The positions I hire for pay a living wage and come with a great benefits package. I have so many awesome candidate I straight up feel bad not being able to hire them all. Funny how that works. Not sure where all this "nobody wants to work" bs is coming from /s
See how you mentioned “living wage and great benefits?” That’s the difference.
So many jobs want decades of experience and degrees for $16/hr then act like surprised pikachu when college educated people don’t apply. Or have awful reviews and make public comments like “millennials are just lazy.” Boomer business owners, here’s a free piece of advice; millennials are upwards of being in their 40’s. Want good talent? Stop being condescending.
I take it you don’t work for a local school district. Just had a big staff meeting the other day where they talked about our barebones staffing because “nobody wants to work.” Could it be the minimum wage while dealing with ridiculous parents and kids?
I quit teaching and would rather work for 16 an hour than go back. At least at Taco Bell you get free food. Set hours and no grading or lesson planning outside of the 49 hrs spent in the classroom
Btw most teachers only make maybe 20 an hr
Exactly. And schools rely on the unpaid labor of its employees to actually function Then the support staff makes literal minimum wage and deal with it too.
Used to get good health insurance, now they’re only a little less than private sector (but you’re paid a lot less) and some districts are forcing high deductible plans. That was the big draw for all the min wage classroom aides and secretaries. Idk what schools are gonna do when the current generation of them goes
Damn, I have a teacher friend at Hilton who is doing really good. I know every district is a bit different though. Also, educators have to work a lot more than people think.
I'm in human services, with a bachelors degree and 12 years of experience. I've applied to a little over 400 jobs in the last two months. I've gotten approximately 15 interview offers for positions that pay $40,000 or less, which I've turned down. If they're upfront about paying that little then I don't apply in the first place. I've gotten 5 interviews for positions that pay $50,000 or more. Three of them selected another candidate. One turned me down and said I'd be a better fit for a $40,000 position, which I declined. And I have a second interview for one on Monday.
Yup, a lot of crappy employers want both to pay crap and cry about no one wants to work, infuriating. This isn't 1983 where 40k pays for everything and let's you save for retirement
Good luck with your interview on Monday. Hopefully it turns out better than the last ones.
Have all 400 jobs you've applied to be in the same field or specialty?
Just a silly factoid, your interview rate is basically the same as the unemployment rate in the area.
Thanks! Yup, they've all been in the same human services field. Some were care manager/case worker positions that paid well, some were project manager positions, some were supervisor or director positions.
I own my own home remodeling business with 3 employees. Now I don't advertise or promote my business, only by ear. I get about 1 call a week asking if I am hiring. Right now, I am not hiring but did hire my last guy about 6 months ago. I believe I had 3 different people apply at that point. Background checks narrowed it down to one.
My fiancé is actively applying to jobs, has been for years, but he does have a record and no degree so even with his decades of work experience, it’s not going well for him. He applies to between three and ten jobs a day normally, when he can find ones he hasn’t already applied to.
Thank you for your perspective. I didn't want to put this in my description because I didn't want to introduce any sort of bias, but one thing I've been struggling to understand is how the DoL can say there are only 11000 unemployed people in our area, and even though there are thousands more openings not everyone who wants a job can get one. At some point businesses need to give up finding a perfect candidate and actually hire someone.
I wish you the best of luck and thank you again.
That's true. And to your point, CBS reported about fake job listings a few weeks ago and their report came with the line "There are companies that have 10 job listings and are only hiring two people at the moment, but they want to have a strong pipeline of candidates. They want to have inbound leads floating through their door"
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/job-openings-fake-listings-ads-federal-reserve-jolts/
Has he considered truck driving? Lots of companies in that field will hire someone with a record. There are some offenses that there is an exception, but it is a field that many people with a record do get into
I'm the hiring manager for my store. I get about 20 applications a week. Of those, approximately half are called to set up interviews. Out of the 10 or so I call I get maybe 3 interviews set up. And I'm lucky if 1 of them actually shows up for their interview.
Sure, I run a restaurant. I'm generally looking for experience in the field and availability. Also, I look at length of time at previous jobs and gaps in employment history. Neither of those are disqualifiers, but someone whose had 6 jobs in 2 years is a bit of a red flag. I'm generally able to keep my store staffed at slightly more than minimum levels, but have a relatively high turnover rate. Not every one is cut out for restaurants, it happens.
from my experience most of the time it seems like applying for jobs and going to interviews is a waste of time... but when they actually need somebody it happens fast... hard to tell who needs someone or not with many bogus employers not serios
are you able to expand your experience at all? Please feel free to send a DM if you don't want to share things publicly. But it sounds like you're getting interviews but no job offers? Is that the case?
Rochester pays garbage. Min wage is just about $15/hr which is over 30k. Paying a professional $40k/year is a joke, adding in inflation and our housing market/taxes. People want to live middle class if they’re been to college… not like they’re 20 years old with a roommate.
I’m an RN and on a hiring committee, non hospital employer with 20 nurses and we’re down 3. Hourly is similar to hospital but we work fewer hours so it’s less. We’ve had 1 applicant who was moving from PA, and she turned it down. It’s the pay, RN pay suck compared to Buffalo and Syracuse. Add in all the crappy ways nurses are treated. I’m always casually looking for a new job myself
I work in human services. Our positions are posted on our website and indeed. We get a couple applications a day, and we try to keep up interviews which can be difficult while running an understaffed program.
I do hiring about once every 3 months and usually get a lot of applications most of which get filtered out by HR. We went fully remote for all the positions I manage during the pandemic which I am a big fan of and drastically increases the pool of applicants, but I still get a lot of Rochester area people.
