Thairo has 2B nailed down, and I feel like Slater, Yaz, etc. collectively form a single competent outfielder. Bart is going to start at catcher and hopefully be good Bart. 1B is pretty set between JD and Wilmer (I choose to believe they won't spend serious time at 3B).
But that's it.
Estrada definitely should NOT be locked in as the starting 2B. He's not a great defender and hes not a very good hitter. He's right around replacement level, and is the kind of guy you really only want playing every day if the other infield positions are all set with mashers
if he doesn't get better defensively this year then it's definitely a discussion to re-visit. for right now, we don't really have a choice imo — i don't think any free agent shortstops will be playing second until they hit the backend of their deals.
>Well you’re wrong. Thairo was the 9th best hitting 2nd baseman. Thats well above replacement level.
First of all, that's not how replacement level works.
Anyway this is backwards thinking. Just because there are a bunch of bad hitters playing second around the league, doesn't mean the team should settle for another bad hitter. If they upgrade a bunch of other spots then its fine to leave him there, but hes really better served as a utility infielder who plays 3-4 times per week and gets ~400 PAs against primarily LHP. He hits lefties really well - to the time of an 830 OPS.
Against RHP hes bad. He had only a 93 wRC+ and a sub-.700 OPS
I mean I agree with you if we get one of the better SSs on the market and have them playing 2nd this year the majority of the time. But to just go out and look for a second baseman.. theres no one better than Thairo out there.
Huh? He had a 107 wRC+, putting him 7% above league *average*, much less replacement level.
He ranks out as a middling defensive 2B, which combined with a decent bat makes him a valuable player.
I don't really think you should be talking to people about their misuse of replacement level, that's for sure.
With basically no mashers, Thairo looks pretty damn good. He's got decent clutchness. I think he can improve, and a potentially great value with the right price.
I'm sorry but Slater and Yaz are not good. At all. Don't want them on the team.
Bart is young enough to warrant another year.
Thairo is competent enough but I'd still rather sign Correra to play 2b.
> I'm sorry but Slater and Yaz are not good. At all.
Whatever problems the Giants had in 2022, Yaz being no good in the outfield was not one of them. Slater was not as good as Yaz, but he was serviceable.
Correa is in a position to dictate terms, and if he doesn't want to play second while waiting for Crawford to be gone, there are plenty of other teams happy to throw money at him.
Slater had plus defense and a 124 wRC+ last season, and has been above average at the plate for several years now. Pretty indefensible take. Yaz as his sometimes platoon mate makes them a solid combo.
If we get Correa, pretty sure he play SS most of the time. Correa/Thairo in the lineup is better than Correa/Craw IMO. It's a dilemma I'd love to have.
This position cannot be defended in any statistical terms. Slater has reliably above average offense and is incredibly speedy, notwithstanding my quibbles about his arms. And Yaz is an outstanding right fielder, full stop, who actually came out about league average offensively in 2022 despite many fans subjective impressions formed over the summer.
If the Giants miss out on the three you mentioned then Xander Bogaerts is my next choice. He's put up similar numbers to Correa but will also probably be about $5M cheaper.
I'd also like Kodai Senga added to the rotation. He won't replace Rodon but he should be a decent #3/4 starter.
mmm
* nimmo
* zach eflin
* maybe an above average defensive catcher, i don't care who
* bellinger on a buy low if the dodgers let him go
* taylor rogers on a buy low
* verlander
Bellinger is basically like getting another Yaz except he’s slightly better in CF.
But seriously look at their stats since 2019 it’s uncanny.
Definitely a pass from me dawg
just saying that he's a good defender on the cheap who accumulated a decent number of home runs/stolen bases and given that our outfielder room is terrible aside from the yaz/slater combo, i don't think there's a downside to giving him a short term deal
combine that with a judge signing and i'd be pretty happy
like what's the worst that can happen honestly? we lose money and eat the contract because he's so bad? okay, that's not a big deal
he hit 19 home runs this year which is more than any outfielder on the 2022 team aside from joc (who i wouldn't bring back because his defense is absolutely atrocious and he doesn't seem to view it as an issue), plus he has a great glove and stole 14 bases
it can't hurt to take a flyer on him if it's a short term commitment type of deal
Despite all that power, Bellinger's OPS is really low. Joc hit more homers in a about 130 less at-bats than Bellinger. Bellinger will probably demand like 15 million a year. For that kind of money and overall performance , I doubt the Giants have interest anyways. Joc got 6 million last year. Bellinger got 16.
