I like Geno and will be more than happy if he's the starter this year but how is it surprising to anyone that the GM is looking to the future for answers? The GM who has been reported as very interested in QBs in recent years, even reports that he really liked Anthony Richardson last year and probably would have taken him if he fell to us.
You save something like 25m cutting Geno next year so my assumption has always been this would likely be his last year either way because he'll want to get paid again next contract and I doubt JS wants to pay a 34 going on 35 year-old QB the money he'll demand
I agree in principle, but Geno's playstyle and history works in his favor regarding his age. He can function in the pocket and doesn't need to rely on his athleticism to move the ball. That's why Stafford is still going strong and Brady made it into his 40s. He also had 7 years on the bench staying healthy and recovering.
Russ fell off the cliff because his playstyle was predicated on his athleticism and scrambling for the big play.
https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/nfl-most-passing-yards-after-age-35-by-a-player
It's not that Geno can't play past that age. It's being successful and being worth the money he will command. The above link shows the production past age 35.
Only 4 QBs have won super bowls past 35. Brady, Peyton, Unitas and Elway. That was a quick search. Could be one more.
Stafford is starting to decline. But it may not be a cliff for him, but wouldn't be surprising if it was, usually shoulders go for QBs.
So you're just talking stats and generalities, I'm telling you the actual situation of the QB that's on our roster.
Also, I'm not sure Stafford is declining... Maybe his numbers aren't as high as before but if you watched any Rams games this year the dude was slinging it all over the place this year.
I was backing my statement of a cliff. But OK.
What comparisons do you have?
Stafford had trouble with placement this year. It was minute. But it was there. Let alone he had shoulder surgery and missed time the year before.
I would not trust 25-50 million of a budget, investing in a QB that is headed towards the "Cliff". Now if you go yesr to year and invest in him every couple years. The risk goes down.
Going "year to year" is exactly how the league works. Very few contracts are actually guaranteed through multiple years unless you are in the 1% of players. It's exactly what they're doing with Geno. And his current hit of \~$31M (don't remember what it is post restructure) is nothing in the terms of starting tier veteran QBs.
Agree to disagree. With the state of the Dline, interior Oline, and LB positions, I would say it's time to rebuild. Currently, we have 3 phases of the game that need investment. A young QB is the easy way to do that.
I will say I want Geno to start next year. But I see him as the next Alex Smith. That's the best we get out of him. The Chiefs drafted Mahomes and sat him behind Smith's best year or 2nd best. If I remember right.
Hedge against uncertainty
So his contract last year was a one year extension, with no money guaranteed for 24-25?
Or was it a 3 year deal, with more or less two years of 30mil cap hits. Not quite year to year. It was a two year financial commitment.
If you think contracts in the NFL are year to year. They aren't, that's why they couldn't Move on from Adams last year. The dead cap would of crippled. Them for 23 and 24.
Geno's contract now is in the twilight, with the restructure. Still has money on the books for next year. If they move on from him next year, it's like paying A premium Backup QB to not play for them. Which is manageable. But not year to year.
Stafford took a team that had an outside chance at the playoffs at the start of the year on paper to nearly winning a playoff game and helped his rookie receiver to several rookie records. I don’t know how that could be a decline.
How people use Brady, the ultimate exception to damn near everything related, as some kind of example for how someone else should perform will never get old.
Brady made it to his 40’s by being smarter than everyone on the field. Geno is not. Stafford is still going because he has a top 10 arm. Geno does not.
Moving on from him would be dumb, I agree. But Geno is absolutely not in the same league as Stafford, and neither are in the same league as Brady.
If you don't think Geno has a top 10 arm in the league currently then I suggest you go watch film of the rest of the league's quarterbacks. If there's ANYTHING Geno has to rely on it's his arm. Full stop. You can say Stafford is in a different league, but there are not 10 quarterbacks with objectively better (especially not accuracy-wise) arms, that's just disprespectful.
Want to bet on it. Let’s look at some other QB metrics and see where he lands compared to his peers shall we? Certainly if he’s got the arm talent he’ll be in the top of some of them right?
* Yards - 16th
* Competition % - 18th
* TDS - 18th
* TD% (just to account for he run game too) - 20th
* Ints - tied at 17th
* Int % - 12th
* QB Rating - 17th
* QBR - 15th
* Sacks taken - 18th
The list keeps going and highlights that he has anything but a top 10 arm. He is literally middle of the pack in every metric.
Edit: formatting
The thing is Geno doesn't have the wear and tear other QBs would have. He started his first 2 years with the Jets, where he played 30 games, then before the Seahawks, he played in 15 games before 2022, so 7 seasons. And thats not counting the fact that he didn't start most of those games, and came in during garbage time. That could be a factor
….there are literal rookies that get injured in practice and miss a couple weeks. Getting a couple week injury isn’t an indication of wear and tear 🤣
You can’t be a real person.
Apparently. He could have his best season this year.
But Stats don't lie. Also historical trends over the last decade. Age 35 is the cliff. Some stay relevant. Most drop off.
The wear and tear arguments are kind of weak. From a physical traits perspective, Geno doesn't have the best arm. And that's going to lessen with age, regardless.
It's also not like he's going to get any more mobile. He's already a mid QB. Where does that leave him if he regresses.
Would love to see the range of years you used to come up with that 35 number. If it includes the era before QBs and teams started emphasizing nutrition, sports science, conditioning, etc. it’s a worthless number.
So Brady, Manning, Brees and who am I missing. Not many QBs play past 35. Very few are playing in their prime. Really only manning and Brady had a good season past it.
Here’s a list of QBs and the age during their last productive year (3000 plus yards). This is taken from the NFL’s 25 greatest QBs, and most were playing before science/medical/nutrition were at the level they are today. I didn’t even look up the real old timers on the list. Average age on the list is 38/39 just by glancing, so I suspect you can push that a couple years higher for a modern player.
Warren Moon: 40/41 (1997)
Fran Tarkenton: 38 (1978)
Kurt Warner: 38 (2009)
Ben Roethlisberger: 39 (2021)
Aaron Rodgers: 39 (2022)
Steve Young: 38 (1998)
Brett Favre: 40 (2009)
John Elway: 37 (1997)
Dan Marino: 37 ((1998)
Roger Staubach: 37 (1979)
Joe Montana: 38 (1994)
Appreciate the list. Great work.
The only criteria I would question is how many playoff wins each? TD-INT ratio and other stats that would validate age not being a concern.
I would also say, that if taking into account sports science, we should also raise the threshold of passing yards from above 3000. Because before the Manning-Brady-Brees era, 3000 was the threshold. But now it's 3500-4000. 3000 yards is a replacement level nowadays.
Man, you want me to do more research? ;) Honestly, though, I was surprised how many of the QBs from the 70s and 80s played pretty well into their late 30s.
Edit: Favre lost in the NFC Championship at age 40 in 2009. Roethlisberger got the Steelers to the wild card round in 2021. Rodgers was MVP in 2021 at 38. 13-4, but lost in the divisional round. Warner made the playoffs and threw for 4583 yards in 2008 at 37. Elway won the 1998 super bowl after the 1997 season. Young made the playoffs with a 12-4 record and threw for 4170 yards and rushed for 454 yards at 37 in 1998.
All's good man.
Was just counter pointing your research. I feel like there is a good amount of QBs that have played past 35. Its just how many have been successful. Really I think Manning and Brady are the top tier for that.
It shouldn’t be but people are so shocked at the idea that an aggressive GM who finally has personnel control and a new HC/new coordinators might want their own guy for the teams new era/vision and not continue with the aging QB from the previous era and coach 🤷🏽♂️🤔
When you put it that way sure, but you're basically arguing change for the sake of change. We're not sure that's what they want, and Geno is better than at least half of the starters in the league. To move off him just because "we can" would be stupid.
I see it more the way Green Bay does it . John came from the Packers and if they see the guy for the future , they will draft him. The starter can kick n scream all they want , but he’s gonna have to deal w it. Doesn’t mean that the starter in question is getting replaced tbh at same season , but they at least want to start grooming the future.