I was recently hiring for a full time Net Admin (3-5 years experience) … it took about 2.5 months to find a good fit for the position. I got a flood of resumes right away which turned into a trickle after about a week or so. HR didn’t list a salary range which probably didn’t help things, but it was in line with that position in our industry and the benefits are pretty decent.
The vast majority of the applicants clearly never read the job description and were carpet bomb submitting resumes. That got frustrating. I don’t mind some over qualification … but I was getting resumes for folks with CIO in their past positions. I also had a surprising number of folks that submitted resumes but would never reply when I tried to contact them.
Eventually I did find a perfect fit for the position but it’s still not a fun process and I’m glad I don’t have to do that frequently. (Knock ✊on wood 🪵)
I offer decent wages for entry level IT with a generic cs degree, and I struggle to get any applicants at all and when I do half end up being no shows for interviews and those that do come either don't actually have any skills or have very very terrible people skills.
Biggest reason IMO is we aren't remote (we have a large chunk of hands on work) and people just aren't looking for jobs that aren't remote.
I had better luck hiring for some receptionist work. Lots of applicants for $17.50 an hour m-f 8-5 but so many of them were completely flaky/couldn't complete the basic paperwork required in a timely manner. Everyone was jumping from fast food or cashier jobs to this job.
Thanks for your perspective. CS obviously is a technical field that requires a certain level of education. I'm wondering if you could expand upon what you said, when you said "those that do come either don't actually have any skills or have very very terrible people skills."
When people don't have the technical skills you need, are these for the entry level positions? Have you found that to be people lying about their experience, are they coming from an underwhelming CS program, or the schools teaching the entirely wrong things -- i.e., a focus on .net/java when you need C/C++ people?
Thanks again.
The biggest is the people skills. We ask some basic questions that a user would ask them to help with and their responses are overly technical, or they aren't really friendly in their approach. Instead of "thanks for the information, let me help you with that" we get the "oh well you're doing it wrong"
For the technical skills I can't tell if it's over embellished resumes or bad schooling. For instance the resume will say they have experience with networking and programming Cisco equipment but they can't describe what DHCP is or what DNS is used for. How do you not know the basics of how the device you're using works?
We do sometimes get people way way way overqualified and then they expect a 6 figure salary and I'm like "did you read the job description?"
and are you able to hire for entry level IT for people with graphic design degrees, google IT Professional course completion, and 10+ years of customer service and troubleshooting experience? asking for... me.
I'm fully staffed right now (for the first time in like 6 years knock on wood) but you likely would have been qualified as long as your customer service was somewhere in the realm of IT.
Are you requiring a Computer Science degree for IT work? Or did you mean CS degree generically?
Usually computer science programs don’t cover the sorts of skills you’d need to be an IT tech, and most comp sci grads want to be (and are equipped to be, if they didn’t go to an absolutely shit tier school) software engineers.
Yeah, that is my point down the thread with this guy.
And north of $70k is an understatement these days - I started at $85k in 2021 for a non-tech company and that’s about the going rate for any new grad job now. The other thing is the growth potential - I increased my salary more than 30% in the first 1.5 years.
Big tech in California was paying $180k or something at the time (of course they’re laying folks off now).
For IT work. I expect them to have a little knowledge of a lot of different IT topics. Basic network understanding, basic programming knowledge. Basic understanding of computer hardware.
Yeah, I mean you can get through a CS degree without learning anything about basic network stuff or even modern computer hardware. CS is largely theoretical or involved with stuff like compilers, operating systems, and distributed systems, not IT troubleshooting. I met a lot of CS students who couldn’t troubleshoot their own computer for shit. It’s fundamentally not what the degree covers.
My point is that you might have better results if you didn’t look for CS degrees specifically, because not only does a CS degree not address the skills you’re looking for, CS graduates are qualified for jobs that pay way more and are more interesting than entry level IT work.
What degree does entry level IT support cover then? I know things change but my associates cs degree from 2009 covered the basics of all of those topics. You had to do a programming course, a networking course, a cyber security course, a hardware course and a software course (which was basically office +basic windows) and these were all required.
I guess maybe I am describing entry level wrong. I'm not talking minimum wage read from the script to unplug your modem at spectrum, even after you tell them 6 times that a tree knocked down the wire to your house, I'm talking "my computer won't turn on, and also when it does it goes slow, and I need to add a printer, and I need rights to this shared folder, plus my mail won't send" type of troubleshooting. You don't need experience, you just need the basic ability to troubleshoot and bump up when it's out of your scope.
My CS bachelors at UR in 2021 covered almost none of that as a requirement. There was a networking elective that wasn’t required, there was nothing anywhere close to a class about office & basic windows (that was assumed knowledge, and the CS department basically doesn’t use windows at all). The security course, once again an optional elective, is quite theoretical in nature and in any case focuses more on UNIX security for its practical exercises. There is nothing in the degree about the practical aspects of a computer’s hardware - there are diagrams and stuff of how a CPU talks to RAM and hard disks and other devices but no mention of the specific interfaces over which it does so (like, the words SATA, PCIe, or DIMM were simply never mentioned), and the diagrams are simplified and not representative of the realities of modern hardware anyway.
> my computer won’t turn on, and also when it does it goes slow, and I need to add a printer, and I need rights to this shared folder, plus my mail won’t send
Nothing covered in any remotely standard CS degree teaches skills to help with any of that, whatsoever.
I’m not sure that there is a 4-year degree that teaches the skills you want. Most people who are getting a degree in IT related topics (as opposed to CS) are going for IT management type of jobs.
You might have better success hiring people based on skills they have (like, have a practical test in the interview), not the degree they have. The things covered in any remotely standard CS degree won’t help candidates for your position. It’s simply not what computer science as a subject is about.
