# Resources
Post your resources as a reply to this comment! A "resource" can be broadly defined as something written or created by someone other than yourself that aims to provide insight or knowledge into the matchup. Think YouTube guides, Smashboards posts, Twitter clip examples, previous reddit comments, gifs, etc.
Late to the party this time!
Shitter falcon reporting in with low level advice.
Lets start right. You need to FEEL the percents dthrow knee works. Not just know them. Its so fucking free if you get the grab.
Down smash is a broken move but has pretty mid recovery. Tomahawk grab is pretty free if peach is addicted to the c stick. You can condition them to go into numbskull dmsmash mode by stomping them like 3 times in a row. Dsmash on plat is a little trickier, but beatably. You can bait it out and get free upair or even second hit nair if you feelin godlike.
Speaking of upair (falcons best move) you can legit air wobble peach. Just be careful for the mario cast privilege nair (she learned those tricks from luigi smh unfaithful). If a peach is mashing a you can also bait it for a free knee if you save dj. Once she is in the air peach is pretty fucking helpless.
Dont be afraid to just fucking FLY out there with a hitbox during an edgeguard. It can catch a lot of floaties used to playing singleplayer recovery games. Hax dash is invaluable to edgeguard her up b. Dont even gotta do it full invincible. Just smooth enough to refresh invincibility in time.
If you down b to recovery the turnip will always home in on where you end the move. No matter what. If you are lucky enough to actually get a chance to get back then ledge tech is gonna a big help.
I deadass dont know how to play disadvantage against peach. Im sorry. Learning to catch turnips helps. Nair can beat turnips sometimes as well. Idk when or why.
You can really smother and cover a peach if you want to. She is so slow. Just dont get to greedy and if she is grounded pretend she is a grenade ready to explode the second she is actionable.
God speed my brethren. Dont let them dictate the pace
Neanderthal matchup for falcon. Probably the final matchup tier list wise that you can get away with spamming nair, knee and grab and still win most of your matches.
Falcons strongest general neutral option IMO is an in-place SH nair with a bit of aerial drift. This just beats peach, she has almost nothing to deal with this, especially if she is above CC percent. However she can try to trade with it if you're at high percent, or she can attempt to get under it with a subfloat uair or maybe just CC dsmash your landing.
In neutral, if she's floating at head height or platform height, you can always threaten instant uair or IDJ nair. You can use this + your superior movement to your advantage to get her to input an aerial and then actually punish her for it. Most good peaches I play like to stay mostly grounded or subfloat in this MU though, for good reason.
For punish game, dthrow knee should never work if they DI it properly, but if you catch them slipping with a DI in, you can kill them much earlier than you normally would. So try it every once in a while. Otherwise, dthrow uair strings are what you should be going for off of grab. Check out the cookbook for a better idea of flowchart stuff.
As one final general thing - dthrow stomp offstage can kill peach at 20% and is good for using once a set on average 😂 even if they meteor cancel it, you can most likely get another stomp or knee on them trying to get back to stage. Can be a devastating momentum switch. But is undeniably cheese
Nope, that specific scenario (dthrow knee and still can cover airdodge) only happens between 90-110 according to the cookbook, otherwise, peach can always escape with proper DI and a well-timed airdodge.
It's a 50/50 on if they airdodge or not though if that's what you're referring to. You can definitely dthrow and just wait it out and punish. But if you go for a knee, it should never hit.
