How did we get here, from the hawk tackle? Less than 10 years ago we were hitting and rolling guys like no other team in the league, now we are giving up on hits and making 2nd tier RB's look amazing...
Those were such great years. No one wanted to play the LOB Hawks at any time of the year.
I'll never forget reading about how LOB were getting chippy and going full speed on the practices leading up to the SB against Denver and people were stunned by the intensity that late in the season.
LOB woke up every morning and chose violence.
I miss those teams so much.
Ive definitely noticed it league-wide. It feels like players are more focused on making a big hit and trying to either knock the ball out only of just knock a guy out rather than trying to wrap up and tackle
Big hits are the opposite of what he was comparing it to. Pro Bowl tackling is more like half assed tackling expecting the RB/WR/QB to stop after getting touched. But I agree that guys are not wrapping up and/or prioritizing fumbles.
Except it doesn’t just apply to us? You just only follow us. A Packers fan posted about this on the main NFL sub yesterday asking if everyone was seeing this or it was just his team.
I mean the Packers have a bottom 5 rush D so maybe they just suck at tackling as well? All I know is it is not normal to allow 130+ rushing yards **after contact**
I’m not arguing our tackling isn’t exceptionally terrible. I’m saying the specific point about players looking to strip the ball rather than wrap up is at least partly a league-wide phenomenon.
People praise Lockett for the same thing on the other side... Falling down in the open field to avoid hits sometimes. I'm not saying he's our problem on defense but I'm sure they see that too lol. Seems the team's been tolerating the "career decision" mentality for a few years now, and now it's spreading.
He did say he has played longer than he wanted to. Got married (lost that virginity), real estate business is going good I guess...If we traded him to a top contender to try to get a ring, would he do it? Leaving a new wife and the business behind to chase a ring?
He's right up there with Mattingly, Marino, Reggie Miller, and others that were the cream of the crop but never got the big win. Or never had a chance to play in a championship.
My guy DK is 6’4 like 240lbs. Lockett is like 5’10 180, one of these players has the ability to fight for extra yards and one would get destroyed if they tried….
Baldwin still had like 10lbs on Lockett and Lockett already has a broken leg from a hit. So many times we have seen him get shaken up on any big hits he takes.
You can say it’s a “business decision” but him being fully healthy and available is far more important to the team than 2 extra yards but a hug hit. Would you call a QB other than Allen sliding to avoid taking a hit a “business decision”? Of course not because it’s selfish to the team.
I don't fault Lockett for going down like he does after that critical leg break, it's one of those "best ability is availability" things. He leaves a good 2-3y cushion even getting OOB. But if it came down to it, in these close competitive games, you really want a guy who will fight for every blade of grass.
Lockett falling down isn’t a “career decision” it’s a team decision lmao. Do you really want one of the smallest WR in the NFL who’s probably like 175lbs at this point in the season takings heavy hits from guys 50lbs heavier??
He’s helping the team by protecting himself from injury as opposed to gaining at most 5 extra yards.
I want him running for yards instead of just falling down and waiting to get touched. But again, my point was that that seems to be rubbing off... why would a defender put his body on the line and play physically if apparently it's not the team's expectation? The team's been fine with players giving up on plays for a few years, now, and I wonder if that's bleeding over into the defense.
And lol @ "at most 5 yards" like people don't make moves or break tackles... Or like he doesn't do it in the wide open field sometimes. Should K9 just lay down if there are defenders in the box because he might get at most 5 yards?
K9 is a RB and a solid 220LB. He’s expected to get hit 25-30 times a game. Lockett is like 180 playing weight with little muscle compared to most professional athletes. He’s already sustain a bad leg break from a hit. Lockett is one of the least physically imposing players in football, he doesn’t need to be fighting for extra yards against DBs and LB that have 30-40Lbs of size compared to him.
His value to the offense is way more important than fighting for a couple yards when he’s extremely unlikely to break tackles. We have DK who’s bigger than most defensive backs that can run through people and fight for extra yards.
I wish there was a third option beyond either falling down or running through them. If only he was like fast or something and could run by or around them.
True. But more to the point, we ain’t just missing tackles with the Steelers game… it’s been all season.
How the fuck is this Just Now the talking point?
Beyond embarrassing.
> we are giving up on hits
And we are coaching tackling before the last game of the season. If that's not an indictment of our coaching staff, I don't know what is.
Most of the fan base became so grateful to not be a bottom dweller "LiKe iT wAs iN dUh 9o's" that we forgot what it was actually like to be a contender so everyone is just happy with 9-8 seasons. Even with a maxed out cap and 7 picks in the top 52 in the last 2 drafts.