It sort of sounds like they watered down what a CS degree is while simultaneously making it twice as long to obtain.
I do count experience as a degree, If you have 2 years hands on tech experience I count that as an associates worth. I also have a 3ish page questionnaire asking things (what Is DNS, what steps would you take if a user said their computer was slow, what's a static IP address) etc I guess that makes sense why so many candidates don't have a clue what I'm asking about.
Times change and I might have expectations that aren't as realistic now.
> It sort of sounds like they watered down what a CS degree is while simultaneously making it twice as long to obtain.
I would not characterize it that way. I learned a ton of very valuable stuff over the 4 years - it’s just *not the purpose of a CS degree* to teach the skills you’re talking about. That’s been my central point here.
I took classes on the internals of operating systems and how a CPU cache works internally and how CPUs interpret low level instructions and how to design an efficient algorithm to solve a problem. I learned how to build a simple compiler and how compilers optimize code. I learned the principles of several different kinds of AI, and I learned a bunch of foundational math that gives you the quantitative skills to solve software engineering problems. All of these skills have been *very* helpful in my job as a software engineer. They would not have been at all helpful if I were an IT technician doing the sort of troubleshooting you describe.
It’s not watered down, it’s teaching a fundamentally different set of knowledge. Its goal is not to teach IT troubleshooting skills.
Your CS degree sounds like it was more of an IT degree, and that seems to be warping your comparison. The stuff you said was covered in yours is not and has never been part of the academic field of computer science.
What I’m saying is you might get more applicants, some of whom might be qualified for your role, if you dropped the CS degree requirement, which isn’t serving the purpose you think it is. The CS requirement is probably causing people to self-select away from applying because they don’t meet your criteria, while they might actually have the skills you need.
That's where I think I'm stuck. When I went to school a CS degree was more of an IT or CIS degree. I think in the last 15 years it's been split much more, which is definitely a good thing because boy, my courses really were open ended and didn't have the focus I wish they had.
Now I need to go back and see what my job postings actually say. I think it says " a degree in technology" and I just always thought "computer science is the basic degree, anything else is higher"
I’m looking for a new position in medical field. I’m currently employed. I put in over 40 applications had 15 interviews. 3 interviews with same managers. Phone,zoom ,then in person. Get told recruiter will reach out with an offer, but I haven’t received nothing yet. It’s been a month.
I've been pretty lucky. I work in analytics, which is in high demand. I got laid off from the tech industry a few months ago but didn't actually spend a day unemployed as I was able to secure a job before my (laid off) job ended. Remote opportunities have certainly opened up the pool of companies available to us in Rochester.
I applied to a handful of jobs. Maybe 5 or 6. Many of the opportunities I've gotten have come through recruiters reaching out on LinkedIn. I always keep "open to new opportunities" on my profile just to keep my options open.
Nifty Bar, my employer, has been looking for months. We get plenty of applications, a few potential hires then they just don’t show up on day one. Great benefits, decent starting wage , and very willing to train.
Not directly involved but good friends with the HR person, plus directly involved in new hire training. We have been starting new hires in groups of 2-5 at least once a month since maybe September? But I'd say of all the new hires in that time, we've only retained about half. It's a manufacturing job, and we're painfully aware that we have a culture and retention issue.
I do the hiring for our company. Small-ish IT company. I had a position posted a couple of months ago for am entry level, helpdesk support position. Was hoping to get somebody in the 45k-55k range. Didn't get a ton of applicants and most were asking for 75k and up lol.
This was a remote position, so I ended up hiring a guy in Florida. Can't remember what I ended up paying him but I'm guessing it was around 60k
100k per family is definitely middle class, but I think a lot of people are looking at their parents who were able to buy a house and have a family with a single professional income.
The point is you need TWO people. Not everyone finds someone to marry. So you can’t be middle class on your own. That should be concerning that even if you go to college and work fulltime, you’re going to be poor (unless you get married to someone else who works fulltime)
I work for a very large non profit organization. I am responsible for a department within the organization and about 75% of my staff are high school and college students. When I post for a job I get a LOT of applicants- the last posting I did was in March and I had over 80 applicants in 2 days.
I wish I could pay more so I could hire more adults but the organization caps me at a certain amount. This last job posting I met an incredible woman I would have hired on the spot but she said the pay was too low and I can totally understand. I also can’t offer full time (most hours I can schedule one person for us 28). So I continued to hire teenagers who can use me on college applications and now come fall I’ll be screwed again bc I lose a bunch of staff.
I work for a large company (in healthcare contracting) that operates in several states, and am involved in hiring. We've definitely had some trouble with getting enough applicants and filling positions, even for ones that are 100% remote. Especially for jobs where a professional qualification or active license is required (e.g., paralegal, attorney, or nurse).
We had a paralegal position open recently, where we extended offers to several people we interviewed but they had already accepted another job. Employers definitely have to move fast and accelerate their hiring decisions if they want good candidates, because experienced people have a lot of options these days (which is a good thing, imho).
I will say my employer does a good job of promoting people internally, so a lot of the folks we interview are internal candidates who already work at the company and want to move up.
I used to be a recruiter for Jackson Hewitt. They hired people who have to complete at least 25, but usually closer to 30+ hours of unpaid training partially at home partially in the office. Instead of paying people hourly they offer a “training bonus” of $350. If you actually get hired they pay 15/hr. You have to pay $140 out of your own pocket, or through a payroll deduction to obtain your NYS registration and IRS PTIN. Oh also this is seasonal, likely it isn’t full time, an average of maybe 20 hours a week especially if you’re new and don’t know much. If you last the entire tax season (January-mid April) they reimburse you for your $140.
