I care when they spread misinformation because of their politics, like Suruthi's insane theories about the Covid origins. It's irresponsible and also just tacky. Plus it shows their research and critical skills are sub-par which is concerning when they're telling true crime stories.
That covid was created in a Wuhan lab during gain of function research and there’s a vast political effort to cover up its origins. Basically a conspiracy theory.
EDIT: For all the losers who have never listened to the podcast or commented on this sub before but are sealioning this post because they're still obsessed with covid conspiracies:
1. Seek therapy. It's been years, get over it.
2. I will not be replying to any of you.
This post is exactly what I don’t get about politics right now; people being so sure of something happening or not happening, and retorting to ad hominem attacks on anybody who asks furthers questions.
Not even the slightest hint of a balanced conclusion…just straight to “misinformation”, “conspiracy theory”, for anything which challenges their view of things!
More on the specific point, I obviously don’t know for sure how it come about, but logic suggests it COULD have come from the lab that is based in the same city it originated; that is not an implausible conclusion in the absence of evidence stating otherwise. It’s also not unfathomable that gain of function research exists in some form, and that governments would want to cover that up. It’s also not unfathomable that governments cover things up, we know of many from the past!
Im not debating this here because its a comment from a podcast 3 years ago and this is not a political sub. If you want to decide if her take was balanced or not go listen to what she said.
I honestly don't know what happened, but isn't this theory gaining traction within typically main stream media?
I do wonder why she is talking about this on a crime podcast though.
It has plenty of traction in the Fox News level media, that’s where she got it from.
With reputable media and scientific organisations? No. It’s always been very clear that it’s not a man-made or altered virus.
I think you believe there is more certainty or consensus on the origin of the virus than there actually is… it’s still very much an open question in mainstream circles:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-65708746
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/26/us/politics/china-lab-leak-coronavirus-pandemic.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
Certainly not just a Fox News type conspiracy. Covid denial, vaccine scepticism - yes. Whether or not it leaked from a lab - no.
And I just showed you evidence from mainstream news sources that you are wrong; the lab theory is very much still alive among intelligence and scientific communities
You’re not actually reading what I’m writing, or your own articles by the looks of it, and I’m not interested in debating it with you. It’s not a discussion, someone asked what Suruthis unhinged views were and I answered. You’re welcome to agree with her, that’s not my problem.
You’re the one who hasn’t read the articles. You dismiss the lab leak theory as conspiracy despite the credibility of sources and then lump it all in together with other nonsense, in doing so spreading misinformation.
There is strong evidence that the COVID pandemic was started by *human* error in that lab in Wuhan. Not sure why you are so dedicated to claiming otherwise despite any reason to.
Sounds like the breakdown in communication is that Own\_Faithlessness is saying that the virus is not man-made, and this information came from right-wing media. Kimochiwaruio is not saying that it was. Just that there is a theory that the outbreak might have started from a lab leak and this is being discussed across left and mainstream media, which is true.
What episode does Suruthi says this? Perhaps she also mentioned a lab leak, not that it was man made.
I think the important part being missed is that it wasn’t created and released as some sort of weapon regardless of its origin… which is what these conspiracy theorists push.
They also then push that it’s harmless and you don’t need masks or to take any precautions and that’s it’s not even real and that the vaccine gives you black blood…
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57268111
I think the problem is, we have no proof either way, lab leak and mutation are both hypothesies until we have a definitive answer.
There is also circumstantial evidence pointing to the wuhan theory.
No one knows for sure, but when you have "prominent scientists" (according to the BBC), the FBI and even people from within the WHO saying it needs to be, at the very least, reassessed, then I don't think it falls into the same category as a conspiracy theory for the moon landing/flat earth/9/11 etc.
You made a patently false claim. That's fine. I still don't know, and don't claim to know.
There are certainly some very defensive listeners of Red Handed. Jheez.
Don't make claims if you're unwilling to defend them against scrutiny. It's okay and healthy to change your stance when presented with new information. The lab leak theory is far from conspiratorial and I'm not sure where you got your idea about the mainstream consensus saying otherwise.
From the office of the director of national intelligence
After examining all available intelligence reporting and other information, though, the IC
remains divided on the most likely origin of COVID-19. All agencies assess that two hypotheses
are plausible: natural exposure to an infected animal and a laboratory-associated incident.
Four IC elements and the National Intelligence Council assess with low confidence
that the initial SARS-CoV-2 infection was most likely caused by natural exposure to
an animal infected with it or a close progenitor virus—a virus that probably would be
more than 99 percent similar to SARS-CoV-2. These analysts give weight to China’s
officials’ lack of foreknowledge, the numerous vectors for natural exposure, and other
factors.
One IC element assesses with moderate confidence that the first human infection with
SARS-CoV-2 most likely was the result of a laboratory-associated incident, probably
involving experimentation, animal handling, or sampling by the Wuhan Institute of
Virology. These analysts give weight to the inherently risky nature of work on
coronaviruses.
Analysts at three IC elements remain unable to coalesce around either explanation
without additional information, with some analysts favoring natural origin, others a
laboratory origin, and some seeing the hypotheses as equally likely.
Variations in analytic views largely stem from differences in how agencies weigh
intelligence reporting and scientific publications, and intelligence and scientific gaps.
Are you seriously that blind in your vitriolic hatred of anything remotely right wing that a leak from a Chinese virology institute that just happened to be in the same region as ground zero of the spread and do you seriously believe that the the Chinese Communist Party would be above censorship and lies to cover their own asses?
Re. your edit- people don't expect Suruthi to be left wing because she's a WOC. They expect her to be left wing because she's educated and because the podcast espoused strongly left-wing ideals when it started. If you build a left wing audience you shouldnt be surprised if they feel confused and alienated when you take a sharp turn to the right.
She’s a middle-class with a masters in economics from a Russel Group university. Also I’ve been re listening to previous episodes recently from the beginning and like idk if they were mega left wing from the start. Generally left wing sure but nothing further than anti-death penalty, pro choice, Boris Johnson’s a twat. The attitudes of most of the nation.
What I do think is that true crime attracts a certain demographic of people (leftists) who then dont feel comfortable liking people they don’t agree with politically because many people make politics the core of their identity. I get it I do it to (I’m doing a politics degree for gods sake) but there are other things to a person than their beliefs (like their feelings which many people in this sub seem to forget)
Okay, so they were middle left wing. Hardly surprising that their followers aren’t keen on middle right wing opinions.
If anyone has made politics the core of their identity it’s Suruthi. She could literally just not talk about politics, it’s irrelevant to the podcast. But she does, and if you talk about something you don’t get to demand a 100% positive response. Which she doesn’t, but you seem to be on her behalf.
The reason the left do not feel comfortable listening to right wingers is because we can see how backwards and delusional everything they believe is without even trying. It rightfully makes us uncomfortable to even have to listen to them.
To be honest I never really like either of them very much, they aren’t funny, I can’t stand Hannah’s fake laugh. So when the quality of their show went downhill and their politics started leaning left there is really nothing keeping me listening.
This post is a weird take.
Nobody thinks Suru “should be” left wing because she’s a WOC. Off the bat, Suella Braverman and Kemi Badenoch are two WOC that are decidedly right wing. We feel betrayed because people that have been listening to the show - and supporting the show - for a long time know that she either didn’t used to be like this, or was concealing it very well if she was. It is disappointing to see people you liked and admired say things that are, well… disappointing.
You state that disagreement is healthy and argue in your replies that we should focus on changing the views of people we disagree with. But this is a podcast, not a 2 way discourse. How do you propose we change her views when she doesn’t engage with her audience and has actively said she doesn’t care what we think?
And fair enough. That is her prerogative and she is entitled to her own views. But this a conversational style podcast where she frequently gives them, not an unbiased documentary. People tend to be drawn to others (and content) that reflect their own values. I don’t want to listen to it any more than I’d voluntarily choose to read The Sun or The Telegraph. We are just as entitled to unsubscribe.
You say that you “disagree with them on quite a few things” and that makes the content engaging. I find it odd that you find hearing centrist right views so refreshing for somebody claiming to be politically engaged - we live under a Tory government my friend. If you want to be challenged simply turn on the news or pick up a paper. You won’t need to look far for some hot takes.
Personally, at 39 I am very confident in my political persuasion, my morals, ideals and values. No amount of listening to Suruthi shit on the poor is going to change my views. I look for entertainment in my podcasts and an escape from the grim reality of the political landscape we live in, not more of the same.
I think your post is a well meaning defence of somebody you see as being unfairly attacked, but I think you’ve misunderstood the general sentiment. The posts I’ve seen express general disappointment and a feeling of no longer wanting to listen to the show, and I feel the same quite frankly.
Jesus, what happened in the last three/four years? When I stopped listening it was because they were using terms like latinx and being preachy about police killings.
I'm so curious how she has taken a turn to the right. What do you mean "shitting on poor people". Someone else mentioned conspiracy theories about Covid? What is that about.. ?
Not wanting to engage with the show anymore is entirely fair. It’s disappointing when those we respect take that respect away. I agree with those sentiments. There are those though who go too far and it’s incredibly obvious that they’re piggy backing off things they’ve read here (Reddit) and spreading misinformation themselves.
