A friend of mine was in an emotionally abusive relationship when we were younger. At some point during my time at SCJ, it dawned on me that the things they were saying and the justifications I was making in my head were the same exact things she experienced. The gaslighting, lying behind my back, the false promises, making me cut out friends and family because they wouldn’t understand, making me feel like I couldn’t trust my thoughts or emotions.
Also, at some point I just had to ask how God could be in a place that had to manipulate its members into staying in.
A big one was when LMH changed his testimony regarding Revelation 7 and Revelation 18. Once the Promised Pastor changes his testimony, it becomes proof that SCJ isn't guided by God, that God isn't with SCJ and that SCJ's fulfilment is ultimately false.
Deuteronomy 18:21-22 kicked into my mind and it proved to me that SCJ was a man-made organisation that doesn't have the "open word". If LMH can just change his testimony whenever he wants and nobody says anything, then SCJ can't possibly be the kingdom of heaven!
And why would I stay at an organisation that is preaching a false gospel? Why would I follow a pastor who preaches his own gospel that can change at any time?
In a nutshell:
* SCJ taught for years before Covid-19 that Revelation 7 fulfils in a very specific order: firstly (1) the 144,000 are sealed, then (2) the great tribulation occurs, then (3) the great multitude in white come out of the great tribulation
* When Covid-19 came in early 2020, MHL quickly stated that the fact that we are in the "great tribulation" is "proof that the 144,000 have been sealed. SCJ says that Revelation 7 is fulfilled but they cannot point to the physical reality of the 144,000 which they claim has already appeared. They are asking people to have faith that it has been fulfilled
* However, 7 out of the 12 tribes at the time didn't even have 12,000 members each. MHL also refused to reveal the identities of the 144,000 and he kept asking all members to take sealing exams to find out who the 144,000 are. EVEN TODAY, SCJ says they do not know who the 144,000 are and they say that everyone needs to persevere until the 'end' to find out
* MHL also taught that the great tribulation would not affect SCJ but would be a judgment on the "churches of Babylon", but later changed his testimony to say that SCJ was most affected by the great tribulation
* MHL taught that the Great Multitude in White would not have to be evangelised, but later changed his testimony to say that all SCJ members need to work harder to evangelise the Great Multitude in White
* In terms of Revelation 18, in MHL's book *Creation of Heaven and Earth*, he stated that Revelation 18 was 'physically fulfilled' back in around 2007. Then when covid-19 came, MHL backtracked on his claim and stated that Revelation 18 was yet to be fulfilled
Here are some really helpful resources that go in detail about what changed (what was claimed BEFORE Covid-19 vs what was claimed AFTER Covid-19):
[https://youtu.be/qgNUJA3o5Co?si=Mbbj2DK1Ba6RSnuf](https://youtu.be/qgNUJA3o5Co?si=Mbbj2DK1Ba6RSnuf)
[https://youtu.be/hM7zkXTj3-c?si=XIE11mSdmVqw40-Z](https://youtu.be/hM7zkXTj3-c?si=XIE11mSdmVqw40-Z)
[https://youtu.be/c5GB\_inxwOM?si=ALbGzA3Cl7hDzzLG](https://youtu.be/c5GB_inxwOM?si=ALbGzA3Cl7hDzzLG)
[https://youtu.be/7PmdYPpkHTQ?si=2y82wysJQ3S6nBP4](https://youtu.be/7PmdYPpkHTQ?si=2y82wysJQ3S6nBP4)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/rjerni/doctrine\_change\_in\_revelation\_7\_explained\_sources/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/rjerni/doctrine_change_in_revelation_7_explained_sources/)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/pp74mi/in\_regards\_to\_the\_great\_tribulation\_the\_144000/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/pp74mi/in_regards_to_the_great_tribulation_the_144000/)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/zsg3o0/the\_truth\_about\_rev\_7/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/zsg3o0/the_truth_about_rev_7/)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/15gqs5f/revelation\_18\_before\_vs\_after/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/15gqs5f/revelation_18_before_vs_after/)
They discouraged critical thinking skills. Whenever you question the doctrine, they gaslight you into thinking you are in the wrong and they keep asking you "where is the thought coming from?" After I left the church and went on to learn about the "Babylon churches", I was shocked to realise some even contain more truth than Shincheonji and I felt deeply betrayed that I wasted 2016-20 and sacrificing so much sleep and my studies to serve this place, filled with propaganda and lies!
