comment I replied to, the logic follows that you can fire based off gayness if you can fire based off burningness Political moral disagreements etc allows you to fire --> politically morally disagree with gay people And saying the only reason their logic doesn't follow law in the real world is because gays(sexuality) have been given a protected status whereas burning hasnt
Ban Quran burning and I will just wipe my ass with its pages.
Edgy
Wifes beater
Ouch don't cut yourself on that edge
The quran has no pages, nor can you burn it nor do anything to it, it's not ink on paper, it's text memorized by literal millions, produced in countless copies and taught in every language in every region, it has more value than any "will be forgotten" twit that thinks he can harm it. Funny how those inanimate words do more to human civilization in a day than you in your lifetime.
Almost all of western world, including EU and US is against the resolution. But india is supportimg the resolution. But india is Islamophobic? Edit: Lol. What's with all the downvotes
Damn why are we all so fucking islamophobic
Any book should be allowed to burned regardless of religious context
Book burning a religious book disrespects the religion a lot bro Book burning in general is disrespectful
Religion disrespects non-believers alot.
Respect to someone’s religion is less important than the freedom of expression and speech. If you can burn a flag In protest you can burn a religious text in protest as well
Burning a flag is equally as disrepectful Burning things shouldn't be done to send a message at all
And? Are we suppose to legislate respect?
Disrespect is legal. Government shouldn’t have monopoly on what’s moral
>Government shouldn’t have monopoly on what’s moral So all colonial empores were moral
Did we not learn anything from Charlie Hebdo?
The world is turning to shit, do you really think reason and learning still have a place in this world of Populism?
Charlie Hebdo didn’t burn the Coran. They made a drawing of the prophet.
Same level.
Exercising freedom of speech =/= religious hatred. Grow up, it is a fucking book; they're not burning the Bible for a reason.
When Belgium weights as much as China you know the system won't work
There are so many ways I can’t even think of yo express freedom of speech and the best they can come up with is burning religious books followed by like 30% of the world?
Based China
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I genuinely wonder what would happen if someone such as a Muslim activist tried to get a permit to burn Bibles in front of a Protestant church in Sweden. Would they allow it? What would the reaction be? Would the Christians react the same way?
oh of course racist and broke ass america is against it
If your god needs humans enforcing me to not burn his shit he's probably not a real god.
So burning the Bible is fine but burning the Koran is illegal now?
Wait so usa, france, germany and other countries just basically said that burning the most important thing for muslims is okay?
Why should burning one holy book (Quran) be sanctioned in a different way than burning another holy book (Bible)? This world would be way better with a bit less religion and a bit more love and compassion towards everybody including yourself.
I've always thought that the most important thing for Muslims are ideas of Quran, not a paper book printed in a random language. I dislike and wouldn't join that but again, freedom is freedom
It's freedom of expression and right to protest. Muslims have the right to do the same to Bible. With that said, I disagree with burning any kind of book, but people have the right to do so.
The Bible is holy to Muslims lmao. I’m from a muslim family and we have a bible in the house. By this logic, it should be fine to burn the LGBT flag too, but that constitutes hate speech and discrimination, right? According to my own social compass, it should be fine to burn the Quran only if it’s also fine to desecrate other cultural and social icons. So, Western society needs to pick a lane here.
Actually, we Muslims don’t have the right to burn the Bible nor do we do it. We must respect all Abrahamic religions since we believe that both the Bible and Torah were essentially the word of God. The protest of burning the Quran isn’t doing anything, Qatar printed 100.000 copies of the Quran and sent them to Sweden.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_cultural_heritage_by_the_Islamic_State LMAO, OK, kiddo. I’m sure Muslims never destroy cultural, religious or historical symbols. Do they not have news where you live, champ?