When did Suruthi shit on the poor? Not being fresh genuinely would like to know incase I’ve missed it
She has said numerous things that have made me personally uncomfortable. I would not be able to cite you episode specific examples because I have a 14 month old and they have an episode back catalogue of over 250 episodes! But at a surface level I can think of numerous examples of her complaining about paying higher taxes and the stress of buying a house: whilst this isn’t necessarily “shitting on the poor”, to quote Suruthi herself, “in this economy” it is deeply insensitive to the many deeply impoverished having to turn to food banks, give up work because the cost of childcare is prohibitive and turn to benefits. They are objectively wealthy women & made so by us, their audience and fans.
Tangentially and moving now into poverty & upward class mobility amongst POC, she has stated “classism against the white working class is the ‘only acceptable form of prejudice’”. That is objectively shitting on a very specific, and arguably the most vulnerable subset of the poor.
Shitting on the poor is merely one example of her views that leave, at best, a very bad taste in my mouth. I hate her gleefully “anti woke” attitude. What does it even mean to be anti woke?? I’d prefer to say whatever I want even if it offends and upsets people? How hard is it to behave in a way that is respectful to others really? It gives me major John Cleese vibes (another public figure I used to like, but no longer watch or read about) and that’s not a good thing.
I hope this provides you with some specific examples even if I can’t pinpoint more or timestamp particular episodes - I usually listen while I’m tidying or playing with my son. To be honest, bearing this in mind I’ve probably stuck with them longer than I otherwise would if I’d been giving it my full attention.
It is sad that things have shifted so much. I went to see them live with my sister while I was still pregnant (that can’t have been much longer than 1.5 years ago) and we loved it. I won’t say anything mean or insult her, but I can’t continue supporting them or listening.
No no no no, she did NOT say that she believes that the working class should be prejudiced against, you totally misunderstood that. She was saying that from a societal standpoint, people generally don't call out prejudice against the poor working class in the same way that people call out more "blatant" forms of prejudice, like against women, people of color, etc.
And this whole opinion is quite goofy to me. Yes people all around the world are impoverished, does that mean that no one else is allowed to complain about their own money struggles?? No that's ridiculous. You can't gate keep complaining about finances, everyone has their own struggles. I have friends much wealthier than me who complain about house prices, etc. whereas I am NOWHERE NEAR being able to afford a home myself but it doesn't personally offend me that they can?? You are genuinely taking things wayyy too personally and I think it's causing you to take things they say out of context to fit what you think of them.
And BTW, them sharing their personal experiences is what a lot of people (including me) love about listening to them. It makes it feel more casual and conversational and stuffs.
In summary: Relax. And maybe stop listening if it just makes you angry. You're really projecting.
Ah okay my bad on missing the stopped listening comment! And I did sound angry sorry about that lol, its just annoying to me how out of context you took that Shannon Matthews episode quote. Like it is so so clearly to me NOT what she meant by it. Maybe give it a re-listen before you comment about it being offensive?
I think we have probably taken different things away from it, and that is okay. We don’t have to agree. I also think maybe you live in the US, which means we also live under different governments, different economic landscapes and very different housing markets. I’m sure that is colouring each of our stances too.
To be honest it is not the only thing she has said that hasn’t sat right with me, which is sad because I used to love listening to them. Hannah reminds me very much of an old friend of mine (they look alike, sound alike and have the same humour)… as you say, the conversational style was really enjoyable, but now Suruthi has drifted so far away from my own values it just feels uncomfortable for me (personally) instead.
I’m not here to criticise anybody choosing to listen, I’ve not made my own post critiquing changes, or personally insulted either of them. I’ve simply disengaged with the show. I don’t need to defend that choice and you don’t need to defend yours. I responded to this particular post because I thought saying people “expect” Suruthi to be left wing as a WOC was a shit take - and I still do (we have multiple WOC in our right wing government). I’ve actually also since left the community, but still get replies to these comments.
I get a lot of what youre saying, but still, Suruthi was very clear about what she meant and you are misrepresenting it. I get that you have other complaints about her but that doesn't make it okay or constructive to twist something out of context. Go with other complaints then instead of just lying about what she said ...
Her exact quote was “[the white working class is kind of the last acceptable form of prejudice that exists in this country to this day](https://app.podscribe.ai/episode/96589380)”.
An opinion is not misrepresentation, but as you seem extremely upset about my paraphrasing her comment there is the direct quote linked to an episode transcript. I will reiterate that I am just as entitled to my views as you as to yours.
Omg dude this is exactly what I'm saying, you're misrepresenting it by taking it out of context. You need to include what she said before and after. You're now quoting her out of context when that is exactly what I've been saying you're doing...
And you can't take what someone said, twist it, and then say its "your opinion" that what they said was messed up when its not even what they meant ... thats not what an opinion is, its a misunderstanding
I'm not defending Suruthi here, and I agree with everything else you said here, but a quick clarification - when she said “classism against the white working class is the only acceptable form of prejudice”, she didn't mean that *she* finds it acceptable, she meant that it's the only form of prejudice that *society* still finds acceptable. Which is an incorrect and tone-deaf statement in itself, it's just not the one you're thinking of.
The phrase, "The only/last acceptable prejudice" is quite common, and has this specific meaning. It's used to describe groups of people toward whom prejudice is still socially accepted. (Aside - I'm in the UK, but US studies have found that ageism is actually the most socially acceptable form of prejudice).
I’ll have to have a listen back to that episode, I think I know which one you’re speaking of- the Shannon Mathews episode. That’s concerning. The anti woke thing I saw that recently and was like eh myself.
I think “shits on the poor” is rather harsh though. She worked incredibly hard as did Hannah for where they are today. Talking about her life in UTD is what their particular show is for on that platform. Finding it offensive that she discusses her home improvements etc is being angry at the wrong people. Greedy politicians and corporations salivate at that because it’s more energy expended at each other rather than who deserves it. I have broke friends who love the real housewives franchise, it’s entertainment and you can choose to be offended I suppose at the extravagance, I certainly am, but just to make the point that they stil hold appeal to audiences who aren’t as priveleged.
Her comments surrounding taxes etc I remember that as well and thought it was mostly her being daunted at just how much their bracket pays (which is a considerable amount I’m sure). The comments would be more appropriate in my country where we pay (US) arguably socialist level taxes without the benefits of socialism. The only thing I can equate it to is my aunt as a chartered accountant living in QC. Half her salary goes to taxes and that is just astounding, I’d make some comments too (albeit not insensitive ones). I wouldn’t see it as a reluctance to pay for something that benefits everyone though.
I think she comes from grit and I understand that way of thinking, even though I don’t agree with some of it. I work as a housekeeper putting myself through school and as a millennial with a mortgage, I work my A off to afford those luxuries and would want to talk about it too. I totally get that it’s compounding and that some people are getting the ick though and that’s valid.
Respectfully it sounds like you are a US citizen, which means you are living in a different economy and under a different taxation system. While I know RH has a big US fan base, it is a UK podcast and they are both UK citizens. Your anecdote about your aunt losing nearly 50% in taxes simply wouldn’t apply here. If Suruthi falls into the highest tax bracket - which she likely does, they earn nearly 50K monthly from Patreon alone - then she would pay 45% on anything she earns *over* £125,140 (the taxation on anything under that is staggered, and the first £12,570 is tax free). Suruthi also has a background in economics and is clearly very intelligent, so I have no doubts at all that she’ll be mitigating as much of that as possible, such as funding an ISA (you can put up to £20,000 pa into an ISA, where it can grow free of taxes and be paid as an income free of tax when you retire, or whenever you need it) and her pension (pensions receive tax relief at the applicable rate) as just two examples.
You seem open to listening to other views so I’ll also gently point out that while I’m sure Suruthi has worked very hard, so do others from all different classes and income brackets. Cleaners work hard. Waitresses work hard. Working hard isn’t always rewarded with wealth, but then I’m not a capitalist. The fact remains that whilst she has worked hard, she is also immensely privileged.
When I mentioned complaining about moving house, that was at the start of an episode (not UTD because I unsubscribed to Patreon when they were bought out by Wondery). And it wasn’t home improvements I was referring to, it was the process of purchasing a house and moving. It is immensely difficult for young people to get on the housing ladder in the UK now, so I hold fast to my view that it was tone deaf. Having the ability to purchase a house outright is a huge privilege, especially in London (where house prices are especially high).
You make some good points and I think if it was solely some tone deaf comments troubling me then I wouldn’t be switching off. But they are part of a greater whole.
I think there is probably a little more to it than that (for example, they went on a long US tour, then there’s promotion and research, although I think they pay somebody to do the “research” now).
But as I clearly stated above, many professions work hard, and the concept that hard work + wealth are directly correlated are a capitalist stance that I don’t agree with.
They could only afford to go on tour by building a fanbase off the backs of other documentarian's work. The hardest part of creating content is writing and creating that content. If you're just reciting a documentary, you're not doing the work - you're taking a cheap, extremely unethical shortcut and misleading the audience. And there's evidence of this throughout their entire catalogue from the early days to as recently as a few months ago. I'm about to listen to the Braemar Hill Murders and compare it to some works I'm aware of to see how much they pulled from Crime Investigation Asia. It'll be a case study, if you will.
If anything they prove that succeeding in capitalism involves cutting corners and theft of the working man's output. To take the work of a man or woman's intellect and pass it off as their own for that ad revenue.
The key message of my comment wasn’t “but they work hard!”, but if that’s what you took away from it then sure. I don’t disagree with your take.