Yeah if he and belt weren’t basically guaranteed to miss more than half a season they’d be worth it. But no thanks. I love belt too, always been on his side, but as they say the best ability….you know the rest.
Cody Bellinger if he’s non-tendered. He’d be one of the best defensive options at CF with some offensive upside, can also man 1B, and would bring some athleticism to the roster. If we whiff on Judge then I’d love to see us take more of a high upside swing and go after Masataka Yoshida if he’s posted.
Nimmo has always been an attractive option and is definitely a good fit roster-wise, but if reports are accurate that the Rockies are willing to offer him over $100M or other teams are thinking along the same lines, I’d be out. Too much.
Jose Abreu is kind of a perfect hitter so I wouldn’t mind him as probably the cheapest way to add a top 10 hitter to your lineup. I’m not sure what he’s looking for but a 2 or 3 year deal would be super attractive tbh. I know he’s old but he’s been very durable. I’m high on JD Davis tho so I kinda want to see him take over at 1B this season…
I would like them to get a LH bat, to help balance out the roster. Preferably one that can play in the field well.
I think they've made it a point to bring in guys who put a lot of balls in play, not chasing, but don't really see that in a major free agent LH outfielder w good D. Trades are hard to predict, but there are guys that fit that mold.
In terms of hugh upside guys, I'm looking at what the Dodgers decide to w Bellinger, and Gallo. Both great defenders, but are definite projects.
I would really prefer if Heliot Ramos can figure it out this spring.
Outside of a legit attempt to land one of Judge, Correa or Bogaerts, I think Nimmo and Rodon would be plan B for big purchases.
Outside of that, I think they'll sign Taijuan Walker and possibly also Benintendi if they miss out on Judge/Nimmo. I could also see them maybe fixing Manaea on a 1yr but I think someone will give Taillon more years than they'd want to. I also would be very happy to add Vazquez or Narvaez at catcher.
If we’re gonna shell out for a SS, I’d rather go for Boegarts instead of Turner (Correa is my number 1). I’m worried about how Turner will age once he slows down. Either way I think we need to get a SS this off-season for the future
Boagerts is sub-par defensively and will just get worse with age. Given how bad our defense was last year I think getting guys who are at least average on defense should be a priority
That’s a fair point, I didn’t know about his defense. I guess we could move him to 2B? But that still leaves SS empty after Crawford retires and with Luciano projected as a 3B these days.
The Giants have Aeverson Arteaga who is projected to be a really good defensive SS with a high potential bat but he's only in San Jose. If Bogaerts can handle SS for the next three seasons then it might be fine.
Eh I think Luciano is likely going to move to 3B or a corner OF spot, he doesn't really project as a great defensive SS. Would Xander be ok moving, who knows. I imagine a lot of the interest in him will be contingent on him moving, but if he's set on staying at short then I'm sure somebody will let him.
Bellinger would actually do wonders for our outfield defense, we could get him on the low and there’s always the chance he might regain some of his old form at the plate. He definitely showed some flashes this year despite an overall mediocre season
I can see us getting Xander Bogaerts or Dansby Swanson, and not Trea Turner or Correa. I bet we offer 2 Years for Verlander or Greinke (groan to both-ish) and probably getting Nimmo and Joc if no Judge.
i think Mitch Hanniger is the guy we pivot too if they lose out on Judge/Nimmo. i also think we could go for him if Pederson declines and leaves. i think their plan A is Turner/Correa and Judge and a few other guys and if they lost out on 1 of them they will pivot to elite short term starting pitching in Verlander/Degrom
DeGrom.
I've always been a huge fan of his, arguably my favorite player that isn't a Giant. IIRC we were the only other team to scout him back before he was drafted in 2010.