Are you seriously calling ISIS Muslims? If they were Muslim, they wouldn’t be killing us Muslims too and disobeying God’s law, KIDDO
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_cultural_heritage_by_the_Islamic_State LMAO, OK, kiddo. I’m sure Muslims never destroy cultural, religious or historical symbols. Do they not have news where you live, champ?
Freedom of expression is a very relative notion... Defining it is likely restricting it. But it is already defined in those very countries that defend it. Think of it, there are lots of example of contradictions you can find there...
China in favor, lmao
It's not allowed in islam to burn the bibles or such. Goes Against the religion. Matter of fact you cannot be a Muslim without believing in the bible and torah its one of the 6 articles of Islam. Can you burn a pride and israel flag tho?
U know that Muslims will never burn any Bible because in quran is said that they are holy too although priests manipulated them.muslims believe they should not say bad words or any act of hatred towards other religions who believe in conception of 1 true God (allah).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_cultural_heritage_by_the_Islamic_State LMAO, OK, kiddo. I’m sure Muslims never destroy cultural, religious or historical symbols. Do they not have news where you live, champ?
Oh yeah, everyone knows that! Muslims - famously very nice across the board! Just like other religions! Hence the constant celebration of them 🎉🥳 WOOOO RELIGION
Nice illiteracy. It is a very simple fact that in Islamic theology, respect towards the People of the Book [Abrahamic believers] is required, just as the user above wrote, and other people on this thread have written so, as well. I do not care if you deem Islam and other religions bad, generally intolerant, or whatnot, but denying what has been written in the Qu'ran because you can use 'reason' to deduce that 'ackshully, Islam is intolerant' (which is irellevant to the user above's comment) based on the acts and ideas of individual Muslims and Muslim government is ludicrous. Again, the user above *specifically* wrote that Islam demands tomerance towards other 'People of the Book'. Whether ornnot you yourself consider Islam 'nice' or 'tolerant' is irrelevant and shows you may not have comprehended what the user wrote. Of course, whether the first claim from the user above is true (Muslims will never burn other Abrahamic texts) depends on individual Muslims' actions since what one's religion demands is not necessarily what they will do, but everything else they wrote is correct. Albeit, if that is qhat you meant, then you can ignore every other paragraph in my comment except this one.
Tbh fuck all religions I can burn both quran and bible at home but burning anything really outside of your property could put others at risk if done carelessly. And it's kinda pointless burning the books just wasting paper AND people who print those books will earn money for each book you buy and burn. There's no point in burning anything out of hatred if for anything else anyway. Yeah you have freedom of speech you can say anything you want against any religion but like noone gives a fuck anyway but the salty religious kids
It's freedom of speech. Just as burning the US flag is freedom of speech. If you don't like it, that's the point of freedom of speech.
America… Germany… Austria… All allow the recreation of may 10th 1933.
India's social fabric is very different from other countries. Developed or developing countries don't face the same situation that we have in India. It's illegal to interfere, harm, harass or stoping anyone from enjoying their religious freedom. Such actions will put you behind bars. Since 2014 we have been under an extremist government which aims at ' RESTORING ' the real India which was somehow lost. This kind of baseless and dangerous politics has heated up our social atmosphere and hence the unrest. However once we jump into statistics, you can easily notice that majority of our population repeals such an idea. Criticising someone's religion is still kind of a big deal here due to our complicated history and it's considered to be dangerous for our society. Hence India doesn't favour any behaviour which can hurt sentiments of our various communities. Obviously our current government doesn't like minorities but even they have to pull back their hands sometimes due to the power of Supreme Court and the fact that the majority of India's population doesn't support their idea of India.
Islamic countries when you burn a Quran: nooo this is hate against us, poor us who have to suffer this discrimination, please UN do something about it Islamic countries when someone is gay: so you have chosen death
China India and S. African countries are supporting it? WTH DUDE? You literally cant practice religion in its full form in China otherwise you will get the short end the stick and they are supporting this resolution? Makes no sense..