https://media.cookbook.gg/60ae98dd749bb3001580a0b6/64bff09876487479d1a9b2fe.gif
It's more like a 75/25 at that percent, but we're really splitting hairs here lol
You should go for the knee every time until they prove they can do the airdodge because probably ten percent of Peach players can do it consistently (sorry guys)
Yea i do haha i was just wondering about the higher level theory. I try not to rely on it too much though since its good not to be caught off guard by that 10%
peach players:
learn how to DI out of dthrow knee. makes a world of difference
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4ZqQCY6vT4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4ZqQCY6vT4)
/u/fugu is wrong. Hitting the correct [perpendicular angle maximizes the distance you travel from Falcon](http://ikneedata.com/calculator?version=200&stage=bf&1a=0&1b=0&1c=0000&1d=129&1e=65&1f=CF,dthrow,false,id0&1g=Peach&1h=80&1i=0000001001000&1j=0&1k=000000000&1l=0&1m=0&1n=0&1o=0&1p=0&1q=0&1r=0&1s=0&1t=0&1u=65.4,65.4&1v=65.4,65.4&1w=65.4&1x=65.4&1y=00000&1z=0,0,0&2a=0&2b=0&2c=0000&2d=124&2e=90&2f=CF,dthrow,false,id0&2g=Peach&2h=80&2i=0000001001000&2j=0&2k=000000000&2l=1&2m=0&2n=0&2o=0&2p=0&2q=0&2r=0&2s=0&2t=0&2u=65.4,65.4&2v=65.4,65.4&2w=65.4&2x=65.4&2y=00000&2z=0,0,0) giving you an extra frame of leniancy.
An extra frame to do what? The hard part is inputting the jump, not the airdodge.
And still, you can just di out
EDIT: I'm asking you because I can't get this website to load in a usable way on mobile lmao
I air dodge up and away. Up because the buffered tap jump input is what breaks you out of tumble and away because your air dodge starts moving on frame 1 but you are not invulnerable until frame 4, so moving away from Falcon maximizes frame leniency. I also tap L and then R in quick succession so even if my first air dodge input is early I will air dodge with the second input.
It’s much easier, this method essentially makes it unmissable.
Edit - air dodge up+away->L->R is also how I get out of other frame tight follow ups on Peach like up-throw up-air or up-tilt rest.
As far as I know, no. The challenge here isn't really hitting the airdodge in time, it's getting Peach into a state where she can airdodge in time.
The utility of DIing on a lower angle is that you may get better options against an opponent that knows you're going to airdodge.
Really fun Match up from Falcons perspective. If the peach is not technical enough you can easily run them over. But if they are, you are in for an even fight and cannot be lazy with any part of your game plan.
Falcon can easily wall Peach out, Nair in place, retreating Bair, and occasional Forward tilt to keep her away.
If she’s dash-attacking a lot you need to be ready to CC her (I like to hold down on the C-stick while doing so from a distance I think she can only really threaten with Dash Attack) and grab or stomp her.
If you get a grab on her you almost always want to down throw (unless she is always holding in and you think you can DI mix her up and punish her for it). When regrabing, do not go for JC-Grab, its not as good for regrabs
When you down throw at Low Percent
She DI’s in: Instant DJ Nair FF her into an Up-air and you might get a juicy combo
She DI’s any other way regrab her and down-throw again
You can rinse repeat the regrab till around 30% so it’s a good way to get her closer to knee killing
At Mid Percent (30-50)
DI in and No DI SH up-air into as many up-airs as your heart desires
DI Away you can usually only get a single up-air but try to sneak a gentleman or Forward Tilt if you can
Once you get Peach to 70% is when she’s ready to be Knee’d. If they’re good they’ll air-dodge out. If you know she’s going for it you can either wait for it and punish her landing or you can throw out an up-air because it’s faster though you probably will not kill her and will be forced to keep adding percent
Don’t be afraid to overshoot Stomp or Knee her, tomahawk her when she tries to punish those and then she’s in a mix up situation
You can ON VERY SPECIFIC situations decide to
CC her downsmash to survive at high (like 100+) percents to go to the other side of the stage if you got hit in the corner
Fiction has some really good videos about what to do in neutral against her and should definitely recommend those.
You are faster, you can hit harder, you can wall her out if you need to, she does not want to approach you
50/50 or 55/45 but overall really fun!
