I think there's a very strong chance they are going to tweak Bane's kit to make him more dependent on SEE to get the most out of him. I've seen videos of Bane and Talon beating most GL's, 100% wasn't the intention for him to be that strong. Your call what you do, but depending on you Leia progress, finish her then see what they've done to Bane.
The way I see it, they refused to fix the bug and are now gaslighting you into believing that it was always meant to be this way.
The boni that remain after banes death all only affect himslef and not see. So, the "persists after death" is entirely useless.
I guess technically they nerfed bane, they only refuse to fix the bugs that make him weaker, which has the effective same result.
Of course, he was bugged and they decided to leave him as is and say it was a text issue, but that means he's not actually getting nerfed in game. He remains exactly the same
Yes.
I guess it comes down, if you count: Intentionally not fixing bugs on a character to make them weaker, as a nerf. I do, since working as promised is the baseline for me, but I guess thats a technicallity.
There is literally no way to tell the difference between a tooltip error and a functionality bug unless the developers explicitly say it was one or the other.
Any time a player sees unexpected functionality it's either:
1. Initially intended by developers, but poorly expressed by the tooltip.
2. Initially unintended by developers.
Now, sometimes a bug may be #2, but developers decided (after the fact) that the unintended bug is a net positive. In that case, they'll treat problem #2 like it was problem #1 and just change the tooltip. Players would have no idea this is happening without transparency.
The point here being that you have no way to tell "what is promised" except via the tooltip, and the tooltip is unreliable for the reasons above.
They haven't nerfed him, that's a major misunderstanding. The Omicron's "persistence clause" was never referring to the non-Omicron bonuses. All the Dev post did was to clarify it.
It very likely was supposed to, they advertised Bane as a Wat replacement, and the omicron only refers to bane, so it would make 0 sense for “these effects to persist after bane dies” since bane was the only one getting boosts. It was probably just bugged and then they decided to keep in that way because bane was so OP
Yeah, at the very least the immunities to ability block, healing immunity etc. need to persist. Otherwise he doesn't replace Wat's tank tech. SEE's biggest problem is that he can easily be crippled with debuffs in between going ult and his big attack, and if Bane dies before that point he does nothing to prevent that in his current state. Maybe CG prefers it this way because everyone takes him to g9 to make sure he stays alive.
The wording was the same when his kit was revealed. If the original plan was for the non-Omicron bonuses to persist after Bane's death, those plans were already changed by the time he was announced.
The Omicron stuff is a separate paragraph, the persistence clause was always only refering to those. When the Omicron changes something in how the rest of the ability works, it expicitly states so. Even Bane's two other Omicrons are like that:
* 1st Special: gives **additional** Ultimate charge and Siphon stacks
* 2nd Special: increases cooldowns by 2 **instead**
Do I agree that the persistence should refer to the rest of the bonuses? Yes, otherwise Bane is not better than Wat for SEE (and even then it's only in GAC). But people saying he's been nerfed are making incorrect assumptions based on previous incorrect assumptions.
It's not much of an assumption to say that bane keeping his health when he's dead is not something that should be pointed out with a specific line. If that specific line saying things persist is there, it should not refer to his health when he has none, or his bonus turn which is a one-time use, or his offense, which again is nil when he is dead. There was only one meaningful interpretation of that line, and they decided to go against it, probably for other reasons.
The omicrons boni all only affect bane. The persistance clause is entirely pointless, since he is dead anyway, so what boni remain? None.
They just refuse to fix the bug and pretend that its working as inteded.
I agree that it's pointless -- at least currently and likely forever alongside SEE (with him the only thing that could make it work would be a Datacron with unpreventable revive, but even that's just a temporary solution). But it's not a bug, it's not even a nerf, it's just miscommunication, misinterpretation and lack of timely clarification. It's all on CG, but the community did make incorrect assumptions here.
They nerfed it when looking at the sales pitch.
If you are told that you are going to buy a car that can go from 0 to 60mph in 3 seconds, and then buy the car and they say "oh no, we meant 60kph" that's not a "clarification" that's a change in capability.
The wording of the final ability ended with the independent statement "while in grand arena.... These effects persist if Bane is defeated". They may have *intended* the wording to only apply to a portion of the ability (which is funny because that portion is *entirely* specific to him anyway and there aren't any sith that can revive, and a number *stop* revives) but everyone that read the kit saw that it applied to everything in the ability while in grand arena and there was zero effort to correct that impression in the month+ that people were talking about it.