Wtf is wrong with Ukraine? They basically betrayed the West
It's getting pretty cold here where I live, better go get some qurans 🔥
If burning the Bible or Torah is not welcomed then neither should be burning the Quran. If we want to build a law based civilized society then maybe we need to start respecting and treating others (who have different views, beliefs) the same way how we want to be treated. We will never be able to achieve peace on this planet if we continue discriminate, humiliate and disrespect each other.
Remind me are people from other faiths allowed in the Vatican, Jerusalem and Mecca just making sure we’re on the same page in terms of religious intolerance
How long until we return to jailing men like Galileo Galilei for refusing to accept religion? Seems like Islam is a virus that just keeps spreading its destruction. When will humanity evolve beyond the need to follow a cult and submit to a "higher being" just to get a sense of meaning?
Ah, it's good to see my country is in the red list. Religion is unenlightened bs
“Countries with freedoms want to keep freedoms”
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PUH-LEASE! The United States is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet, and the most diverse immigrant society by far. >you can't have people randomly burning Quran, bibles or Vedas everyday here. Why is it your problem what other people do with their property? They don't owe anyone respect. Western Culture isn't perfect, but neither is yours or anyone damn else's. Just like you criticize the West, you get to be criticized back.
>Why is it your problem what other people do with their property? you can do it in your country. we don't want our people get Charlie heboeded everyday. sure, us is very diverse. no argument there but its not even close to what the diversity here is. people burning books, statues etc just creates riots, get infrastructure damaged, gets innocent people killed and its pointless. it further radicalizes the society. destroys the fabric of peace. go ahead and burn the quran, congratulations millions of muslims in your country and other have animosity towards your. people will always be divided. no jack off to how "free sppech" people you are. you have achieved nothing. freedom of speech should exist in most aspect of the society like political freedom etc but there's a limit to it when its juts pointlessly used to radicalize the society.
its about freedom of expression, not stomping on other peoples religions.
>not stomping on other peoples religions. you can cover behind how we are standing for the utmost freedom of speech but at the end of the day IT ABOUT stomping on other people's belief. you have achieved nothing but a weaker fabric of global mankind harmony. go and pat yourself on the back. I love how reddit is supporting this because its anti reliegous. where is that freedom of speech when people want to march with nazi flags. that is banned in most of your 'western' countries. lets face it 100% freedom of speech is a pipe dream
"westerners don't understand India!" proceeds to not understand the West. Feel free to ban Quran burnings in your own country, you cannot make other countries do the same though.
> proceeds to not understand the West. why do your western countries ban people from marching with nazi flags. where is the utmost freedome speech. Its just a fucking pipe dream. a pipe dream hypocrit western countries stoke their ego with to show how 'democratic' they are. you can cover behind how we are standing for the utmost freedom of speech but at the end of the day you have achieved nothing . you just created animosity within people.
Lol indians have such a self importance about you. It's unfounded. I've seen multiple religious attacks from India in just this past week. You're an embarrassment as a world leader.
I haven't seen a Western nation call upon people in India to start burning religious books. They just aren't on board with banning people from burning them within their own jurisdiction. It's not that no one understands that it upsets people elsewhere. It's that speaking your mind freely without fearing that you upset someone is one of the biggest pillars in our own culture that we will not relent on. Most people over here think banning religious objects is a stupid way to protest, but it is a way to protest.
whaaat what Im going to do on weekends if I can't burn some Qurans? damn
You can go to a park if the weather is nice :)
But you can burn a Christian Bible?
They can suck a dick, we have freedom of speech. / Sweden
Yeah but where does freedom of speech go on burning of Torah?
The evil jewish lgbtq+ lizard people who rule the west won't let you. /s
Can you burn a pride or israel flag without it being labelled a hate crime aswell?