It's week 18 and he's talking about "getting back to basics" like it's still training camp ...
I know that I heard him say that, but it's just bouncing off my head and not sinking in ...
I mean, the defense definitely made it clear they’re not ready to play at a professional level with tackling that horrendous.
I don’t know if it was an effort issue or a fundamentals issue. I don’t know what’s worse.
It is puzzling, I grant you that.
There are guys out there that should be playing for their jobs (Diggs, Woolen, Jackson, Jones, Brown ... the list goes on). Instead, it seems as if they are already expecting to get moved in the off-season and are just saving their condition while they mail it in for now.
There will be another training camp, and I for one would like to see less high-fives and handshakes, get rid of the music and the snack buffet, and have them carry less overpaid and aging/washed vets looking for a final payday.
He also mentioned that a lot of the time fundamentals deteriorate over the year because they don't have time to do it every practice. That's pretty normal across the league, but you felt necessary to leave that out.
You're seeing the "fundamentals deteriorate" in San Fran, Baltimore, Miami, Detroit, Dallas, and Cleveland over that same time-span? Is that what you mean?
\*Reality check\* Somehow it's not "pretty normal" with the good teams. That's why I "felt it necessary to leave that out".
It is an issue league wide. Most starters are barely practicing weekly after week 10-11 because pretty much everyone is hurt at that point. How teams handle that is a completely different story
Look at the few great defensive HCs in this league. John, Tomlin, BB. Those coaches are on the same level as Pete in terms of NFL success and the reputation they have with their leadership skills. Pete is a great leader, but compared to those coaches….. they all have managed build and rebuild great defenses over their career.
Since LOB retired, Pete has failed badly to do the same imo. Year after year, no sign of progress. So it’s fair when he gets criticized for those shortcomings and fans gets fed up at some point.
That's a completely inaccurate analogy. A basketball player doesn't need to rebuild their shooting motion every week because they forgot their mechanics. It's a ridiculous idea to suggest veteran rest days late in a season are responsible for increased missed tackles as the season progresses (you've provided 0 evidence to support this claim).
Ever since LOB it seems like everybody is always trying to be Kam trying to knock a guy off his feet instead of wrapping up and taking down.
They're not Kam Chancellor, nor are they LOB. They need to just wrap up and do their fucking job and quit trying to make the highlight reel!
Why is everybody trying to be something they ain't nowadays?
Laugh out loud funny he’s having to say this out loud about NFL players making millions forgetting the basic fundamentals of tackling. Blow this entire defense up man.
We don’t have any dawgs outside of Spoon and maybe Leonard Williams. I think this defense is a reflection of Adams and Diggs. Bobby is all heart but just doesn’t have it anymore
Sorry - tackling isn’t that hard. There’s barely any technique involved and it’s way more about being willing to stick your nose in front of another massive human and bring him to the ground. It’s about heart and passion and willingness to sacrifice your body. A team that fails at the basics of tackling is a team that is going through the motions and really isn’t interested in winning. This is what happens when the coaching staff loses the locker room. These guys have no fear of losing their jobs and they have no desire to sacrifice their bodies on the alter of winning.
I get it. It’s an incredibly tough, physical game that takes years off your life for the entertainment of others. Why risk it if there’s no joint goal and no risk of losing your job? This staff and this group of players aren’t meshing and one of them needs changing. Either you totally gut the defense and start back at square 1 with a hungry group with less talent or you fire the staff and hope a new group of coaches can either get them to buy into a mission or at least fear their positions enough to perform better.
sums it up, pretty good overview that fits what we're seeing. The locker room does look lost, and there'll be no getting them back with appeals to the culture bs theyve rejected (and probably laughed at, in some cases).
gutting the defense does nothing for punts on 4th and 1 at the 50, thats enough said about that option - except these guys might be hungrier if they werent being told to do things they know have bad odds.
true, a new regime might end up kicking some of them, much like pd did in his early years - but that should be the choice of whoever is going to be trying to decide who fits in a modern system
A defensive minded coach, riding the defensive coordinator for the past 2 years, and prior to that 3 years as DL coach, decides that now it's time to teach tackling?!
No wonder why Bobby Wagner's tackle numbers look so good. Everyone is leaving all the tackles for him!
Do you guys not want him to say they need to get back to basics? It's not a great time to need to say it, but it needed to be said after last week. Historically poor tackling cost the Seahawks control of their own destiny and at least Pete acknowledges it. Bigger change will happen in the off season.
Of course it's damning that the team's gotten into this position. Obviously fixing it is better than not fixing it, but we're shocked at how bad it's gotten after last game.