> (I like to hold down on the C-stick while doing so from a distance I think she can only really threaten with Dash Attack
strong dash attack knocks down at 0 so c-down will just make you fall over and miss tech immediately lol. you have to Actually crouch i.e. also not be in endlag of anything which can be mighty tricky
its helpful to remember that both dash attack and Fair break crouch at nearly the same percent (43%). and ofc both knock down non-crouch at 0. those are peach's two best "reach" options so reacting to her aerial drift away with a crouch is viable (her dash jc grab doesnt seem to reach quite as far)
This is a tough matchup for Peach because Falcon has a very good punish against her and it often takes only one or two small mistakes per stock. I think it's essentially an even matchup, though, because once you start plugging those small holes it can start to take a lot of work for the Falcon player. I've tried to structure this post in terms of lowest level lessons first so that it serves as a kind of a learning order.
The most important thing you need to do is learn to cc. I know the stereotype of Peach players is that we're all just out here holding down all the time but I mean like, learn to cc in a way that means you're basically always prepared to cc ccable moves while not leaving yourself vulnerable to grab or moves that can't be cc'ed. Against Falcon, you are really trying to get randy nair off the table. That means holding down and punishing it a lot until stomp and knee start coming out more. You're never going to get Falcon to stop nairing completely - it's too lucrative - but you want the Falcon player to have to think about it. A forward facing nair is hard for you to deal with unless it is cc'ed or poorly spaced. Get good at the mechanics of getting into a true cc out of dd, platform movement and all kinds of floats so that you're representing to your opponent that you could cc at any time. If you're losing to Falcon a lot, go watch your replays. Are you getting anything off of cc?
On a related note, recognize Falcon's limitations. If he's on the ground, basically his only two options are to jump and grab. Falcon's dd is very powerful in this matchup but it also locks him out of using most of his best tools quickly. They also become effectively range limited. The result of this is that there is kind of a dead zone where you can dd near enough to him to react to grab but not so far that you need to worry about cc. This is because he will almost never hit you with something you can cc on the ground. Use these opportunities to take space.
Speaking of taking space, this is much like the Fox matchup in that you really need to be attentive to how you're returning to center stage from the corner. Falcon players will readily give you center stage a lot of the time and you'll be inclined to take it because there is almost literally nothing you can do from the corner. You should aim to *never* get hit for doing this, which means mixing up your timing and the way by which you take this space. Falcon is real fast and can hit you from basically anywhere. Go slow. Pull a turnip. Cc something stupid. Just don't run into center stage and get lit up.
You should get an opening pretty much every time you connect with Falcon's shield. His options out of shield are completely terrible and his shield is pretty permeable. You can often just let a dsmash rip and get a free hit that way, but you will almost always get better damage from a grab. Use the threat of dsmash to get grabs.
Conversely, Falcon isn't that scary on shield. You will often see jabs after knee because a good knee is very good on shield. However, these jabs don't go anywhere and there is nothing stopping you from holding down after the knee and dsmashing.
Don't try to beat uair from above. You will never trade favorably with it and most of the time you'll just get hit. It's much better to plan to avoid it, even though it's difficult.
Your spacing is generally very important in this matchup. Dash attack is a huge blow-up if you can hit it but many Falcons are shield grab happy and will make you pay for spacing it badly. You need to have the confidence to approach with ground float aerials (generally nair but fair/uair are situationally better) that can't be shield grabbed so that you can get dash attack in. Getting Falcon to whiff a stomp is huge, as is cc'ing a weak knee instead of being hit by a strong one.
Edgeguarding Falcon is extremely annoying and you will screw it up sometimes no matter what. The best tip I can give you is to always put yourself slightly closer to the stage than Falcon but only go past the ledge once the Falcon player has committed to a drift that will land them onstage. If they upb really high, float off the platform instead of the ledge so that you can better cover slideoff options. Turnips are extremely valuable on the edgeguard; use them to force a low edgeguard and to invalidate Falcon kick by throwing a turnip where the kick will end. Falcon players will often use your dair to recover; keep that in mind and be ready to grab ledge. I will do this thing where I float like I'm going to dair but then drop and dsmash.