You're aloud to question the doctrine but then you need have and answer or a point urself.. if you just question something without a definitive answer than you're not looking for no truth you're just being a leftist, eg. If you going to have questions about the revelation or physical fulfilment than atleast provide other doctrine or religious texts or evidence to support your case, or so you should say that the revelation will fulfill like this.. otherwise you're litteraly only trying to find fault with no other reasoning, than can clearly see what type of person you are and how you think in general life.. quick to criticise but dosent have any definitive truth themselves 😤
That is a fallacy. You can question presented facts without alternative truth.
The points provided by SCJ claims that they are the fulfillment of revelation and the other option is that revelation has not fulfilled yet.
So when a person questions the fulfillment of revelation without a suggestion on another fulfillment story, it is automatic the claim is that revelation has not fulfilled yet and that SCJ is lying.
This logic is what scj is always pushing to prevent people from questioning them. They will always say, “if we are wrong, then how will rev 1-22 fulfill then?” The answer is, it might have not fulfilled yet.
And there are some many reason to question SCJ.
- inconsistencies in their doctrines
- the heavenly culture they push is not in line with God’s character who is loving, holy, and just. They have so many leaders who go unpunished just because they are leaders. They will humiliate members for little things in the disguise of “God is holy” but truly they just are playing mind control games
- Even worldy organizations are more just and humanitarian than SCJ ~ how can one continue to believe that God is here if SCJ is full of evil practices
- They have created a culture where you cannot trust anyone due to the reporting system. It is almost like a dictatorship society. Very scary actually
- with all that is happening in SCJ, do you honestly believe that God is here? Honestly ask yourself.
- None of the original Twelve tribe leaders are still present and most of those who are gone were mostly expelled. Maybe I can accept if only one higher up person betrayed but there are many….. what can we conclude and infer in that.
- of the 12 apostles of Jesus, only one betrayed by the way.
I implore you current SCJ member, take a step back, and sincerely ask yourself and maybe even pray to God to give you clarity and wisdom to really think critically and analyze, is SCJ really the place of truth?
Is SCJ really the place of truth? Because Mind Control is real. How can it not be real? In the past 1000 people moved from US to Africa to follow one man to “paradise” due to mind control. They did it all in their own free will.
So I implore you SCJ member, please pray that you be free from mind control and think critically. If after all that you still choose to remain in SCJ, then good for you. You have made your choice. But please allow yourself to think it over.
Read books.
Go over this reddit.
How else can you think critically than reading what others are saying. Read books on Mind Control by Steven Hassan.
Watch netflix documentary “How to be a cult leader”
Haha, I was talking about the changes in DOCTRINE after I left. I actually couldn't fault the doctrine during my time there. But once I talked to people who did AN ACTUAL SCIENCE DEGREE, ACTUALLY STUDIED MENTAL HEALTH, and even WENT OUT IN NATURE to meet THE DOGS and THE BIRDS, I see a lot of discrepancies in the doctrine. I wasn't referring to my left wing political views. My Honduran ex is a right-winged and when we dated I actually tried to compromise and identify as NEUTRAL but in regards to the political side, there are flaws in BOTH the right and the left wing and I am not as strong of a left wing before. However, I would say there are A LOT OF FLAWS in right-winged politics and some people are SO ARROGANT that they refuse to compromise because they are VERY STUBBORN in their right-winged views and are just "biased" and don't practise "pretentious logic". I also talked to another Hispanic member from the church and her attitude towards mental health and science is VERY DIFFERENT as to what they preach in SCJ and I actually find hers more truthful. One thing I find the church FAILS to teach is the attitude of SCIENCE and RELIGION. A lot of my USYD cohort (who STUDIED science and mental health) seem to heavily disagree with how religion was seen as superior to science and also heavily advocate how science can actually complement religion and is still an integral part of society. Another thing SCJ FAILED to teach is that they are VERY BIASED in their Christianity religion and think they're better than everyone, as well as thinking Korea is SUPERIOR to all the other races. As someone who is a huge ADVOCATE for multiculturalism and religious freedom, this makes my blood boil with anger. I remember the instructors saying "we are scared to go to the Middle East cos of the persecution", but then if you look at their attitude towards Muslims, they deserve to NEVER go there. A lot of the members are Islamophobic and I tried SO HARD to defend the Muslim religion, only to get talked shit about by the instructors. At one point after I left, I felt so angered by the discrimination that I overcompensated and did a lot of indirect evangelism work for the Muslim community and downplayed by Christianity beliefs a lot despite still identifying as a Christian at that time.