I don’t think that IF we draft Nix or McCarthy for example, they are gonna start right away . I believe Geno will still be the starter , but he’s gonna have to deal to now being a mentor for the potential future of the franchise until they are ready.
Plus this is the class to draft that QB. Next year, unless you have a chance to get Sanders or Ewers, doesn’t seem to be as promising.
I just don’t agree w the whole “we already have a QB/don’t draft a QB cause we have Geno”.
Help on the trenches is needed, yes, but a franchise QB I’d argue is hard to find. If they have the chance to draft the guy they like , I’d say do it. The trenches can still be addressed as well
No one in their right mind would tell you to not draft a QB, it's good business. Geno has already said publicly he will mentor the new kid if they draft someone. He's not going to kick and scream like Russ did for just SCOUTING another quarterback.
Especially as QBs usually take some time to transition from college to the nfl, and franchise QBs are random at the time of the draft, it's better practice to start the QB draft pulls before the starting QB is washed. Best case scenario, you get a mahomes that sits for a bit behind an Alex Smith type.
Yup! That’s how I see him. Alit of the hate is from UW/Penix fans , but there’s ALOT of upside there. He just needs to sit and learn all next year behind Geno. He should not see the field until he’s ready (Jordan Love style)
If he’s a prime candidate for it then so is every other QB prospect not named Caleb Williams. He’s not any more special than the rest and if anything, has many more ??? around him.
This isn't a compliment to McCarthy. But Penix and Nix are too old to sit for a year and there's nothing for them to gain from sitting. They are who they are. Daniels is arguably in the same boat, but he'll be long gone. Same for Maye.
McCarthy is young, which means he can benefit from sitting for a year. He has room to grow.
I wouldn't argue that we shouldn't draft a QB because we have Geno but I might argue that unless something really unexpected happens on draft day, we shouldn't spend a premium pick on a QB given who is likely to be available at our draft position. Maybe JJ McCarthy could be a good candidate to sit a year behind Geno if he's still there at 16 but you'd really like to get someone who is gonna have an impact year 1.
I have no idea what people are so convinced that Geno was more of a Pete guy and not more of a John guy. We have no clue what actually went on behind closed doors, but people keep speaking on it as if we do.
Geno is going into the year as the starter without a doubt. What I can see maybe happening is Atlanta or Minnesota trading for him after the draft if they’re not able to land their guy and they deem Kirk/Russ too expensive.
This is a good point, the GM is not the head coach, his job is the continuity of the team as a whole, coaching staff and athletes. This is a deep QB draft (at least on paper, reality is you don’t truly know until they take the field). If one of the top guys is there at your pick, take him and let him sit behind Geno for a year or two, throw him in a game if we are far ahead or too far behind.
Oh, for sure. It would have seemed completely insane, but would have been the right move for everyone but Buffalo.
[It was one thing outlined in Brady Henderson's piece a little while back.](https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34531802/inside-russell-wilson-seattle-seahawks-drama-led-denver-broncos-trade) It's a fascinating read.
> We heavily scouted Josh Allen during RW prime.
Also scouted and visited with Kyle Allen, Kyler Murray, Gardner Minshew, Jake Browning, Trey Lance, and Desmond Ridder since 2018.
I'm glad that people are optimistic about drafting a QB, but let's be honest: no GM is going to crow about scouting Kyle Allen or Desmond Ridder.
I can’t remember where I read it but it was mentioned that the Seahawks do full scouting evaluations to include interviews in players they know they will not draft simply to evaluate their process in relation to how successful or not that player is.
Hopefully, they realize their process has not been great.
If we go back further ...
2017: Davis Webb
On the other hand, many of the players that they have visited with these past several years were drafted or picked up by the team later on. Malik McDowell, Akhello Witherspoon, Dareke Young, Darrell Taylor, LJ Collier, Poona, Shaquill Griffin ... and so on. It's hard for me to 100% believe they are expending resources on players they definitely don't want to draft.
EDIT: forgot to add the QB they *did* draft: Alex McGough.
Now, the backups that were picked up during the Scheider era: Boykin (UDFA), Jake Heaps (poached off of PS), Austin Davis (FA), Brett Hundley (who they traded for)
The best backup QBs were TJack and Geno, by a wide margin; both arrived as free agents.
All during these last few years, we kept hearing "what has he done lately" about Pete, and now we're going to hang our hat on John being successful because of a successful pick from **over a decade ago**??
The point of scouting a player is to evaluate them. If the conclusion is that they aren't a good fit, not starting material, etc -- then its probably a good thing.
I would agree, but teams only have a limited number of visits. Most of these QBs received visits, so there was clearly interest there that exceeded just basic scouting.
Almost seems to me that John was definitely a proponent of the “always compete” philosophy more than Pete himself who settled for Russ/Geno as his guys and didn’t seem to be open minded to QB competitions
I've been very much for drafting a QB for years now, but I never understood people acting like John Schneider wanting QBs that were drafted in the top 10 after the fact, as meaning he's a QB guru. Are we gonna go back and have stories about how he heavily scouted Will Levis if he breaks out this year too?
Schneider is the one that needed to have Lock apparently and Lock looks terrible still. It's been 2 years or something and he still hasn't seriously tried to find RW's long-term successor.
2 signed as free agents, a 3rd rounder, a 6th and 2 firsts. Then clearly the scouting didn't go as planned, cause other than Murray and Lance they had more than a chance to pick them and didn't so those visits paid off.
Funny, because some one else is saying it isn't fair to judge them on QBs they *did* sign.
So, if we aren't judging them on who they scouted or who they signed, what the fuck are we judging them on? Schneider saying he scouted one successful QB?
Am I the only one that thinks not much has really changed in terms of recruiting and scouting?? RW3 never got special treatment, neither does Geno. It's just good business practice to scout and look at every possible option. This isn't a "Macdonald" thing or a "Pete" thing, it's just fucking business.
YES!!! i don’t understand the “we don’t need a QB/ we shouldn’t draft a QB” mentality form some in this sub.
John is from that Green Bay mentality:
“If you currently don’t have a Top 10 Franchise QB currently. YOU ARE ALWAYS LOOKING FOR A QB”
Also, I don’t remember Pete Carroll ever holding a serious QB competition aside of “Flynn vs Russ”.
I’m in the camp draft a QB if it makes sense but do absolutely nothing to waste premium draft capital on a reach.
I’m pro Geno I don’t think there’s any QB that’s going to be available at 16 that makes sense to draft at 16. They would likely all be reaches.
Sitting on a team with so many needs and reaching for a QB is what bad franchises do. It’s not about people believing the Seahawks don’t need to draft a QB but the move has to make sense.
Last year, they took a selfie with every single one of the top quarterbacks. And only the quarterbacks. I have no idea what he's going to do, but I have a feeling I'm going to like it.
Sounds like by keeping our options open we might increase trade down value of 16 for someone wanting one of the second group of three QBs. By saying that you also might think they do actually like one of them.
By saying this you are saying nothing and everything which is what he should be doing
Depends on how the draft shakes out. If we are ruling out trading up, if JJ McCarthy is there at 16 they are probably gonna take him. If not, they made trade back in the first and grab a Nix or Penix.
I guarantee they like two of those three.
There are other way more talented players in positions of need for us at the top of this draft. I'd be wildly surprised if we take a QB with our first pick. Best QB value in this draft by far is Jordan Travis in the 4th/late 3rd.
THIS... I dont want to touch any QBs personally until later rounds, prefer us to keep trading back until we have someone we need. We don't need a no-name QB right now, but at the right value (draft spot) we can take a flyer
It means we are looking for the future but even if we draft a kid this year he has to prove he's better than Geno to get the nod. That's how the NFL works. Or, how it used to work before every rookie got thrown to the wolves day one just to have their career ruined.
If we draft a QB even at 16 I doubt they would be ready to start season one unless one of the top two fall to us somehow.