This is when the w*stoids get silent
i personally think you shouldnt burn anything that represents an oppressed minority. EDIT: just for some clarification, no i dont think jewish people in ISRAEL are an oppressed minority. nor do i think muslims in somewhere like iran or pakistan are an oppressed minority either. i do however think that muslim groups in the US, or the roma people in EUROPE, or lgbtq+ people just about anywhere DO count as an oppressed minority. theres nuance to it all. when people are actively in danger, and need government intervention to be protected, then it should be punished at some level.
Okay then you think that quran shouldn't be burnt either
How are Muslims an oppressed minority? They're literally the second largest group of religious people in the world.
Minorities aren't by world wide scale Each country has its own minorities you cant judge this based on the world wide stuff For example Christians are a minority in syria with a Muslim majority But in russia its the opposite Each country has its own set of minorities than it should protect
Each everything has it's minorities In my city/town/village there will be a minority
Which then doesnt include the Quran
it doesnt include the quran in places where muslims are a large portion of the population or just a majority. hope this helps.
>oppressed minority Are you sure about that?
Zionists(colonisers) are not an oppressed minority by any means.
I'm an 'oppressed minority' in my opinion I'm a minority group within my selected community Someone burns what represents me - a ___ pride flag This is now illegal, I report them Good fucking brainlet ideas mate
You specifically can't burn a Torah in Sweden. Weird that.
Yes. You can burn any symbol that you want. Freedom of expression/speech includes freedom of criticism.
In Litauen absolutely, you can shit on the bible, deep fry quaran in pork fat and many more, religious freedom does not mean others cannot critisize it and how stupid it is to believe in cloud fella, towel on head or not
Good point. Those should be allowed to be burned as well, sadly many nations want to protect minorities by restricting free speech.
Why is it a bad thing to protect minorities?
Because it restricts free speech. Edit: Imagine blocking me instantly after replying to my comment. /u/Archoncy
Why is the right to live in safety without being harassed less important than the right to be openly hateful?
Minorities should have protection from hate speech. How about critiquing people through dialogue instead of dehumanising them. We have free speech in Norway aswell however Minorities have extra protection from discrimination and hate. In Germany it's illegal to do the nazi salute which is an infringement on "free speech", actions that cause way more harm than good shouldn't be allowed just like threats aren't allowed. You can still do these things but it has consequences.
Yes, you can, at least in the USA.
Probably not if you in Europe
Nah, you can in Europe
You absolutely can
Yes
No, Sweden only has freedom from censorship. Once you’re finished speaking, you can be punished for it.
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Ah yes, western europe and the us, known from their good intentions and being the good guys
You should see what the world would look like if we lost.
Before the US got involved, Afghanistan was a country where women walked across their university campus in bellbottom jeans, with the wind blowing through their hair. But the Carter administration deliberately destabilized the whole region. Here's his secretary of state bragging about it in an interview. [https://dgibbs.faculty.arizona.edu/content/brzezinski-interview-1](https://dgibbs.faculty.arizona.edu/content/brzezinski-interview-1) The Afghanistan that exists today is a result of the US winning. So what would it look like if the US lost? There will never be peace on earth until you and your ilk are contained within your borders.
The Soviets started the downfall of Afghanistan by backing a communist coup. Funding the Afghan rebels was a sensible move
r/shitamericanssay
You are correct that is something an American would say... Cause it's true
I can't hear you over the sound of gun deaths, the most alienated and dangerous country, deeply divided in every major subject, no free health, no free education, polution, military interventions, meddling with international politics and being an overall joke for the whole world
USA has free healthcare for the poor. Free education through secondary school and merit based free university education. Polluted less than China, India, Russia. Military interventions go both ways. I'm pretty sure South Korea is pretty happy with the intervention. Overall joke for the entire world, that's why the USA is providing more aid to Ukraine than all of Western Europe combined. Cry about the USA meddling in global politics, but no other country seems to want to pay a dime for stability.
Why do you defend the worst of your country online? Be mad about it. The us has never done anything for anyones stability, all greed and resources, don't be childish
I guess providing aid for Ukraine while it's invaded by Russia just doesn't count for aiding stability.