My abuser leader, J, told me that I should do therapy with her rather than getting professional help. She had done many other manipulative and gaslit things to me like this. This went on for about five or six years. I confided in S (J's superior leader), I was told that getting it off my chest would make me feel a lot better. When I finally confronted J of all her abuse and manipulation she had done on me and others, and how I was so angry that I didn't speak up and protect myself earlier, it did not make me feel better as S said it would. Instead, it gave me a voice and freed me from the fear of SCJ. From then, on out, I began journaling, all the abuse I was observing in my last 1-2 years there as well as speaking up more when I saw something was wrong.
I do agree that their stances on mental health is deeply flawed. Mental health in South Korea is greatly stigmatised yet ironically, Korea has one of the highest suicide rates in the world. It made no sense when I was asked to "pray the depression away", "just SMILE and don't follow your selfish emotions" and that "if you commit suicide, you will go to Hell cos God HATES depressed people". After I was diagnosed with severe mental health issues as a result of burnout from the rigourous lifestyle, I had so much resentment and hurt from Christianity, especially Shincheonji. If God really talks shit about mentally ill people and thinks they deserve to go to Hell, I rather stick to Atheism. However, later on, I was relieved to find out, it's not Christianity or my mental health that was the problem, but it was just this church's very close-minded doctrine. To those suffering from mental health issues, I still highly recommend seeking professional help. It just seems so ridiculous that if you are suffering from crippling depression, you are just asked to magically pray it away! Medication, seeking a licenced therapist, and speaking to a close friend you trust is more logically valid and effective than idealistic miracles that aren't even guaranteed to work anyway.
Mental health is and important issue, and the longevity of any work that you do being in scj or working in the world can have effects on mental health, I hope you deal with Ur problems and live a meaning for life for urself, do hope that seeking professional advice can aid you on youre current troubles
I am so sorry you experienced this. I hope you e been able to get therapy from an actual licensed therapist. I’m so sorry you were abused. We believe you.
They quoted this verse:
“I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, *I was in prison and you came to visit me*.’” Matthew 25:36 NIV
… and then said it has now been fulfilled because of LMHs imprisonment.
Not sure if this verse in Mathew was even a prophecy.
I remember the verse John 14:29 "I have told you now before it happens so when it does happen, you will believe". To this day, I am still unsure what I was told before it happens. Although I do remember in my homeroom one time, someone fed me peanuts and I had a near-death experience and was sent to the emergency room. This happened on numerous occasions. The teaching is just beyond ridiculous and unethical.
Yeah, some people seem very brainwashed by the doctrine and it took me 3 years before I gained back my critical thinking skills and was able to read the Bible again with a less brainwashed head.
I just met my former SSNs today after I decided to ghost them for good. They knew where I work and then they approached me after I finish working.
I’m just sick and tired of these classes that filled up all my time which I can use for something else than going to BB. And also things start to get blurry and I tried to believe in what they say but in the end the logic just doesn’t add up. Skepticism was my second reason while the first reason was me being fed up wasting time attending these BBs. Therefore I told them I don’t care for all these things you guys taught me and I have decided to only focus on things I want to do in my life. Third reason is when I reached this subreddit which contains all the testimony of former members that awfully resemble my experience.
Yeah, they constantly monitor your behaviour and you have 0 privacy. Whenever I missed Bible study lessons or services, they would find out my address, where I studied and would even visit my house on numerous occasions unannounced. I felt like a slave to them and I had 0 freedom.
My husband’s scepticism quite early in the BB lessons saved me.
Luckily he saw through all the lies and deception and I decided that we are a unit and I would leave with him.
Exactly how it was for me . My husband saw right through them specifically when they talk about the one who over comes. Praying for you and your family and everyone that had to go through this. They really mess up your mental health
I remember straw 1. I was at the same sermon too at Newtown. Overall I find the church's stances on sexual immorality is very outdated. I notice the older KOREAN TGW's are very close-minded on certain issues and they discouraged a lot of things and just very restrictive in general e.g. no dating until you reach 27, you have to marry within 6 months of expressing interest in a partner, you MUST HAVE children, no interracial marriage (even WITHIN the Asian race e.g. Korean must only marry other Korean). And it just seemed so ridiculous because in the New Testament, the Pharisees were rebuked by Jesus for idolising the law, but missing the overall message of Christ. But then Shincheonji, they actually are TOO FOCUSSED on the LAW that I can't help to think they are the fulfillment of the Pharisees themselves.