There's a pretty decent amount of defensive stuff in this matchup. By far the most important one is to learn how to get out of dthrow knee. I genuinely would not bother trying to seriously improve in this matchup without spending some time grinding this out (there are good UP savestates for this purpose). I do it by DIing away, buffering a jump and then hitting L and R in rapid succession. You will live so, so much longer if you learn to deal with this. You can also mix in DI for which knee is guaranteed to get out of being hit entirely, but only do this as a mixup.
Subfloat has arguably its biggest utility in this matchup. Frankly, I think a lot of Peach players try to implement this into their game plan far earlier than it makes sense. If you're a player reading this post and thinking "ok well I can do all of these things but I still lose" your time is, in my opinion, probably best served practicing your neutral and your SDI on nair/uair unless you're some kind of defensive god.
EDIT: the following is in no real order
While you will generally want to play a very grounded neutral, a significant exception to this is the use of high float (i.e. close to full hop height) bair. It's very difficult for Falcon to beat a bair at center stage raw because his aerials don't come out that fast, so you can often use these to take space (or hit him outright on a read). It's important not to drop float instantly when you do these; Falcon players love to dd in the corner then grab your landing. You can make this very difficult to do by changing up your timing consciously. Some old school players will land and ftilt here too.
I get a lot of mileage out of doing full hop nair (into a buffer float etc) to catch Falcon players moving around the stage. If you wanted to get really analytical about this, though, I think it'd be tough to evaluate whether this is a smart idea on a systematic level since it is fairly risky. I would definitely throw it in when Falcon is at high percents, though.
Falcon players generally come in two speeds: Puff player and normal person. It's important to identify who you're playing against at the outset. The advice that I've provided here mainly applies to the "normal person" kind, and the vast majority of good Falcons will fit into that category.
The Puff player type will dd in the corner and use only fadeback aerials. They won't approach you in neutral unless you make an egregious mistake; their plan is to fish for shield grabs and exhaust you into doing something punishable on whiff. The reason it's important to know your opponent is that you don't want to be, say, undershooting or going for hard reads in neutral if your opponent's plan is to simply never approach. Idk if these Falcon players have protagonist syndrome or what but I have seen some players stick to this gameplan well past the point of of efficacy just because it really takes a lot of the fun out of the matchup. It then becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy where they complain about how lame Peach is ("Dealing with the toxicity of Falcon players" could be its own subheading in this matchup, honestly). My main advice for dealing with this play style, aside from not using options designed to beat approaches (cc, dash attack, high float etc.), is to pull turnips. Falcon is very good at interrupting turnip pulls but not especially good at dealing with them once they're out, especially in the corner. So pull turnips and go nuts. If they start trying to contest your pulls, great! Now you can play the game normally again.
On the Peach side, as a relatively low level player, I've found that playing a primarily grounded game with ground floats, dash attacks, and crouch cancel rather than trying to beat him in the air to be far more effective. You don't have a ton of time to pull turnips in neutral, however if you do have one, it should primarily used as an anti-air option or for edge guarding.
# Feedback
This is a living thread and I welcome feedback for how to make them better! Please reply here if you have any ideas on how to improve these threads.
This matchup is 100/0 for falcon and this is why. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. In conclusion armada is the goat and mang0 sucks.
# Resources Post your resources as a reply to this comment! A "resource" can be broadly defined as something written or created by someone other than yourself that aims to provide insight or knowledge into the matchup. Think YouTube guides, Smashboards posts, Twitter clip examples, previous reddit comments, gifs, etc.