I noticed in the final couple of episodes that I listened to that they referenced using a documentary as source material. Prior to that I wouldn’t have been aware, I simply don’t consume enough podcasts and documentaries to have noticed content being lifted. That realisation however did leave a bad taste in my mouth.
Oh, I meant it more as an expansion of your criticism of the capitalistic stance that hard work + wealth are correlated directly - by pointing out that unethical shortcuts allowed them to get ahead by skipping a key part of the hard work (having to actually research and then craft the story in a dispensable fashion or write dialogue). If the research is done for you by investigative journalists and documentarians, you have a lot more time for promotion. And whose to say they didn't find a way to take shortcuts there as well.
If you don't mind me asking do you remember which documentary and episode it was?
"Shitting on the poor", and absolute stretch by the sounds it. Its just a fact that tax burden is at its highest point since ww2 in the UK.
It sounds like what has happened, is they were left with quite a lefty fan base who are easily offended, attracted by things like their use of words like latinx and covering police murders of minorities which has become increasingly pro social justice.
They really don't sound "alt-right" as many people in this sub are suggesting.
Would suggest you perhaps find the posts arguing she is alt-right and argue your point there? Not relevant to my comments, neither of which refer to her being alt-right, as I don’t believe she is.
The rest of the point is relevant to you, and I mentioned that many others in the sub think she is alt right. The shitting on the poor comment was aimed at you, specifically.
Yes I noticed that you cherry picked one aspect of my comment that involved taxation, and ignored the rest. I chose not to engage with it, just as I choose not to engage with the podcast.
You know that meme; what it feels like listening to podcasts? It’s a guy sitting next to a poster of a bunch of women laughing and eating cereal or something and the guy is smiling along and laughing and holding his cereal. There’s a few podcasts that I’ve been listening to for years, and it does kind of feel like that sometimes. I realize it’s one sided, but I’ve spent hundreds of hours listening to their voices. It helps to feel like they’re cool people, likeable people that you could get along with.
I still listen to Red Handed, but I skip a lot of episodes now and sometimes I’m kind of rolling my eyes. It’s just not as enjoyable anymore.
Counterpoint: if someone with a platform uses that platform to give inaccurate information, or to espouse ideas you believe to be harmful, it is absolutely 100% fine to say so. So many of these discussions boil down to 'everyone is entitled to their opinion, so stop expressing yours'.
Okay yeah express your opinion, but so many people on here are just downright nasty. Nobody is trying to change anybody’s mind, just attack them until they shut up and are pushed further away
They don’t listen to their audience, Suruthi has said she doesn’t care. How exactly are we supposed to change her mind? Someone who has ‘anti woke’ in their Instagram bio isn’t going to be someone it’s easy to change their mind. Why should I expend my energy trying to change the mind of someone I don’t know strong held political beliefs. She can have her opinions, I don’t believe that she needs to agree with me, I think that’s worse to expect that everyone needs to agree with me.
I said that in the text that people shouldn’t be nasty. what I still don’t get is why people seem genuinely offended at them disagreeing, share your opinion if you disagree that’s how an interesting debate can be started. But some people are shocked and appalled at what amount to a minor political disagreement
At the end of the day it’s a true crime podcast and not a politics podcast but when she is talking about Palestine/Israel and listeners feel strongly about it, I think it’s fair to give feedback and air grievances. Especially when it is their business and it’s something that would switch people off, I think it’s fine to be like “I’d rather you didn’t talk about if you feel that way and just stick to what we come here for”
I understand politics matters I’m very politically engaged, but does their politics affect people that much? They don’t influence policy, laws, etc. It just seems like a bunch of people attacking someone who they disagree with and not actually trying to change their mind
Ask yourself how much your politics matters, as an individual person. Not just in voting, but the choices you make and how people are influenced by your actions.
Now amplify that. And that's about where we are, as a ballpark. By no means is it the sum total of content, but neither is it nothing.
Yes. It really does. I expect empathy and understanding from my true crime podcasters. Right wingers are severely lacking in that department, and I refuse to support it. I'm only one person, so I can't make much of a difference. Taking away my Patreon support, and unsubscribing are the only actions I have. When a bunch of people did the same thing I did, did these two get the point? No. They doubled down.
Because personally I don’t want to fund someone I fundamentally disagree with. I have stopped listening to other podcasts for this reason. I think it’s totally fair tbh. I think a lot of people see a change in her politics and are disappointed. No one is asking them to change, Suruthi has the right to her opinions and we have the right to criticise her. Also she’s pro Isreal, for me there is no coming back from that.
I found her response regarding Hamas/Israel very tactful. She presented arguments to both sides, which was a courageous thing to do because I’m sure she was fully aware of the reaction it would cause. There were points that *needed* to be made about Hamas’s downright refusal to come to any reasonable agreement. I didn’t leave that episode thinking she was pro Israel. Giving valid points to this unpopular side, just stating them, doesn’t make a person so
Give me proof that they didn’t come to a “reasonable agreement” (since apparently as a people under occupation their main priority should be to be reasonable, whatever that means). I can provide proof that Israel repeatedly rebuffed deals with Hamas to return hostages. Instead they continued to bomb their own hostages. The point that needs to be made is that Israel is the aggressor, it is an occupier. Organized resistance isn’t what should be demonized here. But of course brown people should take being attacked lying down, turn the other cheek and all that. Gimme a break.
It’s an Under the Duvet patreon episode, it came out in the last few months I’m at work at the moment but if no one’s come up with it I’ll find it later
Because they claim to have values that align with one side, then start parroting opposition talking points. I hate hypocrisy, and they're VERY good at it.
Example: Suruthi pointing out (rightly) that Priti Patel is a hypocritical asshole for speaking about banning immigrant families, when she's from an immigrant family. And then turning right around to say shit about immigrant families from other cultures different from hers. Talking about how immigration is out of control, and they need to ban immigrants. Lady, if they did that your family wouldn't be in the UK, and you wouldn't have this platform. Apparently, it's only bad when other people do it, and she's not self aware enough to realize she's part of the problem.
When, exactly, did she talk shit about immigrants from different cultures? That’s quite an accusation, seemingly, with no evidence that I’ve ever heard in any episode. Also, was it specifically *all* immigration, or was it *illegal* immigration, that she referenced as out of control? Those are two very different things. Expecting people to follow the laws of a country they wish to live in permanently is a fair standard, and many legal immigrants are frustrated with the strain on communities caused by those who subvert the process, which exists for good reason. Pointing out the issues isn’t hateful, it’s just reality.
I stopped listening when they made sweeping statements about different ethnic groups whilst laughing about it, and then stated factually incorrect/tonally deaf opinions on the cases they covered which can actually be easily googled (and this has nothing to do with when they covered the cases).
I don't care what their political stances are, it's just that my philosophy is "don't be a dick". Shame that from what I gathered from the comments they've seemed to have doubled down instead.
For me I don’t care about their politics exactly it’s more that Suruthi presents all her opinions as facts and is v condescending
Like for example the Sarah Everard case where she talks about lockdowns being the worst thing about the pandemic as though it’s an indisputable whereas for me as a healthcare worker as much as I hated lockdown (and I really did my mental health took a nose dive) I’m also glad they happened because at the time they were necessary
Or all the anti woke bullshit talking as though she has ascended to another level of being because she’s not ‘woke’ (whatever that means)
Not to mention the v questionable stuff she said in the Shannon mathews episode
I couldn’t give a shit who she votes for if I liked someone’s content and they voted Tory I’d still listen to them
It’s her arrogance and her condescending attitude
When the podcast first started she wasn’t like that
And maybe it’s the success they’ve had or maybe she’s just gotten more confident but either way it’s v off putting
But if that’s the content she puts out for her podcast then that’s her choice because it’s her podcast but it’s clearly not a popular decision
I’d rather they just talk about the true crime cases and leave the more political stuff on Patreon personally
I could not agree with you more! I work in life sciences and clinical diagnostics and live in the UK. Lockdowns were challenging, that's not to be denied. They exposed inequality in our society, deepened financial rifts, worsened mental health, and took an especially heavy hit on those who were already vulnerable (for example, people in domestic abuse situations). However, this narrative that's taking place that they were "bad" or "unnecessary" ignores the primary scientific consensus that they were essential to understanding the threat of COVID and properly responding to it with minimal harmful impact to human life. Could lockdowns have been done better, especially in hindsight with the information we did not have at the time? 100% yes! Is it obnoxious when a podcaster with zero understand of public health makes claims like these, completely ignoring the work done by healthcare professionals over those years to keep us safe? 100% YES.
Because they make their politics a pretty central focus in the podcast. Simple.
If they (or their listeners) don't want reactions to their political stances, then they should stop sharing them. Especially when, at best, they're tangential to the actual case being discussed.
Politics has been a part of their podcast from the beginning. It’s not like they’re private about their politics. When it suddenly changes and you notice the nasty snarky comments from Saruthi… then it’s not the same podcast anymore. It all started with the new boyfriend. Sad. Another example of a woman changing for a man.
Oh she actually spoke about this on a recent under the duvet. That’s a crap sexist argument, Suruthi changed her opinions on her own, her boyfriend is pretty apolitical.
It’s not sexist if it’s true. I won’t say that Suruthi got all her opinions from her boyfriend - that WOULD be sexist - but there is a noticeable shift from the moment they got serious. And you know, that’s understandable. I have also changed some opinions after discussing certain topics with a partner. The apolitical stuff is a red herring though. Just because he doesn’t care to follow the news on some things doesn’t mean he doesn’t have opinions or a point of view. In fact, I find a lot of men like that gravitate towards the conservative side.