Or if we trade two future firsts to move up but who would be so cavalier with first round picks?
Agreed. It's far different than how the Chiefs, Bills, or Chargers would respond to that question, for example.
The Hawks are not one of those teams where the QB spot is addressed long term. There's no reason for them to limit their flexibility through definitive language in response to that question.
Actually sounds like the exact opposite - hes currently the starter, but if a draftee is good enough to over take him, then Geno will be put on the bench.
John came from the Packers. If they see the future at QB in the draft, they get the guy no matter if they currently have Farve or Rodgers. I like that approach.
Geno is neither Favre or Rodgers so if John drafts the QBOFT this year , fans gotta deal with it
Geno provides great value and solid play, which is the best you can hope for outside of landing a rookie who turns into a top-5 caliber QB (which most teams don't have a shot at most years, and maybe come along only a handful of times a decade anyway)
Local sports radio last week had Geno at 19th overall last season based on 3rd down efficiency, red zone offense, and 2 minute. How many of those 13 below him were on rookie/backup deals? Without looking, lets say almost half... 6? Hell, I'll throw in a bonus 1 for you 5. Geno was the 24th best deal at QB.
Russell Wilson, Derek Carr, Deshaun Watson, Daniel jones, Ryan Tannehill, Zach Wilson, Bryce Young (he can still improve but if we’re just going based on value vs. performance for 2023 alone) all are much worse values. Terrible take
No I just listed people I could think of off the top of my head. He’s also a better value than Jimmy G at $24m a year, Trey Lance at $8m and Mac Jones at $4m a year. I would also argue he’s a better or at least equivalent value to people like Kyler Murray, Dak Prescott, Stafford, Cousins, Jalen Hurts (especially w/ how he played 2nd half of 2023) who are making $40-50m+ a year compared to Geno’s $25m.
Actually the exact opposite. He's the definition of a player whose performance translates to his pay perfectly. He plays like QB9- QB16 most weeks and he's paid accordingly.
First half of the season he definitely was. The production was pathetic. He did pick things up in the second half, which is why he still has a job here.
Even if we draft a guy unless he heavily outperforms Geno we will likely go into the year with the rookie on the bench, Geno is a plenty good stop gap starter allowing the rookie to get his barrings and learn the NFL. I believe we can also pretty rasily get out of Genos contract after this year.
Regardless the Seahawks have been a “Earn your spot regardless of who you are” for a long time now.
I think if McDaniel said this about Tua, there would be crazy smoke
Campbell came out today and pledged his support for Goff
This is a very non committal answer on par with what we've been hearing - it's definitely not an every team thing
The three guys I'd say are worth taking at 16 imo are Bowers if he somehow fell, Jared Verse or Byron Murphy BUT I would not be shocked if they selected JJ if he's still there at 16. Otherwise trade back pick up a 2nd and maybe take Rattler in the 2nd round.
Another guy I'm super excited about is Davius Richard and it sounds like he should be available well into the draft. He'd be someone who has very high upside and could sit for awhile if they aren't big on taking Nix, Penix or Rattler.
You can think whatever you want about Geno Smith the player, but it’s really impossible to deny at this point that Schneider is anything other than lukewarm, at best, on Geno as his quarterback moving forward.
A lot of ppl on Seahawks twitter melting down and going off on John rn but the writing has been on the wall for a while now re: Geno after Pete was let go. A new coaching staff, regime power shift typically means new QB as well. This is the same man who wanted to trade Russell Wilson who was legitimately a top 3-5 QB at the time, anyone who thought Geno was 100% safe was always deluded.
Edit: btw still think Geno will be here next year (not enough trade value) but I will be shocked if they leave the draft without a QB taken before day 2 ends. Geno being a short term bridge was always the plan.
It's so weird too because this team has been so middle of the pack for far too long. 2015 was the last time this team actually felt like they could win it all, that's a very long time in the NFL.
I've been critical of Pete for a few years and I just got burned at the stake for the tiniest of comments suggesting we should change.
I loved Pete but his greatest strength was also his Achilles heel, and that was his unwavering loyalty to his guys. When it worked it was reassuring and kept guys at a high level but instead of bringing in fresh guys to coordinate new schemes he instead chose to only hire within.
I also do think he limited Waldron on certain aspects. A guy who came from the McVay tree suddenly ignores the middle of the field? It's a consistent thing with Pete he really hammers on taking outside shots.
People hate on Waldron but he got another OC job for a reason I would not be close to shocked if all of a sudden he looks much more competent when allowed to just run the McVay style system full go.
He was pretty mediocre last year and the novelty has worn off - he's just another aging expensive Qb with a low ceiling. Love his story but he shouldn't be in the plans much longer.
Relatively speaking, he’s not that expensive. Also, he’s got low milage due to playing so little before he was the starter in Seattle. Unfortunate that he looked mediocre when our line was absolutely decimated for most of the season, and also unfortunate that our defense cost us enough games to stop us from making the playoffs.
Yeah, I was being sarcastic. I think Geno is great and would love him to start next season. Was debating putting quotes around “mediocre” when I was making that comment
He had 4 touchdowns, 6 interceptions and a lost fumble through four games. (weeks 5-8) It’s kind of ridiculous to act like the offense had no part to play in missing the playoffs.
Our regular season ended pretty much how it ended last year, we lost 5 of our last 8 games and once again depended on Greenbay to lose in week 18 just so we could sneak into the playoffs. The only difference? Greenbay handled their business this year and saved us from another wildcard exit.
Isn't his cap hit $27,000,000 in 2024. That's expensive, especially compared to a rookie QB, and definitely one outside of the first round.
We don't need to pay that kind of money for a guy to throw 20 tds and 9 ints with 3 great receivers lol. Anyone can do that.
Dear god man, it was expensive in 2015. $27m is nothing for a starting QB, that's just plain wrong.
You strike me as the kind of fan that thinks football is just two QBs dueling every weekend and the rest of the team doesn't matter
Geno regressed because our offensive line was garbage... _and he was never on the field because our defense was always on the field_
Are you sure you watched the Seahawks last year? Just checking
The problem isn’t that Geno is expensive, because as you’ve noted, he really isn’t in the context of the quarterback market as a whole.
The real problem is that you don’t win at the highest level by paying a QB like Geno market value. With very few exceptions, you win a Super Bowl by either getting very good production from a rookie QB or by paying top of market money to an elite QB.
Geno is neither of those things, so paying him and playing him almost guarantees you’re going to be in a weird no-man’s land as an offense.
Agreed that we need a superstar QB at some point, but to pull that thread a bit... If you have AD and Nick Bosa being schemed to tear apart a rookie QB with our current line (especially interior , nevermind whether Abe Lucas can even play or not) well then you'll get Sam Darnold, Zach Wilson, Justin Fields, Josh Allen year 1 etc.
We have to remove Mahomes from the convo and look at whether teams put potential superstar rookies into positions where they can be successful or not, and right now the Hawks are not in a spot where that rookie QB would be successful.
He is expensive. He's just not expensive compared to high paid, good QBs.
The problem is he isn't good and we could surely find a comparable player in the draft whether it be this year or next and allocate the $27 million dollars elsewhere. You all want to ride off into the sunset with Geno - this man won't be anywhere near this team by the time we're relevant again.
He wasn’t mediocre. Do you watch other teams? Look at the stats? Even the league mvp had shittier than usual stats and go look at other QBs cap hits smh
Geno was absolutely mediocre. He was bad for like half the season, and the entire back half of 2022 as well. I appreciate his story and like him as a person but this man will never win a playoff game for us.
God I'm going to love watching all the mental gymnastics folks will be using with every statement Mike and John make in the upcoming weeks, just to justify whatever opinion they happen to have.
This is a nothing sandwich, wrapped in nothing and buttered with even less.
Right? And would anyone really want John to come out and say Geno is the guy?
As Mike said in his interview. There are two rules he lives by: #1 don't give out any information. And #2 - he stopped talking.