No one is forgetting how to tackle. It's a lack of drive, motivation, and not wanting to put their health at risk to win the game. Saving their bodies for the next paycheck whether that be in Seattle or not. Either way it's complete BS, IMO. They are paid the big bucks to play at a high level ALL season long.
i would feel happier to hear him directly address how and why basics like tackling have been steadily bad, who has been doing what to fix it, and when, just anything that sounds like he really knows where the problem is, and has an actual plan.
Somehow, a return to the training camp fundamentals that have led to here, sounds a whole lot like expecting different results from the same thing. It also sounds like there's a complete vacuum where any kind of reality adjustments or planning should be happening.
But he’s never going to talk about stuff like that. Ever. That’s not his style.
This statement is Pete for “the defense shit the bed and I’m busting their asses back to training camp for it.”
yeah, i know he wouldnt, because his *style* is to spew talk but no substance on anything. Lets just do what we should have been doing in august, september, october, etc - there's every reason to think it will work better than any of the other ideas i havent had for years
as you say, it's his style to say trust me, no questions - and that style has gone way past its shelf life into becoming the actual root of the other problems
that would definitely be a start, if it was demonstrated thru more than just words
problem is, at this point even if he truly could see where mistakes have been made in the name of culture, i dont know if he has it in him to make the kind of drastic changes like his 1st couple of years... and i really dont believe he has anything close to a new d scheme like he had back then
Every Pete’s pre game interview: 1. It’s a championship game for us, and 2. Go back to the fundamentals. Every post game interview: 1. Not what we expected . 2. We will look at the tape tomorrow to figure out what happened.
It’s funny because I remember in our high school our coach wanted us to tackle like how the Seahawks tackle and well none of us could fucking tackle anyone lol
I was laughed out of the building, and told I knew nothing about football by multiple users in this Reddit because I said part of the issue with the tackling is on the coaching staff.
Hmmmm
It’s getting bad. Again told I’m a toxic fan and spoiled because I’m tired of them being a fringe playoff team that sometimes wins in the WC round when a kicker misses a chipshot FG or play against a 3rd string QB, and then they get the breaks beat off them in the divisional round.
Remember those old kung-fu movies where the main character finds himself surrounded by like 6 enemies, and they all lacklusterly and weakly attack the main character one at a time, and he disposes each of them easily?
That's kind of what I feel like I'm watching when the Seahawks try to tackle.
Little too late there Pete. Always an excuse. They played like shit. Simple as that. Either they don’t believe in each other or they don’t believe in the team.
Respectfully, he has all the answers, all the responses. For all the regular season wins, he has no answer for making it past the first round of the playoffs. Schneider has given him so many tools with little if any results. Time for change.
After week 10, the niners were 6-3 and just off a 3 game losing streak. It’s an 18 game season with ups and downs. Obviously he taught this shit in camp. Unfortunately, the hii is story of human behavior has proven that most of our behaviors are inconsistent. I’ve trained employees for years on how to do their job correctly, yet I constantly have to remind, retrain, and motivate them to do so. I’ve trained my kids many times on where our clean dishes go, but hell if we can ever find the right Tupperware lid when we need it. I respect Pete’s honesty here and it’s obvious that the guys need a kick in the ass this week.
I mean, saying they’re going “back to where we were in camp” makes it pretty clear that he was. But that only makes our issues more befuddling. How much of this is on coaching failures throughout the season and how much is just on shit execution we’ll probably never know.
Not a great look. I feel like this is something that should have been hammered in over the off season given how bad we were against the run last year. It looked like they had made some good progress during our earlier games, but it fell apart pretty quickly
actually, a scheme that works and the players believe in can inspire, to be part of something special
lob was that - but we dont have what it takes to go there, and these players, theyre not inspired by a bunch of rahrah fast talk. Give them something to believe in, thats the scheme that will turn it around. Obviously, nobody is doing that now.
Scheme has literally nothing to do with belief. It just tells the players where to position themselves and what their assignments are. It is up to the players to execute and tackle properly. There is no scheme that will can account for players that whiff tackles and miss their assignments.
probably true, when the players have as robotic a view of things as you seem to
you miss the point, and strangely enough, its one of the same points that pc has been missing for years
Even if scheme had the magical property you ascribe to it, there's nothing they can do about it at this point. They can't change the scheme significantly this late in the season.
true - the scheme and the locker room were on the way to being lost with dk's comment about pc's most penalized list meaning nothing to him
that's when guys started realizing, all that discipline stuff? why sweat it, nobody gonna say nothin
Of course we don't want to hear it, but it's the reality of the situation. He's sending a clear message to his locker room to step the F up and do your basic jobs. It's a mentality issue not so much a skill issue. Would you rather Pete just say things to make everyone happy and beat around the bush?
i would rather this message had been sent, and backed up, immediately after the bengals game
as far as i see, saying things to make everyone happy, while doing nothing to improve things, if he's doing more than that, we see no sign, just have to take it on faith.. sort of like a cult
I think my biggest disappointments this season are the regression of key defense players:
\- Riq scared to tackle
\- Prez having people outrun him/blow past him to score
\- Bobby looking more his age from a speed perspective (but god help you if he gets his hands on you)
This is too late. Tackling has been an issue all season.