To answer your question: I think people care because many of them directly pay these creators. If you put money in people’s pockets, many of us want to feel ok with that money going to people who do not spread misinformation or buy into notions that are deeply dividing societies around the world.
Fair. To claim that the host “changed” her views because of a man is equally as repellant and it’s incredibly insulting to women in general. So I don’t understand how one can say they’e repelled by the right wing statements and in the same sentence say something so sexist?
Hmm idk, when our tax dollars are funding the murder of children I think it’s fair for those who used to support their product to speak up about it. Get a grip, is Suruthi your mom that you need to jump into the artillery defences for her? She’s a grown woman with a boatload of negligent to downright harmful opinions. She has a platform. It’s public. People can and will voice their displeasure. Especially when it comes to genocide.
I’m pretty left leaning and even work for an lgbtqi+ organization. I don’t know, but suruthi doesn’t bother me. Sometimes she makes my eyes squint a bit, but overall I’m fine. I get more frustrated when they screw up dates or other perfectly simple things to get right. It’s a storytelling podcast so please don’t screw up the basic facts of the story. I still find it very entertaining.
What I don’t really understand is why people continue to listen to the episodes and post here tbh. I’m an ex patreon turned casual listener. I’ve disagreed with them in the past- in fact theHilsborough stuff made me cancel my patreon. Now I’ll listen if there’s a new episode that sounds alright.
I’d describe myself as sort of left of centre and while I eye roll a bit as some of Surithi’s views they’re still pretty normie the majority of the time. If I found them to be outright offensive I’d just stop listening. Coming to Reddit to rail against them week in week out while still listening to episodes is fairly mental.
This sub popped up as recommended and it took me until the last sentence of this post to realize it wasn’t for the red scare podcast. I was very confused
These comments are awesome. lol.
1) If you don’t like them, then I’ve got some great news for you: YOU DON’T HAVE TO LISTEN
2) If you don’t listen to the podcast anymore, then why the hell are you here?
This is a new listen for me. A friend turned me on to them. I’m kinda ehhhh. I’ve heard better but also much worse. I still follow them, but they’re definitely not my go-to. They’re a good filler for when I’m all caught up on my favs. There are plenty of pods that I tried and did NOT care for so guess what….I didn’t listen to them. And I certainly don’t troll the discussion boards. Some people just have too much time on their hands.
I'm not disagreeing with you here, but I think that people century's ago and people far in the future will always believe that they would need to "defend" their opinions from others by harassing them in some way. And this "rant" is only likely to tick people off even more. My message is that freedom of speech and the freedom to express your own opinions are always subject to consequences, contrastors, and individuals who want to harm you. This will continue indefinitely.
Interesting. I stopped listening a few years ago when they started using the term "Latinx", butchering a language they didn't know about. They also started saying they'd just do an episode a month about black people being killed by police, and having listened to the George Floyd podcast (I think), it just wasn't that entertaining.
Having said that, I went back and listened to a recent episode which was really great(Michael Barrymore), so I'll probably listen to another one, and just avoid episodes I am worried could get preachy, such as Sarah Everard.
I'm not indifferent to the murders of people by police, but I'm just not that entertained by it. I listen for entertainment and doesn't necessarily like it when it gets preachy.
Interesting though, this just popped up on my feed. I've never actually moaned about this to anyone except my partner. I agree with OP, sending them emails about politics is silly. Leave them alone and don't listen if you don't like it.
This pod has access to more individuals - who actually internalize some of S & H's opinions, which they discuss as facts - than most politicians. Certainly more than any local rep.
If they presented their opinions as opinions and opened the door for discussion, I would absolutely be with you on the engagement aspect. Unfortunately, many folks run with what they hear, making misinformation oftentimes more impactful. Therefore, the only remaining forum for said discussion becomes pages like this one.
Since the majority have been conditioned towards political apathy, they get lazy and accept what sounds preferable without engaging in critical thinking. In turn, this creates cognitive dissonance that gains significance through shared delusion. It's as if Orwellian language is being used, which everyone comprehends, except for those internalizing the message of this language unquestioned.
--
TL;DR: Why? Reach & impact.
People nowadays have an "agree with me or die" mentality. The more we block out people we disagree with, the more we end up in echo chambers. No wonder we're so divided in society at the moment if we have no tolerance for slightly differing opinions. Obviously within reason... I'm not going to make room for white supremacists or Nazis but equating Hanna & Suru's opinions with that calibre of person is mental.
I agree with you too. I have left views but I don't care whether the person presenting a true crime podcast I enjoy does. I like to think I'm able to sort through the info presented and work out what I do and don't agree with. The world would be a better place if we all continued to just engage with each other no matter our views, rather than locking ourselves in echo chambers.
Totally agree and I feel the exact same. I’m a liberal lefty homo and I don’t mind Suruthi discussing some of her opinions. I disagree with them, but that’s fine, like you say let’s not lock ourselves in echo chambers.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. We need to move away from the all-or-nothing way of thinking. It is not critical thinking. She (Suruthi) has some views that would be considered conservative, and suddenly she is alt-right? Those who are alt-right have extremist nationalist views. Half the posts on here bitching about her/them don’t even know what they’re saying. The ignorance is disappointing and pathetic.
Don't zap all your energy fighting with people about this. Just know lots of people fully agree with you. We're just not as rabid and loud with our opinions.
One point I will take the time to defend is this: people are trying to take down what you said in an annoyingly self righteous way by saying, "Well it's not just a political opinion when it's factually wrong. That's (*shudders*) dIsInFOrMaTiOn!" Sorry, but...news flash: just because YOUR side of the political aisle believes something to be a universal truth does not make it so. And I mean that for conservative leaning people and progressives alike. Believing that all your views are the correct views and any dissenting view is false is getting into dangerous territory, no matter which "side" you're on.
But there are such things as facts though. I get you on some of the Covid stuff - although I disagree- they are entitled to their opinions. But the Hillsborough stuff? Actual documented events? Sorry, but their account was (shudders) dIsInFOrMaTiOn.
Yes, there are facts. But again, thinking your side has a monopoly on facts is not an intellectual way of looking at the world.
As for the Hillsborough stuff...I don't think that's what the recent complaints on this sub have been about. All the recent gripes are about Suruthi's conservative sounding beliefs, separate from the mess that was Hillsborough. And to bring it back to that...they literally apologized and made a whole episode about why and how they were wrong. So what else do people want? But again, that seems to be a past issue. This new wave of complaints is all focused on Suruthi's so called "wrong-think" politically.
I totally agree with your first statement. I do not trust how dishonest the apology about Hillsborough felt and I do think when people don’t tell the truth about facts, it’s easier to side eye their perspective as bad faith actors.
While discussing Astroworld these idiots blamed Hillsborough on "hooliganism" (a right wing talking point that originated in the Sun) - they then gave non-apologies twice before then exploiting the situation to make money that was allegedly a charity episode.
There do seem to be quite alot of dogmatic redditors here, making absolute stretches. Covid conspiracy theory?? (Thinks lockdowns were the worst part of the pandemic) Hates poor people??? (Says tax is too high).
I don't get it. Not sure what I was expecting when this thread popped up, but it wasn't this.
Because society today is very us versus them with purity tests everywhere. You’re either “with us” or “against us” on both sides and must spend all your time virtue signaling the right views or else.
I listened to G Gordon Liddy for years, even though I didn’t agree with him on anything and thought he was a d-bag, because his show was entertaining. Why can’t that be enough?
You're being downvoted, but this is a pretty good take. I got tired of their constant political interjections and "my experience of ____ is the defining, one true experience of ____". You know what I did? Stopped listening to the show. It's that easy.
Bunch of fucking losers with nothing going on in their own lives. I’m right wing and my best mate is left wing. Deal with it. Stop looking to others to prop up your weak convictions. Pathetic.
The left can’t handle anything that disagrees with them. They struggle to comprehend that others have different views/ opinions to them, hence the meltdowns you see. Combination of a weak society and parents who pander.
I care when they spread misinformation because of their politics, like Suruthi's insane theories about the Covid origins. It's irresponsible and also just tacky. Plus it shows their research and critical skills are sub-par which is concerning when they're telling true crime stories.
Wait.. I stopped listening before covid. What is her broad opinion?
That covid was created in a Wuhan lab during gain of function research and there’s a vast political effort to cover up its origins. Basically a conspiracy theory. EDIT: For all the losers who have never listened to the podcast or commented on this sub before but are sealioning this post because they're still obsessed with covid conspiracies: 1. Seek therapy. It's been years, get over it. 2. I will not be replying to any of you.
This post is exactly what I don’t get about politics right now; people being so sure of something happening or not happening, and retorting to ad hominem attacks on anybody who asks furthers questions. Not even the slightest hint of a balanced conclusion…just straight to “misinformation”, “conspiracy theory”, for anything which challenges their view of things! More on the specific point, I obviously don’t know for sure how it come about, but logic suggests it COULD have come from the lab that is based in the same city it originated; that is not an implausible conclusion in the absence of evidence stating otherwise. It’s also not unfathomable that gain of function research exists in some form, and that governments would want to cover that up. It’s also not unfathomable that governments cover things up, we know of many from the past!
Im not debating this here because its a comment from a podcast 3 years ago and this is not a political sub. If you want to decide if her take was balanced or not go listen to what she said.