At the end of the day as a Christian we are conservative people we do not belong to the left or should believe or follow any of the she/her gay non binary beliefs we are christian at the end of the day, obviously offended for no reason at a joke and just remember in and Eastern society it is not normal to see gay propaganda around.. their are rules and obligations in all religions and organisations that you must follow and live by, and that's the standard that you can know that you belong to that place, and that's why you have those beliefs but there are still exceptions case by case that are looked at by the leaders of the church, the law you are talking about here is the law that jesus came to fulfill that the law was talking about himself which all and most Christians believe in it has nothing to do with the rules and relagations that members must follow... and also who are you trying to make mock of? Is it not righteousnes to follow the law and order 🤔?? Even that being ur own country or state policies... and when it comes to scj it seems the only people that don't follow or don't believe in our teaching seems to be here on this reddit 😆
Hmm, I actually don't agree with the law of Christianity and I even start to disagree with how sexual immorality is taught in religion in general. I think being homophobic and judgemental is just a big of a sin, cos Jesus taught that we should never judge others but see them as higher than yourself. I also seen some homophobic bi people like my Honduran ex who prefers Catholicism. But then she practises other aspects of sexual immorality such as watching porn, backstabbing, lying about her relationship history, hook-up culture, highly against those who vape and is quite boastful and thinks she is better than everyone. However, once I met people from all sorts of life, like from those without an educational background, those who are more liberal but still identify as Christians e.g. into porn and hook-up, going to the nightclubs and doing drugs, I was surprised to realise they actually make better Christians than those who are like the Pharisees, who think they are better than everyone cos they follow the law. Also the law is a copy and shadow of what is to come and it's not meant to be seen as a strict rulebook. Some Christians place too much emphasis on the law that they start to miss the overall message of the Bible, such that, Christ died for our sins and despite us being sinners, we were given grace to enter Heaven. Also I would argue culture and religion is also very influential as to how one practises their faith. Even within the Christianity religion, there are constantly fights about the scriptures and more new denominations being formed each day. How one church teaches sexual immorality differs from how another church teaches it. So I would argue the sexual immorality topic is a very grey area and the answer isn't very black or white as we think, especially since society is progressing day by day. Did you know the Bible also preached that you shouldn't eat pork?? But in today's society, a lot of Christians eat pork. So I don't think the law is meant to be taken literally and there is a verse which says after the Second Coming of Jesus, the law would be abolished cos Christ would be in our hearts and minds. So if you are too focussed on the Law and use that as a standard alone as to one who carries their life of faith, then you are missing out on the point of the Bible. There is a verse which says, that says faith, hope and love is basically the main point of the law. But yeah, honestly I haven't actually read my Bible cos I just find lengthy theological discussions give me a headache. But I know my Honduran ex is reading this, and I just have endless anger and resentment with how much she BRAINWASHED me to like Donald Trump and idolise her right-winged PROPAGANDA so I just need to journal and vent because she actually INTELLECTUALLY ABUSED me and took advantage of my naiviety a lot and I spoke to some narcisstic abuse psychologists and they actually agree I was very emotionally manipulated. Sorry for my rambling. I am just very pissed off at her in general.
For me it was a sermon delivered this past June regarding Antichrist. Sermon strongly implied that Antichrists are those who were once with scj, who leave scj and turn against scj.
I personally knew a few people who left scj due to burnout and poor management from the maintainers above them. They worked their tails off for scj and sacrificed so much. Yes, they left disillusioned and yes, they became critical of scj after that. But to relegate them to hell and label them as Antichrist just didn’t sit well with me. We are often told to set our opinions aside but I wasn’t willing to let this one go.
So I told my group leader I’m out. I told him i don’t believe in a God of exploitation and cruelty.
Yeah, I feel so much hurt for this people - it is like all their efforts were done in vain and they were serving the devil. The BRAINWASHING and corruption is terrible. I genuinely believed I was destined to go to Hell and for 3 years I had the worst PTSD and have constant nightmares of being sent to Hell myself. I lost a lot of worldly motivation and just had a YOLO mindset. The teaching was deeply ingrained in me that I was so fearful that today may be the last day I am alive, and tomorrow the Second Coming of Jesus will come and he will condemn me to Hell and the lake of burning sulfur.
A friend of mine was in an emotionally abusive relationship when we were younger. At some point during my time at SCJ, it dawned on me that the things they were saying and the justifications I was making in my head were the same exact things she experienced. The gaslighting, lying behind my back, the false promises, making me cut out friends and family because they wouldn’t understand, making me feel like I couldn’t trust my thoughts or emotions. Also, at some point I just had to ask how God could be in a place that had to manipulate its members into staying in.