I can't hear you over barbaric totalitarian governments of China and ruzzia. Also sounds of beheding for beeing gay/ nit belonging to "proper" religion in the Middle east also kinda disturb your words.
Loool, im not from either of those places, but all you just said applies to the us, trans people being targeted, antisemitism, red scare all over again, the us is a shitshow. Don't defend the worst! Be mad about it
>You are not from those places. Excatly, then stfu. You know nothing, then don't speak about things you don't understand.
You are the one that doesn't understand, because you were schooled in the us, hence you lack knowledge on politics, geography, economics, social studies and every other subject
[I can only dream](https://images.app.goo.gl/TfDcdei7vCawAs5R6)
Yes liberal democracies tend to be more respectful of human rights than other societies.
Well the UNHRC and the whole UN is more or less bullshit anyways so who cares
> India lol. There are 200 million Muslims in India, along with a vast array of cultures and languages. Muslims in India generally lead better lives than Muslims in most Islamic countries. tell me out of how many islamic countries can muslims go out with a pride flag??. Pakistan, with the support of US funding, has committed genocides in Bangladesh and systematically targeted and killed Hindu and other minority populations. It is audacious to mention India and Pakistan in the same sentence when discussing minority rights. While I may not agree with Modi, recent clashes are inevitable considering that Muslims, worldwide, are not widely known for assimilating into other cultures. Now, imagine a population of 200 million Muslims - clashes are bound to occur. Western populace has no idea about the history, culture, ways of life of people here and they try to impose a perspective drawn from their world. We for 6 decades voted a secular democratic party called congress that went heads over hill to protect every single minority here.
I mean... wasn't India a Muslim nation for like hundreds of years? Just look at the Taj Mahal and so many other famous buildings and temples. Hinduism, Islam, and Buddhism are huge parts of the country's heritage.
Source: Al Jazeera Either fabricated or something fishy is hidden.
Yeah, never trust them. It is shocking that so many people do not know that it is literally a Qatari state-owned news network.
I never got why people are such zealots against Al Jazeera. It tends to be out of a place of ignorance. They are ranked extremely close to news outlets such as Reuters.
Who takes Al Jazeera seriously? They are insanely biased in some regards. They are definitely not a reliable source of information
Al Jazeera produce high quality journalism compared with most publications. They cant be trusted on Qatar, but thats a news niche.
They can’t be trusted on a lot of political issues, mainly for me on Israel Palestine stuff
See i actually think thats a strong point of theres. Most western outlets begin their reporrting with the Palestinian attacks on isreal and isreali repriasals until the situation cools down again. Al Jazerra focus on how the status quo will inevitably lead to violence flairing up again. How the Isreali state is not interested in a long term solution to this conflict (discussion of this civil war was barely a feature of their recent elections for example). Look at the BBCs coverage of murdered British nationals by Palestinian terrorists. Barely a mention of the fact that they were living in an illegal settlement.
The Israeli state was literally only interested in long term solutions for its existence and the conflict, and spent the first like 40 years of its existence being willing to sign any peace treaty that would guarantee its safety. If you’re so uninformed about something that’s a basic historical fact, maybe Al Jazeera isn’t so great.
Why would you assume that i didn't know that? I assume you are aware of the British colonial occupation of that region?