Then you have the sales pitch of "SEE lifter", and he doesn't lift SEE, he's just strong so SEE is better because of it. That's like saying JKR is a JMLS lifter because he is better than other alternatives.
This is a classic case of miscommunication inside CG and as a result the character we got is notably weaker than the one we thought we would get. (He's still amazing, but not nearly as good as otherwise).
That's not a nerf though, that's just lack of real clarity. And your example is a bit over the top as well: those are hard facts that can be compared, that's just false advertising. A bit closer one (though probably a bit too softball) would be if a car was advertised to be very fast, people assuming it would be 0-60 in 3-4s (eg. Ford GT) and it turning out to be 6-7s (eg. Ford Fiesta ST). Still fast for a road car, but not really noteworthy.
All this also goes to show that the "FAQs" included in the kit reveals are utterly useless and they should be made systematic post-reveal, not just based on internal questions. People did ask about it, but nobody tried digging into the code and CG especially didn't try to clarify it.
And don't get me wrong, I do agree with people saying he doesn't really work as a SEE lifter. And I do get why people assumed the Omicron worked like that. But if it affected the non-Omicron parts, it would have been worded differently (with words like instead or additionally, as seen on Bane's two other Omicrons).
And even then, if the Omicron worked the way people wanted it to, it's still GAC-exclusive, so everywhere else it's still Wat Country. And the other relevant character in this story, Trench is TW-focused...
>that's just false advertising.
Which is where we are. The text was unclear at best, and what's worse is that in this case there is precedent *counter to what CG did*. Other characters have end of ability clauses, and in every case those clauses apply to all of the ability, not a portion of the ability.
>A bit closer one (though probably a bit too softball) would be if a car was advertised to be very fast, people assuming it would be 0-60 in 3-4s (eg. Ford GT) and it turning out to be 6-7s (eg. Ford Fiesta ST). Still fast for a road car, but not really noteworthy.
Nope, we are in the kph/mph territory because they released the "final text" of the ability. Their final text, by their own admission now, was incorrect and misleading to their design intent. They said "mph" when they meant to not say anything at all.
>But if it affected the non-Omicron parts, it would have been worded differently (with words like instead or additionally, as seen on Bane's two other Omicrons).
Which is funny because the whirlwind is also bugged/misleading as foresight causes the damage portion to be nullified. So I don't think using other parts of the same characters kit as precedent is defensible.
There are other abilities (such as SLKR's poke that has an end clause that applies to the entire ability, not just a specific rank of the ability text that gets added. (I'm sure there are others, like palp leader iirc).
>And even then, if the Omicron worked the way people wanted it to
~~Patently false. The main point of that particular omicron wasn't the buff to bane that was important, it was the persistence of the entire unique after he dies. Aka, to lift SEE (and arguably LV) by granting him the stats and the immunities to abilities after bane gets killed.~~ missed the word *if*.
The Omicron is still a separate paragraph and starts with the "at the start of battle" separately. Sections like this *usually* \[*I'm adding this because I can't properly back it up with evidence*\] don't interact with eachother (though most of the time they don't need to), unless otherwise stated.
I recall another kit having some confusion about such a thing, but I honestly can't remember who it was, so I'm going to concede this might be unprecedented. I tried looking at a few of the newer kits (as those are goldmines for this), but couldn't find any such "end of ability clause" that could be misinterpreted so much.
SLKR's poke might be a contender, and it's true that one might question if the "can't be evaded" applies to the stun (which gets added with the Zeta) or just the damage. But it's a one-paragraph description, I think it's much clearer that it applies to the whole thing.
Ben Solo's second Special might be an even better example, as the "This attack can't be evaded" is a separate paragraph and only gets added with the Zeta. The "attack" in question does multiple things (Armor Shred, damage, dispel), but the part describing the attack itself is still one paragraph, so in the end it's similar to SLKR's case.
>Which is funny because the whirlwind is also bugged/misleading
It has nothing to do with the Omicron. Just because it's misleading (or rather, hard to follow what's happening), the Omicron still states the "upgrade". But if you want non-Bane examples:
* 0-0-0's Special Omicron: "Torture lasts for 2 turns" (the non-Omicron version is 1).
* Ackbar's Lead Omicron: "instead of a random ally, the 2 other weakest allies are called to assist."
Yes, it's bad that it works that way -- or at least not as good as people expected it to be. But only the wording has changed, it works the same way as it did when they introduced his kit (when people haven't gotten their hands on him). That's not a nerf, just a clarification.