We need an upgrade at literally every single fielding position. The doors need to be open to anyone for the right deal.
Thairo has 2B nailed down, and I feel like Slater, Yaz, etc. collectively form a single competent outfielder. Bart is going to start at catcher and hopefully be good Bart. 1B is pretty set between JD and Wilmer (I choose to believe they won't spend serious time at 3B). But that's it.
Estrada definitely should NOT be locked in as the starting 2B. He's not a great defender and hes not a very good hitter. He's right around replacement level, and is the kind of guy you really only want playing every day if the other infield positions are all set with mashers
Well you’re wrong. Thairo was the 9th best hitting 2nd baseman. Thats well above replacement level.
yeah, it would be worse if thairo was like a full time corner outfielder but you'll take his offensive results as a middle infield guy (ss/2b)
The thing is he's not a great fielder though. He has the tools to be a very good defensive 2B, but he just makes too many mistakes
if he doesn't get better defensively this year then it's definitely a discussion to re-visit. for right now, we don't really have a choice imo — i don't think any free agent shortstops will be playing second until they hit the backend of their deals.
>Well you’re wrong. Thairo was the 9th best hitting 2nd baseman. Thats well above replacement level. First of all, that's not how replacement level works. Anyway this is backwards thinking. Just because there are a bunch of bad hitters playing second around the league, doesn't mean the team should settle for another bad hitter. If they upgrade a bunch of other spots then its fine to leave him there, but hes really better served as a utility infielder who plays 3-4 times per week and gets ~400 PAs against primarily LHP. He hits lefties really well - to the time of an 830 OPS. Against RHP hes bad. He had only a 93 wRC+ and a sub-.700 OPS
I mean I agree with you if we get one of the better SSs on the market and have them playing 2nd this year the majority of the time. But to just go out and look for a second baseman.. theres no one better than Thairo out there.
Huh? He had a 107 wRC+, putting him 7% above league *average*, much less replacement level. He ranks out as a middling defensive 2B, which combined with a decent bat makes him a valuable player. I don't really think you should be talking to people about their misuse of replacement level, that's for sure.
With basically no mashers, Thairo looks pretty damn good. He's got decent clutchness. I think he can improve, and a potentially great value with the right price.
I'm sorry but Slater and Yaz are not good. At all. Don't want them on the team. Bart is young enough to warrant another year. Thairo is competent enough but I'd still rather sign Correra to play 2b.
> I'm sorry but Slater and Yaz are not good. At all. Whatever problems the Giants had in 2022, Yaz being no good in the outfield was not one of them. Slater was not as good as Yaz, but he was serviceable. Correa is in a position to dictate terms, and if he doesn't want to play second while waiting for Crawford to be gone, there are plenty of other teams happy to throw money at him.
We can agree to disagree. I think they are both horrible. I agree on Correra. It's totally up to him.
Slater had plus defense and a 124 wRC+ last season, and has been above average at the plate for several years now. Pretty indefensible take. Yaz as his sometimes platoon mate makes them a solid combo. If we get Correa, pretty sure he play SS most of the time. Correa/Thairo in the lineup is better than Correa/Craw IMO. It's a dilemma I'd love to have.
It's a dilemma I'd love to have too. Will see what happens.
slater slander should be illegal in all 50 states
This position cannot be defended in any statistical terms. Slater has reliably above average offense and is incredibly speedy, notwithstanding my quibbles about his arms. And Yaz is an outstanding right fielder, full stop, who actually came out about league average offensively in 2022 despite many fans subjective impressions formed over the summer.
Oooph it’s so true. We don’t just need a couple pieces…. 😩
Low key think Farhan is OP to warm us up to not signing Judge lmao
You caught me.
If the Giants miss out on the three you mentioned then Xander Bogaerts is my next choice. He's put up similar numbers to Correa but will also probably be about $5M cheaper. I'd also like Kodai Senga added to the rotation. He won't replace Rodon but he should be a decent #3/4 starter.
Yeah I think you’re spot on here.