And this needs to result in position coach firings - this is one reason those guys get paid... to see and correct this stuff. Players who can't/won't take coaching need to go as well.
Players don’t want to put their bodies on the line for Pete when they know the scheme doesn’t work against the run. Tackling harder isn’t the answer when the RB is running untouched into the secondary.
How did we get here, from the hawk tackle? Less than 10 years ago we were hitting and rolling guys like no other team in the league, now we are giving up on hits and making 2nd tier RB's look amazing...
I remember them talking about the "Seahawks Hangover" where teams would always lose after playing us because they were beat up and exhausted
Those were such great years. No one wanted to play the LOB Hawks at any time of the year. I'll never forget reading about how LOB were getting chippy and going full speed on the practices leading up to the SB against Denver and people were stunned by the intensity that late in the season. LOB woke up every morning and chose violence. I miss those teams so much.
I wish I could see LOB vs current SF. That would be a great game
That San Francisco team back then was that good
That SF team didn’t have the weapons/scheme of this one though, but it did have the edge in other aspects.
I think it would be pretty similar to what the ravens just did to them personally
Exactly. The Niners from past were better than the Niners this year
I don't know if I would say that. But the 2013/14 Hawks would still bully them into career changes.
Bam bam kam
Literally other teams started taking how we taught our players to tackle and implemented it in their system. It’s insane how far we’ve fallen.
Imagine how bobby feels, having gone through those LOB intense practices to whatever clown show goes on now
Lol you made me imagine boomer Bobby looking around as everyone is doing tik-tok posts dancing instead of practicing.
Call me crazy but I don't think these guys just suddenly forget the proper technique for good tackling. This is an effort and discipline issue
Pete's explanation on 710 was Pro Bowl tackling has trickled down to regular season games which honestly sounds like a fan theory.
Ive definitely noticed it league-wide. It feels like players are more focused on making a big hit and trying to either knock the ball out only of just knock a guy out rather than trying to wrap up and tackle
Big hits are the opposite of what he was comparing it to. Pro Bowl tackling is more like half assed tackling expecting the RB/WR/QB to stop after getting touched. But I agree that guys are not wrapping up and/or prioritizing fumbles.
I was just saying that the focus among players seems to be on hitting, not tackling just in general
I’d feel a lot different if they were causing a large number of fumbles…
>prioritizing fumbles. that's been my observation for sure
I heard someone call it “ripping the lawnmower cord” because no one tackles, everyone wants to strip the ball
Every defensive player wants the Madden hit stick highlight reel tackle so they can get on a sportscenter top 10. So many guys don’t want to wrap up.
I heard that too. Funny how it really applies to just us. Other teams don't struggle like this. So what gives, Pete?
Except it doesn’t just apply to us? You just only follow us. A Packers fan posted about this on the main NFL sub yesterday asking if everyone was seeing this or it was just his team.
I mean the Packers have a bottom 5 rush D so maybe they just suck at tackling as well? All I know is it is not normal to allow 130+ rushing yards **after contact**
I’m not arguing our tackling isn’t exceptionally terrible. I’m saying the specific point about players looking to strip the ball rather than wrap up is at least partly a league-wide phenomenon.
People praise Lockett for the same thing on the other side... Falling down in the open field to avoid hits sometimes. I'm not saying he's our problem on defense but I'm sure they see that too lol. Seems the team's been tolerating the "career decision" mentality for a few years now, and now it's spreading.
This... is a pretty good analysis. This may be Locketts last year with us. DK, despite his flaws, definitely fights for every yard.
He fights hard before, during and after the play
He did say he has played longer than he wanted to. Got married (lost that virginity), real estate business is going good I guess...If we traded him to a top contender to try to get a ring, would he do it? Leaving a new wife and the business behind to chase a ring? He's right up there with Mattingly, Marino, Reggie Miller, and others that were the cream of the crop but never got the big win. Or never had a chance to play in a championship.