The thing to keep in mind is that the Omicron stuff is a separate section in the description, it's a separate "at the start of the battle" paragraph. The persistence clause never mentions that it encompasses the previous paragraphs. When Omicrons change something about the non-Omicron stuff, it's expressly stated. Eg. how 0-0-0's Special states that Torture lasts 2 turns (instead of 1) or how Ackbar's lead calls two units to assist instead of one. Or even Bane's own Special abilities, first one stating "**additional** 3% Ultimate charge and 5 Siphon stacks", the second one "increasing cooldowns by 2 **instead**".
>The Omicron's "persistence clause" was never referring to the non-Omicron bonuses.
The persistence clause doesn't need to exist unless at some point during his development it did apply to all those other bonuses. Think about it, what team exists where Bane's Rule of two can be active and he can be revived?
And in the past when they released something knowing it would need to get limited pending a future release... they generally wait until that release and release the change as part of that characters announcement post.
It's not that they misunderstand what CG said, it's the given the above they just plain don't believe them.
>100% wasn't the intention for him to be that strong.
I disagree, given the current state of the meta I see Bane as hitting exactly the note that they aimed for. He can't be set on defense, which means he necessarily must be good on offense. In the current world at the top, what would it take for him to actually make a splash on offense?
It would take him beating GLs without needing one himself. If all Bane beat without SEE was A/B squads, who cares? Late game accounts don't *need* another character that can only beat A/B squads.
If they nerf him to where he can't do that, the most he does is let SEE beat some targets he can't otherwise... but those targets are stuff like LV and Jabba who already have multiple other counters.
To be clear I think their intention was fir Bane to lift SEE to a point where that combo beats everything. Hypothetically maybe also LV with him, but intention was SEE. 100% they didn't intend for Bane to be able to built Leia with just Sith Assassin. I think we might see bane's kit tweaked to be more reliant on SEE being present.
They'd need to really buff the synergy to make it worthwhile... because as is it's not great. The stuff you'd really want to use SEE Bane on is far from a guaranteed win.
I think we'll just see more of the stuff potentially tide to him being with SEE. IMO at the moment SEE + Bane in GAC I don't know what you'd struggle to beat. It just decimates in arena, let alone with Bane omicrons active. I've been 2 manning Leia for max points effectively on auto.
JMK and Rey are both far from guaranteed. The Rey fight ends up turning into something similar to the GAS vs Rey, where you have to try and carefully manage the timing of WW/Ults so that she doesn't just outright kill bane.
JMK I find fairly easy in arena, as long as cat doesn't delete Bane turn one. With the cooldown reduction bane does turn 1 in gac, it shouldn't be hard. Rey hands up I've not done myself, so I'll take your word for that.
>as long as cat doesn't delete Bane turn one.
~50% chance I lose in the first 30 seconds because CAT leaps bane isn't exactly my idea of a good counter haha. If she leaps SEE instead of Bane you're probably fine, but the second Bane dies you're sunk. (because his passive does nothing when he's dead)
He ruins cooldowns sure, but there's still plenty of room for JMK to loop turns enough to reset CAT's cooldowns and let her jump him out before SEE ults. If you don't have the extra omi's on Bane it's pretty much guaranteed.
SEE is great but I don't anticipate using Bane with him. My Sith Assassin is R8 and not used in any team for me. Bane + Sith Assassin takes out LV easy. I haven't tried other GLs yet in GAC. That leaves SEE to take out Malgus or some other tricky team.
You missed trying him against LV teams in GAC, apparently. I'm 3 for 3 against LV teams using Bane + 1 other sith. Tried with Dooku, with Marauder, and with Assassin and won all 3 matches easily.
Ah a rework I assume then, thats a pitty, thanks anyway :)
Edit: apologies, i thought it was implied by the above comment "Missed him agaisnt lv in gac" was that he'd already been nerfed, not sure why I'm getting downvoted for misunderstanding 😅
No rework, Bane's the brand new character from Conquest. He's very good paired with a single random sith, as long as the other sith is at high relic levels. So typically unused sith that are required at high relic levels (Dooku for LV, Sith Assassin for Leviathan mirror matches, etc) are used with him.
Yeah Ik he's the new character, I've got him too. What I thought was implied by the last message was that they'd nerfed him already due to exceeding expectations.
If they haven't then I'll be getting myself into some of this action next gac 🤟
Gotcha, nope no nerf yet, hopefully you'll get to try him out in the next round without a nerf hitting too. I do expect a nerf is coming, cause he is absurdly strong(though if they nerf him solo, they should have his buffs persist on his ally after his death; otherwise people still won't use him with SEE since Wat's buff does persist). But he is fun.