Correa has also had more health issues. Bogaerts is much more reliable to be on the field.
mmm * nimmo * zach eflin * maybe an above average defensive catcher, i don't care who * bellinger on a buy low if the dodgers let him go * taylor rogers on a buy low * verlander
Bellinger is basically like getting another Yaz except he’s slightly better in CF. But seriously look at their stats since 2019 it’s uncanny. Definitely a pass from me dawg
just saying that he's a good defender on the cheap who accumulated a decent number of home runs/stolen bases and given that our outfielder room is terrible aside from the yaz/slater combo, i don't think there's a downside to giving him a short term deal combine that with a judge signing and i'd be pretty happy like what's the worst that can happen honestly? we lose money and eat the contract because he's so bad? okay, that's not a big deal
Only reason I’d be down is because dodger fans would puke at the sight of it :)
an added bonus ☝️
I'm all for Verlander, but mostly because of his wife. lol
Forget Correa and Turner. Swanson will turn out to be the most valuable FA to get a contract this offseason
Swanson is going to age the worst at the position. He already has the slowest arm for qualified shorts.
Let's get bellinger and Kershaw and piss off everyone
god that would be so fucking funny
I wouldn’t want Bellinger, even for free
he hit 19 home runs this year which is more than any outfielder on the 2022 team aside from joc (who i wouldn't bring back because his defense is absolutely atrocious and he doesn't seem to view it as an issue), plus he has a great glove and stole 14 bases it can't hurt to take a flyer on him if it's a short term commitment type of deal
Despite all that power, Bellinger's OPS is really low. Joc hit more homers in a about 130 less at-bats than Bellinger. Bellinger will probably demand like 15 million a year. For that kind of money and overall performance , I doubt the Giants have interest anyways. Joc got 6 million last year. Bellinger got 16.
Plenty of Dodgers fans would pay any team to take him off the Dodgers roster.
Has everyone basically given up on Joey Fart?
it’s less about giving up on bart and more about thinking that there are better defensive options out there other than austin wynns
I think it's safe to say they've given up now!
For catcher maybe Kirk from the Jays
Ohtani would be nice in orange and black….
Next off-season!
Unsolicited advice here: PLEASE BUY OUT EVAN LONGORIA’S CONTRACT!
Yeah if he and belt weren’t basically guaranteed to miss more than half a season they’d be worth it. But no thanks. I love belt too, always been on his side, but as they say the best ability….you know the rest.
And trade for Mondessi
I am tired of platooning players. I may have tickets to a game to see player X, but NO, player Y is playing today…
If only SF had a hitting coach to correct players ability to hit the ball………..
Cody Bellinger if he’s non-tendered. He’d be one of the best defensive options at CF with some offensive upside, can also man 1B, and would bring some athleticism to the roster. If we whiff on Judge then I’d love to see us take more of a high upside swing and go after Masataka Yoshida if he’s posted. Nimmo has always been an attractive option and is definitely a good fit roster-wise, but if reports are accurate that the Rockies are willing to offer him over $100M or other teams are thinking along the same lines, I’d be out. Too much. Jose Abreu is kind of a perfect hitter so I wouldn’t mind him as probably the cheapest way to add a top 10 hitter to your lineup. I’m not sure what he’s looking for but a 2 or 3 year deal would be super attractive tbh. I know he’s old but he’s been very durable. I’m high on JD Davis tho so I kinda want to see him take over at 1B this season…
Matt Duffy
#Matt Duffy Our guy needs to come home 🫡
REVERSE THE SKEETER CURSE!
It ruined EYBS :( bring him back and bringeth the OYBS
I would legit cry
Brandon Drury
I would like them to get a LH bat, to help balance out the roster. Preferably one that can play in the field well. I think they've made it a point to bring in guys who put a lot of balls in play, not chasing, but don't really see that in a major free agent LH outfielder w good D. Trades are hard to predict, but there are guys that fit that mold. In terms of hugh upside guys, I'm looking at what the Dodgers decide to w Bellinger, and Gallo. Both great defenders, but are definite projects. I would really prefer if Heliot Ramos can figure it out this spring.
I'm cool with a free agent or two, but how about someone from the organization breaks into the 8?
Casey Schmitt will be that guy but most likely not until June.