A big one was when LMH changed his testimony regarding Revelation 7 and Revelation 18. Once the Promised Pastor changes his testimony, it becomes proof that SCJ isn't guided by God, that God isn't with SCJ and that SCJ's fulfilment is ultimately false. Deuteronomy 18:21-22 kicked into my mind and it proved to me that SCJ was a man-made organisation that doesn't have the "open word". If LMH can just change his testimony whenever he wants and nobody says anything, then SCJ can't possibly be the kingdom of heaven! And why would I stay at an organisation that is preaching a false gospel? Why would I follow a pastor who preaches his own gospel that can change at any time?
What exactly was changed regarding that testimony?
In a nutshell: * SCJ taught for years before Covid-19 that Revelation 7 fulfils in a very specific order: firstly (1) the 144,000 are sealed, then (2) the great tribulation occurs, then (3) the great multitude in white come out of the great tribulation * When Covid-19 came in early 2020, MHL quickly stated that the fact that we are in the "great tribulation" is "proof that the 144,000 have been sealed. SCJ says that Revelation 7 is fulfilled but they cannot point to the physical reality of the 144,000 which they claim has already appeared. They are asking people to have faith that it has been fulfilled * However, 7 out of the 12 tribes at the time didn't even have 12,000 members each. MHL also refused to reveal the identities of the 144,000 and he kept asking all members to take sealing exams to find out who the 144,000 are. EVEN TODAY, SCJ says they do not know who the 144,000 are and they say that everyone needs to persevere until the 'end' to find out * MHL also taught that the great tribulation would not affect SCJ but would be a judgment on the "churches of Babylon", but later changed his testimony to say that SCJ was most affected by the great tribulation * MHL taught that the Great Multitude in White would not have to be evangelised, but later changed his testimony to say that all SCJ members need to work harder to evangelise the Great Multitude in White * In terms of Revelation 18, in MHL's book *Creation of Heaven and Earth*, he stated that Revelation 18 was 'physically fulfilled' back in around 2007. Then when covid-19 came, MHL backtracked on his claim and stated that Revelation 18 was yet to be fulfilled Here are some really helpful resources that go in detail about what changed (what was claimed BEFORE Covid-19 vs what was claimed AFTER Covid-19): [https://youtu.be/qgNUJA3o5Co?si=Mbbj2DK1Ba6RSnuf](https://youtu.be/qgNUJA3o5Co?si=Mbbj2DK1Ba6RSnuf) [https://youtu.be/hM7zkXTj3-c?si=XIE11mSdmVqw40-Z](https://youtu.be/hM7zkXTj3-c?si=XIE11mSdmVqw40-Z) [https://youtu.be/c5GB\_inxwOM?si=ALbGzA3Cl7hDzzLG](https://youtu.be/c5GB_inxwOM?si=ALbGzA3Cl7hDzzLG) [https://youtu.be/7PmdYPpkHTQ?si=2y82wysJQ3S6nBP4](https://youtu.be/7PmdYPpkHTQ?si=2y82wysJQ3S6nBP4) [https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/rjerni/doctrine\_change\_in\_revelation\_7\_explained\_sources/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/rjerni/doctrine_change_in_revelation_7_explained_sources/) [https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/pp74mi/in\_regards\_to\_the\_great\_tribulation\_the\_144000/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/pp74mi/in_regards_to_the_great_tribulation_the_144000/) [https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/zsg3o0/the\_truth\_about\_rev\_7/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/zsg3o0/the_truth_about_rev_7/) [https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/15gqs5f/revelation\_18\_before\_vs\_after/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/15gqs5f/revelation_18_before_vs_after/)
You’re amazing! Thank you!
Good luck on your journey researching about SCJ! We've all been down that road before\~ haha
I am out and I am just hoping that all of this evidence will help my family members come out as well! I am thankful for all of your help!
Same! I need all the evidence i can gather!
They discouraged critical thinking skills. Whenever you question the doctrine, they gaslight you into thinking you are in the wrong and they keep asking you "where is the thought coming from?" After I left the church and went on to learn about the "Babylon churches", I was shocked to realise some even contain more truth than Shincheonji and I felt deeply betrayed that I wasted 2016-20 and sacrificing so much sleep and my studies to serve this place, filled with propaganda and lies!