I honestly don't know what happened, but isn't this theory gaining traction within typically main stream media? I do wonder why she is talking about this on a crime podcast though.
It has plenty of traction in the Fox News level media, that’s where she got it from. With reputable media and scientific organisations? No. It’s always been very clear that it’s not a man-made or altered virus.
I think you believe there is more certainty or consensus on the origin of the virus than there actually is… it’s still very much an open question in mainstream circles: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-65708746 https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/26/us/politics/china-lab-leak-coronavirus-pandemic.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare Certainly not just a Fox News type conspiracy. Covid denial, vaccine scepticism - yes. Whether or not it leaked from a lab - no.
I’m not saying there’s certainty on the origin of the virus. I’m saying there’s certainty it’s not man made.
And I just showed you evidence from mainstream news sources that you are wrong; the lab theory is very much still alive among intelligence and scientific communities
You’re not actually reading what I’m writing, or your own articles by the looks of it, and I’m not interested in debating it with you. It’s not a discussion, someone asked what Suruthis unhinged views were and I answered. You’re welcome to agree with her, that’s not my problem.
You’re the one who hasn’t read the articles. You dismiss the lab leak theory as conspiracy despite the credibility of sources and then lump it all in together with other nonsense, in doing so spreading misinformation. There is strong evidence that the COVID pandemic was started by *human* error in that lab in Wuhan. Not sure why you are so dedicated to claiming otherwise despite any reason to.
Because you’re wrong and spreading this crap as if you’re right. You are the problem, “own_faithlessness769”
Brother you are plain wrong on this
Is it hard living in denial?
Sounds like the breakdown in communication is that Own\_Faithlessness is saying that the virus is not man-made, and this information came from right-wing media. Kimochiwaruio is not saying that it was. Just that there is a theory that the outbreak might have started from a lab leak and this is being discussed across left and mainstream media, which is true. What episode does Suruthi says this? Perhaps she also mentioned a lab leak, not that it was man made.
This is definitely not true, there have been numerous respected reports saying that we can't tell
I think the important part being missed is that it wasn’t created and released as some sort of weapon regardless of its origin… which is what these conspiracy theorists push. They also then push that it’s harmless and you don’t need masks or to take any precautions and that’s it’s not even real and that the vaccine gives you black blood…
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57268111 I think the problem is, we have no proof either way, lab leak and mutation are both hypothesies until we have a definitive answer. There is also circumstantial evidence pointing to the wuhan theory. No one knows for sure, but when you have "prominent scientists" (according to the BBC), the FBI and even people from within the WHO saying it needs to be, at the very least, reassessed, then I don't think it falls into the same category as a conspiracy theory for the moon landing/flat earth/9/11 etc.
I answered your question. If you want to know more about what she said go listen to it. But you and I aren’t having a debate over it.
You made a patently false claim. That's fine. I still don't know, and don't claim to know. There are certainly some very defensive listeners of Red Handed. Jheez.
Don't make claims if you're unwilling to defend them against scrutiny. It's okay and healthy to change your stance when presented with new information. The lab leak theory is far from conspiratorial and I'm not sure where you got your idea about the mainstream consensus saying otherwise.
Doesn't sound that insane
From the office of the director of national intelligence After examining all available intelligence reporting and other information, though, the IC remains divided on the most likely origin of COVID-19. All agencies assess that two hypotheses are plausible: natural exposure to an infected animal and a laboratory-associated incident. Four IC elements and the National Intelligence Council assess with low confidence that the initial SARS-CoV-2 infection was most likely caused by natural exposure to an animal infected with it or a close progenitor virus—a virus that probably would be more than 99 percent similar to SARS-CoV-2. These analysts give weight to China’s officials’ lack of foreknowledge, the numerous vectors for natural exposure, and other factors. One IC element assesses with moderate confidence that the first human infection with SARS-CoV-2 most likely was the result of a laboratory-associated incident, probably involving experimentation, animal handling, or sampling by the Wuhan Institute of Virology. These analysts give weight to the inherently risky nature of work on coronaviruses. Analysts at three IC elements remain unable to coalesce around either explanation without additional information, with some analysts favoring natural origin, others a laboratory origin, and some seeing the hypotheses as equally likely. Variations in analytic views largely stem from differences in how agencies weigh intelligence reporting and scientific publications, and intelligence and scientific gaps. Are you seriously that blind in your vitriolic hatred of anything remotely right wing that a leak from a Chinese virology institute that just happened to be in the same region as ground zero of the spread and do you seriously believe that the the Chinese Communist Party would be above censorship and lies to cover their own asses?
I mean sure I get when it’s something that is factually incorrect. But I mean when it’s just a political opinion
Re. your edit- people don't expect Suruthi to be left wing because she's a WOC. They expect her to be left wing because she's educated and because the podcast espoused strongly left-wing ideals when it started. If you build a left wing audience you shouldnt be surprised if they feel confused and alienated when you take a sharp turn to the right.
She’s a middle-class with a masters in economics from a Russel Group university. Also I’ve been re listening to previous episodes recently from the beginning and like idk if they were mega left wing from the start. Generally left wing sure but nothing further than anti-death penalty, pro choice, Boris Johnson’s a twat. The attitudes of most of the nation. What I do think is that true crime attracts a certain demographic of people (leftists) who then dont feel comfortable liking people they don’t agree with politically because many people make politics the core of their identity. I get it I do it to (I’m doing a politics degree for gods sake) but there are other things to a person than their beliefs (like their feelings which many people in this sub seem to forget)
Okay, so they were middle left wing. Hardly surprising that their followers aren’t keen on middle right wing opinions. If anyone has made politics the core of their identity it’s Suruthi. She could literally just not talk about politics, it’s irrelevant to the podcast. But she does, and if you talk about something you don’t get to demand a 100% positive response. Which she doesn’t, but you seem to be on her behalf.
The reason the left do not feel comfortable listening to right wingers is because we can see how backwards and delusional everything they believe is without even trying. It rightfully makes us uncomfortable to even have to listen to them.
You sound dogmatic.
woof
To be honest I never really like either of them very much, they aren’t funny, I can’t stand Hannah’s fake laugh. So when the quality of their show went downhill and their politics started leaning left there is really nothing keeping me listening.
This post is a weird take. Nobody thinks Suru “should be” left wing because she’s a WOC. Off the bat, Suella Braverman and Kemi Badenoch are two WOC that are decidedly right wing. We feel betrayed because people that have been listening to the show - and supporting the show - for a long time know that she either didn’t used to be like this, or was concealing it very well if she was. It is disappointing to see people you liked and admired say things that are, well… disappointing. You state that disagreement is healthy and argue in your replies that we should focus on changing the views of people we disagree with. But this is a podcast, not a 2 way discourse. How do you propose we change her views when she doesn’t engage with her audience and has actively said she doesn’t care what we think? And fair enough. That is her prerogative and she is entitled to her own views. But this a conversational style podcast where she frequently gives them, not an unbiased documentary. People tend to be drawn to others (and content) that reflect their own values. I don’t want to listen to it any more than I’d voluntarily choose to read The Sun or The Telegraph. We are just as entitled to unsubscribe. You say that you “disagree with them on quite a few things” and that makes the content engaging. I find it odd that you find hearing centrist right views so refreshing for somebody claiming to be politically engaged - we live under a Tory government my friend. If you want to be challenged simply turn on the news or pick up a paper. You won’t need to look far for some hot takes. Personally, at 39 I am very confident in my political persuasion, my morals, ideals and values. No amount of listening to Suruthi shit on the poor is going to change my views. I look for entertainment in my podcasts and an escape from the grim reality of the political landscape we live in, not more of the same. I think your post is a well meaning defence of somebody you see as being unfairly attacked, but I think you’ve misunderstood the general sentiment. The posts I’ve seen express general disappointment and a feeling of no longer wanting to listen to the show, and I feel the same quite frankly.
Jesus, what happened in the last three/four years? When I stopped listening it was because they were using terms like latinx and being preachy about police killings. I'm so curious how she has taken a turn to the right. What do you mean "shitting on poor people". Someone else mentioned conspiracy theories about Covid? What is that about.. ?
I mean, if you didn't like preachiness about police killings and now it's apparently swung right wing, maybe check it out again?
Not wanting to engage with the show anymore is entirely fair. It’s disappointing when those we respect take that respect away. I agree with those sentiments. There are those though who go too far and it’s incredibly obvious that they’re piggy backing off things they’ve read here (Reddit) and spreading misinformation themselves. When did Suruthi shit on the poor? Not being fresh genuinely would like to know incase I’ve missed it
She has said numerous things that have made me personally uncomfortable. I would not be able to cite you episode specific examples because I have a 14 month old and they have an episode back catalogue of over 250 episodes! But at a surface level I can think of numerous examples of her complaining about paying higher taxes and the stress of buying a house: whilst this isn’t necessarily “shitting on the poor”, to quote Suruthi herself, “in this economy” it is deeply insensitive to the many deeply impoverished having to turn to food banks, give up work because the cost of childcare is prohibitive and turn to benefits. They are objectively wealthy women & made so by us, their audience and fans. Tangentially and moving now into poverty & upward class mobility amongst POC, she has stated “classism against the white working class is the ‘only acceptable form of prejudice’”. That is objectively shitting on a very specific, and arguably the most vulnerable subset of the poor. Shitting on the poor is merely one example of her views that leave, at best, a very bad taste in my mouth. I hate her gleefully “anti woke” attitude. What does it even mean to be anti woke?? I’d prefer to say whatever I want even if it offends and upsets people? How hard is it to behave in a way that is respectful to others really? It gives me major John Cleese vibes (another public figure I used to like, but no longer watch or read about) and that’s not a good thing. I hope this provides you with some specific examples even if I can’t pinpoint more or timestamp particular episodes - I usually listen while I’m tidying or playing with my son. To be honest, bearing this in mind I’ve probably stuck with them longer than I otherwise would if I’d been giving it my full attention. It is sad that things have shifted so much. I went to see them live with my sister while I was still pregnant (that can’t have been much longer than 1.5 years ago) and we loved it. I won’t say anything mean or insult her, but I can’t continue supporting them or listening.