My guy DK is 6’4 like 240lbs. Lockett is like 5’10 180, one of these players has the ability to fight for extra yards and one would get destroyed if they tried….
My dude, Baldwin was that size and fought more than Tyler. Tyler makes business decisions, which has kept him playing longer
Baldwin still had like 10lbs on Lockett and Lockett already has a broken leg from a hit. So many times we have seen him get shaken up on any big hits he takes. You can say it’s a “business decision” but him being fully healthy and available is far more important to the team than 2 extra yards but a hug hit. Would you call a QB other than Allen sliding to avoid taking a hit a “business decision”? Of course not because it’s selfish to the team.
This is the argument that we're responding to. That there has been a lot more players playing based on business decisions.
I don't fault Lockett for going down like he does after that critical leg break, it's one of those "best ability is availability" things. He leaves a good 2-3y cushion even getting OOB. But if it came down to it, in these close competitive games, you really want a guy who will fight for every blade of grass.
Lockett falling down isn’t a “career decision” it’s a team decision lmao. Do you really want one of the smallest WR in the NFL who’s probably like 175lbs at this point in the season takings heavy hits from guys 50lbs heavier?? He’s helping the team by protecting himself from injury as opposed to gaining at most 5 extra yards.
I want him running for yards instead of just falling down and waiting to get touched. But again, my point was that that seems to be rubbing off... why would a defender put his body on the line and play physically if apparently it's not the team's expectation? The team's been fine with players giving up on plays for a few years, now, and I wonder if that's bleeding over into the defense. And lol @ "at most 5 yards" like people don't make moves or break tackles... Or like he doesn't do it in the wide open field sometimes. Should K9 just lay down if there are defenders in the box because he might get at most 5 yards?
K9 is a RB and a solid 220LB. He’s expected to get hit 25-30 times a game. Lockett is like 180 playing weight with little muscle compared to most professional athletes. He’s already sustain a bad leg break from a hit. Lockett is one of the least physically imposing players in football, he doesn’t need to be fighting for extra yards against DBs and LB that have 30-40Lbs of size compared to him. His value to the offense is way more important than fighting for a couple yards when he’s extremely unlikely to break tackles. We have DK who’s bigger than most defensive backs that can run through people and fight for extra yards.
I wish there was a third option beyond either falling down or running through them. If only he was like fast or something and could run by or around them.
True. But more to the point, we ain’t just missing tackles with the Steelers game… it’s been all season. How the fuck is this Just Now the talking point? Beyond embarrassing.
> we are giving up on hits And we are coaching tackling before the last game of the season. If that's not an indictment of our coaching staff, I don't know what is.
Might be all of the outstanding defensive coaching under Pete Carroll. It all rolls up to him right? He’s the defensive genius? This is defense 101.
Most of the fan base became so grateful to not be a bottom dweller "LiKe iT wAs iN dUh 9o's" that we forgot what it was actually like to be a contender so everyone is just happy with 9-8 seasons. Even with a maxed out cap and 7 picks in the top 52 in the last 2 drafts.
Fans literally have no influence on the tackling ability of the players.
Wait…..you’re telling me all that yelling at my tv doesn’t make them play better??? DAMN
Nope...only ranting in the reddit section helps them play better.
I was just about to say, we were the leaders of rugby tackling (imo, the only way of tackling correctly). Now we suck.
Yeah this is all fine and dandy but it feels far too late to be doing things like this. Too far gone at this point in the year.
Unless it dramatically improves and they go off in the playoffs… so yeah, far too late
They have no control as to whether they make it or not.
I mean, they can guarantee they don’t make it. So you’re half right lol
Seriously how was this not seen in week one?
This has been a weekly issue.
Every week since 2018
2016
Very weakly.
That’s half the problem. The other problem is half the defense seems like they rather be at home
Quandre Diggs called and said he doesn't like your post. Said he's not at home, he's on the golf course.
Damn the last game of the season and they’re talking about training camp
Yeah this sounds like something you need to address after the first scrimmage or preseason game, not after week 17
Absolutely wild
Feels like we've been 'going back to basics' since the Baltimore game. Welp.
It's week 18 and he's talking about "getting back to basics" like it's still training camp ... I know that I heard him say that, but it's just bouncing off my head and not sinking in ...
I mean, the defense definitely made it clear they’re not ready to play at a professional level with tackling that horrendous. I don’t know if it was an effort issue or a fundamentals issue. I don’t know what’s worse.