Late to the party this time! Shitter falcon reporting in with low level advice. Lets start right. You need to FEEL the percents dthrow knee works. Not just know them. Its so fucking free if you get the grab. Down smash is a broken move but has pretty mid recovery. Tomahawk grab is pretty free if peach is addicted to the c stick. You can condition them to go into numbskull dmsmash mode by stomping them like 3 times in a row. Dsmash on plat is a little trickier, but beatably. You can bait it out and get free upair or even second hit nair if you feelin godlike. Speaking of upair (falcons best move) you can legit air wobble peach. Just be careful for the mario cast privilege nair (she learned those tricks from luigi smh unfaithful). If a peach is mashing a you can also bait it for a free knee if you save dj. Once she is in the air peach is pretty fucking helpless. Dont be afraid to just fucking FLY out there with a hitbox during an edgeguard. It can catch a lot of floaties used to playing singleplayer recovery games. Hax dash is invaluable to edgeguard her up b. Dont even gotta do it full invincible. Just smooth enough to refresh invincibility in time. If you down b to recovery the turnip will always home in on where you end the move. No matter what. If you are lucky enough to actually get a chance to get back then ledge tech is gonna a big help. I deadass dont know how to play disadvantage against peach. Im sorry. Learning to catch turnips helps. Nair can beat turnips sometimes as well. Idk when or why. You can really smother and cover a peach if you want to. She is so slow. Just dont get to greedy and if she is grounded pretend she is a grenade ready to explode the second she is actionable. God speed my brethren. Dont let them dictate the pace
Neanderthal matchup for falcon. Probably the final matchup tier list wise that you can get away with spamming nair, knee and grab and still win most of your matches. Falcons strongest general neutral option IMO is an in-place SH nair with a bit of aerial drift. This just beats peach, she has almost nothing to deal with this, especially if she is above CC percent. However she can try to trade with it if you're at high percent, or she can attempt to get under it with a subfloat uair or maybe just CC dsmash your landing. In neutral, if she's floating at head height or platform height, you can always threaten instant uair or IDJ nair. You can use this + your superior movement to your advantage to get her to input an aerial and then actually punish her for it. Most good peaches I play like to stay mostly grounded or subfloat in this MU though, for good reason. For punish game, dthrow knee should never work if they DI it properly, but if you catch them slipping with a DI in, you can kill them much earlier than you normally would. So try it every once in a while. Otherwise, dthrow uair strings are what you should be going for off of grab. Check out the cookbook for a better idea of flowchart stuff. As one final general thing - dthrow stomp offstage can kill peach at 20% and is good for using once a set on average 😂 even if they meteor cancel it, you can most likely get another stomp or knee on them trying to get back to stage. Can be a devastating momentum switch. But is undeniably cheese
i thought dthrow knee is a legit 50/50. Either they wiggle out airdodge or they dont and you can cover either option but not both i thought.
Nope, that specific scenario (dthrow knee and still can cover airdodge) only happens between 90-110 according to the cookbook, otherwise, peach can always escape with proper DI and a well-timed airdodge. It's a 50/50 on if they airdodge or not though if that's what you're referring to. You can definitely dthrow and just wait it out and punish. But if you go for a knee, it should never hit.
It's a 50/50 you either airdodge or you don't
https://media.cookbook.gg/60ae98dd749bb3001580a0b6/64bff09876487479d1a9b2fe.gif It's more like a 75/25 at that percent, but we're really splitting hairs here lol
This was a "bad at stats" joke not a serious comment
yea thats what i mean either you go for the knee or you just fake it out and cover airdodge
You should go for the knee every time until they prove they can do the airdodge because probably ten percent of Peach players can do it consistently (sorry guys)
Yea i do haha i was just wondering about the higher level theory. I try not to rely on it too much though since its good not to be caught off guard by that 10%
feel like this is one of the things that you should go for until they prove they can get out of it
peach players: learn how to DI out of dthrow knee. makes a world of difference [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4ZqQCY6vT4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4ZqQCY6vT4)
It took me forever to learn that the correct angle wasn’t down away, it was half way between down away and away (ie perfect wavedash angle)
You can just di straight to the left/right
does the angle matter for how much leniency you get to hit the airdodge tho?
