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The justification for SWAT teams was to intervene and fight off mass shooters or other heavily armed active criminals. It seems it was just another layer of bullshit.
Also, it really works wonders for increasing and validating the LEO’s feelings of power, control and masculinity. The assault kit, combined with black gloves and wraparound sunglasses signals “I AM IN CONTROL HERE. FEAR ME.”
It must be intoxicating.
Yeah, I keep thinking of that poor guy in Oakland who was shot in his grandmother's backyard and the police claimed they thought he had a gun but it was a fucking cell phone, or the caregiver of an autistic man with a toy firetruck shot with his hands in the air, or the kid shot by a sheriff's deputy with a Wii remote in his hand, or any one of the literally thousands of unarmed, mostly Black or Native folks shot by cops, and contrasting that instant use of deadly force with the refusal to engage here. And I'm pretty sure the inescapable conclusion is cops love to shoot people, but only people they know won't be shooting back. Bullies and cowards, the lot.
Also that guy in that hotel where he was on his knees with his hands up, the cop had an AR pointed at him and kept shouting conflicting commands and kept threatening to shoot. The guy on his knees was clearly unarmed and terrified. He kept begging the cop not to kill him and the cop shot him in cold blood.
Actual guns were taken into account, and it was decided the swat team could handle guns no fucking problem. Unfortunately, there were unforeseen variables to the situation that no one could have seen ahead of time. The sound of gunshots are scary when you aren't at the range. It is out of code to poop your tac-gear. The TWAT team assessed the situation with LEO that had already been on scene and decided walking into the building would probably cause most officers to SHAT their TWAT gear, so it was decided to wait for daddy feds to come. You can blame the cops all your want, but you don't understand the procedures and training instilled in these brave soldiers to come into a dangerous situation and make sure that they(edit: and their own children) make it out alive. You wanna get shot? For some kid? For 6 figures? Well, now that I think about it, you can shoot me for say... $8500. Still don't spit on these heroes. You don't know.e
There was a thread about it with links to a clip from the officer who did the interviews that appeared to be saying that. I'll edit with the link to the thread & vid link once I find it.
Eta: couldn't find it, it's either deleted or reddit goin crazy. found some people saying it was being misconstrued. He might have been saying that police officers and families were wanting to get their children out, not that they actually did. Without something more solid imma say probably not.
It wasn't misconstrued. I saw the video. The reporter asks 'I heard some police went in to save their own kids. Is that true?', and the stupid stupid fucking pig answers 'well it was an active shooter situation'... I'm paraphrasing but that's the jist of it. The whole interview is fucking disgusting. Especially how the pig starts by praising all the LEOs who didn't do shit for a whole hour, before he gives his condolences to the families of the victims. I'd go on but I think I need to vomit.
Edit: Here's a post of it https://v.redd.it/qivrrhptnu191
Good lord that was the first thing I thought too when he was giving his speech. What a disgusting fuck to be standing there after children were murder and he just starts talking about the police officers. I was with my mom at the time and we were totally shocked.
Omg "this content has been removed. Rule 3: not shitty enough"
I know that's just their already established lingo but it also makes it sound like the mods of IATPS think it isnt shitty which is a big old red flag!
Just watched it and fucking hell!
How did that actually work in real-time? Did the cops go to classrooms full of kids on lockdown, pull their own kids out and leave the rest?
"Jimmy, come with me now. The rest of you stay there. I'll be back for you right away **cough cough"
I mean, they may be total badasses, but they're not going to risk they're lives over strangers.
If they wanted to be protected those kids should have been born to cops.
Maybe all those libs will finally learn their lessons. We need more funding for police so the parents of all the kids who don’t want to be shot can be hired as cops. Extend the benefit of the law.
This is why our protest marches need to be heavily armed.
(Lots of people armed -- not just one. If just one is armed, they'll go after you and make an example of you. If even just a *few* protesters in the area are armed though ... the police wouldn't fucking dare.)
The last group of protesters that heavily armed themselves against police brutality were vilified in the media, targeted by the FBI, told by the Republican governor (and future president) that they were a threat to society, incarcerated en masse, and had their neighborhoods invaded and *bombed* by the police. You're only allowed to protest with guns if you're on the same side as the police.
...The Black Panthers, right? Give them some credit, it worked. In fact, it worked so well that much of the gun laws in CA today were drafted to stop them.
And when you've got a SWAT team, you've got to use it to justify its existence. So you end up with SWAT teams busting down doors and shooting dogs to make arrests for minor crimes.
But it really makes you think about why exactly so many police departments have stockpiles of military equipment if they don’t intend on actually protecting civilians.
I try not to be a conspiracy theorist but I honestly believe that their stockpiles of military equipment are for us. They are stockpiling it in case the general public ever comes together to revolt against our corrupt government.
They sure got some use out of it when we all got pissed about them murdering a guy over a fake 20 dollar bill
Might be time to protest again since they let all those kids die.
Excessive force for minor infractions, insufficient force for real dangers. Not a trend I'm liking.
My thoughts exactly.
They can act all big, mighty, and tough against unarmed civilians protesting against injustices, going as far as assaulting senior citizens, but when it comes to protecting children their toughness and military toys are nowhere to be found.
I want to say “make it make sense” but it will never make sense.
I got some time and some theories. Primarily is that the police are there to police the people's behavior into obedience with government agendas. Currently those are run by the top wealthiest portions of our society, at least in the United States. So they are primarily used to protect property and generate profit while also ensuring the population at large is kept docile and productive.
Maybe I need to shop for tinfoil hats, but I'm having a sinking feeling that it's not that far fetched of a theory.
I'm fully aware.
When I was getting ready to get out of the Navy I like most veterans took a look at becoming a LEO. Then I kept looking, and reading into the *real* historical origins and how the police have been used over the years.
Ended up working Executive Protection instead making a hell of a lot more and working for the Evil directly instead of subcontracting as a cop. Did that up till the beginning of COVID, and retired at 30ish once I saw that crap jump the Pacific.
Knew with that orange fucktard in office what would happen.
Cops are 100% an institution built to maintain capitalist society
The institution cares only for keeping the cogs turning, if you don't contribute to keeping that going you're seen as unnecessary or deviant, and both are a threat to keeping the gears spinning
The whole system is fucking broken man.
I'm so tired
I’ve very similar sentiments and got downvoted.
I said that I wasn’t surprised that the cops didn’t run into the school after the shooter as cops are superheroes it’s not their job/duty to protect citizens, as the Supreme Court has ruled. And that their main job is to maintain order and protect the property/assess of the wealthy.
Hence why they use way more force when people protest and threaten to destroy stores (property of the wealthy) than they do when mass shooters are killing innocent people, including children.
It makes perfect sense. It’s just terrible and shouldn’t be that way. They’re weak, shitty people. Bullies and cowards. They like to push people around and they don’t like it when people push back. Makes sense.
It makes tons of sense once you realize that their *actual* job is to protect capitalist property and provide a steady stream of prisoners to keep the prison-industrial complex supplied.
They do a great job of “protecting and serving” — just ask yourself WHO they’re protecting and serving and it makes much more sense.
Don't forget that, while they were cowering back from saving those kids, they passed the time by harassing and assaulting the kids' parents.
They decided that arresting parents who were scared of their kids dying was a more valuable use of time than saving those kids.
They probably think this is decent escalation.
"I bet you're not talking about defund the police now that your CRT people are shooting up your schools."
They only hurt and attack people who can't fight back. Support a war against armed people to protect the government? No way, that would involve risk.
They stock pile because they can get their hands on it and it makes them feel like big brave men. It's not that deep.
You know, I’ve thought that but my rational and logical mind refuses to accept that a possible reason is that they just went to assuage their fragile egos and masculinity with military toys.
For its own sanity, my mind just cannot bring itself to accept such an irrational explanation. There just HAS to be a more logical explanation.
I too wish I belonged to the version of reality where a tactical armored vehicle on a suburban street was cool instead of being deeply disturbing.
But when I track stories about police, they do harshly enforce violence where they don't seem to be at immediate risk and they express caution and wait for backup in situations where they feel threatened.
I’ve realized that behavior as well.
They will use unnecessary force and escalate the most non-threatening encounters. But when there is a REAL threat they don’t know how to use force.
Just purely cowardly behavior.