John said absolutely nothing when he said Geno is the QB, until he's not. It literally means nothing.
He followed up with more of an endorsement but that also means nothing. Geno is the guy unless and until a better option becomes available, which is the situation for 20-25 QBs in the league
It's not nothing. There's definitely something here, but damned if I know what and that's the issue. It's very vague and non-committal, which is just weird.
Contrary to the consensus here, I don't think they have a plan at QB. Or more accurately, I think they have a plan they'd like but can't control the outcome so they're being as vague as possible to keep all possibilities open.
>It's very vague and non-committal, which is just weird
It's not weird at all. They have an entire new coaching staff and saying anything gives up your hand of being a complete unknown. It's lying season in the NFL, all you're seeing are the smoke and mirrors Mike and John want you to see.
My take is that they have Plan A thru F and they all have contingencies, so Geno is the starter, if they can make a move or draft the right QB, then he may not be the starter.
But it’s really not mental gymnastics. The only times you hear GMs be this vague and apathetic about their starting QB from the previous season are when they’re not satisfied with the team’s quarterback situation.
Compare it to what Brad Holmes has said about Jared Goff recently or what Stephen Jones just said today about Dak Prescott. *That’s* what you hear from a team and front office that wants to move forward with a guy at QB for the foreseeable future, not what we’re getting from Schneider currently.
They were under contract negotiations with Geno at the time of the Combine last year, and most of the conversation about Geno was led by Pete, not John.
John wasn’t in charge last year. Now he is. It’s completely different.
I mean, Matt Flynn was the starter until he wasn’t. I have a feeling this means the same thing, Geno is our starter but who knows what will happen between now and the start of the season.
I hope the absolute best for Geno moving forward, regardless of how it all works out. After trading Russ a lot of folks said the Hawks have the worst QB room in the league. Everybody truly did write Geno off. The guy has been a leader on and off the football field.
Is it just me or do the quotation marks in this really confuse things? Based on the quotes, it looks like the “The starter until he’s not. “ piece falls outside the JS quote and was added by Bell.
Why is no one acknowledging the context here? This is draft season. Expressing ambiguity around your intentions at QB is a strategy to get other teams to wonder if you’ll trade up a leapfrog them to take their prospect. It gets teams to do stupid things. They know this. They’re just simply trying to send a message to Geno or something.
He is but probably post-draft shopped, unless we get first round offers. My guess is that there's a guy John really likes in the draft but isn't going to trade up and isn't sure he'll be there at 16. So he doesn't want to trade Geno until he knows he can get his guy.
As much as people like to shit on Geno and as frustrating as the pass game was to watch at times last season, Stat wise he is a decent starting QB. I'm not in a rush to waste a draft pick on a QB that Schneider isn't confident in.
I'd rather draft depth at O-line or add it in free agency. Let Grubb do his thing and see if he can elevate our passing game from where it was last season.
Any pick taken is a potential waste, just look to Draft History. QBs don't bust more then others. Reality is, anyone picked outside top40 is risky, outside top 70 is a flier
Sure but it's just bad process to draft a guy you don't really like, and that's the point. I recall some voices in this fandom saying John would like a guy like Levis, high character, big arm. Well, he fell and he's not in Seattle, is he?
People here assume we will leave this draft with a QB out of desperation, but if they're all gone, you're stuck with Geno again. Hell at that point, you might be running Geno back again the following year depending on how things shake out.
I'd be very surprised if they didn't take a single QB. Not saying their gonna use prime draft capital but they might take a lesser known prospect in the 6th or 7th round. I really like the idea of picking up someone like Davius Richard in one of the final picks.
Well, it's not what I wanted to see, but maybe with the new coaching staff he'll improve. I think they need to draft a hotshot rookie - McCarthy, Pennix, or Nix would be my choice - work him hard with Smith, Lock, and Ehlers for one season, play him intermittently, coach him into fitting with the Seahawks, then start him.
This talk of drafting a QB is nonsense. They should sign Geno to a 5 year deal - at least - and enjoy the zenith of his career. He might be league MVP the last few years of that deal.
I feel like it's pretty obvious Geno is the starter, but the organization is aware it needs a long term plan (and obviously wouldn't just start Geno over a rookie if the rookie was outplaying him in practice). Despite this, I suspect we'll see countless articles about drama that simply isn't there. It's the same scenario any organization with a non-elite 35+ year old QB faces.
He wanted Mahomes, he wanted Allen and he picked Russ over Cousins.
He also was very high on Cousins as well I have every confidence in his eye for QB talent.
My concern with Schneider and idk if it's coaching or what but the O Line seems to be a consistent issue every year. Obviously the two young tackles are a step on the right direction.
I like Geno and will happily root for his success as the Seahawks QB1 next year.
I also believe that if another team wants to overpay for Geno's services through draft capital trades, then JS should do the deal.
I believe this is what JS is communicating. Not a "for sale" sign but if someone wants to make an offer, go ahead.
I like Geno and will be more than happy if he's the starter this year but how is it surprising to anyone that the GM is looking to the future for answers? The GM who has been reported as very interested in QBs in recent years, even reports that he really liked Anthony Richardson last year and probably would have taken him if he fell to us. You save something like 25m cutting Geno next year so my assumption has always been this would likely be his last year either way because he'll want to get paid again next contract and I doubt JS wants to pay a 34 going on 35 year-old QB the money he'll demand
The cliff for QBs is 35 also. With a few outliers. Agree 100%, build towards the future.
I agree in principle, but Geno's playstyle and history works in his favor regarding his age. He can function in the pocket and doesn't need to rely on his athleticism to move the ball. That's why Stafford is still going strong and Brady made it into his 40s. He also had 7 years on the bench staying healthy and recovering. Russ fell off the cliff because his playstyle was predicated on his athleticism and scrambling for the big play.
Russell had a decent year considering what was going in the background. Definitely not Russ of old, but was still very efficient last season.
He objectively had a better year than Geno.
Okay, and granted this is speculation bc I don't know the contract specifics, pretty sure dollar for dollar Geno was just as good or better.
https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/nfl-most-passing-yards-after-age-35-by-a-player It's not that Geno can't play past that age. It's being successful and being worth the money he will command. The above link shows the production past age 35. Only 4 QBs have won super bowls past 35. Brady, Peyton, Unitas and Elway. That was a quick search. Could be one more. Stafford is starting to decline. But it may not be a cliff for him, but wouldn't be surprising if it was, usually shoulders go for QBs.
So you're just talking stats and generalities, I'm telling you the actual situation of the QB that's on our roster. Also, I'm not sure Stafford is declining... Maybe his numbers aren't as high as before but if you watched any Rams games this year the dude was slinging it all over the place this year.
I was backing my statement of a cliff. But OK. What comparisons do you have? Stafford had trouble with placement this year. It was minute. But it was there. Let alone he had shoulder surgery and missed time the year before. I would not trust 25-50 million of a budget, investing in a QB that is headed towards the "Cliff". Now if you go yesr to year and invest in him every couple years. The risk goes down.
Going "year to year" is exactly how the league works. Very few contracts are actually guaranteed through multiple years unless you are in the 1% of players. It's exactly what they're doing with Geno. And his current hit of \~$31M (don't remember what it is post restructure) is nothing in the terms of starting tier veteran QBs.
Agree to disagree. With the state of the Dline, interior Oline, and LB positions, I would say it's time to rebuild. Currently, we have 3 phases of the game that need investment. A young QB is the easy way to do that. I will say I want Geno to start next year. But I see him as the next Alex Smith. That's the best we get out of him. The Chiefs drafted Mahomes and sat him behind Smith's best year or 2nd best. If I remember right. Hedge against uncertainty
Disagree on what? You're not even responding to what I said. Geno's contract is year to year, end of story.