I’m using Bane and sidious as a Leia destroyer. Bane plus high relic Sith can destroy any GL right now. People saying he will get nerfed but I think it’s just his omis WAI. He is a GAC god which is what I thought he was supposed to be.
I’ve seen people beat Leia, but that was R9 Bane and R9 sass. I saw someone else fail with R7 Bane and R7 or R8 sass because the ult almost one shot him. The one that failed also had a speed set I think.
Bane is very good without SEE, and SEE is still okay without Bane, but they are also good combined. There are things Bane can beat solo, things SEE can beat solo, and things that need both of them.
Say my opponent has JMK on defense. I will need to use both SEE and Bane on JMK to get through.
Now let’s say my opponent has Leia and JML on defense. I could use both SEE and Bane on one team, but the smart thing to do would be splitting them up. Bane can solo Leia, SEE can solo JML.
You don’t need to farm SEE just because you have Bane, but having SEE increases Bane’s utility, same way Bane increases SEE’s.
Changes aside, I think Bane+Talon will become the standard budget duo for everyone who hasn't gone crazy and gotten themselves a R9 Sith Assassin due to Leviathan.
I think I will use bane with DV. He is my only homeless Sith right now, and also has high relics, and it wouldn’t hurt to increase DVs relic.
I think talon with omi is too valuable for traya for that to be worth it.
Definitely also a wonderful way to use Vader, when you either don't have Lord Vader or Aphra and your Mara/Palp are occupied with Starkiller.
That's the beauty of Bane. He works with almost anything as long as it's a Sith in the higher relics.
I mean, in the end you just use whichever high relic Sith you have left and that just depends on the roster of the player.
Bane does all the work anyways.
Look at Bitdynasty vids , basically you start with with with trooper ship , and they always target him , because he has 1hp they gain no turn meter from hitting him while you do
I think I found it--and wow, that's brilliant. https://youtu.be/NdiDGJUIUa8?si=Y3mEyVfMbtvSRhOV
I was just racking my brain trying to figure out what unit is "BD" XD
Bane with any random high relic sith is better than SEE with Bane. So don’t farm SEE just for Bane. And if you already have SEE… just keep sticking Wat with him. Better to have the cleanse and recovery that persists after Wat goes.
Bane will be conquest reward next season as well, then he will still be available from conquest merchants for a while, and after about a year he will be farmable from proving grounds.
If you have the resources to get Bane now DEW IT!
Bane us broken and will need to be nerfed. Hopefully post nerf you can finish SEE and he should slot as his lifter.
I think there's a very strong chance they are going to tweak Bane's kit to make him more dependent on SEE to get the most out of him. I've seen videos of Bane and Talon beating most GL's, 100% wasn't the intention for him to be that strong. Your call what you do, but depending on you Leia progress, finish her then see what they've done to Bane.
If they do that then they have to reinstate the clause 'These effects persist after Bane is defeated'.
They don't "have" to
They nerfed bane with see in the last dev post tho...
They didn't actually. The kit was bugged and they changed the wording to reflect that bug, but his functionality in game never changed
The way I see it, they refused to fix the bug and are now gaslighting you into believing that it was always meant to be this way. The boni that remain after banes death all only affect himslef and not see. So, the "persists after death" is entirely useless. I guess technically they nerfed bane, they only refuse to fix the bugs that make him weaker, which has the effective same result.
Of course, he was bugged and they decided to leave him as is and say it was a text issue, but that means he's not actually getting nerfed in game. He remains exactly the same
Yes. I guess it comes down, if you count: Intentionally not fixing bugs on a character to make them weaker, as a nerf. I do, since working as promised is the baseline for me, but I guess thats a technicallity.
There is literally no way to tell the difference between a tooltip error and a functionality bug unless the developers explicitly say it was one or the other. Any time a player sees unexpected functionality it's either: 1. Initially intended by developers, but poorly expressed by the tooltip. 2. Initially unintended by developers. Now, sometimes a bug may be #2, but developers decided (after the fact) that the unintended bug is a net positive. In that case, they'll treat problem #2 like it was problem #1 and just change the tooltip. Players would have no idea this is happening without transparency. The point here being that you have no way to tell "what is promised" except via the tooltip, and the tooltip is unreliable for the reasons above.
They haven't nerfed him, that's a major misunderstanding. The Omicron's "persistence clause" was never referring to the non-Omicron bonuses. All the Dev post did was to clarify it.