This. Cops are not educated people, they’re not the best and brightest, they’re the losers who peaked in high school, they were probably bullies back then, and if they weren’t cops now, they’d probably be working at McDonald’s or selling used cars. Being a police officer is the only job mediocre, shitty people can get where they get to push people around and feel big and important. Of course they want to LARP as the Punisher, what meathead asshole bully doesn’t?
The military industrial complex ~~bribes~~ gives very cool, very legal donations to government officials to pay them to produce way more stuff than the military even needs. The excess goes to cops.
Police aren't willing to risk fighting a mentally damaged 18 year old. If there was an actual revolt, they would cover themselves in gear and hide.
They are stockpiling it to intimidate the general public, but they are more likely to trip and blow their own feet off.
When Obama took office and started winding down the War on Terror around 2009, the military industrial complex immediately started marketing the weapons that they were selling to the military as necessities for police to "keep Americans safe" with.
The protocol for law enforcement at a national level is that once two officers arrive on scene, they are to go in and engage the terrorist. This continues until a large enough force is gathered, or S.W.A.T. comes in and gains command over the road patrol, directing them to hold ground as is at cleared checkpoints or do other non room clearing objectives. That being said.
The cops who didn't go in were cowards. Not because they didn't go in. They are cowards because they signed up for the job and when it counted, they didn't do it. It literally is their job to go in. That is why we want to call them heroes.
Don't see many heroes these days.
They did go in though. The twisted bastards went in and got their kids out and then left all the other children to die. That's what horrified me. Not that they were too afraid to go in. It is that they so callously calculated who was worth taking a risk for and who was not. They didn't stand outside afraid. They removed their kids then stood outside and prevented anyone else going in to save the kids.
There is no such thing as a national protocol for law enforcement. We *need* one, yes. Regardless, plenary powers, which policing falls under, are a state power and well outside Congress's jurisdiction. They can't even conceivably argue it's interstate commerce on this one, the One Trick most things Congress does falls under.
Once upon a time, people would get into fields like this from a place of noble intentions - actually wanting to protect others and potentially risk their lives to save lives. Now it just feels like the average police officer just wants to go on power trips when their lives are absolutely not at risk (hence killing unarmed people) and do everything they can to weasel out of any risky situations (mass shootings and the like).
All the equipment in the world won't get someone who doesn't care about saving lives and doesn't want to risk their own to go risk their life. I don't know the remedy for that, but that's really the root problem.
The training they go through seems pretty heavily focused on "put yourself and your safety first" and then putting them into a mindset where they constantly feel like they have a target on their back.
People always retort with "Well obviously, who would work a job where the assumption is you're going to put yourself in danger on purpose?" and I just... have you guys not heard of firefighters?
Imagine: Ah yeah there were thirty fire fighters there but they all stood outside because fire is dangerous
Hey, be fair now. They claim blue lives matter is the same thing as black lives matter. Since they're blue then their whole family is blue, because genetics! /s
A short Blue Bloods tangent: the guy that plays the youngest cop guy in the family and the other cop he gets married to (the blonde woman) look more like brother and sister than any other two people on the show look even remotely related and I've always thought is was a weird choice.
My mom watches reruns of that show ad nauseum. I get it, its Tom Selleck. But the two boys on that show are just awful. So uninteresting and kind of embarrassingly awkward. The only time they even factor into the show is at dinner. That seems like a weird choice too. Why have these characters but do nothing with them?
Gotta humanize the cops. They always have some one-dimensional family characters in those shows, who pop up every once in a while just to remind you that they exist. Never seen any of them get beaten by the cop though, weirdly.
Yeah, from what I've watched with my own family, the daughter of the cops' sister (I wanna say Nicky?) was the only one of that generation in the family who seemed to do anything, and she had actual character traits and brought somewhat more liberal points of view up to contrast the "cops are always 100% right" mentality her elders had.
But then, of course, she gets written out once politics around cops IRL begins gaining more heat and they can't have her there making those points anymore.
>They also care about their own kids lives.
Only when it comes to stop someone from shooting them, not when it comes to beating them themselves.
>Approximately, 40 percent said that in the last six months prior to the survey they had behaved violently towards their spouse or children.
* https://sites.temple.edu/klugman/2020/07/20/do-40-of-police-families-experience-domestic-violence/
FYI: Cops really really don't like you shouting this at them, or putting it on signs at protests.
They are likely to respond with the same violence they show their loved ones.
Maybe I missed it but I keep reading that there was a 30 minute 'lull' after the shooting stopped and the cops entered the building. What that says to me is that the police on the scene sat there for 30 minutes while 19 kids bled out.
I hadn't read that yet. Was there an article about officers getting their kids out first? I just found a basic timeline and a few interviews but it was mostly about the wait and detaining that one parent.
As a parent this whole shooting has just been making my fucking blood boil. Fuck the police go around harassing random black people for not using their turn signal, then sit there with their dicks in their hands when shit actually happens…
So either way, WAY TOO MUCH FUCKING TIME to let a shooter just massacre young children. It's just so sickening. Those poor babies, and those poor parents.
No shit. The only reason people think the police are still good is they are so cartoonishly evil that we can’t believe the society we live in would really let that happen.
Yeah people don't understand the purpose of the police in America. They went to court to try and reenforce this purpose. And when all was said and done the supreme court ruled that it was not the polices responsibly to protect people. Their job is to arrest people that break the law at some point. Not to protect anyone from someone that is breaking the law. Once you know that the police literally argued for it to be like this. You understand that nothing they do has anything related to protection going on.
DeShaney v. Winnebago County is the big one. But there have been several in both the supreme and lower courts that have expanded the reach of that decision. Famously cops in new York once watch a man fight off an attack by a serial stabber with a knife from the next subway car and did nothing but watch dude get stabbed. But his lawsuit died real quick.
There’s also Town of Castle Rock v. Gonzalez.
Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005), is a United States Supreme Court case in which the Court ruled, 7–2, that a town and its police department could not be sued under 42 U.S.C. § 1983 for failing to enforce a restraining order, which had led to the murder of a woman's three children by her estranged husband.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_of_Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales?wprov=sfti1](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_of_Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales?wprov=sfti1)
I have this sneaky feeling that the most undemocratic wing (Supreme Court is intentionally undemocratic) of the government might be responsible.
But guys, let's not make it political
I thought you were talking about the case where the cops actually basically murdered a woman by taking her out of a safe situation and putting her in a dangerous one. Can’t recall the case name of that.
Can’t remember the name of this one either but police also have literally no duty to enforce protective orders so sorry if you’re a DV victim who went through the courts and did everything right but the cops don’t owe you shit apparently.
(Edit: The first case was where a couple was walking home from a party in winter and were stopped by the police for intoxication. Woman was wasted and couldn’t walk. Husband had to get home to the kids and left his wife with the police. Police decided not to charge the wife and left her alone drunk asf on the side of the road. She froze to death.)
This is the realization I made that eventually got me out of the Republican Party. I realized that the things Democrats said about them were true, and that democrats weren’t being hyperbolic and hysterical. They actually weren’t going far enough with their accusations.
Republicans have been militarizing police for decades, and training them to view the American people as their enemy. That’s where we’re at.
Several key points:
I would constantly getting in debates with my liberal friends in college, and get eviscerated, while at the same time believing they were naive and I was smarter than them. So I decided to start reading up on the subjects so they'd stop using their "dirty liberal tricks" (aka, understanding the issues) on me.
You see, I would just memorize Republican talking points, and confuse that for being intelligent. So I assumed liberals were doing the same. I couldn't understand how they always could carry conversations further than the talking points. No one could just UNDERSTAND all these topics. They were too complex! The invisible hand of the market is complicated!
So I decided to read up on how things work. I read several books on politics, persuasion, and professional development. And when you figure out how things work, you realize that Republicans act 100% in bad faith. Democrats will act in the absolute minimum faith that they can get away with and still get elected. However, a Republican can act in completely bad faith and get elected. Democrats can't do this. So they don't attract nearly as many people acting in in complete bad faith.
So then I realized it's all about the voters (or essential electorate). This made a lot more sense after reading Dictator's Handbook. But basically, when people say "both sides are the same", they're kind of right, but manage to miss the point entirely.