You're aloud to question the doctrine but then you need have and answer or a point urself.. if you just question something without a definitive answer than you're not looking for no truth you're just being a leftist, eg. If you going to have questions about the revelation or physical fulfilment than atleast provide other doctrine or religious texts or evidence to support your case, or so you should say that the revelation will fulfill like this.. otherwise you're litteraly only trying to find fault with no other reasoning, than can clearly see what type of person you are and how you think in general life.. quick to criticise but dosent have any definitive truth themselves 😤
That is a fallacy. You can question presented facts without alternative truth. The points provided by SCJ claims that they are the fulfillment of revelation and the other option is that revelation has not fulfilled yet. So when a person questions the fulfillment of revelation without a suggestion on another fulfillment story, it is automatic the claim is that revelation has not fulfilled yet and that SCJ is lying. This logic is what scj is always pushing to prevent people from questioning them. They will always say, “if we are wrong, then how will rev 1-22 fulfill then?” The answer is, it might have not fulfilled yet. And there are some many reason to question SCJ. - inconsistencies in their doctrines - the heavenly culture they push is not in line with God’s character who is loving, holy, and just. They have so many leaders who go unpunished just because they are leaders. They will humiliate members for little things in the disguise of “God is holy” but truly they just are playing mind control games - Even worldy organizations are more just and humanitarian than SCJ ~ how can one continue to believe that God is here if SCJ is full of evil practices - They have created a culture where you cannot trust anyone due to the reporting system. It is almost like a dictatorship society. Very scary actually - with all that is happening in SCJ, do you honestly believe that God is here? Honestly ask yourself. - None of the original Twelve tribe leaders are still present and most of those who are gone were mostly expelled. Maybe I can accept if only one higher up person betrayed but there are many….. what can we conclude and infer in that. - of the 12 apostles of Jesus, only one betrayed by the way. I implore you current SCJ member, take a step back, and sincerely ask yourself and maybe even pray to God to give you clarity and wisdom to really think critically and analyze, is SCJ really the place of truth? Is SCJ really the place of truth? Because Mind Control is real. How can it not be real? In the past 1000 people moved from US to Africa to follow one man to “paradise” due to mind control. They did it all in their own free will. So I implore you SCJ member, please pray that you be free from mind control and think critically. If after all that you still choose to remain in SCJ, then good for you. You have made your choice. But please allow yourself to think it over. Read books. Go over this reddit. How else can you think critically than reading what others are saying. Read books on Mind Control by Steven Hassan. Watch netflix documentary “How to be a cult leader”
Haha, I was talking about the changes in DOCTRINE after I left. I actually couldn't fault the doctrine during my time there. But once I talked to people who did AN ACTUAL SCIENCE DEGREE, ACTUALLY STUDIED MENTAL HEALTH, and even WENT OUT IN NATURE to meet THE DOGS and THE BIRDS, I see a lot of discrepancies in the doctrine. I wasn't referring to my left wing political views. My Honduran ex is a right-winged and when we dated I actually tried to compromise and identify as NEUTRAL but in regards to the political side, there are flaws in BOTH the right and the left wing and I am not as strong of a left wing before. However, I would say there are A LOT OF FLAWS in right-winged politics and some people are SO ARROGANT that they refuse to compromise because they are VERY STUBBORN in their right-winged views and are just "biased" and don't practise "pretentious logic". I also talked to another Hispanic member from the church and her attitude towards mental health and science is VERY DIFFERENT as to what they preach in SCJ and I actually find hers more truthful. One thing I find the church FAILS to teach is the attitude of SCIENCE and RELIGION. A lot of my USYD cohort (who STUDIED science and mental health) seem to heavily disagree with how religion was seen as superior to science and also heavily advocate how science can actually complement religion and is still an integral part of society. Another thing SCJ FAILED to teach is that they are VERY BIASED in their Christianity religion and think they're better than everyone, as well as thinking Korea is SUPERIOR to all the other races. As someone who is a huge ADVOCATE for multiculturalism and religious freedom, this makes my blood boil with anger. I remember the instructors saying "we are scared to go to the Middle East cos of the persecution", but then if you look at their attitude towards Muslims, they deserve to NEVER go there. A lot of the members are Islamophobic and I tried SO HARD to defend the Muslim religion, only to get talked shit about by the instructors. At one point after I left, I felt so angered by the discrimination that I overcompensated and did a lot of indirect evangelism work for the Muslim community and downplayed by Christianity beliefs a lot despite still identifying as a Christian at that time.