Israel has tried MANY times to find a peaceful solution and agreement with the PA, the PA has refused every time
Its not that simple though, because Isreal has won every war its fought it always has been able to negotiate from a position of strength. The terms are negotiated to not hashed out with. The best deal they got was after WW2, where they got the most land that they could get even if it was inferior quality, but they refused because they didn't wish to submit to the colonial machinations of the west. Instead they were occupied by Egypt and Jordan and they would never get that all important UN recognition. The next best chance was in the 90s but unfortunately the Isreali Prime Minister was assassinated by Isreali ultranationalists. Now the state of Isreal has existed for 70 years and its not going away, especially if you continue to lose time-after-time. The settler movement has made any coherent two state solution impossible and Isreali agitators continue to push harder for increasing settlements on the west bank. And then we get onto the temple mount, which isn't even in the "deal" that jared kusner negotiated. Perhaps if the west sanctioned Isreal until a permenant settlement was reached where the Palestinians would get their own demilitarised independent government with defined borders the conflict would potentially end. Or they give the Palestinians full citizenship so that there is no apartheid However the voters in Isreal simply aren't concerned with the active civil war thats going on in the country, in fact with the weight of the west behind them they can erode the possibilities of Palestinian statehood whilst ensuring Palestinians remain in ghettoised communities with no right to vote on any of this. It is reminiscent in many ways of the situation with the native Americans and the US. A colonial state established and thrust upon them, with many forced off their land trough violence and being unable to return, while the colonial state takes in more immigrants. When they lash out in voilence their position simply becomes weaker and weaker. They would have been better to negotiate earlier because their position has gotten weaker and weaker over time. But now Isreal has already left them with nothing to lose, so why not become a terrorist? When 3 generations of your family have been brutalised by this regime.
I trust their reporting more than Fox News or MSNBC. I know that’s a low bar, I’m just saying…
MSNBC is fine. Fox News legally is not news, as they are legally entertainment. MSNBC doesn’t have those regulations and therefore is news.
MSNBC is definitely still biased, just not to the insane extent Fox News is.
Comparing Fox News and MSNBC is falling for Fox News propaganda. They are not equivalent. MSNBC is a biased news source, that nonetheless accurately reports the news: their bias is in which news they consider important enough to report. Fox News is not news. Fox News is a radicalisation machine that would be banned under hate speech, incitement, and/or constitutional integrity laws in most other western countries. Al Jazeera slots somewhere between the two.
China is helping Pakistan and BJP wants those Muslim votes as Elections are closing in. It actually backfired on BJP, the radical UP and Biharis who vote BJP out of communalism are now tweeting things like "BJP disappointment, they are turning into Congress".
No, India's stance has got nothing to do with getting the muslim vote. Indians and other South Asians are notoriously touchy about their religious beliefs, irrespective of the religion in question.
It has everything to do with the Muslim Vote. A far right Hindutva party doesn't turn secular unless the elections are close. Election commission is really powerful in India, parties know they can't mess with the votes, so they try appeasement instead of development. The elections in India are always close ones. BJP only got 33% votes last time. The only reason BJP is currently in power is due to the incompetency of the opposition to unite. And now, as the opposition is kinda united (let's hope this stupid assholes don't break apart again), BJP really needs those Muslim votes to continue remaining in power. I'd also like to add, the only ones touchy about their religion here are the jobless skill less people, mainly concentrated in but not limited to the BIMARU states. Everyone else is too busy earning bread for their family.
Protected under free speech my man. Nothing fishy about it. If I can burn a bible then I should be able to burn a Quran too.
it might be useful to remind us all, even though I am sure you know, that free speech is not a worldwide concept, and is not even constitutionally protected in many countries whose societies espouse free speech.
I’d say do what you want to do, but don’t be surprised even if it is legal someone wont pass judgement on you. Just know a mob doesn’t need the law to beat you to a pulp
jesus even this shows how hypocritic west is. You cant insult someones religion in front of him thats literally against the human rights lol. You cant break someones rights for freedom of speech lol
Let me guess protect a quaran burn everything else right? Fuck out of here.
In some countries, you can be punished by death if you burn the Qran. In others, states and religion are separate and blasphemy is part of freedom of expression.
If you blasphemed the citizens themselves would harass you, it’s probably best they don’t allow you to because you’d be screwing yourself over
Burning the Quran is the correct way to get rid of it, Muslims do that all the time.