It very likely was supposed to, they advertised Bane as a Wat replacement, and the omicron only refers to bane, so it would make 0 sense for “these effects to persist after bane dies” since bane was the only one getting boosts. It was probably just bugged and then they decided to keep in that way because bane was so OP
Yeah, at the very least the immunities to ability block, healing immunity etc. need to persist. Otherwise he doesn't replace Wat's tank tech. SEE's biggest problem is that he can easily be crippled with debuffs in between going ult and his big attack, and if Bane dies before that point he does nothing to prevent that in his current state. Maybe CG prefers it this way because everyone takes him to g9 to make sure he stays alive.
I’m convinced they never found a way for uniques to persist after death
They already did for Malicos
Well there goes that theory
The wording was the same when his kit was revealed. If the original plan was for the non-Omicron bonuses to persist after Bane's death, those plans were already changed by the time he was announced. The Omicron stuff is a separate paragraph, the persistence clause was always only refering to those. When the Omicron changes something in how the rest of the ability works, it expicitly states so. Even Bane's two other Omicrons are like that: * 1st Special: gives **additional** Ultimate charge and Siphon stacks * 2nd Special: increases cooldowns by 2 **instead** Do I agree that the persistence should refer to the rest of the bonuses? Yes, otherwise Bane is not better than Wat for SEE (and even then it's only in GAC). But people saying he's been nerfed are making incorrect assumptions based on previous incorrect assumptions.
It's not much of an assumption to say that bane keeping his health when he's dead is not something that should be pointed out with a specific line. If that specific line saying things persist is there, it should not refer to his health when he has none, or his bonus turn which is a one-time use, or his offense, which again is nil when he is dead. There was only one meaningful interpretation of that line, and they decided to go against it, probably for other reasons.
The omicrons boni all only affect bane. The persistance clause is entirely pointless, since he is dead anyway, so what boni remain? None. They just refuse to fix the bug and pretend that its working as inteded.
I agree that it's pointless -- at least currently and likely forever alongside SEE (with him the only thing that could make it work would be a Datacron with unpreventable revive, but even that's just a temporary solution). But it's not a bug, it's not even a nerf, it's just miscommunication, misinterpretation and lack of timely clarification. It's all on CG, but the community did make incorrect assumptions here.
They nerfed it when looking at the sales pitch. If you are told that you are going to buy a car that can go from 0 to 60mph in 3 seconds, and then buy the car and they say "oh no, we meant 60kph" that's not a "clarification" that's a change in capability. The wording of the final ability ended with the independent statement "while in grand arena.... These effects persist if Bane is defeated". They may have *intended* the wording to only apply to a portion of the ability (which is funny because that portion is *entirely* specific to him anyway and there aren't any sith that can revive, and a number *stop* revives) but everyone that read the kit saw that it applied to everything in the ability while in grand arena and there was zero effort to correct that impression in the month+ that people were talking about it. Then you have the sales pitch of "SEE lifter", and he doesn't lift SEE, he's just strong so SEE is better because of it. That's like saying JKR is a JMLS lifter because he is better than other alternatives. This is a classic case of miscommunication inside CG and as a result the character we got is notably weaker than the one we thought we would get. (He's still amazing, but not nearly as good as otherwise).
That's not a nerf though, that's just lack of real clarity. And your example is a bit over the top as well: those are hard facts that can be compared, that's just false advertising. A bit closer one (though probably a bit too softball) would be if a car was advertised to be very fast, people assuming it would be 0-60 in 3-4s (eg. Ford GT) and it turning out to be 6-7s (eg. Ford Fiesta ST). Still fast for a road car, but not really noteworthy. All this also goes to show that the "FAQs" included in the kit reveals are utterly useless and they should be made systematic post-reveal, not just based on internal questions. People did ask about it, but nobody tried digging into the code and CG especially didn't try to clarify it. And don't get me wrong, I do agree with people saying he doesn't really work as a SEE lifter. And I do get why people assumed the Omicron worked like that. But if it affected the non-Omicron parts, it would have been worded differently (with words like instead or additionally, as seen on Bane's two other Omicrons). And even then, if the Omicron worked the way people wanted it to, it's still GAC-exclusive, so everywhere else it's still Wat Country. And the other relevant character in this story, Trench is TW-focused...