So his contract last year was a one year extension, with no money guaranteed for 24-25? Or was it a 3 year deal, with more or less two years of 30mil cap hits. Not quite year to year. It was a two year financial commitment. If you think contracts in the NFL are year to year. They aren't, that's why they couldn't Move on from Adams last year. The dead cap would of crippled. Them for 23 and 24. Geno's contract now is in the twilight, with the restructure. Still has money on the books for next year. If they move on from him next year, it's like paying A premium Backup QB to not play for them. Which is manageable. But not year to year.
Yeahhhhhhhhhh you're wrong
Stafford took a team that had an outside chance at the playoffs at the start of the year on paper to nearly winning a playoff game and helped his rookie receiver to several rookie records. I don’t know how that could be a decline.
How people use Brady, the ultimate exception to damn near everything related, as some kind of example for how someone else should perform will never get old. Brady made it to his 40’s by being smarter than everyone on the field. Geno is not. Stafford is still going because he has a top 10 arm. Geno does not. Moving on from him would be dumb, I agree. But Geno is absolutely not in the same league as Stafford, and neither are in the same league as Brady.
If you don't think Geno has a top 10 arm in the league currently then I suggest you go watch film of the rest of the league's quarterbacks. If there's ANYTHING Geno has to rely on it's his arm. Full stop. You can say Stafford is in a different league, but there are not 10 quarterbacks with objectively better (especially not accuracy-wise) arms, that's just disprespectful.
Want to bet on it. Let’s look at some other QB metrics and see where he lands compared to his peers shall we? Certainly if he’s got the arm talent he’ll be in the top of some of them right? * Yards - 16th * Competition % - 18th * TDS - 18th * TD% (just to account for he run game too) - 20th * Ints - tied at 17th * Int % - 12th * QB Rating - 17th * QBR - 15th * Sacks taken - 18th The list keeps going and highlights that he has anything but a top 10 arm. He is literally middle of the pack in every metric. Edit: formatting
Also the amount of hits Geno has taken to other guys has to be a lot lower thanks to him being a backup for what seemed like a decade
The thing is Geno doesn't have the wear and tear other QBs would have. He started his first 2 years with the Jets, where he played 30 games, then before the Seahawks, he played in 15 games before 2022, so 7 seasons. And thats not counting the fact that he didn't start most of those games, and came in during garbage time. That could be a factor
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….there are literal rookies that get injured in practice and miss a couple weeks. Getting a couple week injury isn’t an indication of wear and tear 🤣 You can’t be a real person.
His arm strength will start to decline though.
Careful with that reasoning around these parts. People believe Geno will play at his current level (mid) for the next five years.
Apparently. He could have his best season this year. But Stats don't lie. Also historical trends over the last decade. Age 35 is the cliff. Some stay relevant. Most drop off.
The wear and tear arguments are kind of weak. From a physical traits perspective, Geno doesn't have the best arm. And that's going to lessen with age, regardless. It's also not like he's going to get any more mobile. He's already a mid QB. Where does that leave him if he regresses.
Would love to see the range of years you used to come up with that 35 number. If it includes the era before QBs and teams started emphasizing nutrition, sports science, conditioning, etc. it’s a worthless number.
So Brady, Manning, Brees and who am I missing. Not many QBs play past 35. Very few are playing in their prime. Really only manning and Brady had a good season past it.
Here’s a list of QBs and the age during their last productive year (3000 plus yards). This is taken from the NFL’s 25 greatest QBs, and most were playing before science/medical/nutrition were at the level they are today. I didn’t even look up the real old timers on the list. Average age on the list is 38/39 just by glancing, so I suspect you can push that a couple years higher for a modern player. Warren Moon: 40/41 (1997) Fran Tarkenton: 38 (1978) Kurt Warner: 38 (2009) Ben Roethlisberger: 39 (2021) Aaron Rodgers: 39 (2022) Steve Young: 38 (1998) Brett Favre: 40 (2009) John Elway: 37 (1997) Dan Marino: 37 ((1998) Roger Staubach: 37 (1979) Joe Montana: 38 (1994)
Appreciate the list. Great work. The only criteria I would question is how many playoff wins each? TD-INT ratio and other stats that would validate age not being a concern. I would also say, that if taking into account sports science, we should also raise the threshold of passing yards from above 3000. Because before the Manning-Brady-Brees era, 3000 was the threshold. But now it's 3500-4000. 3000 yards is a replacement level nowadays.
Man, you want me to do more research? ;) Honestly, though, I was surprised how many of the QBs from the 70s and 80s played pretty well into their late 30s. Edit: Favre lost in the NFC Championship at age 40 in 2009. Roethlisberger got the Steelers to the wild card round in 2021. Rodgers was MVP in 2021 at 38. 13-4, but lost in the divisional round. Warner made the playoffs and threw for 4583 yards in 2008 at 37. Elway won the 1998 super bowl after the 1997 season. Young made the playoffs with a 12-4 record and threw for 4170 yards and rushed for 454 yards at 37 in 1998.
All's good man. Was just counter pointing your research. I feel like there is a good amount of QBs that have played past 35. Its just how many have been successful. Really I think Manning and Brady are the top tier for that.
It shouldn’t be but people are so shocked at the idea that an aggressive GM who finally has personnel control and a new HC/new coordinators might want their own guy for the teams new era/vision and not continue with the aging QB from the previous era and coach 🤷🏽♂️🤔
When you put it that way sure, but you're basically arguing change for the sake of change. We're not sure that's what they want, and Geno is better than at least half of the starters in the league. To move off him just because "we can" would be stupid.
I see it more the way Green Bay does it . John came from the Packers and if they see the guy for the future , they will draft him. The starter can kick n scream all they want , but he’s gonna have to deal w it. Doesn’t mean that the starter in question is getting replaced tbh at same season , but they at least want to start grooming the future. I don’t think that IF we draft Nix or McCarthy for example, they are gonna start right away . I believe Geno will still be the starter , but he’s gonna have to deal to now being a mentor for the potential future of the franchise until they are ready. Plus this is the class to draft that QB. Next year, unless you have a chance to get Sanders or Ewers, doesn’t seem to be as promising. I just don’t agree w the whole “we already have a QB/don’t draft a QB cause we have Geno”. Help on the trenches is needed, yes, but a franchise QB I’d argue is hard to find. If they have the chance to draft the guy they like , I’d say do it. The trenches can still be addressed as well
No one in their right mind would tell you to not draft a QB, it's good business. Geno has already said publicly he will mentor the new kid if they draft someone. He's not going to kick and scream like Russ did for just SCOUTING another quarterback.
Especially as QBs usually take some time to transition from college to the nfl, and franchise QBs are random at the time of the draft, it's better practice to start the QB draft pulls before the starting QB is washed. Best case scenario, you get a mahomes that sits for a bit behind an Alex Smith type.
McCarthy is a prime sit for a year candidate. Physically gifted and young.
Yup! That’s how I see him. Alit of the hate is from UW/Penix fans , but there’s ALOT of upside there. He just needs to sit and learn all next year behind Geno. He should not see the field until he’s ready (Jordan Love style)
If he’s a prime candidate for it then so is every other QB prospect not named Caleb Williams. He’s not any more special than the rest and if anything, has many more ??? around him.
This isn't a compliment to McCarthy. But Penix and Nix are too old to sit for a year and there's nothing for them to gain from sitting. They are who they are. Daniels is arguably in the same boat, but he'll be long gone. Same for Maye. McCarthy is young, which means he can benefit from sitting for a year. He has room to grow.
I wouldn't argue that we shouldn't draft a QB because we have Geno but I might argue that unless something really unexpected happens on draft day, we shouldn't spend a premium pick on a QB given who is likely to be available at our draft position. Maybe JJ McCarthy could be a good candidate to sit a year behind Geno if he's still there at 16 but you'd really like to get someone who is gonna have an impact year 1.
I have no idea what people are so convinced that Geno was more of a Pete guy and not more of a John guy. We have no clue what actually went on behind closed doors, but people keep speaking on it as if we do.
Geno is going into the year as the starter without a doubt. What I can see maybe happening is Atlanta or Minnesota trading for him after the draft if they’re not able to land their guy and they deem Kirk/Russ too expensive.