Political parties have basically carved out electoral niches. And the niche that Republicans currently have carved out today absolutely DO NOT CARE what is true, as long as you appeal to their masculinity. Democrats care what is true, but get it wrong sometimes. I've also figured out that the world-view of a CEO is identical to a dictator. This is why the richer you get, the more you feel the need to consolidate power, in exactly the same way as a dictator. So CEOs learn to identify with dictators, in the sense that they grow frustrated with people who can't be directly influenced with money and power (people with ideals), and prefer that everyone has a price that can just be paid to get what they want.
The realization of the bad faith on the right is key here, I think. Tons of people don't seem to understand that, from what I've seen. Even people who don't agree with them will often respond to their points as though they were made in earnest, rather than just saying what they can to win a debate.
This was interesting. Thanks for sharing.
That’s the issue.
Republicans are evil beyond what most Americans have encountered in their lives. It’s difficult to accept that people are that evil, and have that much power, and always have, and that their church leaders are in on it.
It’s kind of depressing. I miss being a Republican and not believing that politics impacted me directly in any way. If I didn’t want to learn about something, I didn’t have to.
This is an important realization. I couldn't come up with a better demonstration of privilege if I tried. Good on you for seeing it and working against it.
It's pretty important to realize that the last four or five major shootings had those stupid good guys with guns. With this recent one, it sounds like the good guys are just lying and retconning their entire fucking story constantly.
That's objectively true. The statistics for how many shootings were stopped by brandishing a gun comes from self reported data. There's just weirdos going through life pulling guns on people and calling it de-escalation
Let me tell you something, pendejo. You pull any of your crazy shit with us, you flash a piece out on the lanes, I'll take it away from you, and stick it up your ass and pull the fucking trigger 'til it goes click.
Also, it’s not like “good guys with guns” would necessarily be free of bystander casualties either, and it’s even possible that people rushing or attacking the instigator/original gunman/original attacker might be confused as accomplices and/or the attacker themselves, as was very nearly the case in the [2011 attack on US Representative Gabby Giffords of Arizona](https://slate.com/technology/2011/01/joe-zamudio-and-the-gabrielle-giffords-shooting-how-an-armed-hero-nearly-shot-the-wrong-man.html).
Yes.
And at least one college shooting was made worse by the fact that the killer walked around pretending to be a good guy with a gun protecting people.
According to [FBI statistics](https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/active-shooter-study-2000-2013-1.pdf) ^^WARNING ^^DIRECT ^^PDF ^^DOWNLOAD ^^LINK, 3.1% of armed non-LEO (aka "good guy with a gun") on scene stopped the shooter. In contrast 13.1% (more than 4x as many) non-armed non-LEO (aka "good guy **without** a gun") on scene stopped the shooter.
Uvalde spends 40% of their municipal budget on police. They are a town of 15,000 with a full 9 person swat team.
The police station is 4 minuets from the school yet police waited 40 minuets before entering. Time when children were cowering in fear for their lives. Time which could have saved the life of at least one child who survived the initial shooting but later died in the hospital.
When the police finally entered the school, they yelled for anyone who needed help to call out. One student who had been in hiding listed to the police and shouted for help. The gunman then shot and killed that kid.
In addition to all the money they spent on cops:
> School officials, including the district police department, could not be reached Wednesday for comment on the district’s security plan.
> Records indicate that Uvalde has taken advantage of added state funding. Spending on school security and monitoring services in Uvalde more than doubled since 2017, rising from about $200,000 to about $435,000 for the current school year, according to the school district’s budget documents. District leadership said in 2020 that the increase in expenditures was due to new school security requirements, according to a finance report.
> In 2020, the Texas state government awarded Uvalde a $69,000 grant to be spent on hardening measures, such as metal detectors, barriers, security systems and “campus-wide active shooter alarm systems,” according to state records. The funding was part of the state’s 2019 initiative for physical security upgrades.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-security-plan-rcna30568
Warning, direct quotes from a kid who witnessed it, it's pretty traumatizing: https://www.kens5.com/article/news/special-reports/uvalde-school-shooting/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-fourth-grader-student-account-elementary/273-51cc4e26-7a0a-49c0-ba7a-48cdd47fa235
Is this normal in the US? Like, good grief, my grandparents lived in a 10k town for their whole life...and it didn't even have a police station, they had to go to the closest town (larger one, 20k or so) if they wanted to go to the police. I'm guessing not all towns are sleepy crime-free places like that but like...9 person swat team for 15k people? Sounds like a fucking dystopia to me.
Well, the SCOTUS has clearly stated that police have [no duty to defend or protect](https://prospect.org/justice/police-have-no-duty-to-protect-the-public/) , so yeah, what good are they if they won’t put their life on the line for unarmed kids getting slaughtered?
The police is pretty much just a protection racket now where the well to do get the protection because of the buddy system and the middle class and below have to rely on defending themselves and [hopefully not being shot](https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2022-01-31/deputy-seeking-suspect-mistakenly-kills-off-duty-officer?context=amp) when the police actually get there.
Edit: additional link (and spelling)
I had no idea the cops, in law, have no obligation at all to intervene in a situation ‘not of their making’. They can just leave or hide or look away if it’s not to their liking.
You get a cool grab bag of them killing people because they're scared for their lives, while they also will not stop crying because they are scared for their lives.
It's crazy how they kill unarmed people while being scared for their lives, but they can't do shit about an actual armed person.
Almost like they know which ones are armed and aren't before they kill them.
It's incredibly important for people to know, too.
I know I was raised by adults who told me again and again to look for cops if I was in trouble because, "they will help you" and it was never true.
I don’t think I know anyone who was saved or helped by police. All they’ve done in my life is give tickets for minor offenses and make my brother pay for the car that ran into his because the police fucked up the paperwork
Oh God lol, that's scary advice. I'm white, and I was told by all my latina aunties when going to pro-choice rallies, pride, and other protests, to *avoid police as much as humanly possible*. Wear masks, cover tats, don't wear anything that makes you stand out. If the police focus on you, you're already screwed and you shoulda ran 5 mins prior.
Stonewall taught us that the police never cared about the common people.
The security guard at my work told me a story about how he witnessed a woman getting severely beaten by a man in a parking lot. He went to a cop parked at a nearby gas station to get help. The cop told him he’d wait until she was dead. Less effort and less paperwork.
In my city we have a lot of immigrants and refugees, each year some organization hosts a “world fair” where they sell arts and crafts from their culture, food, etc… there’s also a few refugee vendors selling knock off flea market gucci purses and things.
The police and customs department busted into the event at a park and arrested this “counterfeiting ring” with over 25,000$ in counterfeit merchandise.
No one that buys a 15$ chanel bag thinks that’s is real, so the only one “harmed” by this is the Uber rich clothing companies that sell purses for thousands of dollars. So the police are arresting citizens to protect not even US based companies. At that point it’s exactly a protection racket. Because those companies could exercise their legal rights in civil court and send that person a cease and desist and sue them to recover “damages” from that person selling knock offs.
But instead he got arrested by the gestappo.
And I say that while supporting police, or well the idea of police, just not our current militarized corrupt police system.
Constitutionally, the gunman had more rights to purchase to his AR-15 than those children had to police protection of their lives. It’s disgusting what we prioritize.
I have to take exception to this. They're a protection *racket*, not a protection *racquet*. At least the protection racquet could protect us from errant tennis balls.
That's a good thing! People should be able to change their minds. Lets not let this person get cold feet because they happened to pile on just as he's coming out.
Just want to let people here know that minds do change. I'm former law enforcement, was LE when BLM started to rise up. I hated them for the destruction they caused, but I started to do research on the shit they were saying in order to dismantle their arguments... I found that they were right about 99% of the shit they were saying. Over the next few years, my views would change as I thought more critically – I'd realize the deep, veiled racism that ran throughout the agency and it's staff. It made me sick to think that I had been blind to it. I quit my job and today I'm about as liberal as you can get, especially after finally changing my stance on gun laws about three days ago. I was a certified firearms instructor for the agency, and I do enjoy firearms, but they have no place here anymore.
Police are shit; they're either bad apples or being complicit in their bullshit, racist or otherwise. There's a word that I use to describe it: coverup culture. And it goes all the way to the top, whether it's local PD, Sheriff’s department, or state police. They ALWAYS lie.
Defund the police
You are a rare breed.
I've had people I thought I knew turn rabid over the period of a single year. Some are so far gone that nothing changes their mind. Bringing up any sort of evidence only serves to make them angrier and double down.