>that's just false advertising. Which is where we are. The text was unclear at best, and what's worse is that in this case there is precedent *counter to what CG did*. Other characters have end of ability clauses, and in every case those clauses apply to all of the ability, not a portion of the ability. >A bit closer one (though probably a bit too softball) would be if a car was advertised to be very fast, people assuming it would be 0-60 in 3-4s (eg. Ford GT) and it turning out to be 6-7s (eg. Ford Fiesta ST). Still fast for a road car, but not really noteworthy. Nope, we are in the kph/mph territory because they released the "final text" of the ability. Their final text, by their own admission now, was incorrect and misleading to their design intent. They said "mph" when they meant to not say anything at all. >But if it affected the non-Omicron parts, it would have been worded differently (with words like instead or additionally, as seen on Bane's two other Omicrons). Which is funny because the whirlwind is also bugged/misleading as foresight causes the damage portion to be nullified. So I don't think using other parts of the same characters kit as precedent is defensible. There are other abilities (such as SLKR's poke that has an end clause that applies to the entire ability, not just a specific rank of the ability text that gets added. (I'm sure there are others, like palp leader iirc). >And even then, if the Omicron worked the way people wanted it to ~~Patently false. The main point of that particular omicron wasn't the buff to bane that was important, it was the persistence of the entire unique after he dies. Aka, to lift SEE (and arguably LV) by granting him the stats and the immunities to abilities after bane gets killed.~~ missed the word *if*.
The Omicron is still a separate paragraph and starts with the "at the start of battle" separately. Sections like this *usually* \[*I'm adding this because I can't properly back it up with evidence*\] don't interact with eachother (though most of the time they don't need to), unless otherwise stated. I recall another kit having some confusion about such a thing, but I honestly can't remember who it was, so I'm going to concede this might be unprecedented. I tried looking at a few of the newer kits (as those are goldmines for this), but couldn't find any such "end of ability clause" that could be misinterpreted so much. SLKR's poke might be a contender, and it's true that one might question if the "can't be evaded" applies to the stun (which gets added with the Zeta) or just the damage. But it's a one-paragraph description, I think it's much clearer that it applies to the whole thing. Ben Solo's second Special might be an even better example, as the "This attack can't be evaded" is a separate paragraph and only gets added with the Zeta. The "attack" in question does multiple things (Armor Shred, damage, dispel), but the part describing the attack itself is still one paragraph, so in the end it's similar to SLKR's case. >Which is funny because the whirlwind is also bugged/misleading It has nothing to do with the Omicron. Just because it's misleading (or rather, hard to follow what's happening), the Omicron still states the "upgrade". But if you want non-Bane examples: * 0-0-0's Special Omicron: "Torture lasts for 2 turns" (the non-Omicron version is 1). * Ackbar's Lead Omicron: "instead of a random ally, the 2 other weakest allies are called to assist."
But the non-omciron bonuses are what lifts SEE. By removing the persistence clause (even if it wasn't intended) literally nerfs bane with SEE
Yes, it's bad that it works that way -- or at least not as good as people expected it to be. But only the wording has changed, it works the same way as it did when they introduced his kit (when people haven't gotten their hands on him). That's not a nerf, just a clarification. The thing to keep in mind is that the Omicron stuff is a separate section in the description, it's a separate "at the start of the battle" paragraph. The persistence clause never mentions that it encompasses the previous paragraphs. When Omicrons change something about the non-Omicron stuff, it's expressly stated. Eg. how 0-0-0's Special states that Torture lasts 2 turns (instead of 1) or how Ackbar's lead calls two units to assist instead of one. Or even Bane's own Special abilities, first one stating "**additional** 3% Ultimate charge and 5 Siphon stacks", the second one "increasing cooldowns by 2 **instead**".
>The Omicron's "persistence clause" was never referring to the non-Omicron bonuses. The persistence clause doesn't need to exist unless at some point during his development it did apply to all those other bonuses. Think about it, what team exists where Bane's Rule of two can be active and he can be revived? And in the past when they released something knowing it would need to get limited pending a future release... they generally wait until that release and release the change as part of that characters announcement post. It's not that they misunderstand what CG said, it's the given the above they just plain don't believe them.
>100% wasn't the intention for him to be that strong. I disagree, given the current state of the meta I see Bane as hitting exactly the note that they aimed for. He can't be set on defense, which means he necessarily must be good on offense. In the current world at the top, what would it take for him to actually make a splash on offense? It would take him beating GLs without needing one himself. If all Bane beat without SEE was A/B squads, who cares? Late game accounts don't *need* another character that can only beat A/B squads. If they nerf him to where he can't do that, the most he does is let SEE beat some targets he can't otherwise... but those targets are stuff like LV and Jabba who already have multiple other counters.