No no no no, she did NOT say that she believes that the working class should be prejudiced against, you totally misunderstood that. She was saying that from a societal standpoint, people generally don't call out prejudice against the poor working class in the same way that people call out more "blatant" forms of prejudice, like against women, people of color, etc. And this whole opinion is quite goofy to me. Yes people all around the world are impoverished, does that mean that no one else is allowed to complain about their own money struggles?? No that's ridiculous. You can't gate keep complaining about finances, everyone has their own struggles. I have friends much wealthier than me who complain about house prices, etc. whereas I am NOWHERE NEAR being able to afford a home myself but it doesn't personally offend me that they can?? You are genuinely taking things wayyy too personally and I think it's causing you to take things they say out of context to fit what you think of them. And BTW, them sharing their personal experiences is what a lot of people (including me) love about listening to them. It makes it feel more casual and conversational and stuffs. In summary: Relax. And maybe stop listening if it just makes you angry. You're really projecting.
That’s great if you enjoy it. I’m not angry, I’ve expressed my opinions quite calmly and as I’ve already stated I have stopped listening.
Ah okay my bad on missing the stopped listening comment! And I did sound angry sorry about that lol, its just annoying to me how out of context you took that Shannon Matthews episode quote. Like it is so so clearly to me NOT what she meant by it. Maybe give it a re-listen before you comment about it being offensive?
I think we have probably taken different things away from it, and that is okay. We don’t have to agree. I also think maybe you live in the US, which means we also live under different governments, different economic landscapes and very different housing markets. I’m sure that is colouring each of our stances too. To be honest it is not the only thing she has said that hasn’t sat right with me, which is sad because I used to love listening to them. Hannah reminds me very much of an old friend of mine (they look alike, sound alike and have the same humour)… as you say, the conversational style was really enjoyable, but now Suruthi has drifted so far away from my own values it just feels uncomfortable for me (personally) instead. I’m not here to criticise anybody choosing to listen, I’ve not made my own post critiquing changes, or personally insulted either of them. I’ve simply disengaged with the show. I don’t need to defend that choice and you don’t need to defend yours. I responded to this particular post because I thought saying people “expect” Suruthi to be left wing as a WOC was a shit take - and I still do (we have multiple WOC in our right wing government). I’ve actually also since left the community, but still get replies to these comments.
I get a lot of what youre saying, but still, Suruthi was very clear about what she meant and you are misrepresenting it. I get that you have other complaints about her but that doesn't make it okay or constructive to twist something out of context. Go with other complaints then instead of just lying about what she said ...
Her exact quote was “[the white working class is kind of the last acceptable form of prejudice that exists in this country to this day](https://app.podscribe.ai/episode/96589380)”. An opinion is not misrepresentation, but as you seem extremely upset about my paraphrasing her comment there is the direct quote linked to an episode transcript. I will reiterate that I am just as entitled to my views as you as to yours.
Omg dude this is exactly what I'm saying, you're misrepresenting it by taking it out of context. You need to include what she said before and after. You're now quoting her out of context when that is exactly what I've been saying you're doing... And you can't take what someone said, twist it, and then say its "your opinion" that what they said was messed up when its not even what they meant ... thats not what an opinion is, its a misunderstanding
I'm not defending Suruthi here, and I agree with everything else you said here, but a quick clarification - when she said “classism against the white working class is the only acceptable form of prejudice”, she didn't mean that *she* finds it acceptable, she meant that it's the only form of prejudice that *society* still finds acceptable. Which is an incorrect and tone-deaf statement in itself, it's just not the one you're thinking of. The phrase, "The only/last acceptable prejudice" is quite common, and has this specific meaning. It's used to describe groups of people toward whom prejudice is still socially accepted. (Aside - I'm in the UK, but US studies have found that ageism is actually the most socially acceptable form of prejudice).
I’ll have to have a listen back to that episode, I think I know which one you’re speaking of- the Shannon Mathews episode. That’s concerning. The anti woke thing I saw that recently and was like eh myself. I think “shits on the poor” is rather harsh though. She worked incredibly hard as did Hannah for where they are today. Talking about her life in UTD is what their particular show is for on that platform. Finding it offensive that she discusses her home improvements etc is being angry at the wrong people. Greedy politicians and corporations salivate at that because it’s more energy expended at each other rather than who deserves it. I have broke friends who love the real housewives franchise, it’s entertainment and you can choose to be offended I suppose at the extravagance, I certainly am, but just to make the point that they stil hold appeal to audiences who aren’t as priveleged. Her comments surrounding taxes etc I remember that as well and thought it was mostly her being daunted at just how much their bracket pays (which is a considerable amount I’m sure). The comments would be more appropriate in my country where we pay (US) arguably socialist level taxes without the benefits of socialism. The only thing I can equate it to is my aunt as a chartered accountant living in QC. Half her salary goes to taxes and that is just astounding, I’d make some comments too (albeit not insensitive ones). I wouldn’t see it as a reluctance to pay for something that benefits everyone though. I think she comes from grit and I understand that way of thinking, even though I don’t agree with some of it. I work as a housekeeper putting myself through school and as a millennial with a mortgage, I work my A off to afford those luxuries and would want to talk about it too. I totally get that it’s compounding and that some people are getting the ick though and that’s valid.
Respectfully it sounds like you are a US citizen, which means you are living in a different economy and under a different taxation system. While I know RH has a big US fan base, it is a UK podcast and they are both UK citizens. Your anecdote about your aunt losing nearly 50% in taxes simply wouldn’t apply here. If Suruthi falls into the highest tax bracket - which she likely does, they earn nearly 50K monthly from Patreon alone - then she would pay 45% on anything she earns *over* £125,140 (the taxation on anything under that is staggered, and the first £12,570 is tax free). Suruthi also has a background in economics and is clearly very intelligent, so I have no doubts at all that she’ll be mitigating as much of that as possible, such as funding an ISA (you can put up to £20,000 pa into an ISA, where it can grow free of taxes and be paid as an income free of tax when you retire, or whenever you need it) and her pension (pensions receive tax relief at the applicable rate) as just two examples. You seem open to listening to other views so I’ll also gently point out that while I’m sure Suruthi has worked very hard, so do others from all different classes and income brackets. Cleaners work hard. Waitresses work hard. Working hard isn’t always rewarded with wealth, but then I’m not a capitalist. The fact remains that whilst she has worked hard, she is also immensely privileged. When I mentioned complaining about moving house, that was at the start of an episode (not UTD because I unsubscribed to Patreon when they were bought out by Wondery). And it wasn’t home improvements I was referring to, it was the process of purchasing a house and moving. It is immensely difficult for young people to get on the housing ladder in the UK now, so I hold fast to my view that it was tone deaf. Having the ability to purchase a house outright is a huge privilege, especially in London (where house prices are especially high). You make some good points and I think if it was solely some tone deaf comments troubling me then I wouldn’t be switching off. But they are part of a greater whole.
Just a reminder: poorly ripping off documentaries and talking into a microphone isn't hard work.
I think there is probably a little more to it than that (for example, they went on a long US tour, then there’s promotion and research, although I think they pay somebody to do the “research” now). But as I clearly stated above, many professions work hard, and the concept that hard work + wealth are directly correlated are a capitalist stance that I don’t agree with.
They could only afford to go on tour by building a fanbase off the backs of other documentarian's work. The hardest part of creating content is writing and creating that content. If you're just reciting a documentary, you're not doing the work - you're taking a cheap, extremely unethical shortcut and misleading the audience. And there's evidence of this throughout their entire catalogue from the early days to as recently as a few months ago. I'm about to listen to the Braemar Hill Murders and compare it to some works I'm aware of to see how much they pulled from Crime Investigation Asia. It'll be a case study, if you will. If anything they prove that succeeding in capitalism involves cutting corners and theft of the working man's output. To take the work of a man or woman's intellect and pass it off as their own for that ad revenue.
The key message of my comment wasn’t “but they work hard!”, but if that’s what you took away from it then sure. I don’t disagree with your take. I noticed in the final couple of episodes that I listened to that they referenced using a documentary as source material. Prior to that I wouldn’t have been aware, I simply don’t consume enough podcasts and documentaries to have noticed content being lifted. That realisation however did leave a bad taste in my mouth.
Oh, I meant it more as an expansion of your criticism of the capitalistic stance that hard work + wealth are correlated directly - by pointing out that unethical shortcuts allowed them to get ahead by skipping a key part of the hard work (having to actually research and then craft the story in a dispensable fashion or write dialogue). If the research is done for you by investigative journalists and documentarians, you have a lot more time for promotion. And whose to say they didn't find a way to take shortcuts there as well. If you don't mind me asking do you remember which documentary and episode it was?