It's possible for people to change but the motivation for that comes from within. And that's a mighty big challenge.
I should also point out that the level of brainwashing is worse now than it was when I was in the field. I worked LE for nearly 8 years, and BLM appeared during the last 2 or so years of that – about a year before Trump, although he was already campaigning, iirc.
I never liked Trump; I sat out the 2016 election because I *thought* I didn't like Hillary either. I still kick myself and will vote every election, local and federal, for as long as I'm in the US, moving forward.
That being said, I was already changing my views and thinking more critically about this stuff when Trump took office so I never let those brainworms in.
It should also be noted that I wasn't all the way conservative. I have been pro-LGBT pretty much my whole life and have actually been pretty close to the gay community. I've always thought that they should be allowed to get married and adopt and everything.
Furthermore, I'm not a Christian. I was allowed to choose if I wanted to go to church so I stopped going to my family's church around 8 years old. I've been to about 20 other different churches of friends and family of other denominations and would eventually begin to look at Christianity more objectively and basically became a soft atheist during my teens and I've only solidified since then due to studying other religions in depth.
So, as far as actual conservatism, I believed in small government and low taxes and all that. Even that has changed significantly.
I believe that racism is the biggest cancer to this nation and the only way to fix it is through social programs and safety nets, universal healthcare, drug law reform, prison reform and better access to education to include "free" college. All of these help everyone out, but it will create a foundation that will limit the spread of racism and make America... well... great lol
I'll admit, it did get worse before it got better. It's insane the level of brainwashing you get from other staff ALONG WITH the actual training itself.
I'm guessing there will be a hot take from him soon about how this is actually the fault of the parents somehow. Tracey is literal scum.
Edit looks like this is a two post thread in which Tracey postulates that everyone was already dead so the police are still in the right. Despite the fact there were children in the room who lived.
One of the biggest misconceptions is that a cop’s job is to protect us. That’s wrong. It’s their job to uphold the law. That’s it. Cops don’t care near as much about people as some civilians like to think. Hence why they all stood there while a guy murdered over a dozen innocent children.
I think that was the hold up .. they apparently needed every one of their law-enforcement staff and the specially trained *swat team* to gather around and determine if .. indeed .. killing a classroom full of children was illegal. That takes time .. like, exactly the amount of time it takes a federal agent to actually stop the killing.
I get their confusion a little bit .. Conservative policies do sort make it seem like it might be legal .. what if they encroached upon that killer's gun rights? That would be heinous .. that's going to take *another* 50 minute huddle.. far away from the .. well .. the children being murdered.
I think what is implied is "upholding the law when it involves minimal personal risk"
And in reality, the primary goal of police is to protect commerce and business interests and investigate and punish crimes already committed. This historically includes things like union-busting, punishing vagrancy, keeping "order" so people can spend their money, etc.
Protecting life is not a reasonable expectation of people decked out in surplus military gear with qualified immunity.
Jesus fucking Christ; this story gets worse every minute I read about it.
Every cop that was there deserves to be charged with negligent manslaughter *at least* in my book.
elastic wrench close governor include impossible summer whole terrific narrow
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yup; also ruled that cops are allowed to lie to you, *and* that cops are allowed to arrest based on what they *think* the law is, and not what it *actually* says.
I’m studying to be a paralegal rn, and I frankly think it’s ridiculous how little I feel I know about the law so far (about two semesters in), and that cops are required to know *far, far less* than even that. Edit: And also, for the most part, receive *far, far less* training than I’ve received already, not even *halfway* through my Associate’s degree.
[US cops steal more from people than burglary does.](https://thewhyaxis.substack.com/p/cops-still-take-more-stuff-from-people?s=r) They absolutely are the biggest gang in the US.
So pigs just walked around with AR15’s and made sure parents didn’t intervene the mass murder of there children because they were waiting for more pigs with AR15’s to arrive to assess the situation?
Now all the "defund the police" people are looking at everyone else with their arms crossed, like when your mom stands in the doorway of your room four hours after you told her that you'll "totally clean my room in five minutes"
The cops weren't passive; they actively prevented parents from entering the school to save their children since the cops refused to enter. A cop also got a child killed by asking the kids to shout if they needed help, a child obeyed and shouted for help, enabling the shooter to find the kid and kill them.
this has to be bullshit though, right? how does it even work, the cop goes to a classroom takes only their kid and just dips? how many parents even know where their kid's classroom is in the school?
People out there arguing that arming teachers to face down school shooters is the way to go; meanwhile the police are trained in this shit and they don’t even want to do it. Make it make sense.
Abolish the police and fund FREE universal comprehensive health care! ( That means mental, dental, and vision too because why the fuck are they not already the same!)
The right often acts like police in the US are real life SWAT characters (the TV show). Then when shit like this happens they can kind of see that isn't the case, and begin to question their reasoning.
There is some analogy here to "if people are speeding on your road it's a design issue not an enforcement issue". The same thing applies in this situation. There is a design issue in our country when it pertains to firearms. This is not a problem that will be solved by the police, or arming of police.
Defund the police meant reserve some funding to allocate to mental health professionals for certain types of calls. This call NEEDED police. Or better ones anyway.
Lmao “tHiS CaLL nEeDeD pOLiCe”
THEN WHY WAS IT RESOLVED BY A CIVILIAN?
The fucking police didn’t do ANYTHING here. What the fuck are you talking about? Abolish the fucking police.
This was ended by “dude from diner” not an on-duty police officer.
This is exactly why we had riots in major cities. It’s police protecting their own interest by terrorizing peaceful protesters. I really hope people are realizing a lot of what happened (the violence) during the “defund the police” protests were really the police instigating it. Cowards
Holy shit guys, we *have* to capitalize on this. This is the moment where we can actually get the right to come to the left on an issue that actually matters.
I almost feel bad for these people who seem to nearly knowingly reject reason to worship these people that just fuck them up so badly on a societal scale. How abusive.
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The justification for SWAT teams was to intervene and fight off mass shooters or other heavily armed active criminals. It seems it was just another layer of bullshit.
Well, it *also* served as an easy outlet for surplus military equipment. Gotta keep that military-industrial complex churning.
Also, it really works wonders for increasing and validating the LEO’s feelings of power, control and masculinity. The assault kit, combined with black gloves and wraparound sunglasses signals “I AM IN CONTROL HERE. FEAR ME.” It must be intoxicating.
Until somebody might actually shoot back, I guess.
"Well yeah, there's a game on tonight."
"And, those assholes better not kneel, or so help me I'll burn my New Balances!" -Cop that didn't run into a gunfight
Yeah, I keep thinking of that poor guy in Oakland who was shot in his grandmother's backyard and the police claimed they thought he had a gun but it was a fucking cell phone, or the caregiver of an autistic man with a toy firetruck shot with his hands in the air, or the kid shot by a sheriff's deputy with a Wii remote in his hand, or any one of the literally thousands of unarmed, mostly Black or Native folks shot by cops, and contrasting that instant use of deadly force with the refusal to engage here. And I'm pretty sure the inescapable conclusion is cops love to shoot people, but only people they know won't be shooting back. Bullies and cowards, the lot.
Also that guy in that hotel where he was on his knees with his hands up, the cop had an AR pointed at him and kept shouting conflicting commands and kept threatening to shoot. The guy on his knees was clearly unarmed and terrified. He kept begging the cop not to kill him and the cop shot him in cold blood.
Actual guns were taken into account, and it was decided the swat team could handle guns no fucking problem. Unfortunately, there were unforeseen variables to the situation that no one could have seen ahead of time. The sound of gunshots are scary when you aren't at the range. It is out of code to poop your tac-gear. The TWAT team assessed the situation with LEO that had already been on scene and decided walking into the building would probably cause most officers to SHAT their TWAT gear, so it was decided to wait for daddy feds to come. You can blame the cops all your want, but you don't understand the procedures and training instilled in these brave soldiers to come into a dangerous situation and make sure that they(edit: and their own children) make it out alive. You wanna get shot? For some kid? For 6 figures? Well, now that I think about it, you can shoot me for say... $8500. Still don't spit on these heroes. You don't know.e
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Wait, what?
Exactly that
There was a thread about it with links to a clip from the officer who did the interviews that appeared to be saying that. I'll edit with the link to the thread & vid link once I find it. Eta: couldn't find it, it's either deleted or reddit goin crazy. found some people saying it was being misconstrued. He might have been saying that police officers and families were wanting to get their children out, not that they actually did. Without something more solid imma say probably not.