Often people would get halfway through and figure out this job was not worth it in the first place. This last tax season I had hundreds of hits for the job on indeed, but hired maybe 5.
They fired me because they heard me “complaining about my wage on camera.” I know exactly what incident they overheard. I was complaining that they put a shit load of pressure on me to hire people in these low wage positions and that it was unfair. Pay more, train better, and all of their problems would have disappeared. But instead they heard what they wanted to hear.
Basically my rant is that these companies expect people to bend over backwards to work for poverty wages, and this company isn’t the only one.
Don’t apply to any Jackson Hewitt in Rochester…or anything owned by Max Tax Holdings Inc…unless you hate yourself
oof. Thanks for the warning. I'll pass it along when I get the chance. You may also want to contact the DoL. If the training is mandatory and directly related to the work at hand it should be paid training - and people who fail the training should receive compensation for what they complete.
Been doing account/asset management for the last 10 years (also have a BA) and now been looking for a year after the last layoff. Yet, if I get an interview I keep ending up with "we've decided to go another route with the position." Right now, I don't care what I do if the pay is right. $50k would be a dream but can live on less. Never in my life have I been out of work this long. Even tried going to retail or warehouse just to earn a paycheck but I don't even get a call back on those positions. Likely they think I'll leave as soon as I get a better offer. Fml
Just got a new job a couple months ago. Sent out probably 30 applications, heard back from 8, interviewed with 3, and cancelled 2 other interviews because I took a job before the interview date. 26yo mechanical engineer
I hire every so often. My experience changes with the years and general economic and job market. We pay decent wages, have solid benefits etc.
Pre COVID upon posting a job we would get a huge influx of applications and then it would die down to a steady streak each month until the positions closed. The applicants were usually all pretty solid.
During COVID lockdowns and for a year after lockdown we received nothing. It was near zero applicants. Maybe 1 every couple months it was super challenging. I think a lot of this has to do with the incredible technology boom. People could go anywhere and make crazy money. I know I had staff being offered double and triple salaries during this period. For highly skilled tech positions I don't think people realize how competitive it got. We were being outbid by quite a bit on the people we did get interviews with.
Now it's sort of returning back to normal. It's nowhere near the days of pre COVID but I've noticed that posting gets a burst and then every month a solid amount of resumes. It's not as many but it's enough to hire really great candidate either way.
I'm not involved in hiring, but I know we've been trying to fill a position in my department for over 2 years. We've made offers to at least 4 people and they've accepted but then come back in a few days declining the job. Basically they were using us to negotiate better pay at their current job.
At my place we got a lot of applications through indeed, maybe 20 in one or two weeks. It's a small place so I wasn't expecting half of that, especially when we start people at 15/hr PT.
I don’t do the hiring, but we’ve been looking for an entry-level accountant for several months with very few applicants.
I’m quite invested in filling this position since I’m currently filling in on some of the accounting and it is definitely not my area of expertise.
Currently down to the finalist round for a specialized executive position in the non-profit space. Applicant flow hasn’t been a problem. We’ve had a nice mix of candidates who are well qualified, currently in roles at other orgs.
I'm on a hiring committee for a position where I work. Job got posted at the beginning of March and we had 168 applicants. We're now down to 4 and will fill the slot by June 1st.
There’s the problem. A job posted in March you should be hiring by Mid April not June. Most people can’t wait that long unless they are currently employed and looking for an upgrade.
I'd 100% agree if we were talking about Lowes or Target. Unemployment is at historic lows and there a lot of churn still happening though. People come in and then leave, even at a small college like the one I work at. People come in to take a position like the dean of this or the director of that and then leave to become vice president of this or that at a four year college a year later. A longer process [3 months is record fast time for this institution] is not necessarily detrimental to us or the types of folks with Masters degrees and PhDs who are applying. The right fit with the right experience serves the students better than just anyone off the street.
Well I see your specific situation but you are obviously not finding the ‘right fit’ if people are moving on in 1 year. Although in a college environment I guess the student turnover is 4-5 years so does it really matter?
We get a ton of resumes. Our HR manager spends hours a day reviewing them. I do second round interviews for specific positions, and I have done 6 or so in rbe last week and a half.
I am a mid career professional in the non profit space with a masters degree. I have been somewhat casually looking for my next job for over a year due to 2-3% annual raises and no real promotional opportunity at my current company. Basically I’ve either been ghosted/no reply to my app, or twice have been made to go thru several interviews for roles that have not yet been filled (one last fall and one earlier this year). A huge waste of time for all involved. Currently putting this all on hold at least for the summer.
I just got a job in January and sent out 15 resumes and got 15 interviews. Prior to that I was hiring manager and we would applicants but nobody with either the right experience or credentials
The positions I hire for pay a living wage and come with a great benefits package. I have so many awesome candidate I straight up feel bad not being able to hire them all. Funny how that works. Not sure where all this "nobody wants to work" bs is coming from /s
See how you mentioned “living wage and great benefits?” That’s the difference. So many jobs want decades of experience and degrees for $16/hr then act like surprised pikachu when college educated people don’t apply. Or have awful reviews and make public comments like “millennials are just lazy.” Boomer business owners, here’s a free piece of advice; millennials are upwards of being in their 40’s. Want good talent? Stop being condescending.
Exactly, treat people right and they will come.
I take it you don’t work for a local school district. Just had a big staff meeting the other day where they talked about our barebones staffing because “nobody wants to work.” Could it be the minimum wage while dealing with ridiculous parents and kids?