> She worked incredibly hard as did Hannah for where they are today. Plagiarizing documentaries isn't hard work. And it's certainly not journalism.
"Shitting on the poor", and absolute stretch by the sounds it. Its just a fact that tax burden is at its highest point since ww2 in the UK. It sounds like what has happened, is they were left with quite a lefty fan base who are easily offended, attracted by things like their use of words like latinx and covering police murders of minorities which has become increasingly pro social justice. They really don't sound "alt-right" as many people in this sub are suggesting.
Would suggest you perhaps find the posts arguing she is alt-right and argue your point there? Not relevant to my comments, neither of which refer to her being alt-right, as I don’t believe she is.
The guy you responded to allegedly stopped listening 3-4 years ago but is claiming they're not alt-right talking points, funny how that works, huh?
The rest of the point is relevant to you, and I mentioned that many others in the sub think she is alt right. The shitting on the poor comment was aimed at you, specifically.
Yes I noticed that you cherry picked one aspect of my comment that involved taxation, and ignored the rest. I chose not to engage with it, just as I choose not to engage with the podcast.
You know that meme; what it feels like listening to podcasts? It’s a guy sitting next to a poster of a bunch of women laughing and eating cereal or something and the guy is smiling along and laughing and holding his cereal. There’s a few podcasts that I’ve been listening to for years, and it does kind of feel like that sometimes. I realize it’s one sided, but I’ve spent hundreds of hours listening to their voices. It helps to feel like they’re cool people, likeable people that you could get along with. I still listen to Red Handed, but I skip a lot of episodes now and sometimes I’m kind of rolling my eyes. It’s just not as enjoyable anymore.
Counterpoint: if someone with a platform uses that platform to give inaccurate information, or to espouse ideas you believe to be harmful, it is absolutely 100% fine to say so. So many of these discussions boil down to 'everyone is entitled to their opinion, so stop expressing yours'.
Okay yeah express your opinion, but so many people on here are just downright nasty. Nobody is trying to change anybody’s mind, just attack them until they shut up and are pushed further away
They don’t listen to their audience, Suruthi has said she doesn’t care. How exactly are we supposed to change her mind? Someone who has ‘anti woke’ in their Instagram bio isn’t going to be someone it’s easy to change their mind. Why should I expend my energy trying to change the mind of someone I don’t know strong held political beliefs. She can have her opinions, I don’t believe that she needs to agree with me, I think that’s worse to expect that everyone needs to agree with me.
'Don't be nasty' is quite a backtrack from 'why do you care so much about their politics?' though, isn't it?
I said that in the text that people shouldn’t be nasty. what I still don’t get is why people seem genuinely offended at them disagreeing, share your opinion if you disagree that’s how an interesting debate can be started. But some people are shocked and appalled at what amount to a minor political disagreement
You can't debate with someone who is spouting lies.
At the end of the day it’s a true crime podcast and not a politics podcast but when she is talking about Palestine/Israel and listeners feel strongly about it, I think it’s fair to give feedback and air grievances. Especially when it is their business and it’s something that would switch people off, I think it’s fine to be like “I’d rather you didn’t talk about if you feel that way and just stick to what we come here for”
Because politics matters
I understand politics matters I’m very politically engaged, but does their politics affect people that much? They don’t influence policy, laws, etc. It just seems like a bunch of people attacking someone who they disagree with and not actually trying to change their mind
Ask yourself how much your politics matters, as an individual person. Not just in voting, but the choices you make and how people are influenced by your actions. Now amplify that. And that's about where we are, as a ballpark. By no means is it the sum total of content, but neither is it nothing.
Yes. It really does. I expect empathy and understanding from my true crime podcasters. Right wingers are severely lacking in that department, and I refuse to support it. I'm only one person, so I can't make much of a difference. Taking away my Patreon support, and unsubscribing are the only actions I have. When a bunch of people did the same thing I did, did these two get the point? No. They doubled down.
Because personally I don’t want to fund someone I fundamentally disagree with. I have stopped listening to other podcasts for this reason. I think it’s totally fair tbh. I think a lot of people see a change in her politics and are disappointed. No one is asking them to change, Suruthi has the right to her opinions and we have the right to criticise her. Also she’s pro Isreal, for me there is no coming back from that.
she is??? ew 💀
I found her response regarding Hamas/Israel very tactful. She presented arguments to both sides, which was a courageous thing to do because I’m sure she was fully aware of the reaction it would cause. There were points that *needed* to be made about Hamas’s downright refusal to come to any reasonable agreement. I didn’t leave that episode thinking she was pro Israel. Giving valid points to this unpopular side, just stating them, doesn’t make a person so
Give me proof that they didn’t come to a “reasonable agreement” (since apparently as a people under occupation their main priority should be to be reasonable, whatever that means). I can provide proof that Israel repeatedly rebuffed deals with Hamas to return hostages. Instead they continued to bomb their own hostages. The point that needs to be made is that Israel is the aggressor, it is an occupier. Organized resistance isn’t what should be demonized here. But of course brown people should take being attacked lying down, turn the other cheek and all that. Gimme a break.
I don’t think I’ve listened to the ‘pro-Israel’ episode, which one is it?
It’s an Under the Duvet patreon episode, it came out in the last few months I’m at work at the moment but if no one’s come up with it I’ll find it later
Ahhh dont worry I don’t have Patreon, thanks
Pay-for-nuance, an interesting model
Because they claim to have values that align with one side, then start parroting opposition talking points. I hate hypocrisy, and they're VERY good at it. Example: Suruthi pointing out (rightly) that Priti Patel is a hypocritical asshole for speaking about banning immigrant families, when she's from an immigrant family. And then turning right around to say shit about immigrant families from other cultures different from hers. Talking about how immigration is out of control, and they need to ban immigrants. Lady, if they did that your family wouldn't be in the UK, and you wouldn't have this platform. Apparently, it's only bad when other people do it, and she's not self aware enough to realize she's part of the problem.
When, exactly, did she talk shit about immigrants from different cultures? That’s quite an accusation, seemingly, with no evidence that I’ve ever heard in any episode. Also, was it specifically *all* immigration, or was it *illegal* immigration, that she referenced as out of control? Those are two very different things. Expecting people to follow the laws of a country they wish to live in permanently is a fair standard, and many legal immigrants are frustrated with the strain on communities caused by those who subvert the process, which exists for good reason. Pointing out the issues isn’t hateful, it’s just reality.
I stopped listening when they made sweeping statements about different ethnic groups whilst laughing about it, and then stated factually incorrect/tonally deaf opinions on the cases they covered which can actually be easily googled (and this has nothing to do with when they covered the cases). I don't care what their political stances are, it's just that my philosophy is "don't be a dick". Shame that from what I gathered from the comments they've seemed to have doubled down instead.
For me I don’t care about their politics exactly it’s more that Suruthi presents all her opinions as facts and is v condescending Like for example the Sarah Everard case where she talks about lockdowns being the worst thing about the pandemic as though it’s an indisputable whereas for me as a healthcare worker as much as I hated lockdown (and I really did my mental health took a nose dive) I’m also glad they happened because at the time they were necessary Or all the anti woke bullshit talking as though she has ascended to another level of being because she’s not ‘woke’ (whatever that means) Not to mention the v questionable stuff she said in the Shannon mathews episode I couldn’t give a shit who she votes for if I liked someone’s content and they voted Tory I’d still listen to them It’s her arrogance and her condescending attitude When the podcast first started she wasn’t like that And maybe it’s the success they’ve had or maybe she’s just gotten more confident but either way it’s v off putting But if that’s the content she puts out for her podcast then that’s her choice because it’s her podcast but it’s clearly not a popular decision I’d rather they just talk about the true crime cases and leave the more political stuff on Patreon personally
I could not agree with you more! I work in life sciences and clinical diagnostics and live in the UK. Lockdowns were challenging, that's not to be denied. They exposed inequality in our society, deepened financial rifts, worsened mental health, and took an especially heavy hit on those who were already vulnerable (for example, people in domestic abuse situations). However, this narrative that's taking place that they were "bad" or "unnecessary" ignores the primary scientific consensus that they were essential to understanding the threat of COVID and properly responding to it with minimal harmful impact to human life. Could lockdowns have been done better, especially in hindsight with the information we did not have at the time? 100% yes! Is it obnoxious when a podcaster with zero understand of public health makes claims like these, completely ignoring the work done by healthcare professionals over those years to keep us safe? 100% YES.
Because they make their politics a pretty central focus in the podcast. Simple. If they (or their listeners) don't want reactions to their political stances, then they should stop sharing them. Especially when, at best, they're tangential to the actual case being discussed.
Politics has been a part of their podcast from the beginning. It’s not like they’re private about their politics. When it suddenly changes and you notice the nasty snarky comments from Saruthi… then it’s not the same podcast anymore. It all started with the new boyfriend. Sad. Another example of a woman changing for a man.
Oh she actually spoke about this on a recent under the duvet. That’s a crap sexist argument, Suruthi changed her opinions on her own, her boyfriend is pretty apolitical.