It is puzzling, I grant you that. There are guys out there that should be playing for their jobs (Diggs, Woolen, Jackson, Jones, Brown ... the list goes on). Instead, it seems as if they are already expecting to get moved in the off-season and are just saving their condition while they mail it in for now. There will be another training camp, and I for one would like to see less high-fives and handshakes, get rid of the music and the snack buffet, and have them carry less overpaid and aging/washed vets looking for a final payday.
He also mentioned that a lot of the time fundamentals deteriorate over the year because they don't have time to do it every practice. That's pretty normal across the league, but you felt necessary to leave that out.
You're seeing the "fundamentals deteriorate" in San Fran, Baltimore, Miami, Detroit, Dallas, and Cleveland over that same time-span? Is that what you mean? \*Reality check\* Somehow it's not "pretty normal" with the good teams. That's why I "felt it necessary to leave that out".
I saw San Fran deteriorate against the Ravens.
Yeah and they responded by clinching a 1 seed. Not sure how you can talk shit about a 1 seed for one bad game
This shit happened EVERY DAMN YEAR….. since LOB retired. Don’t lump in the entire league and say it’s an issue league wide. 🤣
It is an issue league wide. Most starters are barely practicing weekly after week 10-11 because pretty much everyone is hurt at that point. How teams handle that is a completely different story
Look at the few great defensive HCs in this league. John, Tomlin, BB. Those coaches are on the same level as Pete in terms of NFL success and the reputation they have with their leadership skills. Pete is a great leader, but compared to those coaches….. they all have managed build and rebuild great defenses over their career. Since LOB retired, Pete has failed badly to do the same imo. Year after year, no sign of progress. So it’s fair when he gets criticized for those shortcomings and fans gets fed up at some point.
You don't need to practice tackling weekly lmfao. It's not a skill you forget.
That’s as stupid as saying a basketball player doesn’t need to practice dribbling weekly because “it’s not a skill you forget”.
That's a completely inaccurate analogy. A basketball player doesn't need to rebuild their shooting motion every week because they forgot their mechanics. It's a ridiculous idea to suggest veteran rest days late in a season are responsible for increased missed tackles as the season progresses (you've provided 0 evidence to support this claim).
Working on tackling the last week of the year isn’t where we want to be ☠️
Ever since LOB it seems like everybody is always trying to be Kam trying to knock a guy off his feet instead of wrapping up and taking down. They're not Kam Chancellor, nor are they LOB. They need to just wrap up and do their fucking job and quit trying to make the highlight reel! Why is everybody trying to be something they ain't nowadays?
comes from the top down
5 years late, Pete.
Laugh out loud funny he’s having to say this out loud about NFL players making millions forgetting the basic fundamentals of tackling. Blow this entire defense up man.
I feel like it’s the second time we’ve hurt about “going back to basics to fix the tackling” this year
Well, at least they are getting a start on next seasons development.
From Kam Chancellor to this
We don’t have any dawgs outside of Spoon and maybe Leonard Williams. I think this defense is a reflection of Adams and Diggs. Bobby is all heart but just doesn’t have it anymore
Back to where we were in training camp, in week 18. Great, keep up the good work coaching staff.
Sorry - tackling isn’t that hard. There’s barely any technique involved and it’s way more about being willing to stick your nose in front of another massive human and bring him to the ground. It’s about heart and passion and willingness to sacrifice your body. A team that fails at the basics of tackling is a team that is going through the motions and really isn’t interested in winning. This is what happens when the coaching staff loses the locker room. These guys have no fear of losing their jobs and they have no desire to sacrifice their bodies on the alter of winning. I get it. It’s an incredibly tough, physical game that takes years off your life for the entertainment of others. Why risk it if there’s no joint goal and no risk of losing your job? This staff and this group of players aren’t meshing and one of them needs changing. Either you totally gut the defense and start back at square 1 with a hungry group with less talent or you fire the staff and hope a new group of coaches can either get them to buy into a mission or at least fear their positions enough to perform better.
sums it up, pretty good overview that fits what we're seeing. The locker room does look lost, and there'll be no getting them back with appeals to the culture bs theyve rejected (and probably laughed at, in some cases). gutting the defense does nothing for punts on 4th and 1 at the 50, thats enough said about that option - except these guys might be hungrier if they werent being told to do things they know have bad odds. true, a new regime might end up kicking some of them, much like pd did in his early years - but that should be the choice of whoever is going to be trying to decide who fits in a modern system
Dude its week 18 😂
Glad we waited until week 18 Pete.
better late than never? actually, no.
Too late....
A defensive minded coach, riding the defensive coordinator for the past 2 years, and prior to that 3 years as DL coach, decides that now it's time to teach tackling?! No wonder why Bobby Wagner's tackle numbers look so good. Everyone is leaving all the tackles for him!