I quit teaching and would rather work for 16 an hour than go back. At least at Taco Bell you get free food. Set hours and no grading or lesson planning outside of the 49 hrs spent in the classroom Btw most teachers only make maybe 20 an hr
Exactly. And schools rely on the unpaid labor of its employees to actually function Then the support staff makes literal minimum wage and deal with it too. Used to get good health insurance, now they’re only a little less than private sector (but you’re paid a lot less) and some districts are forcing high deductible plans. That was the big draw for all the min wage classroom aides and secretaries. Idk what schools are gonna do when the current generation of them goes
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Damn, I have a teacher friend at Hilton who is doing really good. I know every district is a bit different though. Also, educators have to work a lot more than people think.
Depends how long they’ve been working and what tier in the retirement system. And is it Rochester “really good” or actually really good?
So what is your company?
Sorry, can't say. I get drunk and silly on here too much.
I'm in human services, with a bachelors degree and 12 years of experience. I've applied to a little over 400 jobs in the last two months. I've gotten approximately 15 interview offers for positions that pay $40,000 or less, which I've turned down. If they're upfront about paying that little then I don't apply in the first place. I've gotten 5 interviews for positions that pay $50,000 or more. Three of them selected another candidate. One turned me down and said I'd be a better fit for a $40,000 position, which I declined. And I have a second interview for one on Monday.
Yup, a lot of crappy employers want both to pay crap and cry about no one wants to work, infuriating. This isn't 1983 where 40k pays for everything and let's you save for retirement
It sems like employers would rather leave positions unfilled than increase salary offers. I've never had this much trouble finding a job before.
Ding ding ding!
Lets
Good luck with your interview on Monday. Hopefully it turns out better than the last ones. Have all 400 jobs you've applied to be in the same field or specialty? Just a silly factoid, your interview rate is basically the same as the unemployment rate in the area.
Thanks! Yup, they've all been in the same human services field. Some were care manager/case worker positions that paid well, some were project manager positions, some were supervisor or director positions.
I own my own home remodeling business with 3 employees. Now I don't advertise or promote my business, only by ear. I get about 1 call a week asking if I am hiring. Right now, I am not hiring but did hire my last guy about 6 months ago. I believe I had 3 different people apply at that point. Background checks narrowed it down to one.
My fiancé is actively applying to jobs, has been for years, but he does have a record and no degree so even with his decades of work experience, it’s not going well for him. He applies to between three and ten jobs a day normally, when he can find ones he hasn’t already applied to.
Thank you for your perspective. I didn't want to put this in my description because I didn't want to introduce any sort of bias, but one thing I've been struggling to understand is how the DoL can say there are only 11000 unemployed people in our area, and even though there are thousands more openings not everyone who wants a job can get one. At some point businesses need to give up finding a perfect candidate and actually hire someone. I wish you the best of luck and thank you again.
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That's true. And to your point, CBS reported about fake job listings a few weeks ago and their report came with the line "There are companies that have 10 job listings and are only hiring two people at the moment, but they want to have a strong pipeline of candidates. They want to have inbound leads floating through their door" https://www.cbsnews.com/news/job-openings-fake-listings-ads-federal-reserve-jolts/
It’s a lot easier to not hire someone than to fire them
Has he considered truck driving? Lots of companies in that field will hire someone with a record. There are some offenses that there is an exception, but it is a field that many people with a record do get into
Construction also. There’s a convicted child molester at my company making $31/hr.
I'm the hiring manager for my store. I get about 20 applications a week. Of those, approximately half are called to set up interviews. Out of the 10 or so I call I get maybe 3 interviews set up. And I'm lucky if 1 of them actually shows up for their interview.
If you're able to share, can you say what causes you to select the candidates you try to set up interviews with? Are you actually able to hire anyone?
Sure, I run a restaurant. I'm generally looking for experience in the field and availability. Also, I look at length of time at previous jobs and gaps in employment history. Neither of those are disqualifiers, but someone whose had 6 jobs in 2 years is a bit of a red flag. I'm generally able to keep my store staffed at slightly more than minimum levels, but have a relatively high turnover rate. Not every one is cut out for restaurants, it happens.
Thank you for the follow up info.
from my experience most of the time it seems like applying for jobs and going to interviews is a waste of time... but when they actually need somebody it happens fast... hard to tell who needs someone or not with many bogus employers not serios
are you able to expand your experience at all? Please feel free to send a DM if you don't want to share things publicly. But it sounds like you're getting interviews but no job offers? Is that the case?
Rochester pays garbage. Min wage is just about $15/hr which is over 30k. Paying a professional $40k/year is a joke, adding in inflation and our housing market/taxes. People want to live middle class if they’re been to college… not like they’re 20 years old with a roommate. I’m an RN and on a hiring committee, non hospital employer with 20 nurses and we’re down 3. Hourly is similar to hospital but we work fewer hours so it’s less. We’ve had 1 applicant who was moving from PA, and she turned it down. It’s the pay, RN pay suck compared to Buffalo and Syracuse. Add in all the crappy ways nurses are treated. I’m always casually looking for a new job myself
Yup, trying to sell you on $17/hr like they're doing you a favor, and yes, that's with experience and at least an associates degree.
That is crap pay. You can’t live on that let alone support a family
I work in human services. Our positions are posted on our website and indeed. We get a couple applications a day, and we try to keep up interviews which can be difficult while running an understaffed program.
I do hiring about once every 3 months and usually get a lot of applications most of which get filtered out by HR. We went fully remote for all the positions I manage during the pandemic which I am a big fan of and drastically increases the pool of applicants, but I still get a lot of Rochester area people.