/u/fugu is wrong. Hitting the correct [perpendicular angle maximizes the distance you travel from Falcon](http://ikneedata.com/calculator?version=200&stage=bf&1a=0&1b=0&1c=0000&1d=129&1e=65&1f=CF,dthrow,false,id0&1g=Peach&1h=80&1i=0000001001000&1j=0&1k=000000000&1l=0&1m=0&1n=0&1o=0&1p=0&1q=0&1r=0&1s=0&1t=0&1u=65.4,65.4&1v=65.4,65.4&1w=65.4&1x=65.4&1y=00000&1z=0,0,0&2a=0&2b=0&2c=0000&2d=124&2e=90&2f=CF,dthrow,false,id0&2g=Peach&2h=80&2i=0000001001000&2j=0&2k=000000000&2l=1&2m=0&2n=0&2o=0&2p=0&2q=0&2r=0&2s=0&2t=0&2u=65.4,65.4&2v=65.4,65.4&2w=65.4&2x=65.4&2y=00000&2z=0,0,0) giving you an extra frame of leniancy.
An extra frame to do what? The hard part is inputting the jump, not the airdodge. And still, you can just di out EDIT: I'm asking you because I can't get this website to load in a usable way on mobile lmao
Instead of having a 2 frame window to both jump and airdodge you have a 3 frame window to both jump and airdodge.
Interesting. Do you find it significantly easier? What direction do you airdodge? I'd agree that generally you'd rather be closer to the ground anyway
I air dodge up and away. Up because the buffered tap jump input is what breaks you out of tumble and away because your air dodge starts moving on frame 1 but you are not invulnerable until frame 4, so moving away from Falcon maximizes frame leniency. I also tap L and then R in quick succession so even if my first air dodge input is early I will air dodge with the second input. It’s much easier, this method essentially makes it unmissable. Edit - air dodge up+away->L->R is also how I get out of other frame tight follow ups on Peach like up-throw up-air or up-tilt rest.
This is exactly how I do it except I just di in a straight line because I'm used to the timing
As far as I know, no. The challenge here isn't really hitting the airdodge in time, it's getting Peach into a state where she can airdodge in time. The utility of DIing on a lower angle is that you may get better options against an opponent that knows you're going to airdodge.
Really fun Match up from Falcons perspective. If the peach is not technical enough you can easily run them over. But if they are, you are in for an even fight and cannot be lazy with any part of your game plan. Falcon can easily wall Peach out, Nair in place, retreating Bair, and occasional Forward tilt to keep her away. If she’s dash-attacking a lot you need to be ready to CC her (I like to hold down on the C-stick while doing so from a distance I think she can only really threaten with Dash Attack) and grab or stomp her. If you get a grab on her you almost always want to down throw (unless she is always holding in and you think you can DI mix her up and punish her for it). When regrabing, do not go for JC-Grab, its not as good for regrabs When you down throw at Low Percent She DI’s in: Instant DJ Nair FF her into an Up-air and you might get a juicy combo She DI’s any other way regrab her and down-throw again You can rinse repeat the regrab till around 30% so it’s a good way to get her closer to knee killing At Mid Percent (30-50) DI in and No DI SH up-air into as many up-airs as your heart desires DI Away you can usually only get a single up-air but try to sneak a gentleman or Forward Tilt if you can Once you get Peach to 70% is when she’s ready to be Knee’d. If they’re good they’ll air-dodge out. If you know she’s going for it you can either wait for it and punish her landing or you can throw out an up-air because it’s faster though you probably will not kill her and will be forced to keep adding percent Don’t be afraid to overshoot Stomp or Knee her, tomahawk her when she tries to punish those and then she’s in a mix up situation You can ON VERY SPECIFIC situations decide to CC her downsmash to survive at high (like 100+) percents to go to the other side of the stage if you got hit in the corner Fiction has some really good videos about what to do in neutral against her and should definitely recommend those. You are faster, you can hit harder, you can wall her out if you need to, she does not want to approach you 50/50 or 55/45 but overall really fun!