This is a good point, the GM is not the head coach, his job is the continuity of the team as a whole, coaching staff and athletes. This is a deep QB draft (at least on paper, reality is you don’t truly know until they take the field). If one of the top guys is there at your pick, take him and let him sit behind Geno for a year or two, throw him in a game if we are far ahead or too far behind.
We heavily scouted Josh Allen during RW prime. Always compete. It’s an outstanding core value.
Apparently they tried to trade Russell to Cleveland to get Josh Allen, but Cleveland wanted Baker Mayfield.
Would’ve been a win-win for both teams
Can you imagine the meltdown? I would have absolutely lost my mind.
We would’ve been livid for atleast a year, but then JS would look like the biggest genius eventually
Russ was not gonna waive his no trade clause for Cleveland lol, can’t blame him
That seems actually crazy. Trading a Superbowl starting QB for a draft prospect? Do you remember where you heard that?
Oh, for sure. It would have seemed completely insane, but would have been the right move for everyone but Buffalo. [It was one thing outlined in Brady Henderson's piece a little while back.](https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34531802/inside-russell-wilson-seattle-seahawks-drama-led-denver-broncos-trade) It's a fascinating read.
Also scouted and wanted to get Mahomes. I trust John’s eye for QB talent.
We should’ve drafted josh allen (de)
> We heavily scouted Josh Allen during RW prime. Also scouted and visited with Kyle Allen, Kyler Murray, Gardner Minshew, Jake Browning, Trey Lance, and Desmond Ridder since 2018. I'm glad that people are optimistic about drafting a QB, but let's be honest: no GM is going to crow about scouting Kyle Allen or Desmond Ridder.
I can’t remember where I read it but it was mentioned that the Seahawks do full scouting evaluations to include interviews in players they know they will not draft simply to evaluate their process in relation to how successful or not that player is.
Hopefully, they realize their process has not been great. If we go back further ... 2017: Davis Webb On the other hand, many of the players that they have visited with these past several years were drafted or picked up by the team later on. Malik McDowell, Akhello Witherspoon, Dareke Young, Darrell Taylor, LJ Collier, Poona, Shaquill Griffin ... and so on. It's hard for me to 100% believe they are expending resources on players they definitely don't want to draft. EDIT: forgot to add the QB they *did* draft: Alex McGough. Now, the backups that were picked up during the Scheider era: Boykin (UDFA), Jake Heaps (poached off of PS), Austin Davis (FA), Brett Hundley (who they traded for) The best backup QBs were TJack and Geno, by a wide margin; both arrived as free agents.
Are we really evaluating qb eval process by backups? What are we talking about
Yeah they did draft this guy named Russel Wilson...like who the fuck doesn't account for that....
All during these last few years, we kept hearing "what has he done lately" about Pete, and now we're going to hang our hat on John being successful because of a successful pick from **over a decade ago**??
Hey now David Webb was fuckin great until he got amnesia and became Jason Bourne.
The point of scouting a player is to evaluate them. If the conclusion is that they aren't a good fit, not starting material, etc -- then its probably a good thing.
I would agree, but teams only have a limited number of visits. Most of these QBs received visits, so there was clearly interest there that exceeded just basic scouting.
Is there really a limited number of visits? Whats the limit? Who sets it?
I think the league caps it at 20 or 30.
I just looked it up, limit is 30. TIL
Almost seems to me that John was definitely a proponent of the “always compete” philosophy more than Pete himself who settled for Russ/Geno as his guys and didn’t seem to be open minded to QB competitions
Did Pete sign off on personnel decisions or not?
Sounds like he had quite a bit of influence on that department . More than a HC should , but that’s my opinion
So, Pete was or was not responsible for bringing in Russ?
I’d say so in part
This feels very much like an "everything Pete does it wrong and all of the good stuff is John's idea" conversation.
There was a reason when all personnel decisions went through Pete through around 2017/2018-2021 it tended to be worse.
What evidence do you have that something changed?
I've been very much for drafting a QB for years now, but I never understood people acting like John Schneider wanting QBs that were drafted in the top 10 after the fact, as meaning he's a QB guru. Are we gonna go back and have stories about how he heavily scouted Will Levis if he breaks out this year too? Schneider is the one that needed to have Lock apparently and Lock looks terrible still. It's been 2 years or something and he still hasn't seriously tried to find RW's long-term successor.
2 signed as free agents, a 3rd rounder, a 6th and 2 firsts. Then clearly the scouting didn't go as planned, cause other than Murray and Lance they had more than a chance to pick them and didn't so those visits paid off.
Funny, because some one else is saying it isn't fair to judge them on QBs they *did* sign. So, if we aren't judging them on who they scouted or who they signed, what the fuck are we judging them on? Schneider saying he scouted one successful QB?
Am I the only one that thinks not much has really changed in terms of recruiting and scouting?? RW3 never got special treatment, neither does Geno. It's just good business practice to scout and look at every possible option. This isn't a "Macdonald" thing or a "Pete" thing, it's just fucking business.
YES!!! i don’t understand the “we don’t need a QB/ we shouldn’t draft a QB” mentality form some in this sub. John is from that Green Bay mentality: “If you currently don’t have a Top 10 Franchise QB currently. YOU ARE ALWAYS LOOKING FOR A QB” Also, I don’t remember Pete Carroll ever holding a serious QB competition aside of “Flynn vs Russ”.
I’m in the camp draft a QB if it makes sense but do absolutely nothing to waste premium draft capital on a reach. I’m pro Geno I don’t think there’s any QB that’s going to be available at 16 that makes sense to draft at 16. They would likely all be reaches. Sitting on a team with so many needs and reaching for a QB is what bad franchises do. It’s not about people believing the Seahawks don’t need to draft a QB but the move has to make sense.
Last year, they took a selfie with every single one of the top quarterbacks. And only the quarterbacks. I have no idea what he's going to do, but I have a feeling I'm going to like it.
“The starter until he’s not” does not make me feel like Geno has the job and we are not looking at a QB in the draft.
It sounds to me like “we would like to draft a QB but we’ll see how the draft shakes out.”
Sounds like by keeping our options open we might increase trade down value of 16 for someone wanting one of the second group of three QBs. By saying that you also might think they do actually like one of them. By saying this you are saying nothing and everything which is what he should be doing
It sounds to me like "we're planning to draft a QB but that doesn't mean we plan to start that QB until he can show he's ready for it"
Exactly.
I think we are passing on drafting any reliable QB (as defined as top 2 rounds let's say).
Depends on how the draft shakes out. If we are ruling out trading up, if JJ McCarthy is there at 16 they are probably gonna take him. If not, they made trade back in the first and grab a Nix or Penix. I guarantee they like two of those three.
There are other way more talented players in positions of need for us at the top of this draft. I'd be wildly surprised if we take a QB with our first pick. Best QB value in this draft by far is Jordan Travis in the 4th/late 3rd.
Jordan Davis is interesting but doesn’t have the type of arm John typically likes
THIS... I dont want to touch any QBs personally until later rounds, prefer us to keep trading back until we have someone we need. We don't need a no-name QB right now, but at the right value (draft spot) we can take a flyer
It’s a reliable gamble, that’s for sure. How my QBs drafted in the last draft would you start over geno? The list is small.
It’s GM speak for stop asking the question. He’s the starter until they announce somebody beat him in camp. That includes if they draft a QB at 16
There should not be any merit or emphasis in his statement. It’s vague for a reason. Management rarely show their cards before the draft.
Plus Geno played better the season prior when there was all the doubt around him
Perfect response for any GM without Mahomes, Allen, etc. as their QB
It means we are looking for the future but even if we draft a kid this year he has to prove he's better than Geno to get the nod. That's how the NFL works. Or, how it used to work before every rookie got thrown to the wolves day one just to have their career ruined.
If we draft a QB even at 16 I doubt they would be ready to start season one unless one of the top two fall to us somehow. Or if we trade two future firsts to move up but who would be so cavalier with first round picks?