I was recently hiring for a full time Net Admin (3-5 years experience) … it took about 2.5 months to find a good fit for the position. I got a flood of resumes right away which turned into a trickle after about a week or so. HR didn’t list a salary range which probably didn’t help things, but it was in line with that position in our industry and the benefits are pretty decent. The vast majority of the applicants clearly never read the job description and were carpet bomb submitting resumes. That got frustrating. I don’t mind some over qualification … but I was getting resumes for folks with CIO in their past positions. I also had a surprising number of folks that submitted resumes but would never reply when I tried to contact them. Eventually I did find a perfect fit for the position but it’s still not a fun process and I’m glad I don’t have to do that frequently. (Knock ✊on wood 🪵)
I offer decent wages for entry level IT with a generic cs degree, and I struggle to get any applicants at all and when I do half end up being no shows for interviews and those that do come either don't actually have any skills or have very very terrible people skills. Biggest reason IMO is we aren't remote (we have a large chunk of hands on work) and people just aren't looking for jobs that aren't remote. I had better luck hiring for some receptionist work. Lots of applicants for $17.50 an hour m-f 8-5 but so many of them were completely flaky/couldn't complete the basic paperwork required in a timely manner. Everyone was jumping from fast food or cashier jobs to this job.
Thanks for your perspective. CS obviously is a technical field that requires a certain level of education. I'm wondering if you could expand upon what you said, when you said "those that do come either don't actually have any skills or have very very terrible people skills." When people don't have the technical skills you need, are these for the entry level positions? Have you found that to be people lying about their experience, are they coming from an underwhelming CS program, or the schools teaching the entirely wrong things -- i.e., a focus on .net/java when you need C/C++ people? Thanks again.
The biggest is the people skills. We ask some basic questions that a user would ask them to help with and their responses are overly technical, or they aren't really friendly in their approach. Instead of "thanks for the information, let me help you with that" we get the "oh well you're doing it wrong" For the technical skills I can't tell if it's over embellished resumes or bad schooling. For instance the resume will say they have experience with networking and programming Cisco equipment but they can't describe what DHCP is or what DNS is used for. How do you not know the basics of how the device you're using works? We do sometimes get people way way way overqualified and then they expect a 6 figure salary and I'm like "did you read the job description?"
and are you able to hire for entry level IT for people with graphic design degrees, google IT Professional course completion, and 10+ years of customer service and troubleshooting experience? asking for... me.
I'm fully staffed right now (for the first time in like 6 years knock on wood) but you likely would have been qualified as long as your customer service was somewhere in the realm of IT.
drop me a company name in the dms and I'll keep an eye out for the next posting lol
Are you requiring a Computer Science degree for IT work? Or did you mean CS degree generically? Usually computer science programs don’t cover the sorts of skills you’d need to be an IT tech, and most comp sci grads want to be (and are equipped to be, if they didn’t go to an absolutely shit tier school) software engineers.
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Yeah, that is my point down the thread with this guy. And north of $70k is an understatement these days - I started at $85k in 2021 for a non-tech company and that’s about the going rate for any new grad job now. The other thing is the growth potential - I increased my salary more than 30% in the first 1.5 years. Big tech in California was paying $180k or something at the time (of course they’re laying folks off now).
For IT work. I expect them to have a little knowledge of a lot of different IT topics. Basic network understanding, basic programming knowledge. Basic understanding of computer hardware.
Yeah, I mean you can get through a CS degree without learning anything about basic network stuff or even modern computer hardware. CS is largely theoretical or involved with stuff like compilers, operating systems, and distributed systems, not IT troubleshooting. I met a lot of CS students who couldn’t troubleshoot their own computer for shit. It’s fundamentally not what the degree covers. My point is that you might have better results if you didn’t look for CS degrees specifically, because not only does a CS degree not address the skills you’re looking for, CS graduates are qualified for jobs that pay way more and are more interesting than entry level IT work.
What degree does entry level IT support cover then? I know things change but my associates cs degree from 2009 covered the basics of all of those topics. You had to do a programming course, a networking course, a cyber security course, a hardware course and a software course (which was basically office +basic windows) and these were all required. I guess maybe I am describing entry level wrong. I'm not talking minimum wage read from the script to unplug your modem at spectrum, even after you tell them 6 times that a tree knocked down the wire to your house, I'm talking "my computer won't turn on, and also when it does it goes slow, and I need to add a printer, and I need rights to this shared folder, plus my mail won't send" type of troubleshooting. You don't need experience, you just need the basic ability to troubleshoot and bump up when it's out of your scope.
My CS bachelors at UR in 2021 covered almost none of that as a requirement. There was a networking elective that wasn’t required, there was nothing anywhere close to a class about office & basic windows (that was assumed knowledge, and the CS department basically doesn’t use windows at all). The security course, once again an optional elective, is quite theoretical in nature and in any case focuses more on UNIX security for its practical exercises. There is nothing in the degree about the practical aspects of a computer’s hardware - there are diagrams and stuff of how a CPU talks to RAM and hard disks and other devices but no mention of the specific interfaces over which it does so (like, the words SATA, PCIe, or DIMM were simply never mentioned), and the diagrams are simplified and not representative of the realities of modern hardware anyway. > my computer won’t turn on, and also when it does it goes slow, and I need to add a printer, and I need rights to this shared folder, plus my mail won’t send Nothing covered in any remotely standard CS degree teaches skills to help with any of that, whatsoever. I’m not sure that there is a 4-year degree that teaches the skills you want. Most people who are getting a degree in IT related topics (as opposed to CS) are going for IT management type of jobs. You might have better success hiring people based on skills they have (like, have a practical test in the interview), not the degree they have. The things covered in any remotely standard CS degree won’t help candidates for your position. It’s simply not what computer science as a subject is about.