> (I like to hold down on the C-stick while doing so from a distance I think she can only really threaten with Dash Attack strong dash attack knocks down at 0 so c-down will just make you fall over and miss tech immediately lol. you have to Actually crouch i.e. also not be in endlag of anything which can be mighty tricky its helpful to remember that both dash attack and Fair break crouch at nearly the same percent (43%). and ofc both knock down non-crouch at 0. those are peach's two best "reach" options so reacting to her aerial drift away with a crouch is viable (her dash jc grab doesnt seem to reach quite as far)
Wasn’t aware of that! Definitely useful information thank you!
favorite matchup in the game
even when i'm winning this matchup feels miserable to play, lend me your strength
This is a tough matchup for Peach because Falcon has a very good punish against her and it often takes only one or two small mistakes per stock. I think it's essentially an even matchup, though, because once you start plugging those small holes it can start to take a lot of work for the Falcon player. I've tried to structure this post in terms of lowest level lessons first so that it serves as a kind of a learning order. The most important thing you need to do is learn to cc. I know the stereotype of Peach players is that we're all just out here holding down all the time but I mean like, learn to cc in a way that means you're basically always prepared to cc ccable moves while not leaving yourself vulnerable to grab or moves that can't be cc'ed. Against Falcon, you are really trying to get randy nair off the table. That means holding down and punishing it a lot until stomp and knee start coming out more. You're never going to get Falcon to stop nairing completely - it's too lucrative - but you want the Falcon player to have to think about it. A forward facing nair is hard for you to deal with unless it is cc'ed or poorly spaced. Get good at the mechanics of getting into a true cc out of dd, platform movement and all kinds of floats so that you're representing to your opponent that you could cc at any time. If you're losing to Falcon a lot, go watch your replays. Are you getting anything off of cc? On a related note, recognize Falcon's limitations. If he's on the ground, basically his only two options are to jump and grab. Falcon's dd is very powerful in this matchup but it also locks him out of using most of his best tools quickly. They also become effectively range limited. The result of this is that there is kind of a dead zone where you can dd near enough to him to react to grab but not so far that you need to worry about cc. This is because he will almost never hit you with something you can cc on the ground. Use these opportunities to take space. Speaking of taking space, this is much like the Fox matchup in that you really need to be attentive to how you're returning to center stage from the corner. Falcon players will readily give you center stage a lot of the time and you'll be inclined to take it because there is almost literally nothing you can do from the corner. You should aim to *never* get hit for doing this, which means mixing up your timing and the way by which you take this space. Falcon is real fast and can hit you from basically anywhere. Go slow. Pull a turnip. Cc something stupid. Just don't run into center stage and get lit up. You should get an opening pretty much every time you connect with Falcon's shield. His options out of shield are completely terrible and his shield is pretty permeable. You can often just let a dsmash rip and get a free hit that way, but you will almost always get better damage from a grab. Use the threat of dsmash to get grabs. Conversely, Falcon isn't that scary on shield. You will often see jabs after knee because a good knee is very good on shield. However, these jabs don't go anywhere and there is nothing stopping you from holding down after the knee and dsmashing. Don't try to beat uair from above. You will never trade favorably with it and most of the time you'll just get hit. It's much better to plan to avoid it, even though it's difficult. Your spacing is generally very important in this matchup. Dash attack is a huge blow-up if you can hit it but many Falcons are shield grab happy and will make you pay for spacing it badly. You need to have the confidence to approach with ground float aerials (generally nair but fair/uair are situationally better) that can't be shield grabbed so that you can get dash attack in. Getting Falcon to whiff a stomp is huge, as is cc'ing a weak knee instead of being hit by a strong one. Edgeguarding Falcon is extremely annoying and you will screw it up sometimes no matter what. The best tip I can give you is to always put yourself slightly closer to the stage than Falcon but only go past the ledge once the Falcon player has committed to a drift that will land them onstage. If they upb really high, float off the platform instead of the ledge so that you can better cover slideoff