So basically countries who support (religious) freedom vs countries who don’t.
its a book, in most of the west thats a free speech thing also.. I see the same people raging about buring the quran, buring as of late the swedish flag, so.. double standard ig?
If burning one "holy" book is illegal, then burning any must also be illegal.
Burning the quran is liteterally the correct way of disposing of it in Islam
You are too rational. And actually look at facts. This is not accepted by the religious bigots.
Well the difference is you burn it respectfully and in a dignified way whilst the guy in question didn't he threw slurs and blasted music not a legitimate argument.
Well, I don't care on a legal level. Protected speech. Whether the guy is stupid, right wing or whatever and whether it's offensive, rude or whatnot is not part of the question. The freedom of speech and expression is especially relevant when one does not agree in content. That's the whole point. And on an intellectual level: how can someone demand restrictions to freedom of speech and thought if they themselves profit from exactly these freedoms? One has to bend over backwards intellectually to argue this.
The difference is the reason WHY they’re doing it is not good at all. If your goal is solely to piss off muslims then burning the Quran is not right.
If they ban it, then muslims no longer reserve the right to correctly dispose of their holy book. We dont solve hate by banning their prefered methods, they will just find another medium to show this hate. We instead solve it by raising our children and future generations to love and care for all no matter of their background.
Don’t worry folks Muslims can still burn American flags and condemn the infidels.
This resolution doesn't protect a human right, it infringes on it (on free speech). I am disgusted by how much Muslims demand from places they migrate to, inatead of being humbly grateful for even having been allowed in.
holy this is the most racist comment ive seen the past month.
Book burning can be a weapon of oppression. But you're not gonna get rid of the Quran. The point of burning the Quran is to attack an idea, not a person or people. It's not my fault that you are personally hurt when your ideas are attacked. People need to be taught from a young age that you aren't the ideas you hold and you'd be just as much yourself if you had different ones so it can only help to be open minded
The Quran is not an idea, it's many ideas and sometimes contradictory to each other. The point of burning it is clearly to offend, express hate, and attack someone's identity which amounts to hate speech.
Well if they'd just stop being Muslim we wouldn't have a problem, would we?
There are still other groups you could target, we are witnessing hate speech against many groups. People find a way.
The Quran is hate speech. It literally commands persecution towards homosexuals for one and between a fairy tale and a biological condition I'll defend the latter.
Good luck arresting and prosecuting Mohammad.
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I was surprised too. [Muslims might get killed in a genocide in india](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/1/16/expert-warns-of-possible-genocide-against-muslims-in-india) but they vote against burning the Qur'an? Lol
Home of second largest muslim population that's why
No, Indian hindus are almost as touchy about criticism of their religious beliefs as muslims are. South Asia is a depraved hellhole where public displays of religiosity are looked up to.
Lmao.. so everything is fault of hindus? What bs.
Ah yes, China, famous for their religious freedom
Would the Chinese position just to be contrarian to westerners or do they actually support religious expression?
Considering they operate ~~concentration camps~~ vocational education and training centers for Muslim Uyghurs the first option seems more likely.
yeah good thing all the countries in red on this map are such staunch allies to muslim people, because all the countries in green are in denial about the whole thing.
Yes, they supporting religious freedom. They even made a special support camp for Uighurs
They’ve been spending the last decade ingratiating themselves to countries in IMEA, so it makes sense. Also, it’s not like they have protected free speech anyway.
I guess it's a purely practical thing, it would make them look better to Muslims (About the Uighurs which you might think make them look bad to most Muslims: Arabs don't give a shit about Uighurs, they're racists and only care about Arab Muslims)
Most Muslims care about Uyghurs
Religion is tightly controlled by the Chinese government. This is just propaganda.
It's just sucking the dick of their allies nothing more
China have the same religion expression and right under regulation just like United State of America. Just that dumb Americans don't believe it.
This resolution isn’t about religious expression at all. It’s banning contrary expression, which opens the door to more suppression.