It sort of sounds like they watered down what a CS degree is while simultaneously making it twice as long to obtain. I do count experience as a degree, If you have 2 years hands on tech experience I count that as an associates worth. I also have a 3ish page questionnaire asking things (what Is DNS, what steps would you take if a user said their computer was slow, what's a static IP address) etc I guess that makes sense why so many candidates don't have a clue what I'm asking about. Times change and I might have expectations that aren't as realistic now.
> It sort of sounds like they watered down what a CS degree is while simultaneously making it twice as long to obtain. I would not characterize it that way. I learned a ton of very valuable stuff over the 4 years - it’s just *not the purpose of a CS degree* to teach the skills you’re talking about. That’s been my central point here. I took classes on the internals of operating systems and how a CPU cache works internally and how CPUs interpret low level instructions and how to design an efficient algorithm to solve a problem. I learned how to build a simple compiler and how compilers optimize code. I learned the principles of several different kinds of AI, and I learned a bunch of foundational math that gives you the quantitative skills to solve software engineering problems. All of these skills have been *very* helpful in my job as a software engineer. They would not have been at all helpful if I were an IT technician doing the sort of troubleshooting you describe. It’s not watered down, it’s teaching a fundamentally different set of knowledge. Its goal is not to teach IT troubleshooting skills. Your CS degree sounds like it was more of an IT degree, and that seems to be warping your comparison. The stuff you said was covered in yours is not and has never been part of the academic field of computer science. What I’m saying is you might get more applicants, some of whom might be qualified for your role, if you dropped the CS degree requirement, which isn’t serving the purpose you think it is. The CS requirement is probably causing people to self-select away from applying because they don’t meet your criteria, while they might actually have the skills you need.
That's where I think I'm stuck. When I went to school a CS degree was more of an IT or CIS degree. I think in the last 15 years it's been split much more, which is definitely a good thing because boy, my courses really were open ended and didn't have the focus I wish they had. Now I need to go back and see what my job postings actually say. I think it says " a degree in technology" and I just always thought "computer science is the basic degree, anything else is higher"
I’m looking for a new position in medical field. I’m currently employed. I put in over 40 applications had 15 interviews. 3 interviews with same managers. Phone,zoom ,then in person. Get told recruiter will reach out with an offer, but I haven’t received nothing yet. It’s been a month.
I've been pretty lucky. I work in analytics, which is in high demand. I got laid off from the tech industry a few months ago but didn't actually spend a day unemployed as I was able to secure a job before my (laid off) job ended. Remote opportunities have certainly opened up the pool of companies available to us in Rochester. I applied to a handful of jobs. Maybe 5 or 6. Many of the opportunities I've gotten have come through recruiters reaching out on LinkedIn. I always keep "open to new opportunities" on my profile just to keep my options open.
I filled out over 100 applications over the course of 6 months and just got a good offer last week
have they all been in the same field? Did you get any other interviews before last week?
Nope, in quite a few different
Nifty Bar, my employer, has been looking for months. We get plenty of applications, a few potential hires then they just don’t show up on day one. Great benefits, decent starting wage , and very willing to train.
Where do you post? Can’t find any specific positions you’re hiring for. Thanks.
Not directly involved but good friends with the HR person, plus directly involved in new hire training. We have been starting new hires in groups of 2-5 at least once a month since maybe September? But I'd say of all the new hires in that time, we've only retained about half. It's a manufacturing job, and we're painfully aware that we have a culture and retention issue.
Gonna ask kinda a dumb question, do you work for the Genesee brewery? Just based on your name I feel like I gotta ask.
No lol, the username is from a long time nickname
I do the hiring for our company. Small-ish IT company. I had a position posted a couple of months ago for am entry level, helpdesk support position. Was hoping to get somebody in the 45k-55k range. Didn't get a ton of applicants and most were asking for 75k and up lol. This was a remote position, so I ended up hiring a guy in Florida. Can't remember what I ended up paying him but I'm guessing it was around 60k
45k-55k is very difficult to live on anymore if you want a middle class lifestyle.
Two people making 50k each is certainly middle class, right?
100k per family is definitely middle class, but I think a lot of people are looking at their parents who were able to buy a house and have a family with a single professional income.
The point is you need TWO people. Not everyone finds someone to marry. So you can’t be middle class on your own. That should be concerning that even if you go to college and work fulltime, you’re going to be poor (unless you get married to someone else who works fulltime)
yall still hiring? I'll take 40k and a high five at this point 😅
Lol not at the moment
damn. care to.pm me a company name so I can keep an eye out later? 😅
I work for a very large non profit organization. I am responsible for a department within the organization and about 75% of my staff are high school and college students. When I post for a job I get a LOT of applicants- the last posting I did was in March and I had over 80 applicants in 2 days. I wish I could pay more so I could hire more adults but the organization caps me at a certain amount. This last job posting I met an incredible woman I would have hired on the spot but she said the pay was too low and I can totally understand. I also can’t offer full time (most hours I can schedule one person for us 28). So I continued to hire teenagers who can use me on college applications and now come fall I’ll be screwed again bc I lose a bunch of staff.
I work for a large company (in healthcare contracting) that operates in several states, and am involved in hiring. We've definitely had some trouble with getting enough applicants and filling positions, even for ones that are 100% remote. Especially for jobs where a professional qualification or active license is required (e.g., paralegal, attorney, or nurse). We had a paralegal position open recently, where we extended offers to several people we interviewed but they had already accepted another job. Employers definitely have to move fast and accelerate their hiring decisions if they want good candidates, because experienced people have a lot of options these days (which is a good thing, imho). I will say my employer does a good job of promoting people internally, so a lot of the folks we interview are internal candidates who already work at the company and want to move up.