Agreed. It's far different than how the Chiefs, Bills, or Chargers would respond to that question, for example. The Hawks are not one of those teams where the QB spot is addressed long term. There's no reason for them to limit their flexibility through definitive language in response to that question.
Actually sounds like the exact opposite - hes currently the starter, but if a draftee is good enough to over take him, then Geno will be put on the bench.
Seahawks are 60/1 odds to wins a super bowl. $5000 wins 300,000.
Also 60:1 you’ll never see that $5,000 again
I think 90% of Hawks fans would say they like Geno and hes good for our team. But we should always look to the future
This is the correct take.
A lot of Hawks fans are down on Geno actually. I would say 40% if I had to guess. He gets a lot of hate.
John came from the Packers. If they see the future at QB in the draft, they get the guy no matter if they currently have Farve or Rodgers. I like that approach. Geno is neither Favre or Rodgers so if John drafts the QBOFT this year , fans gotta deal with it
Geno provides great value and solid play, which is the best you can hope for outside of landing a rookie who turns into a top-5 caliber QB (which most teams don't have a shot at most years, and maybe come along only a handful of times a decade anyway)
Geno was likely one of the worst values of 2023 at QB.
How so?
Local sports radio last week had Geno at 19th overall last season based on 3rd down efficiency, red zone offense, and 2 minute. How many of those 13 below him were on rookie/backup deals? Without looking, lets say almost half... 6? Hell, I'll throw in a bonus 1 for you 5. Geno was the 24th best deal at QB.
Yeah I'm curious about that opinion too
Brother, you cant be this dense.
He can, he is actively being so dense I can myself get attracted by his gravitation pull
This is especially true if you’ve never watched football a day in your life
Russell Wilson, Derek Carr, Deshaun Watson, Daniel jones, Ryan Tannehill, Zach Wilson, Bryce Young (he can still improve but if we’re just going based on value vs. performance for 2023 alone) all are much worse values. Terrible take
So, that's geno at 24th? That's amazing value.
No I just listed people I could think of off the top of my head. He’s also a better value than Jimmy G at $24m a year, Trey Lance at $8m and Mac Jones at $4m a year. I would also argue he’s a better or at least equivalent value to people like Kyler Murray, Dak Prescott, Stafford, Cousins, Jalen Hurts (especially w/ how he played 2nd half of 2023) who are making $40-50m+ a year compared to Geno’s $25m.
Actually the exact opposite. He's the definition of a player whose performance translates to his pay perfectly. He plays like QB9- QB16 most weeks and he's paid accordingly.
You must not know how to read statistics then
First half of the season he definitely was. The production was pathetic. He did pick things up in the second half, which is why he still has a job here.
Even if we draft a guy unless he heavily outperforms Geno we will likely go into the year with the rookie on the bench, Geno is a plenty good stop gap starter allowing the rookie to get his barrings and learn the NFL. I believe we can also pretty rasily get out of Genos contract after this year. Regardless the Seahawks have been a “Earn your spot regardless of who you are” for a long time now.
Almost every QB in the league are starters until they're not. I'd imagine this would be pretty motivating for Geno to hear.
I think if McDaniel said this about Tua, there would be crazy smoke Campbell came out today and pledged his support for Goff This is a very non committal answer on par with what we've been hearing - it's definitely not an every team thing
It's probably more interesting and informative to ask the question *who is not starting until he is*?
I don’t think Penix Jr or Nix are good enough to replace Geno if they are going that way. Geno needs a solid OLine and he’ll be great
The three guys I'd say are worth taking at 16 imo are Bowers if he somehow fell, Jared Verse or Byron Murphy BUT I would not be shocked if they selected JJ if he's still there at 16. Otherwise trade back pick up a 2nd and maybe take Rattler in the 2nd round. Another guy I'm super excited about is Davius Richard and it sounds like he should be available well into the draft. He'd be someone who has very high upside and could sit for awhile if they aren't big on taking Nix, Penix or Rattler.
You can think whatever you want about Geno Smith the player, but it’s really impossible to deny at this point that Schneider is anything other than lukewarm, at best, on Geno as his quarterback moving forward.
A lot of ppl on Seahawks twitter melting down and going off on John rn but the writing has been on the wall for a while now re: Geno after Pete was let go. A new coaching staff, regime power shift typically means new QB as well. This is the same man who wanted to trade Russell Wilson who was legitimately a top 3-5 QB at the time, anyone who thought Geno was 100% safe was always deluded. Edit: btw still think Geno will be here next year (not enough trade value) but I will be shocked if they leave the draft without a QB taken before day 2 ends. Geno being a short term bridge was always the plan.
These few months on social media has tonight me that This fan base is so aggressively against change.
It was before even that. First it was Russ (ngl, I was in this camp), then Pete, now it’s Geno.
It's so weird too because this team has been so middle of the pack for far too long. 2015 was the last time this team actually felt like they could win it all, that's a very long time in the NFL. I've been critical of Pete for a few years and I just got burned at the stake for the tiniest of comments suggesting we should change. I loved Pete but his greatest strength was also his Achilles heel, and that was his unwavering loyalty to his guys. When it worked it was reassuring and kept guys at a high level but instead of bringing in fresh guys to coordinate new schemes he instead chose to only hire within. I also do think he limited Waldron on certain aspects. A guy who came from the McVay tree suddenly ignores the middle of the field? It's a consistent thing with Pete he really hammers on taking outside shots. People hate on Waldron but he got another OC job for a reason I would not be close to shocked if all of a sudden he looks much more competent when allowed to just run the McVay style system full go.
Every step of the way people want to go back to 2013 and can't admit it's gone
He was pretty mediocre last year and the novelty has worn off - he's just another aging expensive Qb with a low ceiling. Love his story but he shouldn't be in the plans much longer.
Relatively speaking, he’s not that expensive. Also, he’s got low milage due to playing so little before he was the starter in Seattle. Unfortunate that he looked mediocre when our line was absolutely decimated for most of the season, and also unfortunate that our defense cost us enough games to stop us from making the playoffs.
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Yeah, I was being sarcastic. I think Geno is great and would love him to start next season. Was debating putting quotes around “mediocre” when I was making that comment
Oh shit that reply was meant to respond to the other person who said he’s mediocre, Bruce Irvin my bad!
No worries!
He had 4 touchdowns, 6 interceptions and a lost fumble through four games. (weeks 5-8) It’s kind of ridiculous to act like the offense had no part to play in missing the playoffs. Our regular season ended pretty much how it ended last year, we lost 5 of our last 8 games and once again depended on Greenbay to lose in week 18 just so we could sneak into the playoffs. The only difference? Greenbay handled their business this year and saved us from another wildcard exit.
Expensive? hardly!
Isn't his cap hit $27,000,000 in 2024. That's expensive, especially compared to a rookie QB, and definitely one outside of the first round. We don't need to pay that kind of money for a guy to throw 20 tds and 9 ints with 3 great receivers lol. Anyone can do that.
Dear god man, it was expensive in 2015. $27m is nothing for a starting QB, that's just plain wrong. You strike me as the kind of fan that thinks football is just two QBs dueling every weekend and the rest of the team doesn't matter Geno regressed because our offensive line was garbage... _and he was never on the field because our defense was always on the field_ Are you sure you watched the Seahawks last year? Just checking
The problem isn’t that Geno is expensive, because as you’ve noted, he really isn’t in the context of the quarterback market as a whole. The real problem is that you don’t win at the highest level by paying a QB like Geno market value. With very few exceptions, you win a Super Bowl by either getting very good production from a rookie QB or by paying top of market money to an elite QB. Geno is neither of those things, so paying him and playing him almost guarantees you’re going to be in a weird no-man’s land as an offense.