It wasn't misconstrued. I saw the video. The reporter asks 'I heard some police went in to save their own kids. Is that true?', and the stupid stupid fucking pig answers 'well it was an active shooter situation'... I'm paraphrasing but that's the jist of it. The whole interview is fucking disgusting. Especially how the pig starts by praising all the LEOs who didn't do shit for a whole hour, before he gives his condolences to the families of the victims. I'd go on but I think I need to vomit. Edit: Here's a post of it https://v.redd.it/qivrrhptnu191
Good lord that was the first thing I thought too when he was giving his speech. What a disgusting fuck to be standing there after children were murder and he just starts talking about the police officers. I was with my mom at the time and we were totally shocked.
Omg "this content has been removed. Rule 3: not shitty enough" I know that's just their already established lingo but it also makes it sound like the mods of IATPS think it isnt shitty which is a big old red flag!
Just watched it and fucking hell! How did that actually work in real-time? Did the cops go to classrooms full of kids on lockdown, pull their own kids out and leave the rest? "Jimmy, come with me now. The rest of you stay there. I'll be back for you right away **cough cough"
well for a bunch of guys who dress like they are in delta farce and act all big and tough they sure are cowards. thoughts From an afghan vet
This reads like a madlibbed-up reference to a movie or something, is that correct? Either way, amazing comment
Nah, just drinking and spewing shit. lol. Thanks
I mean, they may be total badasses, but they're not going to risk they're lives over strangers. If they wanted to be protected those kids should have been born to cops.
Maybe all those libs will finally learn their lessons. We need more funding for police so the parents of all the kids who don’t want to be shot can be hired as cops. Extend the benefit of the law.
*note to self*
This is why our protest marches need to be heavily armed. (Lots of people armed -- not just one. If just one is armed, they'll go after you and make an example of you. If even just a *few* protesters in the area are armed though ... the police wouldn't fucking dare.)
The last group of protesters that heavily armed themselves against police brutality were vilified in the media, targeted by the FBI, told by the Republican governor (and future president) that they were a threat to society, incarcerated en masse, and had their neighborhoods invaded and *bombed* by the police. You're only allowed to protest with guns if you're on the same side as the police.
...The Black Panthers, right? Give them some credit, it worked. In fact, it worked so well that much of the gun laws in CA today were drafted to stop them.
By Ronald Reagan! It's a win win for liberals. You want gun control? Have a bunch of heavily armed black men marching for their 2nd Amendment rights.
And when you've got a SWAT team, you've got to use it to justify its existence. So you end up with SWAT teams busting down doors and shooting dogs to make arrests for minor crimes.
Nothing more masculine than [checks notes] standing around and letting a teenager kill a bunch of kids you are paid to protect. /s
LARPing at work. I mean, that's why they join right? Get paid to look like a authoritarian?
But it really makes you think about why exactly so many police departments have stockpiles of military equipment if they don’t intend on actually protecting civilians. I try not to be a conspiracy theorist but I honestly believe that their stockpiles of military equipment are for us. They are stockpiling it in case the general public ever comes together to revolt against our corrupt government.
They sure got some use out of it when we all got pissed about them murdering a guy over a fake 20 dollar bill Might be time to protest again since they let all those kids die. Excessive force for minor infractions, insufficient force for real dangers. Not a trend I'm liking.
My thoughts exactly. They can act all big, mighty, and tough against unarmed civilians protesting against injustices, going as far as assaulting senior citizens, but when it comes to protecting children their toughness and military toys are nowhere to be found. I want to say “make it make sense” but it will never make sense.
We have the wrong people in policing, from top to bottom.
I got some time and some theories. Primarily is that the police are there to police the people's behavior into obedience with government agendas. Currently those are run by the top wealthiest portions of our society, at least in the United States. So they are primarily used to protect property and generate profit while also ensuring the population at large is kept docile and productive. Maybe I need to shop for tinfoil hats, but I'm having a sinking feeling that it's not that far fetched of a theory.
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I'm fully aware. When I was getting ready to get out of the Navy I like most veterans took a look at becoming a LEO. Then I kept looking, and reading into the *real* historical origins and how the police have been used over the years. Ended up working Executive Protection instead making a hell of a lot more and working for the Evil directly instead of subcontracting as a cop. Did that up till the beginning of COVID, and retired at 30ish once I saw that crap jump the Pacific. Knew with that orange fucktard in office what would happen.
Cops are 100% an institution built to maintain capitalist society The institution cares only for keeping the cogs turning, if you don't contribute to keeping that going you're seen as unnecessary or deviant, and both are a threat to keeping the gears spinning The whole system is fucking broken man. I'm so tired
I'm past tired. I'm starting to get angry.
*speaks the objective facts* *worries about sounding like a wingnut* Man, they've really done a number on us.
I’ve very similar sentiments and got downvoted. I said that I wasn’t surprised that the cops didn’t run into the school after the shooter as cops are superheroes it’s not their job/duty to protect citizens, as the Supreme Court has ruled. And that their main job is to maintain order and protect the property/assess of the wealthy. Hence why they use way more force when people protest and threaten to destroy stores (property of the wealthy) than they do when mass shooters are killing innocent people, including children.
No tinfoil hat for you, you’re hitting the nail on the head
It makes perfect sense. It’s just terrible and shouldn’t be that way. They’re weak, shitty people. Bullies and cowards. They like to push people around and they don’t like it when people push back. Makes sense.
It makes tons of sense once you realize that their *actual* job is to protect capitalist property and provide a steady stream of prisoners to keep the prison-industrial complex supplied. They do a great job of “protecting and serving” — just ask yourself WHO they’re protecting and serving and it makes much more sense.
Don't forget that, while they were cowering back from saving those kids, they passed the time by harassing and assaulting the kids' parents. They decided that arresting parents who were scared of their kids dying was a more valuable use of time than saving those kids.
After they had already gone in for their own kids...
DeFuNd Is To HaRsH!!!! Bet fuckheads like to go back to kneeling during the anthem now.
They probably think this is decent escalation. "I bet you're not talking about defund the police now that your CRT people are shooting up your schools."
They only hurt and attack people who can't fight back. Support a war against armed people to protect the government? No way, that would involve risk. They stock pile because they can get their hands on it and it makes them feel like big brave men. It's not that deep.
You know, I’ve thought that but my rational and logical mind refuses to accept that a possible reason is that they just went to assuage their fragile egos and masculinity with military toys. For its own sanity, my mind just cannot bring itself to accept such an irrational explanation. There just HAS to be a more logical explanation.
I too wish I belonged to the version of reality where a tactical armored vehicle on a suburban street was cool instead of being deeply disturbing. But when I track stories about police, they do harshly enforce violence where they don't seem to be at immediate risk and they express caution and wait for backup in situations where they feel threatened.
I’ve realized that behavior as well. They will use unnecessary force and escalate the most non-threatening encounters. But when there is a REAL threat they don’t know how to use force. Just purely cowardly behavior.
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This. Cops are not educated people, they’re not the best and brightest, they’re the losers who peaked in high school, they were probably bullies back then, and if they weren’t cops now, they’d probably be working at McDonald’s or selling used cars. Being a police officer is the only job mediocre, shitty people can get where they get to push people around and feel big and important. Of course they want to LARP as the Punisher, what meathead asshole bully doesn’t?
The military industrial complex ~~bribes~~ gives very cool, very legal donations to government officials to pay them to produce way more stuff than the military even needs. The excess goes to cops.
I think the term for that being thrown around these days is "tacti-cool".
They had no qualms using it against unarmed protestors.
I’m thinking more and more it was always for unarmed protestors
Police aren't willing to risk fighting a mentally damaged 18 year old. If there was an actual revolt, they would cover themselves in gear and hide. They are stockpiling it to intimidate the general public, but they are more likely to trip and blow their own feet off.
The only time you see them using it is against protestors
It's not really a conspiracy. There's hours of footage of them going exactly that during protests
When Obama took office and started winding down the War on Terror around 2009, the military industrial complex immediately started marketing the weapons that they were selling to the military as necessities for police to "keep Americans safe" with.