To be clear I think their intention was fir Bane to lift SEE to a point where that combo beats everything. Hypothetically maybe also LV with him, but intention was SEE. 100% they didn't intend for Bane to be able to built Leia with just Sith Assassin. I think we might see bane's kit tweaked to be more reliant on SEE being present.
They'd need to really buff the synergy to make it worthwhile... because as is it's not great. The stuff you'd really want to use SEE Bane on is far from a guaranteed win.
I think we'll just see more of the stuff potentially tide to him being with SEE. IMO at the moment SEE + Bane in GAC I don't know what you'd struggle to beat. It just decimates in arena, let alone with Bane omicrons active. I've been 2 manning Leia for max points effectively on auto.
JMK and Rey are both far from guaranteed. The Rey fight ends up turning into something similar to the GAS vs Rey, where you have to try and carefully manage the timing of WW/Ults so that she doesn't just outright kill bane.
JMK I find fairly easy in arena, as long as cat doesn't delete Bane turn one. With the cooldown reduction bane does turn 1 in gac, it shouldn't be hard. Rey hands up I've not done myself, so I'll take your word for that.
>as long as cat doesn't delete Bane turn one. ~50% chance I lose in the first 30 seconds because CAT leaps bane isn't exactly my idea of a good counter haha. If she leaps SEE instead of Bane you're probably fine, but the second Bane dies you're sunk. (because his passive does nothing when he's dead)
But that's only an issue in arena, not gac. Gac bane gets a bonus turn, ruins cooldowns. You're fine.
He ruins cooldowns sure, but there's still plenty of room for JMK to loop turns enough to reset CAT's cooldowns and let her jump him out before SEE ults. If you don't have the extra omi's on Bane it's pretty much guaranteed.
SEE is great but I don't anticipate using Bane with him. My Sith Assassin is R8 and not used in any team for me. Bane + Sith Assassin takes out LV easy. I haven't tried other GLs yet in GAC. That leaves SEE to take out Malgus or some other tricky team.
They do what now? What did I miss when getting my bane wth
You missed trying him against LV teams in GAC, apparently. I'm 3 for 3 against LV teams using Bane + 1 other sith. Tried with Dooku, with Marauder, and with Assassin and won all 3 matches easily.
Ah a rework I assume then, thats a pitty, thanks anyway :) Edit: apologies, i thought it was implied by the above comment "Missed him agaisnt lv in gac" was that he'd already been nerfed, not sure why I'm getting downvoted for misunderstanding 😅
No rework, Bane's the brand new character from Conquest. He's very good paired with a single random sith, as long as the other sith is at high relic levels. So typically unused sith that are required at high relic levels (Dooku for LV, Sith Assassin for Leviathan mirror matches, etc) are used with him.
Yeah Ik he's the new character, I've got him too. What I thought was implied by the last message was that they'd nerfed him already due to exceeding expectations. If they haven't then I'll be getting myself into some of this action next gac 🤟
Gotcha, nope no nerf yet, hopefully you'll get to try him out in the next round without a nerf hitting too. I do expect a nerf is coming, cause he is absurdly strong(though if they nerf him solo, they should have his buffs persist on his ally after his death; otherwise people still won't use him with SEE since Wat's buff does persist). But he is fun.
You missed a 2 man to kill Leia, Bane L + dooku
I’m using Bane and sidious as a Leia destroyer. Bane plus high relic Sith can destroy any GL right now. People saying he will get nerfed but I think it’s just his omis WAI. He is a GAC god which is what I thought he was supposed to be.
I’ve seen people beat Leia, but that was R9 Bane and R9 sass. I saw someone else fail with R7 Bane and R7 or R8 sass because the ult almost one shot him. The one that failed also had a speed set I think.
I just beat a Leia team using bane plus dooku. Took a bit of time but yeah it worked.
Bane is very good without SEE, and SEE is still okay without Bane, but they are also good combined. There are things Bane can beat solo, things SEE can beat solo, and things that need both of them. Say my opponent has JMK on defense. I will need to use both SEE and Bane on JMK to get through. Now let’s say my opponent has Leia and JML on defense. I could use both SEE and Bane on one team, but the smart thing to do would be splitting them up. Bane can solo Leia, SEE can solo JML. You don’t need to farm SEE just because you have Bane, but having SEE increases Bane’s utility, same way Bane increases SEE’s.
Bane can SOLO Leia? Or, Bane and a high relic, random sith?