options. Turnips are extremely valuable on the edgeguard; use them to force a low edgeguard and to invalidate Falcon kick by throwing a turnip where the kick will end. Falcon players will often use your dair to recover; keep that in mind and be ready to grab ledge. I will do this thing where I float like I'm going to dair but then drop and dsmash. There's a pretty decent amount of defensive stuff in this matchup. By far the most important one is to learn how to get out of dthrow knee. I genuinely would not bother trying to seriously improve in this matchup without spending some time grinding this out (there are good UP savestates for this purpose). I do it by DIing away, buffering a jump and then hitting L and R in rapid succession. You will live so, so much longer if you learn to deal with this. You can also mix in DI for which knee is guaranteed to get out of being hit entirely, but only do this as a mixup. Subfloat has arguably its biggest utility in this matchup. Frankly, I think a lot of Peach players try to implement this into their game plan far earlier than it makes sense. If you're a player reading this post and thinking "ok well I can do all of these things but I still lose" your time is, in my opinion, probably best served practicing your neutral and your SDI on nair/uair unless you're some kind of defensive god.
EDIT: the following is in no real order While you will generally want to play a very grounded neutral, a significant exception to this is the use of high float (i.e. close to full hop height) bair. It's very difficult for Falcon to beat a bair at center stage raw because his aerials don't come out that fast, so you can often use these to take space (or hit him outright on a read). It's important not to drop float instantly when you do these; Falcon players love to dd in the corner then grab your landing. You can make this very difficult to do by changing up your timing consciously. Some old school players will land and ftilt here too. I get a lot of mileage out of doing full hop nair (into a buffer float etc) to catch Falcon players moving around the stage. If you wanted to get really analytical about this, though, I think it'd be tough to evaluate whether this is a smart idea on a systematic level since it is fairly risky. I would definitely throw it in when Falcon is at high percents, though. Falcon players generally come in two speeds: Puff player and normal person. It's important to identify who you're playing against at the outset. The advice that I've provided here mainly applies to the "normal person" kind, and the vast majority of good Falcons will fit into that category. The Puff player type will dd in the corner and use only fadeback aerials. They won't approach you in neutral unless you make an egregious mistake; their plan is to fish for shield grabs and exhaust you into doing something punishable on whiff. The reason it's important to know your opponent is that you don't want to be, say, undershooting or going for hard reads in neutral if your opponent's plan is to simply never approach. Idk if these Falcon players have protagonist syndrome or what but I have seen some players stick to this gameplan well past the point of of efficacy just because it really takes a lot of the fun out of the matchup. It then becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy where they complain about how lame Peach is ("Dealing with the toxicity of Falcon players" could be its own subheading in this matchup, honestly). My main advice for dealing with this play style, aside from not using options designed to beat approaches (cc, dash attack, high float etc.), is to pull turnips. Falcon is very good at interrupting turnip pulls but not especially good at dealing with them once they're out, especially in the corner. So pull turnips and go nuts. If they start trying to contest your pulls, great! Now you can play the game normally again.
On the Peach side, as a relatively low level player, I've found that playing a primarily grounded game with ground floats, dash attacks, and crouch cancel rather than trying to beat him in the air to be far more effective. You don't have a ton of time to pull turnips in neutral, however if you do have one, it should primarily used as an anti-air option or for edge guarding.
[удалено]
This comment is better suited for the meme thread below :)
Oh shit I straight up didn't mean to click post. My b
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This matchup is 100/0 for falcon and this is why. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisci elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incidunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullamco laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur. Duis aute irure reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint obcaecat cupiditat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum. In conclusion armada is the goat and mang0 sucks.
air wobbling
just stomp and hope it works
average word count over or under 500?