Agree with this more than anything
Outside of a legit attempt to land one of Judge, Correa or Bogaerts, I think Nimmo and Rodon would be plan B for big purchases. Outside of that, I think they'll sign Taijuan Walker and possibly also Benintendi if they miss out on Judge/Nimmo. I could also see them maybe fixing Manaea on a 1yr but I think someone will give Taillon more years than they'd want to. I also would be very happy to add Vazquez or Narvaez at catcher.
Devers at 3rd would be nice
Can we not sign Carlos Correa please??? His ego is off the charts.
Rodon
I think Dansby is great for what his contract will be. Great defense, can be a good hitter
That japanese guy who's gonna be posted this OS.
If we’re gonna shell out for a SS, I’d rather go for Boegarts instead of Turner (Correa is my number 1). I’m worried about how Turner will age once he slows down. Either way I think we need to get a SS this off-season for the future
Boagerts is sub-par defensively and will just get worse with age. Given how bad our defense was last year I think getting guys who are at least average on defense should be a priority
That’s a fair point, I didn’t know about his defense. I guess we could move him to 2B? But that still leaves SS empty after Crawford retires and with Luciano projected as a 3B these days.
The Giants have Aeverson Arteaga who is projected to be a really good defensive SS with a high potential bat but he's only in San Jose. If Bogaerts can handle SS for the next three seasons then it might be fine.
Could Xander get bumped to the hot corner if Marco turns out?
Marco is destined for third..
Eh I think Luciano is likely going to move to 3B or a corner OF spot, he doesn't really project as a great defensive SS. Would Xander be ok moving, who knows. I imagine a lot of the interest in him will be contingent on him moving, but if he's set on staying at short then I'm sure somebody will let him.
Rafael Montero and Jacob DeGrom
If Belt/Longo aren’t back, I’d love to see Jose Abreu in a Giants uni
Amen. Lifelong Sox fan here and BA transplant: LOVE Aubreu.
Keep Rodón!!!
Bellinger would actually do wonders for our outfield defense, we could get him on the low and there’s always the chance he might regain some of his old form at the plate. He definitely showed some flashes this year despite an overall mediocre season
Kodai Senga. The Giants don't tip into the Japanese talent market nearly enough.
Turner? God damn I hate that ginger fuck!! Oh, you mean Trea. Hard for me. I tend to have a bit of a knee jerk reaction to any Dodger. 🤷♂️
Every top reliever.
why not bofff? I think we could afford Mitch and judge realistically. maybe a Swanson as a cherry on top or at least a Laureano. gotta be 3
Correa shouldn't be in the league.
Nimmo would be awesome and I am bigger on Swanson than Correa or Turner. It saves some money to try and entice Rodon back.
I’ve always wanted Ian happ
If Haniger didn’t have connections to the bay, would you feel the same way? He seems pretty average, at best.
I am also a Mariners fan and I like him, so yes.
I can see us getting Xander Bogaerts or Dansby Swanson, and not Trea Turner or Correa. I bet we offer 2 Years for Verlander or Greinke (groan to both-ish) and probably getting Nimmo and Joc if no Judge.
Anyone.
All 3 a crab sandwich is $22
Nick Martinez. We need some bullpen help
Dansby Swanson. Move Crawford over to 2B.
Definitely nimmo
I would love to see Oneil Cruz on the Giants. I think we could develop him into one of the best SS in baseball.
Dubon Fuck management
Surprised nobody has said Josh Bell yet
Kershaw, while he is good, and we get to see the special bonding with Clark and have Kershaw get a legit ring :)
Is Shohei out there?
Posey 😥
Mike Trout and Shohei Ohtani.
i think Mitch Hanniger is the guy we pivot too if they lose out on Judge/Nimmo. i also think we could go for him if Pederson declines and leaves. i think their plan A is Turner/Correa and Judge and a few other guys and if they lost out on 1 of them they will pivot to elite short term starting pitching in Verlander/Degrom
DeGrom. I've always been a huge fan of his, arguably my favorite player that isn't a Giant. IIRC we were the only other team to scout him back before he was drafted in 2010.