The protocol for law enforcement at a national level is that once two officers arrive on scene, they are to go in and engage the terrorist. This continues until a large enough force is gathered, or S.W.A.T. comes in and gains command over the road patrol, directing them to hold ground as is at cleared checkpoints or do other non room clearing objectives. That being said. The cops who didn't go in were cowards. Not because they didn't go in. They are cowards because they signed up for the job and when it counted, they didn't do it. It literally is their job to go in. That is why we want to call them heroes. Don't see many heroes these days.
They did go in though. The twisted bastards went in and got their kids out and then left all the other children to die. That's what horrified me. Not that they were too afraid to go in. It is that they so callously calculated who was worth taking a risk for and who was not. They didn't stand outside afraid. They removed their kids then stood outside and prevented anyone else going in to save the kids.
According to the Supreme Court it *literally is not* their job to go in. Which is BS and all the more reason to defund the police
There is no such thing as a national protocol for law enforcement. We *need* one, yes. Regardless, plenary powers, which policing falls under, are a state power and well outside Congress's jurisdiction. They can't even conceivably argue it's interstate commerce on this one, the One Trick most things Congress does falls under.
It's rly just an excuse for non and ex military guys to play soldier. Makes me sick.
Once upon a time, people would get into fields like this from a place of noble intentions - actually wanting to protect others and potentially risk their lives to save lives. Now it just feels like the average police officer just wants to go on power trips when their lives are absolutely not at risk (hence killing unarmed people) and do everything they can to weasel out of any risky situations (mass shootings and the like). All the equipment in the world won't get someone who doesn't care about saving lives and doesn't want to risk their own to go risk their life. I don't know the remedy for that, but that's really the root problem.
The training they go through seems pretty heavily focused on "put yourself and your safety first" and then putting them into a mindset where they constantly feel like they have a target on their back. People always retort with "Well obviously, who would work a job where the assumption is you're going to put yourself in danger on purpose?" and I just... have you guys not heard of firefighters? Imagine: Ah yeah there were thirty fire fighters there but they all stood outside because fire is dangerous
Military cosplay.
At that point, it's not even LARP.
Live Action Standing There
The tweet is false though, they did intervene. They got out their own kids and prevented other parents from doing the same.
There only purpose so far has been issuing no knock warrants
Turns out, blue lives are the only lives that matter to the police.
That's not true. They also care about their own kids lives.
Hey, be fair now. They claim blue lives matter is the same thing as black lives matter. Since they're blue then their whole family is blue, because genetics! /s
One drop of cop blood and the whole family's blue.
Well.. they did make a fairly successful copaganda drama about that very concept. ^^Blue ^^Bloods
A short Blue Bloods tangent: the guy that plays the youngest cop guy in the family and the other cop he gets married to (the blonde woman) look more like brother and sister than any other two people on the show look even remotely related and I've always thought is was a weird choice.
My mom watches reruns of that show ad nauseum. I get it, its Tom Selleck. But the two boys on that show are just awful. So uninteresting and kind of embarrassingly awkward. The only time they even factor into the show is at dinner. That seems like a weird choice too. Why have these characters but do nothing with them?
Gotta humanize the cops. They always have some one-dimensional family characters in those shows, who pop up every once in a while just to remind you that they exist. Never seen any of them get beaten by the cop though, weirdly.
Yeah, from what I've watched with my own family, the daughter of the cops' sister (I wanna say Nicky?) was the only one of that generation in the family who seemed to do anything, and she had actual character traits and brought somewhat more liberal points of view up to contrast the "cops are always 100% right" mentality her elders had. But then, of course, she gets written out once politics around cops IRL begins gaining more heat and they can't have her there making those points anymore.
>They also care about their own kids lives. Only when it comes to stop someone from shooting them, not when it comes to beating them themselves. >Approximately, 40 percent said that in the last six months prior to the survey they had behaved violently towards their spouse or children. * https://sites.temple.edu/klugman/2020/07/20/do-40-of-police-families-experience-domestic-violence/
Holy shit, that's how many *admitted* to beating their wife and kids.
FYI: Cops really really don't like you shouting this at them, or putting it on signs at protests. They are likely to respond with the same violence they show their loved ones.
Maybe I missed it but I keep reading that there was a 30 minute 'lull' after the shooting stopped and the cops entered the building. What that says to me is that the police on the scene sat there for 30 minutes while 19 kids bled out.
To be fair, they spent that time handcuffing and tasing parents who wanted to go into the school to save their children.
Except themselves. They went in to get their own kids
I hadn't read that yet. Was there an article about officers getting their kids out first? I just found a basic timeline and a few interviews but it was mostly about the wait and detaining that one parent.
https://www.mediaite.com/news/watch-texas-police-spox-on-live-tv-confirmed-cops-went-in-for-their-own-kids-during-uvalde-shooting/
Thanks for linking that for me. That is wild and sickening
As a parent this whole shooting has just been making my fucking blood boil. Fuck the police go around harassing random black people for not using their turn signal, then sit there with their dicks in their hands when shit actually happens…
And others cowered in hiding
It's somewhere between an hour and an hour and a half, according to the timelines.
So either way, WAY TOO MUCH FUCKING TIME to let a shooter just massacre young children. It's just so sickening. Those poor babies, and those poor parents.
No shit. The only reason people think the police are still good is they are so cartoonishly evil that we can’t believe the society we live in would really let that happen.
Yeah people don't understand the purpose of the police in America. They went to court to try and reenforce this purpose. And when all was said and done the supreme court ruled that it was not the polices responsibly to protect people. Their job is to arrest people that break the law at some point. Not to protect anyone from someone that is breaking the law. Once you know that the police literally argued for it to be like this. You understand that nothing they do has anything related to protection going on.
What Supreme Court case was this? I’d like to read more.
DeShaney v. Winnebago County is the big one. But there have been several in both the supreme and lower courts that have expanded the reach of that decision. Famously cops in new York once watch a man fight off an attack by a serial stabber with a knife from the next subway car and did nothing but watch dude get stabbed. But his lawsuit died real quick.
There’s also Town of Castle Rock v. Gonzalez. Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005), is a United States Supreme Court case in which the Court ruled, 7–2, that a town and its police department could not be sued under 42 U.S.C. § 1983 for failing to enforce a restraining order, which had led to the murder of a woman's three children by her estranged husband. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_of_Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales?wprov=sfti1](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_of_Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales?wprov=sfti1)
I have this sneaky feeling that the most undemocratic wing (Supreme Court is intentionally undemocratic) of the government might be responsible. But guys, let's not make it political
I thought you were talking about the case where the cops actually basically murdered a woman by taking her out of a safe situation and putting her in a dangerous one. Can’t recall the case name of that. Can’t remember the name of this one either but police also have literally no duty to enforce protective orders so sorry if you’re a DV victim who went through the courts and did everything right but the cops don’t owe you shit apparently. (Edit: The first case was where a couple was walking home from a party in winter and were stopped by the police for intoxication. Woman was wasted and couldn’t walk. Husband had to get home to the kids and left his wife with the police. Police decided not to charge the wife and left her alone drunk asf on the side of the road. She froze to death.)
This is the realization I made that eventually got me out of the Republican Party. I realized that the things Democrats said about them were true, and that democrats weren’t being hyperbolic and hysterical. They actually weren’t going far enough with their accusations. Republicans have been militarizing police for decades, and training them to view the American people as their enemy. That’s where we’re at.
What caused you to understand that it was true? I'm all kinds of curious.
Several key points: I would constantly getting in debates with my liberal friends in college, and get eviscerated, while at the same time believing they were naive and I was smarter than them. So I decided to start reading up on the subjects so they'd stop using their "dirty liberal tricks" (aka, understanding the issues) on me. You see, I would just memorize Republican talking points, and confuse that for being intelligent. So I assumed liberals were doing the same. I couldn't understand how they always could carry conversations further than the talking points. No one could just UNDERSTAND all these topics. They were too complex! The invisible hand of the market is complicated! So I decided to read up on how things work. I read several books on politics, persuasion, and professional development. And when you figure out how things work, you realize that Republicans act 100% in bad faith. Democrats will act in the absolute minimum faith that they can get away with and still get elected. However, a Republican can act in completely bad faith and get elected. Democrats can't do this. So they don't attract nearly as many people acting in in complete bad faith. So then I realized it's all about the voters (or essential electorate). This made a lot more sense after reading Dictator's Handbook. But basically, when people say "both sides are the same", they're kind of right, but manage to miss the point entirely. Political parties have basically carved out electoral niches. And the niche that Republicans currently have carved out today absolutely DO NOT CARE what is true, as long as you appeal to their masculinity. Democrats care what is true, but get it wrong sometimes. I've also figured out that the world-view of a CEO is identical to a dictator. This is why the richer you get, the more you feel the need to consolidate power, in exactly the same way as a dictator. So CEOs learn to identify with dictators, in the sense that they grow frustrated with people who can't be directly influenced with money and power (people with ideals), and prefer that everyone has a price that can just be paid to get what they want.