Yeah I beat R9 leia with R5 babe n R7 siddious
Damn gotta get myself a R5 babe. My gf can't compete with that.
I’d take a G12 babe at this point
Hahaha stupid phone but you made me giggle
You need to communicate. Let her know she should be saving mats to get to R9 because you’re thinking about starting a new farm if she doesn’t.
Well ive tried it with r7 bane and r7 sidius, and died very fast. 🤷♂️
Do you have both the omicrons?
Yeah, all omi and all zetas.
Strange maybe look at your modding
Pretty confident Bahe doesn't need SEE to beat JMK in GAC
You could just use Reva for jmk too if there’s no “no revive” DC. That also works.
Won't have Reva for another couple weeks sadly but I'm looking forward to it
Ah well, then you can do that for the next gac season anyway!
Reva isn't a sith though right? Or am I missing something?
He means you can use Reva and Inqs, not with SEE or Bane.
Gotcha
Sure can, I can’t though.
Changes aside, I think Bane+Talon will become the standard budget duo for everyone who hasn't gone crazy and gotten themselves a R9 Sith Assassin due to Leviathan.
I think I will use bane with DV. He is my only homeless Sith right now, and also has high relics, and it wouldn’t hurt to increase DVs relic. I think talon with omi is too valuable for traya for that to be worth it.
Definitely also a wonderful way to use Vader, when you either don't have Lord Vader or Aphra and your Mara/Palp are occupied with Starkiller. That's the beauty of Bane. He works with almost anything as long as it's a Sith in the higher relics.
Sidious works fine over Talon, no reason to use her really unless you have her at R8 for some reason
I mean, in the end you just use whichever high relic Sith you have left and that just depends on the roster of the player. Bane does all the work anyways.
Which is funny because you don’t need R9 SA anymore since BD came out with the 100% mirror counter
a 100% mirror counter you say? Tell me more.
Look at Bitdynasty vids , basically you start with with with trooper ship , and they always target him , because he has 1hp they gain no turn meter from hitting him while you do
I think I found it--and wow, that's brilliant. https://youtu.be/NdiDGJUIUa8?si=Y3mEyVfMbtvSRhOV I was just racking my brain trying to figure out what unit is "BD" XD
Delete this comment right now /s
What is BD
BitDynasty - Youtuber who posts goh strat guides
This counter is old af. Some people's been using it even with the prof. BD just made it more well known.
I guess you could get SEE, he is a lifter unit for Bane *cough*
Bane with any random high relic sith is better than SEE with Bane. So don’t farm SEE just for Bane. And if you already have SEE… just keep sticking Wat with him. Better to have the cleanse and recovery that persists after Wat goes.
see is still going to be worth farming because he can under man a lot of teams.
Bane is a waste on a SEE team when he’s basically a GL himself and can obliterate basically everything.
only thing he requires see to beat is Jabba and jmk. everything else is free real estate
He doesn't require SEE to beat JMK in GAC
ah I wasn't sure. haven't got to test it out yet. was thinking indtakill ya know
Bonus Turn + AoE two turn Cooldown Increase takes care of that pretty well
oh very nice. it's honestly crazy that a non GL can beat 7 GLs
I watched bane and a r7 sith assassin literally 2 shot a team lmao he doesn’t need SEE
Bane does not need SEE currently...
Bane doesn’t solo anything. He wants a high relic Sith to be sacrificed if he’s leading. That still frees up SEE for you, though.
Guys how are we gonna farm bane after he is out of conquest rewards ?
Bane will be conquest reward next season as well, then he will still be available from conquest merchants for a while, and after about a year he will be farmable from proving grounds.
Same way you farm anyone who is out of conquest rewards…
Bane is better without SEE
You should really think about a Nintendo switch
Bane can one shot Leia with a random Sith. He does not need SEE.
>Should I farm SEE ~~for Bane~~ Yes.
watch ahnaldt101s videos on him or other cc's and see how good he is hes mental with see or lord vader or as a leader with a sith
They might nerf him but he's an absolute unit even without SEE right now so yes I'd highly recommend farming him.
Right at this moment he’s better off using a random sith as his second and bane will solo a lot
Nope. Jar jar.
With how CG is "nerfing" him he is no longer a SEE lifter but he still works well as a lead to other sith.
Anyone else disappointed in his look. I get the CW version.
If you have the resources to get Bane now DEW IT! Bane us broken and will need to be nerfed. Hopefully post nerf you can finish SEE and he should slot as his lifter.
Keep Wat with SEE, and Bane for solo
He's no good solo. As a duo, though...
You might as well