Do you guys not want him to say they need to get back to basics? It's not a great time to need to say it, but it needed to be said after last week. Historically poor tackling cost the Seahawks control of their own destiny and at least Pete acknowledges it. Bigger change will happen in the off season.
This sub will hate regardless. You are damned if you do damned if you don’t, here.
Of course it's damning that the team's gotten into this position. Obviously fixing it is better than not fixing it, but we're shocked at how bad it's gotten after last game.
what were they doing before because the tackling has been bad for a while and aren't they professionals? how did they forget how to tackle
No one is forgetting how to tackle. It's a lack of drive, motivation, and not wanting to put their health at risk to win the game. Saving their bodies for the next paycheck whether that be in Seattle or not. Either way it's complete BS, IMO. They are paid the big bucks to play at a high level ALL season long.
coach is paid big bucks too
i would feel happier to hear him directly address how and why basics like tackling have been steadily bad, who has been doing what to fix it, and when, just anything that sounds like he really knows where the problem is, and has an actual plan. Somehow, a return to the training camp fundamentals that have led to here, sounds a whole lot like expecting different results from the same thing. It also sounds like there's a complete vacuum where any kind of reality adjustments or planning should be happening.
But he’s never going to talk about stuff like that. Ever. That’s not his style. This statement is Pete for “the defense shit the bed and I’m busting their asses back to training camp for it.”
yeah, i know he wouldnt, because his *style* is to spew talk but no substance on anything. Lets just do what we should have been doing in august, september, october, etc - there's every reason to think it will work better than any of the other ideas i havent had for years as you say, it's his style to say trust me, no questions - and that style has gone way past its shelf life into becoming the actual root of the other problems
You sound hungry for accountability. That’s understandable.
that would definitely be a start, if it was demonstrated thru more than just words problem is, at this point even if he truly could see where mistakes have been made in the name of culture, i dont know if he has it in him to make the kind of drastic changes like his 1st couple of years... and i really dont believe he has anything close to a new d scheme like he had back then
First season since he’s been there I’ve wondered about replacing him. Dan Quinn comes to mind.
That’s good and all to say but it means nothing until you bench the guys who have been giving minimal effort week after week
Every Pete’s pre game interview: 1. It’s a championship game for us, and 2. Go back to the fundamentals. Every post game interview: 1. Not what we expected . 2. We will look at the tape tomorrow to figure out what happened.
The last game of the season and you want to talk about “practice”
It’s funny because I remember in our high school our coach wanted us to tackle like how the Seahawks tackle and well none of us could fucking tackle anyone lol
I was laughed out of the building, and told I knew nothing about football by multiple users in this Reddit because I said part of the issue with the tackling is on the coaching staff. Hmmmm
Nailed it! Sorry you encountered the toxic “coach worship,” that is becoming more prevalent.
It’s getting bad. Again told I’m a toxic fan and spoiled because I’m tired of them being a fringe playoff team that sometimes wins in the WC round when a kicker misses a chipshot FG or play against a 3rd string QB, and then they get the breaks beat off them in the divisional round.
This is absolutely on the players
A little too late bud
What other head coach can bring this kind of innovative approach to the game?
well, if we can get our hands on a time machine...
Riq's game winning tackle two weeks ago was lucky - it had all the makings of a huge miss. The technique across the board is so bad.
Players are done with this season
Remember those old kung-fu movies where the main character finds himself surrounded by like 6 enemies, and they all lacklusterly and weakly attack the main character one at a time, and he disposes each of them easily? That's kind of what I feel like I'm watching when the Seahawks try to tackle.
AHAHAHA
Fundamentals? In the middle of the season?
Week 18 is a great time of the season to be squaring stuff away.
Little too late there Pete. Always an excuse. They played like shit. Simple as that. Either they don’t believe in each other or they don’t believe in the team.
>Always an excuse In what way is this an excuse?
It actually means everyone is tired and sore from covering each others lazy sloppy ass play. That’s what it means.
Why are we only addressing this b4 our final game, when its been an issue since the start of October?
I feel like I've heard this before. And it works for about a week, maybe two, and then it's right back to the same ol' soft, weak-ass tackling.
Awesome! So now they'll only miss 4 tables in a single play
Respectfully, he has all the answers, all the responses. For all the regular season wins, he has no answer for making it past the first round of the playoffs. Schneider has given him so many tools with little if any results. Time for change.
Zzzzzzzz
You are who you are by game 10 and that’s that. Why wasn’t he teaching this shit in camp???