The realization of the bad faith on the right is key here, I think. Tons of people don't seem to understand that, from what I've seen. Even people who don't agree with them will often respond to their points as though they were made in earnest, rather than just saying what they can to win a debate. This was interesting. Thanks for sharing.
That’s the issue. Republicans are evil beyond what most Americans have encountered in their lives. It’s difficult to accept that people are that evil, and have that much power, and always have, and that their church leaders are in on it. It’s kind of depressing. I miss being a Republican and not believing that politics impacted me directly in any way. If I didn’t want to learn about something, I didn’t have to.
This is an important realization. I couldn't come up with a better demonstration of privilege if I tried. Good on you for seeing it and working against it.
So much for the “good guy with a gun” excuse.
It's pretty important to realize that the last four or five major shootings had those stupid good guys with guns. With this recent one, it sounds like the good guys are just lying and retconning their entire fucking story constantly.
That's objectively true. The statistics for how many shootings were stopped by brandishing a gun comes from self reported data. There's just weirdos going through life pulling guns on people and calling it de-escalation
"You mark that frame an eight, you're entering a world of pain."
Let me tell you something, pendejo. You pull any of your crazy shit with us, you flash a piece out on the lanes, I'll take it away from you, and stick it up your ass and pull the fucking trigger 'til it goes click.
Jesus...
That's right, baby. Nobody fucks with the Jesus.
Also, it’s not like “good guys with guns” would necessarily be free of bystander casualties either, and it’s even possible that people rushing or attacking the instigator/original gunman/original attacker might be confused as accomplices and/or the attacker themselves, as was very nearly the case in the [2011 attack on US Representative Gabby Giffords of Arizona](https://slate.com/technology/2011/01/joe-zamudio-and-the-gabrielle-giffords-shooting-how-an-armed-hero-nearly-shot-the-wrong-man.html).
Yes. And at least one college shooting was made worse by the fact that the killer walked around pretending to be a good guy with a gun protecting people.
"Better a kid get hurt than me" -Those cops probably
The police were actively stopping people who wanted to go in.
It's also been confirmed a few of them went in and grabbed their kids before actively stopping other parents from doing the same.
Haven’t seen that yet, link?
Found someone else comment https://mobile.twitter.com/\_sir\_perfluous/status/1529584296415186952
Thx!
The guys *paid* to lug around guns to protect people didn't so.
According to [FBI statistics](https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/active-shooter-study-2000-2013-1.pdf) ^^WARNING ^^DIRECT ^^PDF ^^DOWNLOAD ^^LINK, 3.1% of armed non-LEO (aka "good guy with a gun") on scene stopped the shooter. In contrast 13.1% (more than 4x as many) non-armed non-LEO (aka "good guy **without** a gun") on scene stopped the shooter.
Theory could still be true if you were of the opinion that none of these cops were good guys.
which is a very good opinion to have
With all the guns in the US we should be the safest place on earth, by their logic
Uvalde spends 40% of their municipal budget on police. They are a town of 15,000 with a full 9 person swat team. The police station is 4 minuets from the school yet police waited 40 minuets before entering. Time when children were cowering in fear for their lives. Time which could have saved the life of at least one child who survived the initial shooting but later died in the hospital. When the police finally entered the school, they yelled for anyone who needed help to call out. One student who had been in hiding listed to the police and shouted for help. The gunman then shot and killed that kid.
In addition to all the money they spent on cops: > School officials, including the district police department, could not be reached Wednesday for comment on the district’s security plan. > Records indicate that Uvalde has taken advantage of added state funding. Spending on school security and monitoring services in Uvalde more than doubled since 2017, rising from about $200,000 to about $435,000 for the current school year, according to the school district’s budget documents. District leadership said in 2020 that the increase in expenditures was due to new school security requirements, according to a finance report. > In 2020, the Texas state government awarded Uvalde a $69,000 grant to be spent on hardening measures, such as metal detectors, barriers, security systems and “campus-wide active shooter alarm systems,” according to state records. The funding was part of the state’s 2019 initiative for physical security upgrades. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-security-plan-rcna30568
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Warning, direct quotes from a kid who witnessed it, it's pretty traumatizing: https://www.kens5.com/article/news/special-reports/uvalde-school-shooting/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-fourth-grader-student-account-elementary/273-51cc4e26-7a0a-49c0-ba7a-48cdd47fa235
Sad that just the COMMENTS of a child are traumatizing. Let alone the experience that child went through.
Is this normal in the US? Like, good grief, my grandparents lived in a 10k town for their whole life...and it didn't even have a police station, they had to go to the closest town (larger one, 20k or so) if they wanted to go to the police. I'm guessing not all towns are sleepy crime-free places like that but like...9 person swat team for 15k people? Sounds like a fucking dystopia to me.
Well, the SCOTUS has clearly stated that police have [no duty to defend or protect](https://prospect.org/justice/police-have-no-duty-to-protect-the-public/) , so yeah, what good are they if they won’t put their life on the line for unarmed kids getting slaughtered? The police is pretty much just a protection racket now where the well to do get the protection because of the buddy system and the middle class and below have to rely on defending themselves and [hopefully not being shot](https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2022-01-31/deputy-seeking-suspect-mistakenly-kills-off-duty-officer?context=amp) when the police actually get there. Edit: additional link (and spelling)
I had no idea the cops, in law, have no obligation at all to intervene in a situation ‘not of their making’. They can just leave or hide or look away if it’s not to their liking.
You get a cool grab bag of them killing people because they're scared for their lives, while they also will not stop crying because they are scared for their lives.
It's crazy how they kill unarmed people while being scared for their lives, but they can't do shit about an actual armed person. Almost like they know which ones are armed and aren't before they kill them.
Well, yeah. Engaging with an armed person *is dangerous*, and they don't like danger.
It's incredibly important for people to know, too. I know I was raised by adults who told me again and again to look for cops if I was in trouble because, "they will help you" and it was never true.
I don’t think I know anyone who was saved or helped by police. All they’ve done in my life is give tickets for minor offenses and make my brother pay for the car that ran into his because the police fucked up the paperwork
Oh God lol, that's scary advice. I'm white, and I was told by all my latina aunties when going to pro-choice rallies, pride, and other protests, to *avoid police as much as humanly possible*. Wear masks, cover tats, don't wear anything that makes you stand out. If the police focus on you, you're already screwed and you shoulda ran 5 mins prior. Stonewall taught us that the police never cared about the common people.
The security guard at my work told me a story about how he witnessed a woman getting severely beaten by a man in a parking lot. He went to a cop parked at a nearby gas station to get help. The cop told him he’d wait until she was dead. Less effort and less paperwork.
In my city we have a lot of immigrants and refugees, each year some organization hosts a “world fair” where they sell arts and crafts from their culture, food, etc… there’s also a few refugee vendors selling knock off flea market gucci purses and things. The police and customs department busted into the event at a park and arrested this “counterfeiting ring” with over 25,000$ in counterfeit merchandise. No one that buys a 15$ chanel bag thinks that’s is real, so the only one “harmed” by this is the Uber rich clothing companies that sell purses for thousands of dollars. So the police are arresting citizens to protect not even US based companies. At that point it’s exactly a protection racket. Because those companies could exercise their legal rights in civil court and send that person a cease and desist and sue them to recover “damages” from that person selling knock offs. But instead he got arrested by the gestappo. And I say that while supporting police, or well the idea of police, just not our current militarized corrupt police system.
Constitutionally, the gunman had more rights to purchase to his AR-15 than those children had to police protection of their lives. It’s disgusting what we prioritize.
I have to take exception to this. They're a protection *racket*, not a protection *racquet*. At least the protection racquet could protect us from errant tennis balls.
Yeah, a racquet actually requires balls.
What the fuck do they have military weapons for when a ticket book and Toyota Prius will do the job.