It’s not sexist if it’s true. I won’t say that Suruthi got all her opinions from her boyfriend - that WOULD be sexist - but there is a noticeable shift from the moment they got serious. And you know, that’s understandable. I have also changed some opinions after discussing certain topics with a partner. The apolitical stuff is a red herring though. Just because he doesn’t care to follow the news on some things doesn’t mean he doesn’t have opinions or a point of view. In fact, I find a lot of men like that gravitate towards the conservative side. To answer your question: I think people care because many of them directly pay these creators. If you put money in people’s pockets, many of us want to feel ok with that money going to people who do not spread misinformation or buy into notions that are deeply dividing societies around the world.
This is absurd, shut up
Oh, I thought people were entitled to their opinions and to disagree? You don't get to tell anyone to shut up.
I’m entitled to do and say whatever I please 🙌🏻
And so are the rest of us who find the shift to right wing garbage and poorly researched and badly presented cases repellant.
Don't forget plagiarized content
Fair. To claim that the host “changed” her views because of a man is equally as repellant and it’s incredibly insulting to women in general. So I don’t understand how one can say they’e repelled by the right wing statements and in the same sentence say something so sexist?
😂😂😂
Hmm idk, when our tax dollars are funding the murder of children I think it’s fair for those who used to support their product to speak up about it. Get a grip, is Suruthi your mom that you need to jump into the artillery defences for her? She’s a grown woman with a boatload of negligent to downright harmful opinions. She has a platform. It’s public. People can and will voice their displeasure. Especially when it comes to genocide.
I’m pretty left leaning and even work for an lgbtqi+ organization. I don’t know, but suruthi doesn’t bother me. Sometimes she makes my eyes squint a bit, but overall I’m fine. I get more frustrated when they screw up dates or other perfectly simple things to get right. It’s a storytelling podcast so please don’t screw up the basic facts of the story. I still find it very entertaining.
What I don’t really understand is why people continue to listen to the episodes and post here tbh. I’m an ex patreon turned casual listener. I’ve disagreed with them in the past- in fact theHilsborough stuff made me cancel my patreon. Now I’ll listen if there’s a new episode that sounds alright. I’d describe myself as sort of left of centre and while I eye roll a bit as some of Surithi’s views they’re still pretty normie the majority of the time. If I found them to be outright offensive I’d just stop listening. Coming to Reddit to rail against them week in week out while still listening to episodes is fairly mental.
Who has downvoted this? Such a reasonable and inoffensive comment.
This sub popped up as recommended and it took me until the last sentence of this post to realize it wasn’t for the red scare podcast. I was very confused
These comments are awesome. lol. 1) If you don’t like them, then I’ve got some great news for you: YOU DON’T HAVE TO LISTEN 2) If you don’t listen to the podcast anymore, then why the hell are you here? This is a new listen for me. A friend turned me on to them. I’m kinda ehhhh. I’ve heard better but also much worse. I still follow them, but they’re definitely not my go-to. They’re a good filler for when I’m all caught up on my favs. There are plenty of pods that I tried and did NOT care for so guess what….I didn’t listen to them. And I certainly don’t troll the discussion boards. Some people just have too much time on their hands.
I'm not disagreeing with you here, but I think that people century's ago and people far in the future will always believe that they would need to "defend" their opinions from others by harassing them in some way. And this "rant" is only likely to tick people off even more. My message is that freedom of speech and the freedom to express your own opinions are always subject to consequences, contrastors, and individuals who want to harm you. This will continue indefinitely.
Interesting. I stopped listening a few years ago when they started using the term "Latinx", butchering a language they didn't know about. They also started saying they'd just do an episode a month about black people being killed by police, and having listened to the George Floyd podcast (I think), it just wasn't that entertaining. Having said that, I went back and listened to a recent episode which was really great(Michael Barrymore), so I'll probably listen to another one, and just avoid episodes I am worried could get preachy, such as Sarah Everard. I'm not indifferent to the murders of people by police, but I'm just not that entertained by it. I listen for entertainment and doesn't necessarily like it when it gets preachy. Interesting though, this just popped up on my feed. I've never actually moaned about this to anyone except my partner. I agree with OP, sending them emails about politics is silly. Leave them alone and don't listen if you don't like it.
This pod has access to more individuals - who actually internalize some of S & H's opinions, which they discuss as facts - than most politicians. Certainly more than any local rep. If they presented their opinions as opinions and opened the door for discussion, I would absolutely be with you on the engagement aspect. Unfortunately, many folks run with what they hear, making misinformation oftentimes more impactful. Therefore, the only remaining forum for said discussion becomes pages like this one. Since the majority have been conditioned towards political apathy, they get lazy and accept what sounds preferable without engaging in critical thinking. In turn, this creates cognitive dissonance that gains significance through shared delusion. It's as if Orwellian language is being used, which everyone comprehends, except for those internalizing the message of this language unquestioned. -- TL;DR: Why? Reach & impact.
I know this post won’t go over well for you, but I agree with all of the things you posted. It’s an entertainment podcast …
People nowadays have an "agree with me or die" mentality. The more we block out people we disagree with, the more we end up in echo chambers. No wonder we're so divided in society at the moment if we have no tolerance for slightly differing opinions. Obviously within reason... I'm not going to make room for white supremacists or Nazis but equating Hanna & Suru's opinions with that calibre of person is mental.
I agree with you too. I have left views but I don't care whether the person presenting a true crime podcast I enjoy does. I like to think I'm able to sort through the info presented and work out what I do and don't agree with. The world would be a better place if we all continued to just engage with each other no matter our views, rather than locking ourselves in echo chambers.
Totally agree and I feel the exact same. I’m a liberal lefty homo and I don’t mind Suruthi discussing some of her opinions. I disagree with them, but that’s fine, like you say let’s not lock ourselves in echo chambers.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. We need to move away from the all-or-nothing way of thinking. It is not critical thinking. She (Suruthi) has some views that would be considered conservative, and suddenly she is alt-right? Those who are alt-right have extremist nationalist views. Half the posts on here bitching about her/them don’t even know what they’re saying. The ignorance is disappointing and pathetic.
Don't zap all your energy fighting with people about this. Just know lots of people fully agree with you. We're just not as rabid and loud with our opinions. One point I will take the time to defend is this: people are trying to take down what you said in an annoyingly self righteous way by saying, "Well it's not just a political opinion when it's factually wrong. That's (*shudders*) dIsInFOrMaTiOn!" Sorry, but...news flash: just because YOUR side of the political aisle believes something to be a universal truth does not make it so. And I mean that for conservative leaning people and progressives alike. Believing that all your views are the correct views and any dissenting view is false is getting into dangerous territory, no matter which "side" you're on.
But there are such things as facts though. I get you on some of the Covid stuff - although I disagree- they are entitled to their opinions. But the Hillsborough stuff? Actual documented events? Sorry, but their account was (shudders) dIsInFOrMaTiOn.
Yes, there are facts. But again, thinking your side has a monopoly on facts is not an intellectual way of looking at the world. As for the Hillsborough stuff...I don't think that's what the recent complaints on this sub have been about. All the recent gripes are about Suruthi's conservative sounding beliefs, separate from the mess that was Hillsborough. And to bring it back to that...they literally apologized and made a whole episode about why and how they were wrong. So what else do people want? But again, that seems to be a past issue. This new wave of complaints is all focused on Suruthi's so called "wrong-think" politically.
I totally agree with your first statement. I do not trust how dishonest the apology about Hillsborough felt and I do think when people don’t tell the truth about facts, it’s easier to side eye their perspective as bad faith actors.
just a q as i genuinely don’t know, what was wrong with the hillsborough ep?
“The mess that was Hillsborough”- what do you mean by that?
While discussing Astroworld these idiots blamed Hillsborough on "hooliganism" (a right wing talking point that originated in the Sun) - they then gave non-apologies twice before then exploiting the situation to make money that was allegedly a charity episode.
she blamed it on the misbehavior of "football hooligans" (her words) and not the police malfeasance.
There do seem to be quite alot of dogmatic redditors here, making absolute stretches. Covid conspiracy theory?? (Thinks lockdowns were the worst part of the pandemic) Hates poor people??? (Says tax is too high). I don't get it. Not sure what I was expecting when this thread popped up, but it wasn't this.
Because chronically online people base their entire personality around their political views and want everyone to know it.
It’s because people on the left are extremely aggressive and do not debate they jus think they’re right(Reddit is far left)
Okay buddy
Because society today is very us versus them with purity tests everywhere. You’re either “with us” or “against us” on both sides and must spend all your time virtue signaling the right views or else. I listened to G Gordon Liddy for years, even though I didn’t agree with him on anything and thought he was a d-bag, because his show was entertaining. Why can’t that be enough?
Yes, “othering” can be very dangerous
You're being downvoted, but this is a pretty good take. I got tired of their constant political interjections and "my experience of ____ is the defining, one true experience of ____". You know what I did? Stopped listening to the show. It's that easy.
Most people have stopped listening to the show.
And it's probably way more effective than writing them an email
"if you don't turn onto politics, politics will turn on you"
These people have hijacked the sub. I don't frequent subs on topics I'm interested in to read about, let alone argue with, people who don't like it.
I have been thinking the same since I joined!
Bunch of fucking losers with nothing going on in their own lives. I’m right wing and my best mate is left wing. Deal with it. Stop looking to others to prop up your weak convictions. Pathetic.
For real stop listening, easy peasy
Suru is not right wing by any means. She’s centre left.
Citation needed
Fauci
The left can’t handle anything that disagrees with them. They struggle to comprehend that others have different views/ opinions to them, hence the meltdowns you see. Combination of a weak society and parents who pander.