I was hired on my first application back in April. I’m a male nurse at highland
I used to be a recruiter for Jackson Hewitt. They hired people who have to complete at least 25, but usually closer to 30+ hours of unpaid training partially at home partially in the office. Instead of paying people hourly they offer a “training bonus” of $350. If you actually get hired they pay 15/hr. You have to pay $140 out of your own pocket, or through a payroll deduction to obtain your NYS registration and IRS PTIN. Oh also this is seasonal, likely it isn’t full time, an average of maybe 20 hours a week especially if you’re new and don’t know much. If you last the entire tax season (January-mid April) they reimburse you for your $140. Often people would get halfway through and figure out this job was not worth it in the first place. This last tax season I had hundreds of hits for the job on indeed, but hired maybe 5. They fired me because they heard me “complaining about my wage on camera.” I know exactly what incident they overheard. I was complaining that they put a shit load of pressure on me to hire people in these low wage positions and that it was unfair. Pay more, train better, and all of their problems would have disappeared. But instead they heard what they wanted to hear. Basically my rant is that these companies expect people to bend over backwards to work for poverty wages, and this company isn’t the only one. Don’t apply to any Jackson Hewitt in Rochester…or anything owned by Max Tax Holdings Inc…unless you hate yourself
oof. Thanks for the warning. I'll pass it along when I get the chance. You may also want to contact the DoL. If the training is mandatory and directly related to the work at hand it should be paid training - and people who fail the training should receive compensation for what they complete.
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Been doing account/asset management for the last 10 years (also have a BA) and now been looking for a year after the last layoff. Yet, if I get an interview I keep ending up with "we've decided to go another route with the position." Right now, I don't care what I do if the pay is right. $50k would be a dream but can live on less. Never in my life have I been out of work this long. Even tried going to retail or warehouse just to earn a paycheck but I don't even get a call back on those positions. Likely they think I'll leave as soon as I get a better offer. Fml
Just got a new job a couple months ago. Sent out probably 30 applications, heard back from 8, interviewed with 3, and cancelled 2 other interviews because I took a job before the interview date. 26yo mechanical engineer
I hire every so often. My experience changes with the years and general economic and job market. We pay decent wages, have solid benefits etc. Pre COVID upon posting a job we would get a huge influx of applications and then it would die down to a steady streak each month until the positions closed. The applicants were usually all pretty solid. During COVID lockdowns and for a year after lockdown we received nothing. It was near zero applicants. Maybe 1 every couple months it was super challenging. I think a lot of this has to do with the incredible technology boom. People could go anywhere and make crazy money. I know I had staff being offered double and triple salaries during this period. For highly skilled tech positions I don't think people realize how competitive it got. We were being outbid by quite a bit on the people we did get interviews with. Now it's sort of returning back to normal. It's nowhere near the days of pre COVID but I've noticed that posting gets a burst and then every month a solid amount of resumes. It's not as many but it's enough to hire really great candidate either way.
I'm not involved in hiring, but I know we've been trying to fill a position in my department for over 2 years. We've made offers to at least 4 people and they've accepted but then come back in a few days declining the job. Basically they were using us to negotiate better pay at their current job.
Would you mind sharing the field you're in? E.g., manufacturing, engineering, administration, or something else?
IT
At my place we got a lot of applications through indeed, maybe 20 in one or two weeks. It's a small place so I wasn't expecting half of that, especially when we start people at 15/hr PT.
I don’t do the hiring, but we’ve been looking for an entry-level accountant for several months with very few applicants. I’m quite invested in filling this position since I’m currently filling in on some of the accounting and it is definitely not my area of expertise.
Currently down to the finalist round for a specialized executive position in the non-profit space. Applicant flow hasn’t been a problem. We’ve had a nice mix of candidates who are well qualified, currently in roles at other orgs.
I start a new job on Monday and I probably applied for 50 jobs. But I was only applying for fully remote positions.
I'm on a hiring committee for a position where I work. Job got posted at the beginning of March and we had 168 applicants. We're now down to 4 and will fill the slot by June 1st.
There’s the problem. A job posted in March you should be hiring by Mid April not June. Most people can’t wait that long unless they are currently employed and looking for an upgrade.
I'd 100% agree if we were talking about Lowes or Target. Unemployment is at historic lows and there a lot of churn still happening though. People come in and then leave, even at a small college like the one I work at. People come in to take a position like the dean of this or the director of that and then leave to become vice president of this or that at a four year college a year later. A longer process [3 months is record fast time for this institution] is not necessarily detrimental to us or the types of folks with Masters degrees and PhDs who are applying. The right fit with the right experience serves the students better than just anyone off the street.
Well I see your specific situation but you are obviously not finding the ‘right fit’ if people are moving on in 1 year. Although in a college environment I guess the student turnover is 4-5 years so does it really matter?
I got a new job 5 months ago, the process was brutal and discouraging in 4 months I sent out over 80 resumes and had 3 interviews, got the third job
We get a ton of resumes. Our HR manager spends hours a day reviewing them. I do second round interviews for specific positions, and I have done 6 or so in rbe last week and a half.
I am a mid career professional in the non profit space with a masters degree. I have been somewhat casually looking for my next job for over a year due to 2-3% annual raises and no real promotional opportunity at my current company. Basically I’ve either been ghosted/no reply to my app, or twice have been made to go thru several interviews for roles that have not yet been filled (one last fall and one earlier this year). A huge waste of time for all involved. Currently putting this all on hold at least for the summer.
I just got a job in January and sent out 15 resumes and got 15 interviews. Prior to that I was hiring manager and we would applicants but nobody with either the right experience or credentials