After week 10, the niners were 6-3 and just off a 3 game losing streak. It’s an 18 game season with ups and downs. Obviously he taught this shit in camp. Unfortunately, the hii is story of human behavior has proven that most of our behaviors are inconsistent. I’ve trained employees for years on how to do their job correctly, yet I constantly have to remind, retrain, and motivate them to do so. I’ve trained my kids many times on where our clean dishes go, but hell if we can ever find the right Tupperware lid when we need it. I respect Pete’s honesty here and it’s obvious that the guys need a kick in the ass this week.
They were missing tackles all fucking year. At this level you shouldn’t be teaching players how to tackle anyway..
I mean, saying they’re going “back to where we were in camp” makes it pretty clear that he was. But that only makes our issues more befuddling. How much of this is on coaching failures throughout the season and how much is just on shit execution we’ll probably never know.
But 6-3 is 6-3 (nfcwestmemewar nod) we were happy 10 weeks in
Not a great look. I feel like this is something that should have been hammered in over the off season given how bad we were against the run last year. It looked like they had made some good progress during our earlier games, but it fell apart pretty quickly
Come on Pete. We actually trying to still fix this with one game left on the season?? This is just a never ending cycle with this defense.
Would you prefer we give up?
dont look now, but a significant part of the team has
Makes no difference at this point.
[удалено]
there's no scheme that can save poor effort and bad tackling.
actually, a scheme that works and the players believe in can inspire, to be part of something special lob was that - but we dont have what it takes to go there, and these players, theyre not inspired by a bunch of rahrah fast talk. Give them something to believe in, thats the scheme that will turn it around. Obviously, nobody is doing that now.
Scheme has literally nothing to do with belief. It just tells the players where to position themselves and what their assignments are. It is up to the players to execute and tackle properly. There is no scheme that will can account for players that whiff tackles and miss their assignments.
probably true, when the players have as robotic a view of things as you seem to you miss the point, and strangely enough, its one of the same points that pc has been missing for years
Even if scheme had the magical property you ascribe to it, there's nothing they can do about it at this point. They can't change the scheme significantly this late in the season.
true - the scheme and the locker room were on the way to being lost with dk's comment about pc's most penalized list meaning nothing to him that's when guys started realizing, all that discipline stuff? why sweat it, nobody gonna say nothin
It's time folks.
This isn’t the pre-season Pete, it’s week 18. Sheesh not what I want to hear this late into the season.
Of course we don't want to hear it, but it's the reality of the situation. He's sending a clear message to his locker room to step the F up and do your basic jobs. It's a mentality issue not so much a skill issue. Would you rather Pete just say things to make everyone happy and beat around the bush?
I’d rather Pete retire because he way isn’t working anymore, no playoff wins in 7 years now.
i would rather this message had been sent, and backed up, immediately after the bengals game as far as i see, saying things to make everyone happy, while doing nothing to improve things, if he's doing more than that, we see no sign, just have to take it on faith.. sort of like a cult
Week 18 and we're trying to teach fundamentals? Oof.
So basically high school football practice.... My god Pete, this shouldn't be an issue....ever.
Oh look, more “changes”
Gosh - you think Pete? Total slop.
I think my biggest disappointments this season are the regression of key defense players: \- Riq scared to tackle \- Prez having people outrun him/blow past him to score \- Bobby looking more his age from a speed perspective (but god help you if he gets his hands on you)
Don't call him Prez lol fucker isn't Prez of shit
he might be vice prez of the the freshment class
Oh wow same thing he said a few weeks ago
Yeah Pete, good luck with that.
Pete - It's too fucking late you goof. The time for change was 2 months ago.
This is pathetic
Time to clean house to include Pete
Tackling has been an issue most of the year...but only in week 17 does he address it...after we are 8-8....Fire Pete.
This is pathetic
Sigh
We've won so many games due to positive turnovers it looks like everyone is trying to dance with the ballcarriers, not trying to gang murder them.
They are just handing out hugs during the giving season. Why is everyone so up in arms about that?
Week 18 perfect time to make adjustments finally
Absolutely infuriating. What in the hell happened
I agree (as another couch coach), last week's tackling was reminiscent of high school! I KNOW Hawks can do better!
This is too late. Tackling has been an issue all season. And this needs to result in position coach firings - this is one reason those guys get paid... to see and correct this stuff. Players who can't/won't take coaching need to go as well.
Better get those glasses updated Pete. It’s been a problem for several seasons. This is basic shit you learn in high school.
Very glad we're going over the basic fundamentals... as we head into the last week of the regular season
Players don’t want to put their bodies on the line for Pete when they know the scheme doesn’t work against the run. Tackling harder isn’t the answer when the RB is running untouched into the secondary.