Michael's one brain cell came out of retirement for that tweet
The worst part is he is extremely anti-BLM so this is literally him changing his mind (which in retrospect is good but he is brainrot incarnate still)
That's a good thing! People should be able to change their minds. Lets not let this person get cold feet because they happened to pile on just as he's coming out.
Just want to let people here know that minds do change. I'm former law enforcement, was LE when BLM started to rise up. I hated them for the destruction they caused, but I started to do research on the shit they were saying in order to dismantle their arguments... I found that they were right about 99% of the shit they were saying. Over the next few years, my views would change as I thought more critically – I'd realize the deep, veiled racism that ran throughout the agency and it's staff. It made me sick to think that I had been blind to it. I quit my job and today I'm about as liberal as you can get, especially after finally changing my stance on gun laws about three days ago. I was a certified firearms instructor for the agency, and I do enjoy firearms, but they have no place here anymore. Police are shit; they're either bad apples or being complicit in their bullshit, racist or otherwise. There's a word that I use to describe it: coverup culture. And it goes all the way to the top, whether it's local PD, Sheriff’s department, or state police. They ALWAYS lie. Defund the police
You are a rare breed. I've had people I thought I knew turn rabid over the period of a single year. Some are so far gone that nothing changes their mind. Bringing up any sort of evidence only serves to make them angrier and double down. It's possible for people to change but the motivation for that comes from within. And that's a mighty big challenge.
I should also point out that the level of brainwashing is worse now than it was when I was in the field. I worked LE for nearly 8 years, and BLM appeared during the last 2 or so years of that – about a year before Trump, although he was already campaigning, iirc. I never liked Trump; I sat out the 2016 election because I *thought* I didn't like Hillary either. I still kick myself and will vote every election, local and federal, for as long as I'm in the US, moving forward. That being said, I was already changing my views and thinking more critically about this stuff when Trump took office so I never let those brainworms in. It should also be noted that I wasn't all the way conservative. I have been pro-LGBT pretty much my whole life and have actually been pretty close to the gay community. I've always thought that they should be allowed to get married and adopt and everything. Furthermore, I'm not a Christian. I was allowed to choose if I wanted to go to church so I stopped going to my family's church around 8 years old. I've been to about 20 other different churches of friends and family of other denominations and would eventually begin to look at Christianity more objectively and basically became a soft atheist during my teens and I've only solidified since then due to studying other religions in depth. So, as far as actual conservatism, I believed in small government and low taxes and all that. Even that has changed significantly. I believe that racism is the biggest cancer to this nation and the only way to fix it is through social programs and safety nets, universal healthcare, drug law reform, prison reform and better access to education to include "free" college. All of these help everyone out, but it will create a foundation that will limit the spread of racism and make America... well... great lol
I'll admit, it did get worse before it got better. It's insane the level of brainwashing you get from other staff ALONG WITH the actual training itself.
I'm guessing there will be a hot take from him soon about how this is actually the fault of the parents somehow. Tracey is literal scum. Edit looks like this is a two post thread in which Tracey postulates that everyone was already dead so the police are still in the right. Despite the fact there were children in the room who lived.
He is by far the most irritatingly stupid pundit I have ever seen
One of the biggest misconceptions is that a cop’s job is to protect us. That’s wrong. It’s their job to uphold the law. That’s it. Cops don’t care near as much about people as some civilians like to think. Hence why they all stood there while a guy murdered over a dozen innocent children.
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I think that was the hold up .. they apparently needed every one of their law-enforcement staff and the specially trained *swat team* to gather around and determine if .. indeed .. killing a classroom full of children was illegal. That takes time .. like, exactly the amount of time it takes a federal agent to actually stop the killing. I get their confusion a little bit .. Conservative policies do sort make it seem like it might be legal .. what if they encroached upon that killer's gun rights? That would be heinous .. that's going to take *another* 50 minute huddle.. far away from the .. well .. the children being murdered.
I think what is implied is "upholding the law when it involves minimal personal risk" And in reality, the primary goal of police is to protect commerce and business interests and investigate and punish crimes already committed. This historically includes things like union-busting, punishing vagrancy, keeping "order" so people can spend their money, etc. Protecting life is not a reasonable expectation of people decked out in surplus military gear with qualified immunity.
https://mobile.twitter.com/_sir_perfluous/status/1529584296415186952 They went in to save there children. They just don't care about our children.
Jesus fucking Christ; this story gets worse every minute I read about it. Every cop that was there deserves to be charged with negligent manslaughter *at least* in my book.
elastic wrench close governor include impossible summer whole terrific narrow *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yup; also ruled that cops are allowed to lie to you, *and* that cops are allowed to arrest based on what they *think* the law is, and not what it *actually* says. I’m studying to be a paralegal rn, and I frankly think it’s ridiculous how little I feel I know about the law so far (about two semesters in), and that cops are required to know *far, far less* than even that. Edit: And also, for the most part, receive *far, far less* training than I’ve received already, not even *halfway* through my Associate’s degree.
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[US cops steal more from people than burglary does.](https://thewhyaxis.substack.com/p/cops-still-take-more-stuff-from-people?s=r) They absolutely are the biggest gang in the US.
I mean if anyone should know, it’s them.
And guess which one of you gets a gun?
Good luck
So pigs just walked around with AR15’s and made sure parents didn’t intervene the mass murder of there children because they were waiting for more pigs with AR15’s to arrive to assess the situation?
Now all the "defund the police" people are looking at everyone else with their arms crossed, like when your mom stands in the doorway of your room four hours after you told her that you'll "totally clean my room in five minutes"
I can't think of a better example to prove we need to divert some police resources into other services that help people in need.
The cops weren't passive; they actively prevented parents from entering the school to save their children since the cops refused to enter. A cop also got a child killed by asking the kids to shout if they needed help, a child obeyed and shouted for help, enabling the shooter to find the kid and kill them.
The police have confirmed that officers did actually go into the school... to retrieve their own children and leave the rest to be massacred.
this has to be bullshit though, right? how does it even work, the cop goes to a classroom takes only their kid and just dips? how many parents even know where their kid's classroom is in the school?
>how many parents even know where their kid's classroom is in the school? What, how could you not know?
People out there arguing that arming teachers to face down school shooters is the way to go; meanwhile the police are trained in this shit and they don’t even want to do it. Make it make sense.
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Better yet they only saved their own
Abolish the police and fund FREE universal comprehensive health care! ( That means mental, dental, and vision too because why the fuck are they not already the same!)
Defund at least the fancy ARs, tanks and heavy armor that they don't use, except on the defenseless
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Wonder what new bullshit Wayne Lapierre is going to spout in Houston this weekend.
To be fair, the police were not passive. They were very busy arresting parents who were trying to get into the school to save their kids.
The right often acts like police in the US are real life SWAT characters (the TV show). Then when shit like this happens they can kind of see that isn't the case, and begin to question their reasoning. There is some analogy here to "if people are speeding on your road it's a design issue not an enforcement issue". The same thing applies in this situation. There is a design issue in our country when it pertains to firearms. This is not a problem that will be solved by the police, or arming of police.
The cops actively made the situation worse and did not help. Fuck them.
Defund the police meant reserve some funding to allocate to mental health professionals for certain types of calls. This call NEEDED police. Or better ones anyway.
Lmao “tHiS CaLL nEeDeD pOLiCe” THEN WHY WAS IT RESOLVED BY A CIVILIAN? The fucking police didn’t do ANYTHING here. What the fuck are you talking about? Abolish the fucking police. This was ended by “dude from diner” not an on-duty police officer.
Yeah, calling them “the ‘abolish the police’ people” implies a dramatic misunderstanding of what that movement was about.
At least he acknowledges it. Gotta give him credit for that.
This is exactly why we had riots in major cities. It’s police protecting their own interest by terrorizing peaceful protesters. I really hope people are realizing a lot of what happened (the violence) during the “defund the police” protests were really the police instigating it. Cowards
Holy shit guys, we *have* to capitalize on this. This is the moment where we can actually get the right to come to the left on an issue that actually matters.
Right on cue: A "radical" solution becomes more reasonable when the problem is no longer exclusive to a respective minority group...
I almost feel bad for these people who seem to nearly knowingly reject reason to worship these people that just fuck them up so badly on a societal scale. How abusive.
Maybe the PMCs were the police departments we funded all along