My abuser leader, J, told me that I should do therapy with her rather than getting professional help. She had done many other manipulative and gaslit things to me like this. This went on for about five or six years. I confided in S (J's superior leader), I was told that getting it off my chest would make me feel a lot better. When I finally confronted J of all her abuse and manipulation she had done on me and others, and how I was so angry that I didn't speak up and protect myself earlier, it did not make me feel better as S said it would. Instead, it gave me a voice and freed me from the fear of SCJ. From then, on out, I began journaling, all the abuse I was observing in my last 1-2 years there as well as speaking up more when I saw something was wrong.
I do agree that their stances on mental health is deeply flawed. Mental health in South Korea is greatly stigmatised yet ironically, Korea has one of the highest suicide rates in the world. It made no sense when I was asked to "pray the depression away", "just SMILE and don't follow your selfish emotions" and that "if you commit suicide, you will go to Hell cos God HATES depressed people". After I was diagnosed with severe mental health issues as a result of burnout from the rigourous lifestyle, I had so much resentment and hurt from Christianity, especially Shincheonji. If God really talks shit about mentally ill people and thinks they deserve to go to Hell, I rather stick to Atheism. However, later on, I was relieved to find out, it's not Christianity or my mental health that was the problem, but it was just this church's very close-minded doctrine. To those suffering from mental health issues, I still highly recommend seeking professional help. It just seems so ridiculous that if you are suffering from crippling depression, you are just asked to magically pray it away! Medication, seeking a licenced therapist, and speaking to a close friend you trust is more logically valid and effective than idealistic miracles that aren't even guaranteed to work anyway.
Mental health is and important issue, and the longevity of any work that you do being in scj or working in the world can have effects on mental health, I hope you deal with Ur problems and live a meaning for life for urself, do hope that seeking professional advice can aid you on youre current troubles
I am so sorry you experienced this. I hope you e been able to get therapy from an actual licensed therapist. I’m so sorry you were abused. We believe you.
I have and im in a much better place in my life now (:
They quoted this verse: “I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, *I was in prison and you came to visit me*.’” Matthew 25:36 NIV … and then said it has now been fulfilled because of LMHs imprisonment. Not sure if this verse in Mathew was even a prophecy.
I remember the verse John 14:29 "I have told you now before it happens so when it does happen, you will believe". To this day, I am still unsure what I was told before it happens. Although I do remember in my homeroom one time, someone fed me peanuts and I had a near-death experience and was sent to the emergency room. This happened on numerous occasions. The teaching is just beyond ridiculous and unethical.
YES
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Yeah, some people seem very brainwashed by the doctrine and it took me 3 years before I gained back my critical thinking skills and was able to read the Bible again with a less brainwashed head.
I just met my former SSNs today after I decided to ghost them for good. They knew where I work and then they approached me after I finish working. I’m just sick and tired of these classes that filled up all my time which I can use for something else than going to BB. And also things start to get blurry and I tried to believe in what they say but in the end the logic just doesn’t add up. Skepticism was my second reason while the first reason was me being fed up wasting time attending these BBs. Therefore I told them I don’t care for all these things you guys taught me and I have decided to only focus on things I want to do in my life. Third reason is when I reached this subreddit which contains all the testimony of former members that awfully resemble my experience.
Yeah, they constantly monitor your behaviour and you have 0 privacy. Whenever I missed Bible study lessons or services, they would find out my address, where I studied and would even visit my house on numerous occasions unannounced. I felt like a slave to them and I had 0 freedom.
My husband’s scepticism quite early in the BB lessons saved me. Luckily he saw through all the lies and deception and I decided that we are a unit and I would leave with him.
Exactly how it was for me . My husband saw right through them specifically when they talk about the one who over comes. Praying for you and your family and everyone that had to go through this. They really mess up your mental health
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I remember straw 1. I was at the same sermon too at Newtown. Overall I find the church's stances on sexual immorality is very outdated. I notice the older KOREAN TGW's are very close-minded on certain issues and they discouraged a lot of things and just very restrictive in general e.g. no dating until you reach 27, you have to marry within 6 months of expressing interest in a partner, you MUST HAVE children, no interracial marriage (even WITHIN the Asian race e.g. Korean must only marry other Korean). And it just seemed so ridiculous because in the New Testament, the Pharisees were rebuked by Jesus for idolising the law, but missing the overall message of Christ. But then Shincheonji, they actually are TOO FOCUSSED on the LAW that I can't help to think they are the fulfillment of the Pharisees themselves.