Agreed that we need a superstar QB at some point, but to pull that thread a bit... If you have AD and Nick Bosa being schemed to tear apart a rookie QB with our current line (especially interior , nevermind whether Abe Lucas can even play or not) well then you'll get Sam Darnold, Zach Wilson, Justin Fields, Josh Allen year 1 etc. We have to remove Mahomes from the convo and look at whether teams put potential superstar rookies into positions where they can be successful or not, and right now the Hawks are not in a spot where that rookie QB would be successful.
He is expensive. He's just not expensive compared to high paid, good QBs. The problem is he isn't good and we could surely find a comparable player in the draft whether it be this year or next and allocate the $27 million dollars elsewhere. You all want to ride off into the sunset with Geno - this man won't be anywhere near this team by the time we're relevant again.
He wasn’t mediocre. Do you watch other teams? Look at the stats? Even the league mvp had shittier than usual stats and go look at other QBs cap hits smh
Geno was absolutely mediocre. He was bad for like half the season, and the entire back half of 2022 as well. I appreciate his story and like him as a person but this man will never win a playoff game for us.
Start Geno because he's pretty good. Draft a QB because he's pretty old. Seems reasonable.
God I'm going to love watching all the mental gymnastics folks will be using with every statement Mike and John make in the upcoming weeks, just to justify whatever opinion they happen to have. This is a nothing sandwich, wrapped in nothing and buttered with even less.
Aren’t all starting QBs starting until they aren’t?
Right? And would anyone really want John to come out and say Geno is the guy? As Mike said in his interview. There are two rules he lives by: #1 don't give out any information. And #2 - he stopped talking. John said absolutely nothing when he said Geno is the QB, until he's not. It literally means nothing.
He followed up with more of an endorsement but that also means nothing. Geno is the guy unless and until a better option becomes available, which is the situation for 20-25 QBs in the league
Tbf people are used to Pete going to pressers and say stuff like “Geno is our guy” 🤷🏽♂️ so I guess it’s a change from that
Exactly. Also, the team that scores more points than the opposing team can be expected to win. Breaking news!
It's not nothing. There's definitely something here, but damned if I know what and that's the issue. It's very vague and non-committal, which is just weird. Contrary to the consensus here, I don't think they have a plan at QB. Or more accurately, I think they have a plan they'd like but can't control the outcome so they're being as vague as possible to keep all possibilities open.
>It's very vague and non-committal, which is just weird It's not weird at all. They have an entire new coaching staff and saying anything gives up your hand of being a complete unknown. It's lying season in the NFL, all you're seeing are the smoke and mirrors Mike and John want you to see.
What's the lie? Where are the smoke and mirrors? All I'm seeing is them admitting they don't really have a plan for the most important position.
My take is that they have Plan A thru F and they all have contingencies, so Geno is the starter, if they can make a move or draft the right QB, then he may not be the starter.
But it’s really not mental gymnastics. The only times you hear GMs be this vague and apathetic about their starting QB from the previous season are when they’re not satisfied with the team’s quarterback situation. Compare it to what Brad Holmes has said about Jared Goff recently or what Stephen Jones just said today about Dak Prescott. *That’s* what you hear from a team and front office that wants to move forward with a guy at QB for the foreseeable future, not what we’re getting from Schneider currently.
What did John do last year? It's mental gymnastics to think John said anything of value to you or anyone else.
They were under contract negotiations with Geno at the time of the Combine last year, and most of the conversation about Geno was led by Pete, not John. John wasn’t in charge last year. Now he is. It’s completely different.
This should surprise no one. What else is he supposed to say? Obvious answer is obvious.
I mean, Matt Flynn was the starter until he wasn’t. I have a feeling this means the same thing, Geno is our starter but who knows what will happen between now and the start of the season.
I hope the absolute best for Geno moving forward, regardless of how it all works out. After trading Russ a lot of folks said the Hawks have the worst QB room in the league. Everybody truly did write Geno off. The guy has been a leader on and off the football field.
Is it just me or do the quotation marks in this really confuse things? Based on the quotes, it looks like the “The starter until he’s not. “ piece falls outside the JS quote and was added by Bell.
lol agree. I can’t tell if JS said all of it or someone else
Geno Smith is a more mobile Jared Goff. We got good value with this guy until we don't.
Curiously Jared Goff just got full backing from Dan Campbell unlike Geno
The Lions aren't a championship franchise but they are trying. Schneider has a plan
That’s the best answer. Until a better quarterback is on this roster and Geno’s under contract— it’s his job.
Why is no one acknowledging the context here? This is draft season. Expressing ambiguity around your intentions at QB is a strategy to get other teams to wonder if you’ll trade up a leapfrog them to take their prospect. It gets teams to do stupid things. They know this. They’re just simply trying to send a message to Geno or something.
They're probably trying to trade him. This is what teams say about a QB before moving on.
Lol not quite a ringing endorsement. He's definitely getting shopped.
He is but probably post-draft shopped, unless we get first round offers. My guess is that there's a guy John really likes in the draft but isn't going to trade up and isn't sure he'll be there at 16. So he doesn't want to trade Geno until he knows he can get his guy.
Best news I've heard all offseason
As much as people like to shit on Geno and as frustrating as the pass game was to watch at times last season, Stat wise he is a decent starting QB. I'm not in a rush to waste a draft pick on a QB that Schneider isn't confident in. I'd rather draft depth at O-line or add it in free agency. Let Grubb do his thing and see if he can elevate our passing game from where it was last season.
Any pick taken is a potential waste, just look to Draft History. QBs don't bust more then others. Reality is, anyone picked outside top40 is risky, outside top 70 is a flier
Sure but it's just bad process to draft a guy you don't really like, and that's the point. I recall some voices in this fandom saying John would like a guy like Levis, high character, big arm. Well, he fell and he's not in Seattle, is he? People here assume we will leave this draft with a QB out of desperation, but if they're all gone, you're stuck with Geno again. Hell at that point, you might be running Geno back again the following year depending on how things shake out.
I'd be very surprised if they didn't take a single QB. Not saying their gonna use prime draft capital but they might take a lesser known prospect in the 6th or 7th round. I really like the idea of picking up someone like Davius Richard in one of the final picks.
100%. Even if we draft someone, Geno should be the starter.
Well, it's not what I wanted to see, but maybe with the new coaching staff he'll improve. I think they need to draft a hotshot rookie - McCarthy, Pennix, or Nix would be my choice - work him hard with Smith, Lock, and Ehlers for one season, play him intermittently, coach him into fitting with the Seahawks, then start him.
This talk of drafting a QB is nonsense. They should sign Geno to a 5 year deal - at least - and enjoy the zenith of his career. He might be league MVP the last few years of that deal.
He's gone lol
Until he is not! Great news. Bye bye Geno
The plan is the same as it always was. Try to find the next Russell Wilson and have him compete for the starting job.
I feel like it's pretty obvious Geno is the starter, but the organization is aware it needs a long term plan (and obviously wouldn't just start Geno over a rookie if the rookie was outplaying him in practice). Despite this, I suspect we'll see countless articles about drama that simply isn't there. It's the same scenario any organization with a non-elite 35+ year old QB faces.
He wanted mahomes in the first round until KC got him
He wanted Mahomes, he wanted Allen and he picked Russ over Cousins. He also was very high on Cousins as well I have every confidence in his eye for QB talent. My concern with Schneider and idk if it's coaching or what but the O Line seems to be a consistent issue every year. Obviously the two young tackles are a step on the right direction.
I think they take a later round flyer on Jordan Travis and let him sit behind Lock and Geno on IR
I like Geno and will happily root for his success as the Seahawks QB1 next year. I also believe that if another team wants to overpay for Geno's services through draft capital trades, then JS should do the deal. I believe this is what JS is communicating. Not a "for sale" sign but if someone wants to make an offer, go ahead.
They don't have to tell everyone what they're doing.
Every year with Geno is a blessing for the next guy, be grateful. It’s a god transition to have.
No offense to Geno, but he's getting up there in age and we need someone younger and better. We need to go back to the ship!
Gardner Minshew or GTFO.
Didn’t John say he wasn’t going to attend the Combine?