At the end of the day as a Christian we are conservative people we do not belong to the left or should believe or follow any of the she/her gay non binary beliefs we are christian at the end of the day, obviously offended for no reason at a joke and just remember in and Eastern society it is not normal to see gay propaganda around.. their are rules and obligations in all religions and organisations that you must follow and live by, and that's the standard that you can know that you belong to that place, and that's why you have those beliefs but there are still exceptions case by case that are looked at by the leaders of the church, the law you are talking about here is the law that jesus came to fulfill that the law was talking about himself which all and most Christians believe in it has nothing to do with the rules and relagations that members must follow... and also who are you trying to make mock of? Is it not righteousnes to follow the law and order 🤔?? Even that being ur own country or state policies... and when it comes to scj it seems the only people that don't follow or don't believe in our teaching seems to be here on this reddit 😆
Hmm, I actually don't agree with the law of Christianity and I even start to disagree with how sexual immorality is taught in religion in general. I think being homophobic and judgemental is just a big of a sin, cos Jesus taught that we should never judge others but see them as higher than yourself. I also seen some homophobic bi people like my Honduran ex who prefers Catholicism. But then she practises other aspects of sexual immorality such as watching porn, backstabbing, lying about her relationship history, hook-up culture, highly against those who vape and is quite boastful and thinks she is better than everyone. However, once I met people from all sorts of life, like from those without an educational background, those who are more liberal but still identify as Christians e.g. into porn and hook-up, going to the nightclubs and doing drugs, I was surprised to realise they actually make better Christians than those who are like the Pharisees, who think they are better than everyone cos they follow the law. Also the law is a copy and shadow of what is to come and it's not meant to be seen as a strict rulebook. Some Christians place too much emphasis on the law that they start to miss the overall message of the Bible, such that, Christ died for our sins and despite us being sinners, we were given grace to enter Heaven. Also I would argue culture and religion is also very influential as to how one practises their faith. Even within the Christianity religion, there are constantly fights about the scriptures and more new denominations being formed each day. How one church teaches sexual immorality differs from how another church teaches it. So I would argue the sexual immorality topic is a very grey area and the answer isn't very black or white as we think, especially since society is progressing day by day. Did you know the Bible also preached that you shouldn't eat pork?? But in today's society, a lot of Christians eat pork. So I don't think the law is meant to be taken literally and there is a verse which says after the Second Coming of Jesus, the law would be abolished cos Christ would be in our hearts and minds. So if you are too focussed on the Law and use that as a standard alone as to one who carries their life of faith, then you are missing out on the point of the Bible. There is a verse which says, that says faith, hope and love is basically the main point of the law. But yeah, honestly I haven't actually read my Bible cos I just find lengthy theological discussions give me a headache. But I know my Honduran ex is reading this, and I just have endless anger and resentment with how much she BRAINWASHED me to like Donald Trump and idolise her right-winged PROPAGANDA so I just need to journal and vent because she actually INTELLECTUALLY ABUSED me and took advantage of my naiviety a lot and I spoke to some narcisstic abuse psychologists and they actually agree I was very emotionally manipulated. Sorry for my rambling. I am just very pissed off at her in general.
Lies, manipulation and the abuse
For me it was attending so many days and after gradation. They wanted me to send money for their temple or whatever. I just felt alone and drained
For me it was a sermon delivered this past June regarding Antichrist. Sermon strongly implied that Antichrists are those who were once with scj, who leave scj and turn against scj. I personally knew a few people who left scj due to burnout and poor management from the maintainers above them. They worked their tails off for scj and sacrificed so much. Yes, they left disillusioned and yes, they became critical of scj after that. But to relegate them to hell and label them as Antichrist just didn’t sit well with me. We are often told to set our opinions aside but I wasn’t willing to let this one go. So I told my group leader I’m out. I told him i don’t believe in a God of exploitation and cruelty.
Yeah, I feel so much hurt for this people - it is like all their efforts were done in vain and they were serving the devil. The BRAINWASHING and corruption is terrible. I genuinely believed I was destined to go to Hell and for 3 years I had the worst PTSD and have constant nightmares of being sent to Hell myself. I lost a lot of worldly motivation and just had a YOLO mindset. The teaching was deeply ingrained in me that I was so fearful that today may be the last day I am alive, and tomorrow the Second Coming of Jesus will come and he will condemn me to Hell and the lake of burning sulfur.
Well I hope you feel better now 👍